# US income in retirement



## Gimme the Green (Feb 4, 2014)

At this point in our lives, my wife and I have one main objective in retirement, being snowbirds. That said, I believe it would be nice to have some USD coming in regularly in retirement to help us with this goal. Here are our details,

Both in mid 30's
I have a defined benefit pension plan on the go, wife has been in one in the past and will probably be in one again in the future.
House paid off in 2 years
Investors, 1/2 going into couch potato portfolios using TD e-series funds, 1/2 into high quality Canadian dividend payers (questrade). 

So my first thought is going with high end US dividend payers. Building up a nice grouping of US stocks over the years and letting the USD hopefully flow in so it can be used while down south. My question is where should I put these stocks? I of course want everything to be as efficient tax wise as possible. I know having US stocks in an RRSP would keep me away from the US withholding tax but I would get hit eventually on withdrawals. In a TFSA I would be using after tax cash and be getting hit with the US withholding taxes. Is there really any question here? Better to go with the RRSP and not worry about the withholding? I would think the money would be more convenient to use out of a TFSA when the time comes but might not be worth the extra taxes over the years?

I know there are Canadian stocks that pay US dividends but they are pretty limited in choice.

Thanks,


----------



## leslie (May 25, 2009)

I think there is some misunderstanding with " US stocks in an RRSP would get hit eventually on withdrawal". What is being referred to there? The US tax withholdings does not come back to bite you. The normal RRSP withdrawal tax is just repaying the original loan from the government (at no cost to you). You will be required to make RRIF w/drawals of some $$ anyways. 

There is also the issue of whether your RRSP/TFSA allows you to hold USD (for free or at a charge), or charges you conversions.


----------



## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

Gimme the Green said:


> So my first thought is going with high end US dividend payers. Building up a nice grouping of US stocks over the years and letting the USD hopefully flow in so it can be used while down south. My question is where should I put these stocks?


Several possibilities I'm sure. We are building up USD in the USD side of out TDDI (non-registered) trading account. We hold US stocks and the dividends go into cash rather than being DRIP'd as they do in our CDN$ account. This money can be transferred to a USD bank account as needed.

Remember you will need to deal with the T1135 if the cum cost of your US assets exceeds $100k during the year (might make sense for your wife and you to have your own accounts if you intend to exceed this).

Some info here: http://advisors.tdwaterhouse.ca/public/projectfiles/011b7cdf-f530-455d-94af-4f4b63cf9504.pdf


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

If you think your tax rate in retirement might be higher than 15%, then it might make some sense to keep a few U.S. dividend paying stocks inside your USD $$ TFSA. 

This would provide some tax-free US $$ for snow-birding


----------



## RBull (Jan 20, 2013)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> Several possibilities I'm sure. We are building up USD in the USD side of out TDDI (non-registered) trading account. We hold US stocks and the dividends go into cash rather than being DRIP'd as they do in our CDN$ account. This money can be transferred to a USD bank account as needed.
> 
> Remember you will need to deal with the T1135 if the cum cost of your US assets exceeds $100k during the year (might make sense for your wife and you to have your own accounts if you intend to exceed this).
> 
> Some info here: http://advisors.tdwaterhouse.ca/public/projectfiles/011b7cdf-f530-455d-94af-4f4b63cf9504.pdf


property or assets?


----------



## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

RBull said:


> property or assets?


Both terms get used. The point being that foreign shares are included, so building up US equities could cause you to need to report. Foreign property aka real estate is included if it is rented/income producing, but not if it is a vacation property. 

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/nnrsdnts/cmmn/frgn/1135-eng.html


----------



## RBull (Jan 20, 2013)

^Thanks.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Just remember when it comes to T1135....

.... investments held inside Canadian registered accounts (RRSP’s, RRIF’s, TFSA’s etc.) are exempt from this reporting requirement, as are foreign securities held by Canadian mutual funds and ETF’s. This means the average investor only has to worry about non-registered accounts and foreign bank accounts for the $100k CDN.


