# Climate Change 2022



## sags (May 15, 2010)

Climate change scientists these days.......


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

Suicide by climate change ?

Record level extreme heat around the world, challenging old energy infrastructure to keep up to demand.

Record level droughts causing agricultural catastrophes around the world. Fresh water sources drying up for hundreds of millions of people.

Invasive species on the move. Fisheries collapsing due to the change in ocean temperatures.

Forest fires burning out of control around the world. Fear of the Arctic tundra melt releasing huge amounts of methane and prehistoric pathogens.

And on and on.


----------



## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

sags said:


> Suicide by climate change ?


You make it seem like climate change has never happened in earth's 4.5 billion year history. 

We've already experienced 5 ice ages, long before man was involved. Where you're sitting right now was many times covered in at least 5km of solid ice. What caused the melting? Who knows, but hopefully we can use that information to mitigate against future climate change.

I always like reading about the periods between ice ages when Antarctica was completely forested. Can you imagine how hot it was at the equator. I doubt that banning plastic straws would have much effect.









Fossil forests under Antarctic ice


In around 1833 the first specimens of fossilized wood from Antarctica were reported by surgeon, naturalist and artist James Eights.




phys.org





ltr


----------



## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

like_to_retire said:


> I doubt that banning plastic straws would have much effect.


If only the dinosaurs would have died and made stuff for EV batteries we would be saved!


----------



## AlwaysMissingTheBoat (8 mo ago)

I like to think human ingenuity will bail us out, even if we've been accelerating things over the past several decades. 

Until then, I'm content to vent my spleen on a discussion forum.


----------



## AlwaysMissingTheBoat (8 mo ago)

BTW, OP, do you only invest in "green" funds. Just wondering how much you walk the walk?


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

We cashed in all our equities when we retired, and entered into capital preservation mode.

Our climate change footprint is very low due to our age, location, fuel efficient vehicle, very low kms or other travel.

I hope you are right about human ingenuity, because otherwise we are going to leave an uninhabitable mess for future generations.

Maybe it is just an aberration, but it seems to me that the dire climate change forecasts are coming to fruition far earlier than previously expected.


----------



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

sags said:


> I hope you are right about human ingenuity, because otherwise we are going to leave an uninhabitable mess for future generations.


As usual, wealthier people will have resources (and comforts) to survive, while poor people around the world suffer and die.

This has always been the case with pollution and environmental damage as well. The impacts are always the worst in poor countries and poor communities.

It's really the sad, old story of the world and pretty depressing IMO. The wealthy industrialists exploit the earth to enrich themselves, becoming even wealthier. Meanwhile poor people are taken advantage of (economically), and *also* tend to suffer the consequences of the the side effects, such as environmental pollution, damage to land, harm to the climate, environment, crops.


----------



## prisoner24601 (May 27, 2018)

sags said:


> Climate change scientists these days.......
> 
> View attachment 23426


Part of the problem with any transformational change program is the narrative leaders adopt. Basically you have two choices - doomsday (we are screwed if we don't change) or visionary (look how much better things will be if we change). The doomsday narrative creates a big push-back and usually fails until the crisis is well underway and obvious to all. The positive approach needs amazing vision and leadership but ultimately is the only way that can create sustainable change before it's too late. I have faith in the younger generation that knows what kind of a world they want and they are going to make it happen


----------



## damian13ster (Apr 19, 2021)

The answer isn't really the end goal. I think there is wide-spread consensus of what people want for the future.

The question is how do we get there - that's where the differences lay.


----------



## Gumball (Dec 22, 2011)

Climate change is so rampant that Barack Obama and Bill Gates have purchased oceanside mansions due to their level of fear regarding rising sea levels!!

Obama just had a 2,500 lb propane tank installed at his mansion (is he not confident in the green inititatives he has been pushing?)








Why Do the Obamas Need a 2,500-Gallon Propane Tank at Their Martha's Vineyard Estate? It's Not What You Think


A news item about a huge propane tank at former President Barack Obama's mansion had us wondering why his family would need that much gas.




www.realtor.com





I am all for recylcing, I live below my means, I am aware and actively do whatever I can to be green, but the hypocrisy from the worlds leaders is absolutely disgusting. Im all for solar, all for wind.. but why we demonize fossil fuels and PUNISH our citizens with the absurd carbon tax is absolutely beyond me..


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

I don't think debate matters anymore. We have passed the tipping point and what is coming is coming regardless of what we do now.

Eat, drink, and be merry...........for tomorrow we die.


----------



## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

The Right isn't bothered with Earth's global warming because Hell was hotter.


----------



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Here's an amazing segment from CNN about a heatwave in Greenland, causing unusually high temperatures and powerful melting of ice.

Amazing visuals too.


----------



## Fisherman30 (Dec 5, 2018)

It's an extremely difficult issue to contend with, because it's a global issue. Canada could completely 100% stop producing CO2 emissions, and it would make zero difference to climate change. China produces 29% of the world's CO2 emissions and the US produces 14%. Russia is in 3rd place, producing 5%. Canada produces 2%. So until we can convince China and the US to start taking it seriously, not much is going to change. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying we shouldn't do our part, but the problem is huge, global, and until we can convince China and the US to do something, then not much is going to change. 

