# auto insurance renewal ....rates up, again....



## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

Just got my annual good news renewal letter from my insurance provider!
Same 2 cars, no claims, same coverage as last year. Nothing's changed -only the premiums - up by 10.6%!
You guys finding the same?


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

Mine went down $50 plus they've been giving out rebate cheques (due to low claims) so down like $120 this year.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

cainvest said:


> Mine went down $50 plus they've been giving out rebate cheques (due to low claims) so down like $120 this year.


wow! who are you insured with?


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

I just got my bill to pay next month. Mine only went down 0.9%, but at least it didn't go up.

ltr


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

jargey3000 said:


> wow! who are you insured with?


We only have government insurance here in MB, no private stuff.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

anyone whose rate went down , could you volunteer who you're insured with? tks.
(l-t-r...?)


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## nathan79 (Feb 21, 2011)

I recently got about $400 back from ICBC. It also looks like it will be cheaper when I renew since they changed to a no-fault insurance model.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

JEEZ....


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

jargey3000 said:


> anyone whose rate went down , could you volunteer who you're insured with? tks.
> (l-t-r...?)


It's with a company that only handles group insurance.

ltr


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## spiritwalker2222 (Nov 7, 2017)

My rates went down, but not much. We pay $1,200 a year for full coverage on 2 cars. Belair direct.


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

My bill from ICBC came in at $1,047, minus $618 safe driver discount, plus $108 vehicle licence fee, for a total of $537. 

But then, in May, ICBC sent a cheque for $47 "Covid-19 Rebate" and I got $16 back for "Enhanced Care", which their letter said came into effect on May 1, so that covers the amount I overpaid last July to cover the months of May, June, July 2021.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

Do not know yet. But....I have no doubt that there will be an increase. I will shop this year at renewal, if only to verify that our premium is within the ball park of reasonable.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Mine went up $25, house insurance went way up.
I'm not surprised, we're getting lots of Toronto idiots around here. Neighbour backed out of their driveway into a parked car, then refused to pay saying "go through insurance". Stupid thing to do for a $1500 claim. 

I just deal with it, and plan on funding my retirement with insurance companies.

Really the only options are is pay through commercial insurance, or pay even more through a mismanaged government monopoly.


https://www.icbc.com/about-icbc/company-info/Documents/year-in-review-2020.pdf


Look they're losing LESS money, what progress.

Oh and how long do you think they'll be able to pay out 127% of premiums?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I don't fret about insurance premiums. Just pay them and spend that time thinking about and doing more pleasurable things. Time gets more precious every year.


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## Synergy (Mar 18, 2013)

spiritwalker2222 said:


> My rates went down, but not much. We pay $1,200 a year for full coverage on 2 cars. Belair direct.


Full coverage? So you have every single coverage available to you including the highest possible limits. That's a dangerous term.


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## Synergy (Mar 18, 2013)

Rates gone down but premiums up for me in Ontario - new car, extra coverage added, etc.


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## peterk (May 16, 2010)

Up 8% here.


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## nobleea (Oct 11, 2013)

I don't track the y/y changes, more just look at the number and wonder if that's reasonable. Just got my renewal and it's getting to the point of not being reasonable. Though I don't know if it's enough to look elsewhere. I think we're getting a good deal on the house insurance. But 1800/yr for one truck, full coverage but leisure use only seems high. No tickets, no claims. 1200-1400 would be more reasonable in my books.


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## kellanfaraday (Jul 2, 2021)

Same, man. Rates went up 7% in our area. Doesn't help that I'm in a big family with a lot of cars.


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## spiritwalker2222 (Nov 7, 2017)

Synergy said:


> Full coverage? So you have every single coverage available to you including the highest possible limits. That's a dangerous term.


Well I guess we don't have full coverage as we don't have everything. No accident forgiveness.

How is having "full" coverage dangerous?


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

spiritwalker2222 said:


> My rates went down, but not much. We pay $1,200 a year for full coverage on 2 cars. Belair direct.


my bill is $2003 for 2 toyotas. $1M liability, collision, comprehensive on each.
we drive less than 10k km. annually on each car.
With Johnsons /Unifund Ins. in NL( which was just recently bought out by Intact)
between insurance, maintenance & gas @ $1.53/L, its prob cheaper to ditch the cars & use bus, cabs!