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

My Own Advisor said:


> If you think your tax rate in retirement might be higher than 15%, then it might make some sense to keep a few U.S. dividend paying stocks inside your USD $$ TFSA.
> 
> This would provide some tax-free US $$ for snow-birding


Don't you lose the withholding tax when you hold dividend paying US stocks in a TFSA? I seem to recall moving an ADR from TFSA to taxable account just for that reason.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

agent99 said:


> Don't you lose the withholding tax when you hold dividend paying US stocks in a TFSA? I seem to recall moving an ADR from TFSA to taxable account just for that reason.




yes, one does "lose" the 15% US NR withholding tax when US dividends are paid into a TFSA.

the point is that, if RRSP & TFSA are already maxed out - or if RRIF prevents additional contributions - plus if one's marginal tax rate either now or in retirement is greater than 15%, then the 15% NR tax will be the lesser of two evils.

for parties whose RRSPs & TFSAs are not yet maxed out, one would keep US stocks in RRSP as a first choice.

MOA didn't mention, but i believe he's fairly skilled at finding the USD-traded british ADRs that have no withholding taxes whatsoever? RDS.B is one example (note that it has to be the B shares) & there are many other british companies trading stateside as ADRs.

next point: in spite of what MOA has posted, i find myself wondering if US stocks in TFSA are truly exempt from the requirement to list foreign assets under CRA form T1135. One assumes this data is being harvested for the benefit of washington & the IRS, but since washington doesn't view the TFSA as a bona fide retirement account, i'm thinking that possibly they'd want foreign holdings in canadian TFSAs listed. There may be other countries that don't view TFSAs as genuine retirement accounts, as well.

if anyone can comment on this point, i'm sure many forum readers would be grateful.

last point: i believe the IRS will gotcha in the end, with its estate taxation of non-resident aliens that will be implemented in the not-too-distant future. The US intends to tax the estates of foreigners who may have never even set a toe inside the country, if they so much as own a smidgin of a US stock on the day they regretfully depart planet earth.

it's my understanding that US securities held in retirement accounts such as RRSPs & RRIFs will be included in the estate tax inventory of assets.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Thanks HP 

Yes, this is what I mean. Investors are _better off_ with 15% withholding tax inside the TFSA, if their tax rate is higher than 15%. Hopefully folks see what I mean....

As for the T1135, there are a couple of issues here as I understand it.

1. The "living issue" - there is no foreign income reporting on T1135 is you hold U.S. assets inside registered accounts:

Older post but you get the idea:
http://www.myownadvisor.ca/note-to-cra-foreign-income-reporting-doesnt-need-to-be-a-foreign-concept/

Newer content from PWL:
https://www.pwlcapital.com/en/Advis.../March-2014/Tax-Tip-Do-I-Need-to-File-a-T1135

2. The "death issue" - U.S. estate taxes. 
http://www.bdo.ca/en/Library/Servic...letins/US-Estate-Tax-Issues-for-Canadians.pdf


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

alas your first 2 links (yourself & pwl) do not treat the TFSA issue per se so i remain with my question, namely:

- do governments other than canadian, including washington for whose principal benefit the CRA is meekly gathering the T1135 data, consider the canadian TFSA to be a bona fide registered account for retirement purposes, as they accept the concept?

this is actually a difficult question. A proper answer should come from a tax lawyer or CA specialized in cross-border issues, not an investor best guess. There may not have been any cases yet that challenge this concept, so the CRA may not yet have any private rulings on the matter.

as for estate taxes, the issue is so massive we should avoid it here imho. Suffice to say that, for non-resident aliens, 1) the $5M exemption for stateside US taxpayers will be pro-rated to the proportion of US securities in the estate plate upon death; & 2) that plate will include RRSPs, RRIFs, principal residence & all other assets wheresoever situated.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Good question..... - do governments other than canadian, including washington for whose principal benefit the CRA is meekly gathering the T1135 data, consider the canadian TFSA to be a bona fide registered account for retirement purposes, as they accept the concept?

I agree the final answer needs to come from a tax accountant or lawyer, just some links to consider...

The estate tax issue is messy and complex. Another reason to simplify the tax code on this side of the boarder.

Why on earth does CRA make it so difficult to manage our tax affairs???


