# Random passerby wants to buy rental unit



## adrienne (Mar 27, 2015)

Sorry--this is really long. Thanks to anyone who reads it all. 

We received a handwritten note hanging out of our mailbox stating that some random person and his family wants to buy the rental unit we live in. We live in a half duplex and our landlord owns both sides; neither unit is up for sale. 

The tenant on the other side has been there for 10 years, and we have been here for one year, with a new baby due in Feb, 2017. (We have a 3 year old as well). When we moved in, we had a discussion with the owner about any prospect of him selling in the near future, and he indicated he had no intention to do so for at least 10 years. We wanted to stay a while and wouldn't have moved in had he had intentions to sell within a year or two. 

My initial thought was to just trash the note, but my spouse decided it was best to call and inform the owner, as it is his property and not really our place to make a decision. I agreed that he is right, so he called the landlord. He was unable to reach the owner last night but will likely talk with him today or tomorrow I'm sure. 

We are just really quite annoyed by all of this; the fact someone randomly scoped out the place while we weren't here; the fact that the guy entered our gate to place the note in the mailbox right beside our front door. Did he also look in our windows, check out the yard? Also, as everyone knows, there is a huge INFLUX of homes all over this damn city that are for sale! Like buzz off.

Anyways, I know any response is speculation, but what do any of you think is the likelihood of something like this turning into a buyer/seller type situation? We have a really good rapport with our landlord, he's aware of the second baby on the way. We are about half way to saving a 20% down payment, and my spouse is just getting fed up with stuff like this (the first place we brought our baby home in had our tenancy terminated as the landlord's estranged wife decided to move into our unit). This is now our third rental with our first child and we were hoping to be here until we decided to buy. We have a lease until next April/May. 

Thanks so much for any responses!


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

There is a good chance every house in the neighborhood got one. It is a well know technique of real estate investors and real estate agents. Put such notes around to dozens of properties and see what happens. They don't often get a response but when they do, they know the owner wants to sell and there will be no agents and no one else bidding.

I wouldn't take it seriously. The chance of the owner selling is about 100:1.


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## heyjude (May 16, 2009)

This is why I prefer to own my home. 

I think your spouse was right to pass the note on to your landlord. Otherwise, the writer might find another way to contact him, and deception would not impress your landlord. 

Potential buyers approach owners all the time. I was approached by a realtor about a rental property that I own, but did not pursue the offer as I had no plans to sell a profitable unit. As Rusty said, there is a good chance that the neighbours got the same note. In my case, every owner in the condo building got one.

My friends were approached with an offer they could not refuse on their spacious home, and used it as an opportunity to downsize. Your landlord may or may not be tempted by an unsolicited offer, depending on many factors, not least, whether you are good tenants. 

If the property changes hands, a new owner may want to keep existing tenants. Tenancy legislation gives you some protection, depending on the province.


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> There is a good chance every house in the neighborhood got one. It is a well know technique of real estate investors and real estate agents. Put such notes around to dozens of properties and see what happens. They don't often get a response but when they do, they know the owner wants to sell and there will be no agents and no one else bidding.
> 
> I wouldn't take it seriously. The chance of the owner selling is about 100:1.


I'll second Rusty. Probably many of those were issued.

Years ago there was an outfit that would send out written offers in the mail to Vancouver homeowners. They had obtained names of registered owners and the letter would be addressed to the RO and would contain a cash offer. The RO could sign acceptance and return it. They sent out maybe thousands of those letters. The offer was always for an amount conspicuously below market value. They must have hoped that perhaps one in 1,000 would actually be accepted by someone mentally infirm.


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

There is no reason not to throw it in the trash like any other advertisement or flyer. Unless it is specifically addressed to the owner. "Occupant" or "to whom it may concern" does not count.


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## Prospector (Jul 25, 2014)

I've been on the buyer's side of this before. We wanted a particular house. Lost out on it because ours sold to slowly, but knew that it was a canned floor plan, and there were dozens of others similar. Took a drive around the neighbourhood and posted a note on the front door of every house that matched the floor plan we wanted. 

No one called us back. We found another house.


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> There is no reason not to throw it in the trash like any other advertisement or flyer. Unless it is specifically addressed to the owner. "Occupant" or "to whom it may concern" does not count.