FWIW...when I call in annually just to ask them to justify the rate increase I get the same old BS.
Today....the nice young lady said: _qoute"_Oh no, it'll NEVER go DOWN."_unquote_
I pointed out that "never" is a looooong time....but I must admit....so far, she's right....sigh...


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)




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## spiritwalker2222 (Nov 7, 2017)

What baffles me is that my rate is potentially higher cause I don't have a cell phone. As if distracted driving wasn't bad enough among the general public.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

spiritwalker2222 said:


> What baffles me is that my rate is potentially higher cause I don't have a cell phone. As if distracted driving wasn't bad enough among the general public.


I dont either. But how do they know? Never asked me.


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## spiritwalker2222 (Nov 7, 2017)

jargey3000 said:


> I dont either. But how do they know? Never asked me.


They asked me if I wanted to install "automerit" on my phone to get an additional discount. I said I don't have a phone and asked if I can get an OBDII plug in instead. They said they don't use that anymore.

And just to clarify. You need a phone with a data plan.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

jargey3000 said:


> my bill is $2003 for 2 toyotas. $1M liability, collision, comprehensive on each.


FWIW, $1M liability these days is marginal in most cases... unless for example, your cars never leave NL or the Maritimes. Most will want at least $2M, if not $3-5M if one is traveling stateside. Insurance settlements have risen for years. The default number for most people today is $2M.

What you need to know about third-party liability insurance in Canada | MoneySense


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

AltaRed said:


> FWIW, $1M liability these days is marginal in most cases... unless for example, your cars never leave NL or the Maritimes. Most will want at least $2M, if not $3-5M if one is traveling stateside. Insurance settlements have risen for years. The default number for most people today is $2M.
> 
> What you need to know about third-party liability insurance in Canada | MoneySense


ya, aware of that alta.
our cars rarely leave a 50km radius of our house, lol....but, still....


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## Synergy (Mar 18, 2013)

spiritwalker2222 said:


> Well I guess we don't have full coverage as we don't have everything. No accident forgiveness.
> 
> How is having "full" coverage dangerous?


You provided a good example above. Get involved into an at fault accident thinking you are "fully" covered (whatever that means) and you find out that you didn't have a particular coverage (accident forgiveness) that could have protected your driving record and rates for a period of 6-9 yrs. Premium doubles, can't shop around as no company want to quote a client with a recent at fault accident, etc. Client goes to his or her agent / broker. I thought you told me I had full coverage ;o). Ask any lawyer, it's dangerous! Not sure what province you are in but in Ontario there are a ton of optional accident benefits and each company has their own unique endorsements - conviction protection, waiver of depreciation, new vehicle replacement, etc. Here's another example for you. Client injured in a bad car accident, can't work for over 1 year, is the sole bread winner for the home, standard income replacement benefit on the policy is insufficient to cover his usually income / expenses, has to sell his home, etc. Client could have purchased higher limits but didn't because he or she thought they had "full" coverage already. Family with 2-3 children, 2 of the children involved in a serious car accident (negligence on the part of one of their parents - fell asleep at the wheel), children are catastrophically injured and are going to require care / assistance for the rest of their lives Parents did not purchase any of the optional benefits that could have protected their children. Lawyer advises parents / children that the only option remaining is to have the child sue the parents in an attempt to gain additional funds from insurance....


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

^Most people never think through these kinds of scenarios. They actually don't think about ANY scenarios. And it just takes one mistake at an intersection, or a 180 on an icy street/highway. NONE of us are immune to the very worst of nightmares. Don't be stupid. Buy the coverage.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

spiritwalker2222 said:


> My rates went down, but not much. We pay $1,200 a year for full coverage on 2 cars. Belair direct.


I wonder why am I being charged nearly DOUBLE that ($2300) here in NL?
( and before anyone asks, wife & I have clean records; I dont think I've EVER made a claim in my 53 years of driving!)


