# i need some urgent advice thank you



## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

here is my situation

i dont wanna file bankruptcy because ill lose a 12k disability tax credit im applying for

consumer proposal/ consolidated debt/ debt management program is not an option since i have zero income

im litteraly thinking of just waiting the debt out till the statue of limitations is hit ... its like 60k in debt and there is zero way ill be able to pay it 
i dont have a wage so they cant garnish anything... 

a) i dont have a car or house HOWEVER my mom has an apartment (where im living, hence the address is on file ) that she is mortgaging ...my question is can they LEGALLY take stuff on an apartment thats under HER name not mine... my understanding is that they cant ... i just dont want my family to be in any way shape or form liable for my actions thats why i wanna do as much research as i can and make sure I fully understand all the consequences
as of right now the cards have been paid due to me doing a cash advance to pay them but that will not last forever specially with the promotional rates ending soon

I also heard about peaceful entry meaning that a bailiff cant enter your house unless he has peacefully enter your residence first, does this apply to quebec... and this is the theory but in really life is it possible to block a bailiff at your door

what if i litteraly move out of the country can they do anything



If there is one just one question that I would really appreciate the answer too its this one as I absolutely don’t want anything to happen to my family 
regarding the banks 

b) can a creditor go after a bank account OTHER than the one you had originally acquired debt with... for instance i had a card with bank A... i decide to stop using bank A and use bank B as my main bank account ... this account has never had an issue. can company A withdraw the money in bank B

please i also need an specific answer regarding this

in case you are wondering why i need a bank account i may get a registered disability savings plan that has to be under MY NAME only I also have a bit of cash

c) how does bank garnishment work exactly… is it done once or is it recurring … if its recurring how long does this last? 
Is there ANYTHING else a credit collector can do to me apart from the options mentioned above … which according to my research are wage garnishment, bank garnishment , writ of execution , going after property

im also thiking of settling if it gets to around ten cents on a dollar with mom help mainly and just a tiny tad of money i have i just dont know between waiting it out and settling which is better... 

d) im thinking of going solo against creditors if ever im sued , I know about affirmative defense (prove to me I have a contract with you in written , prove to me you own the loan and how much you paid for it in written , proof of judgement etc) ive done some homework but what I don’t know is the exact steps I should take to defend myself … e.i example what form to file in to ask discovery how to exactly reply to a summit… what exactly should be written in the settlement so that my credit isn’t as affected … I would appreciate any tips regarding this

e) do BANKS NOT collection agencies sue people has this ever happened, or is it only collection agencies , my understanding is that after six months the debt gets transferred to a collector… and they are the ones who sue you but never the banks am I correct?

f) would anyone recommend a good trustee or even a pro bono lawyer… not necessarily to take the case but to guide me as to how to defend myself

g) if heard of an insurance that pays your minimun card payments if ever you have health issues my point is that given that I have no income whatsoever is it worth it to try it out or would I get denied


EDIT: to clarify ... i have dual citizenship and family abroad ... i would just take a suitcase and pay nothing ... this is why me moving abroad is feasible.... that being said after doing some research im more leaning towards settling the debts with fam help


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## Daniel A. (Mar 20, 2011)

WOW you are way over thinking this !!!!!

First you really need to sit down with a trustee and get your facts straight.
#1- they will know all your bank accounts its part of your credit report, save yourself all the drama and go see a trustee.


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

Check out this website:
https://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/oca-bc.nsf/eng/ca02193.html

They recommend a couple of different debt counselling services in Quebec, which should be free to consult:

Union des consommateurs
Union is a consumer organization made up of 10 ACEFs (Association coopérative d'économie familiale) as members.

Tel.: 514-521-6820
Outside Montreal: 1-888-521-6820
Union des consommateurs's Website 
(in French only)

Coalition des associations de consommateurs du Québec
The CACQ is a national group of consumer associations of which, 22 organizations that provide credit counselling services are members.

Tel.: 514-362-8623
CACQ's Website 
(in French only)


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

See a licensed bankruptcy trustee.

Given the information at hand, I would think they would advise you to simply stop paying the debt and default.

