# Computer help? Browsing history & IP address?



## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

I'm hoping some of the more "computer-knowledgeable" people here can comment on this.
I was having a chat last night with a friend re permanently deleting one's browsing history. From what I've read, there's no sure-fire way to permanently delete all your history other than to physically remove the hard drive & smash it to smithereens with a sledgehammer. Then start over fresh & clean with a new computer (or at least a new hard drive). He said no, not even that works because some of your browsing history is tied to (not his words exactly) your IP address, and, of course, your IP address doesn't change with a new computer.
Anyone care to comment on this? And, if this is true, can one get a new IP address and, would this solve the problem. If not- is there ANY WAY to permanently delete one's browsing history for once & for all? Thanks.


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

jargey3000 said:


> I'm hoping some of the more "computer-knowledgeable" people here can comment on this.
> I was having a chat last night with a friend re permanently deleting one's browsing history. From what I've read, there's no sure-fire way to permanently delete all your history other than to physically remove the hard drive & smash it to smithereens with a sledgehammer. Then start over fresh & clean with a new computer (or at least a new hard drive). He said no, not even that works because some of your browsing history is tied to (not his words exactly) your IP address, and, of course, your IP address doesn't change with a new computer.
> Anyone care to comment on this? And, if this is true, can one get a new IP address and, would this solve the problem. If not- is there ANY WAY to permanently delete one's browsing history for once & for all? Thanks.


I don't think changing your IP address will do much. Your ISP as well as search engines like Google likely have records of your browsing history. This link might be a start: http://whatismyipaddress.com/change-ip as may this one: http://whatismyipaddress.com/hide-ip


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

LOL: reminds me of this: https://vimeo.com/41920743

Googles: "very elderly butts"


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Well, it depends on what you mean by delete? It's unlikely you would ever be able to erase any data that any number of internet firms have gathered about your interests or activities on the internet. If you are interested in protecting your privacy from people you live with, that is a different story. You could consider using a VPN, which would prevent your ISP or anyone whose network you are using from monitoring your browsing activity.

It is just about impossible to be completely anonymous and untraceable on the internet though. Something you'll have to live with, or live without.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

jargey3000 said:


> is there ANY WAY to permanently delete one's browsing history for once & for all? Thanks.


Questions are ...
1> Why do you feel you need to delete it?
2> Who are you trying to hide it from?

BTW, if you're on the internet chances are you're leaving digital footprints all over the place.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

cainvest said:


> Questions are ...
> 1> Why do you feel you need to delete it?
> 2> Who are you trying to hide it from?
> 
> BTW, if you're on the _internet chances are you're leaving digital footprints all over the place_.


I don't think you can completely erase your browsing history due to hard drive partitioning. 

Local disc "C", local disk "e", and system reserved disk "H".

The last one is privileged access and stores key system data. The police can access that area with a special "key" to find if you have been visiting
illegal child porn sites, ISIS or Al Queda recruitment sites.
Your ISP will also have a copy on their servers of your account and your surfing habits as well.

The only way to ensure they wont access your data is to smash the hard drive into many pieces so the disk won't spin...but the police can go to your
ISP and get the backup data...that's how some get caught.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Using the internet is equivalent to standing on the corner and yelling out all your personal information to everyone passing by.

I Googled my own name occasionally, and there wasn't much of anything...........until I gave an interview in the local paper and there it was. 

Then there appeared an additional article with me in it from a church pamphlet in 1964.

How that showed up suddenly 52 years later is beyond me.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Isn't this what Apple is battling the US government over right now ?

Law enforcement could go to the ISP provider, but I think they needed to prove who was actually using the phone to obtain a search warrant.

The latest legal trick I have read about is the authorities apply for search warrant using a "John Doe" application which doesn't require proof of use by a specific individual.

The courts have upheld the practice and formerly anonymous internet bloggers are being sued for defamation because their identity is eventually discovered through the ISP address.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

cainvest said:


> Questions are ...
> 1> Why do you feel you need to delete it?
> 2> Who are you trying to hide it from?
> 
> BTW, if you're on the internet chances are you're leaving digital footprints all over the place.


A lot of people store passwords on their computer for every site the enter. If someone takes the computer, they would have the passwords to sites they know you visited..........as in the bank.

