# Frugal Cooking/grocery ideas



## Plugging Along

Groceries seems to be one of the expenses that there is a lot of variability. When my spouse was laid off, I was able to cut my expenses before from about $1200 to $400 a month. Now we are up more than that since I have less time to look for the deals. I have however found some very time saving/money habits along the way and will use this thread to share. It's my mini blog, as I don't have time to blog on a regular basis. Perhaps this thread will lead to a blog, book or something else . . At the very least maybe this will help others save a little money.

My priorities are health, taste, the finances when it comes to food. Some things I post here may not be the cheapest or the fastest but they will be good. 

Feel free to add your own tips.

I will add to this thread when I have done something that I have discovered at home.


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## Plugging Along

This morning, I made a Nanking cherry compote/syrup. These were actually picked last summer from the person I buy my raw organic honey. The land owner said he had cherries that he didn't know what to do with because he is never home. He invited my family to do some picking, we ended up with about 3 ice cream pails full. 

I washed them, and pitted them (that was a pain) and made some sauces and things. The rest, I froze in two cup portions in ziplock bags. That one hint, freeze you bulk goods in the potions you think you will most often use. Go on smaller side because you can always combine two portions.

This morning, I took a bag, boiled, added some agave (sugar is fine), vanilla, and thicken with corn starch. 

I served it over French toast on a loaf of bread that is going stale. It was a big loaf, so I ended up making it all, and the rest will be frozen on a cookie sheet. Fast break fast for the kids on school days. They get sad that they don't have cereal often.


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## rikk

Just made a nice beef stew for Sunday dinner ... small cheap beef roast cubed, potatoes, carrots, celery, onions, turnip ... 2 servings each for dinner (haven't had stew in a while) with 6 servings into containers for lunches. Agreed, beef's a bit expensive these days but ...


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## Just a Guy

Best thing to do is shop by the pound, not by the price or what you assume...

For example, many people think stewing beef is cheap, but I was at Costco the other day and it's $11/kg. Their vacuum packed top serloin sells for $9/kg (exact prices may have been a bit different). 

Many stores sell precut cheese all for the same price (say $5/block) but the weight of the blocks can vary quite a bit, sometimes by almost a pound. Walmart sold turkeys like that just before thanksgiving. They had price points $10, $15, $20 for three different sizes under 5kg, 5-10kg and over 10kg (or something similar)...you could get quite a bit more turkey if you looked through the pile.

Of course, picking up a few turkeys when they are on sale, or right after thanksgiving, can fill up a freezer pretty cheap as well.


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## rikk

Just a Guy said:


> For example, many people think stewing beef is cheap, but I was at Costco the other day and it's $11/kg. Their vacuum packed top serloin sells for $9/kg ...


I mainly get a small boneless roast for stew because it is much more tender than stewing beef, and as a bonus, as you posted, the roast is less expensive ... stewing beef - tough, stringy, a total waste of time, space, and money :hopelessness:

We also buy a whole salmon which is often on sale and have the butcher (or whatever the title of the guy is that works the fish counter) cut it up into steaks ... for a small fee of course ... for freezing.

Shopping for two at a reasonable cost can't help but require a bit of "bulk" buying and freezing now and then.


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## Sherlock

I've foudn the slow cooker to be a great way to prepare food if you don't have a lot of time. Simply throw the ingredients in and let them cook for 8 hours.

An easy pulled pork recipe: Buy a pork shoulder, which is a relatively cheap cut of meat. Put it in the slow cooker, then pour in a can of root beer or dr pepper (non-diet). Cook on low for 8 hours, then just pull it apart with two forks and add sauce (I like sweet baby ray's bbq sauce). If you want you can add more seasoning like onions or whatever but I don't bother.

There are lots of slow cooker recipes here: https://www.reddit.com/r/slowcooking


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## atrp2biz

We find that the cheapest way to shop is without a shopping list. Save for the staples like milk, eggs and bread, we generally don't have a shopping list. The Walmart/Superstore flyer is our shopping list--we'll buy whatever is on sale. It's like the TV show Chopped. You get a pre-determined basket of goods and you figure out how to make the week work with those goods.


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## Ponderling

While some of the ideas have become outdated with the rise of the availability of information on the Web, the 'Tightwad Gazette' anthologies are great resources on affordable ways to cook meals for less money.

Yes, for us, meals are built around what is on sale at the store, or what was loaded up on when that meat item was on sale or ridiculously discounted as it neared its price sticker date.

Other things take a bit more work, but are worth it, and makes something nice without shelling out for meat.

One example we make is called Barley Lentil stew. About $4 in dried barley soaked up a day before, and about the same value in lentils which don't need soaking. Saute onions, toss in pepper to taste. and chop up any vegetables that are hanging around in the fridge, or buy a frozen diced vegetables to toss in. This makes about 20L worth - so eat a hearty meal fresh with bread to sop it up, and lightly pressure can if that is your thing, or freeze left overs in old ice cream tubs, etc, , or just stick this into left over jars in the back of the fridge for a week or two for short term storage.


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## Plugging Along

atrp2biz said:


> We find that the cheapest way to shop is without a shopping list. Save for the staples like milk, eggs and bread, we generally don't have a shopping list. The Walmart/Superstore flyer is our shopping list--we'll buy whatever is on sale. It's like the TV show Chopped. You get a pre-determined basket of goods and you figure out how to make the week work with those goods.


I keep an ongoing list of items that are staples, that we may need to stock up on, so when they go on sale, I will buy. I also go through the flyers weekly, and make note of the sale items which I need to pick up on. We cook based on the sale items too. However, since I buy in bulk, I do my own thing of Chopped for the week, but also do a little Iron chef, where I come up with freezer meals with that theme.


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## none

This:

http://www.epicurious.com/recipes/food/views/pasta-puttanesca-242590


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## Plugging Along

My latest shopping are found a pork loin sale $1.88 lb. bought 7 lbs roast. Sliced it into a whole bunch of pork chops, some for grilling, another meal for freezing, then pounded out two meals in pork schnitzel. They are are freezing now. Was able to get 20 servings from under $13. I also found some apples that were looking a little sad (hidden u dear my fruit basket), and there was an apple sale, so I bought a few more, and made the best applesauce. It went great with the pork,and the kids won't stop eating it. 

I may run and getting anothe pork loin to stonily slice, and marinade to make Tocino pork. I am running a little low on freezer space because of the French toast. We will have to see.


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## lost in space

There is a price checker app which my niece uses all the time, best part is many stores accept the app so you don't even need to bring the ad with you unfortunately I can't find the email where she mentioned it. 

Redflag deals would be a good place to check out, as I don't live in Canada at the moment I don't spend much time there. 

For feeding an army I had a missionary friend in Madrid who used to host large groups for dinner each week, and on top of that he had three teenage boys and a daughter, yet he managed to spend less than my wife and I on food. This interested me so I really paid attention to what he did and there where several tricks he used

1.	Go shopping only once a week
2.	Buy only the cheapest of the cheapest - with a few exceptions he bought only the no name store branded products*
3.	Cook with lentils and beans
4.	Use very little meat, I remember one meal in particular where he served slow cooker lentil stew and he put in 2 potatoes 2 carrots and one sausage This was a meal for 7 adults people

The key really is to find bulk stuff that’s cheap to buy and easy to cook, But it’s mostly about avoiding meat.


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## rikk

Consume what you buy ... off topic, bigger picture consequences http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/food-waste-costs-canada-31b-a-year-report-says-1.2869708 ... I just casually mentioned to someone that most everything comes to town by truck ... if we weren't so wasteful (food, clothes, you name it) there'd be half as many ... ok, a bit of an exaggeration ... fuel burning trucks on the road ... her response, but what about the truck drivers? Don't get me wrong, I've nothing against trucks, my stepson got his C1 on a Friday in July, started working the following Monday, a flatbed for now, just saying ...


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## Plugging Along

^ Actually consume what you buy is a huge one. I admit as a bulk buyer I have over bought on things. That was part of the reason for this thread. I have learned more creative ways to reduce the wastage of food which leads to the frugality.

Some more tips that I do sonce you added....
Yogurt that is near or just past expiry, I freeze if int he individual containers, or often if it's Ina tub, I out on ice cube trays and freeze for smoothies
The leafy overs of a little vegetable, , pasta, meat that we didn't finish, get frozen in ziploc, they get added into my home made soups
Vegetable peelings (cleaned) get thrown in to another freezer bag, and used for vegetable stock. 

We have been trying to reduce our trash, which is hard with kids, but any food that has been left over and not reached their plate I try and figure out if I can do something with it.


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## peterk

Ag Driver said:


> I just bought a 10lb bag of carrots for $0.99.


How??? I've never seen a 10lb bag for under $5. I just bought a 5lb bag for $2.25 last week on steep discount and that's the lowest I've EVER seen carrots.
I do recall vegetables on ultra discount at St. Jacob's market in Waterloo, late in the afternoon as all the sellers are closing, but 10c/lb for any produce is exceptionally low even for them...


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## nobleea

Ag Driver said:


> Rice and Quinoa are my go-to staples for keeping costs down. A cold quinoa salad is a tasty and cheap meal or side dish!.


Rice for sure, but where can you get cheap quinoa? We love it, but it's expensive anywhere. Even costco is expensive.


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## Ponderling

Putting up apples at the moment. Bought three bushels of their left over after Apple Day in exchange for a donation to the local scout group. 

So far I have done runny apple sauce for spreading on the dehydrator, sliced apples into apple crisp, sliced apples canned in light syrup for making apple crisp mid winter, thick apple sauce into jars and can for baking and eating with pork, or just as is later on. 

This weekend I have plans for more thick apple sauce to make into a few varieties of apple butter batches - one with sliced cooked up lemons, and one with cinnamon and nutmeg and mace.
Plus more runny apple sauce into 1.5l jars to do more apple fruit leathers on the dehydrator later in the winter - so much nicer to smell them drying than just running the humidifier. 

Once the dehydrator trays are done with the current apple sauce batches, I will grind up some vitamin c tablets and dissolve them into water to make a dip , and place dipped apple slices on mesh trays in the dehydrator to make dried apple for cooking with oat meal next summer when we go camping, etc. The vita C dip keep the drying fruit from browning.

As we get closer to Christmas I will use up the last of these apples to make up apple pies to serve over the holidays and to freezer to eat over the winter.


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## rikk

For lunch ... 1/2 price pork chop, fry, add can of brown beans at $1.09/can, simmer. Out this evening for pool and beer ... what could possibly go wrong. Enjoy the weekend :cheerful:


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## Plugging Along

Ponderling said:


> Putting up apples at the moment. Bought three bushels of their left over after Apple Day in exchange for a donation to the local scout group.
> 
> So far I have done runny apple sauce for spreading on the dehydrator, sliced apples into apple crisp, sliced apples canned in light syrup for making apple crisp mid winter, thick apple sauce into jars and can for baking and eating with pork, or just as is later on.
> 
> This weekend I have plans for more thick apple sauce to make into a few varieties of apple butter batches - one with sliced cooked up lemons, and one with cinnamon and nutmeg and mace.
> Plus more runny apple sauce into 1.5l jars to do more apple fruit leathers on the dehydrator later in the winter - so much nicer to smell them drying than just running the humidifier.
> 
> Once the dehydrator trays are done with the current apple sauce batches, I will grind up some vitamin c tablets and dissolve them into water to make a dip , and place dipped apple slices on mesh trays in the dehydrator to make dried apple for cooking with oat meal next summer when we go camping, etc. The vita C dip keep the drying fruit from browning.
> 
> As we get closer to Christmas I will use up the last of these apples to make up apple pies to serve over the holidays and to freezer to eat over the winter.


Love the idea of the food dehydrator. I have one that o haven used in ages. Just for clarification, are you dehydrating apple sauce in to leather, or is it Apple slices.


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## Itchy54

I am trying very hard to eat only ethically raised, grass fed/free range animals. You all know this can get expensive but as I approach 60 I feel it's worth it. What I have found is that we just eat less meat and far more veggies (i am gluten and grain free as well due to allergies). I am in love with the organic black bean noodles from costco....very high protein and fibre rich, low in carbs with a great noodle texture. 
I do try to save money on other things and love the walmart clearance shelf. Every bag is a dollar and today I got three pounds of Roma tomatoes for $1 and two bags of onions...one red, one yellow and white and both bags at 3 pounds. I have yet to understand why they are on the clearance shelf as there is nothing wrong with them. This shelf helps me with meal planning.
I like to use organic greens, a great deal at costco, for salads every second night. Huge salads with greens, broccoli, pumpkin seeds, tomatoes, onions....whatever else I have on hand, along with some protein.
Will make a stew on Sunday and serve with cauliflower rice, leftovers the next night as it's a late night for me. All meals are planned on flyer day and I shop accordingly but will make changes if I see something in store that is a great deal.
Buy organic when I can but am not obsessed. Try to stick with the top ten offenders. I have a pantry full of stuff for those days that I don't want to plan....
Hubby converted to my diet (gave up gluten, almost, and grains) and lost his 30 pound belly. He looks amazing and recent health analysis had his heart health age at 42 (he is 58), perfect blood pressure and cholesterol. He was thrilled to hear he had the best numbers of the day!
Good food is worth the money, in my opinion anyways....


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## 1980z28

I purchase some property for retirement

I would love to and cant wait to grow all my own food


If member are close free vegetables

I will donate to food bank for what is not needed as I used the food bank when I got to ontario as a young man


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## betsu63

The app maybe Flipp. I use this to get a lot of things on sale by price matching. If you live in an area without a lot of stores change your location to a big centre so you have more stores to price match from. I.e. Kraft peanut butter 2.88 at Food Basics


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## Cdnwife

lost in space said:


> There is a price checker app which my niece uses all the time, best part is many stores accept the app so you don't even need to bring the ad with you unfortunately I can't find the email where she mentioned it.


App that I have been using is called Flipp. I have never had an issue price matching even w meat. They usually take the flyer to re price but the just wrote the details.


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## humble_pie

*can't get cheaper than free*

.
can't get healthier than wild greens either

it's so mild here that the leaves haven't fallen yet. Wild plants in backyards & country lanes are still fresh & green.

this recipe for wild pesto is Plugging style:

- wash if necessary & pick over about 4 cups of wild greens. Discard stems. Nettle leaves, dandelion leaves, wild garlic-mustard leaves (the mild weather should have started tender young plants from seed already), chives. Add wild violet, mallow, motherwort, mint, strawberry & raspberry leaves. Young blackberry leaves if you can find any still growing. A few yarrow leaves but careful, they are bitter.

- put some Dijon mustard in the food processor. The _right_ amount of mustard. Enough but not too much. 

- squash 6 or 7 garlic cloves with side of knife blade. Squashing gets the peels off. Chop em & add to processor.

- chop walnuts or brazil nuts fairly fine & add to food processor. You can use pine nuts but i've given up on these due to their cost. Chop more nuts than you'd think, then chop some more. 

- run the processor while slowly dripping in olive oil. Add sea salt & freshly ground pepper.

- optional: add honey. Not too much, maybe a teaspoon.

- once the pesto base is set up. add the wild greens a big handful at a time, alternating with more streaming olive oil. At some point add fresh lemon or lime juice, if you like.


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## Plugging Along

That sounds amazing for a pesto. I do have to admit, I am not very good In nature or foraging so could not recognize any of the plants you described. I am very much a city gal, but love the idea. I wish you could send me some. Yum.


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## humble_pie

dandelions, they grow everywhere. Even more nutritious than spinach, kale or chard.

the only catch is that you have to find them in a pure environment. No polluted city lawns, industrial settings, railway yards or highway borders.

these are 2nd year dandelion leaves. They are somewhat more bitter than leaves from first year growths. These latter are less toothed, leaf borders are more rounded, colour is usually a brighter/paler green.

gastronomie sauvage chef & caterer Nancy puts up pickled dandelion buds each spring. I've never tasted but i bet they are a delicious accompaniment to meat & fish dishes. A bit like capers.

.









.


