# Canada Post direction



## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

This is the kind of government thinking that drives me nuts. You have a crown corporation that exists to do one service - deliver mail. Their volumes have dropped and are continuing to drop.

Instead of just downsizing the business (and reducing service) to reflect reality, they are trying to get into new businesses to justify their existence.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...ic-shift-from-paper-to-pixels/article2402074/


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

Are they going to deliver junk mail to each of our e-Inboxes?


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## DanFo (Apr 9, 2011)

any bills I recieve online come to one email address I have already, cost to tax payers for me to maintain this service = $0...They need to figure out how to make themselves profitable again be it negotiating labour costs, raising fees or cutting services if they wish to survive....I think I've only used 1 book of stamps in the 9 years I've been in my own place and I'm probably not alone in my age group or younger, almost anything i need to send to someone can be done quicker and easier online or via fax. 90% of the mail I recieve is unsolicited junk anyway.


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## Jungle (Feb 17, 2010)

Another dying business model because of the internet. (not saying it's a bad thing, just stating the fact)


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## Jungle (Feb 17, 2010)

ddkay said:


> Are they going to deliver junk mail to each of our e-Inboxes?


Yup you can send it right to my junk mail that I never look at.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

They should do something useful that reflects the changes in their industry. IE set up electronic mailboxes for people to retrieve their internet purchases 24/7 like in Germany. Not very expensive and encourages people to use their service (which is superior to private UPS/Fedex scam artists imo) I love internet shopping but hate chasing down packages. How do people who run these organizations have no clue? They could also do weekend deliveries, seeing as Sunday is no longer sacrilege for anything else in Canada...


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## Dmoney (Apr 28, 2011)

Two day a week delivery, cut 1/2 of their staff. Dying business in a dying industry. Only growth is coming from the package side.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Full pension at 55 or 25 years, whatever comes first? My head is so explodey right now. 

I did an entire graduate degree with a postie. He sorted his mail and then walked his route for 2-3 hours in the morning and went to school the rest of the day. My landlord at the time was also a postie; same work schedule. 

I know I've complained about these two guys and used the same anecdote but holy moley. The funny thing is that these two guys didn't know each other or have any connection...it isn't like they schemed to get these great schedules - I was lead to believe that once you get enough work years in, that's what's available.


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

They can also get rid of door to door delivery and install supermailboxes in older neighborhoods. I also agree with cutting the frequency of delivery.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

I'm not sure why they view ePost as a failed model. I've been using it for years and love it; I'd prefer to get all my bills that way. If they improved the interface and spent some effort marketing ePost so the number of service providers participating in the program increased beyond the current pathetic number, it would be fine.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

Another great example of of tax dollars efficiently at work. :hopelessness:


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

Gee, I wonder why we have a $580B debt and $32B deficit.
Let us hire a few hundred bureaucrats to figure out how to solve this problem.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

I live in Mexico and get everything I can electronically. My hard copy mail is fowarded for "mules" about every 6 weeks.

Aside from the the junk mail, I get annual stuff, like insurance renewals, membership renewals. I also get the results of class action suits against companies that I hold. And I get selected magazines that I subscribe to. There are services that will open my mail and scan it to send by email. So far I have not seen the need for that. CRA also sends me notices for assessment, GST payments due, quarterly installments due.

I can mail relationship information such as new bank accounts being set up via Mexican Post and rely on CP to get it there. This is a problem with the banks needing signed documents. Brokers also need these once in a while, e.g. private placements.


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## Square Root (Jan 30, 2010)

mail drives us crazy. we move around between our 4 places with mail delivery to 3 of them. Get as much as possible on internet but it is surprising how many companies don't offer paperless communication. Banks are probably the best. Annual reports fill the boxes every spring. insurance co's may be the worst. Catalogues and cruise brochures just cannot be stopped. We try to constantly. Eventually paper mail will be extinct, maybe 10-20 years?


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Spudd said:


> They can also get rid of door to door delivery and install supermailboxes in older neighborhoods. I also agree with cutting the frequency of delivery.


I moved to a new neighbourhood.

I like my superbox. It is close, secure, has a drop slot.

I also stopped checking my mail every day, 2-3 times a week is plenty, if it was important, they would have emailed or called me.

I see paper mail as a second rate information transfer system.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Hopefully they have recycling bins right next to those superboxes.


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## Jungle (Feb 17, 2010)

Yea cause the landfill is getting quite full with the Yellowpages books. Lol

Businesses that do not change their model by using the internet will get left behind.


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## zylon (Oct 27, 2010)

*Your wish is our command*



andrewf said:


> Hopefully they have recycling bins right next to those superboxes.












_______________
_There is no reward in pessimism._


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## CanadianCapitalist (Mar 31, 2009)

brad said:


> I'm not sure why they view ePost as a failed model. I've been using it for years and love it;


I like epost as well. I especially like how nicely it is integrated with TD Canada Trust bank accounts. The only problem is that not every business is available on epost. Example: our Hydro and Enbridge bills are not available on epost. If epost can fix this problem, it will be a winner.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

CanadianCapitalist said:


> Example: our Hydro and Enbridge bills are not available on epost. If epost can fix this problem, it will be a winner.