That is especially true of smartphones, which are essentially computers. If the wrong person finds or steals a password loaded IPhone............it is shopping time.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

jargey3000 said:


> I'm hoping some of the more "computer-knowledgeable" people here can comment on this.
> I was having a chat last night with a friend re permanently deleting one's browsing history. From what I've read, there's no sure-fire way to permanently delete all your history other than to physically remove the hard drive & smash it to smithereens with a sledgehammer. Then start over fresh & clean with a new computer (or at least a new hard drive). He said no, not even that works because some of your browsing history is tied to (not his words exactly) your IP address, and, of course, your IP address doesn't change with a new computer.


That's right. Your IP address is unique, but there is a way of making it virtual so that it looks like *** ***.**


> Anyone care to comment on this? And, if this is true, can one get a new IP address and, would this solve the problem. If not- is there ANY WAY to permanently delete one's browsing history for once & for all? Thanks.


A newIP address is a solution, but it should not be visible to the outside. You Can use one of these services maybe?

http://download.cnet.com/Easy-Hide-IP/3000-2144_4-10714026.html
http://whatismyipaddress.com/hide-ip


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Overall answer: the history of your web activity is very difficult/impossible to conceal.

_On the computer level_: you can (and should) routinely delete your history and cache. Firefox can be configured (under Preferences - Privacy) to "Clear history when Firefox closes". In both Firefox and Chrome, you can press CTRL+SHIFT+DEL to clear your browsing history, at any time. This however does not erase all traces of the file from your computer hard drive. Thoroughly erasing that is very difficult. Taking a hammer or blowtorch to your hard drive does not accomplish it either. Rather, you have to first do multiple rewrites over your hard drive with random garbage, then you have to remove your hard drive and carefully destroy it, being carefully to destroy the magnetic storage. Overall, this entire process is extremely difficult (back in 1999, I created software to do this process, but the procedure has become significantly more difficult since then because hard drives and operating systems are more resilient)

^ Summary: on your computer, it makes sense to routinely clear the cache, cookies and history. *This prevents casual snooping*. But it's nearly impossible to fully delete your traces.

_On the internet level_: The common web browsing we all do, including our google searches, cannot be obliterated. The remnants remain. Even though you can change your IP address, it's almost pointless. Other forms of internet tracking can uniquely identify you (see browser fingerprinting, or this EFF tool). The silicon valley industries like Google, Facebook and others have spent BILLIONS of dollars figuring out ways to track you. The IP address is not a big deal; they can still track you. Two popular approaches to side-stepping this to retain privacy are the use of VPN services, and the Tor web browser. But this is not fool proof either. VPNs are more meant to superficially conceal your address/location (they are not immune to more advanced methods or law enforcement). And Tor was recently hacked by the FBI. It is believed by some that the FBI has the legal authority to indiscriminately hack systems like Tor, but nevertheless, Tor is one of the only solid anonymization services that has also been thoroughly studied by researchers and found to be strong.

^ Summary: on the internet, it's virtually impossible to eliminate your traces. VPN help keep your activity private, and Tor is even better, but neither of these are total solutions.

The only way to avoid your internet history from being logged is to stop using the internet. You have to realize that these various services, like the ones others mentioned in this thread, or VPNs, only superficially provide you anonymity.

Tor provides the strongest anonymization that I know of, but even that can be hacked by law enforcement. The reason we know that Tor is very potent is that law enforcement is vocal about the problem Tor causes them.

Any information that you ALREADY put out there is ... out there. You can't reverse it.

For you parents out there: these are strong reasons to restrict a child's use of the internet. Think twice before buying them a smartphone. Everything they say and do will be logged forever, and can hurt them later when they're an adult. Children, as under-matured people, are completely incapable of understanding the harm that they will cause to themselves when they use smartphones or tablets. Hell, even most of us adults barely understand the privacy implications. I would never let my kid use a smartphone.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

sags said:


> Using the internet is equivalent to standing on the corner and yelling out all your personal information to everyone passing by.


That's right. And the anonymization services like those linked by carverman (which are VPN and proxy services) help a little bit, by muffling the sound coming out, but a careful listener can still hear it all.

Using a smartphone is like yelling on the street corner, while filming video of your face with your name emblazoned below it, projected onto a cinema screen behind you. Don't ever think that anything you do on a smartphone has any kind of privacy... these platforms, including the iPhone, were designed to be marketing vehicles. By their nature they are meant to let Google, Apple, and advertisers track you.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

james4beach said:


> Overall answer: the history of your web activity is very difficult/impossible to conceal.
> 
> 
> Any information that you ALREADY put out there is ... out there. You can't reverse it.
> ...