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## none

humble_pie said:


> They are somewhat more bitter than leaves from first year growths. These latter are less toothed, leaf borders are more rounded, colour is usually a brighter/paler green.
> 
> gastronomie sauvage chef & caterer Nancy puts up pickled dandelion buds each spring. I've never tasted but i bet they are a delicious accompaniment to meat & fish dishes. A bit like capers.


Get a ripe avocado and massage it into the leaves and add some salt and lemon juice (plus any other vegetables you would like). The avocado really gets rid of a lot of the biter flavour (at least with kale it does).


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## none

Here's a pro-tip: get a buddy with a boat! My freezer is stuffed with fresh frozen halibut, coho and chinook. It's pretty great.


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## Ponderling

Plugging Along said:


> Love the idea of the food dehydrator. I have one that o haven used in ages. Just for clarification, are you dehydrating apple sauce in to leather, or is it Apple slices.


I actually do both 

The apple slices I do don't go totally dry without a parboil dip to break down the cell walls, but come pretty close, and stay flexible. I just freeze them unit needed. 10 apples worth of slices into one of the bit taller than a sandwich bag heavy duty zip locks. I tend to use them with raisins to spice up oatmeal when wilderness camping; oatmeal is a great compact breakfast, but just on its own for days on end gets kind of boring.

The bit runnier than normal apple sauce onto tray liners makes fruit leather. Apple on its own is nice, and again, once off the trays I store them in the freezer. Get them off the tray liners while still warm; once cooler they will crack coming off the tray liners. 

Over the winter the runny apple sauce instead of drying to fruit leather all alone sometimes gets mixed up with bananas that are past their eat fresh state. Bananas on their way out get tossed in our freezer, and pulled later. The freeze/thaw removes the need to blenderize them - just stir into the apple sauce once thawed to mix well and pour onto the tray. Keep the apple sauce to be more than 60% or the mixed leather will easily flake.


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## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> dandelions, they grow everywhere. Even more nutritious than spinach, kale or chard.
> 
> the only catch is that you have to find them in a pure environment. No polluted city lawns, industrial settings, railway yards or highway borders.
> 
> these are 2nd year dandelion leaves. They are somewhat more bitter than leaves from first year growths. These latter are less toothed, leaf borders are more rounded, colour is usually a brighter/paler green.
> 
> gastronomie sauvage chef & caterer Nancy puts up pickled dandelion buds each spring. I've never tasted but i bet they are a delicious accompaniment to meat & fish dishes. A bit like capers.
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> .


This is not very frugal sounding, but i have purchased organic dandelions when I was in the states to try. I am worried about pesticides. Do you think it would be safe to eat the ones that grow on my harder, I don't spray on there. I will have to research this more. I like the idea though. I also know I can recognize a dandelion.


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## Plugging Along

none said:


> Get a ripe avocado and massage it into the leaves and add some salt and lemon juice (plus any other vegetables you would like). The avocado really gets rid of a lot of the biter flavour (at least with kale it does).


Nice tip



none said:


> Here's a pro-tip: get a buddy with a boat! My freezer is stuffed with fresh frozen halibut, coho and chinook. It's pretty great.


Doesn't help in the pairires halibut is almost $18 a lb. I love it too



Ponderling said:


> I actually do both
> 
> The apple slices I do don't go totally dry without a parboil dip to break down the cell walls, but come pretty close, and stay flexible. I just freeze them unit needed. 10 apples worth of slices into one of the bit taller than a sandwich bag heavy duty zip locks. I tend to use them with raisins to spice up oatmeal when wilderness camping; oatmeal is a great compact breakfast, but just on its own for days on end gets kind of boring.
> 
> The bit runnier than normal apple sauce onto tray liners makes fruit leather. Apple on its own is nice, and again, once off the trays I store them in the freezer. Get them off the tray liners while still warm; once cooler they will crack coming off the tray liners.
> 
> Over the winter the runny apple sauce instead of drying to fruit leather all alone sometimes gets mixed up with bananas that are past their eat fresh state. Bananas on their way out get tossed in our freezer, and pulled later. The freeze/thaw removes the need to blenderize them - just stir into the apple sauce once thawed to mix well and pour onto the tray. Keep the apple sauce to be more than 60% or the mixed leather will easily flake.


I will have to give this one a try soon. I will come back and post.


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## humble_pie

i once went fishing in northern alberta. September. The whitefish & the northern pike were throwing themselves onto the baits. We couldn't fish more than 20 minutes, we'd already caught as much as we could possibly handle.


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## birdman

none said:


> Here's a pro-tip: get a buddy with a boat! My freezer is stuffed with fresh frozen halibut, coho and chinook. It's pretty great.


Not so sure about that. My buddy has a boat and we make 2 - one week trips to the west coast of Van. Island each year and do well fishing. However, expenses are huge and as we live in the Okanagan they include the ferry for boat and truck (612.00 return), truck fuel (300.), boat fuel (400.), accommodation or camping (560.), moorage (140), etc. Anyways, for 3 of us it costs about 800. each per trip or 1600.00 each for 2 trips. Probably works out to $10. lb for the fish but the vacation is free! Less if you manage to get a few good size hali. Good times.


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## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> i once went fishing in northern alberta. September. The whitefish & the northern pike were throwing themselves onto the baits. We couldn't fish more than 20 minutes, we'd already caught as much as we could possibly handle.


My dad used to go all the time, and bring back sturgeon and lots of other fish. Unfortunately on one of his trip is was in a life threatening accident where he was air lifted out of a rural area. That was the last fishing trip ever taken. we plan to start with our kids again, but haven gotta back into it.


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## humble_pie

i take it your harder is your backyard? not spraying pesticides or fungicides in backyard is a good starting point but one also has to think of what kind of soil one has.

what was on the land before your house was built? any previous structure or usage that could have polluted the soil? are you close to a big highway or throughway? there would have been particle settlement in the soil, particularly lead, from years of gasoline emissons.

what about building your house, would the construction company have buried leftover toxic materials a couple of feet down (or less), then covered with soil?

what kind of soil itself was installed on top?

some people deal with questionable soil by building raised beds. I also buy flats of young dandelion plants at the big farmers' market in april, then grow them on in large tub planters filled with compost. 

a place you could look would be the farm where you buy your organic honey (if this is a farm.) One can just about guarantee that they have dandelions in some field or other. The farmers will be so happy to have you pick their dandelions.

as you know, U-pick apple orchards are not a good place to look, unless the farm is certified organic. Even then i wouldn't gather directly underneath the trees, as there are all kinds of oil-based drenches & other applications they can use without affecting their organic certification.

all in all, i think growing one's own is a good bet. One can harvest leaves from the plants all summer long, right through september.


EDIT: i like bitter tastes - after all, what is a greek meal without its little plate of fresh horta in olive oil - so 2nd year leaves & leaves from post-flowering dandelion plants are welcome in my kitchen. One just has to chop them fairly fine & use more as a garnish, less as an actual dandelion leaf salad.


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## none

frase said:


> Not so sure about that. My buddy has a boat and we make 2 - one week trips to the west coast of Van. Island each year and do well fishing. However, expenses are huge and as we live in the Okanagan they include the ferry for boat and truck (612.00 return), truck fuel (300.), boat fuel (400.), accommodation or camping (560.), moorage (140), etc. Anyways, for 3 of us it costs about 800. each per trip or 1600.00 each for 2 trips. Probably works out to $10. lb for the fish but the vacation is free! Less if you manage to get a few good size hali. Good times.


I'm extremely fortunate. My two buddies only ask that I pay for gas (and even that is hard to give them sometimes!). Once I went out and came home with 2 20 pound chinook all for the bargain price of around $50. See that is about $400 in top quality meat - it's a serious money saver! It's good to have friends with boats!

Although we did go halibut fishing the other day and we got skunked. Oh well, he dug in his freezer and gave me half a coho and a good slab of halibut anyway. I need to buy a gift for that guy.


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## none

Plugging Along said:


> Nice tip
> 
> .


BVased on this:
http://www.food.com/recipe/kale-salad-with-avocado-for-two-400088


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## humble_pie

frase said:


> Anyways, for 3 of us it costs about 800. each per trip or 1600.00 each for 2 trips. Probably works out to $10. lb for the fish but the vacation is free! Less if you manage to get a few good size hali. Good times.



$10/lb for the fish is probably cheaper than market, plus the vacation is free, it all sounds heavenly.

everyone keeps saying how there's something profound about the experience of growing your own vegetables, fishing your own fish, making your own jam from wild blueberries or crab apples picked from the tree in the backyard.

just the sheer hard work involved makes one appreciate the beauty & the health of the earth i think.


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## AirPro

peterk said:


> How??? I've never seen a 10lb bag for under $5. I just bought a 5lb bag for $2.25 last week on steep discount and that's the lowest I've EVER seen carrots.
> I do recall vegetables on ultra discount at St. Jacob's market in Waterloo, late in the afternoon as all the sellers are closing, but 10c/lb for any produce is exceptionally low even for them...


You're clearly shopping in the wrong places. Freshco had 10lb local carrots, potatoes, onions or beets for $1.44 at the beginning of this month. Soups, stews, freeze, pickle, cold store - whatever works.

bread - we make all our own, fresh, for a fraction of shop bought. wtf do they put in the store bought stuff that you can leave it lying around for a couple of weeks and it doesn't go moldy?
meat - we can't go without it but a little can go a surprisingly long way in stews, sauces, curries etc Try cranking up on the other ingredients.
yogurt - we go through a lot, again all made at home.


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## Just a Guy

Nothing like raising some of your own food...know a guy who does his own chickens, ducks, and bees...the eggs taste and feel a whole lot different than store bought. Then again, the cost of feed probably makes them more expensive. Of course, in the summer, each of his chickens lays 1egg/day (and he has a lot of chickens) so he almost has to give them away to keep up...in the winter, they lay less so he's not as generous.


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## brad

There's an excellent free cookbook by Leanne Brown called "Good and Cheap," which shows you how to eat well for $4 per person per day. For one person that works out to about $120/month; for a family of four it works out to a little under $500/month.

See http://www.leannebrown.com

I was skeptical until I browsed through the recipes: they're all good, easy, and delicious.


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## none

Just a Guy said:


> Nothing like raising some of your own food...know a guy who does his own chickens, ducks, and bees...the eggs taste and feel a whole lot different than store bought. .


Love me a bee sandwich!


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## Sherlock

Thanks Brad there are some interesting recipes in that pdf.


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## Plugging Along

Thanks brad for the recipes. They are very nicely put together. Nice find


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## Plugging Along

I had to make a post as I am sitting here waiting for my last pumpkin to roast. Yep, I did again, I roasted my four Halloween jack o lanterns. As son as the lights were out, they started too get chopped up. 

I have only managed to purée the first two, and already have just under 50 cups of pumpkin purée. I think I am going to end up with close to 100 cups of puréed pumpkin by tomorrow. Maybe less, as I have found that I am not taking the skin off quite as closely to get more yield.

Once cooled, I have so far planned...

Freezing 3 cup portion in ziploc bags. I already called my sister and she will take a few off my hands.
- pumpkin soup for lunch tomorrow
- homemade pumpkin spice lattes (that only takes a tbs a serving though), so I will sponsor a pumpkin spice latte day at work next week.
Maybe some pies, and cheesecakes

Will post more later, I as I am elbow deep on pumpkin


----------



## Plugging Along

All pumpkin processed... 

I ended up with a little less than first planned. In the spirit of Harry Potter, we decided to 'juice' some of the purée. We have about 2 litres that we are experimenting with. Plain, it was a little bitter, so we have added some pumpkin spice and agave. Still playing around with that, but I am a little done with pumpkin for the moment.

I made pumpkin spice lattes for breakfast, yum. That used abut 2 tbs, so lots to so
Donated some to family and friends so 30 cups gone, leaving 40 cups the freezer 
Have a pumpkin coconut milk curry soup cooking for lunch.

All this for $10


----------



## Ponderling

In the past I have made up pumkin butter post Halloween. You do by adding in brown sugar and spices, and end up with a pie filling that needs to be pressure canned, as I recall. 

Nice to be able to bake a pumpkin pie by prepping the crust and pouring a jar of this stuff into it and then baking it up mid winter for a treat after Sunday dinner, etc.


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## none

Plugging Along said:


> I made pumpkin spice lattes for breakfast, yum. That used abut 2 tbs, so lots to so
> 0


That's disgusting.


----------



## Plugging Along

Ponderling said:


> In the past I have made up pumkin butter post Halloween. You do by adding in brown sugar and spices, and end up with a pie filling that needs to be pressure canned, as I recall.
> 
> Nice to be able to bake a pumpkin pie by prepping the crust and pouring a jar of this stuff into it and then baking it up mid winter for a treat after Sunday dinner, etc.



I haven't figured out pressure canning yet. That's on my list of things to learn to do. It would save a lot on the freezer space I need. I may whip a small batch of pumpkin butter tonight.




none said:


> That's disgusting.


Not if you like pumpkin spice lattes. I did have to purée it again and put it through a strainer, but it tastes quite good, not exactly like Starbucks, but close enough.


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## none

Plugging Along said:


> Not if you like pumpkin spice lattes. I did have to purée it again and put it through a strainer, but it tastes quite good, not exactly like Starbucks, but close enough.


i don't. Adding pumpkin to coffee or beer for that matter is the definition of yuck.


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## andrewf

Flavoured coffee is indeed gross. Even sugar is an affront to coffee.


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## Plugging Along

Well, it's at least not the pumpkin. I general like flavoured coffee, so this was a good one, I could make a few thousand of them if I wanted. 

I am making another batch of pumpkin spice tonight.


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## lost in space

Plugging Along said:


> I had to make a post as I am sitting here waiting for my last pumpkin to roast. Yep, I did again, I roasted my four Halloween jack o lanterns. As son as the lights were out, they started too get chopped up.
> 
> I have only managed to purée the first two, and already have just under 50 cups of pumpkin purée. I think I am going to end up with close to 100 cups of puréed pumpkin by tomorrow. Maybe less, as I have found that I am not taking the skin off quite as closely to get more yield.
> 
> Once cooled, I have so far planned...
> 
> Freezing 3 cup portion in ziploc bags. I already called my sister and she will take a few off my hands.
> - pumpkin soup for lunch tomorrow
> - homemade pumpkin spice lattes (that only takes a tbs a serving though), so I will sponsor a pumpkin spice latte day at work next week.
> Maybe some pies, and cheesecakes
> 
> Will post more later, I as I am elbow deep on pumpkin


I love pumpkin, only been in the last few years they've made an appearance over here. Pumpkin pie and soup. Ummm but am I correct that you chop them up bake them in the oven than puree them in the food processor?


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## Plugging Along

lost in space said:


> I love pumpkin, only been in the last few years they've made an appearance over here. Pumpkin pie and soup. Ummm but am I correct that you chop them up bake them in the oven than puree them in the food processor?


To cook the pumpkin, you scoop out all the guts (I clean and roast the seeds), I chop it in larger chunks, just so it will fit in the oven. No need to go small. Roast and then scoop out with a spoon. I use my immersion blender to purée, you can use a masher too, or food processor. One large pumpkin gave me about 20 cups of pumpkin.


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## Spudd

I guess I wasted my time peeling it before putting it in the oven. Oh well! 

They say that Jack O'Lantern pumpkins aren't as tasty as the little ones, but I figured it wouldn't cost anything to try. Except the oven time, I suppose.


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## humble_pie

Spudd said:


> They say that Jack O'Lantern pumpkins aren't as tasty as the little ones, but I figured it wouldn't cost anything to try. Except the oven time, I suppose.



last year i cooked 2 or 3 big hallowe'en type pumpkins, i hadn't carved 2 but had left them outside.

the cooking turned into an ordeal that went on for a couple days. Oven working overtime, huge cauldrons of pumpkin pieces - i peeled mine - simmering on the stove, it felt like it was going on night & day.

in the end i got a mild-tasting pale amber puree, nothing to write home about. I'd been expecting something as delicious as butternut squash but i was disappointed. Did not bother to do any this year.

i appreciate Plugging's marathon, but if ever i do another big jack o'lantern again, it will be because i'm baking in the oven anyhow.


