# 5 outrageous fees consumers are being charged - are there more of these dumb fees ...



## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

? Couldn't quite believe the headline but ... 

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/5-outrageous-fees-consumers-being-090000671.html ... 



> Watch Marketplace's season premiere, Canada’s Dumbest Charge, Friday Oct. 17 at 8 p.m. (8:30 p.m. in Newfoundland and Labrador).
> While Marketplace was poring through the submissions, it came across some shocking fees that seemed especially outrageous. While these didn’t make the final five, *here are some of the most ridiculous fees that Canadians are paying:
> *
> The fee you didn’t expect: *Charged for takeout
> ...


 ...:livid:


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## OhGreatGuru (May 24, 2009)

_The fee for absolutely every small cost: Staple and paperclip fee

One of the most ridiculous submissions takes nickel-and-diming to a new level. One man complained of being charged precise amounts for every office supply his lawyer used.

“[I was] charged separately for staples ($0.07 each) and paperclips ($0.12 each) on my legal bill for doing up a will.”_

He probably got the idea from US hospital billing practices, where you get charged for every bandaid & swab.


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## Jaberwock (Aug 22, 2012)

OhGreatGuru said:


> _The fee for absolutely every small cost: Staple and paperclip fee
> 
> One of the most ridiculous submissions takes nickel-and-diming to a new level. One man complained of being charged precise amounts for every office supply his lawyer used.
> 
> ...


If that happened to me, I would carefully remove the staples and the paper clips, and return them with a cheque for the total fees minus the charges for the staples and paper clips.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

Jaberwock said:


> If that happened to me, I would *carefully remove the staples and the paper clips, and return them with a cheque for the total fees minus the charges for the staples and paper clips*.


 ... LOL! That's a great idea should the need arises (hopefully not). :encouragement:


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Beaver101 said:


> ... LOL! That's a great idea should the need arises (hopefully not). :encouragement:


Well it does cost something for staples and paperclips, but these are a very small part of the service of what the lawyer charges and it does add up as I found out over 4 years of legal battles. They also charge for postage and in cases of special delivery for that as well.
IMO, The highway robbery is not the few cents for paper clips but the 13% HST that is tacked onto a legal bill of several hundred or several thousand...$130 per $1000 of billing..the gov't adding to your financial misery, but isn't it funny that as Canadians, we don't complain about the taxes charged.

Wheelchair handling fee? Was this is for a folding wheelchair or a power chair that requires special wheelchair taxis?..most taxi companies will have some kind of excess baggage fee..especially the ones at the airport, because you are at their mercy. 

As far as the pet euthanizing "being with your pet " fee..that is absolutely wrong! 
The vet was greedy $%%^&. Besides the euthanizing fee, there is... or should be no charge when you bring in a sick animal. You are already in distress as it is, for what you are authorizing the vet to do. 

At most vets, you have a choice to be present or not at the very moment the pet is put down, but no extra fee is charged for being there with the pet. I had to go through that. IMO, that vet should have been reported.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

Ridiculous indeed.

How about the very old charge of a decade+ for touch-tone service? Marketplace covered this one a year or two ago. 

Why there continues to be an extra fee for a standard service, when today, one would have to go to an antique store to find the old phones anyway? People who have rotary phones don't pay the fee, but should it not be the other way around?

I understand that consumers need to pay for upgrades, but haven't we paid for this already given touch-tone has been around for decades now? Maybe carverman can explain that one.

'Join 2night's discussion on Twitter by using the hashtag #dumbcharge.'


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

> [*carverman*]Well it does cost something for staples and paperclips, but these are a very small part of the service of what the lawyer charges and it does add up as I found out over 4 years of legal battles. They also charge for postage and in cases of special delivery for that as well.
> IMO, The highway robbery is not the few cents for paper clips but the 13% HST that is tacked onto a legal bill of several hundred or several thousand...$130 per $1000 of billing..the gov't adding to your financial misery, *but isn't it funny that as Canadians, we don't complain about the taxes charged.
> *


 ... ah yes, known as the disbursement fees ... so if the law firm offers to print 1,000 copies of whatever document that they will email, politely decline. Hope they don't charge to use their bathroom too. Re the part that Canadian don't complain about taxes??? How are we, the average Joe Canadian, is going to complain when we continue to feed the upper mandarins that approved the tax rules? 



> Wheelchair handling fee? *Was this is for a folding wheelchair *or a power chair that requires special wheelchair taxis?..most taxi companies will have some kind of excess baggage fee..especially the ones at the airport, because you are at their mercy.


 ... not sure about this one, will watch the program tonight. 



> As far as the pet euthanizing "being with your pet " fee..*that is absolutely wrong*!
> The vet was greedy $%%^&. Besides the euthanizing fee, there is... or should be no charge when you bring in a sick animal. You are already in distress as it is, for what you are authorizing the vet to do.
> 
> At most vets, you have a choice to be present or not at the very moment the pet is put down, but no extra fee is charged for being there with the pet. I had to go through that. IMO, that vet should have been reported.