Well said, J4B...this is the price we pay for using a sophisticated computer network where everyone is interconnected. 

You cannot remain completely hidden from hackers or identity thieves. Tracking cookies is yet another snooping mechanism that someone can find out what your activities are on the internet..and on the internet..you can be anyone you want to be as we all know by now.

I shudder , when I hear stories on TV of teenagers getting into trouble on social media sites with pictures and remarks they make at the spur of the moment on their smart phones. Taking selfies of themselves in compromised situations and saying things that can be taken seriously as bullying or even illegal (libel) in some cases.

I guess like with everything else these days,there has to be a maturing process involved with the new generation..and some of the older ones as well.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

> I shudder , when I hear stories on TV of teenagers getting into trouble on social media sites with pictures and remarks they make at the spur of the moment on their smart phones


I worry about embarrassment of kids and teenagers. Near the final year of highschool and into early college years, we had parties where people would get drunk and crazy things would happen. There were topless girls and drunk girls acting wild. Several of my classmates went on to become lawyers. One of the girls -- who _definitely_ got wild back then -- has gained a position of power in the court system. Another one of these girls ran for a political position... nearly 15 years after the fact. If elected, she would have been a public figure.

Thankfully, back in our days, there were no smartphones. People weren't carrying around video recording devices everywhere. As a result, I have these fantastic memories which I'll always cherish, BUT compromising images of these women are not plastered on the internet. These days, however, teenagers with phones are constantly sending nude pictures to each other. They have cameras in their pocket, that they take to their bedrooms every night, which is linked and networked with all their friends.

This is really dangerous stuff

Now imagine if that classmate of mine, the one who ran for political office, had grown up in the smartphone era. Someone would have pictures. That could be used against her and certainly would affect her career.

I really wonder what's going to happen in a few years. A teenage girl in 2011 who has a smart phone and uses it for everything (including sending pictures to her boyfriend), could become a powerful executive or a politician in 2030. And someone is going to drag out the photos of her from her wild teenage days, and try to blackmail her, or destroy her career, or otherwise be a pest.

What about a teenage girl today who's going down the path of my old classmate, ending up working in the court system. Possibly becoming a judge. Everything seems fine until one day, 30 years later, someone pulls out footage from a party where the judge is shown performing sexual acts back when she was 19. Why does this footage exists? Because they were at a wild party with twenty drunk young adults and everyone was carrying a damned video camera. _The party might as well have been full of cops._

Kids, teens, and young adults are supposed to do stupid things and make mistakes. I worry about this.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

james4beach said:


> Now imagine if that classmate of mine, the one who ran for political office, had grown up in the smartphone era. Someone would have pictures. That could be used against her and certainly would affect her career.
> 
> 
> What about a teenage girl today who's going down the path of my old classmate, ending up working in the court system. Possibly becoming a judge. Everything seems fine until one day, 30 years later, someone pulls out footage from a* party where the judge is shown performing sexual acts back when she was 19.* Why does this footage exists? Because they were at a wild party with twenty drunk young adults and everyone was carrying a damned video camera. _The party might as well have been full of cops._
> ...


This happened to a female judge who was sitting on the Queens Bench in Manitoba, I believe. 

In this case, the husband was also involved to encourage her to perform these acts. 
"computer specialist"? was "harassed" to have sex with her?...its sad that social media knows no boundaries



> the CBC had reported that sexually explicit photographs of Douglas are part of the complaint made in July by *Alexander Chapman, a 44-year-old computer specialist*, who says he was *harassed by the judge’s husband to have sex with her.*


http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/..._questions_about_private_lives_of_judges.html


> Chapman accepted a $25,000 settlement from the lawyer in July 2003 that required Chapman to delete photographs of Douglas from his personal computer


.
uh huh!...more like some kind of extortion hushed up by bribes


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

Once you've done something on the Internet it's nearly impossible to undo it. There are records of things everywhere. If you go to a website, the website has a record you were there and your computer does too...and, technically, so does every computer that relayed parts of the information between the two of you. The Internet doesn't work like a telephone with a direct connection between you and the place you are looking at, it packs up small bundles of information and sends them out via multiple paths, to be reassembled at your end, so information passes through many servers (not all of the information passes through each server,,but parts of it do) on its way to you. 