Prospector said:


> I've been on the buyer's side of this before. We wanted a particular house. Lost out on it because ours sold to slowly, but knew that it was a canned floor plan, and there were dozens of others similar. Took a drive around the neighbourhood and posted a note on the front door of every house that matched the floor plan we wanted.
> 
> No one called us back. We found another house.


The above quotes show why this technique is of little utility for a serious buyer. As Rusty says, a note stuck to the door is really just junk mail and may be regarded as such. Even if addressed to the owner.

I have been on the purchaser’s end of soliciting vendors. It is not done by posting notes or by sending out “To whom it may concern” letters. It takes more effort.

The rural oceanfront property I now call home I acquired by the direct solicitation method. Properties such as this change hands seldom. One could wait years to find a listing that has the desired attributes. I gave up on waiting for a realtor’s call.

So I obtained cadastral maps for places of interest. I observed lot dimensions, and boundaries and obtained legal descriptions. I overlaid topographical maps and I obtained marine charts showing the nature of the shoreline and the intertidal zone.

Next, I short-listed some parcels that looked interesting. I searched titles to identify registered owners. Once in awhile, the RO was a corporation. A company search then revealed the identity of the company principals. Then I started digging up phone numbers for owners of parcels I thought might be worthy of consideration. All of this was long before the advent of the internet. A fair amount of research was involved. Those with whom I spoke were all content to discuss with me. No one was offended. They admired my approach and due diligence. It paid off. I got what I wanted.


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## nobleea (Oct 11, 2013)

We bought our current property this way. Similar to Mukhang's work, but in the age of internet.
Looked at all the houses in our neighbourhood of interest, both by walking by them and scoping our on google satellite. Then shortlisting the lots we liked and comparing against city assessed values. Rating the general condition, one could tell which properties were rentals (a landlord is more likely to gauge the correct value of the place). Rank the most promising properties and then pulled the title to get the registered owners. Google search for their address and then sent them a personal letter by registered mail (to confirm they read it). Our number one choice got back to us within a week and said they'd be interested. Met for coffee and agreed to a deal in 15 mins.

The thing with land title searches is they're seldom up to date. Someone who owned the house, then moved but is now renting it out will still show th eowner as living at that address. Similar to if someone dies. Until the heirs go to sell the property, the listed owner is generally still the deceased.

Our neighbours built their current home on property purchased similarly. Though they approached the owner in person. They had a verbal agreement, then the owner died, so it had to go through probate.


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

I've bought places this way before, and know others who have as well...that being said, it generally doesn't pay off. Even if I'm interested in buying, and the owner is interested in selling, doesn't mean we'll agree on a price. Also, it doesn't mean you'll be affected in any way whatsoever except for the person you make the cheques payable to.

You're probably getting worried over nothing, a lot of stars have to align for your worst case scenario to come true.


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## adrienne (Mar 27, 2015)

Thanks for all of the replies guys! My spouse talked with our landlord last night and sure enough, the note was a mass produced one that was handed out throughout the block. It looks like it was handwritten but in actuality it was typed to look that way. Our landlord reiterated that he is not interested in selling for many years. I was pretty certain nothing would come of it because as mentioned we have a good relationship with him, we are respectful tenants, and we have no issues with him nor anyone else around here. 

It's funny people will do stuff like this; I bet it's a common tactic just to see if anyone bites. Thanks again


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

adrienne said:


> It's funny people will do stuff like this; I bet it's a common tactic just to see if anyone bites. Thanks again


I have no first hand knowledge of anyone taking the bait, but it must occur. Just as the Nigerian bank scams must succeed in finding a victim every now and again. Same goes for all of those entreaties from wealthy aged widows, who are dying of some dread disease, looking for someone to assist them in their final hours in finding a home for their wealth. Or the "my client died leaving millions and I'd like you to come forward to claim it" scam. There must be a few who fall prey to these things, given how they persist.

What I have seen is how it might work. Many years ago in Vancouver, I was walking along my street in the morning to catch the Macdonald bus to get to my office downtown. I encountered an elderly fellow on the sidewalk. He stopped me and asked, "Excuse me, but I am trying to get to Vancouver, can you help?" I was nonplussed. Here's a guy in the heart of Vancouver seeking help to get there. I thought I had fallen down a rabbit hole. Our conversation seemed quite normal on a superficial level. I sought to determine just where in Vancouver he wanted to be. He could not really answer.