With no money, no assets and no job.........there isn't much else that can be done.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

first of thank you very much for all your answers ....for people telling me to see a trustee i have an appointment Tuesday... to be quite honest the only thing that really concerns me its my moms property cuz like you said the cant do anything to me i have no job , little to no assets ... and the bank accounts just to clarify the gouv puts around 3k in a disability savings account if ever i qualify ... ... spudd really helpful ill go check that out


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## Daniel A. (Mar 20, 2011)

The only problem your mom could have is if she co-sighed for you, only in that case would she be involved.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

Daniel A. said:


> The only problem your mom could have is if she co-sighed for you, only in that case would she be involved.


no she didnt shes mortaging the apartment and its under her name ONLY the problem is that the address if on file as im living here


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## Daniel A. (Mar 20, 2011)

catsarepretty said:


> no she didnt shes mortaging the apartment and its under her name ONLY the problem is that the address if on file as im living here


No worries about where you live it does not matter.


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## Bruins63 (Jan 18, 2018)

I’ll reiterate what others have said...u r waaaaay over thinking this...a good trustee should be able to put your mind at ease...bad things happen to good people...in the big picture you are merely noise as your debts aren’t high...if you’re a good person, not trying to mess with the system, u will be ok...they can’t get blood from a stone...there are many many many other BIG defaulters that the system needs to worry about...just my opinion, but do have some experience with this...


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

are you sure im litteraly thinking of moving outside the country till the statue of limitation expires or until i can get back on my fit and either settle or pay in full....i just feel uneasy with my moms address on file


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

Bruins63 said:


> I’ll reiterate what others have said...u r waaaaay over thinking this...a good trustee should be able to put your mind at ease...bad things happen to good people...in the big picture you are merely noise as your debts aren’t high...if you’re a good person, not trying to mess with the system, u will be ok...they can’t get blood from a stone...there are many many many other BIG defaulters that the system needs to worry about...just my opinion, but do have some experience with this...


thank you for your nice words


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

catsarepretty said:


> are you sure im litteraly thinking of moving outside the country till the statue of limitation expires or until i can get back on my fit and either settle or pay in full....i just feel uneasy with my moms address on file


You have already been advised that if your mother has not co-signed anything for you, she has no legal obligations to your debts and no one can touch her assets. In simplest terms, you are simply a tenant in your mother's house/apartment.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

thanks to all


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

You haven't said the nature of your debt, but if it goes to a collection agency you can expect them to be aggressive, to the point of contacting your mother if they can and harassing /guilting her. Not something I'd wish on a friend or a mother. Hopefully she's on your side.

You haven't mentioned whether you have any assets. They can be seized. I've seen wheel locks put on a Camaro in a bar parking lot so the delinquent owner couldn't drive off before a flatbed truck arrived to seize it.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

can i go to jail over this... the answer seem to be no but apparently there is a loophole ... i am wondering if this applies to quebec

The practice is definitely underhanded, but is it illegal?
Again, keep in mind that debtors’ prison is supposed to be abolished in the U.S. back in the 1800s and under the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act (FDCPA) even the mere act of a collector threatening you with jail time is supposed to be against the law. That’s right, just for saying you could go to jail over a debt a collector is supposed to be open to face a civil suit where you could receive a cash compensation for being threatened.

So what gives?

Basically, debt collectors have found ways – at least in certain states – to exploit a loophole in the system so people can potentially get arrested over a debt. Here’s how it works:

You have an unpaid debt that the original creditor charges off and sells to a third-party debt collector.
That collector attempts to collect but you either dodge them or simply don’t pay because you don’t have the funds to do so.
As a result, the collector files a civil suit against you in your state’s court system.
In many cases, you may not even know you’re being sued, but in any case you fail to appear at the hearing – something that according to NerdWallet’s report happens about 90% of the time
A default judgment is entered against you.
That order can then be used to obtain wage garnishment and bank liens by the collector to get you to pay
However in about one third of the states in the U.S. the collector can also use that judgement to get arrest warrants for failing to comply with a court order.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> You haven't said the nature of your debt, but if it goes to a collection agency you can expect them to be aggressive, to the point of contacting your mother if they can and harassing /guilting her. Not something I'd wish on a friend or a mother. Hopefully she's on your side.
> 
> You haven't mentioned whether you have any assets. They can be seized. I've seen wheel locks put on a Camaro in a bar parking lot so the delinquent owner couldn't drive off before a flatbed truck arrived to seize it.


well i was planning on changing/ cancelling phone numbers, im thinking of moving out if necessary problem is i have no money to move out.... i will however talk to my mom to see if this is somehow possible so that shes not affected in any way shape or form including harassment ...i wanna take responsibility on this and my family should not suffer for my actions...


