# Ontario Hydro Time of Use pricing



## Userkare (Nov 17, 2014)

For those of you (us) who care about such things, the TOU hydro pricing is "off-peak" for all day today and tomorrow. 

So go nuts, blow out those candles, splurge and read your new Christmas gift book with your LED lamp.

http://www.ontarioenergyboard.ca/OE...ectricity+Prices/Time-of-Use+Holiday+Schedule


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## STech (Jun 7, 2016)

How sad and pathetic is it, in a province (which once was an economic powerhouse) flush with surplus electricity, that we get excited about the pittance we get to save on the birth of Christ, for electricity that's already 3 times the fair market price?

Is it any surprise that people like me, university educated, previous sympathizer and actively engaged in fighting "climate change" is now feeling very jaded and is really starting to doubt the smell of BS that's only making some well-connected, and well-heeled individuals very wealthy on the backs of everyone.

So yeah blow out the candles, turn on those lights, and blast away the shadows where the most scandal plagued, and money moronic government is is hiding and counting on people's gullibility to vote for them. Time to put an end to the nightmare on Queen St.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

STech said:


> *How sad and pathetic is it, in a province (which once was an economic powerhouse) flush with surplus electricity, that we get excited about the pittance we get to save *on the birth of Christ, for electricity that's already 3 times the fair market price?


our illustrious premiere was at loss for words when interviewd by the media about HER hydro bill..did she ever check it?
She hemmed and hawed..had trouble coming out with an answer to a direct question. Political bafflegab again.
We have no choice..we have to vote out these mismanagement buffoons that are in their to stuff their pockets at the expense of the rest of Ontario.. Wynne's apologies now is not enough.

Skyrocketing hydro rates belong to Wynne. Listen to the video interviews with Wynne. 

http://globalnews.ca/news/3139056/o...ion-helped-spur-wynne-government-into-action/

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/gas-prices-heating-fuel-cap-and-trade-ontario-2017-1.3894270


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## mordko (Jan 23, 2016)

So, they are not going to charge HST on our Hydro bills. 

That's just moving money from one of our pockets into another; more specifically from our children's pockets as I doubt the debt generated by this government will be repaid before I retire.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

mordko said:


> So, they are not going to charge HST on our Hydro bills.
> 
> That's just moving money from one of our pockets into another; more specifically from our children's pockets as I doubt the debt generated by this government will be repaid before I retire.


it's a political nutshell game with Wynne and her henchmen. Grease the squeakiest wheel (Hydro rates complaints and disconnections) by NOT charging PST (8% tax) on the total hydro bill as of Jan 1st, 
but at the same time impose a 4.3 cent carbon tax on each liter of gasoline sold,
heating oil, and a 3.3 cents per cu metre of natural gas consumed. 300 cu metres used per month
in the coldest monts (Dec/jan/Feb) = $*9.90 extra carbon tax charge per heating bill on top of all the
the other taxes imposed. *

(around $6 per month increase on the average household heating bill) and them tell us, the Wynne gov't is doing this for our own good as Global warming is a reality today...uh huh..what about China, India, Russia
and some of the larger consuming fossil fuel countries including the US..they won't because the publc
would not stand for that.
We are being screwed again by Wynne and her henchmen.

In the end with this funny math..the gov't ends up collecting more, so they aren't really losing much revenue by dropping the 8% PST on hydro bills.

Each tank of gasoline (assume 100 litre fillup) = $4.30 cents of carbon tax revenue + PST
Each heating bill assume ($100 per month) = $6.00 -$10.00 of carbon tax revenue + PST
That's at least $10 of extra tax coming in to replace the $8 of tax they remove on $100 worth of hydro bill.

The net income is that they are still gouging consumers more with this carbon tax and it will only go up in'
the next few years because it is NOT FIXED like the HST.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

If carbon taxes are used to fund alternative energy for the future, it is a good thing.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

sags said:


> If carbon taxes are used to fund alternative energy for the future, it is a good thing.


What alternative energy projects? Solar cell farms? /windmill farms?, cow farts? Atomic energy is very expensive to operate and retrofit.
They have cancelled building any nuclear reactors and what's left..hydro electric dams? All the suitable rivers and lakes have been dammed already. The last coal burning plants were just shut down. 

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...-to-buy-new-nuclear-reactors/article14793803/

Perhaps harness that political hot air belching out of Wynne and her cronies? All this additional carbon tax
goes right into the provincial coffers...and they have a million and one ways to spend/waste it!
Where is Wynne's plan to present to the people of Ontario on how they plan to invest this windfall from
the carbon tax..its all BS!



> “It is not wise to spend billions and billions of dollars in new nuclear when that power is not needed,” the minister said.
> 
> “*So this is a good decision for ratepayers and the people of Ontario*.”
> 
> ...