One thing that I think would save a lot of CO2 emissions in Canada would be more roundabouts. They've proven hugely effective in the UK, and I seem to waste a lot of time and fuel in Winnipeg stopped at red lights while there is no traffic coming from the other sides of the intersection. 

Another cool thing that's happening with air travel is that WestJet (and a number of other airlines) is taking part in an SAF (sustainable aviation fuel) trial. SAF is a type of biofuel that works in jet engines. They flew a 737 from LA to Calgary last month on SAF. Burning it still produces CO2 emissions, but the actual process of creating the fuel is more environmentally friendly. Burning SAF apparently produces less CO2 emissions than jet fuel somehow though, and modern jet engines are becoming incredibly efficient. I recently looked at a flight plan from a 787 flying from Calgary to Rome, did the math, and the fuel burn per passenger worked out to 3.2 litres/100 km. If that can be achieved worldwide in the aviation industry, while using SAF, then I think that will be huge.


----------



## damian13ster (Apr 19, 2021)

The problem with SAF, as currently defined, is that it takes out of food stock.
And now with idiots in governments (Sri Lanka, Holland, Canada) promoting world hunger and cutting food production, there really isn't that much to spare.
Biodiesel is another case in which regulation run in front of technology - which causes food to be turned into diesel. Until refineries are advanced enough and can use exclusively other feedstock (look at the mess in Surrey refinery for example), without cutting into food supply, mandating biodiesel will result in massive food inflation and hunger


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

Indoor vertical farming is the future of agriculture.


----------



## damian13ster (Apr 19, 2021)

How is that going to affect the fertilizer usage? That's what is being cut - that's what governments are doing to cut food production


----------



## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

damian13ster said:


> How is that going to affect the fertilizer usage? That's what is being cut - that's what governments are doing to cut food production


Indoor farming is very efficient wrt fertilizer use. Very little run-off. But vertical farming is far from being a solution for the vast bulk of calories consumed (grains).

I think it is fair to challenge the ag industry to improve practices wrt to runoff. Blanket limitations on inputs doesn't seem appropriate.


----------



## damian13ster (Apr 19, 2021)

The problem is that is precisely what is being done.
That's what Sri Lanka did, that's what the Dutch is doing, and that's what Canada is doing (30% drop in fertilizer use)


----------



## damian13ster (Apr 19, 2021)

Two-thirds of the Great Barrier Reef in Australia recorded the highest amount of coral cover in nearly four decades


----------



## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

sags said:


> Maybe it is just an aberration, but it seems to me that the dire climate change forecasts are coming to fruition far earlier than previously expected.


Thanks boomers


----------



## damian13ster (Apr 19, 2021)

Well ****, even Liberal MPs are on board with global warming:

Liberal MP Kody Blois is speaking alongside Chrystia Freeland in Nova Scotia right now, where he just said climate change is presenting a "net benefit" for the local wine sector.


----------



## AlwaysMissingTheBoat (8 mo ago)

I realize the bad new stories outnumber the good (whether that's just the media's penchant for crises is open to interpretation), but it's nice to see that we're not on the express train to hell in a handbasket...



_The summer of 2022 is shaping up to be a bumper season for both pink and sockeye salmon in British Columbia rivers, with one veteran Indigenous fisherman reporting the biggest catches of sockeye in decades.

Mitch Dudoward has worked in the salmon industry for more than 40 years, and says fishing on the Skeena River in northwest B.C. has never been better.

"This is the best season I can recall in my lifetime with the numbers we are catching,'' said Dudoward, who recently completed a big sockeye haul aboard his gillnetter Irenda.

Meanwhile, Bob Chamberlin, chairman of the First Nations Wild Salmon Alliance, said thousands of pink salmon are in Central Coast rivers after years of minimal returns.

The strong run comes two years after the closure of two open-net Atlantic salmon farms in the area._



https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/pinkeye-sockeye-salmon-run-bc-2022-1.6546874


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

That is a good news story, and there are some others.......but what happens to the salmon if water temperatures keep rising ?

Would that be good, bad or indifferent for the salmon fishery ?


----------



## AlwaysMissingTheBoat (8 mo ago)

sags said:


> That is a good news story, and there are some others.......but what happens to the salmon if water temperatures keep rising ?
> 
> Would that be good, bad or indifferent for the salmon fishery ?


Maybe there's a fisheries expert here who could answer that question. I'd presume IF the temperatures keep rising and IF they rise enough, that would not be good for stocks. But I've heard predictions over the past several years that salmon in B.C. were already doomed and would never return to average numbers. Glad to read that the average has apparently been surpassed in 2022!


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

Interesting.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1562411110065704960


----------



## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I think it's a pretty silly idea. It looks expensive for something that only generates 1 kW. A couple solar panels on a roof would do the same, and are unlikely to be hit by a passing vehicle, destroying it.