assets ... no car, no house... i have a 5 year old computer , a screen, a lamp , a chair, a speaker, a sound card, some headphones a 3 year old cellphone and thats it ... which my understanding is that they can be all exempt 

the debt i screwed up with cryptos yes i was an idiot... i know ...


btw i acreated an account for my mom and by mistake posted this message using her account ... its to be approved by admins


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

Reason is not really important, **** happens. The point is you are working to understand the implications and your options. You have gotten some suggestions here to pursue.
Don't get overly stressed about this. The world is afloat in debt and people dealing with it.
I would not make major life changes such as moving out etc. Hang in there, pursue the suggestions.
My only reason for mentioning collections is because they can be aggressive if you've not encountered them before. Stand your ground, if they harass your Mom tell them nicely to f off, she has nothing to do with your debt.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> Reason is not really important, **** happens. The point is you are working to understand the implications and your options. You have gotten some suggestions here to pursue.
> Don't get overly stressed about this. The world is afloat in debt and people dealing with it.
> I would not make major life changes such as moving out etc. Hang in there, pursue the suggestions.
> My only reason for mentioning collections is because they can be aggressive if you've not encountered them before. Stand your ground, if they harass your Mom tell them nicely to f off, she has nothing to do with your debt.


=) thank you for helping me out


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## Oldroe (Sep 18, 2009)

I had a guy tell me to offer 3 party collector .10 on dollar and they will likely take .25. 

They will threaten your credit score and you counter if you do it's zero. This dude was pretty slippery

so maybe, couldn't make things much worst.


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## off.by.10 (Mar 16, 2014)

catsarepretty said:


> the debt i screwed up with cryptos yes i was an idiot... i know ...


Do you owe the government anything significant (ie. taxes on capital gains) ? They tend to have different rules so it might be worth knowing.

As a general rule, Quebec has fairly pro-consumer laws and debt collectors can't do that much, especially if you have nothing. There are laws on when, where and how often they are allowed to call you. I'm pretty sure they are not allowed more than one call per day. They are not allowed to call friends and relatives. etc. In some cases, it's good for you to know the rules so you can remind them ;-)


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## coptzr (Jan 18, 2013)

Get some help and professional advice. The replies here have been helpful I'm sure but considering leaving the country. If you want real problems, that's how to get them. Make an appointment, deal with your issue up front and in person, take the time and make the calls. It only.takes a few years to get back on track if you have the discipline.


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

catsarepretty said:


> well i was planning on changing/ cancelling phone numbers, im thinking of moving out if necessary problem is i have no money to move out.


You have no money to move out of mom's home, yet you have the funds required to leave the country until the "statue" of limitations (a relative to the Statue of Liberty perhaps?) expires. That's interesting.

You mention being in Quebec, but then, in post #15, you make many references to US law and practice. Not clear how that figures in all of this.

I know nothing of Quebec law, but in BC (and in most common law jurisdictions), fleeing the jurisdiction won't accomplish much unless you have no plans to return. Your absence will not prevent a lawsuit from being commenced and default judgment (which you seem to know something about) taken against you. Here in BC, a judgment is good for 10 years and may be renewed by suing on the judgment. That way, the judgment creditor can hide in the weeds until you happen to come into some money (or get a job or acquire assets) years from now and then strike, realizing upon the judgment.

I know I am against the tide here, but I grew up learning that you pay your debts and you accept the consequences of your mistakes. As may be seen from much advice given on cmf, the modern view is that if there's a way to duck out, take it. 



catsarepretty said:


> the debt i screwed up with cryptos yes i was an idiot... i know ...


I think you should start a thread here on how to speculate on someone else's dime. You'll enjoy a substantial following. Nothing idiotic about figuring out how to gamble without accepting the risk.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Mukhang pera said:


> I know I am against the tide here, but I grew up learning that you pay your debts and you accept the consequences of your mistakes. As may be seen from much advice given on cmf, the modern view is that if there's a way to duck out, take it.
> 
> I think you should start a thread here on how to speculate on someone else's dime. You'll enjoy a substantial following. Nothing idiotic about figuring out how to gamble without accepting the risk.


Actually I am with you. It's a hard lesson, but the OP needs to take ownership and personal pride. Stand up and be counted. Seems the OP has some money hidden in a bank account somewhere. How does one fund an escape to another jurisdiction anyway?


