# Minivan vs 3 row SUV - why are minivans looked down upon?



## NewbieInvestor88 (Feb 21, 2021)

It seems weird to me that people look down on minivans because they are not “cool”. The 90s/00s soccer mom image has unfairly stayed with the minivan which in my opinion is the ultimate people carrier (or at least a 3rd row that can fit actual adults).

The only advantage I see to an SUV is looks, higher driving position and towing.

For example, although I like my Edge, I can’t see myself getting an Explorer or an Expedition over something like a Sienna.

Thoughts?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

It was/is about image. Minivans are the most functional people/cargo carriers there are in that class of vehicle but became 'uncool'. We had one for about 15 years until after the kids left home, after which we moved to a mid-size SUV. The Honda and Toyota versions will likely be around for a long time to come yet. Maybe the new Kia and Chrysler as well. That is enough to choose from. Every New 2021 Minivan Ranked from Worst to Best


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

You seem very concerned about what people think of your vehicle. Why would you even care?

We kept our Camry for 17 years. Now it is a 2006 Accord and a 2007 Solara in the summer. Our current neighbours mostly have late model Lexus, Mercs, Audis, and Acuras in the drive. The occasional high end NA SUV. Many have two. A few Telsa's thrown in for good measure on the next street.


Do we care what they think about what we drive???? Not for a New York Minute. Why would we?


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

I like minivans! We have Sienna 2006 and it’s very comfortable! This Sumer we couple if times went to the cottages up north. We fitted 3 bikes, puddle boat and 3 suitcases 😁


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

NewbieInvestor88 said:


> Thoughts?


Buy what you want .. it's your money.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Minivans are the most practical family haulers.
Most people love them.

I love the practicality of my Caravan, stow and go, integrated roof rack, that's wonderful.

However mine is a lemon, it's the worst most pathetic POS ever.
But you can't argue with the capability of it.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Funny how tastes change.

When I was in my 30s......a lot of people wanted one of these. They were a cool way to get around and hang around a ball diamond, soccer field, or hockey rink while the kid was playing in a tournament. They were great for a trip to the beach or an overnight fishing or boating trip.

Now you Google "customized vans" and you get pictures of shoes.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)




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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

We love the practically of mini vans but we’re one of those that never bought one. Mini vans are the most practical thing out there For day to day hauling. The other reasons we went with the SUV was because we drove through icy mountain roads to get to our cabin and at the time there was only one mini van with four wheel drive At the time. 

there still an image with mini vans, it’s not cool, but I currently drive a little versa, so I don’t care. I do remember borrowing my brothers mini van and rocking out and getting a ot of very strange looks.


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## peterk (May 16, 2010)

We're nearly resigned on getting a minivan... maybe _sigh_. The new 21 Sienna and new 22 Kia Carnival are brand new overhauls of the design and they look pretty darn OK.

Van are about 10% cheaper than their 3-row same size (exterior size) equivalent, like the Explorer, Traverse, Pallisade, Highlander, etc. But have 2x more storage and usability.

To get the same people and cargo use you need to go all the way up to the full-size _extended_ SUVs like the Suburban or Expedition MAX. Regular full size SUVs like a Tahoe or Expedition don't cut it -- they hold way less than a minivan. Full size SUV are about 1.5 - 2x more expensive than minivans.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

MrMatt said:


> However mine is a lemon, it's the worst most pathetic POS ever.
> But you can't argue with the capability of it.


The problem is you bought a Dodge Chrysler product... like we did. My one and only product I would ever own from that garbage company. Folks who had Hondas especially drove the bejesus out of them and they lasted forever. I think most of the models that still exist today will still be around for the longer term. There still is a market and they are practical for those needing more than 4 seating positions. Just like sports sedans/coupes will appeal to a segment of the market.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

My former boss had one of those family vans a number of years ago.. He bought it through his BIL who worked for GM. After two years he said the thing rattled like a 10 year old used car. Too much time in the dealer for warranty work. He kept it three years and then dumped it. The discounted price that he paid did not make up for all the problems and the poor quality.

