# Choose your fav recent PM



## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

I don't think we spend as much time on PM legacies as the US does on their Presidents.

How do you see the recent PMs?


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Tough one.
Mulroney paid a huge political price for NAFTA.
Putting the best interest of the Country ahead of politics is really remarkable.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

I'm not trying to criticize this poll but one can see it following party-lines.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

MrMatt said:


> Tough one.
> Mulroney paid a huge political price for NAFTA.
> Putting the best interest of the Country ahead of politics is really remarkable.


Mulroney wasn't involved with NAFTA. It was Chretien.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Tostig said:


> Mulroney wasn't involved with NAFTA. It was Chretien.


Are you talking about the 1993 NAFTA agreement Mulroney negotiated, signed, and ratified, which Chretien opposed?

I'm assuming you're a Liberal, since you're taking credit for the hard work of a Conservative government. Talk about "following party lines".


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

NAFTA killed Canadian manufacturing jobs and bankrupted farmers........but otherwise it was a good deal.

Mulroney and Reagan negotiated it, and Jean Chretien should have buried it. That was a big fail for him, so he doesn't get my vote.

If considering the amount of legislation, program restructuring and new programs........Justin Trudeau wins hands down.

Revamping EI, CPP, child benefits, legalize marijuana, end mandatory sentencing, return OAS to age 65, end of life legislation, handle the COVID, approve an oil pipeline to the west coast..........just for starters.

It is easy to forget just how much Trudeau has done that others couldn't accomplish, in a short period of time, starting with the Syrian refugee crisis.

Canada is fortunate to have a leader who makes Canada better.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

sags said:


> NAFTA killed Canadian manufacturing jobs and bankrupted farmers........but otherwise it was a good deal.
> 
> Mulroney and Reagan negotiated it, and Jean Chretien should have buried it. That was a big fail for him, so he doesn't get my vote.
> 
> ...


It's hard to remember how much Trudeau has done.
He failed to screen refugees, totally mangled the COVID19 response, broke multiple election promises, and set records in the number of ethics breeches.

He doesn't even know how many times he did Blackface, so yeah, I don't expect anyone else to recall all that he's done.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

MrMatt said:


> Are you talking about the 1993 NAFTA agreement Mulroney negotiated, signed, and ratified, which Chretien opposed?
> 
> I'm assuming you're a Liberal, since you're taking credit for the hard work of a Conservative government. Talk about "following party lines".


So how did I guess this will quickly fall into party-lines and tribalism?


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Tostig said:


> So how did I guess this will quickly fall into party-lines and tribalism?


Well you made the claim, then immediately credited Chretien with the work of Mulroney, so yeah, didn't take long.


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## afulldeck (Mar 28, 2012)

They need to be rank voted.....

1. Mulroney
2. Martin
3 Harper
4. Chretien
5. Any but the end of this list
6
7
8 
9 
10
.
.
.
999 ..P.Trudeau
1000.. J Trudeau


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

I voted Chretien because I really respected his standing up to Bush about the Iraq WMD thing.


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Money172375 said:


> I don't think we spend as much time on PM legacies as the US does on their Presidents.
> 
> How do you see the recent PMs?


Presumably when one PM gets 270 votes, he will be declared the winner? 

Or maybe not if the losers declare this poll rigged or fraudulent?
😎


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

I am surprised that Harper is ranked so highly........or maybe not in a conservative dominated forum.

But realistically, of all the PMs, Harper probably met the most embarrassing end to his career in politics.

An incumbent with a majority government beaten soundly by an unproven, inexperienced young part time drama teacher and snowboarder to a Liberal majority government no less.

And then Harper just.........vanished into the Calgary night. We looked around and there he was.........gone.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

sags said:


> I am surprised that Harper is ranked so highly........or maybe not in a conservative dominated forum.


This forum is conservative leaning and also skews to older ages. The results of the poll will be pretty meaningless, other than showing the political leaning of the board.

