# I'm in deep trouble



## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

Ok guys I posted about bad spending habits previously, but now I am in deep trouble. Due to an emergency I am simply out of money even though I take home $4000 every month. I have started taking out pay day loans to meet my needs. Now that I have fallen into the cycle it's never ending and I keep taking another one.

I recently consolidated my credit line and card so my question is can I re consolidate all my loans, credit card and car loan to get out of this pay day thingy? I need about $2000 to get back on track but I simply don't have that money or can't get if from anyone else.


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## YYC (Nov 12, 2012)

You can do whatever a bank/lender will approve you for. So, the answer to "can I re-consolidate all my loans?" is "maybe". 

Have you considered posting your budget here for others to help with? Perhaps there's some way you could make it work which you haven't thought of. Sometimes an outside perspective can see things we miss from up close.


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

Things didn't seem that bad in your original thread http://canadianmoneyforum.com/showt...ey-management-help-needed?p=128763#post128763

I don't understand how you could be in a position where $2k will make a difference and you can't get more credit from a bank with your income. Have you asked your bank for more credit on a LOC? Consolidation etc? When is your next payday? 

Anyway, you mentioned having $800 in a TFSA and $14k in an RRSP. Assuming at least some of that money is still there, one option is to use that money to get you through the rough patch. I don't care what any of the 'holier-than-thou' cmfers might say - I would always use my registered account funds before using payday loans.

Assuming this is even a real situation, you really need to make some fundamental changes to how you manage your money or this 'emergency' will be a regular event.


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## Argonaut (Dec 7, 2010)

Stop spending money. Stop it. Stop. It.

Something tells me you're not serious about it, and will happily eat up more credit if and when you dig out of the hole. If you are serious, start living off loaves of bread and peanut butter. Maybe some Cheerios and pasta too. Start walking everywhere. $4000 a month is a big wage, I can easily live on $200 a month after potential housing costs.


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## onomatopoeia (Apr 8, 2009)

you can talk to a bank to see what they will do, but only they can tell you.

really, re-consolodating is not the solution here, budgeting is. you HAVE to cut all extra expenses now.

consolodating loans is a sign that you spend too much. If you need to do it again, you havent clued into the fact that your budget stinks.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

I already got a consolidation for the credit line and visa I had. Since there was a $25000 personal emergency I had to withdraw my RRSP, TSFA and all other funds I had including selling of electronics I had. Now just to meet day to day expense I have taken out 2 pay day loans. What I mean by additional $2000 will help me resolve is I will stop taking payday loans which I pay about $25 for every $100 I borrow. 

The $25000 emergency is an unavoidable fund and to meet I had to go to this extent depleting all my funds. 

Now I have a $40000 consolidation loan and about $5000 on credit card that needs to be paid. I'm wondering if I can ask the bank to re consolidate all I owe and start again. Will the bank even consider doing that as I already consolidated once? My payments on consolidation loan is just 852 and I have a rent of $400. So based on this I still have lot of money to pay back what I owe. But due to the fact I don't have funds now I'm loosing about $800 every month on pay day loans interest.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

and I already missed out a loan payment for december. Is going through the same bank a better option or consult other institutions to provide me a consolidation loan?


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## YYC (Nov 12, 2012)

vigmoney said:


> and I already missed out a loan payment for december. Is going through the same bank a better option or consult other institutions to provide me a consolidation loan?


You need to post more detail on your budget and situation. As it stands now, this almost reads like a trolling post.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Quick link on your options: http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/personalfinance/credithelp.html

You have a lot, ranging from consolidation to consumer proposal. An actual credit counselling agency (CHOOSE CAREFULLY; you don't want a loan consolidation company masquerading as a credit counselling agency) will help you understand your options. Pick up the phone and get going!


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## the-royal-mail (Dec 11, 2009)

Last May, you started a thread and asked for our help. At the time you said you were focused on debt repayment. I said you needed to find the source of the money leak FIRST, prior to shell games and the like. I sensed at the time you had no interest in that, only on debt repayment. Today, you are panicking and seem interested in shell games, consolidation etc but continue to ignore what we are telling you about reducing your expenses, learning to say no to things and such.

Even if someone handed you $2000 gift right now, I am not convinced you have changed your ways.

For right now, I don't know what else you can do besides talk to the bank. That might get you past the current hump but unless you change your mindset towards spending money that will only be temporary relief at best.