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## Zipper (Nov 18, 2015)

While you are at it do a very thorough sweep for bugs. Check all the light fixtures, behind the switchplates, inside the TV, behind all baseboards, and if there is crown moulding take them down too because you just never know. And if you have a cellphone ditch it.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

coptzr said:


> Get some help and professional advice. The replies here have been helpful I'm sure but considering leaving the country. If you want real problems, that's how to get them. Make an appointment, deal with your issue up front and in person, take the time and make the calls. It only.takes a few years to get back on track if you have the discipline.


i have changed my mind regarding this ill stay and eventually try to settle with fam help


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

> You have no money to move out of mom's home, yet you have the funds required to leave the country until the "statue" of limitations (a relative to the Statue of Liberty perhaps?) expires. That's interesting.
> 
> You mention being in Quebec, but then, in post #15, you make many references to US law and practice. Not clear how that figures in all of this.
> 
> ...



the moving out of the country thing ... i would be living with fam abroad would not pay anything nor move anything per say.... ill just take a suitcase .... that being said after doing some research im more leaning towards staying and settling the debts with family help


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

Oldroe said:


> I had a guy tell me to offer 3 party collector .10 on dollar and they will likely take .25.
> 
> They will threaten your credit score and you counter if you do it's zero. This dude was pretty slippery
> 
> so maybe, couldn't make things much worst.



honestly i dont care much about my credit score .... not planing to buy a house or car any time soon... plus it can always be rebuilt .... but ya been researching on this


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

off.by.10 said:


> Do you owe the government anything significant (ie. taxes on capital gains) ? They tend to have different rules so it might be worth knowing.
> 
> As a general rule, Quebec has fairly pro-consumer laws and debt collectors can't do that much, especially if you have nothing. There are laws on when, where and how often they are allowed to call you. I'm pretty sure they are not allowed more than one call per day. They are not allowed to call friends and relatives. etc. In some cases, it's good for you to know the rules so you can remind them ;-)


i dont think i can owe taxes in negative capital gain....


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

> I know I am against the tide here, but I grew up learning that you pay your debts and you accept the consequences of your mistakes. As may be seen from much advice given on cmf, the modern view is that if there's a way to duck out, take it.
> 
> I think you should start a thread here on how to speculate on someone else's dime. You'll enjoy a substantial following. Nothing idiotic about figuring out how to gamble without accepting the risk.
> Actually I am with you. It's a hard lesson, but the OP needs to take ownership and personal pride. Stand up and be counted. Seems the OP has some money hidden in a bank account somewhere. How does one fund an escape to another jurisdiction anyway?



i already answer the moving out with family thing but here it goes again.... i would be living with fam abroad would not pay anything nor move anything per say.... ill just take a suitcase .... that being said after doing some research im more leaning towards staying and settling the debts with family help


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

Zipper said:


> While you are at it do a very thorough sweep for bugs. Check all the light fixtures, behind the switchplates, inside the TV, behind all baseboards, and if there is crown moulding take them down too because you just never know. And if you have a cellphone ditch it.


? i dont understand


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

for those of you wondering i have family abroad i have dual citizenship thats why the moving out thing would have been feasible...


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

catsarepretty said:


> for those of you wondering i have family abroad i have dual citizenship thats why the moving out thing would have been feasible...


Somehow that scenario would look like this to me: Rather than continuing to leech off family here and face the music, you would run from your debts and leech off family somewhere else?


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

AltaRed said:


> Somehow that scenario would look like this to me: Rather than continuing to leech off family here and face the music, you would run from your debts and leech off family somewhere else?


look i already answered the family question mainly because people where wondering how could i afford to move abroad...short answer: i have fam abroad and would pay nothing... i also said that after doing some research i was more leaning towards staying here and settling with fam help instead of moving abroad... so i fail to see your point


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## Speculator (May 9, 2018)

catsarepretty said:


> for those of you wondering i have family abroad i have dual citizenship thats why the moving out thing would have been feasible...


I don't know why you are dragging family through this. (your poor mother) Hiding and feeding you and allowing you to live rent free is a BAD decision. 
What happened to you thinking that it's fun to pretend to be ten again? You seem to have zero self worth and a severe lack of do-it-yourself skills. 

Life is not fair and struggling is how it's supposed to work. It's a disgrace you don't recognize this. Just move out and take some risks. Sheesh!


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

it seems as thought whether i have answered the family question or not ... some people are just going to judge me regardless... that being said...if you read the beginning of this post im trying my best to make sure my mom is not harassed or affected ... whether you believe me or not its up to you...