For a while it also had a lot of oil & gas people.

Not at all surprising to see a lot of votes for Harper in this kind of crowd.


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## Mechanic (Oct 29, 2013)

Anyone is better than a Trudeau


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

sags said:


> I am surprised that Harper is ranked so highly........or maybe not in a conservative dominated forum.
> 
> But realistically, of all the PMs, Harper probably met the most embarrassing end to his career in politics.
> 
> ...


Harper didn't disappear. He just isn't in the headlines.

He was always a policy guy, and never really took to the political stage like many politicians.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

MrMatt said:


> Harper didn't disappear. He just isn't in the headlines.


The last time I saw him, Harper was busy making videos for a right wing American propaganda outlet. The organization he's contributing to is funded by Christian conservatives and oil tycoons... they use social media to target young people.

The worst part is that Harper really is all about *American* right wing values and bringing them to Canada. Horrible stuff!

This has nothing to do with more traditional Canadian conservatives. Just like when he was in power, he's all about pushing the American brand right wing agenda. Scheer continued with the same.

And this is fundamentally because these guys are a new party. Remember, they are Reform/Alliance... and have always been an American-brand of right wing. That means more social conservatism, highly religious slant, and strong alignment with evangelicals. Also strong alignment with the Republican Party.

Evangelical Christians and big oil money ... talk about wholesome, traditional Canadian values!


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

james4beach said:


> The last time I saw him, Harper was busy making videos for a right wing propaganda outlet. The org he's contributing to is funded by Christian conservatives and oil tycoons... they use social media to target young people.
> 
> Horrible stuff!


Haven't heard about that.
But I'm far more comfortable with Conservatives than the alternative.
I'm for human rights, due process and against racism. It's abundantly clear that these days those are Conservative principles.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

Jim Flaherty was excellent. His policies made Harper look good. Harper not so much. I could not bring myself to vote for him....we were in his riding.

Just governing is not enough for me when it comes to Prime Ministers. I judge them by what lasting programs and legacy they leave behind. Just think of what Lester Pearson's legacy was. Universal medicare, CPP, bilingualism, etc. These are things that have impacted our lives going forward and shaped our country.

Same with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. Or P. Trudeau (and M. Begin) passing the Canada Health Act that effectively prevented the Provinces from dismantling universal health care in their respective Provinces. Or Joe Clark bringing in far more Vietnamese boat people into Canada than he planned because it was the right thing to do (even if he had to disguise those numbers from his Party members and from his caucus).

Or Brian Mulroney refusing requests to trade with South Africa despite calls from his Cabinet and economic blackmail threats from the UK and the US. Or Chretien, rejecting the misrepresentations of Blair and Bush and refusing to commit Canadian forces to Iraq. Or Paul Martin doing the right thing following the request by 7 Provincial Premiers to formally make gay marriage legal across Canada despite what it might cost him at the poll or veiled threats of ex-communication from his church. Or P. Trudeau airlifting 5000 Ugandans literally overnight who were faced with certain death simply because of their faith.

The list of lasting contributions goes on and on.


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

ian said:


> Jim Flaherty was excellent. His policies made Harper look good. Harper not so much. I could not bring myself to vote for him....we were in his riding.
> 
> Just governing is not enough for me when it comes to Prime Ministers.
> 
> The list of lasting contributions goes on and on.