Within a few minutes of me trying to tell the man that he had reached his destination - at least he had made it to Vancouver - he took me to his car, parked on the driveway of the nearby residence. From a distance it looked like an older model Olds 98; nothing unusual. When we got close and he opened the driver's side door, I could tell the car had not moved in years. The interior was mildewed and smelled musty. The man pulled out an old road map. 

As it turned out, from more conversation and a look at documents in the car, it became clear that we were standing in front of his house. But at that time, he did not even recognize it as home. At some point in our meandering discourse the market value of local home came up. I mentioned that what I now understood to be his house was probably worth in the range of $200,000. He laughed and suggested I had a good sense of humour. He thought $20,000 would be a good price, probably what he had paid years before.

My point is that someone like that I could see being swindled out of his home in various ways, including the mailed offer I mentioned above.


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

Not everyone is looking to rob the old and mentally infirm. Many times, when I invest in a complex, I talk to other owners to see if they want to sell. Some are long term investors looking to cash out, others may be foolish investors tired of screwing up, some may be owners looking to relocate and save realtor fees. 

Yesterday I attended a meeting and had several people approach me about buying their places. A meeting last month, I had one investor approach me about buying all his places. It happens all the time. Many sales occur outside of a realtor. 

I also know a couple who grew up in an area where they wanted to move back to. They put a note in everyone's mailbox and found their home that way.

Not everyone is out to take advantage of someone else. It's just another way, albeit not very likely to succeed, to try and get what you want.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

adrienne said:


> We received a handwritten note hanging out of our mailbox stating that some random person and his family wants to buy the rental unit we live in. We live in a half duplex and our landlord owns both sides; neither unit is up for sale.
> 
> 
> Thanks so much for any responses!


It's basically farming the area of the real estate company or agent. I get them occasionally too. 
They don't know what unit is a rental or owned.

They hire flyer delivery people to go door to door and put them on the doorstep or hang them from the old mailbox that
CP doesn't use anymore, in the hope that they get a 'bite"
Throw them in the paper recycle bin if you have one.


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## 319905 (Mar 7, 2016)

^ Well, I've recently rec'd 2 legitimate offers to purchase that started out as a knock on the door, a letter in the mailbox because I wasn't home ... just saying, no harm in reading these things over. If I was a renter though, I'd just ignore them. Last week's offer was "this close" to making it to my lawyer ... the last 2 houses I sold were by sitting down, dickering and dealing over the terms of an offer, and then off to my lawyer to take care of the details ... done.


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

Just a Guy said:


> Not everyone is looking to rob the old and mentally infirm.
> 
> Not everyone is out to take advantage of someone else. It's just another way, albeit not very likely to succeed, to try and get what you want.


I never suggested that "everyone is looking to rob the old and mentally infirm", which seems to be the import of your comment. I would think the number of nefarious types would be quite limited. However, I would place in that category those responsible for the mailing of cash offers to Vancouver homeowners, requesting a signed acceptance by return mail. Those offers were always for a fraction of fair market value and they did not purport to be an opening bid and an invitation to negotiate. In my anecdote above I described someone who could just be vulnerable to such a solicitation.

The OP here spoke of receiving a note in a mailbox. No particular offer involved. Probably not a scammer, just someone "farming the area" as carver suggests.


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

You might as well ask why Canadian Tire or A&W send around flyers. It is a legitimate method of advertising. In the case of a house the advertiser will not get many replies, but maybe they only want to buy 1 or 2 houses a year. If they spend a few hundred dollars to get a lead on a $200,000 house it is money well spent.

I will say this is a favorite technique of "no money down" gurus. Maybe the sender was a real estate agent new in the area. Or maybe an investor trying his luck. In any case, nothing wrong with trying something a little bit creative, if it doesn't work no harm done.

This kind of thing does not work with the stupid, the uninformed, or the average broke person. It works best with an experienced real estate investor who knows how hard it is to sell a house, and how much you have to pay a real estate agent.