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## treva84 (Dec 9, 2014)

I have a novel idea that's fairly straight forward - how about you accept the consequences of your actions rather than trying to avoid them?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

catsarepretty said:


> it seems as thought whether i have answered the family question or not ... some people are just going to judge me regardless... that being said...if you read the beginning of this post im trying my best to make sure my mom is not harassed or affected ... whether you believe me or not its up to you...


I acknowledge you said you wanted to keep your mother out of this. Good on you for doing so. And it is only right that you do so...since you appear to be getting free room and board. 

Some of the responses might seem harsh, but what I haven't heard is your willingness to 'face the music'. Why don't you have a job? Why do you think you should keep your bank account (whatever is in it) and what is this about the potential for a disability payment? There is nothing in your responses about what YOU intend to do for yourself to stand on your own feet and be a paying member of our society. You were given some good advice in the first several posts of this thread. Start with your Tuesday appointment and go from there. Everything else is noise.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

AltaRed said:


> I acknowledge you said you wanted to keep your mother out of this. Good on you for doing so. And it is only right that you do so...since you appear to be getting free room and board.
> 
> Some of the responses might seem harsh, but what I haven't heard is your willingness to 'face the music'. Why don't you have a job? Why do you think you should keep your bank account (whatever is in it) and what is this about the potential for a disability payment? There is nothing in your responses about what YOU intend to do for yourself to stand on your own feet and be a paying member of our society. You were given some good advice in the first several posts of this thread. Start with your Tuesday appointment and go from there. Everything else is noise.


i got an appoiment on tuesday with the trustee how is that not facing the music


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Donald Trump made defaulting on debt, not only an acceptable strategic business decision but a golden rung on the ladder of success.

What successful person hasn't failed numerous times.........including bankruptcy or defaults ?

I think the OP may have the makings of a future business tycoon. To be successful you gotta think strategically.......not emotionally.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

sags said:


> Donald Trump made defaulting on debt, not only an acceptable strategic business decision but a golden rung on the ladder of success.
> 
> What successful person hasn't failed numerous times.........including bankruptcy ?
> 
> I think the OP may have the makings of a future business tycoon.


that has always been my dream ... actually having a business, investing etc but i somewhat hate myself for that cuz it got me 60k in debt ... sigh


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

So pick yourself up, dust yourself off and go at it again........and again.......and again........until you succeed.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

catsarepretty said:


> i got an appoiment on tuesday with the trustee how is that not facing the music


That is a good start. 

FWIW, you should have never brought up the opportunity to 'skip the country'. Reflects badly on one's character and a key reason for the hostile feedback. You have not responded to my query about why you have no income coming in, nor why you do not appear to be doing anything about it. There are plenty of jobs of many kinds. Something for everyone.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

catsarepretty said:


> that has always been my dream ... actually having a business, investing etc but i somewhat hate myself for that cuz it got me 60k in debt ... sigh


You said crypto was the reason for your debt. Crypto is nothing more than speculating and gambling. It was neither a business, nor was it investing. Real business plans focus on real goods and services that can be financed. Try your luck at being an employee or a self-employed consultant/contractor providing goods or services.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

sags said:


> So pick yourself up, dust yourself off and go at it again........and again.......and again........until you succeed.


thank you =)


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

AltaRed said:


> That is a good start.
> 
> FWIW, you should have never brought up the opportunity to 'skip the country'. Reflects badly on one's character and a key reason for the hostile feedback. You have not responded to my query about why you have no income coming in, nor why you do not appear to be doing anything about it. There are plenty of jobs of many kinds. Something for everyone.


im looking for a job it just has not been working out... and i agree about the cryptos it was a bad decition


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## Daniel A. (Mar 20, 2011)

Let us know how things go with the trustee and if you feel more settled.


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## Karen (Jul 24, 2010)

Actually I'm quite appalled at the rather nasty comments some of you have made to catsarepretty. He's got himself into a mess; he has acknowledged his stupidity and learned his lesson; now he's trying to determine what he can do about it without harming his mother's financial situation. I don't doubt that some of you have learned some of your lessons the hard way, as he has. Give him a break!