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

it's the US that's making tax life miserable for many canadians each:

i've seen the question asked, why is the CRA being so docile, kowtowing to washington's demands for data on us?

the answer seems to be, that getting along by going along is how our banks & our major corporations will get to carry on business in the US of A without major problems!


----------



## fatcat (Nov 11, 2009)

believe it or not i think that the cra is more humane tjan the irs because, though it isn't invited to thanksgiving by canadian families it isn't nearly as despised as the irs

the cra at least has the decency to respond when you send them letters forms and money

you will file reams of important, even critical forms to the irs and hear nothing, nada zilch

sometimes you want to owe them a little money just so you can see a cashed cheque

every accountant i have dealt with has echoed the same song, you want to avoid the tfsa primarily because of compliance costs, it's just too expensive a form to have prepared and you owe the money to the usa anyway


----------



## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

humble_pie said:


> alas your first 2 links (yourself & pwl) do not treat the TFSA issue per se so i remain with my question, namely:
> 
> - do governments other than canadian, including washington for whose principal benefit the CRA is meekly gathering the T1135 data, consider the canadian TFSA to be a bona fide registered account for retirement purposes, as they accept the concept?


I don't know about foreign governments but it seems that CRA considers TFSA to be exempt from T1135 reporting. Here is the language from CRA's own website:

25. Does specified foreign property held in registered plans, such as registered retirement savings plans (RRSPs) or tax-free saving accounts (TFSAs), have to be reported on form T1135?
Specified foreign property held in an RRSP or a TFSA is excluded from form T1135 reporting requirements.

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/nnrsdnts/cmmn/frgn/1135_fq-eng.html


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

My Own Advisor said:


> Thanks HP
> 
> Yes, this is what I mean. Investors are _better off_ with 15% withholding tax inside the TFSA, if their tax rate is higher than 15%. Hopefully folks see what I mean....


Thanks for explanation. Supplementary - Withholding tax on ADRs can vary depending on country company is in. Also higher than 15% on some other types of investments. Even for countries where a treaty exists with Canada that would reduce WT to 15%, they may still deduct a non-treaty amount (25 or 30%?) because they don't know where you live. Rob Carrick had an article on this. So presumably that 15% "rule" would only apply to US based equity dividends where the US-Canada treaty applies?

I have not checked if BMOIL will allow accumulation of US$ income from US equities/ADRs in TFSA without currency conversion. Hopefully they will, because it would be a good way of generating US$ savings for snowbirding use.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

Spudd said:


> I don't know about foreign governments but it seems that CRA considers TFSA to be exempt from T1135 reporting. Here is the language from CRA's own website:
> 
> 25. Does specified foreign property held in registered plans, such as registered retirement savings plans (RRSPs) or tax-free saving accounts (TFSAs), have to be reported on form T1135?
> Specified foreign property held in an RRSP or a TFSA is excluded from form T1135 reporting requirements.
> ...




thankx so much for clearing up that point, Spudd. I'd actually wondered about it in the past. 

if i were a tax lawyer (which i'm not) i'd say so far, so good. The CRA has decided what data it will collect. Foreign securities in TFSAs are not on the menu.

if washington would want to refine or expand its plate later, washington couldn't make it retroactive.

it's interesting how chameleon-like TFSAs are, though. In some respects (NR tax is one) washington treats TFSAs as if there were no registered savings plan envelope to protect them; while in other respects, as here with T1135, the normal benefits accruing to registered plans apply.


----------



## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

humble_pie said:


> ... The CRA has decided what data it will collect. Foreign securities in TFSAs are not on the menu.


The T1135 is for Canada so they become the gatekeeper for what's one it. Even if they decided to hand everything listed on the T1135 over to the IRS (I don't believe they do), there's nothing on the Canadian side asking for the TFSA to be listed.

Those having to file a US tax return, are typically getting rid of their TFSA because of what US tax return/FACTCA requires, not the Canadian return or the T1135 form.




humble_pie said:


> ... if washington would want to refine or expand its plate later, washington couldn't make it retroactive.


Without recognised grounds (ex. having to file a US tax return) - what Washington refines or expands or makes retroactive makes no difference to what CRA collects and how they use it.




humble_pie said:


> it's interesting how chameleon-like TFSAs are, though. In some respects (NR tax is one) washington treats TFSAs as if there were no registered savings plan envelope to protect them; while in other respects, as here with T1135, the normal benefits accruing to registered plans apply.