Being an experience RE investor, if I had a house worth say $250,000 I would figure on getting $225,000 if I tried to sell it, and it might take a year to get that, and I would have to pay a 5% commission which is $12,500 and I might have to spend $5000 on painting and fixing to make it look nice and pay taxes and insurance for a year.

If someone offered me $200,000 I would grab it fast. And if they wanted me to take back a mortgage I would do that too, if they had a decent credit rating and at least 10% cash down.

The average homeowner wouldn't know what the hell I was talking about and wouldn't do a deal like that in 100 years.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> If they spend a few hundred dollars to get a lead on a $200,000 house it is money well spent.


Where exactly would one find a $200K house these days in Canada?..maybe up Northern Ontario, but certainly not too many of those in the major cities here. If there is one, then the real estate agent/broker would grab it..if as you say..the seller is uniformed as to the real value of his house. 

Their most recent assessment should pretty much give them an idea of what their house is worth as far
as property taxes. 

For instance my house in Ottawa Ont is assessed at 285K for property taxes. It's just an average built 43 yr old house built on the cheap by a builder that went bankrupt shortly after. I know how much it's worth to the municipality from my MPAC assessment, usually a "few thousand lower" than the listing price, so that is a starting point since i'm still living in it. 

Now if "somebody" dropping a flyer at my door step (or hanging it off the front door knob) is telling me they have a buyer ready to pay me a $200k more than it's assessed ($500K) ,..maybe. 

In Toronto, with real estate prices spiralling (at least so far), I can see that happening. though.
Somebody off the street looking to make a few bucks on the deal by flipping the property, 
buying it as cheaply as possible, then reselling it at a higher price, 
but only the uninformed or stupid or a bit of both homeowner would go for that kind of offer.


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## Prospector (Jul 25, 2014)

carverman said:


> Where exactly would one find a $200K house these days in Canada?..maybe up Northern Ontario, but certainly not too many of those in the major cities here. If there is one, then the real estate agent/broker would grab it..if as you say..the seller is uniformed as to the real value of his house.



<action> Whistles Quietly and nods knowingly. </action>

<action> Swings ruby in front of carverman's eyes</action> 

Nothing out there. 
There is nothing out there. 
Don't look too closely, there is nothing out there. 
You can't find anything worth buying under $200K. 
Nothing out there.


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

There are houses for $200,000 or less in small towns all across Canada. And sometimes it is hard to get a decent price for even the best house. Shopping for bargains may not work in Toronto or Vancouver but they are less than 1% of Canada.

Here is what you can get for under $200,000 in Trenton. A brick 3 bedroom 2 bath bungalow on a 50 foot lot.

http://www.quinte-mls.com/listings/403770070/trenton/33-third-avenue

And, there are lots cheaper places to buy than Trenton.


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## Prospector (Jul 25, 2014)

Or a 4 bd, 2 ba student rental in Brantford: https://www.realtor.ca/Residential/Single-Family/17548419/76-Grey-Street-Brantford-Ontario-N3T2T5
Or a 4 bd student rental in London: https://www.realtor.ca/Residential/Single-Family/17574388/105-BARKER-ST-London-Ontario-N5Y1X8
Or...


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## 319905 (Mar 7, 2016)

rikk2 said:


> ^ Well, I've recently rec'd 2 legitimate offers to purchase that started out as a knock on the door, a letter in the mailbox because I wasn't home ... just saying, no harm in reading these things over. If I was a renter though, I'd just ignore them. Last week's offer was "this close" to making it to my lawyer ... the last 2 houses I sold were by sitting down, dickering and dealing over the terms of an offer, and then off to my lawyer to take care of the details ... done.


Interesting: last weeks offered expired on Thursday, I responded by email to the buyer about my concerns, just received an email ... the buyer would like to meet and discuss my concerns, incorporate them into a new offer so could be I'll be off to the lawyer ... and done. Just saying, no harm in reading these things over ...


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> There are houses for $200,000 or less in small towns all across Canada. And sometimes it is hard to get a decent price for even the best house. Shopping for bargains may not work in Toronto or Vancouver but they are less than 1% of Canada.


There are places for under $200k in major cities all across Canada. Sure they are not in the top neighbourhoods, or always in the best condition, but that's also a long way from being an unliveable he'll hole.


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