Anyone here want to sneer at me now about my opinions on savings and emergency funds?


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

the-royal-mail said:


> Last May, you started a thread and asked for our help. At the time you said you were focused on debt repayment. I said you needed to find the source of the money leak FIRST, prior to shell games and the like. I sensed at the time you had no interest in that, only on debt repayment. Today, you are panicking and seem interested in shell games, consolidation etc but continue to ignore what we are telling you about reducing your expenses, learning to say no to things and such.
> 
> Even if someone handed you $2000 gift right now, I am not convinced you have changed your ways.
> 
> ...


I was focused since last May about repaying my loans and I did payback about $6000 in a matter of 4 months. But last september I had an emergency(too personal to tell) for about $25000 and I had to take RRSP and other funds out. I even took out the 100,000 points in my credit card as registered rewards and used it for the emergency. The reason I'm posting this again is, since I started posting I have changed my spending dramatically. Now more people make me realize that I need to change. I will never go back to the same spending spree. I just need a temporary solution to get out of the hole I dug. A re consolidation will save me from late payments and what not.


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

Regarding consolidation, I don't think any of us can tell you if you'd be approved or not. 

If you want help shaving your budget, you could post your current monthly payments and perhaps we could provide some help.

Common places to save money:
- cable/internet/cellphone
- car 
- entertainment
- eating out (are you brown bagging your lunch? cooking dinner at home every day?)


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## Young&Ambitious (Aug 11, 2010)

Can you sell some unused objects? Can you pick up a temporary job or work overtime? Move to lower-cost housing? Take public transit or use your bicycle? Eat out your fridge, freezer and cupboards. Those are some additional actions that could help.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

Spudd said:


> Regarding consolidation, I don't think any of us can tell you if you'd be approved or not.
> 
> If you want help shaving your budget, you could post your current monthly payments and perhaps we could provide some help.
> 
> ...





Young&Ambitious said:


> Can you sell some unused objects? Can you pick up a temporary job or work overtime? Move to lower-cost housing? Take public transit or use your bicycle? Eat out your fridge, freezer and cupboards. Those are some additional actions that could help.



Starting may I'm taking bus to work and sold the car I had. So there is no more car payments.

My expenses per month are:

Rent: 400
Phone + Cable + Power: 150
Groceries: 150 (I'm sharing it with room mates so roughly 450 per month for 3 of us)
Loan: 858
Memberships and license fee for self business: 200
Other expenses 200(includes eating out, bus($80) and entertainment)

So I got lot of room to repay. But since I had this emergency fund requirement I am left with 3 payday loans to be repaid on next pay day. Which exceeds the pay and I have to re loan just to pay all 3 in full.


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## YYC (Nov 12, 2012)

Can you post the amounts of the payday loans and the repayment cost each pay day? It seems with the amount of wiggle room you have in your budget you should be able to get these cleaned up fairly quickly.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

the-royal-mail said:


> Anyone here want to sneer at me now about my opinions on savings and emergency funds?


No sneering but surely you understand that "need for a large emergency fund" is correlated with "likelihood of experiencing financial emergencies." 

Having good money management habits and good savings habits (ahem, a very large fraction of the CMF population, I would wager - except I don't lay wagers, part of my good money management habits) obviates the need for a large emergency fund. 

Which isn't to say that there aren't demonstrable instances where the existence of a liquid "emergency fund" would save someone's bacon. But! You are unlikely to find a lot of those situations here, so you are kind of preaching to the wrong audience. I'm pretty clear I've transferred financial risk where I can. I can't even imagine what kind of situation would require $25K in liquid cash (or rephrase that as some fraction of my net worth which represents what $25K represents to the OP's net worth). I can't imagine it, and I'm a pretty imaginative person, so...I'm good with no "emergency fund" as you define it.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

next pay day I owe 1225 + 750x2 = 2725, so that's greater than my next pay day pay. For this reason I have to take another payday loan to cover everything.

So next month I will owe 900 for payday loan. I have consolidation loan payment of 858, rent and other stuffs where I would need additional 1800 or so which I won't have. You can see how I'm failing to stop taking payday loans.

So if I have the extra 2000, I will stop using payday loans and save a lot to meet my expense and save more.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

And for an arbitrary size emergency fund, there exists a hypothetical scenario where your immediate liquidity needs will exceed that amount. This is where probability comes in... for someone in OP's position, a $25k emergency fund would have been unreasonable, and still insufficient to have seen him through this event.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Huh. It's like set theory!


