# transfer from non-reg to TFSA at Questrade



## joncnca (Jul 12, 2009)

is there a simple way to transfer holdings (stocks, ETFs) from a non-reg account (at Questrade) into a TFSA?...preferably avoiding taxes

or do i have to just liquidate holdings in the non-reg account (incurring taxes) and then move the cash into the TFSA, and then buy whatever it is i want again?

can i do any of these transfers within Questrade itself, or does the money need to come from outside? I notice a "transfer funds" option under accounts tab...does this work?

thanks!


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

You'll have to pay any capital gains realized on assets transferred. You should be able to transfer the assets "in kind" and transfer to TFSA.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

Transferring shares to a registered account is an "in kind" transfer ... which includes a "deemed disposition" at the transfer. This means you have to report the capital gain as if you sold the stock and contributed the cash. If the stock is in a capital loss position, one can't claim the loss.
http://www.taxtips.ca/personaltax/investing/transfersharestorrsp.htm

A couple of advantages to the "in-kind" transfer is that there's no sell commission required, one keeps what is presumably a long term investment and on the day of the transfer, one can usually choose the value set for the transfer based on any trading price from the opening to when the transfer happens. 

I've used to ability to choose the transfer price to end up with a minimal capital gain when the investment was temporarily trading at lower values.


The main situation I can think of when one would prefer to sell, contribute the proceeds and rebuy thirty days later is when the investment is in a significant loss position. If one does not sell and does the "in-kind" transfer, one would lose the capital loss. Note that to avoid the superficial loss rule, one either has to wait thirty days *or* if there's a suitable alternative, buy it right away (i.e. sell TD bank and buy BMO).

http://www.taxtips.ca/personaltax/investing/taxtreatment/shares.htm


AFACIT - the "in-kind" transfer is always going to require a call to a broker rep as they have to get you to tell them what of the day's trading range for the investment, you want the transfer recorded at. You could probably fill out paperwork to transfer from say TDDI to Questrade "in-kind" but I have always transferred within the same group (ex. Questrade taxable to Questrade TFSA).

I suspect the "transfer funds" is limited to cash transfers between accounts but am not sure.


Cheers


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

I'm with you Eclectic...

I usually do an "in-kind" transfer for those same reasons: 

a) no sell commission required,
b) can port my investments, and
c) I can choose the value of the transfer.

I also try and time my transfer where my capital gains is just above zero, or at least minimal, not always possible.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

I thought it important to mention the "pick the value" part as I've been able to take advantage of dips of long term holds to either have a minimal CG or cap off the gain to be paid.

Then too ... for someone who has other cash needs in a particular year (ex. I was paying down my mortgage in 2009) but have other assets in the right situation ... it can mean an extra year of fully using the TFSA contribution room versus having to wait.


YMMV ... where IMO it's good to know all the tools in the toolbox.


Cheers


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## joncnca (Jul 12, 2009)

Eclectic12 said:


> AFACIT - the "in-kind" transfer is always going to require a call to a broker rep as they have to get you to tell them what of the day's trading range for the investment, you want the transfer recorded at. You could probably fill out paperwork to transfer from say TDDI to Questrade "in-kind" but I have always transferred within the same group (ex. Questrade taxable to Questrade TFSA).
> 
> Cheers


I just noticed these options to transfer in-kind and transfer funds in myQuestrade. I'm getting ready to do it, but you mention that "in-kind" transfer requires a call to a broker....doesn't that cost something like $50 or some sort of fee anyway?

have 5 ETFs in the non-reg account, which I'm planning to move into the TFSA because it now has enough contribution room. transferring in-kind may avoid the sell commission, but if it's going to cost about as much for the broker, then....no difference. right? i could just sell everything then transfer funds in cash online...i don't like dealing with calling questrade, not the best experiences. I'm fine with the company, but i'm realistic about my expectations for customer service given their low cost.

timing my losses are not a big consideration. actually, everything has gained, so i know i'll incur capital gains tax. but it's actually my wife's fund, and she's on leave this year so she has basically no income and i'm not worried about the tax. just want to simplify as much as possible, so i'm going to do the transfer and then forget about it for a little while. waiting could actually work against me given the opportunity cost of not putting it into a TFSA when i have the room.

so...can i not do the in-kind transfer online? it seems to have a request page for this transfer. who do i need to call, if necessary?


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

A call to broker to sell would trigger something like $50 for the phone in sell commission ... this is a call to request a transfer which my broker does not charge for. 

I suspect it's pretty standard across the brokers but to be sure, you can call the info line (that's a free call, right?) to ask.


If there is a $50 charge, then a sell, transfer the proceeds to the TFSA and then re-buy would be cheaper ... however, I suspect there is no charge for a call requesting an in-kind transfer.


If the stock being transferred is resulting in a capital gain ... then if you choose to sell/transfer/re-buy, you won't have to worry about the superficial loss rules. At that point, the only difference between selling and an "in-kind" transfer is avoiding the two commissions (sell, buy).