I don't think the T1135 has anything to do with what Washington does or does not treat a TFSA.

One can have less than the threshold, have no need to fill out a T1135 but in Washington's eyes, have to file a US tax return that as I understand it, will fully tax the TFSA.

Or one can be well over the threshold, fill out a T1135 and as long as there's only a requirement to fill out a Canadian tax return - have Washington stick to "reduce the 30% NR withholding to 15% by tax treaty provisions".


The bottom line is that Canada controls what goes onto the T1135, the US controls what they require from US tax returners and the tax treaty controls what categories the accounts fall into.


Cheers


----------



## Gimme the Green (Feb 4, 2014)

Thanks for all the detailed replies. I never really thought about the T1135 issue. We invest primarily in TD e-series funds as well as Canadian dividend payers. This is what we plan to live on in retirement along with my (at the moment) defined benefit pension as well as my wife's. We have set this goal to be snowbirds in retirement so we are planning on setting aside additional funds specifically for this purpose. I guess in this case, making the proper decisions as far as tax treatment ect. almost is secondary to the fact that we just want some easily accessible funds we can use on US soil while away. I'm not sure where we will be tax rate wise in retirement. If I was to guess, I would say we will probably be above that 15% bracket, (both work, not having kids, live pretty frugally). Maybe high end US dividend payers in a TFSA is worth the 15% withholding for ease of use when the time comes. We have plenty of room for RRSP's and TFSA's at the moment.


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Gimme the Green said:


> I know there are Canadian stocks that pay US dividends but they are pretty limited in choice.


Just a quick comment for snowbirds:
The easiest way to deal with US expenses seems to be:
1) Have a credit card that does not charge extra for US charges, e.g. not TD at 3.5% vig but Home Capital et al
2) Hold Canadian stocks that pay dividends in USD. This has several advantages over US holdings:
a) No 15% tax withholding giving you more cash flow per $ of dividend,
b) You get to claim the dividend tax credit on your tax return.

Here is a partial list of current stocks that work.







There are other approaches that work. This one is intended for the less sophisticated snowbird. Be sure to verify individual stocks, r.g. TDDI does not allow you to get the IOL dividends in USD.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

kcowan said:


> Just a quick comment for snowbirds:
> The easiest way to deal with US expenses seems to be:
> 1) Have a credit card that does not charge extra for US charges, e.g. not TD at 3.5% vig but Home Capital et al
> 2) Hold Canadian stocks that pay dividends in USD. This has several advantages over US holdings:
> ...



gosh that linked list is hopelessly inadequate & out-of-date

the known list of canadian companies paying USD dividends numbers 35 to 40

there is no official record-keeper for this data; in any event a proper such list would have to be updated from time to time (something like 2-5 revisions per year)

i was the party that made the original list for Canadian Capitalist way back in 2012, remember? the list that another website - of which i believe kcowan is a part owner or possibly the majority owner - that other website promptly plagiarized not only my/CC's list but also CC's article explaining what the canadian USD payors were up to plus how to avoid/workaround brokers' FX fees on the dividends. Plagiarized with never even so much as an acknowledgment, let alone a word of thanks.

it baffles why so many of you out there are so ungracious about acknowledging another party's excellent research, that was freely & generously donated in the first place. Surely it could not be possible that grab-&-run is the official style of that other website ... or could it? each:

in any event, i can guarantee that all known such "lists" in the public domain are either hopelessly inadequate or hopelessly out-of-date or both


.


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

kcowan said:


> Just a quick comment for snowbirds:
> The easiest way to deal with US expenses seems to be:
> 1) Have a credit card that does not charge extra for US charges, e.g. not TD at 3.5% vig but Home Capital et al
> 2) Hold Canadian stocks that pay dividends in USD. This has several advantages over US holdings:
> ...


This is an OLD thread  

Agree with no FX credit card, but now that the Chase Amazon Visa has gone, there are few choices other than Home Capital. (there are some, but some of them have annual fees making them perhaps less attractive). For coming year I will generate FFX free US$ using methods below and use our US$ Mastercard while in USA. 