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

To answer your question, you have to go to your bank and ask them for options which will get you some more cash to get you through this situation. If they refuse you, then you can look at plan B. Stop wasting your time with us and go to your bank right now. Make sure you tell them about the $25k payout as well.

I'm not a banker, but I don't see why the fact that you recently consolidated will automatically exclude you from doing it now. If you are eligible for more credit, they will likely give it to you. That's what banks do.

If that doesn't work out then do as YYC suggested and see if you can just get the payday loans paid off from your normal cash flow even if it takes a paycheck or two.


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

vigmoney said:


> next pay day I owe 1225 + 750x2 = 2725, so that's greater than my next pay day pay. For this reason I have to take another payday loan to cover everything.
> 
> So next month I will owe 900 for payday loan. I have consolidation loan payment of 858, rent and other stuffs where I would need additional 1800 or so which I won't have. You can see how I'm failing to stop taking payday loans.
> 
> So if I have the extra 2000, I will stop using payday loans and save a lot to meet my expense and save more.


I'm not following the math. If you keep taking out smaller and smaller payday loans, then with your income and low expenses, they should be eliminated fairly soon - no? Taking a loan to cover a shortfall is not an all or none proposition (ie stuck in payday loans). Am I missing something?


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## Pennypincher (Dec 3, 2012)

!!!! I am suuuuuuper curious now what the $25,000 was needed for.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

It sounds like all the debt is unsecured credit, you are technically insolvent..........debts vs assets.

I would recommend you arrange a meeting with a bankruptcy trustee to discuss your options.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Yes, consumer proposal - a step before bankruptcy which clears your debts owing without the credit score hit of bankruptcy.


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## jamesbe (May 8, 2010)

I'm also confused. There must be something you can do / skip a payment on etc to get rid of the payday loans.


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## Young&Ambitious (Aug 11, 2010)

Can your work give you an advance on your next paycheque?


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## Argonaut (Dec 7, 2010)

Debt consolidation sounds great from his point of view, but it won't from the bank's. All risk, no reward. Especially with the default in December, I can't see that going through.

The answer to the problem is not more credit. This feels like the US debt ceiling. The solution is to cease all spending immediately. Still making $4000/month, no excuse for not fixing this right away.


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

Pennypincher said:


> !!!! I am suuuuuuper curious now what the $25,000 was needed for.


Loan shark?


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## Homerhomer (Oct 18, 2010)

Four Pillars said:


> Loan shark?


Bail money ?



vigmoney said:


> Starting may I'm taking bus to work and sold the car I had. So there is no more car payments.
> 
> My expenses per month are:
> 
> ...


You have expenses under control, I would suggest getting extra work at least until you don't need payday loans.

And stop putting yourself in the position where you would need $25K emergency fund.


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## YYC (Nov 12, 2012)

Expenses per month:

Rent: 400
Phone + Cable + Power: 150
Groceries: 150 (I'm sharing it with room mates so roughly 450 per month for 3 of us)
Loan: 858
Memberships and license fee for self business: 200
Other expenses 200(includes eating out, bus($80) and entertainment)

$4000 per month gross is around $3300 take home, I think.

Your expenses are $1808 per month.

$3300 - $1808 = $1492 per month. Am I right so far, ish?

So next payday, pay the payday loan people $746 (I'm assuming you get paid twice a month, obviously number change slightly if this assumption is incorrect). Keep the remaining $904 to live on for half a month. Tell them to suck a lemon and they can wait for the remainder. The following paycheck give them another $746. Rinse and repeat until you don't owe them any more money.

There is no way taking more payday loans to keep making the payments on payday loans makes sense. Better to declare bankruptcy or have your credit get screwed a little bit by a couple of missed payments. You need to stop the bleeding.


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## Echo (Apr 1, 2011)

YYC said:


> So next payday, pay the payday loan people $746 (I'm assuming you get paid twice a month, obviously number change slightly if this assumption is incorrect). Keep the remaining $904 to live on for half a month. Tell them to suck a lemon and they can wait for the remainder. The following paycheck give them another $746. Rinse and repeat until you don't owe them any more money.
> 
> There is no way taking more payday loans to keep making the payments on payday loans makes sense. Better to declare bankruptcy or have your credit get screwed a little bit by a couple of missed payments. You need to stop the bleeding.