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## spiritwalker2222 (Nov 7, 2017)

Synergy said:


> You provided a good example above. Get involved into an at fault accident thinking you are "fully" covered (whatever that means) and you find out that you didn't have a particular coverage (accident forgiveness) that could have protected your driving record and rates for a period of 6-9 yrs. Premium doubles, can't shop around as no company want to quote a client with a recent at fault accident, etc. Client goes to his or her agent / broker. I thought you told me I had full coverage ;o). Ask any lawyer, it's dangerous! Not sure what province you are in but in Ontario there are a ton of optional accident benefits and each company has their own unique endorsements - conviction protection, waiver of depreciation, new vehicle replacement, etc. Here's another example for you. Client injured in a bad car accident, can't work for over 1 year, is the sole bread winner for the home, standard income replacement benefit on the policy is insufficient to cover his usually income / expenses, has to sell his home, etc. Client could have purchased higher limits but didn't because he or she thought they had "full" coverage already. Family with 2-3 children, 2 of the children involved in a serious car accident (negligence on the part of one of their parents - fell asleep at the wheel), children are catastrophically injured and are going to require care / assistance for the rest of their lives Parents did not purchase any of the optional benefits that could have protected their children. Lawyer advises parents / children that the only option remaining is to have the child sue the parents in an attempt to gain additional funds from insurance....


Lol, accident forgiveness is actually costumer retention. It does not protect your record or keep your rates from going up at competing insurance companies. I have never been at the same insurance company for more than 2 or 3 years. Why, cause I don't want to pay double another companies rate for "loyalty". I'd rather pay double if I'm really in an accident than double now for who knows how long. That accident forgiveness does not cover reckless driving or a "major" driving conviction, which is where you find you have a hard time getting insurance.

How much liability do you have? 2 million is max that Belair allows. I don't know if other insurance companies have higher.

Regardless, I believe car rental, roadside assistance and accident forgiveness as unnecessary. As the cost to pay those expenses out of pocket are not much, if they are needed.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

jargey3000 said:


> I wonder why am I being charged nearly DOUBLE that ($2300) here in NL?
> ( and before anyone asks, wife & I have clean records; I dont think I've EVER made a claim in my 53 years of driving!)


 ... it's a secret of the insurance companies. Are you sure that Johnson firm is the only brokerage around your place?


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## spiritwalker2222 (Nov 7, 2017)

jargey3000 said:


> I wonder why am I being charged nearly DOUBLE that ($2300) here in NL?
> ( and before anyone asks, wife & I have clean records; I dont think I've EVER made a claim in my 53 years of driving!)


Do you shop around? I don't know if NL is more or less expensive than Ontario. My experience is that after 2 or 3 years I will be paying that much or more if I stay with my current provider, as has happened with previous insurance providers. Heck at one point I had 2 separate auto policies with Aviva (underwriter) but with different brokers. I tried to combine them to one broker but it would have been significantly more. That boggled my mind.

Maybe there is an extra premium for your age? You can ask, but not much you can do about that.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

spiritwalker2222 said:


> Lol, accident forgiveness is actually costumer retention. It does not protect your record or keep your rates from going up at competing insurance companies. I have never been at the same insurance company for more than 2 or 3 years. Why, cause I don't want to pay double another companies rate for "loyalty". I'd rather pay double if I'm really in an accident than double now for who knows how long. That accident forgiveness does not cover reckless driving or a "major" driving conviction, which is where you find you have a hard time getting insurance.
> 
> How much liability do you have? 2 million is max that Belair allows. I don't know if other insurance companies have higher.
> 
> Regardless, I believe car rental, roadside assistance and accident forgiveness as unnecessary. As the cost to pay those expenses out of pocket are not much, if they are needed.


Car rental, accident forgiveness, commercial usage were a very small add on for me.

Also I have the highest deductable, but a declining deductable, so each year I don't make a claim my deductable goes down.. nice little incentive to not make claims. Also windshield repairs aren't considered a claim.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

jargey3000 said:


> I wonder why am I being charged nearly DOUBLE that ($2300) here in NL?
> ( and before anyone asks, wife & I have clean records; I dont think I've EVER made a claim in my 53 years of driving!)


Big differences in auto insurance across each province.