 .. totally agree it's wrong ... I think that vet should be put down first ... how the hxll did he/she become a "veterinarian" in the first place??? Don't they have a code of conduct, like for physicians?


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## Sasquatch (Jan 28, 2012)

Shop charge in a garage..

yesterday I had a new muffler installed on my truck with the old muffler having a lifetime warranty, so I just had to pay for the labour to install new muffler.... fair enough
then there's a SHOP CHARGE of $ 19.95 for shop supplies ????
when I asked what these supplies were they said.... aaaah well ahem.... acetylene gas and oxygen, welding rods or wire, shop rags etc.

what a ripoff !!


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Sasquatch said:


> Shop charge in a garage..
> 
> yesterday I had a new muffler installed on my truck with the old muffler having a lifetime warranty, so I just had to pay for the labour to install new muffler.... fair enough
> then there's a SHOP CHARGE of $ 19.95 for shop supplies ????
> ...


Yes, it is..but they break it down into segments...parts., labour, shop supplies and then the taxes on top of that.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Beaver101 said:


> ...
> 
> .. totally agree it's wrong ... I think that vet should be put down first ... how the hxll did he/she become a "veterinarian" in the first place??? Don't they have a code of conduct, like for physicians?


Well, I guess the vets are talking a page from the funeral directors, who charge to witness a cremation.. 
maybe the biggest ripoff artists next to lawyers...where paperclips and staples are the least of your financial worries.

Not sure about Vets charging for witnessing the euthanasia, but some vets charge if you want to go physically to witness the cremation at the crematorium... (similar charges apply to witnessing human cremations as well).

*Additional costs:
Some crematories charge an added fee of about $45 to pick-up the body after hours and on weekends.
Some crematories allow the pet owner to view the cremation, sometimes for an added fee of about $25 or more*.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The funeral directors already charge for a graveside service ( which can be witnessing)
*Graveside Service from	$200 to $300 to $350 to $500 to $550 to $1,700 
Guest Register Book $25 to $80	*

and 

*Direct Cremation Service*
Professional & Staff Services	$ 120.00 
Registration & Documentation	$ 120.00 
Facilities	$ 80.00 
Transfer from Place of Death	$ 155.00 
Transfer to Cemetery/Crematorium	$ 155.00 
Cardboard Cremation Casket (OCS #10)	$ 70.00 
Subtotal	$ 700.00	

*Government HST $ 91.00 *
_Government Fee (Coroner)	$ 75.00_ 
_Government Fee (Municipal)	$ 67.50_ 
Total	$933.50 *plus cremation ($500)*


*Other Goods & Services*
Proofs of Death Certificates (after first ten)
$50.00 (10) or $15.00 each
Non-Hospital Death
$50.00
Viewing Deceased for Identification Purposes (optional)
$225.00
*Witnessing Cremation
$225.00*
Mileage Surcharge after 40 km (out of town death only)
$1.50/km


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## OurBigFatWallet (Jan 20, 2014)

Ticketmaster's "convenience" fees annoy me to no end. The sad thing is that they have zero competition and the government won't regulate them so they can essentially charge whatever they want. I recently paid $14 in convenience fees to purchase the tickets online


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Toronto.gal said:


> Ridiculous indeed.
> 
> How about the very old charge of a decade+ for touch-tone service? Marketplace covered this one a year or two ago.
> 
> ...


Ahem...Yes, I can. I worked for 'Ma" Bell in my younger days, installing phones..digipulse and digitone (or touch tone as it was called in the US) . 
Now some history on basic POTS (Plain Old Telephone Service) 

The older standard equipment in Bell's central offices , (where your phone line goes to get decoded for "off hook" and digits that represent the phone number you are calling, require equipment to process the electrical signals to be routed to the correct destination.

Many years ago, up until the mid eighties when DMS (digital machines) were introduced, there was step by step (SXS) and Crossbar central office circuit switches that detected an off hook, and for each pulse of the rotary dial number set that you dialed, required electro-mechanical routing of your call. 

At some point it was decided to introduce DIGITONE(MF) RECEIVERS, and the telephone sets that had a numeric keypad instead of the old "500 style"sets that still had the rotary dial. 
At that time it was decided by the management, that since the MF (multi frequency) key sets made calling a bit
faster and digitone receivers had to be installed in front of the old stepXstep central office machines, this was an optional feature and subscribers *could be charged extra* for the Digitone phones vs the old rotary dial. 

If you didn't want to pay the extra rental charges per month, Bell also offered a DigiPulse set that had the keypad
BUT was slower and replaced the rotary dial.

