# Best GIC rates?



## Addy (Mar 12, 2010)

I tried searching "GIC" but it said it found nothing which I find difficult to believe! Can anyone tell me where I can find a good comparison of GIC rates? I'm looking at starting a ladder as part of my portfolio and want to get the most bang for my bucks.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

It seems HISA's lately have higher rates


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## leoc2 (Dec 28, 2010)

http://www.redflagdeals.com/deals/main.php/financial/rates/


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## Quotealex (Aug 1, 2010)

http://www.financialpost.com/personal-finance/rates/gic-annual.html has an updated list of GICs


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## fatcat (Nov 11, 2009)

acheiva and accelerate at 3.5 / 5 years is looking pretty good about now ...


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## Addy (Mar 12, 2010)

Thanks everyone! I was checking into Achevia and suddenly wondered what Happy Savings offered as we currently have a 2.5% HISA with them and they offer 3.55% on a 5 yr annual GIC, so we may stick with them for simplicity sake. I'm still curious if anyone can beat 3.55% for a 5 yr annual GIC?


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## Sherlock (Apr 18, 2010)

Have you considered going to your bank and negotiating for a higher rate than what they normally offer?


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## NorthernRaven (Aug 4, 2010)

I made a little chart for myself recently as an _aide-memoire_ to remember who had what cashability options for high-end GICs. The rates should be reasonably current.

5 or 10 ticks doesn't make a huge amount of difference, but if you are at Hubert anyway and comfortable they seem to be trying to maintain numerical supremacy (the Manitoba CUs all have pretty similar rates) . They don't have a one-year for a ladder, but their 2.5% HISA is a pretty good substitute. 

The nice thing about Hubert and Outlook is they have very liberal early-cashout policies (1% rate for Outlook anytime, 1.75% for Hubert after one year), which can't hurt just in case you need the cash unexpectedly.

Peoples Trust seems to offer better rates directly to customers than what they post through third-party sites - presumably they don't want to compete with the CUs for brokered business, but want to keep their own customers. They pretty much match the Manitoba CUs, but at a CDIC-insured institution, which might be attractive to some. Here's how to log on to check their member rates - I assume setting up a savings account with them would be enough to qualify.


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## Addy (Mar 12, 2010)

I doubted my bank (TD) would be able to come anywhere near 3.55% on a 5 yr annual GIC, but surprisingly I found this on their website a five year "Stepper" GIC which seems pretty decent, any comments?

Non-registered and Registered (TFSA
Year 1 0.95%*
Year 2 1.15%
Year 3 1.50%
Year 4 2.00%
Year 5 3.75%
Effective Annual*Yield 1.865%

Rates for Registered(RSP, RIF,*RESP)
Year 1 0.95%*
Year 2 1.15%
Year 3 1.50%
Year 4 2.00%
Year 5 3.75%
Effective Annual*Yield 1.865%


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## NorthernRaven (Aug 4, 2010)

I'm not sure what would be attractive about the TD Stepper? You are locking your money in for 5 years 1.865%, when you can get 2.75%-3.55% on a 5-year GIC at any number of places? You could put it with Hubert in a 5-year and get 3.55%, and cash it any time after a year if needs be at 1.75% - pretty much what TD is paying for a 5-year lock. Am I missing something? You could do the same thing at Ally for 2.75%, and 1.5% on early cashout, or investigate Peoples Trust, if you want CDIC.

I think a 5 year ladder at Hubert/Outlook rates would be around 3%, depending on what the rates are as you reinvest - I'm sure there are ladder gurus around here somewhere.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Steppers are designed to manipulate people who are bad at math. It's shameful. My mother got suckered into those all the time.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

andrewf said:


> Steppers are designed to manipulate people who are bad at math. It's shameful. My mother got suckered into those all the time.


Sad but true


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## Jon_Snow (May 20, 2009)

I'm getting 5.25% on the final year of 3 year stepper from TD. 3 years ago I had thought I may have made a mistake in locking up 100k in this way. Looking like a decent decision now.