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

thanks


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

Daniel A. said:


> Let us know how things go with the trustee and if you feel more settled.



i went talk to the trustee and well apparently i can do a consumer proposal with my mothers support... which truth be told i was 100% certain i would not qualify cuz i had no income... this was a shocker to me... that being said i would not know how to pay my mother so ill be upfront and tell her that before we engage to do anything

another option is voluntary deposit which is an option available to quebec residents only

Voluntary Deposit Service (Quebec only)
If you are a resident of Quebec, you can register at the nearest courthouse for the province’s Voluntary Deposit Service.
Under this program, you deposit money with the court monthly. The size of these payments is based on your income and number of dependents. The court then distributes the money to your creditors.

given that i have 0$ income the payments will be minimun ... the interest rate will drop to 5% ... the debt still exist thought so this is only a temporary solution... while i get back on my feet and settle or declare bankroupcy 

i truthfully thought i have research absolutely every solution out there i didnt think voluntary deposit existed so yes i do feelk more settled thanks for your concern


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## Daniel A. (Mar 20, 2011)

catsarepretty said:


> i went talk to the trustee and well apparently i can do a consumer proposal with my mothers support... which truth be told i was 100% certain i would not qualify cuz i had no income... this was a shocker to me... that being said i would not know how to pay my mother so ill be upfront and tell her that before we engage to do anything
> 
> another option is voluntary deposit which is an option available to quebec residents only
> 
> ...


I think it is helpful to others to see your response and yes there are options.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

Daniel A. said:


> I think it is helpful to others to see your response and yes there are options.


i was gonna send you a private message but it seems that option does not exist


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## off.by.10 (Mar 16, 2014)

catsarepretty said:


> i dont think i can owe taxes in negative capital gain....


There were articles recently about this. Basically, I think that if you:
- Buy low.
- Sell high.
- Buy again.
- Loose it all the next year.

You won't be able to offset the capital gain with a capital loss. I think some people ended up with no money and a tax bill in the tens of thousands. I'm no tax expert though so don't take that as the law. But if there's a chance you end up with that problem, it might be best to know about it sooner rather than later. You probably wouldn't want it to pop up a few years later.


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## Mortgage u/w (Feb 6, 2014)

you need to declare bankruptcy. you then need to find a source of income.
you have a chance to start over and make it right.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

AltaRed said:


> You said crypto was the reason for your debt. Crypto is nothing more than speculating and gambling. It was neither a business, nor was it investing. Real business plans focus on real goods and services that can be financed. Try your luck at being an employee or a self-employed consultant/contractor providing goods or services.


Does anyone know if the OP will be able to record, and preserve, capital loss (carry forward) if going through bankruptcy?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

james4beach said:


> Does anyone know if the OP will be able to record, and preserve, capital loss (carry forward) if going through bankruptcy?


I don't know, but I would think that one's capital 'loss' balance with CRA under the Income Tax Act should be separated from bankruptcy, particularly if there is no outstanding taxes owing to CRA. CRA would be near (at) the top as a creditor. Now if there was a tax refund coming, I suspect that would form part of the assets in bankruptcy court, but we have no such details. 

IOW, unless the capital losses were part of a business, I don't know how a personal non-transferable capital loss balance could be an asset in bankruptcy court.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

What I am thinking is that if the OP carefully and properly files their taxes, including recording their crypto currency losses on Schedule 3, then perhaps they will see the capital loss carry forward persist even through bankruptcy... meaning that in the future, they can basically have tax-free investment gains for a very, very long time.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I would think that is a good suggestion. The capital account is assigned to SIN so I'd think it 'should' carry through bankruptcy. But maybe the question is..... was the individual trading cryto-currency as a business? Or as an investing sideline to other employment? We know little about the OP other than the OP really had bad luck, or made very poor decisions. But I think it would be worth a try.


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

off.by.10 said:


> There were articles recently about this. Basically, I think that if you:
> - Buy low.
> - Sell high.
> - Buy again.
> ...


ill ask but i mean i doubt it as off right now im legally insolvent so i mean how could i end up in a bigger hole... i dont think its possible ill ask either way thanks


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

james4beach said:


> What I am thinking is that if the OP carefully and properly files their taxes, including recording their crypto currency losses on Schedule 3, then perhaps they will see the capital loss carry forward persist even through bankruptcy... meaning that in the future, they can basically have tax-free investment gains for a very, very long time.


ill ask about that as well thanks


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## catsarepretty (May 20, 2018)

AltaRed said:


> I would think that is a good suggestion. The capital account is assigned to SIN so I'd think it 'should' carry through bankruptcy. But maybe the question is..... was the individual trading cryto-currency as a business? Or as an investing sideline to other employment? We know little about the OP other than the OP really had bad luck, or made very poor decisions. But I think it would be worth a try.


i tried to trade cryptos and it was an effin disaster...i wouldn't know what to consider it... i guess self employment... not sure about the right term ... i think it was the latter i made some very poor choices


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