If someone really wants to see if you were someplace, they could probably find out given enough resources.

There are ways to make it even harder, VPN was mentioned, there are browsers that use the TOR network to spoof your IP address (however if the police got access to the routing tables, they could probably still track you), there are anonymizers, and other things which may help but, in reality, probably only give you a false sense of security because, as I said, a determined person, with enough resources, could still track you.

At the end of the day it's best to admit that privacy doesn't really exist anymore...the real question you should ask is, is it worth the time and effort for someone to actually try and track down the information,,because that will be the real determining factor in any investigation.

There are many companies which will send out endless emails harassing people, emails are cheap and addresses usually easy to track down, but to take things to the next level requires effort and money...this is why collection agencies rarely get past harassment for small amounts...the payback isn't worth it.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

The only solution as I see it, is to severely limit disclosure of the personal information that various sources already hold.

If they keep the information, they should be be required to safeguard it and face severe consequences when they don't.

Just because they hold the information doesn't give them the right to publish it.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

sags said:


> The only solution as I see it, is to severely limit disclosure of the personal information that various sources already hold.
> 
> If they keep the information, they should be be required to safeguard it and face severe consequences when they don't.
> 
> Just because they hold the information doesn't give them the right to publish it.


tell that to Target,Home Depot and many others that had sensitive customer data comprimised. Maybe even an inside job.
If there is something to be gained by collecting sensitive CC Data, names,addresses and other personal information..sooner
or later somebody will hack into it.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

And what did Home Depot do for their customers ? Free credit monitoring for a year. Gee..........thanks Home Depot.

How about the national travel agency that hired convicts in prison to take bookings. Customers phoned in and had no idea they were giving their personal information to prison inmates.

But...........the good news is the company did save some money on staffing levels :smilet-digitalpoint


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

I still it's prudent to take some basic privacy measures. For example, regularly clear your cookies & cache from your web browser.

Most important - as mentioned by others here - is to limit what kind of personal information you share and post. I have a facebook account but I share very little about my life.

Obviously you should also use strong passwords for your accounts


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

There are a number of chrome extension you can use. For example, I use Ghostery, adblock, cookie killer etc.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Good point about the plugins. I use Ad Block Plus which does a great job at stopping ads and flash plugins from running.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

james4beach said:


> I still it's prudent to take some basic privacy measures. For example, regularly clear your cookies & cache from your web browser.
> 
> Most important - as mentioned by others here - is to limit what kind of personal information you share and post. I have a facebook account but I share very little about my life.
> 
> Obviously you should also use strong passwords for your accounts


I use Chrome and I regularly use the "clear History - since the beginning of time" option.
Does that "clear your cookies & cache", as you say? Or do you have to do something else to clear cookies & cache?


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

jargey3000 said:


> I use Chrome and I regularly use the "clear History - since the beginning of time" option.
> Does that "clear your cookies & cache", as you say? Or do you have to do something else to clear cookies & cache?


Do you use CTRL+SHIFT+DEL in Chrome (same as More Tools -> Clear browsing data)? On mine it shows a window as attached in the graphic. Mine shows not just history but also cookies and caches. This window, shown in my attachment, does indeed clear the cookies & cache - as indicated by the check boxes.


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## Video_Frank (Aug 2, 2013)

You can go to jail in the U.S. for clearing your cache.



> ...charges against David Kernell, who hacked into Sarah Palin's email account. The actual hacking resulted in misdemeanor charges. The cleanup processes deployed by Kernell (clearing browser cache, running a disk defragmenter, deleting downloaded photos) were treated as felony obstruction of justice...


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## GreenAvenue (Dec 28, 2011)

https://www.torproject.org/projects/torbrowser.html.en 

There is no such thing as 'safe' on the internet. You were online? You left a trail.


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

Even the TOR browsers can be traced though, even when you think you are safe...

http://xordern.net/ip-leakage-of-mobile-tor-browsers.html


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Yes it's possible to "see through" any of these methods. For instance in TOR you can be compromised by a web browser that (deliberately or unwittingly) reveals something about you.

You should never assume that anything you do online is private. Nothing is 100% solid for privacy.

However you should take steps to strengthen your privacy and security, that's just prudent. It's like locking the door to your house or car. Locks are extremely easy to pick... it's almost laughable how ineffective they are against a trained intruder. However, it is absolutely prudent to lock your doors -- it prevents most kinds of mischief.


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