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## Synergy (Mar 18, 2013)

spiritwalker2222 said:


> Lol, accident forgiveness is actually costumer retention. It does not protect your record or keep your rates from going up at competing insurance companies. I have never been at the same insurance company for more than 2 or 3 years. Why, cause I don't want to pay double another companies rate for "loyalty". I'd rather pay double if I'm really in an accident than double now for who knows how long. That accident forgiveness does not cover reckless driving or a "major" driving conviction, which is where you find you have a hard time getting insurance.
> 
> How much liability do you have? 2 million is max that Belair allows. I don't know if other insurance companies have higher.
> 
> Regardless, I believe car rental, roadside assistance and accident forgiveness as unnecessary. As the cost to pay those expenses out of pocket are not much, if they are needed.


Not everyone will require all of the coverages or the highest limits available, it's highly unique to the individuals needs, risk tolerance, etc. My issue is only with the term "full coverage" and the ultimate lack of awareness, ignorance, etc. that often goes with it. Most people will not take the time to read their policy, learn about the coverage options, etc.

Most companies will offer up to 5 million if you want / need it. Other alternatives are to purchase an umbrella policy that could cover all of your exposures - cottage, boats, rec vehicles, vacant land, homes, vehicles, etc. Often much cheaper to have an underlying 1 or 2 million dollar policy and a 5 million umbrella if you have a lot of exposures.

Liability and accident benefits are the ones one needs to pay closer attention to. Law school has courses dedicated to learning about auto insurance - $$


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

Has anybody taken notice of those TD Insurance commercials in which the manager is asking her staff how to save customers money? And in the end, the narrator says customers save on average 24% by switching to TD.

What a laugh.

You generally do save money by switching. This year I saved 45% by switching out of TD Insurance after 30years.


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## martik777 (Jun 25, 2014)

Mukhang pera said:


> My bill from ICBC came in at $1,047, minus $618 safe driver discount, plus $108 vehicle licence fee, for a total of $537.
> 
> But then, in May, ICBC sent a cheque for $47 "Covid-19 Rebate" and I got $16 back for "Enhanced Care", which their letter said came into effect on May 1, so that covers the amount I overpaid last July to cover the months of May, June, July 2021.


Mine was 760 including license for the basic only, full discount for 40+ years no claims. Then I pay another 500 to BCAA for optional. You must be in a rural area? I'm in a suburb of Vancouver.


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

martik777 said:


> Mine was 760 including license for the basic only, full discount for 40+ years no claims. Then I pay another 500 to BCAA for optional. You must be in a rural area? I'm in a suburb of Vancouver.


Yes, I am in a decidedly rural area, rated as Territory Y

I also carry no collision coverage. I have purchased a few fairly expensive vehicles new, and carried collision coverage for the first 3 years. After 3 years, ICBC would take the position they are close to fully depreciated and they would pay nothing, so why carry collision?

The last vehicle I bought new was in 2016. I never took out collision coverage on it. It's now 5 years old and worth nothing in the eyes of an insurer, although less than 40,000 k on it. 

I insured vehicles in Vancouver (Territory D) for years. Back then (I think gone now), they had that "Air Care" nonsense and one had to find time to go for smog check and maybe be told one's new car needed a new engine or something if their machine said it did. I never did go through Air Care, but heard stories of the problems created for some. So, in those days, I had my vehicles rated as "Territory Z" - driven primarily outside BC. Territory Z cars did not have to undergo smog check. In those years, before I moved to the U.S., I was still driving a lot in the U.S., so I just said I had a Territory Z. car. I recall the premium was a bit higher than Territory D, but well worth it. Once I moved south, I insured in my home state.


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## martik777 (Jun 25, 2014)

Mukhang pera said:


> Yes, I am in a decidedly rural area, rated as Territory Y
> 
> I also carry no collision coverage. I have purchased a few fairly expensive vehicles new, and carried collision coverage for the first 3 years. After 3 years, ICBC would take the position they are close to fully depreciated and they would pay nothing, so why carry collision?
> 
> ...


Interesting comment on the depreciated value being near zero after 3-5 years. I will have to check what BCAA's valuation is with those timeframes.

I remember, having to insure under Territory Z one year when I needed to avoid the dreaded Aircare. Sadly most of the "benefits" of Aircare went into the pockets of unscrupulous repair shops


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