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## rikk

^ "Double, double toil and trouble; Fire burn, and cauldron bubble " ... was just thinking, a thread on frugality gone wrong could be just as useful to others as the plethora of frugality ideas currently available everywhere you look these days, you know, an it's better to learn from the mistakes of others kind of thing. If I think of something ... well, apart from trying pumpkin in my coffee ... sorry pumpkin huggers, but not to my taste either :listening_headphone


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## humble_pie

don't u think that food security is appropriate to a section on frugality though.

Spudd alludes to a factor that Plugging didn't mention & that is the cost of the cooking fuel. It's not nothing. I thought vaguely of this when the big hallowe'en pumpkins cooked down into something relatively bland & tasteless, nothing like the bright orange canned pumpkin puree that we make pies from.

it crossed my mind to wonder how much the cooking fuel that is consumed during a 10-hour jack o lantern marathon session does cost. Is why i thought i'd only ever do big pumpkins again if i have the oven going anyhow.


----------



## Plugging Along

Spudd said:


> I guess I wasted my time peeling it before putting it in the oven. Oh well!
> 
> They say that Jack O'Lantern pumpkins aren't as tasty as the little ones, but I figured it wouldn't cost anything to try. Except the oven time, I suppose.


That's why I bake them, so I don't have to peel them. I just cut them enough to fit in my oven.



humble_pie said:


> last year i cooked 2 or 3 big hallowe'en type pumpkins, i hadn't carved 2 but had left them outside.
> 
> the cooking turned into an ordeal that went on for a couple days. Oven working overtime, huge cauldrons of pumpkin pieces - i peeled mine - simmering on the stove, it felt like it was going on night & day.
> 
> in the end i got a mild-tasting pale amber puree, nothing to write home about. I'd been expecting something as delicious as butternut squash but i was disappointed. Did not bother to do any this year.
> 
> i appreciate Plugging's marathon, but if ever i do another big jack o'lantern again, it will be because i'm baking in the oven anyhow.


I can definitely appreciate the work. I cooked four large pumpkins in about 3.5 hours, with the last pumpkin I just turned off the oven and let it cook over night. I wasn't trying to frugal for electricity, but I was just tired. The big pumpkins are definitely paler, and more mild on Flavour than the smaller sugar pumpkins. I found juicing it did help, again, that was was part of my experiment, and a way to reduce my freezer space. I use the purée for the sauce and soups where I want a milder flavour, for the pumpkin pie, I will boil down to reduce it and concentrate the flavours. Definitely not for everyone, I did it as I was buying the pumpkins anyways, and thought I could come up with a frugal way to use it. 



rikk said:


> ^ "Double, double toil and trouble; Fire burn, and cauldron bubble " ... was just thinking, a thread on frugality gone wrong could be just as useful to others as the plethora of frugality ideas currently available everywhere you look these days, you know, an it's better to learn from the mistakes of others kind of thing. If I think of something ... well, apart from trying pumpkin in my coffee ... sorry pumpkin huggers, but not to my taste either :listening_headphone


My lesson, is make sure the pumpkin is puréed well. Chunky coffee is gross.


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## james4beach

humble_pie said:


> i once went fishing in northern alberta. September. The whitefish & the northern pike were throwing themselves onto the baits. We couldn't fish more than 20 minutes, we'd already caught as much as we could possibly handle.


This is a delicious thread.

By the way everyone, here in the US pacific north-west, the seafood aisle is stocked with Canadian fish at very good prices.


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## james4beach

Another frugal idea. Chickpeas & rice. I just prepare some rice (which is always cheap) and throw in a few cans of chickpeas, heat them together and sautee with onions and add in some other seasonings, perhaps tomato or crushed tomato sauce.

Very nutritious and cost per lb is very low.


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## Plugging Along

I have been trying to reduce increase the number of vegetarian meals, and rice and beans has been becoming quite popular. To reduce sodium, i make my beans from dry, and it saves a lot. I have been cooking large bags, 1 or 2 kg at time, draining, and freezing them in 2 cups portions. I found the results taste better than canned, and healthier and cheaper too.


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## humble_pie

Plugging Along said:


> Definitely not for everyone, I did it as I was buying the pumpkins anyways, and thought I could come up with a frugal way to use it.



oh, i know the exercise. Every innovation cries out to be explored. A poet would say it's all part of the hymn in praise of the bounty of the earth.

however, when it comes to big hallowe'en pumpkins, when one considers the cost of cooking fuel plus the amount of labour involved, together with the bland, tasteless quality of the final product, my conclusion is that this project is No Go as a standalone.

i wouldn't mind baking pumpkin pieces alongside in the oven if i were already roasting a chicken or other small roast, though. I'm mentioning chicken not turkey sized, because one has to leave enough room in the oven to fit the big pumpkin pieces.

re pumpkin & squash seeds, these are nutritious & medicinal. Me i clean, slightly oil, salt, roast or dry in the sun. Recently i've read that some people include the strings, they pull these apart & dry them in fragments along with the seeds. Reportedly salted strings are delicious in their own right. IDK, this idea somehow doesn't appeal.

what does appeal would be accumulating a quantity of dried possibly roasted or toasted pumpkin seeds, then grinding these to make pumpkin seed flour. Some day i'll try.

medicinal properties? anti-bacterial, anti-fungal, anti-parasite. The fiber would benefit the cardiovascular system. No doubt some protein & minerals, most seeds are rich in these.


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## brad

Plugging Along said:


> I have been trying to reduce increase the number of vegetarian meals, and rice and beans has been becoming quite popular. To reduce sodium, i make my beans from dry, and it saves a lot. I have been cooking large bags, 1 or 2 kg at time, draining, and freezing them in 2 cups portions. I found the results taste better than canned, and healthier and cheaper too.


This is generally true, but more true for some beans than others. Mark Bittman of the NY Times did some pretty extensive experimentation and taste-testing with this over the course of several months, and concluded that for chick peas (garbanzos) the canned ones are just as good as those cooked from dry (as long as you rinse the canned beans well), although it's true that the canned beans are more expensive. For most other beans (pinto, black-eyed peas, etc.), he found that dried beans taste noticeably better than the canned ones; chickpeas were the only exception. If you consume a lot of chick peas, dried beans are the way to go, but otherwise canned are okay. In our case, my girlfriend cannot tolerate most beans (except lentils), even with Beano, so I usually used canned chickpeas if I'm cooking them. For other beans, I use dried.

Lentils are a special case: there is really no reason at all to buy canned lentils, as the dried ones don't take long to cook and don't need any pre-soaking.


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## humble_pie

^^
.
of all the beans, chickpeas are said to be lowest in protein. Lentils are another low-protein legume

these are the incomplete proteins, that have to be combined with a seed starch such as a wheat product to form whole proteins ...

not, actually, making this up. It's from nutrition & wild plants courses a decade ago.

PS brad do you have an expert opinion on protein content of quinoa? i mean truly expert, with academic research support ... what i find is that authorities are divided, with some impeccable authorities claiming that quinoa alone is a grain that supplies complete protein, while other equally impeccables say No, it's a grain so how can it?

me i tend to hang with the latter school


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## brad

humble_pie said:


> ^^
> 
> these are the incomplete proteins, that have to be combined with a seed starch such as a wheat product to form whole proteins ...


I remember reading very recently (a week or two ago) of a new study that called into question this whole notion that we need to complement beans with rice to ensure we get "complete" proteins, but I just tried to find it with no luck; the only article I found was this, not exactly a trustworthy scientific source: http://www.onegreenplanet.org/natural-health/busted-the-myth-about-incomplete-plant-based-protein/

I don't have any expert opinion on any of this, since I'm not an expert. I don't think of quinoa as a source of protein, I just eat it because I like it.


----------



## Hiitsme

Plugging Along said:


> I have been trying to reduce increase the number of vegetarian meals, and rice and beans has been becoming quite popular. To reduce sodium, i make my beans from dry, and it saves a lot. I have been cooking large bags, 1 or 2 kg at time, draining, and freezing them in 2 cups portions. I found the results taste better than canned, and healthier and cheaper too.


Do you use a pressure cooker for those 1-2kg batches? I'm not sure what the break even is, but it takes forever to cook chickpeas at normal boil vs. 15 minutes in a cooker.


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## Plugging Along

^. I cook my beans several ways depending on how organized and how much time I have.

I try to soak them over night most times. I just bring water to a boil, add beans, boil for 5 minutes, cover, and drain in the morning, then I 'cook' it. I find this takes out a lot of the enzymes that cause a gaseous effect, 

I will sometimes throw it in my slow cooker over night, or boil I on the stove, for a few hours, and I will use a pressure cooker too, I use the pressure cooker when I am in a rush or forgot to soak. However, I find the beans not quite as 'whole' compared to the other two methods.


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## Plugging Along

I thinking about beans, so I pressure cooked some black beam, and chick peas (separately) I forgot how much they grow from dry, I ended up with way too many, so in the freezer on ziploc bags they went. 

I made some roasted red pepper hummus, and froze that in small 1/2 cup portions with a drizzle of great olive oil on top to protect it. I also roasted some chickpeas too. I find an odd concept to bake them after I pressure cook them. The kids love them like nuts, but they are nut free. 

For the black beans, I ended up making a tex mex breakfast sandwiches. English muffins were on sale,s o I bought four bags, scrambled eggs, chopped up onions, peppers, shredded cheese, black beans and corn. I put a big spoon of sales on each half of the muffin, and then added the mix, more cheese and baked. I have 40 breakfasts ready in under 2 minutes. The cost was about $15, and much healthier than an egg mc muffin.


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## Plugging Along

It's been a while since I have updated. My perennial herbs are out of control. I have given away 5 1 gallon bags of fresh herbs, plus used close to that myself.

I was planning on freezing some,and dehydrating some.

Need ideas for tarragon, oregano, and chives.


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## carverman

none said:


> This: pasta-puttanesca


Fancy name for just some spaghetti in tomato paste sauce...and the "ladies of the night" would make this before seeing their next client?

Now for me..nothing beats plain old KD..but even that is no longer "frugal" considering the prices they sell that for these days.

Years ago, somebody gave me a recipe for "Stone soup...and I lost it..but that HAD to be the ultimate in frugality when it comes to cooking.

Fill a point with water, add 3 or 4 nice potato size smooth stones, preferably washed in a riverbed.
Bring to a boil...
salt and pepper to taste..and maybe add some carrots from somebodies garden..
and perhaps some beet greens and perhaps two or three pebble size potatoes..if you can find them in some elses garden.



> Once the water is in place, start asking your kids for ingredients – one by one – just like in the book:
> • “Does anyone have … [name an ingredient]
> • “Mmm, what would really make this soup even more magical would be … [name an ingredient]
> • The stone has asked for … [name an ingredient]


http://www.food.com/recipe/ol-fashioned-stone-soup-213767


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## humble_pie

Plugging Along said:


> My perennial herbs are out of control. I have given away 5 1 gallon bags of fresh herbs, plus used close to that myself ... Need ideas for tarragon, oregano, and chives.



one can never have enough dried tarragon or dried oregano or dried chives in the wintertime.

those one gallon bags will dry down into a few tablespoons. Maybe half a cup to one cup max. In chives, that's not much. A family could easily go through a cup of dried chives in a month. Soups, stews, omelets, crepes, vegetable dishes, other egg dishes.

i dry herbs fluffy (don't pack down) in brown paper lunch bags. Or in brown paper grocery bags if i have a lot.

i clip the bag shut with a paper label folded over the top. Clothespegs, spring clips, whatever works. I turn the bags flat sideways & shake them gently in order to spread out the herbs as much as possible. Dry in an airy place. Luckily i have radiators with fins located near open windows, so drying a paper bag on top of the fins while fresh june air circulates is optimal.

i leave herbs dried in bags for months. Usually until thanksgiving or christmas. Throughout, the critical objective is to prevent mould from setting in.

.


----------



## Rusty O'Toole

On the question of protein in vegetarian diets. Dr Hindehede of Denmark did some experiments more than 100 years ago that proved the human need for protein was so low it could easily be met by a vegetarian diet.

He was in charge of food planning and rationing for Denmark during WW1. During this period of time the diet was mainly potatoes, black bread, barley porridge, and whatever vegetables and fruit they can grow in a northern country with limited amounts of meat, eggs and milk. The death rate fell to the lowest ever recorded in a European country. Infectious diseases like tuberculosis and measles fell slightly but lifestyle diseases like heart disease, diabetes, hardening of the arteries fell by about 1/3 in a year.

In most cases if you eat some meat, milk, fish, or eggs once a week or more you should be fine. A pure vegan diet may be trickier.


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## brad

Rusty O'Toole said:


> In most cases if you eat some meat, milk, fish, or eggs once a week or more you should be fine. A pure vegan diet may be trickier.


There's actually a pretty big vegan movement among bodybuilders, with entire websites dedicated to how you can do bodybuilding and other extreme sports (triathlon, Iron Man, etc.) on a vegan diet. See http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/mahler53.htm for example.


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## carverman

Well I'm very disappointed that nobody commented on my Stone Soup receipie..what is wrong with you people when it comes to frugality?:biggrin:

I guess you are all used to shopping in those big grocery stores and don't want to try something unique for a change.
Now I would like to offer you an alternative to stone soup..pine cone soup..it is the very essence of a vegan diet and very good for youir health.


Pine needles contain 5 times the vitamin C found in lemons.



> Think of it as a herbal tea. A handful of pine needles, or 1/4 cup fresh chopped needles steeped in boiling water for 10 to 15 minutes provide 100% of the U.S.R.D.A. of vitamin C. Pine soup (or tea) tastes like the pine forest smells, or add a squeeze of lemon and a little honey to liven it up a bit.
> 
> In the southwestern deserts of the U.S. grows the Pinion Pine. (California, Nevada, Arizona, Utah, and New Mexico.) Every few years when comes an abundant rainfall, the trees produce a bumper crop of cones bearing the delicately flavored seeds. They can best be foraged by raiding the messy looking nests of wood rats, who hoard many of the seeds.
> 
> *Certain Indian tribes used to peel young shoots of pine and use them as a green vegetable.* The colonists used to make a candy out of these same shoots by boiling them in a heavy sugar syrup until they were nearly transparent and
> thoroughly crystallized. Ojibwa Indians made use of the young staminate catkins (little pine cone like growths, covered in soft brown scales and growing at the terminal end of the needle clusters) by cooking them with a chunk of meat. Don't throw on the steak yet. *Some varieties of pine have a heavy turpentine flavor. *


----------



## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> one can never have enough dried tarragon or dried oregano or dried chives in the wintertime.
> 
> those one gallon bags will dry down into a few tablespoons. Maybe half a cup to one cup max. In chives, that's not much. A family could easily go through a cup of dried chives in a month. Soups, stews, omelets, crepes, vegetable dishes, other egg dishes.
> 
> i dry herbs fluffy (don't pack down) in brown paper lunch bags. Or in brown paper grocery bags if i have a lot.
> 
> i clip the bag shut with a paper label folded over the top. Clothespegs, spring clips, whatever works. I turn the bags flat sideways & shake them gently in order to spread out the herbs as much as possible. Dry in an airy place. Luckily i have radiators with fins located near open windows, so drying a paper bag on top of the fins while fresh june air circulates is optimal.
> 
> i leave herbs dried in bags for months. Usually until thanksgiving or christmas. Throughout, the critical objective is to prevent mould from setting in.
> 
> .


I have read that tarragon doesn't taste as good dried, but I may do it anyways. 

Could you explain how you make sure you don't get mold? Also, do you take the leaves off the stems, or leave it on. 



carverman said:


> Well I'm very disappointed that nobody commented on my Stone Soup receipie..what is wrong with you people when it comes to frugality?:biggrin:
> 
> I guess you are all used to shopping in those big grocery stores and don't want to try something unique for a change.
> Now I would like to offer you an alternative to stone soup..pine cone soup..it is the very essence of a vegan diet and very good for youir health.
> 
> 
> Pine needles contain 5 times the vitamin C found in lemons.
> 
> [/B]


Sorry carve, no comment on the stone soup. I have done it with my girl guides as a part of nutrition and working together. It wasn't that frugal.


