# Does "which" school really matter?



## SkyFall (Jun 19, 2012)

Hey guys I need some opinions/advices...

I am currently 22y/o, I work at a local TD Canada Trust bank as a teller while still in school. I only have been with TD for 8-9 months, but I showed them that I am dedicated, hard worker and very good with my sales goals (yes we do have, it's not really sales but just let's call it that way) and because of that I will likely get a promotion in few months to Financial Services Representative (which deal with very small simple investment i.e. GICs, Saving Bonds and Mutual Funds).

I'd like to have a career in finance, no idea what exactly, but I love working around investments, helping people with their financial stuff and I'd even like to take a shot if I can one day in M&A. Currently I am in French University trying to boost my GPA (UQAM), this University doesn't have a good reputation... a lot of people are making fun of this school mostly because student that goes there aren't the richest and are consider most hipsters.... I also have the option to go to a English University (Concordia) which have a better reputation expecially the Business Faculty of Concordia a.k.a John Molson School of Business.... Now I am wondering does "which" University you graduated from really matter? I mean, in my mind as long as you show what you can do you are good no?

Two of my co-worker graduated from Concordia in Finance, but aren't that far ahead from me, I mean I don't hold a Bachelor yet and I am only few months away from their position (don't get me wrong this is not a Degree vs No-Degree) it's more like Ivy League School vs regular ones... (not saying Concordia is Ivy League material)


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## Janus (Oct 23, 2013)

Hi SkyFall,

First of all if you want to work at the bank you're doing well so far. Having that name on your resume helps a lot. And I'll start with the caveat that my impression may not apply in Quebec.

For your benefit I'll try to be as honest as possible. As a Canadian who went to university for arts and did an MBA to get into business, and worked in investments for the last 2 years in Toronto, I can honestly say I've never heard of your university. It's likely due to Ontarian ignorance, but that being said I'd reckon most recruiters at the big banks will be in the same boat.

That being said, in general I think Canada has a great educational system because it doesn't *really* matter where you go to undergrad. You'll get the same quality education at Western vs. Mcmaster vs. UBC (the differentiation usually comes in at the graduate level, and even then it's program-specific). So I doubt your degree will hold you back... however I imagine there could be some benefits from switching to Concordia which is easily more recognizable.

At the end of the day you're probably fine. Work hard, start on a designation like the CFA after your degree, and if you really think the school holds you back then maybe an MBA is in the cards. But I think Canada is a pretty good model meritocracy so you can succeed without the most recognized finance degree.

Oh, and there's nothing wrong with being a finance hipster. Just don't wear it on your sleeve at work.


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## Islenska (May 4, 2011)

Have to say no, the school's name is not the big deal it is you, your work performance, school is strictly a stepping stone.

My only experience would be graduating in pharmacy from U of Manitoba 1977 and over the years pharmacist in Canada it does not matter diddley what school you came from. (we can't remember what we took in school anyway)

Focus more on your work history, now that matters!


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## MoMoney (Apr 1, 2011)

In short, the answer depends on two factors. What your degree will be in and where you intend to work afterwards.

Some degrees it will matter more which school than others (IE which school you attend for an engineering degree will matter less than the school you choose for finance). 

If you plan to stay around where you are now (Quebec?) it honestly won't matter much school you intend to go to. If you plan to do M&A on a larger stage like Toronto or even NYC, then it definitely matters what school you attend. If you're serious about joining a top tier firm like JPM, GS or Barclays you will want to consider doing what it takes to get into one of the top 5 MBA schools in the US, nothing in Canada will cut it (there are exceptions, but this is in fact the easiest and most straight forward route)


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

I think the school does matter, but not for the name. What matters is the quality of the instructor and what you take away with you. There can be good instructors at bad universities and there can be bad instructors at good universities. That being said, good universities have an easier time attracting good instructors (usually). 

Of course, most banks don't care much about the university as long as you get the degree. That's because they'll send you to many other courses (some regular, some internal) that will teach you what they want you to say (as in how to make the bank a lot of money in the guise of helping people with their savings and investing). 

From what I've seen, both the educational world and the banking world are a little different than the real world when it comes to finance. Anyone remember the prof on dragon's den who tried to teach the dragons? 

Which ever route you take, remember to question everything, especially the things they treat as gospel. There is a big difference in motivations behind what is being taught, the world is grey, not black and white.


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

School matters for the 1st and maybe 2nd job. After that it's the job performance that matters.