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## Userkare (Nov 17, 2014)

In the 1950's, growing up in the NYC suburbs, we heated our house with steam radiators powered by a coal burning furnace. I remember my dad shoveling coal into the beast, and the delivery truck that loaded our coal bin through the basement window. We had natural gas, but it was mainly used for the stove and clothes dryer. I don't remember what the water heater used, but I believe it was also N.G. In early 1960's we replaced the coal furnace with an oil burner. Looking back now, I have to wonder why they didn't use natural gas for heating from the start; why deal all with the black coal soot when the gas comes out of a sealed pipe. I doubt that anyone at the time was concerned with climate change, so I assume that people used what was most economical at the time. 

Now we are faced with a punitive tax for using what, at this time, is the most economical fuel. What are we supposed to do, use less? We've already been shamed into installing automatic set-back thermostats that lower the house temps overnight, or when the house is vacant. Or should we just shut up and shiver? 

If I believed, for a moment, that the money would be used to fund research into clean renewable resources, I would be less upset by this. More likely, the money will just disappear into the hole dug by years of government mismanagement. Maybe some will be funneled into companies with Liberal Party ties, that will come up with some bogus green scam. Flux capacitors, anyone? Energy from garbage?

As for me, the Emerald Ash Bore has provided a source of free fuel for the next 5 years, or until the Wicked Witch of the West bans wood burning fireplaces and sends out the "Chimney Police" to catch carbon criminals.


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

Userkare said:


> As for me, the Emerald Ash Bore has provided a source of free fuel for the next 5 years, or until the Wicked Witch of the West bans wood burning fireplaces and sends out the "Chimney Police" to catch carbon criminals.


In Montreal, the Wicked Witch has already struck there for stoves, and I suppose fireplaces are next...

Canadian government orders residents to get rid of their old wood-burning stoves or pay thousands of dollars in fines.

_....citizens of Montreal have been ordered to first register their wood-burning stoves, and then ultimately get rid of them within three years, unless they meet rigid air quality standards._

ltr


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## mrPPincer (Nov 21, 2011)

^I don't think this is about CO2. 

I think the regulations are more just to keep the breathable air quality at a more decent level in highly populated areas by having more efficient systems that burn up more of the particulates that would otherwise be going up the chimney.

Wood burning for heat is, as I understand it, actually carbon neutral or better if the wood comes from a well-managed woodlot that is kept as such for that purpose (as opposed to e.g., clear-cutting and putting in a parking lot).


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Userkare said:


> ILooking back now, I have to wonder why they didn't use natural gas for heating from the start; why deal all with the black coal soot when the gas comes out of a sealed pipe. I doubt that anyone at the time was concerned with climate change, so I assume that people used what was most economical at the time.


Maybe because the gas lines were not available in every area back then where people lived. That is still true in rural areas where you have to rely on fuel oil or propane (or if you can even afford it these days)..electricity for heating.

Electricity at one point was touted as the most efficient, affordable and pollution free form of heating . 
All electric homes were the rage in the 70s. Some were built in my area of Ottawa and over the last
20 years a lot of homeowners have pulled out the baseboard heaters, installed ducting and gas furnaces.

It only took a few 'years to break that myth in Ontario, gov't mismanagement and the privitazation sell off of the old Ontario Hydro has killed that dream that electricity should be affordable. Now we have TOU rates, set
up in such a way that you have to do your laundry and cooking after 8pm to try to save.
Never mind the fact that both the husband and wife have to work and pay expensive child care to work
to pay for those huge mortgages and electricity bills.

LED light bulbs are here, and now we need some kind of efficient "LED heaters to cut down the amount of electricity we use", so that the Wynne gov't can pay the electricity generators NOT TO PRODUCE ELECTRICITY so they can keep the prices high.

It's a gov't led conspiracy and the only way we can shame them is to force an election. 



> Now we are faced with a punitive tax for using what, at this time, is the most economical fuel. What are we supposed to do, use less? We've already been shamed into installing automatic set-back thermostats that lower the house temps overnight, or when the house is vacant. Or should we just shut up and shiver?


You have a choice...stop using nat gas and use expensive electricty or stop using as much electricity and
use nat gas with these special consumption taxes added on to the existing taxes that are still not enough
for that tax monster..the Ontario government.



> If I believed, for a moment, that the money would be used to fund research into clean renewable resources, I would be less upset by this. *More likely, the money will just disappear into the hole dug by years of government mismanagement.* Maybe some will be funneled into companies with Liberal Party ties, that will come up with some bogus green scam. Flux capacitors, anyone? Energy from garbage?


No matter how much is collected in carbon taxes, it will all go into the government "black hole" (general revenue)
and the debt will stll keep rising. No real effort to come up with renewable energy sources.



> Ontario’s *net debt will reach $350 billion by 2020-21*. He warned this province’s debt burden is one of the highest among Canada’s provincial governments and an interest rate hike could put its credit and “fiscal flexibility” at risk.
> 
> This province has the largest sub-national debt of any jurisdiction in the developed world. With a population a third of California’s, our debt load is double that of the biggest U.S. state. LeClair’s worried the province’s 12-year, $160-billion capital spending spree is driving us further into the red.


Green Power..we already have that..the most expensive power per kilowatt.


Ontarioans still not paying enough tax? Wait for another 3 years with the Wynne gov't ...Tax them some more!


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