----------



## humble_pie

.
let's not turn up our noses at stone soup. It may have a slight nutritional benefit. Some mineral molecules would presumably dissolve out of the stone during boiling/simmering. Limestones, for example, would give up trace amounts of calcium.

they say this is what has given corn-&-maize based first nation cultures across north, central & south america a complete nutritional diet for thousands of years. Among grains, corn is the one that is the most lacking in nutrients. Corn lacks niacin & several amino acids.

these deficiencies can produce pellagra & kwashkior diseases in corn-eating cultures. However, grinding corn for hours in limestone mortars wears off enough calcium to keep the bones & tissues of human beings healthy. The traces of lime - some mesoamerican peoples used ash, which is also alkaline - trigger processes that produce whole proteins & a complete range of the vitamin Bs, including niacin.

apparently the process of using stone to compensate for plant deficiencies is called nixtamalization. Archaeologists have found evidence that this process was used in guatemala as long ago as 1200 BC.

here's a how-it-works explanation:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixtamalization

.


----------



## humble_pie

ultimate frugal diet:


a bowl of stone soup
a flat bread made with flour from ground pine nuts
wash the meal down with a chilled glass of water with either a twist of lemon peel or a cardamom seed


----------



## Rusty O'Toole

I don't know about rock dust in the diet but have heard of using it as fertilizer. The idea is that soils become depleted of minerals after years of growing crops, and the way to put the minerals back is to add rock dust. In nature rock dust comes from the erosion of mountains and rocks, and when we exhaust the minerals in the soil we need to put them back.

Have read about experiments done in Germany with good results. If this turns out to be of value, we in Canada are sitting pretty thanks to the deposits of glacial till and silt, representing every type of rock and mineral ground to a fine powder by glaciers.


----------



## Rusty O'Toole

There is a story that Benjamin Franklin was approached by some rich men who wished to patronize his newspaper and printing business. This was a common practice at the time but of course, such patronage comes with strings attached.

He invited the men to dinner where he served them sawdust pudding. Then told them 'gentlemen, a man who can live on sawdust pudding and cold water needs nobody's patronage'.

I believe sawdust pudding was corn meal boiled in a bag, in other words, polenta. In colonial America it must have been about the cheapest and most common of foods.


----------



## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> .
> let's not turn up our noses at stone soup. It may have a slight nutritional benefit. Some mineral molecules would presumably dissolve out of the stone during boiling/simmering. Limestones, for example, would give up trace amounts of calcium.
> 
> they say this is what has given corn-&-maize based first nation cultures across north, central & south america a complete nutritional diet for thousands of years. Among grains, corn is the one that is the most lacking in nutrients. Corn lacks niacin & several amino acids.
> 
> these deficiencies can produce pellagra & kwashkior diseases in corn-eating cultures. However, grinding corn for hours in limestone mortars wears off enough calcium to keep the bones & tissues of human beings healthy. The traces of lime - some mesoamerican peoples used ash, which is also alkaline - trigger processes that produce whole proteins & a complete range of the vitamin Bs, including niacin.
> 
> apparently the process of using stone to compensate for plant deficiencies is called nixtamalization. Archaeologists have found evidence that this process was used in guatemala as long ago as 1200 BC.
> 
> here's a how-it-works explanation:
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixtamalization
> 
> .



Lol... No problem with stone soup. I was doing it as a part of working together and trying different foods. It was cute to have a whole bunch of 5 and 6 years make the soup after I read them the story. I think I used a boil clay thing as the stone because didn't want the kids to get sick with a rock. 

Most of the kids didn't like it because it had too many vegetables, but my daughter loved it. 



Rusty O'Toole said:


> I don't know about rock dust in the diet but have heard of using it as fertilizer. The idea is that soils become depleted of minerals after years of growing crops, and the way to put the minerals back is to add rock dust. In nature rock dust comes from the erosion of mountains and rocks, and when we exhaust the minerals in the soil we need to put them back.
> 
> Have read about experiments done in Germany with good results. If this turns out to be of value, we in Canada are sitting pretty thanks to the deposits of glacial till and silt, representing every type of rock and mineral ground to a fine powder by glaciers.


My gardener friend swears to adding rock dust every year. Her veggies always look great, bu that could be that she tends to them like her children.


----------



## humble_pie

Plugging Along said:


> Could you explain how you make sure you don't get mold? Also, do you take the leaves off the stems, or leave it on.



first, the stem issue. Plucking off each leaf & drying only the leaves, while discarding the stems, is a key part of mold prevention.

individual plant leaves picked at the node will promptly begin to curl up, as you know. It's this curling of each leaf which incorporates air, which in turn keeps the herbs light & fluffy. Always, it's air circulation that will prevent mold. I've never in my life had a mold problem. I've always turned out really great dried leaves, flowers & buds. Most of the time they even keep their original colours.

i only fill my paper bags about one-eighth to one sixth full, in order to leave lots of air space. I place the bags on their sides, shake them gently in order to space out the herbs inside. Once a day or so, i turn the bags over, again shaking them gently.

even the reason i close the bags with clothespegs or spring clips instead of staples is so i can open them again easily. Sometimes to gently stir the drying herbs with my hand, to make sure the leaves are as separate (ie non-compressed) as possible. Sometimes to add a fresh new sprig or two of the same plant material.

the discarded stems are always the least aromatic part of a plant. In addition, from a medicinal point of view, plant stems will always have the least medicinal value. Into the compost they should go (there are some gastronomie forestière cooks who love to cook young stems in the spring, but as it happens this doesn't appeal to me.)

if you look at very cheap dried commercial herbs sold in some health food stores, often you'll find they consist mostly of finely chopped stems. What a ripoff.


.


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## humble_pie

carverman is quite right about teas & tisanes made from pine, cedar or spruce needles. Reportedly this is how the mohawk whom jacques cartier discovered on hochelaga island treated the scurvy-stricken french sailors during their first winter on this continent. The mohawk cured the sailors with teas made from evergreen needles.

.


----------



## Plugging Along

Didn't know if I should put this update n my gardening thread or here.

I just harvested more herbs. I haven't dried them yet, but have been sharing as hostess gifts. I made the most delicious herb butter compound. I just mash up cut herbs with soften butter and then froze in cute little silicon ice cube models. It looks and tastes fantastic. I used it for a herb garlic bread and to sauté thinnings from my beets, kale and spinach. I also add some sad looking greens that were in ju fridge. I thinned out the plants, and instead of throwing them out, sautéed the with onion, garlic I, the herb butter, then added goat cheese, and sprinkled with Parmesan. It was delicious. The kids wanted more, but we have to leave the plants so they can grown into the real veggies.


----------



## topgun3

atrp2biz said:


> We find that the cheapest way to shop is without a shopping list. Save for the staples like milk, eggs and bread, we generally don't have a shopping list. The Walmart/Superstore flyer is our shopping list--we'll buy whatever is on sale. It's like the TV show Chopped. You get a pre-determined basket of goods and you figure out how to make the week work with those goods.


To me this sounds like a recipe for overspending. People tend to buy more than they need if they don't know what they want. My strategy is to look at flyers (No Frills, Walmart, Food Basics, FreshCo) and determine what I need, and what is a good buy. Some things I put in the freezer or pantry for later use (like rice or canned goods). My cooking decisions are based on what is on sale. We almost never buy finished goods (like TV dinners, cookies, and other snacks), since those are usually overpriced when compared to home cooked food.


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## mayallen

Slow cooking has a lot of benefits . You can get more nutritious meals and it is a huge time saver. I used to use slow cooker whenever I had to work or when I was to busy to spend my time in the kitchen. You don’t have to hover over the pot for hours and check on it all the time. Slow cookers uses lesser energy than an electric cooker.


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## Earl

Yes and another advantage of slow cookers is that you can use cheaper cuts of meat than you can in most other modes of preparation, and they still tend to turn out good.


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## darylshriver

Try this recipe - black beans with sauteed onions/other veggies, garlic, quinoa or rice, chili powder, sriracha, sour cream and cheese in tortilla wraps. So delicious, and most of the condiments once bought will last you a few months.


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## darylshriver

Also generally, cooking things from scratch saves the most money. Try a slow-cooker or going meatless for a bit - this really saved us cash when my wife worked part time. Sweet potatoes and black beans are a great, hearty addition to foods like chili - and adding nuts to veggie stir-fries are also a great way to stay full and save money.


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## heyjude

I have found that by learning how to cook, I can become creative with all sorts of ingredients on sale. I'm kneading my own dough, having fun and saving a ton of money. Best of all, I am avoiding mystery ingredients and eating very well.


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## Rusty O'Toole

May I direct you to my favorite Youtube channel Jas Townsend's 18th century cooking? He is a historical re-enactor specializing in the American Revolutionary War period in the northeastern US. Here he presents a traditional bread pudding called 'white pot'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0e6fOKQT7k


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## jwsclark19

Obviously the most expensive grocery item on a weekly basis is our meat. Costco sells pretty good beef, in my opinion. You can buy a huge beef loin for $150 or so (and I mean huge). You can cook it, and slice it up into sandwich size cuts, stewing strips, steak size pieces.....However you want to divide it up. Keep frozen any meat you won't it within a few days, and you will have enough meat to last for 2 months. Saves a tonne of money in the long run.

Obviously the best way to slash your grocery bill, is to cut out meat completely, and replace it with cheaper protein alternatives (peanuts etc.), but most of us simply refuse to eliminate meat from our diet. 

Also, take advantage of rewards. We got a PC Financial World Elite MasterCard, and we try to fill up at Superstore gas stations as much as possible. We get 9 C/Litre worth of PC points that we can spent at the Superstore. It's a no annual fee credit card, and we get about $30/month in PC points from it to put towards our groceries.


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## Plugging Along

heyjude said:


> I have found that by learning how to cook, I can become creative with all sorts of ingredients on sale. I'm kneading my own dough, having fun and saving a ton of money. Best of all, I am avoiding mystery ingredients and eating very well.


My little tip with making my own bread items is to make much larger batche. I will knead three or for loaves of bread. After the first rise, I will shape the loaves, and freeze them. When I want fresh bread, I will take it out the night before, leave it in the fridge covered with a damp towel. As soon as I wake up, I throw it in the oven to bake. It's great having fresh baked bread, without as much effort. I do the same with buns, and pizza dough.


----------



## Plugging Along

So in my other thread I mentioned my instant pot cooking. It’s an all in one appliance. I have been using it as a pressure cooker. Unlike my stove top one, it has not exploded,

It’s been saving me a lot time and fuel/electricity. Tonight, I made a pressure cooked pomegranate lamb, with potatoes, and green beans. I pressured cooked the potatoes, then roasted them in the oven with some garlic (I didn’t have roast them but I like them crispy). I had some pomegranates that weren’t very sweet and the kids wouldn’t eat. So instead of throwing it out, I puréed, and strained them, added a tad of honey, some soy sauce and beef broth. I seared the lamb with a herb rub, then added the marinade and pressure cooked that while the potatoes crisped up. While the lamb was resting, I used the instant pot and sautéed my green beans in the same pot. Dinner in about an hour.


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## humble_pie

^^

that does sound delicious & agreed, no way could this meal be prepared via conventional cooking in one hour.

i don't know about flavours of meats though. I always thought that meat fats have to undergo direct cooking in order to develop the delicious brown crackle that we like so much.


here's an instaPot kidnapping from Plugging's other thread.



peterk said:


> I bought a new 9L stock pot at Christmas ... I simmered a big beef bone stock for 60 hours over the holidays



one thing i am aware of when conventionally simmering chicken or turkey bones, beef shanks, etc is the cost of the fuel required for those many hours of cooking. Most frugal type recipes & cookbooks don't mention cost of gas or electricity, however i think 60 hours of conventional stovetop simmering in a stock pot might produce a broth with a true cost per litre somewhere in the neighbourhood of champagne.

a lot of these long/slow simmer recipes date back a century or more, when cauldrons could be left on the backs of cast-iron wood-burning stoves for days at a time, at no extra cost.


my custom for making stock is to simmer bones with mirepoix & garlic for a couple of hours, strain off most but not all of the broth, add more water plus roughly 1/4 cup of vinegar, then simmer again for another couple hours.

the vinegar helps to break down the bone molecules, so the resulting 2nd simmer stock will be higher in protein than the first. The 2nd simmer will usually jell, the first one is less likely to jell.

as for flavour, the first simmer is more flavourful than the 2nd, but the difference is slight. This year, from my Xmas roast bird skeleton, i ended up with about 4 litres of broth.

i have no idea how conventionally simmered broths would compare to an instaPot broth. There would be 2 instaPot approaches, i assume. One could pressure cook or one could slow cook.


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## james4beach

A family member recently prepared some turkey thighs for us. Maybe it's a post-holiday thing, but they were very cheap at Superstore.

Rub with herbs and spices, wrap in foil and roast in the oven. I'm planning on finding some turkey tomorrow and cooking this.


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## 319905

^ Mmm, turkey. Funny, I never cared for it that much but these days, both being home, we'll put thighs/herbs/spices, carrots, potatoes into the small roast pan that conveniently fits into the toaster oven and let the toaster oven cook us up a really nice lunch, lunch tending to be the main meal of our day these days. It's really great having the time to prepare simple meals as we go versus the working days of preparing containers of stuff on the weekend for a weeks supply of lunches. Mmmm, retired :joyous:

And while I'm here, today it's chili for lunch ... hamburger/diced tomatoes/kidney beans/onion/chili powder ... which cooks up in about than 20 minutes, with rice, and sure, there will be some put away for later ...


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## fatcat

love my instant pot ...


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## SW20 MR2

We just got an Instant Pot. Anyone have any good recipes to share? We are domestically-challenged so simple is good. LOL...


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## Mukhang pera

humble_pie said:


> one thing i am aware of when conventionally simmering chicken or turkey bones, beef shanks, etc is the cost of the fuel required for those many hours of cooking. Most frugal type recipes & cookbooks don't mention cost of gas or electricity, however i think 60 hours of conventional stovetop simmering in a stock pot might produce a broth with a true cost per litre somewhere in the neighbourhood of champagne.
> 
> a lot of these long/slow simmer recipes date back a century or more, when cauldrons could be left on the backs of cast-iron wood-burning stoves for days at a time, at no extra cost.



Some of us are still living in those olden times. Most of our cooking is done on a wood cookstove. Particularly in winter, when we have it going to help heat the house anyway. We have 2 Waterford Stanley stoves:









Hard to find a better cooking appliance. The only "cost" to operate is the exercise of gathering the firewood. Very frugal.


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## milhouse

We've only had our instant pot for just over a month and used it a handful of times. We haven't been too adventurous with it yet, only making stews, chili, and congee with it. I find it ok. It does speed up the simmering part with good results. I'm not sure if I love its saute functionality to brown meats and sweat veg versus doing in the dutch oven.


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## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> ^^
> 
> that does sound delicious & agreed, no way could this meal be prepared via conventional cooking in one hour.
> 
> i don't know about flavours of meats though. I always thought that meat fats have to undergo direct cooking in order to develop the delicious brown crackle that we like so much.
> 
> 
> here's an instaPot kidnapping from Plugging's other thread.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> one thing i am aware of when conventionally simmering chicken or turkey bones, beef shanks, etc is the cost of the fuel required for those many hours of cooking. Most frugal type recipes & cookbooks don't mention cost of gas or electricity, however i think 60 hours of conventional stovetop simmering in a stock pot might produce a broth with a true cost per litre somewhere in the neighbourhood of champagne.
> 
> a lot of these long/slow simmer recipes date back a century or more, when cauldrons could be left on the backs of cast-iron wood-burning stoves for days at a time, at no extra cost.
> 
> 
> my custom for making stock is to simmer bones with mirepoix & garlic for a couple of hours, strain off most but not all of the broth, add more water plus roughly 1/4 cup of vinegar, then simmer again for another couple hours.
> 
> the vinegar helps to break down the bone molecules, so the resulting 2nd simmer stock will be higher in protein than the first. The 2nd simmer will usually jell, the first one is less likely to jell.
> 
> as for flavour, the first simmer is more flavourful than the 2nd, but the difference is slight. This year, from my Xmas roast bird skeleton, i ended up with about 4 litres of broth.
> 
> i have no idea how conventionally simmered broths would compare to an instaPot broth. There would be 2 instaPot approaches, i assume. One could pressure cook or one could slow cook.