I don't think it works that way. In order to get your payday loan, you'll need to give them a post-dated cheque for the full amount owed on payday. You can't just tell them to suck a lemon. The only way to stop the payday loan cycle is to find another bridge to get you through 'til you get paid (friends, family, co-worker, bank loan, c/c advance, whatever).


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## YYC (Nov 12, 2012)

So couldn't you just bounce the cheque? I mean seriously, how can a payday loan place take precedence over your basic survival costs? (I'm coming from a position of complete ignorance here, though. Never used one of these "services")


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## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

vigmoney said:


> Ok guys I posted about bad spending habits previously, but now I am in deep trouble. Due to an emergency I am simply out of money even though* I take home $4000 every month*. I have started taking out pay day loans to meet my needs. Now that I have fallen into the cycle it's never ending and I keep taking another one.


What the hell?

What kind of "emergency" was this?

There's no such thing as an emergency costing $25k unless you are a drug dealer or you gambled money you didn't have.

For everything else - there's insurance.

You should just quit now. You will never make it.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

All y'all don't understand how payday loans work. I went to grad school with Greg Selinger, who, when he was Finance Minister in Manitoba, managed to get legislation passed which regulates payday loan companies. Greg has long wanted to the feds to regulate payday loan providers, particularly to criminalize the effective rates of interest charged by payday loan companies, which can exceed 400%. http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/personalfinance/payday-loans.html

The OP is stuck in what are called "rollovers," which extend the loans at HUGE penalties.


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## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

YYC said:


> So couldn't you just bounce the cheque? I mean seriously, how can a payday loan place take precedence over your basic survival costs? (I'm coming from a position of complete ignorance here, though. Never used one of these "services")


You can. But then your bank charges you and the loan company does as well.


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## Koala (Jan 27, 2012)

If I had a good friend that had a true emergency, I would lend them $2000 short-term, interest free to get them out of a payday loan cycle. Do you have any friends or family like that? Maybe spread out over your roommates?

If so, take out a side job (I would tutor) and repay them with everything from that, plus whatever else you can afford.


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## lifeliver (Aug 30, 2010)

MoneyGal said:


> Yes, consumer proposal - a step before bankruptcy which clears your debts owing without the credit score hit of bankruptcy.


I work for the bank as a mortgage officer and we look at consumer proposals exactly the same way as we do at bankruptcy. You will have a very hard time getting any type of credit after a consumer proposal. In the case of a mortage you need to have your proposal discharged for 2 years and also have 1 year history of new post discharge credit from an "A" lender (good luck with this). 

The OP may as well go Bankrupt, that way they wont have to pay back the loans at all.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Yabbut no trustee is going to let him declare bankruptcy over $2000 of unpaid debt, given his cashflow. He is unlikely to be able to swing a consumer proposal, either. I just threw that out there as an example of the array of options available to people in financial difficulty.


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## Daenerys Targaryen (May 11, 2012)

There is no way someone with a net income of 4K per month should consider bankruptcy over a 2K shortfall causing a payday loan trap...I agree with the other posters here that if you get creative (odd jobs for cash, selling possessions, borrowing small amounts interest-free from a few friends or family members) there is a way to scrape together 2K and be done with payday loans.
Good luck.


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## YYC (Nov 12, 2012)

This is a decent article with some ideas of how to get out of the cycle.

http://money.msn.com/debt-management/article.aspx?post=2c9acd88-b90c-4e65-b986-8089930add5e


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

From what I read, the OP owes about 50,000 in unsecured debt, including a consolidation loan, credit cards, and payday loans.

It is unlikely a bankruptcy trustee would allow the OP to file bankruptcy because they have enough income to repay some of the debt. Bankruptcy would also require "surplus payments" of 50% of the amount above the guidelines..............1800 I believe for a single person. Any raises in income, inheritances, or any income improvements would be subject to the rules of bankruptcy.

It is true that a consumer proposal is considered the same as a bankruptcy by most lenders, ........but it isn't the same. A consumer proposal does not require "surplus income" payments or monthly expense reporting to the trustee. It is simply a consolidation of all debt, and orderly payments up to 60 months on a reduced principal. All interest and collection calls are ceased by order of the court.

In a consumer proposal, people keep their assets, such as a vehicle.

If the OP doesn't wish to file for a consumer proposal, there are a couple of other options........but they aren't great.