He had two choices. Buy another discounted GM product through his BIL or buy a decent product. He passed on Chrysler. He bought a Honda. From day one he could not believe the difference in quality and performance between his former van and the Honda. Day and night. His view was that the increase in price more than paid for itself in less maintenance costs and longer service. He said that he knew they made the right decision after one week of ownership. His short list came down to Toyota and Honda. He said the Toyota salesperson was a jerk so he went with Honda.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Continuing slightly off course.... Ten? years ago, I was part of a hiking group. One of the rotating carpoolers had the Pontiac version of the GM minivan (forget the model name). I can concur it was pure junk. Those still wanting to own a minivan need to stick with Honda or Toyota....seriously!


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Plugging Along said:


> We love the practically of mini vans but we’re one of those that never bought one. Mini vans are the most practical thing out there For day to day hauling. The other reasons we went with the SUV was because we drove through icy mountain roads to get to our cabin and at the time there was only one mini van with four wheel drive At the time.
> 
> there still an image with mini vans, it’s not cool, but I currently drive a little versa, so I don’t care. I do remember borrowing my brothers mini van and rocking out and getting a ot of very strange looks.


You have the point! Just driving in snowy road can be an issue... we got stuck several times on small roads in winter up north


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

AltaRed said:


> Those still wanting to own a minivan need to stick with Honda or Toyota....seriously!


I really don't do brand loyalty because every company has issues but rather research the specific vehicles for issues. Generally you can start with car complaint sites and dig deeper from there. Many other things to consider as well, how long are you keeping it, initial cost, etc, all come into play.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Our Dodge Caravan was AWD and did per


gibor365 said:


> You have the point! Just driving in snowy road can be an issue... we got stuck several times on small roads in winter up north


Our '90s Dodge Caravan had AWD and was good in the snow (most of its years in Calgary). These days, at least a few makes have AWD, Toyota among them.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

cainvest said:


> I really don't do brand loyalty because every company has issues but rather research the specific vehicles for issues. Generally you can start with car complaint sites and dig deeper from there. Many other things to consider as well, how long are you keeping it, initial cost, etc, all come into play.


I agree one has to research the specific models and work through complaint sites, but odds are Chrysler, aka Fiat Crysler, aka Stellantis, is going to have a disproportionate percentage of dogs. They really needed to drop everything except their Jeep and Ram lines and even they have disproportionate issues. People still buy them due to discounted price but there is a reason for discounted price. The overall statistics for manufacturers don't lie.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

AltaRed said:


> Our Dodge Caravan was AWD and did per
> 
> Our '90s Dodge Caravan had AWD and was good in the snow (most of its years in Calgary). These days, at least a few makes have AWD, Toyota among them.


Our Sienna from 2006 and doesn't have AWD  . When we buy next minivan (only Toyota or maybe some European brand) - I'll make sure that it's AWD.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

AltaRed said:


> I agree one has to research the specific models and work through complaint sites, but odds are Chrysler, aka Fiat Crysler, aka Stellantis, is going to have a disproportionate percentage of dogs.


True enough, some brands have had bad track records. Just took a quick peek at dodge caravan and it seems the complaint numbers after 2016 are very low (redesign or new model in 2017?) but previous years were not very good indeed.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

But.......some of the Japanese vans are just sooooo ugly.

The new Toyota Sienna is a pretty cool vehicle......but costs like over $50,000.

The guy doesn't like the front end, which I like and it is pretty trick inside.

Personally I like clean sharp straight lines and none of that old school "malibu" roundy bubble look.

I wonder if it comes with a full length power moonroof.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

gibor365 said:


> You have the point! Just driving in snowy road can be an issue... we got stuck several times on small roads in winter up north


Mini vans have a lower clearance than even smaller SUVs. If you primarily on the city and don’t have icy or snowy roads to get over, that would be our choice. However. I live in a hilly area and even my SUV would occasionally get stuck. Forget about driving during a mountain snowstorm


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

gibor365 said:


> Our Sienna from 2006 and doesn't have AWD  . When we buy next minivan (only Toyota or maybe some European brand) - I'll make sure that it's AWD.


it was an expensive add on feature. ToyLTA was the only company that had an AWD back. There may be some more now, but that’s why Albertams who drive to the mountain and cabins a lot with have SUVs. 

i Don’t know why, but there aren’t many mini vans with AWD.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Plugging Along said:


> Mini vans have a lower clearance than even smaller SUVs. If you primarily on the city and don’t have icy or snowy roads to get over, that would be our choice. However. I live in a hilly area and even my SUV would occasionally get stuck. Forget about driving during a mountain snowstorm


We don't have mountains in ON  .99.9% Sienna with no AWD is fine..... but when you have a cottage booked in winter and there is even small snowstorm and may be a problem....