I agree about the lack of crackle and crust. I found my roasted lamb delicious and tender, but didn’t have the same crust even though I seared it first. I make a slow roasted crackling pork shoulder but it usuall6 takes up 7 hours, I am trying to figure out a way to perhaps get crackle first, pressure cook it, then roast it on high. I think it would still take a couple of hours, but that’s still 5 hours saved. I won’t do that for a few months though because this is the last weekend I am not busy until the end of feb (hence why I need to instant pot)

In terms of bone stock, I usually follow a similar method as you do, but I add the veingsr part way through, and boil 8t for much longer. I made a ‘roasted’ chicken a couple of weeks ago. I was so surprised to find that the liquid at the bottom gelled once cooled. I would have normally just dumped out the any au jus, but ended us using it t9 make a chicken noodle soup the next day with my left overs (that was my frugal cooking). I only cooked it for about 30 minutes for the whole chicken. I am currently saving up my bones again, and can’t wait to try a proper stock, Again I will report back when I can properly do this.


----------



## Plugging Along

Mukhang pera said:


> Some of us are still living in those olden times. Most of our cooking is done on a wood cookstove. Particularly in winter, when we have it going to help heat the house anyway. We have 2 Waterford Stanley stoves:
> 
> View attachment 17473
> 
> 
> Hard to find a better cooking appliance. The only "cost" to operate is the exercise of gathering the firewood. Very frugal.


. 
The cost of firewood if you didn’t have access would be a small fortune. I have to admit the wood stove is fun to cook on, but I did it with 14 young girls for girl guides, and we ended up moving into the electric kitchen. i did manage o make enough hot chocolate for the girls, and it did kept up warm while doing activities. 

Not the best idea for cooking for a larger group, but that could be because we didn’t totally know what we were doing. 

One of the girls said that she though she would starve havj g to get t(e wood (from the camp wood shed) and help8ng me build the fire. :biggrin-new: I think the old ways are good to keep.


----------



## Plugging Along

SW20 MR2 said:


> We just got an Instant Pot. Anyone have any good recipes to share? We are domestically-challenged so simple is good. LOL...


I have been using mine almost daily, soups, stew and chillis are my fast things, plus eggs as I mentioned. I made the best ad box tomato soup (sorry I don’t follow recipes). But so good and easy. Sautéed garlic and Nino, then added in whatever veggies I had going weird such as carrots, celery, peppers, I dumped in a big can of tomatoes (I didn have an6 fresh), pumpkin purée (see from my earlier parts of this thread), chicken stock, and herbs, pressure cooked for about 15 minutes, then purred with a hand blend and added some Greek yogurt ( or sour cream) served with cheddar. My family loved it.

I made a chilli using dryness beans, and a brick of frozen ground beef (it was my first test), and again, my family lov3d it, I just had to chop u0 the cooked beef and cook for another 10 minutes.

Whole roasted chicken, I stuffed the bird with some onions, and garlic, celery. Sautéed it, the lifted it 9n t(e little rack, and pressure cooked. 

Popcorn is great in it. Better than my stove top, or air popper. Coconut oil butter, heated on sautéed then the kernels, with salt, then finish wit( truffle salt/truffle oil. 

I don’t know why, but I prefer cleaning the instant pot over a regular pot.


----------



## Mukhang pera

Plugging Along said:


> .
> The cost of firewood if you didn’t have access would be a small fortune. I have to admit the wood stove is fun to cook on, but I did it with 14 young girls for girl guides, and we ended up moving into the electric kitchen. i did manage o make enough hot chocolate for the girls, and it did kept up warm while doing activities.
> 
> Not the best idea for cooking for a larger group, but that could be because we didn’t totally know what we were doing.
> 
> One of the girls said that she though she would starve havj g to get t(e wood (from the camp wood shed) and help8ng me build the fire. :biggrin-new: I think the old ways are good to keep.


For sure, paying for firewood would kill the deal. In winter, our cookstove burns from morning to night. I have never paid much attention, but our cookstove probably goes through 4 cords in a year (full cords, not face cords). 

I mentioned we have two wood cookstoves. One is in an outbuilding we use, in part, as a "summer kitchen". We can use it without imparting any heat to the house on warm summer days. Or we can simply resort to one of two propane stoves. We can also use the second wood stove when two are needed to cook for a large group. But that is seldom necessary. As you noted, getting to know what you are going counts for a lot. But they don't come with double ovens, so two can come in handy that way. Making effective and efficient use of a wood cookstove takes some practice. But once one gets the hang of it, and provided there's always a good supply of seasoned firewood to hand, they are a real joy to use. 

Each cookstove make has its own quirks and characteristics. I bought my first Waterford Stanley in 1983 and I have acquired 2 more since. There are other good ones out there, but I got used to the Waterford and did not want to learn another stove. 

One feature of most cookstoves is the large cooktop, every square inch of which is available for cooking. The portion directly over the firebox is always the hottest. It can bring a large pot to boil in no time. The rest of the cooktop provides a wide range of cooking temperatures, getting cooler as you move away from the firebox. So pots and pans can be slid around to be exposed to whatever temperature is required. Oven temperature can be regulated by the oven damper and, for quick temperature changes, by the simple expedient of opening the oven door, a little or a lot.


----------



## humble_pie

Mukhang pera said:


> Some of us are still living in those olden times. Most of our cooking is done on a wood cookstove. Particularly in winter, when we have it going to help heat the house anyway. We have 2 Waterford Stanley stoves:
> 
> View attachment 17473
> 
> 
> Hard to find a better cooking appliance. The only "cost" to operate is the exercise of gathering the firewood. Very frugal.




oh it's beautiful! i cooked on a wood stove in the okanagan valley that was slightly similar, one summer when i was a student at UBC. My cast-iron beauty was named The Pride of Vancouver, in big raised letters on the oven door.

i never got anywhere near this level, of course, but a really good cook will partner instinctively with her wood stove. She will understand its temperamental moods perfectly. She will know which kinds of woods produce what kinds of fires, where on its surface are the hot spots & the cold spots, when will the oven be the perfect temperature for this souffle or that baked fish.

(note to Plugging & other fans of instant engineered cookware) (with a wood stove, there's no temperature dial) (cook has to wait for the stove surface or the oven to either heat up enough or else cool down enough) (then she needs a fire that will stay stable enough for the cooking duration of the dish) (really it's a symphony of talents)


.


----------



## peterk

humble_pie said:


> one thing i am aware of when conventionally simmering chicken or turkey bones, beef shanks, etc is the cost of the fuel required for those many hours of cooking. Most frugal type recipes & cookbooks don't mention cost of gas or electricity, however i think 60 hours of conventional stovetop simmering in a stock pot might produce a broth with a true cost per litre somewhere in the neighbourhood of champagne.
> 
> a lot of these long/slow simmer recipes date back a century or more, when cauldrons could be left on the backs of cast-iron wood-burning stoves for days at a time, at no extra cost.
> 
> 
> my custom for making stock is to simmer bones with mirepoix & garlic for a couple of hours, strain off most but not all of the broth, add more water plus roughly 1/4 cup of vinegar, then simmer again for another couple hours.
> 
> the vinegar helps to break down the bone molecules, so the resulting 2nd simmer stock will be higher in protein than the first. The 2nd simmer will usually jell, the first one is less likely to jell.
> 
> as for flavour, the first simmer is more flavourful than the 2nd, but the difference is slight. This year, from my Xmas roast bird skeleton, i ended up with about 4 litres of broth.
> 
> i have no idea how conventionally simmered broths would compare to an instaPot broth. There would be 2 instaPot approaches, i assume. One could pressure cook or one could slow cook.


Good point! I'm not too worried about the hydro bill, though. But I don't really think it would cost so much? Just a wild guess here: The burner on full blast is ~3000 watts, I think the lowest simmer would probably be somewhere around 2% of that, maybe 60 watts. The burner flicks on for ~2 seconds every minute or so makes sense. I think you could simmer a soup on a 100 watt lightbulb below the pot and a burner is more efficient. So 60watts for 60hrs is 3.6kwh, about 30c of electricity. No?

Also it's only the beef broth that needs the 24hrs+ simmer. Chicken stock is good after 3hrs and completely done at 6hrs. Turkey about 5-10hrs max. The beef bones though after 60 hrs were still *rock hard*...hadn't softened even a tiny bit! Perhaps it needs hundreds of hours to really finish? But I got impatient and there was only so much Christmas holiday left.

I have heard about the vinegar trick before but completely forgot about it, thanks! It makes sense your second batch is where all the collagen comes out in the broth, where is hadn't released yet in the first with the meatier flavor. If you just make one stock for twice as long though I think you'd get the best of both?


I don't know about this pressure cooker stock... The whole point is to simmer, _not_ boil the stock. The gently whirling water coaxes the flavor and collagen out of the bones without agitation that will pulverize the bone and marrow particles and suspend them in the liquid. But then, Alton Brown from the Food Network advocates for pressure cooker broths, and he knows his stuff...so perhaps it is not a big deal. Could be the long simmer method is some snobby, ancient french cooking tradition that doesn't really make a difference. The house smells good though.


----------



## Mukhang pera

humble_pie said:


> oh it's beautiful! i cooked on a wood stove in the okanagan valley that was slightly similar, one summer when i was a student at UBC. My cast-iron beauty was named The Pride of Vancouver, in big raised letters on the oven door.
> 
> i never got anywhere near this level, of course, but a really good cook will partner instinctively with her wood stove. She will understand its temperamental moods perfectly. She will know which kinds of woods produce what kinds of fires, where on its surface are the hot spots & the cold spots, when will the oven be the perfect temperature for this souffle or that baked fish.
> 
> (note to Plugging & other fans of instant engineered cookware) (with a wood stove, there's no temperature dial) (cook has to wait for the stove surface or the oven to either heat up enough or else cool down enough) (then she needs a fire that will stay stable enough for the cooking duration of the dish) (really it's a symphony of talents)
> 
> .


hp, your comment about types of woods tells me you have some real experience with the craft of wood cookery. Indeed, what's in the firebox makes a big difference to how hot a fire will burn, how long it will last before needing stoking, etc. My wife (who has been at it fewer years, but who has developed more expertise than I) always keeps to hand a few different hardwoods (usually maple, alder and some arbutus) as as well as a few softwoods (usually fir, hemlock and cedar). She has distinct preferences for what she burns and when, included when she will mix them.

You also got it right about the stove/cook "partnership". My wife has partnered with our cookstoves. The stoves tolerate my presence, but I have not made partnership. I am primarily there to ensure an adequate supply of seasoned wood of the various types, to empty the ash drawers, clean the chimneys annually etc.


----------



## peterk

Plugging Along said:


> So in my other thread I mentioned my instant pot cooking.
> 
> I made a pressure cooked pomegranate lamb, with potatoes, and green beans. * I seared the lamb* with a herb rub, then added the marinade and pressure cooked that while the potatoes crisped up. While the lamb was resting,* I used the instant pot and sautéed my green beans in the same pot*. Dinner in about an hour.





humble_pie said:


> ^^
> 
> that does sound delicious
> 
> i don't know about flavours of meats though. I always thought that *meat fats have to undergo direct cooking* in order to develop the delicious brown crackle that we like so much.





Plugging Along said:


> I agree about the lack of crackle and crust. I found my roasted lamb delicious and tender, but didn’t have the same crust even though I seared it first. I make a slow roasted crackling pork shoulder but it usuall6 takes up 7 hours, I am trying to figure out a way to perhaps get crackle first, pressure cook it, then roast it on high. I think it would still take a couple of hours, but that’s still 5 hours saved. I won’t do that for a few months though because this is the last weekend I am not busy until the end of feb (hence why I need to instant pot)


Yes I think you've got it dialed in. Brown the meat first in a pan or hot oven and then pressure cook. Could see it being great for stews or a beef/lamb pot roast.

Does the instant pot act as a hot pan too? Did you brown the meat in the instant pot? You said you sauteed the beans in it?


----------



## peterk

Mukhang pera said:


> hp, your comment about types of woods tells me you have some real experience with the craft of wood cookery. Indeed, what's in the firebox makes a big difference to how hot a fire will burn, how long it will last before needing stoking, etc. My wife (who has been at it fewer years, but who has developed more expertise than I) always keeps to hand a few different hardwoods (usually maple, alder and some arbutus) as as well as a few softwoods (usually fir, hemlock and cedar). She has distinct preferences for what she burns and when, included when she will mix them.
> 
> You also got it right about the stove/cook "partnership". My wife has partnered with our cookstoves. The stoves tolerate my presence, but I have not made partnership. I am primarily there to ensure an adequate supply of seasoned wood of the various types, to empty the ash drawers, clean the chimneys annually etc.


That's a great looking stove Muk. I want one, along with the prime woodlot...
Usually when in the woods I prefer an unharnessed, direct heat, though. :biggrin:


----------



## humble_pie

peterk said:


> Good point! I'm not too worried about the hydro bill, though. But I don't really think it would cost so much? Just a wild guess here: The burner on full blast is ~3000 watts, I think the lowest simmer would probably be somewhere around 2% of that, maybe 60 watts. The burner flicks on for ~2 seconds every minute or so makes sense. I think you could simmer a soup on a 100 watt lightbulb below the pot and a burner is more efficient. So 60watts for 60hrs is 3.6kwh, about 30c of electricity. No?
> 
> Also it's only the beef broth that needs the 24hrs+ simmer. Chicken stock is good after 3hrs and completely done at 6hrs. Turkey about 5-10hrs max. The beef bones though after 60 hrs were still *rock hard*...hadn't softened even a tiny bit! Perhaps it needs hundreds of hours to really finish? But I got impatient and there was only so much Christmas holiday left.
> 
> I have heard about the vinegar trick before but completely forgot about it, thanks! It makes sense your second batch is where all the collagen comes out in the broth, where is hadn't released yet in the first with the meatier flavor. If you just make one stock for twice as long though I think you'd get the best of both?
> 
> 
> I don't know about this pressure cooker stock... The whole point is to simmer, _not_ boil the stock. The gently whirling water coaxes the flavor and collagen out of the bones without agitation that will pulverize the bone and marrow particles and suspend them in the liquid. But then, Alton Brown from the Food Network advocates for pressure cooker broths, and he knows his stuff...so perhaps it is not a big deal. Could be the long simmer method is some snobby, ancient french cooking tradition that doesn't really make a difference. The house smells good though.




wow! you are getting really good at this. Male cooks seem to be somewhat in the minority but the ones who do cook - creatively & spontaneously like the above - often turn out to be geniuses in the kitchen. Brad from cmf forum, for example.

re soup stock: i've never seen bones dissolve. Not even chicken bones. I usually simmer mine until i "feel" they are done for. I mean, they start looking grey, sort of past tense, like they have nothing left to give. It's a subjective kind of feeling.

re double batching soup bones, using vinegar in the 2nd batch: when i thought about why i like to do this, i realized that i think the meat without vinegar in the first batch gives a stock with a slightly tastier, meatier flavour. Then in the 2nd batch - about 2 or 3 hours later - i'm happy to add the vinegar & another big portion of fresh water, obtain a somewhat less tasty soup stock but one that is higher in protein extraction.

(to Plugging) that surprising jelly that you find au jus after roasting chickens, beef, etc is indeed protein. Nutritionally it's very valuable, along with the delicious brown crackled bits of fat, it becomes a perfect base for sauces & soups. It wouldn't surprise me to learn that, gram for gram, 100 grams of such a firm jelly contains more protein than 100 grams of the original roast chicken.

.


