# BMO NEW D Series



## Emma (May 18, 2013)

Have been hibernating in the southwest this winter so just getting back to reading all the posts. Still sitting with cash in both RRSP and TFSA. Received an email about this new series of low cost funds available to self directed clients. I cannot find the MER, even when logged in to my account. Are these funds comparable to TD E series? Any comments would be appreciated.


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## richard (Jun 20, 2013)

It sounds like they are somewhere between the price of a regular big-bank index fund (0.7-1%) and an ETF so they may be similar to the e-Series. At least for the index funds. Any active funds are likely to cost more. I'm not a BMO client and there's no public information I can find.


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## madMike (Feb 10, 2012)

I recently moved from TD to BMO. Interested to see if these D series funds are similar to Td's E series; i.e. an alternative to ETFs until enough $$ saved to make ETF purchase cost effective. Could not find these D series funds in my search on BMO IL today. Maybe they are not listed yet?


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## liquidfinance (Jan 28, 2011)

madMike said:


> I recently moved from TD to BMO. Interested to see if these D series funds are similar to Td's E series; i.e. an alternative to ETFs until enough $$ saved to make ETF purchase cost effective. Could not find these D series funds in my search on BMO IL today. Maybe they are not listed yet?


How much do you need to save to make ETFs cost effective when there are brokers out there which allow you to buy them for free?


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## Emma (May 18, 2013)

I received an email from Investorline indicating the funds were available only to Investorline self directed clients. Other than the list of funds, $500 minimum purchase and no buy-sell fees, no other info....except the disclaimer about fees...so what are they?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

You will likely have to give them a phone call to ask for the MER for D series funds of interest. They are so new that the information may not be published yet and/or maybe not even on sale yet. 

Typically I would expect them to be similar (A series relative to D series) as the RBC funds are (A series relative to D series). Maybe knock 50bp off the MER for equity funds, with 25 bp knocked for fixed income funds (with variations between that for everything in between).


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## fatcat (Nov 11, 2009)

am i wrong in thinking we need to thank vanguard for all this ?
their entrance into canada represented the first (but not the last) domino to fall
there is more downward pressure on mer's and trading fees to come i think


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

iShares is doing their part, too.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

And RBC first introducing D series funds, and BMO with their competitive ETFs, and someone (I forget whom) first eliminated the minimum account value for $10 trading fees. Also Questrade (and to some extent Scotia iTrade) for zero commission ETFs. Competition has been good.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

there are several links within BMO investorline to a website that has been built specifically to offer complete info about the new D-funds ... but the links are not yet working ... one of those comedy situations ... possibly BMO released the promotional e-mail a few days too early each:

the bmo reps themselves don't have any additional information; they know the links are not working yet & they say all is being repaired on a rush basis. Perhaps the info will be up & running tomorrow or early next week.

obviously the new fund family has been designed as a competitor to TD e-funds (i believe the bmo D-family MERs might be even lower) & also to the array of zero-commish-to-buy ETFs offered by questrade, which does charge a commission to sell.

the new BMO D-funds reportedly will have no fee to either buy or sell, so the appeal will be great. They should be an excellent new option for some of those very young investors who keep arriving in cmf forum with small savings but enormous talents. 

plus nothing wrong at all with a few chunks of low-cost basic equity D-funds as the bedrock of a core-&-explore portfolio for an investor of any age.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I doubt they will be anything revolutionary in the Canadian fund market.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

andrewf said:


> I doubt they will be anything revolutionary in the Canadian fund market.


I agree. This is more about BMO IL reacting to RBC's D series mutual funds and TD's e-funds, trying to keep clients that might go over to RBC or TD for that reason.


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## Emma (May 18, 2013)

Thanks, Humble, I'll give them a few days to get the info online. Is it possible to compare apples to apples between each Bank's offerings or do you find there is always minor differences in so called similar funds. I need to stop procrastinating and get invested in something.


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## sunwinc (Apr 3, 2014)

*not much interest for BMO*



AltaRed said:


> I agree. This is more about BMO IL reacting to RBC's D series mutual funds and TD's e-funds, trying to keep clients that might go over to RBC or TD for that reason.


MER still much higher even than the TD series I fund:

BMO Canadian Equity ETF Fund Series D 0.80


BMO U.S. Equity ETF Fund Series D 0.85


BMO International Equity ETF Fund Series D 1.00


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Ah but you have to compare apples to apples. You cannot compare directly with TD's index funds. The better comparison is to RBC's D series funds. Not that I am a proponent of any of these D series funds.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

sun i found MERs ranging from .50 (a bond fund) to .70 (growth equity ETF).

even if some are as high as you report, are these not comparable to some of the TD e-funds, though?

also it's not clear yet whether the BMO D funds are including portfolio trading costs - the TERs - with the MERs or whether they are extra. From the way the information is displayed in the prospectus, it appears the TERs are extra, ie in addition to the MERs, which could elevate total portfolio costs for some of the D funds to slightly north of 1% per annum.

also the marketing is poor, i think. There is no intermediate level document, nothing in between a simple list of fund names with codes & a heavy-duty 244-page prospectus, which - like all 244-page prospectuses - is extraordinarily difficult to read online. Missing entirely are intermediate level documents such as fund fact sheets or fund summary pages.

i for one am disappointed because i was looking for another truly competitive low-cost choice for new/young investors. Right now the principal choices are TD e-funds or else a questrade account with its zero commission policy for ETF purchases. The idea is that the new/young investor will get into the habit of investing, will study & will learn while he earns. Then later, once he gets his sea legs, he can branch into individual stocks or sector investing if he wishes.

but alas, from the documents supplied to the BMO discount website, i don't see that it will even be possible for a new/young investor to learn much from series D funds. Meanwhile he will be paying management fees that - if the TER has to be added - are hovering around 1%. This fee approaches that of high-performing low-cost managed funds with good track records, such as some of the Mawer or Jarislowsky Fraser funds.

personally i think i'd be inclined to go with mawer or JF ... the reason is that a discount broker is not going to offer any support at all. All discount will do is point investor to the prospectus. Such zero-service is fine for funds or ETFs in the .10-.30% range, but why pay 1% of capital each year for zero-service.


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## madMike (Feb 10, 2012)

At these prices posted by sunwic, and even without counting additional TER fees as indicated by Humble, these D series are a disappointment and uncompetetive with TD e series funds. Just as an example to address a question a few posts back....at TD one could accumulate $5000 in TDB900 Cdn Index fund, paying $16.50 per year in management fees at MER = 0.33%.
Alternatively, that $5000 could be used to purchase VCE Cdn Index ETF, paying $10 broker purchase (assuming $50, 000.00 in assets qulaifies for $10 purchase..ok 9.95), and $4.50 in management fees at 0.09%, total 10+4.50 = $14.50. Even more cost effective at CIBC investor edge if paying $6.95 broker fee? I know both TDDI and BMO IL charge $9.95 for qualified minmum account size.

I'd be interested to see if people here find Questrade or other online brokers adequate for "plain vanilla" ETF purchases ...i.e. are there many eligible ETFs where purchase fees are waived?


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