----------



## AlwaysMissingTheBoat (8 mo ago)

andrewf said:


> I think it's a pretty silly idea. It looks expensive for something that only generates 1 kW. A couple solar panels on a roof would do the same, and are unlikely to be hit by a passing vehicle, destroying it.


I thought the same thing. Very little payoff for all the materials and likelihood of damage.


----------



## AlwaysMissingTheBoat (8 mo ago)

Another victory. Might as well celebrate them!

Following international action to end overfishing of Pacific bluefin tuna, a new stock assessment shows that the species is now increasing and includes many younger fish that will help accelerate its rebound. The new assessment was presented at a recent plenary meeting of the International Scientific Committee for Tuna and Tuna-Like Species in the North Pacific Ocean (ISC).

The assessment confirmed that the stock surpassed the first rebuilding target in 2019. It is projected to likely increase beyond the second rebuilding target established by the Inter-American Tropical Tuna Commission and Western and Central Pacific Fisheries Commission later this year. This is well ahead of the internationally agreed schedule. 
“The new findings demonstrate the resilience of a species that can multiply quickly when given the chance,” said Kevin Piner, a research fishery biologist at NOAA Fisheries’ Southwest Fisheries Science Center who led work on the stock assessment for the United States. It also reflects the strength of the current stock assessment and projections that incorporate decades of information on Pacific bluefin biology and fisheries. It also demonstrates the success of coordinated management actions taken by the United States, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, and Mexico through regional fisheries management organizations.

“The species has responded exactly as we predicted it would given the actions that were taken,” he said. “This is an amazingly resilient fish and it is now showing us that.”











International Actions Pay Off For Pacific Bluefin Tuna as Species Rebounds at Accelerating Rate


New stock assessment reflects second highest biomass since assessments started.




www.fisheries.noaa.gov


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

The damage from climate change is really starting to pile up.

One "historic" storm after another all over the world. Fires, droughts, rising seas, heat waves, crop failures,.....

The damage from Fiona in Atlantic Canada is mostly not insured, so the government is going to have to step in with reparations.

A couple days later and Florida has Ian pummeling the entire State. The damage will be high.

We need to continue the carbon tax and put the money into a stand alone fund to mitigate the damages, or we will reach the point where there is no insurance and the government can no longer keep paying out.

We need to think ahead..........not drive while looking in the rear view mirror.


----------



## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

sags said:


> One "historic" storm after another


Storms aren't anything new, nor are fires. They've been around forever. Long before the carbon tax.

ltr


----------



## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

sags said:


> We need to think ahead..........not drive while looking in the rear view mirror.


Better start saving up for the next ice age because there goes the entire country of Canada.


----------



## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

AlwaysMissingTheBoat said:


> It also reflects the strength of the current stock assessment and projections that incorporate decades of information on Pacific bluefin biology and fisheries.


Wonder how skipjack is doing ... it's the tuna I mainly eat.


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

The damage has to be paid one way or another.


----------



## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

sags said:


> The damage has to be paid one way or another.


I would rather see investment into technological solutions such as carbon capture, etc., rather than imposing unnecessary taxes that harm the poor disproportionality.

ltr


----------



## Jericho (Dec 23, 2011)

sags said:


> The damage from climate change is really starting to pile up.
> 
> One "historic" storm after another all over the world. Fires, droughts, rising seas, heat waves, crop failures,.....
> 
> ...


We aren't hitting any of the emissions targets and the JT regime has been in power for 7 years now.

It's time to try something else.


----------



## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

Jericho said:


> It's time to try something else.


Yeah, like spend more time worrying about health care and less about the weather.

ltr


----------



## HappilyRetired (Nov 14, 2021)

Who changed the science to turn carbon from plant food into pollution?

How does increasing CO2 from 3 molecules per 10,000 to 4 molecules per 10,000 threaten life on earth?


----------



## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

HappilyRetired said:


> Who changed the science to turn carbon from plant food into pollution?
> 
> How does increasing CO2 from 3 molecules per 10,000 to 4 molecules per 10,000 threaten life on earth?


Life on earth will survive (at least until the sun expands to consume the earth in about a billion years). We have had very high atmospheric CO2 in the past. Human civilization is another matter. This change is also going to be very rapid, much faster than most previous climatic changes, so it remains to be seen how dramatic the mass extinction event will be. We already are in a mass extinction event, due to human activity, as the anthropocene begins.


----------



## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

andrewf said:


> We already are in a mass extinction event, due to human activity, as the anthropocene begins.


Best to get those moon and mars bases up and running soon!


----------



## HappilyRetired (Nov 14, 2021)

andrewf said:


> We already are in a mass extinction event, due to human activity, as the anthropocene begins.


That hasn't been proven.


----------



## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

HappilyRetired said:


> That hasn't been proven.


You mean, there is no evidence of mass species loss? The estimates of species loss is 1,000x to 10,000x the normal rate of extinction.


----------