----------



## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> oh it's beautiful! i cooked on a wood stove in the okanagan valley that was slightly similar, one summer when i was a student at UBC. My cast-iron beauty was named The Pride of Vancouver, in big raised letters on the oven door.
> 
> i never got anywhere near this level, of course, but a really good cook will partner instinctively with her wood stove. She will understand its temperamental moods perfectly. She will know which kinds of woods produce what kinds of fires, where on its surface are the hot spots & the cold spots, when will the oven be the perfect temperature for this souffle or that baked fish.
> 
> (note to Plugging & other fans of instant engineered cookware) (with a wood stove, there's no temperature dial) (cook has to wait for the stove surface or the oven to either heat up enough or else cool down enough) (then she needs a fire that will stay stable enough for the cooking duration of the dish) (really it's a symphony of talents)
> 
> 
> .


I do appreciate all forms of cooking appliances from camp fires, cook stoves to the latest tech. There is actually a wood stove at the residential camping we take our girl guides. I knew it would take a while to get the right temperature as I love campfire cooking. I underestimated the time, and the how hard it was to keep a constant tempurature. We managed to boil water for hot chocolate only after I burned milk on the first attempt. I think if I was cooking with my family and not a whole bunch of teen girls, it might have been better. 

I have talked about doing a heritage/ pioneer theme and trying it again, but just don’t have he ability to test out the stove. If worse comes to worst, I may bring my instant lots and plug it in the neighboring kitchen that has electricity :biggrin-new

It definately took a lot of skill which I did not have, Maybe MUKHANG can come to my nex5 camp and be our quarter master.


----------



## Plugging Along

peterk said:


> Yes I think you've got it dialed in. Brown the meat first in a pan or hot oven and then pressure cook. Could see it being great for stews or a beef/lamb pot roast.
> 
> Does the instant pot act as a hot pan too? Did you brown the meat in the instant pot? You said you sauteed the beans in it?


The Instant pot (or at least my Version) has a sautée function where you can use it like a pan. I thought it was also a silly feature as I have good pans. However, I like it because when I usuall6 slow cook meats, I usually sear them first to seal the juices in. Now, I do it in the instant pot, and then deglaze it. It’s only pot to clean and all the flavours stay in. 

It is fantastic braised meats, pot roast, and stews.


----------



## humble_pie

Plugging Along said:


> I have talked about doing a heritage/ pioneer theme and trying it again, but just don’t have he ability to test out the stove. If worse comes to worst, I may bring my instant lots and plug it in the neighboring kitchen that has electricity :biggrin-new



it's a win-win idea. Difficulties with a temperamental wood stove would show the girls how hard life was for our pioneer mothers. Then all the time you'd have the Plan B instaPot, so nobody would starve.





> Maybe MUKHANG can come to my nex5 camp and be our quarter master.



why not invite peterk & m3s too, to visit with Mukhang on say Day 3 to conduct a rescue operation, just when the girls are getting fed up with mosquitoes, flashlights at night, too much rain, hardship in camp cooking. Those guys could fish you up a fish fry, build you a bonfire, portage a canoe, show you the stars.


----------



## peterk

humble_pie said:


> wow! you are getting really good at this. Male cooks seem to be somewhat in the minority but the ones who do cook - creatively & spontaneously like the above - often turn out to be geniuses in the kitchen. Brad from cmf forum, for example.
> 
> re soup stock: i've never seen bones dissolve. Not even chicken bones. I usually simmer mine until i "feel" they are done for. I mean, they start looking grey, sort of past tense, like they have nothing left to give. It's a subjective kind of feeling.
> .
> .
> .
> 
> (to Plugging) that surprising jelly that you find au jus after roasting chickens, beef, etc is indeed protein. Nutritionally it's very valuable, along with the delicious brown crackled bits of fat, it becomes a perfect base for sauces & soups. It wouldn't surprise me to learn that, gram for gram, 100 grams of such a firm jelly contains more protein than 100 grams of the original roast chicken.


Thanks HP. I may have taken liberty with the word "pulverized". I more mean battered around so the tiny micro bits that scrape and diffuse off the bone and become suspended in the water, clouding it. But the bones stay whole. 
.
.
.
The jelly is exactly that, Gelatin (and collagen). It's an amino acid - protein - not in the muscle building sense, but even more importantly it supports the production of collagen in your body and helps joints, ligaments, skin. I take a hydrolyzed collagen supplement daily, but try and get my gelatin from soup bones as much as I can. Purchased soup broths don't have any.


----------



## Plugging Along

I have a desire to test out broths soon. I actually has no idea of on the benefits of getting it to gel, so thanks for the information.

PeterK. What kind of beef bones do you use


----------



## m3s

SW20 MR2 said:


> We just got an Instant Pot. Anyone have any good recipes to share? We are domestically-challenged so simple is good. LOL...


+1



humble_pie said:


> i never got anywhere near this level, of course, but a really good cook will partner instinctively with her wood stove. She will understand its temperamental moods perfectly. She will know which kinds of woods produce what kinds of fires, where on its surface are the hot spots & the cold spots, when will the oven be the perfect temperature for this souffle or that baked fish.
> 
> (note to Plugging & other fans of instant engineered cookware) (with a wood stove, there's no temperature dial) (cook has to wait for the stove surface or the oven to either heat up enough or else cool down enough) (then she needs a fire that will stay stable enough for the cooking duration of the dish) (really it's a symphony of talents)


Grandmother cooked all her life on a wood stove in the kitchen. I spent weekends and summers living with grandparents until leaving the nest. Helped grandfather cut, split, dry, pile wood every summer, not to mention the hay for cattle. Grandfather lost an eye collecting fire wood long before I came along. NOBODY touched grandmother's kitchen stove. I don't believe she had so much as an electric toaster. We did install a dishwasher for her at some point, but she still insisted to wash the dishes before placing them in the dishwasher. Meat, dairy, eggs, veggies, fruit all grown on the farm. Wild berries collected during grandmother's daily walks. Food will never be that good again



humble_pie said:


> wow! you are getting really good at this. Male cooks seem to be somewhat in the minority but the ones who do cook - creatively & spontaneously like the above - often turn out to be geniuses in the kitchen. Brad from cmf forum, for example.





humble_pie said:


> why not invite peterk & m3s too, to visit with Mukhang on say Day 3 to conduct a rescue operation, just when the girls are getting fed up with mosquitoes, flashlights at night, too much rain, hardship in camp cooking. Those guys could fish you up a fish fry, build you a bonfire, portage a canoe, show you the stars.


My camp cooking skiils are improving every summer. But I think food just tastes better after a day in the elements and fresh air.

Here's my contribution as an aspiring domesticated male cook


----------



## Mukhang pera

peterk said:


> That's a great looking stove Muk. I want one, along with the prime woodlot...
> Usually when in the woods I prefer an unharnessed, direct heat, though. :biggrin:
> View attachment 17481
> 
> View attachment 17489


Hey peterk, I too am a fan of unharnessed direct heat. The best way to go with steak, burgers, etc. It looks like you have a great setup for a bbq out in the woods. And you have managed to give that steak picture-perfect crosshatch grill marks. Very good!

Here, at home, we have used the same grilling idea, with perhaps a little more "bulk" to it, simply because it does not have to be portable. Some years ago, I was looking for ideas for a build-it-yourself backyard fire pit/bbq. Initially, I contemplated one of those big stone fortresses as depicted here:






Then I came across a simple plan for a cement/stone structure that has 2 intersecting circles, one much larger than the other. The smaller one is 24 inches in diameter and will accommodate a standard 24-inch grill. At first, I took one from a Weber kettle bbq and I also took the lid from that bbq which fits over the 24-inch circle when a covered fire is wanted. See pics below.

The idea with the larger circle is that it can be used for a fire pit, but also, as it produces coals, and if more hot coals are needed for the bbq, they can be raked into the smaller circle. In time, I changed the Weber stainless steel grate for a much heavier cast iron grate from an outfit called Craycort, I ordered online. It has 4 removable sections and any can be replaced with different inserts, such as a hotplate, vegetable grate, etc. We are happy with the result. Not the stone fortress, but something more in keeping with my limited skills as a stone mason and less concrete mix to haul by boat.

If we just want to sit around the fire pit, we burn whatever is close to hand, even driftwood from the beach nearby. For grilling, we use mostly alder and maple.


----------



## Mukhang pera

Plugging Along said:


> It definately took a lot of skill which I did not have, Maybe MUKHANG can come to my nex5 camp and be our quarter master.


Just lemme know when!




humble_pie said:


> why not invite peterk & m3s too, to visit with Mukhang on say Day 3 to conduct a rescue operation, just when the girls are getting fed up with mosquitoes, flashlights at night, too much rain, hardship in camp cooking. Those guys could fish you up a fish fry, build you a bonfire, portage a canoe, show you the stars.


Fine idea! But then, hp should also be invited as a special guest, with her storehouse of knowledge of advanced cooking techniques and the science of cooking.


----------



## m3s

Mukhang pera said:


> The idea with the larger circle is that it can be used for a fire pit, but also, as it produces coals, and if more hot coals are needed for the bbq, they can be raked into the smaller circle. In time, I changed the Weber stainless steel grate for a much heavier cast iron grate from an outfit called Craycort, I ordered online. It has 4 removable sections and any can be replaced with different inserts, such as a hotplate, vegetable grate, etc. We are happy with the result. Not the stone fortress, but something more in keeping with my limited skills as a stone mason and less concrete mix to haul by boat.
> 
> If we just want to sit around the fire pit, we burn whatever is close to hand, even driftwood from the beach nearby. For grilling, we use mostly alder and maple.
> 
> View attachment 17498
> 
> View attachment 17506


Interesting!

I have the exact same Weber grill. Will check out the Craycoft grate. Why do you have a wooden cover over the fire pit?

For portable grilling in the woods, I carry a Steamside Packers Grill from a small outfit (1 guy I believe) called Purcell Trench. It aint cheap but it's ultralight and quality to last

I've seen a few other portable grills that come with legs, but I was looking for something flat and durable


----------



## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> it's a win-win idea. Difficulties with a temperamental wood stove would show the girls how hard life was for our pioneer mothers. Then all the time you'd have the Plan B instaPot, so nobody would starve.
> 
> 
> why not invite peterk & m3s too, to visit with Mukhang on say Day 3 to conduct a rescue operation, just when the girls are getting fed up with mosquitoes, flashlights at night, too much rain, hardship in camp cooking. Those guys could fish you up a fish fry, build you a bonfire, portage a canoe, show you the stars.


It sounds like it might be quite the girl guides trip. 

Surprisingly, I can build an awesome bonfire, and cook over it well, I have taken the girls canoeing this year, and star gazing, but my fighting a fish is a little off. If MUK or any of them can navigate or work a compass, that’s where I usually need rescuing. I have unfortunately not done very well o; the naviagating or geocache badge an have had rescues sent out for me. Can’t win them all 



m3s said:


> +1
> 
> 
> 
> Grandmother cooked all her life on a wood stove in the kitchen. I spent weekends and summers living with grandparents until leaving the nest. Helped grandfather cut, split, dry, pile wood every summer, not to mention the hay for cattle. Grandfather lost an eye collecting fire wood long before I came along. NOBODY touched grandmother's kitchen stove. I don't believe she had so much as an electric toaster. We did install a dishwasher for her at some point, but she still insisted to wash the dishes before placing them in the dishwasher. Meat, dairy, eggs, veggies, fruit all grown on the farm. Wild berries collected during grandmother's daily walks. Food will never be that good again
> 
> My camp cooking skiils are improving every summer. But I think food just tastes better after a day in the elements and fresh air.
> 
> Here's my contribution as an aspiring domesticated male cook


Thanks for the video. It works well as that’s how I peel hard boiled eggs, but sadly it Does NOT work on soft boiled eggs, having yolk explode everywhere is not very appetizing. 

Your grandma sounds amazing. I just live farm fresh everything. I love the taste of cooking over fire, though haven’t been successful over a wood stove. I actually First learned to while camping. My parents never wanted me in their kitchen as I had been known to have a few kitchen fires. When I started camp cooking, if it caught on fire, it wasn’t a big deal. 



Mukhang pera said:


> Just lemme know when!
> 
> 
> Fine idea! But then, hp should also be invited as a special guest, with her storehouse of knowledge of advanced cooking techniques and the science of cooking.


This would be the best guides camp ever. Well for me at least, some of the girls have the attention span of a gnat. I would love to have each of you come. I am planning a spereate cooking activity (not at camp) to teach the girls basics, but HO would be great to be there too. She could help forage wild mushrooms.


----------



## Mukhang pera

m3s said:


> Interesting!
> 
> I have the exact same Weber grill. Will check out the Craycoft grate. Why do you have a wooden cover over the fire pit?
> 
> For portable grilling in the woods, I carry a Steamside Packers Grill from a small outfit (1 guy I believe) called Purcell Trench. It aint cheap but it's ultralight and quality to last


m3s, I think what you are seeing is not a wooden cover, but the yellow/beige firebrick that lines the fire pit. The pit is not deep. It's built up so its floor is level with the bbq circle floor. That way coals can easily be shifted to the bbq side. I thought of making it more of a deep pit, but stuck with the plan I found, and it has worked well. With a fire in the pit, you can see the whole fire, the base of the flames, without having to look down into a pit. Some people here use a concrete well ring for a fire pit. Those are about 4 feet across and 2 feet deep. Okay for that purpose, but the concrete wall covers a lot of the flame. Also, well rings are not things of beauty. A simple circle of big rocks looks better (although some of them like to explode, with enough heat). 

Thanks for sharing the Streamside grill. I wish I had had such a thing in the days when I did a lot more camping on hunting and fishing trips. We usually rigged up something much less satisfactory.

My only note of caution if you want to go for a Craycort grill, is I am not sure it would be ideal for the typical standard Weber kettle bbq with the tripod legs. The grill, with all 4 panels in use, weighs about 22 lb. It might render the bbq a bit more prone to being knocked over. If you would like at some point, send me a pm and I'll put the grill on our Weber kettle and see if it becomes unstable. I'd get up and do it this moment, but the grill is in the basement (I do not leave it outside, even covered, in rainy weather) and the Webber kettle is in an outbuilding 2,000 feet from the house. It's dark here and raining now and I am not going to slug the grill up to the other building just to conduct a physics experiment. But I am happy to do it at a more favourable time, at your request.


----------



## Mukhang pera

Plugging Along said:


> It sounds like it might be quite the girl guides trip.
> 
> Surprisingly, I can build an awesome bonfire, and cook over it well, I have taken the girls canoeing this year, and star gazing, but my fighting a fish is a little off. If MUK or any of them can navigate or work a compass, that’s where I usually need rescuing. I have unfortunately not done very well o; the naviagating or geocache badge an have had rescues sent out for me. Can’t win them all


Now if you can start that fire with flint, you just might be able to win Survivor!

I think I can probably still navigate by compass, but like most, I have become lazy in these days of gps. I still try to pay attention to the compass in our boat, just in case I have to rely on it if the chartplotter gives out.

My first very good lesson with navigation by compass took place during a week-long stay at the Island Nature School on Centre Is. off Toronto when I was in Grade 6. We had to find our way through a forested area, using a series of compass points. At each would be found the distance and bearing to the next point. Valuable instruction. All kids should have the opportunity to attend such a place.


----------



## m3s

Mukhang pera said:


> My only note of caution if you want to go for a Craycort grill, is I am not sure it would be ideal for the typical standard Weber kettle bbq with the tripod legs. The grill, with all 4 panels in use, weighs about 22 lb. It might render the bbq a bit more prone to being knocked over. If you would like at some point, send me a pm and I'll put the grill on our Weber kettle and see if it becomes unstable. I'd get up and do it this moment, but the grill is in the basement (I do not leave it outside, even covered, in rainy weather) and the Webber kettle is in an outbuilding 2,000 feet from the house. It's dark here and raining now and I am not going to slug the grill up to the other building just to conduct a physics experiment. But I am happy to do it at a more favourable time, at your request.


No worries. My back and front yards have 10ft drifts of snow at the moment (north/south sides are blown bare) and next summer I'm moving roughly 2000km due north of your presumed location. I don't think I'll be looking to upgrade my grill anytime soon

I've invited myself to your island paradise before for some kind of homemade pizza you described but I don't know when I'll have the opportunity to explore that general are.