Holding Canadian stocks that pay dividends in US$ on US side of taxable account seems a good way to generate US$ on an ongoing basis.
Holding Canadian, International ADRs and US stocks in RRIFs is another way for those of us who have to draw from RRIFs anyway. No withholding in RRIF.

I believe there are a number more Canadian stocks that pay US$ dividends than those in your attachment. (BTW, Notes 1-5 in attachment are not explained. )
These may not be totally up to date:
https://www.dividendearner.com/get-us-dividends-from-canadian-stocks/
https://www.financialwisdomforum.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=117861

The other way to get US$ that many of use, is to sell an interlisted stock on the US side. There are many more stocks that you can do this with. I just sold 100 shares in Royal Bank on US side to generate US$ to pay our condo fees! And if you have C$ in cash, you can always do a Norbert Gambit. 

Its about that time of the year!


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

humble_pie said:


> gosh that linked list is hopelessly inadequate & out-of-date
> 
> the known list of canadian companies paying USD dividends numbers 35 to 40
> 
> there is no official record-keeper for this data; in any event a proper such list would have to be updated from time to time (something like 2-5 revisions per year)


Yes I am aware that any list will be obsolete the moment it is published. I suppose that is why there is a dearth of them!


humble_pie said:


> i was the party that made the original list for Canadian Capitalist way back in 2012, remember? the list that another website - of which i believe kcowan is a part owner or possibly the majority owner - that other website promptly plagiarized not only my/CC's list but also CC's article explaining what the canadian USD payors were up to plus how to avoid/workaround brokers' FX fees on the dividends. Plagiarized with never even so much as an acknowledgment, let alone a word of thanks.


Wow I was unaware of the history in no small part because the search mechanism on these sites is woefully inadequate. Please provide a link to your article so I can incorporate and acknowledge it.

Regarding ownership of Financial Webring, it is member-supported, accepting no other source of financial support (unlike CMF which is advertiser-supported). There is a member-elected Board but I am not now nor ever been a member. In fact, I disagree with their approach, I wanted to go after the mission of educating Canadians using twitter, reddit and Facebook among others. (That objective was back in 2005. I am truly retired now.)


agent99 said:


> Agree with no FX credit card, but now that the Chase Amazon Visa has gone, there are few choices other than Home Capital. (there are some, but some of them have annual fees making them perhaps less attractive). For coming year I will generate FFX free US$ using methods below and use our US$ Mastercard while in USA.
> 
> Holding Canadian stocks that pay dividends in US$ on US side of taxable account seems a good way to generate US$ on an ongoing basis.
> 
> ...


Thanks for adding to the thread. My objective was to post a skeleton approach for an unsophisticated snowbird. All your suggestions are indeed workable. The only caveat I would add is that ADRs often leave the tax paid in their home country stranded, i.e. not recoverable with the CRA.

The notes were supposed to be hotlinked, and the Cycles referred to when the dividends were paid. 1 to 3 are quarterly Jan, Feb, Mar respectively and 4 is monthly. Here is the source along with the explanation of notes.

https://www.finiki.org/wiki/Dividend_cycles


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

You are right about the ADRs. You have to be careful as to which country the company is based. I have several ADRs. All large UK based companies that pay healthy dividends in US$ with no withholding. One, (Unilever) will soon be only based in Netherlands. During transition the company will compensate shareholders for any withholding and in Spring apparently Netherlands will stop withholding. 

Regarding Canadian companies paying dividends in US$. I tidied up my own spreadsheet and it is attached below. I used an older G&M list and brought it up to date. 

By the way: Anyone is free to use this list! It's all based on publicly available data :biggrin: If anyone knows of any stocks that should be added or deleted, please post.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

agent99 said:


> You are right about the ADRs. You have to be careful as to which country the company is based. I have several ADRs. All large UK based companies that pay healthy dividends in US$ with no withholding. One, (Unilever) will soon be only based in Netherlands. During transition the company will compensate shareholders for any withholding and in Spring apparently Netherlands will stop withholding.
> 
> Regarding Canadian companies paying dividends in US$. I tidied up my own spreadsheet and it is attached below. I used an older G&M list and brought it up to date.
> 
> By the way: Anyone is free to use this list! It's all based on publicly available data :biggrin: If anyone knows of any stocks that should be added or deleted, please post.