1) Stop paying the payday loans. Close the bank account from which they are drawn, as the payday loan companies are notorious for continually trying to put through the same cheque over and over, trying to catch the money going in on a payday. If the money happens to be there.............they get it. If the money isn't there...........the OP gets charged NSF fees. This can happen multiple times for each company.

Close the bank account and open a new one for your bills. DO NOT SEND the payday loan companies any information on your new bank account for any reason. Tell only those who need to know, your new account number.

2) Call the payday loan companies and tell them you will be in default, and you wish to have the payments spread over a year or two. Most of their contracts have a normal rate of interest for defaults. Read the fine print.

3) If the payday loan companies say no............don't pay them anything. They will call and call........sell the debt to collection agencies who will call and call.........and after 6 years in Ontario, the debt is automatically erased.

Personally, I would recommend the consumer proposal route, as it addresses all of the debts. The debtors get something, which is better than nothing, and you won't have to sell your car or other assets. You can make a payment you can afford and won't be tempted to get any credit.........because you won't qualify for few years...........which is probably a good thing. If you absolutely have to have a credit card..........you can get a secured card from a variety of lenders. There are also sub-prime lenders who will lend for a vehicle purchase, but other than that it will be hard to get any credit for a few years.

Take the money you save by not having to pay all these debts, and build up a big savings fund...............cash will help if you ever have to move and need a big deposit, buy a vehicle, or get a secured credit card.

Good luck.............and remember..........it is all part of learning and this too shall pass.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

I think the OP should do whatever you can to save a little more money. Forget the $120 for eating out and entertainment. 

I also think you should find a way to make a little more money and way you legally can. Deliver flyers, or newspapers, shovel driveways or sidewalks, fix computers, whatever you can find. 

The link posted above was a good one too. I think you need to find ways to increase your cash flow.


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## mind_business (Sep 24, 2011)

If I was in your shoes, I would:

a) find some extra weekend work
b) liquidate some personal belongings to raise some cash
c) ditch the cable bill and eating out
d) throw away your credit card(s) ... if you haven't already
e) *** DON'T BORROW ANY MORE MONEY ***

You are now in emergency mode.


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## Argonaut (Dec 7, 2010)

I think the underlying issue here is the massive emergency money needed that ruined all savings and blew up the financial picture. Was it drugs? Gambling? Jail time? Organized crime? Prostitution? Without knowing we can only wildly speculate and it serves to cloud the ability to give advice.


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## Echo (Apr 1, 2011)

YYC said:


> So couldn't you just bounce the cheque? I mean seriously, how can a payday loan place take precedence over your basic survival costs? (I'm coming from a position of complete ignorance here, though. Never used one of these "services")


From what I understand, you'll also need to sign something over as collateral - like your car, for example. It's not as easy as just bouncing the cheque or closing your bank account.


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## Sherlock (Apr 18, 2010)

Couldn't you just do a cash transfer from a credit card, then make only the minimum payment on that for a few months? Or is every single one of your credit cards fully maxed out?


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## Charlie (May 20, 2011)

If the budget numbers are right, then I think YYC's calculations should be your guide. With $1492 to go towards the $2725 payday loan, you'll need to re-up by $1400-$1500 this time, and pay it in full in a couple of months. So you're potentially two months away. Not fun, and very expensive debt, but manageable. I wouldn't mess with trying to stiff the payday loan company. They're used to bad credit risks and have processes (and fees!) that address them. 

The key is whether you're actually on budget and have the $1400/mo avail to pay down debt. (and if you do....continue on that budget and add the $1400/mo to your $800 other debt payments so you're not in this mess again and can actually get ahead). I agree with the posters who've said you do not need more debt.

Good luck.


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## indexxx (Oct 31, 2011)

Ask your bank for a line of credit- I can tap mine for emergencies and only pay about 5%. Pay off all debts with an advance on your LOC, then pay down the LOC monthly until it's gone.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

Argonaut said:


> I think the underlying issue here is the massive emergency money needed that ruined all savings and blew up the financial picture. Was it drugs? Gambling? Jail time? Organized crime? Prostitution? Without knowing we can only wildly speculate and it serves to cloud the ability to give advice.


Ok since there is so much speculation about what I did with the $25K I'm going to spill it. It was used to cover my dad's business loss. He lives abroad and owns a business. He will re pay me but will take a little time.

As far as getting a re consolidation I was told by my bank that's not possible. I'm going to just get payday loans and cover up in a month or two. I will try to work harder on my self business and get out of this trouble. I will cut down on eating out and other expenses until I get out of the payday cycle.