Mukhang pera said:


> My first very good lesson with navigation by compass took place during a week-long stay at the Island Nature School on Centre Is. off Toronto when I was in Grade 6. We had to find our way through a forested area, using a series of compass points. At each would be found the distance and bearing to the next point. Valuable instruction. All kids should have the opportunity to attend such a place.


We still do semi-annual compass training just like what you describe.. it's considered a core skill as they figure GPS would be the first thing to go in a contested environment. When the first handheld GPS devices came out they used to tape our compass shut and initial it for emergency use only, because we all hated using GPS. Now it's the other way around


----------



## peterk

Mukhang pera said:


> Hey peterk, I too am a fan of unharnessed direct heat. The best way to go with steak, burgers, etc. It looks like you have a great setup for a bbq out in the woods. And you have managed to give that steak picture-perfect crosshatch grill marks. Very good!


Alas, that was just a fire pit in some park in a place far away from here.  But the temperature has risen to 0 tonight, warmest in weeks, so now I'm heading out to the deck to put some pork tenderloin on the BroilKing!


----------



## james4beach

I could really use some stew-making help from you folks!

I'm in the mood for lamb stew (including bones), and I have some good veggies to put into it but I don't know how to do the meat part. Can someone help me out? I have a nice tall stew pot and have previously made chicken stews but have no idea how to do lamb.

What cut of lamb should I find? How do I prepare it? I don't have the kinds of high-end knives to hack apart meat with bones in it.


----------



## Mukhang pera

james4beach said:


> I could really use some stew-making help from you folks!
> 
> I'm in the mood for lamb stew (including bones), and I have some good veggies to put into it but I don't know how to do the meat part. Can someone help me out? I have a nice tall stew pot and have previously made chicken stews but have no idea how to do lamb.
> 
> What cut of lamb should I find? How do I prepare it? I don't have the kinds of high-end knives to hack apart meat with bones in it.


I would think a lamb shoulder roast should do nicely. To do the hacking, probably a good heavy meat cleaver would be the implement of choice. But using today's internet speak, someone here might offer a better "hack" (ugh) for hacking lamb. 

To do the stewing, I might do something simple like throwing in some tomato paste, an onion, ground allspice, black pepper, a pinch of salt, cider vinegar. Bring to a boil, then simmer for about 2.5 hr.


----------



## Plugging Along

Mukhang pera said:


> Now if you can start that fire with flint, you just might be able to win Survivor!
> 
> I think I can probably still navigate by compass, but like most, I have become lazy in these days of gps. I still try to pay attention to the compass in our boat, just in case I have to rely on it if the chartplotter gives out.
> 
> My first very good lesson with navigation by compass took place during a week-long stay at the Island Nature School on Centre Is. off Toronto when I was in Grade 6. We had to find our way through a forested area, using a series of compass points. At each would be found the distance and bearing to the next point. Valuable instruction. All kids should have the opportunity to attend such a place.


I have started a fire with a flint, even without gasoline any more. I haven’t done it in a while though. 

My daughter did a similar thing at outdoor school this year, I have to admit I was completely lost and again, my group fell behind. I was no help in navigation *sigh*. At least I was able to help them get the fire going.


----------



## heyjude

james4beach said:


> I could really use some stew-making help from you folks!
> 
> I'm in the mood for lamb stew (including bones), and I have some good veggies to put into it but I don't know how to do the meat part. Can someone help me out? I have a nice tall stew pot and have previously made chicken stews but have no idea how to do lamb.
> 
> What cut of lamb should I find? How do I prepare it? I don't have the kinds of high-end knives to hack apart meat with bones in it.


Why not ask the butcher to do the hacking for you?


----------



## Plugging Along

james4beach said:


> I could really use some stew-making help from you folks!
> 
> I'm in the mood for lamb stew (including bones), and I have some good veggies to put into it but I don't know how to do the meat part. Can someone help me out? I have a nice tall stew pot and have previously made chicken stews but have no idea how to do lamb.
> 
> What cut of lamb should I find? How do I prepare it? I don't have the kinds of high-end knives to hack apart meat with bones in it.


I would use a lamb shoulder or shank. You can get the boneless lam should which is easier to cut, however, if you really want the bone, either a clever, or my friend uses a power saw. I can’t tell you much more because I don’t have a circular saw, but I think they do it from frozen.

For me, I just bought some lamb shanks, and will be throwing them in whole, stewing for a longer time.


----------



## peterk

Plugging Along said:


> I have a desire to test out broths soon. I actually has no idea of on the benefits of getting it to gel, so thanks for the information.
> 
> PeterK. What kind of beef bones do you use


I just use my leftover bones from Prime rib roasts, ribeye steaks and T-bone steaks. I've used "soup bones" before, which are bigger carcass bones cut up into puck shapes. They work great, maybe better, but always more expensive than I expect they should be, so I pass. I like to make my stocks for "free" with the leftovers of steaks, grocery store rotisserie chickens, turkey occasionally, ham bones, shrimp shells...Right now I'm savings up my Parmesean rinds to make a cheese broth, which I had for the first time with tortellini at a fancy Italian restaurant in Vegas last year.


----------



## peterk

Plugging Along said:


> I would use a lamb shoulder or shank. You can get the boneless lam should which is easier to cut, however, if you really want the bone, either a clever, or my friend uses a power saw. I can’t tell you much more because I don’t have a circular saw, but I think they do it from frozen.
> 
> *For me, I just bought some lamb shanks, and will be throwing them in whole, stewing for a longer time*.


Ya James, if you insist on using bone in meat, which will be much more work than just a boneless roast or stewing precubed meat, then I'd just roast the whole things in the oven at 400 for 45 minutes, until brown, then toss it whole thing into the pot to simmer for 6hrs minimum. At the end you'll have to pull the roast out and peel off the all the softened meat with forks to put back in the pot with the vegetables.

Also the only vegetable that you should put into the pot from the beginning is the onion. Carrots, garlic, celery, potatoes etc should go in during the last hour only after the meat is already where you want it.

Buy the cheapest cut the store has. With lots of fat and the bone if you want. Shanks, or flanks or legs or shoulders or hocks. Not lamb chops haha.


----------



## humble_pie

peterk said:


> Ya James, if you insist on using bone in meat, which will be much more work than just a boneless roast or stewing precubed meat, then I'd just roast the whole things in the oven at 400 for 45 minutes, until brown, then toss it whole thing into the pot to simmer for 6hrs minimum.



good cooks always say that bones in meat give extra flavour

roasting 45 mins at 400F just to get some delicious crispy surface browning is overkill imho. Meat surfaces will dry out too much at this high temp for so long. Most cooks will get by with searing the future stewing meat with butter or olive oil in a heavy frying pan, as Plugging describes.

in fact Plugging says she's able to sear (brown) her meat cuts right in her instaPot before she closes it to cook with pressure.

6 hours stew simmering is also a bit of overkill imho. In a slow cooker OK but a stovetop stew - which is what this one sounds like - should be done in 2-2.5 hours.






peterk said:


> Also the only vegetable that you should put into the pot from the beginning is the onion. Carrots, garlic, celery, potatoes etc should go in during the last hour only after the meat is already where you want it.



this is true imho. One does not want one's vegetables boiled into pablum mush.


.


----------



## humble_pie

if we are not talking instaPots here i would know how to do a lamb stew. For jas4 the drill would be similar to the chicken stew he's already made.

any inexpensive cut of lamb will do. The whole point of slow-braised or stewed meat cuts is that this method succeeds with the tougher, cheaper portions of the animals. Shoulder cuts or shanks, for example, which will never turn into tender pink roast lamb or succulent lamb chops.

brown your lamb in a heavy frying pan with a bit of olive oil. Even if you bought it as a roast-size slab & you don't have a meat cleaver, you can get it into 2 or 3 pieces with a smaller knife. Not too much oil, lamb itself is a very fatty meat. Me i would include 2 or 3 sliced or quartered onions, 3-5 fine-sliced or mashed garlic cloves. 

once browned, transfer everything to the stew pot. Add water to barely cover plus whatever you have on hand from a list that goes: red wine, bay leaves, rosemary fresh or dried, oregano, cumin, a pinch of ground cloves, peeled roughly chopped carrots, a few stalks of celery, ground black pepper, cayenne pepper (i belong to the school that says don't salt meat while cooking because it makes the meat a bit stringy) (school says add salt at the table instead)

don't forget to deglaze the frying pan with more water or wine & add this to the stew pot.

the grandmothers' school of cooking insists - absolutely insists - that lamb stew must always include one or two whole allspice berries.

then you simmer this collection for say 2 hours. The grandmothers' school of traditional irish lamb stew also says that barley must be included. If using hulled barley, add it after 30 minutes simmering. Pearl barley, add after one hour simmering.

somewhere around 1.5-2 hours of simmering, try the lamb pieces with a fork, they should be tender. At this stage the braised lamb should be edible as is. You could remove the bones now, or later. The meat should be falling-off-the-bones, as cooks say.

now you start adding your veggies, which you've already prepared. You don't need all of these veggies, just some of them, whatever you have on hand.

add them in the order of how long they need to cook. If your carrots are fairly thick (older carrots) & your carrot pieces are big, you'd add them first. Next your potatoes, then turnips if any. Sweet potatoes need less cooking time. More celery goes in now, also kale stems if you have any (slice celery & kale stems quite finely).

you can add a can of tomatoes any time. For lamb stew, i might add a handful of raisins.

finally you'd add the fresh green vegetables, the green peas, broccoli flowers, chopped cauliflowers, sliced chard or kale leaves, any finely-sliced green beans you had on hand, parsley, chopped green onion. These veggies should only cook for a few minutes, not more than 4-5 mins.

many stew recipes will direct cooks to add all the vegetables to the stew pot at the beginning of the 2-hour braising period, ie along with the water and/or wine. The reason i don't do this but add veggies much later, is that i like vegetables on the fresh & crisp side, not mushy & over-cooked. Don't forget that a re-heated stew the next day will already make the vegetables mushier than they were when stew was first prepared.

another thing you could add to lamb stew is bulghur wheat, which we buy as wheat berries already split & partially cooked. You'd use bulghur as a replacement for barley, probably skip the barley. Bulghur cooks up faster than barley.

bulghur has a delicious slighty nutty flavour, it's also very healthy. I like the No.3 grade, which is the coarsest. so it does require more cooking time than the finest. I'd add coarse bulghur along with the carrots & the potatoes.


.


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## james4beach

Thanks for these suggestions everyone. I'm going to visit a couple grocery stores today and see if I can find some boneless lamb, or at least a good meat counter that can point me to the kind of shoulder cut that I can work with. I'm not too familiar with meats, but I'm eager to try something.

My dad tells me that he's found 1 kg bags of frozen and cut NZ lamb for stews (probably at Superstore).


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## humble_pie

^^

bone-in is good. Bones add flavour.

with a shoulder roast you can probably cut it into 3 or even 4 pieces at home, even without a meat cleaver or a seriously big knife. Scissors can help. 

eye a shank bone in the supermarket. Will it go into your stew pot? does store have a butcher at the counter who might be willing to cut it into 2-3 pieces?

my supermarket doesn't have any butcher at counter who will open packages to re-prepare whatever meat contents are enclosed. Those less expensive pre-weighed & pre-packed packages are put out there for a reason. 

market does have a butcher who can customize an order at the counter, but he serves the specialty meat department only. Those choice cuts are $20-$140 per kilo.

.


----------



## peterk

humble_pie said:


> good cooks always say that bones in meat give extra flavour
> 
> roasting 45 mins at 400F just to get some delicious crispy surface browning is overkill imho. Meat surfaces will dry out too much at this high temp for so long. Most cooks will get by with searing the future stewing meat with butter or olive oil in a heavy frying pan, as Plugging describes.
> 
> in fact Plugging says she's able to sear (brown) her meat cuts right in her instaPot before she closes it to cook with pressure.
> 
> 6 hours stew simmering is also a bit of overkill imho. In a slow cooker OK but a stovetop stew - which is what this one sounds like - should be done in 2-2.5 hours.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> this is true imho. One does not want one's vegetables boiled into pablum mush.
> 
> 
> .


You're right, the sear is technically preferred and that's what I'd still do for smaller roasts of meat. For bigger cuts I only recently started to like the oven method because it's less work, doesn't smoke out the house and/or make it smell like grease for hours after searing, and you don't have to flip it with tongs half a dozen times and keep close watch over the browning for 20 constant minutes of frying pan work. A large piece of meat (bone in especially) is somewhat of a menace to properly sear in a pan.


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## Mukhang pera

james4beach said:


> My dad tells me that he's found 1 kg bags of frozen and cut NZ lamb for stews (probably at Superstore).


You can also go online and see if anyone is advertising mutton. It's lamb over one year old and at a few years of age can provide very good stew meat, usually much cheaper than lamb.

Before the internet, when I lived in Vancouver, there was a farm in the Fraser Valley that used to advertise mutton for sale in a small ad in the Vancouver Sun classifieds. It was worth the drive from town. The meat made for excellent lamb curry. You could make a good spicy curry, without overpowering the flavour of the meat.

When I was a kid, you could often find mutton in supermarkets. No more. I was recently at a Save-On Foods and asked for pork kidney, to make steak and kidney pie. The butcher told me it's now a special order item and expensive accordingly. At least I was able to find frozen beef kidney at the Superstore, but I prefer pork (or lamb) kidney for steak and kidney.

The butcher also told me that he had recently brought in on special order a beef tongue, for a price of about $40. When I was a youngin', that could be bought anywhere, cheap as borscht. My mummy used to buy it to make sandwiches for our school lunches. I wouldn't mind having it again.


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## peterk

james4beach said:


> Thanks for these suggestions everyone. I'm going to visit a couple grocery stores today and see if I can find some boneless lamb, or at least a good meat counter that can point me to the kind of shoulder cut that I can work with. I'm not too familiar with meats, but I'm eager to try something.
> 
> *My dad tells me that he's found 1 kg bags of frozen and cut NZ lamb for stews* (probably at Superstore).


That's exactly what I'd go for for lamb stew. Those big cheap frozen bags of halal lamb. I've only bought it once and it seemed to be a bunch of random shoulder or sirloin or other cuts indiscriminately sliced into steaks, with various bones and fat throughout that I couldn't recognize. Pretty much good for stew and only stew.

With enough meat purchasing experience and reading about the various cuts and where on the animal they come from you can learn to eyeball any piece of meat for what it is and how best to cook it. You can also catch mislabeled meat with a good eye. I've seen plenty of striploins that were marked sirloin, premium AAA ribeyes with great marbling tossed in amongst the cheapo rib steaks, thick tender porterhouses as T-bones. Plus with pork there is great value in buying those huge logs of pig loin in the vacuum sealed bags and breaking it down into premium pork chops, roasts, and slowcooked rib meat as pulled pork/boneless ribs.


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## humble_pie

peterk said:


> You're right, the sear is technically preferred and that's what I'd still do for smaller roasts of meat. For bigger cuts I only recently started to like the oven method because it's less work, doesn't smoke out the house and/or make it smell like grease for hours after searing, and you don't have to flip it with tongs half a dozen times and keep close watch over the browning for 20 constant minutes of frying pan work. A large piece of meat (bone in especially) is somewhat of a menace to properly sear in a pan.



what excellent practical points!

still, my religion says never roast meats at temps above 325 fahrenheit. It not only dries out the meat fibres which then become more stringy & tasteless, but the high temps also do something to the molecules, they become more oxidative at high temps & over time can damage human tissue if ingested (just kidding about the religion) (it's more of a cooking credo)

wouldn't the best solution be to simply buy a good strong all-purpose kitchen knife though. I have one, can cut & de-bone anything fit for the table, don't actually need a meat cleaver, although a friend brought me back one from asia that's a beaut 

.