Need to add:

BIP.UN.

If I post to my site in the coming weeks, will certainly give credit to "agent99"


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

My Own Advisor said:


> Need to add:
> 
> BIP.UN.
> 
> If I post to my site in the coming weeks, will certainly give credit to "agent99"


Ok, I added BIP.UN. Don't know how I missed it first time!

I was hoping to have stock prices automatically update, but..... Too lazy!


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

kcowan said:


> Yes I am aware that any list will be obsolete the moment it is published. I suppose that is why there is a dearth of them!
> 
> Wow I was unaware of the history in no small part because the search mechanism on these sites is woefully inadequate. Please provide a link to your article so I can incorporate and acknowledge it.


Here are the links that I discovered without any help from humble_pie:
US dividend payers
and this thread:
US income for snowbirds
and finally a recommendation for UK ADRs:
No withholding from these UK ADRs


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

kcowan said:


> Here are the links that I discovered without any help from humble_pie:
> US dividend payers
> and this thread:
> US income for snowbirds
> ...


List in the first link is dated 2012 and is now, of course, out of date. Some of the companies no longer exist. There was a more up to date list in the G&M in 2016 but it requires a subscription, so cannot be linked. My list is hopefully up to date, but perhaps there are some new US$ dividend payers that now exist that I have not found? There are also likely some Canadian funds as well as a number of preferreds that pay distributions in US$, but I was only looking for stand alone stocks. 

Anyway, there are enough choices in current list (in Post #27)for those wanting some US$ dividend income.


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Thanks I appreciate your disclaimer.


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

I don't have the energy to further update the US$ div payers list, but the site linked below has a list of Canadian stocks that will pay or have paid dividends in past. The list can be searched using CTRL F and USD string and will highlight all those that pay in US$ (at least in Chrome) This will include stock, preferreds as well as ETFs. The free site *Farmers 2018 TSX (ex) Dividend Listing *has a lot more useful information about Canadian dividend paying companies. It's worth a visit.

https://tsx.exdividend.ca/?divlength=radio-custom-symbol&from=&to=&symbol=


----------



## Retiredguy (Jul 24, 2013)

I have read through a lot of the posts and frankly my eyes glaze over when I consider the issues and potential headaches raised, all to avoid some future fx. I have been a snowbird for 10 plus years. I hold no US stock and derive a considerable portion of my yearly income from Canadian dividend payers... many of the usual suspects. I likely spend about 20K C$ per year to enjoy snow birding. My cost of fx is about 1%. I like to keep things simple, yes sometimes simple means paying a little. Don't misunderstand I too avoid fees where ever I reasonably can but sometimes it's like changing the oil in your car yourself or driving into a shop , having a coffee, paying $50 and carrying-on, no fuss no muss.

1). I have a TD US$ Account (no fees)

2). I have a TD US$ Visa card. ($39 yr)

3). I opened an account with VBCE (Vancouver Bullion and Coin Exchange) to exchange Canadian $ to US $. I do it all online and the US$ is deposited directly in my US$ Wells Fargo account or to my TD US$ account to pay my US$ TD visa bill. The exchange rate is very favourable imo. NO IRS, CRA, no 1135, TFSA, RRSP or RRIF considerations. My Wells Fargo account is a straight chequing account and therefore earns no interest that the IRS might be interested in. I usually have about 5k in it and will ensure it never has more than 10K.

I understand you're in your mid 30's and in retirement you want to be a snowbird, so I'm thinking retirement is 15-20 years away. With 2 incomes, no kids, potential DB pensions along with your ongoing investing why concern your self with trying to build up US$ for eventual snow birding. None of us knows what the tax laws (US or Canada) will be then or what the exchange rate will be. Get the best fx rate you can at the time and let someone else change your oil.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Up and running. A big thanks to "agent99" for recent work and all others who have contributed to this thread.
https://www.myownadvisor.ca/get-u-s-dollars-from-canadian-dividend-paying-stocks/


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Good work! Glad to see that list get a wider audience!