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## NorthernRaven (Aug 4, 2010)

Jon_Snow said:


> I'm getting 5.25% on the final year of 3 year stepper from TD. 3 years ago I had thought I may have made a mistake in locking up 100k in this way. Looking like a decent decision now.


Since interest rates went down, a fortunate decision to take a longer rate. But presumably even back then you could have done better than TD's rates. Was your TD GIC a "Triple Value" 3-year GIC, with rates (circa Sept 2008) something like 2.8%/4%/5.25%? That's an effective annual rate of 4.012%. I can't find a general Sept 2008 source offhand, but extrapolating based on lower May 2008 numbers, the top of the GIC market was likely 4.5-5%.

The strange thing about TD's steppers back then is that they seemed to be offering rates much higher than their equivalent term vanilla GIC (4% vs 3.2% for three years, for instance), which doesn't make much sense unless there is some hidden gotcha on the stepper I'm missing. Current TD steppers average out as pretty much identical to the vanilla GICs. I assume it had something to do with the time value of the late-skewed interest payouts to TD in the different environment back then.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

NorthernRaven said:


> Since interest rates went down, a fortunate decision to take a longer rate. But presumably even back then you could have done better than TD's rates. Was your TD GIC a "Triple Value" 3-year GIC, with rates (circa Sept 2008) something like 2.8%/4%/5.25%? That's an effective annual rate of 4.012%. I can't find a general Sept 2008 source offhand, but extrapolating based on lower May 2008 numbers, the top of the GIC market was likely 4.5-5%.


ING was offering 4% on a 2 year and 4.5% on a 3-5 year back then. Not to mention TD always sneaks a few hidden fees in there for good measure that ING doesn't charge. I assume acheiva or Ally were higher.

The step ups aren't so bad if you leave it for the entire term but the other institutions have more flexibility to withdraw early


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## Sampson (Apr 3, 2009)

andrewf said:


> Steppers are designed to manipulate people who are bad at math. It's shameful. My mother got suckered into those all the time.


I don't think it is because they are bad at math, as Northraven points out, most steppers average out to similar rates as the plain fixed-term GICs. So I can understand that people are attracted to the higher #'s they see by the time year 5 rolls around.

The problem is that few people venture outside of their 'favorite' bank to check out the competition. Maybe they will venture to a 2nd bank among the big 5, but that's it. No wonder we get gouged by the banks, people's actions show they don't care enough.


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## leoc2 (Dec 28, 2010)

Raven,

Is your investment portfolio as described here? If yes how is this strategy working?
http://www.northernraven.ca/financial/RavenSpud.html

My self imposed Oct deadline to re-deploy capital is soon approaching and I must choose:
A) Couch Potato (50/50 equity/fixed). <-- My financial advisor's recommendation.
B) Dividend generators (50/50 equity/fixed)
C) 100% fixed (ala Karen)
D) Position trade (what I have done for 15 years)


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## Dmoney (Apr 28, 2011)

Sampson said:


> The problem is that few people venture outside of their 'favorite' bank to check out the competition. Maybe they will venture to a 2nd bank among the big 5, but that's it. No wonder we get gouged by the banks, people's actions show they don't care enough.


Shhhhhhh!!! Don't spread that message. My bank stocks will be worthless


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## OhGreatGuru (May 24, 2009)

BankRate.ca has HISA and GIC rates.
http://www.bankrate.com/can/default.asp

My local newspaper publishes rates from about 20 institutions weekly.


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## Addy (Mar 12, 2010)

NorthernRaven said:


> I'm not sure what would be attractive about the TD Stepper? You are locking your money in for 5 years 1.865%, when you can get 2.75%-3.55% on a 5-year GIC at any number of places?


Yes, that product itself isn't worthwhile, but it had me thinking perhaps TD may possibly be receptive to matching other FI's GIC rates for me. I am still doubtful, but not as doubtful as I was before reading about their stepper rates.


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