After Bell converted to DMS (digital Multiplex system) in the mid 80s, (which I worked on at Nortel), the subscriber lines were still analog, but by then aftermarket "touchtone" phones were available. Bell allowed people to buy their own, not having pay the monthly rental fees on the telephone set rentals...but..each time...a "optional "MF" receiver had to be connected to handle the touch tone digits (in the digital central office systems )every time a subscriber made a call, ...although this made the calls MORE EFFICIENT than the rotary dial phones....this was "optional equipment used", so Bell decided that they continue to charge for that anyway.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

carverman said:


> Well, I guess the *vets are talking a page from the funeral directors*, who charge to witness a cremation..
> maybe the biggest ripoff artists next to lawyers...where paperclips and staples are the least of your financial worries.
> ...


 ... yes, seems like it ... the funeral business is all about making $$$$ and the opportunity for gouging in times when people (families) are in distress or most vulnerable ... I say karma has its way of making it back to these SOBs for "ripping" people off needlessly.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

carverman said:


> Ahem...Yes, I can. I worked for 'Ma" Bell in my younger days, installing phones..digipulse and digitone (or touch tone as it was called in the US) .
> Now some history on basic POTS (Plain Old Telephone Service)
> 
> , ...although this made the calls MORE EFFICIENT than the rotary dial phones....this was "optional equipment used", so Bell decided that they continue to charge for that anyway.


 ... but I have been told by an ex-colleague that her parents still uses a "rotary" phone (don't want to upgrade no matter what) who have been charged $2 / month + tax (of course) also? So this seems to be a perpetual charge by Bell regardless which phony method one elects??? 

Since we have you as the phone expert too on the forum and that we're on the subject on phone /IT technicalities, I'm curious as to how the caller-ID actually works ... by this I mean how come I see a number on my caller-ID panel sometimes and not at other times - is this due to call-blocking - not at my end but by the other end?


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Beaver101 said:


> ... but I have been told by an ex-colleague that her parents still uses a "rotary" phone (don't want to upgrade no matter what) who have been charged $2 / month + tax (of course) also? So this seems to be a perpetual charge by Bell regardless which phony method one elects???
> 
> Since we have you as the phone expert too on the forum and that we're on the subject on phone /IT technicalities, I'm curious as to how the caller-ID actually works ... by this I mean how come I see a number on my caller-ID panel sometimes and not at other times - is this due to call-blocking - not at my end but by the other end?


There is still a line charge even if you buy your own phone. The $2 maybe for some feature on their rotary dial phone that requires special
equipment to be connected..I don't know..I would have to have a discription of the phone bill charge.

First of all: on the extra touch tone fee, here is what Bell says:



> *How the company justifies the fee:*
> In a statement, Bell said: “The $2.80 fee is *part of the cost of Bell home phone service, except of course for customers who remain on rotary-dial service. We’re required to itemize it separately on the invoices of customers with touch-tone service specifically because customers on rotary don’t pay it.*
> "When we discontinue rotary service, we expect that we will no longer be required to itemize it separately. That said, we have no current plans to discontinue rotary service for customers who already have it.”


Translation: ^ :greedy_dollars: In the wake of so much competition out there for home phones, we need to still make a profit some how..we
have all these brick and mortar central offices to maintain, and we need to keep the call routing equipment operational..
so you landline users...if you want 'touch tone"..pay us the fr*gin fee!..or go to some other service provider..see if we care!
Now when all the seniors out there are gone..and nobody wants to the rotary dial phone..we will think about it. 

*Now about the caller id not being displayed on your phone:*
This is part of a ANI (Automatic Number Identification) software feature that can be transmitted with the calling party's
number (depending on the calling area and service features of the calling parties service agreement) or in some cases
from a shared data base between service providers where the called local service provider (yours) has access to this data base.

In a case where neither the number nor the name is displayed, it could be the terms of services (features) or the calling party can block their number from being displayed each time they call ...like *67 on your handset. Most of these Starcode (Asterisk + number code) features are on digital central office switches through specific subscriber datafilled software. 

Such as Caller ID not turned on... or Number display deliberately blocked.
However. not all features are available in certain areas, so it depends on the type of service used by the calling party. 

Custom calling features ................. Digitone / Rotary dial 

*Caller ID........................................	*65* 1165

*Number display blocking (per call).....	*67* 1167



> *Call your phone company to have your caller ID disabled for your specific phone line all the time if you do not want your caller ID information transmitted to anybody.*
> 
> Need to call your grandmother to wish her a Happy Birthday? Unblock your line block by dialing *82 before making your call, so she can see it is you who is calling. Note: Entire line blocking is only available in certain states.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

> *carverman:*There is still a line charge even if you buy your own phone. The $2 maybe for some feature on their rotary dial phone that requires special
> equipment to be connected..I don't know..I would have to have a discription of the phone bill charge.
> 
> First of all: on the extra touch tone fee, here is what Bell says:
> ...


 .. that pretty well sums it up especially this is "Mamma Monopoloy" Bell. 



> *Now about the caller id not being displayed on your phone:*
> 
> This is part of a ANI (Automatic Number Identification) software feature that can be transmitted with the calling party's
> number (depending on the calling area and service features of the calling parties service agreement) or in some cases
> ...


 ... okay, thanks for the explanation.


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