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

We have Hamilton mountain.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

sags said:


> But.......some of the Japanese vans are just sooooo ugly.
> 
> The new Toyota Sienna is a pretty cool vehicle......but costs like over $50,000.
> 
> ...


When it comes to family vans I would much rather have reliable, well built, and long lasting quality vehicle over a possibly better looking bucket of bolts competitive product. 

Most people want to have the van last at least as long as the car loan does!

When it comes to investing in a highly depreciable asset, value wins out over style all day long with us. That is why although I had years of domestic brands (a new one each year) as company cars the experience led us to look elsewhere when it came to acquiring a personal vehicle.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

gibor365 said:


> We don't have mountains in ON  .99.9% Sienna with no AWD is fine..... but when you have a cottage booked in winter and there is even small snowstorm and may be a problem....


Fair enough. I have seen your ski bumps in ON, so I can understand why no AWD is fine. 

Albertans get criticized about just wanting big gas guzzling SUV's and trucks. I can tell you there is really a necessity. I don't even want a AWD car because it doesn't have enough clearance to go over snow banks. 

If you don't need the AWD, then a mini van is great for hauling people.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Most minivans never go in tough places. They are people and cargo haulers. 

However, I would still go AWD in Canadian winters. Our '91 Dodge Caravan was AWD and it was a blessing to use in Calgary winters. So is my current '07 Infiniti an AWD. It doesn't take much in the way of slippery condition to make it worthwhile. Our current 2020 Mazda CX-5 has AWD to handle our local hills in the Okanagan including the lane to our house. I won't have anything but an AWD for a winter vehicle any more.


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## Zipper (Nov 18, 2015)

Still loving our 2011 Dodge Journey.

Bought it new in July 2011. Lots of deals back then.

Entry/exit is ideal and seats are high for geezers and there is power to spare with the big 3.6.

There is an incredible amount of storage with the seats down.

Mrs. Zipper is a crafter and we filled it to the brim with product and carried shelving on the roof rack to shows.

Carried loads of limestone rocks and flagstone for our landscaping.

All in all the perfect vehicle for us.

Now that we are slowing down we will go a step lower next time, maybe a Tucson or a Forester.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

AltaRed said:


> Most minivans never go in tough places. They are people and cargo haulers.
> 
> However, I would still go AWD in Canadian winters. Our '91 Dodge Caravan was AWD and it was a blessing to use in Calgary winters. So is my current '07 Infiniti an AWD. It doesn't take much in the way of slippery condition to make it worthwhile. Our current 2020 Mazda CX-5 has AWD to handle our local hills in the Okanagan including the lane to our house. I won't have anything but an AWD for a winter vehicle any more.


Depends where you live! If you drive only in GTA, you may not see even snow on the roads some winters


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I agree it depends on where one lives and their winter sports. Here the likelihood is not necessarily heavy snow in Dec and Jan, but ice forming on the roadways with small amounts of snow. Navigating 6-8% grades or more with just 2 wheels is difficult but not impossible. Folks near sea level on the west coast certainly don't need AWD, except for those that head off to the mountains for snowshoeing and skiing..


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## nobleea (Oct 11, 2013)

minivans are definitely looked down upon. Maybe up to a certain age. And then it's like, hey this is really practical!