----------



## Longtimeago (Aug 8, 2018)

Retiredguy said:


> I have read through a lot of the posts and frankly my eyes glaze over when I consider the issues and potential headaches raised, all to avoid some future fx. I have been a snowbird for 10 plus years. I hold no US stock and derive a considerable portion of my yearly income from Canadian dividend payers... many of the usual suspects. I likely spend about 20K C$ per year to enjoy snow birding. My cost of fx is about 1%. I like to keep things simple, yes sometimes simple means paying a little. Don't misunderstand I too avoid fees where ever I reasonably can but sometimes it's like changing the oil in your car yourself or driving into a shop , having a coffee, paying $50 and carrying-on, no fuss no muss.
> 
> 1). I have a TD US$ Account (no fees)
> 
> ...


I've watched this thread grow with all the detailed info that people love to show they know about (or think they do). 

Your post Rretiredguy is a breath of fresh air in comparison. Dare I say it is also the first that shows some common sense. What is the point of someone in their 30s trying to decide what to do now financially about snowbirding perhaps several decades from now? Florida may well all be underwater by that time. LOL

While I am all in favour of trying to plan ahead, some things just don't make sense to try and plan too far ahead for. My advice for a 30 something year old is to concentrate your time and energy on your next 5 years of financial goals and leave the long, long term stuff till you are closer to being there. Unless of course your plan is to retire in the next 5 years.

I'm trying to imagine if in my mid-30s I had any thoughts at all as to what I would be doing in my 'retirement years'. I don't think so. Even when I retired in my early 40s, I did not have plans beyond the next few years. Life has a funny way of making a fool of any longer term plans we make. As the saying goes, 'man plans, the gods laugh.'


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Longtimeago said:


> I've watched this thread grow with all the detailed info that people love to show they know about (or think they do).


The 30 yr old posted in 2015. That old thread was just tagged onto by kcowan, likely because it had an appropriate subject. But if you read the whole thread, then you must already know that.



> Retired guy said: I understand you're in your mid 30's and in retirement you want to be a snowbird,


Again, retguy, that original post was 3 or 4 years ago. The thread developed since then. You do FX with VBCE, so sounds like you are into saving FX just same as rest of us retired guys.


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

My Own Advisor said:


> Up and running. A big thanks to "agent99" for recent work and all others who have contributed to this thread.
> https://www.myownadvisor.ca/get-u-s-dollars-from-canadian-dividend-paying-stocks/


Thanks, this looks like the definitive reference at the moment. In spite of some of the naysayers, it makes no sense for a 30-something to hold these stocks in a Canadian $ account and suffer unnecessary conversions at their expense. That has nothing to do with being a US snowbird and everything to do with intelligent investing.


----------



## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

Retiredguy said:


> ... I understand you're in your mid 30's and in retirement you want to be a snowbird, so I'm thinking retirement is 15-20 years away. With 2 incomes, no kids, potential DB pensions along with your ongoing investing why concern your self ...


The OP hasn't posted since 2015 with the last activity in 2016 so I doubt there will be a response. In the meantime, it is unclear whether your guess of how long to retirement is bang on or not. With increasing reports of people deciding to go the FIRE route, with retirements in their early forties, down as low as late twenties - the decades away retirement might not be the plan.


Cheers


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

kcowan said:


> Thanks, this looks like the definitive reference at the moment. In spite of some of the naysayers, it makes no sense for a 30-something to hold these stocks in a Canadian $ account and suffer unnecessary conversions at their expense. That has nothing to do with being a US snowbird and everything to do with intelligent investing.


Thanks kcowan. I will keep it updated thanks to the support from you, agent99, and other dedicated forum members. 

"Snowbirding" is an option for sure but I totally agree with the intelligent investing comment. Trying to do that on my end as well. Not always perfect though!


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

My Own Advisor said:


> Thanks kcowan. I will keep it updated thanks to the support from you, agent99, and other dedicated forum members.
> 
> "Snowbirding" is an option for sure but I totally agree with the intelligent investing comment. Trying to do that on my end as well. Not always perfect though!


I have made a post on FWF ending that thread and pointing to your page.


----------