I commend you on putting some thought into the contributions of our previous PMs to us as a nation. Kind of a contrast from the previous post and it's Likes 

Lester Pearson was the PM when I first came to Canada. I always thought he was a nice guy, but seemed kind of a dull civil servant turned politician. He did get a lot done as PM. I was surprised to read that he won the Nobel Peace Prize in 1957 for organizing the United Nations Emergency Force to resolve the Suez Canal Crisis. For us older members, he should have been part of the poll along with Diefenbaker to keep things "equal" 

PierreT who succeeded Pearson was quite a change! We lived and worked in Montreal at the time he was elected - Amazed to see huge crowds lining the streets to get a glimpse of their new rock-star PM! It was a great time for Montreal and he definitely changed Canada.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

In Montreat when Trudeau was PM. I still remember how Drapeau was one of the first to condemn de Gaulle’s speech. And how Pearson was so quick to tell de Gaulle to leave our country. And when Trudeau had the guts to implement the War Measures Act.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

agent99 said:


> PierreT who succeeded Pearson was quite a change! We lived and worked in Montreal at the time he was elected - Amazed to see huge crowds lining the streets to get a glimpse of their new rock-star PM! It was a great time for Montreal and he definitely changed Canada.


Unfortunately he changed Canada for the worse.


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Money172375 said:


> I don't think we spend as much time on PM legacies as the US does on their Presidents.
> 
> How do you see the recent PMs?


The poll has 4 Liberal PMs and just 2 Conservatives. That might reflect the actuality, but to be fair, perhaps there should have been equal numbers. Add Joe Clark and Kim Campbell. Not sure how much difference that would make though


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

agent99 said:


> The poll has 4 Liberal PMs and just 2 Conservatives. That might reflect the actuality, but to be fair, perhaps there should have been equal numbers. Add Joe Clark and Kim Campbell. Not sure how much difference that would make though


I don't think they have many fans, but I think we can agree, we've typically done pretty well for PMs


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

MrMatt said:


> I don't think they have many fans, but I think we can agree, we've typically done pretty well for PMs


I thought Joe Clark was pretty great.

He's the kind of Conservative I could vote for. Not someone just mimicking the American right wing, not a Republican wannabe like Harper.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

Spudd said:


> I voted Chretien because I really respected his standing up to Bush about the Iraq WMD thing.


Agreed.
But I would consider that PET stood up to Nixon and JT stood up to Trump.

Mulroney was the greenest most environmentally friendly PM (he got action to solve acid rain and he gave Elizabeth May her start in politics) but he and Harper were US lapdogs.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

agent99 said:


> The poll has 4 Liberal PMs and just 2 Conservatives. That might reflect the actuality, but to be fair, perhaps there should have been equal numbers. Add Joe Clark and Kim Campbell. Not sure how much difference that would make though


And then there's John Turner.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Honestly, not too impressed with any of them. If I had to choose, maybe Chretien, but really the Chretien/Martin combination. Martin as PM was not great.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Bob Stanfiield.........he gave us underwear.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

andrewf said:


> Honestly, not too impressed with any of them. If I had to choose, maybe Chretien, but really the Chretien/Martin combination. Martin as PM was not great.


I think Martin was a good #2 to Chretien, but he must have pissed him off, or there was a lot of resentment somewhere.

Martin should have been good.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Tostig said:


> Agreed.
> But I would consider that PET stood up to Nixon and JT stood up to Trump.
> 
> Mulroney was the greenest most environmentally friendly PM (he got action to solve acid rain and he gave Elizabeth May her start in politics) but he and Harper were US lapdogs.


Harper stood up to Putin.


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

Heres the thing...Harper played minor hockey...should be a prerequisite for any aspirating Canadian politician... will weed out the putzes quite quickly.


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

Isn’t this a little like choose your favourite plague?


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Eder said:


> Heres the thing...Harper played minor hockey...should be a prerequisite for any aspirating Canadian politician... will weed out the putzes quite quickly.


Should have guessed - he was a minor player.

By the way, aspirating means something like *sucking* - Is that what you meant  

*Aspirate* (pronounced AS-pih-rayt) refers to the act of withdrawing the fluid, tissue, or other substance through a needle. It also refers to the accidental breathing in of food or fluid into the lungs. This can cause serious problems, such as pneumonia and other lung problems.


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

Vethermond said:


> e
> 
> 
> well, it is. I'd put a question like "who's your least hated PM", lol.


In that case I’d say whichever one is leaving office.


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