My wife has been dead set against one. Forever. I didn't mind the idea, but I wasn't going to be the one driving it. We eventually got the Subaru Ascent. 3 row Suv. Can't say I was blown away. Kind of tight, poor gas mileage. Fun AWD. We eventually got rid of it when we went to 1 vehicle and stuck with the F150. Our full size truck hauls more, drives for longer, better gas mileage and can tow more for the odd time you need to. Seats 5 adults very spaciously, whereas nothing but a full size SUV like the expedition would match the head and foot space. Of course, we can't bring friends with us. We camped with friends last weekend and they had a Sienna. Wife was very impressed at what they managed to stuff in there. I can see her stance softening as she gets older.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

I am amazed to hear that some people look down on minivans. Cannot imagine why. Even more amazed that anyone would care or base their buy decision on this. Surely it is a decision of what works best for me and/or my family.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Some folk have an 'image' problem with minivans for esthetic purposes that I don't understand either. A certain family member was adamant their Honda minivan not be replaced with another one much to the chagrin of her husband. So they have a 3 row Pilot instead. He is waiting to see if she will relent someday although the likelihood is they will eventually downsize to a 2 row SUV/CUV when the teens are out of the house in 5-7 years..


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## afulldeck (Mar 28, 2012)

peterk said:


> We're nearly resigned on getting a minivan... maybe _sigh_. The new 21 Sienna and new 22 Kia Carnival are brand new overhauls of the design and they look pretty darn OK.


The Kia Carnival has a recliner chairs in the back rows and it looks pretty close to an SUV. I would have bought one if I could have gotten one. Ended up with the Ford F150.


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## off.by.10 (Mar 16, 2014)

nobleea said:


> We camped with friends last weekend and they had a Sienna. Wife was very impressed at what they managed to stuff in there. I can see her stance softening as she gets older.


The flip side is that you always pack too much stuff in a minivan. Because there's always room to put more. Just in case. Filling one takes forever. Seriously.

Another thing to consider is that while sliding doors are awesome with young children (no bumping other cars, large opening to access the child seats, etc), they don't age quite as well as regular doors. The electric type are prone to failure. Even manual ones have issues; they're complex mechanisms with rails and rollers which eventually gum up with debris. A bit more prone to freezing shut in the winter too.

Regardless, I don't think minvans are really looked down upon that much. Certainly not among parents. It's probably what marketing would have you believe because it's more profitable to sell huge SUVs.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

If people spent less time worrying about their so called 'image' and more time thinking about what is best for their finances they would be far better off.


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## Mortgage u/w (Feb 6, 2014)

Those who look down upon or dislike Minivans are those who don't need them. 

If you need one, get one.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

I have been looking at new cars and I thought I wanted a new Camaro convertible and one hit the dealer lot the other day. They are rare to find because they don't make many.

I went in and put down a deposit to hold it until my wife and I could test drive it. We arrived, put down the top and I wanted the sales guy to come along to ask questions.

We are driving along and the first thing I notice is I can barely see over the instrument panel. Then I try to put my arm on the door and it is too high....level with my ears.

Then I have to change lanes, look in the mirror and all I see is the sales guy because he can't put his legs down and has to sprawl across the seat.

I couldn't see anything and almost side swiped a car next to us. We get back to the dealer and put the top back up. Now......I really can't see anything.

I ask the wife to sit in the driver seat and go outside to the front and look at her. All I can see is the top of her hair.

The sales guy says.....yea, there is no space in the rear seats, the visibility sucks, there is no trunk and you will need good winter tires and even then it will be iffy on a bad road. He says you can move the seats up and down, and I think......sure, from one extreme to the other every time we get in.

So, I decided I didn't really want a convertible anymore.

The next day, the sales guy calls and says they took delivery of a few cars which was great because they didn't have any due to the chip shortage.

One of the vehicles was a 2022 Chevrolet Trailblazer RS AWD with all the options. We take delivery on Wednesday.

So I guess we are a small SUV/Crossover "ute" or whatever it is family now......but no fancy minivan or convertible sports cars in our future.

At least I got a sunroof.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

An aside... I did some research and GM now has an option to get a rear view mirror camera to replace the mirror type.

With a camera mounted on the back of the vehicle the driver can clearly see all the lanes behind them. There is even a camera washer included in the package.

I would think it is an option that will soon be standard equipment on all vehicles, like the back up camera is today.

I wonder how many accidents are caused by "blind spots".

Also noteworthy.......some new vehicles have wireless connection to Android Auto or Apple and wireless charging.

Vehicles keep getting better and better.


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