I agree -- I'm not sure why more service providers haven't adopted it; I'd pay all my bills via epost if I could, but I can't because only a couple of my service providers use it. I do get my credit card bills through epost, but I don't think I can get my Bell bill that way, for example. The integration with bank websites is great, but my bank (ING) doesn't do epost. I wish they did; it's so convenient to receive and pay bills through the same website.


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## crazyjackcsa (Aug 8, 2010)

There is no recycling bin at my superbox. I (and lots of other people) cram the junk mail right back into the "out" slot. I didn't ask for it, it isn't addressed to me, I'm under no obligation to take it.


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

I agree that epost is a good idea and could work well if all companies participated.

But why can't a private company offer this service? I hate when the government is in direct competition with private industry. As an example, as much as I like watching HNIC (hockey) on CBC, I don't think the gov't should be airing hockey games if private channels are willing to do it (and they are).

There are plenty of good reasons for having a CBC/Canada post etc etc, but they should stick to those reasons.

/end tea party rant


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## 72camaross (Apr 26, 2010)

I bet you I've checked my mail box 7 times in the last year. It even got closed because I forgot to renew it. 99% of the time it's useless crap that I leave there in the recycle bin. I'm also part of the age group that probably doesn't use stamps, I've probably used 10 in my lifetime. (27yo). I think they should focus on epost, get rid of paper completely. Call it a day. 

I use it for my power and Bell bills. Works great. I log into my bank account, says I have some ebills. I click the link shows me my bills and I click pay. 
Boom. Done. Back to the golf course.

I think someone mentioned it but they could do well being just like a courier service with box stuff. Online shopping is taking over.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

Four Pillars said:


> I agree that epost is a good idea and could work well if all companies participated. But why can't a private company offer this service?


I think we've seen how that works with Quicken (BillPay, etc.). When you put a private company in charge, they will most likely treat both ends of the transaction as a money-making opportunity (charge the service providers to offer their bills through the system, and charge customers to use it). Right now, the nice thing for me is that epost is free to consumers. Presumably the service providers are paying a fee to Canada Post in order to be part of the system (which of course is why they don't have a lot of participation).

Of course, if there were private competition presumably someone would come up with a business model similar to that of epost and consumers wouldn't have to pay, so everyone would migrate to that model eventually because it would be more popular. I wouldn't be surprised if a private-sector competitor to epost isn't already being developed; I could see ING developing their own homegrown version of epost, for example, which might explain why they aren't offering the epost service.


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## Jungle (Feb 17, 2010)

I also think they companies could save money on postage stamps and just scan to a mail box.. it doesn't even have to be epost, like on Roger's website you can log in and look at or download your bill. Save the trees!!


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

I am on electronic statements for Telus, Rogers, Shaw, TD, TDW, CIBC, Canaccord to name a few. I don't know any monthly utility supplier who does not offer soft copy today. All my regular payments are automatic, either to the CC or bank draft. I fail to see where ePost can survive because the only thing left are the outliers.


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

brad said:


> I think we've seen how that works with Quicken (BillPay, etc.). When you put a private company in charge, they will most likely treat both ends of the transaction as a money-making opportunity (charge the service providers to offer their bills through the system, and charge customers to use it). Right now, the nice thing for me is that epost is free to consumers. Presumably the service providers are paying a fee to Canada Post in order to be part of the system (which of course is why they don't have a lot of participation).
> 
> Of course, if there were private competition presumably someone would come up with a business model similar to that of epost and consumers wouldn't have to pay, so everyone would migrate to that model eventually because it would be more popular. I wouldn't be surprised if a private-sector competitor to epost isn't already being developed; I could see ING developing their own homegrown version of epost, for example, which might explain why they aren't offering the epost service.


The fact that a private company might charge isn't really an argument against privatization. We do pay for epost with taxes after all. It's not free.

A common business model is to offer a free service and then charge for upgrades or make money from advertising. However, if the service is good enough, there is nothing wrong with charging for it.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

kcowan said:


> I am on electronic statements for Telus, Rogers, Shaw, TD, TDW, CIBC, Canaccord to name a few. I don't know any monthly utility supplier who does not offer soft copy today. All my regular payments are automatic, either to the CC or bank draft. I fail to see where ePost can survive because the only thing left are the outliers.


But the beauty of epost is that you receive all those bills in one place. You don't have to log into separate websites to see your bill, or receive bills by email and forget to pay them. Everything goes to one place (your bank's website); you log in, review your bills, and pay them all from the same website. It couldn't be more convenient. Quicken allows you to do something similar but after trying it for five or six years I gave up because there were too many small glitches and eventual incompatibilities.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

What's EVEN more convenient is setting up autopays. I can't recall the last time I had to take ANY action to pay a regular bill...it all just comes out of my bank account with no action on my part (other than setting up the autopay in the first place).