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## PuckiTwo (Oct 26, 2011)

vigmoney said:


> ......what I did with the $25K I'm going to spill it. It was used to cover my dad's business loss. He lives abroad and owns a business. He will re pay me but will take a little time.


Vigmoney, what an honourable thing to do! Seriously, every parent would wish to have such a son or daughter. Your parents must we very very proud of you. Yes, you are a bit in trouble right now but you spend the money for somebody who means something to you. Congratulations! As Humble would say: Chapeau!


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## YYC (Nov 12, 2012)

vigmoney said:


> Ok since there is so much speculation about what I did with the $25K I'm going to spill it. It was used to cover my dad's business loss. He lives abroad and owns a business. He will re pay me but will take a little time.
> 
> As far as getting a re consolidation I was told by my bank that's not possible. I'm going to just get payday loans and cover up in a month or two. I will try to work harder on my self business and get out of this trouble. I will cut down on eating out and other expenses until I get out of the payday cycle.


Good job, you can do it. I'm in the process of digging out of debt as well. It's painful, but you just gotta suck it up and slowly and steadily make progress.


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## Homerhomer (Oct 18, 2010)

vigmoney said:


> Ok since there is so much speculation about what I did with the $25K I'm going to spill it. It was used to cover my dad's business loss. He lives abroad and owns a business. He will re pay me but will take a little time.
> 
> As far as getting a re consolidation I was told by my bank that's not possible. I'm going to just get payday loans and cover up in a month or two. I will try to work harder on my self business and get out of this trouble. I will cut down on eating out and other expenses until I get out of the payday cycle.


It's great to know that your family and loved once have someone to lean on in times of need, good on you (you did mention that it was embarassing to mention, not sure what so embarassing in helping out family member if such is the case).
Now you have identified your problem, you have identified how it can be fixed, and what options are not available to you (don't dwell on it) just move on towards resolving the issues asap. Once your immediate problems are solved don't go back to your previous ways, work towards a plan of financial stability.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Sending another virtual slap on the back and "good one" to you. Children are our true pensions and you have provided a very literal demonstration of that!


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

Well as you have seen from my previous posts my dad has paid my college fees(about $50,000 as I was international student). I'm what I'm because of him. My dad last year at the same time I realized I should spend less had a major loss. 

Like I said my dad is running the business for more than 40 years and he will likely get back to normal within months. 

Since I have been to the forum I have sold my car, stopped ordering food, found room mates. Yet I'm in the hole.

Now my question is: 

What will happen if I miss two or three payments? I earn enough and dont need any credit in next 3 or 4 years until I at least have about 10,000 net worth. Is it ok to miss payments and end payday cycle?


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## Charlie (May 20, 2011)

You're young and don't really know when you'll need credit. So I'd advise not missing payments. Make the mins. Re-up with the payday loan sharks for a month or two and dig yourself out of this mess. Don't make it worse.


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## the-royal-mail (Dec 11, 2009)

Can you not forecast where you'll be in 1, 2, 6 months etc by your budgeting spreadsheet, software etc? Please tell me you're at least tracking expenses and money in/out on a budget program.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

I think you need to lay it on your Dad about the payday loan vortex. I doubt that he thought he was putting you in that mess. Be open about your situation with him. It is one thing to be the brave son and totally another to be sucked down because of his problems.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

I have a mac that I can sell for about $1500. PS this is the one I use for self business but recently I'm making only about 200 to 300 a month. Is it worth to sell it off and pay off the pay day loan(If I pay early I do get pro rated interest where I can save about $200) and then try to get one with equal payment option for 2 years from futureshop for $2000? I know it's a $500 difference, but I will be updating a newer machine and similarly will be saving the pay day loan cycle,.


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## Erome (Jan 11, 2011)

When you say self business, are you just doing calculations, spreadsheets, etc on it?

Any reason you need a *$2000* super fancy Mac for that?

My CA brother uses a $800 dell machine for all his accounting practices...

I use a $1100 Dell I7 system for advanced gaming...


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

kcowan said:


> I think you need to lay it on your Dad about the payday loan vortex. I doubt that he thought he was putting you in that mess. Be open about your situation with him. It is one thing to be the brave son and totally another to be sucked down because of his problems.


+1 Kudos for wanting to help your Dad, but don't sink your own ship in the process.