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## donald (Apr 18, 2011)

I think for finance it likely does matter in a huge way,your obviously best to listen to the young guys here that are traveling this path(dmoney,ethan/janus ect)
I have a complete layman's view,so i might be ignorant but as far as investment banking in wall street ect i don't think one has even a chance if they are from a non-target school.From what i have read up on investment banking you almost have to be recruited right out of school(gs/jpm ect)And i don't even think a mba even does it(could be wrong)Master of finance ect is what the investment bankers are educated with,mba is ''general'' education of business.
I guess though canada(bay street)is vastly different and not even in the same league as the usa,kind of like the minor's to the nhl.


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## Potato (Apr 3, 2009)

I'll agree generally with the others: particularly for your undergrad your choice of school doesn't matter much. And if you pursue a career in finance you'll likely have either professional designations to follow (CFA, CA, CFP, etc) or an MBA, where you can be a little more selective.

However, I think the language will matter: part of what undergrad will give you is a foundation in the lexicon of your field, and if you plan to practice in English you should get your education in English (and vice versa if you plan to work in French).


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## Xoron (Jun 22, 2010)

none said:


> School matters for the 1st and maybe 2nd job. After that it's the job performance that matters.


This is exactly what I've always thought. After you land your first job, and show your stuff, it's mostly irrelevant where you went to school.


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## wendi1 (Oct 2, 2013)

Well, unlike some of the other posters, I have heard of UQAM.

I think that university may not prepare you very well to get your designation when you graduate. If your English is good enough, I would consider Concordia. This is all about spending YEARS of your working life to get some advantage in your career. You don't want to waste those years. 

Most employers will not know about your school (unless they are in Montreal), but you will know when you try to get your designation(s) how hard it is without proper training.


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## SkyFall (Jun 19, 2012)

First of all, I'd like to say Thank You to everyone, it was really appreciated. 

I'd like to go work in NYC, I think I'll go with Concordia (English) because even though I grew going to French schools when I taught myself Savings, Finance, etc I read English books, all the terms I know are in English hahahhaha until recently I didn't know what was the French words for "assets & liabilities" (it's actifs & passifs) :upset:

Thank You once again guys it's really great to get another point of view. I'll keep you guys up to date and maybe I'll start a thread in the Diary's section.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I have to agree that no one really seems to care that much which school you attended. What's more important is whether you learned what is expected of a graduate of such a program, or at least the parts that are relevant to your position. After a few years, the only thing that really matters is your performance.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Also, French jargon is sometimes really weird. Actives and passives = assets and liabilities? That doesn't even really make sense, given what the terms mean.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

wendi1 said:


> Well, unlike some of the other posters, I have heard of UQAM.


Same here.

I don't know how accurate/fair these rankings are, but UQAM [Université du Québec à Montréal] appears in Maclean’s top 2013 Comprehensive University Rankings, and just behind Concordia. 

http://oncampus.macleans.ca/education/2012/11/01/2013-university-rankings/

I only posted the above to prove that UQAM exists, lol, but seriously, don't focus so much on names, rankings, prestige, etc., rather, pay more attention at researching/enrolling in the right program, then seriously focus on your educational goals, and do your best!

Bonne chance dans tes futurs projects!


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Maybe UQAM suffers a bit of what ails Ryerson (aka Rye High). It has a reputation of not being a 'real' university, for reasons that are no longer relevant, if they ever were.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

andrewf said:


> 1. Ryerson (aka Rye High). It has a reputation of not being a 'real' university.
> 2. Also, French jargon is sometimes really weird


1. Perhaps because graduate degrees were not offered until the 90's. 
2. No different in other languages.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

i doubt that new york city has ever heard of concordia
sometimes referred to as discordia due to all the shufflings at the top

names that might register on wall street are mcGill, U of T, possibly western ontario, not much else

an MBA from montreal's francophone HEC would get more recognition in gotham than concordia

en plus les gens newyorkais would not start laughing at les actifs et les passifs
unlike some rubes in ontario


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Awww, now I'm a rube.

I keep on failing HP's exacting standards...


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

You mean your real name is not Reuben? :biggrin:


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

from le dictionnaire Robert & Collins:

actif, active, _nm_, (b) assets [succession] credits.

_actif réalisable et disponible_, current assets.
_porter une somme à l'actif_, to put a sum on the assets side.

here's an interesting figure of speech from le Robert:

_il a plusieurs crimes à son actif_, he has several crimes to his name.
a rube - translating literally ie clumsily - would write _il a plusieurs crimes à son nom_


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

I don't think it really matters where you go to obtain undergrad, all about the same.

Ivey and Rotmans tend to be highly ranked for MBAs and such. 

Get your degree or Masters and see where it takes you to land the job. Once your career has started, job performance is FAR more relevant than any letters after your name and where you got them.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Well, obviously it was not a translation--the words mean what they mean. I was referring to the root words. It's even more interesting when you look at the origin of the words in English--they have their roots in old French (assez and lier).


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