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

MoneyGal said:


> What's EVEN more convenient is setting up autopays


True, and that's great for bills that don't vary from month to month. But some bills do (e.g., credit card) and I also find that it's too easy to miss the fact that some recurring bills slowly increase over the time if I set them on autopay -- somehow I pay more attention to the amount when I have to take action to pay the bill.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Why does whether the bill vary in amount affect how easy it is to pay by autopay? I have every bill, including credit cards (which vary wildly from month to month) set up on autopay. And I review my finances at least monthly (and usually much more reguarly) - I get notices of every autopay before it happens. I just do not have to take ANY action to ensure the bill is actually paid. There's no risk of a bill creeping up in amount based on how I pay it. :rolleyes2:


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

I'm embarrassed to say that I didn't even know you could do an autopay. I thought all the utilities etc only did autopay if the amount was constant, ie if you do the equal billing plan which I never do.

I'll have to look into this new invention.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

MoneyGal said:


> Why does whether the bill vary in amount affect how easy it is to pay by autopay? I have every bill, including credit cards (which vary wildly from month to month) set up on autopay.


In my case I guess it's because I worry that a big Visa bill will come up when I'm away on vacation and autopay will take care of it leaving me with an overdraft, or at least without enough cash to cover my expenses. Maybe that's an impossible scenario, but I do remember a few glitches once when I was in Europe and some bills were automatically paid out of my account in Canada and I no longer had enough in my account to cover an emergency cash withdrawal at an ATM. I tend not to keep a huge balance in my chequing account since it earns so little interest, so I'd rather manually transfer money in to pay bills when I need to. With autopay I feel like it's a little to automated for comfort. But that's just me, maybe I'm missing part of the picture (which wouldn't surprise me).


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

the silver star version is to autopay directly from a broker margin account so that no bill will ever bounce ...

& the gold star version is a truly well-padded margin account.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

I don't need my junk mail every day...they would save millions just by having every other day service. If I need something for work expedited, we gladly pay for that service.....but regular mail does not need to come every day.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

The one argument against autopay as I see it is as a precaution against any exceptional bills. It is easier to fight an erroneous or unreasonable bill (like a $4000 cell phone bill, etc.) before you pay it, rather than after.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

I also think it's a personal issue: I've learned from past experience that the more I automate my finances, the less I pay attention to them, and things gradually slip out of control. It all has to do with me and my particular quirks, not with the system itself: I'm sure MoneyGal can automate as much as she likes and still maintain tight control, but through trial and lots of error I've discovered that doing almost everything manually works best for me. I use Quicken but don't download my transactions, I enter them by hand from receipts. I do have several bills and monthly donations paid automatically with my credit card, and a few paid automaticaly through my chequing account, but after having both my credit card and debit card hijacked several times over the past five years and having to deal with all the headaches of re-setting those monthly withdrawals I now prefer to pay most bills manually online as they come in. Maybe I take "set it and forget it" too literally...it's just too easy for me to stop paying attention to my daily transactions altogether, so I overcompensate by paying too much attention to them.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Well, to be frank, for about six months last year I was living on the road. I wanted to automate as much as possible because do you know how hard it can be to find an internet connection (never mind a FREE internet connection) at some random airport in the US Midwest, so you can pay your cellphone bill? (Or how much you do NOT want to attend to that after a day on the road?!)

Also - I get e-mail notifications of EVERY bill that is autopaid. I can place a stop on any bill which I am going to contest. The ONLY part that is automated is the payment. No payee is going into my account without my explicit permission and my foreknowledge of the amount that is to be autopaid.

I did think of one thing I love the mail for, though, apart from packages: magazines. I get maybe 5 or 6 different magazines. It's a total luxury. I love to lie in bed and flip through decor magazines. Yesterday I got both House Beautiful and Real Simple - a banner day for me (also because I was in a bike collision and I was able to lie in the bath, recuperating and reviewing a decor mag. Heaven!)

But the trick - as Brad has said - is to find what works for you, and then follow THAT system - mindful of the risks with any system (no autopay: random middle-of-the-night realization - "I forgot to pay the phone bill!" versus autopay: "I could be billed a large amount in error!").


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

Sorry to hear about the bike collision, but it sounds like the bath and magazine helped ease the pain.


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

MoneyGal said:


> I was in a bike collision


Oh no! Did you collide with another bike? car?


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Sudden industrial garbage can on road + me on bike = minor collision. Two people came and helped me off the road, I didn't rip any clothing (I still don't know how that's possible), and I only injured my hands mildly. Thanks for your well wishes, guys!


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I funnel everything through my credit card, and review that. I can appreciate how it might be nice to automate some or most bills when you have 5 or 10 monthly bills to pay.


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

MoneyGal said:


> Sudden industrial garbage can on road + me on bike = minor collision. Two people came and helped me off the road, I didn't rip any clothing (I still don't know how that's possible), and I only injured my hands mildly. Thanks for your well wishes, guys!


Glad to hear it was relatively minor. 

Oh and by the way - stop hijacking the thread!


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