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## marina628 (Dec 14, 2010)

My friend skipped out on a money mart bill and after 2 years still don't show on her credit file.I would not put the relationship with your bank at risk .i would make the payday loan people wait ,why give them $800 to just have to reborrow in a few days.Better to make arrangements upfront with them than compromise the bank loan .


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## thebomb (Feb 3, 2012)

vigmoney said:


> I have a mac that I can sell for about $1500. PS this is the one I use for self business but recently I'm making only about 200 to 300 a month. Is it worth to sell it off and pay off the pay day loan(If I pay early I do get pro rated interest where I can save about $200) and then try to get one with equal payment option for 2 years from futureshop for $2000? I know it's a $500 difference, but I will be updating a newer machine and similarly will be saving the pay day loan cycle,.


seriously? I rarely respond to this type of thread, but dont you see that it is exactly this type of thinking that could be a part of your current financial status?


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## Sherlock (Apr 18, 2010)

No the $2000 one isn't good enough, you need to get the macbook pro with the 3rd gen i7 and retina display which will cost $2800 + tax, it's the minimum you need to run a business.


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## Echo (Apr 1, 2011)

Retina display is vital to operating a business.


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## slacker (Mar 8, 2010)

I will sell my computer before missing out on a debt payment. Do you have a smartphone? how much would that fetch? $300-$400 ?

Have you considered the food bank to help reduce the food budget?

I think you have gotten enough lectures on saving more money. And from the sounds of it, you did a good job. Family is family, and that's a higher priority than money and possessions.

I will look at this from a different angle. An emergency fund sure can help in this situation, but have you considered why there is no one to help you in this situation? Close friends? Significant other? Are they available to help? Are you too proud to ask?

If you don't have this social safety net, do consider nurturing these relationships in the future.

Relationships is also an important resource to draw on in an emergency. I know in some cultures and certainly on CMF, borrowing money from friends and family is almost a taboo subject. But I have help friends and family out on a number of occasions, and they had all worked out well.


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## Argonaut (Dec 7, 2010)

Re: New Macbook. That's the same line of reasoning my friend goes through whenever he buys himself a new truck. OP is probably a spender for life. It's okay, we need spenders and savers both.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

Argonaut said:


> Re: New Macbook. That's the same line of reasoning my friend goes through whenever he buys himself a new truck. OP is probably a spender for life. It's okay, we need spenders and savers both.


Geez, yes I am a spender well was a spender and trying to get back to regular life. I run 3 web servers, need to run photoshop and write mobile apps and thus need the most powerful machine. If you are of zero help to a thread don't reply please.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

slacker said:


> I will sell my computer before missing out on a debt payment. Do you have a smartphone? how much would that fetch? $300-$400 ?
> 
> Have you considered the food bank to help reduce the food budget?
> 
> ...


I run web servers that need to run 24x7 and needs high powered machine. Your other points were helpful and thanks for those.


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## vigmoney (Feb 23, 2012)

Thanks, I spoke with the payday loan people and got an extension for my payment. This means I will pay sooner than I thought and wouldn't be taking another one to pay off the previous one. 

Hopefully things will soon come in to place and I will live by means as much as possible. This forum has helped me a lot and thanks for it.


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## YYC (Nov 12, 2012)

vigmoney said:


> I run 3 web servers, need to run photoshop and write mobile apps and thus need the most powerful machine. If you are of zero help to a thread don't reply please.


Are you selling hosting? Or just using the servers to host the apps? 3 web servers to only make $300 a month (I saw this somewhere, I think, is it accurate?) seems like a pretty bad ratio. Are you including power and maintenance costs in the calculation? 3 servers uses a lot of electricity, or are you co-hosting them somwhere else? 

If you're tech savvy, why not make a bit of extra money by doing computer repair services? You can easily bill yourself out at $60-$100 an hour cleaning viruses, fixing printers, etc. Doing residential work isn't exactly steady, but it's easy to put up a flyer in any local 50+ buildings or retirement homes and get a bit of work. Wouldn't take much of it to make a big difference in your monthly picture.

If you're a developer and hardware/user support isn't your deal, why not outsource yourself using elance.com or a similar site. Speaking as someone who has hired developers through sites like this before, I tend to prefer to hire native English speakers to do my projects, even if they cost slightly more. Again, this could be a very easy way, within your existing skill set, to earn a nice little chunk of extra money.

Best of luck, hopefully you can get out of the vicious cycle.


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