If Questrade has an online request page for an in-kind transfer, feel free to use it and report how well it works. 
For my broker, I call the same number of I would have called for a phone call sell ... but that would be another question to ask when confirming if there is a fee or not.


Cheers


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## CPA Candidate (Dec 15, 2013)

Just put new money in your TFSA and leave the stuff in the non-registered alone.


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## moose (Nov 19, 2013)

Eclectic12 said:


> If Questrade has an online request page for an in-kind transfer, feel free to use it and report how well it works.


I have used the Questrade online in-kind transfer page personally, to transfer in-kind from Questrade margin to Questrade TFSA at a capital loss, and it required no call in whatsoever. I have been told that the settlement price will be on the day the transfer is initiated, but also that the price will be 3 days after the transfer initiation (3 days to settle) both from Questrade staff via their live support chat. I suspect the price is the day the transfer is initiated, but not confirmed. 

I am very happy with the transfer, even if I didn't tell my broker the value of the position I wanted to transfer at


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## joncnca (Jul 12, 2009)

moose said:


> I have used the Questrade online in-kind transfer page personally, to transfer in-kind from Questrade margin to Questrade TFSA at a capital loss, and it required no call in whatsoever. I have been told that the settlement price will be on the day the transfer is initiated, but also that the price will be 3 days after the transfer initiation (3 days to settle) both from Questrade staff via their live support chat. I suspect the price is the day the transfer is initiated, but not confirmed.
> 
> I am very happy with the transfer, even if I didn't tell my broker the value of the position I wanted to transfer at


i imagine the difference between 3 days will be negligible, i just need to figure out the sale price for my ACB.





CPA Candidate said:


> Just put new money in your TFSA and leave the stuff in the non-registered alone.


oh just put new money, huh? just let me head over to my money tree and i'll pick out some freshly blossomed 100s. lol.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

moose said:


> I have used the Questrade online in-kind transfer page personally, to transfer in-kind from Questrade margin to Questrade TFSA at a capital loss ...
> I am very happy with the transfer, even if I didn't tell my broker the value of the position I wanted to transfer at...


Strange ... if I felt I needed to use an investments that was at a CL, I would have sold the investment and transferred the proceeds. This way, I can still make use of the CL against other CG's three years back or the present/going forward. 

As I understand it, transferring to a registered account at a CL means one is not allowed to claim the CL ... which I personally would not be happy with ... but to each their own.




moose said:


> ... I have been told that the settlement price will be on the day the transfer is initiated, but also that the price will be 3 days after the transfer initiation (3 days to settle) both from Questrade staff via their live support chat. I suspect the price is the day the transfer is initiated, but not confirmed. ...


Something in the range the investment traded for the day the transfer was initiated makes sense as that is what my broker uses (except I get to pick from the day's range when requesting the transfer). I'm not sure what is meant by the "3 days after" ... unless they are saying they won't know what the system selected until the trade settles. 

Interesting that an online transfer option is available ... though I would have thought part of the online transfer confirmation would be to have one pick the price.


Cheers


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## moose (Nov 19, 2013)

Eclectic12 said:


> Strange ... if I felt I needed to use an investments that was at a CL, I would have sold the investment and transferred the proceeds. This way, I can still make use of the CL against other CG's three years back or the present/going forward.
> 
> As I understand it, transferring to a registered account at a CL means one is not allowed to claim the CL ... which I personally would not be happy with ... but to each their own.


I would normally agree with you, however I was sitting on a 200$ capital loss, I have no income to claim this year, and I didn't want to wait 30 days to buy back the stock. In my particular case, transfering in-kind was better then selling and transferring the proceeds. Not having to wait, I've gained 12% on the position since the transfer.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

^^^^

As usual ... YMMV ... :biggrin:

In my case, by transferring when I did including picking the transfer price - I ended up with the mirror image ... a nominal $200 CG during a dip. 


Cheers


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## joncnca (Jul 12, 2009)

i would imagine that you could claim a capital loss if you transferred. if they didn't allow it, by extension, the transfer also should not incur capital gains? 

then again, the government can (and probably does) just declare that you can't claim CL, but we'll still tax you on CG =P



i read before that each account at questrade must maintain at least $250 to be in good standing. if i transfer out of my non-reg, do i need to leave 250 in there in order to keep the account?...even if my total amount of money at questrade is way above the $5000 needed to waive the inactivity fee?


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

I hate to tell you ... but it's been know to be one sided to CRA's benefit for years, probably decades.

From the link in post #3:


> Income Tax Act s. 40(2)(g)(iv)(A) and (B)
> 
> If you transfer loss shares to a registered account, or sell them in a non-registered account and repurchase them within 30 days, the loss will not be deductible.


MoneySense says the same thing.
http://www.moneysense.ca/columns/transferring-stocks-into-a-tfsa


Which is why people try to ensure the transfer is at a transfer price that is not a loss and keeps the CG to a minimum.


Feel free to check out other publications, tax books etc. ...


Cheers


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