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## james4beach

peterk said:


> That's exactly what I'd go for for lamb stew. Those big cheap frozen bags of halal lamb. I've only bought it once and it seemed to be a bunch of random shoulder or sirloin or other cuts indiscriminately sliced into steaks, with various bones and fat throughout that I couldn't recognize. Pretty much good for stew and only stew.
> 
> With enough meat purchasing experience and reading about the various cuts and where on the animal they come from you can learn to eyeball any piece of meat for what it is and how best to cook it. You can also catch mislabeled meat with a good eye. I've seen plenty of striploins that were marked sirloin, premium AAA ribeyes with great marbling tossed in amongst the cheapo rib steaks, thick tender porterhouses as T-bones. Plus with pork there is great value in buying those huge logs of pig loin in the vacuum sealed bags and breaking it down into premium pork chops, roasts, and slowcooked rib meat as pulled pork/boneless ribs.


Thanks peterk. I don't have much education in meats and cuts. I think I should take some time to study these on Youtube!

I had a fun time this afternoon touring different grocery stores and looking at some cuts of lamb. Unfortunately the selection in this city's downtown is far inferior to anything you'd find at Superstore. There are no frozen bags of NZ/halal lamb like I've seen in Canadian Superstores, and I checked 4 different large grocery stores.

What I ended up finding are several lamb shoulder chop options at $10/lb for US lamb and then also found some Australian lamb shoulder chops at $9/lb on sale.



Mukhang pera said:


> I would think a lamb shoulder roast should do nicely.


Thanks, I found one. Amazon Whole Foods carries a possibly higher quality product, more bad-stuff-free/hipster US lamb, but that's a whole shoulder roast (meaning 3+ lb) though still only $10/lb. The Amazon Whole Foods butcher offered to hack it up for me, which is great, but this would be $35 of meat. So I didn't go for this, but next time I'm in an organic-hipster mood I may go with this one.

That's as cheap as I could find. There were also lamb shanks at $8/lb but it looked like this would be mostly bone, so I stuck with the shoulder chops instead as I felt like there's more meat per $. I like that they're smallish chops with both meat and bone, so there will be no hacking required. If I can cook this up well, these are easy to find and readily available both from the US and Australia.

Starting the process of cooking with my lamb shoulder cuts at around $9 to $10/lb...


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## james4beach

peterk said:


> Also the only vegetable that you should put into the pot from the beginning is the onion. Carrots, garlic, celery, potatoes etc should go in during the last hour only after the meat is already where you want it.
> 
> Buy the cheapest cut the store has. With lots of fat and the bone if you want. Shanks, or flanks or legs or shoulders or hocks. Not lamb chops haha.


Thanks everyone for all the tips. I've written up a preliminary recipe from tips in this thread, and now I'm trying things out and will adjust the recipe.

I plan on trying this all again with a lamb shank next, since at my local stores they're slightly cheaper ($8/lb) than these shoulder chops/roasts ($10/lb) and the shanks are small enough to fit in my stew pot.

Thanks again - I've been very hungry today and worked up an appetite with some lap swimming and a few hours of walking.


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## Plugging Along

peterk said:


> I just use my leftover bones from Prime rib roasts, ribeye steaks and T-bone steaks. I've used "soup bones" before, which are bigger carcass bones cut up into puck shapes. They work great, maybe better, but always more expensive than I expect they should be, so I pass. I like to make my stocks for "free" with the leftovers of steaks, grocery store rotisserie chickens, turkey occasionally, ham bones, shrimp shells...Right now I'm savings up my Parmesean rinds to make a cheese broth, which I had for the first time with tortellini at a fancy Italian restaurant in Vegas last year.


Usually everyone wants to eat the prime rib bones, I don’t get get many beef bones from other cuts. I may have to try cutting off more of the meat off the bone on m6 next pr8me rib. 

Let us know how the cheese broth goes. It sounds really 8nteresting, I am not sure I understand the flavours, but I will look it up.



humble_pie said:


> good cooks always say that bones in meat give extra flavour
> 
> roasting 45 mins at 400F just to get some delicious crispy surface browning is overkill imho. Meat surfaces will dry out too much at this high temp for so long. Most cooks will get by with searing the future stewing meat with butter or olive oil in a heavy frying pan, as Plugging describes.
> 
> in fact Plugging says she's able to sear (brown) her meat cuts right in her instaPot before she closes it to cook with pressure.
> 
> 6 hours stew simmering is also a bit of overkill imho. In a slow cooker OK but a stovetop stew - which is what this one sounds like - should be done in 2-2.5.
> 
> .


I do generally sear first even before my instant pot. However, I have had the tips from several chefs to roaste my carcasses i. the oven a high temp before turning them into broth. I can’t remeber the science, but it I still suppose to bring out the meaty flavours more. I don’t always do it though. 



humble_pie said:


> what excellent practical points!
> 
> still, my religion says never roast meats at temps above 325 fahrenheit. It not only dries out the meat fibres which then become more stringy & tasteless, but the high temps also do something to the molecules, they become more oxidative at high temps & over time can damage human tissue if ingested (just kidding about the religion) (it's more of a cooking credo)
> 
> 
> .


My dad (he had a restaurant) would roast the prime rib on the highest heat for about 25 minutes, then slow roast it for hours at 200 degrees, raised on a rack over some liquid. It was the most tender prime rib around. People would rave about it.

I don’t have the patience and often the oven space to slow cook it for hours, mine is tasty but not as tender.


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## Plugging Along

Tonight I made Instant Pot beef brisket and mashed potatoes.

-Season a 3.5 lb brisket with some steak spice rub, I put slivere garlic in the brisket, and seared it in the pot 
- added 2 sliced onions and more garlic to the bottom and sautéed it for a few minutes
- out the brisket on top, added some sliced cherry tomatoes (they were going wrinkly) and cup of beef broth out of a box
- pressure cooked it for 30 minutes, I should have gone 35 minutes and let it rest
- i had my potatoes peeled and cut, added some chicken broth, and had it in the instant pot for 10 minutes, and mashed them in the pot.
- while the potatoes were cookiing in the pot, my daughter made a roux for the gravy and made a locel6 gravy with the brisket drippings.

It took just over an hour and 15 minutes to prep and coo everything. I felt the result for the brisket where as good as when I do the slow cooker. I could have cut out time by making my potatoes on the stove, but just wanted to try the mashed potatoes this way.


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## james4beach

^ Inspirational!

Meanwhile, my stew is on the burner. I have an interesting home made sauce from a coworker, and am debating adding this in. It's mashed up figs, wine, and rosemary. I suspect it would work well in a lamb stew... what do you guys think?


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## Plugging Along

^ I think the figs and roasemary would go well with the lamb. The sweetness would contrast nicely with the gameyness 9f the lamb. I use rosemary with lamb often. I would also add a touch of balsamic vinegar. I love figs and balsamic and i love lamb and balsamic, so think the together would be wonderful. I actually have a rosemary balsamic that I have used on figs. 

You will need to post your results after.


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## Mukhang pera

Plugging Along said:


> My dad (he had a restaurant) would roast the prime rib on the highest heat for about 25 minutes, then slow roast it for hours at 200 degrees, raised on a rack over some liquid. It was the most tender prime rib around. People would rave about it.
> 
> I don’t have the patience and often the oven space to slow cook it for hours, mine is tasty but not as tender.


That sounds interesting, PA. But my guess is the roast comes out very tender, but quite thoroughly cooked? I like my prime rib on the rare side and I usually get good results roasting at about 350 F. until the thermometer shows a core temperature of about 130-135. Than take out of the oven, cover with foil, and let rest. The internal temp will usually continue to rise to about 140.

Around here, if we want a really tender roast of beef, but thoroughly cooked, we'll use a chuck roast of about 5 lb. and braise it in a covered Corning Ware (or similar) baking dish and leave it in the oven for 4-5 hr. at 200 degrees. It will emerge cut-with-a-fork tender. 



james4beach said:


> ^ Inspirational!
> 
> Meanwhile, my stew is on the burner. I have an interesting home made sauce from a coworker, and am debating adding this in. It's mashed up figs, wine, and rosemary. I suspect it would work well in a lamb stew... what do you guys think?


Sounds great. I think I'd like to try that. Are you using fresh or dried figs? One cannot go wrong with lamb and rosemary!


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## james4beach

Plugging Along said:


> ^ I think the figs and roasemary would go well with the lamb. The sweetness would contrast nicely with the gameyness 9f the lamb. I use rosemary with lamb often. I would also add a touch of balsamic vinegar. I love figs and balsamic and i love lamb and balsamic, so think the together would be wonderful. I actually have a rosemary balsamic that I have used on figs.
> 
> You will need to post your results after.


Update on my first ever lamb stew...

It turned out well. I started with the shoulder chops and threw them into the empty stew pot with just oil and onions, to brown them first before adding tomato paste. Overall I kept it on a low simmer (lowest heat on electric stove stop) and after about 1.5 hours the meat started falling off the bone. By 2 - 2.5 hours it had really softened up incredibly and bones had separated. I'm also pleasantly surprised with how thick it turned out, but perhaps this is partly due to the starchy effect of the potatoes.

I added that fig and rosemary mix but I think I may have gone a bit overboard with it. This added nice flavour but a bit too sweet for my taste, I guess the figs were quite strong. It's still nice though. I'm very happy with how the whole thing turned out. There's over 1 lb of lamb (meat & bone) in here and I'm not sure if I added too much, or too little, meat.

This was easy to make. Other than a few breaks to add veggies, and cutting and adding potatoes in the last 30 mins, it just cooks itself over a few hours. I was able to do other work and I can easily imagine getting a stew like this going and leaving it while I go to the gym. When it's full of liquid and on the lowest stove setting... bubbling very very slightly... I don't see any danger in leaving it alone.

This would be a good thing to cook on a Sunday while I want to do a few things around my apartment, like the gym and laundry. And 2.5 hours really isn't bad, considering how long I'll be able to eat this amount of stew.


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## Plugging Along

^. Sounds like a success. Way t9 go. 

I would say a pound of mea5 isn’t that much especiall6 with bone, I use probaby 2 lbs lbs for about 5 quarts. I am not sure, becaus I don’t measure.

For the figs, how many did you add, I would think 4 or 5 would be good depending on the size.


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## Plugging Along

Mukhang pera said:


> That sounds interesting, PA. But my guess is the roast comes out very tender, but quite thoroughly cooked? I like my prime rib on the rare side and I usually get good results roasting at about 350 F. until the thermometer shows a core temperature of about 130-135. Than take out of the oven, cover with foil, and let rest. The internal temp will usually continue to rise to about 140.
> 
> Around here, if we want a really tender roast of beef, but thoroughly cooked, we'll use a chuck roast of about 5 lb. and braise it in a covered Corning Ware (or similar) baking dish and leave it in the oven for 4-5 hr. at 200 degrees. It will emerge cut-with-a-fork tender.


Surprising, it was never cooked past medium, but usually medium rare. My dad hated over cooked meat. The prime ribs were were usually at least 10 bones or more, and barely fit in the oven. It actually filled the oven on a diagonal. I would guess almost 15 pounds (not sure as I was young). But it would fee up to 20 people with massive appetites. 

There one end a little rarer. I just remeber it was almost perfectly even in colour but not over cooked. Maybe I have the temperature wrong. It was also over a bath of liquid.


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## james4beach

Plugging Along said:


> For the figs, how many did you add, I would think 4 or 5 would be good depending on the size.


This was tricky since it was a puree that my coworker gave out in jars of preserves. So I don't know how many (effective) figs were added... I did it by taste.


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## Mukhang pera

james4beach said:


> Update on my first ever lamb stew...
> 
> It turned out well. I started with the shoulder chops and threw them into the empty stew pot with just oil and onions, to brown them first before adding tomato paste. Overall I kept it on a low simmer (lowest heat on electric stove stop) and after about 1.5 hours the meat started falling off the bone. By 2 - 2.5 hours it had really softened up incredibly and bones had separated. I'm also pleasantly surprised with how thick it turned out, but perhaps this is partly due to the starchy effect of the potatoes.
> 
> I added that fig and rosemary mix but I think I may have gone a bit overboard with it. This added nice flavour but a bit too sweet for my taste, I guess the figs were quite strong. It's still nice though. I'm very happy with how the whole thing turned out. There's over 1 lb of lamb (meat & bone) in here and I'm not sure if I added too much, or too little, meat.


Thanks for the update and the comment about the figs and sweetness. Good point. I too would not want too sweet. 



Plugging Along said:


> Surprising, it was never cooked past medium, but usually medium rare. My dad hated over cooked meat. The prime ribs were were usually at least 10 bones or more, and barely fit in the oven. It actually filled the oven on a diagonal. I would guess almost 15 pounds (not sure as I was young). But it would fee up to 20 people with massive appetites.
> 
> There one end a little rarer. I just remeber it was almost perfectly even in colour but not over cooked. Maybe I have the temperature wrong. It was also over a bath of liquid.


Medium rare is okay, if tender. Now that you mention the size of the roast, that might explain the superb results. I had in mind the typical prime rib of about 5 pounds (usually the first 3 ribs) we roast here. 

The liquid bath, was it just to provide humidity, do you know? Just plain water? Perhaps not something you can remember. If the cooking process was 4-5 hr. as you recall, you might just be right about the temperature. I might have to try it your dad's way one of these days.


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## Plugging Along

james4beach said:


> This was tricky since it was a puree that my coworker gave out in jars of preserves. So I don't know how many (effective) figs were added... I did it by taste.


This makes sense why it mayhave been too sweet. Usually preserves have sugar added, and are much more concentrated. Depending the amount of stew you had in the, i would guess no more tha a 1/4 cup of preserves would be enough. You also need to give it a little time for the flavours to blend, so maybe two or three tables spoons would be enough.



Mukhang pera said:


> Medium rare is okay, if tender. Now that you mention the size of the roast, that might explain the superb results. I had in mind the typical prime rib of about 5 pounds (usually the first 3 ribs) we roast here.
> 
> The liquid bath, was it just to provide humidity, do you know? Just plain water? Perhaps not something you can remember. If the cooking process was 4-5 hr. as you recall, you might just be right about the temperature. I might have to try it your dad's way one of these days.


I will have to ask my dad. He gave me the instructions years ago when I moved out, but I only too the main points (I felt he was too particular... lol). He stopped making prime rib years ago because he found the prime rib too large to lift. He said cutting it in half wouldn’t do as it gave lesser results. I think you are right about the size making a difference.

In terms of the liquid, it was for humidity,and i can’t rememebr what he pout in it. I rememebr there being onions, garlic (lots), carrots, celery, peppercorns, then the Laurie, and the roast sat on a lightly raised metal rack.


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## MrMatt

Plugging Along said:


> This makes sense why it mayhave been too sweet. Usually preserves have sugar added, and are much more concentrated. Depending the amount of stew you had in the, i would guess no more tha a 1/4 cup of preserves would be enough. You also need to give it a little time for the flavours to blend, so maybe two or three tables spoons would be enough.
> 
> 
> 
> I will have to ask my dad. He gave me the instructions years ago when I moved out, but I only too the main points (I felt he was too particular... lol). He stopped making prime rib years ago because he found the prime rib too large to lift. He said cutting it in half wouldn’t do as it gave lesser results. I think you are right about the size making a difference.
> 
> In terms of the liquid, it was for humidity,and i can’t rememebr what he pout in it. I rememebr there being onions, garlic (lots), carrots, celery, peppercorns, then the Laurie, and the roast sat on a lightly raised metal rack.


Prime Rib? I do it in a pressure cooker. It's great https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XgZD-OJl0A&t=16s


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## peterk

MrMatt said:


> Prime Rib? I do it in a pressure cooker. It's great https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XgZD-OJl0A&t=16s


That is sick and twisted, MrMatt. Blasphemous. 

As you can see though, it didn't work so well. Terrible crust and radiating out in doneness from the middle. I'm sure it still tastes as good as a medium rare rump or sirloin roast or something...but that prime rib isn't anything close to what it could and should be.

Plug has it. Seared dark brown, then in the oven as low as humanly possible. Practically that's 250 degrees. I've never tried lower but I'm sure 200 would be better. The restaurant pro's have special ovens that go even lower, so they can cook it at 250 to rare, drop the oven temp to 160, and then leave the roast in there for an entire day, slicing off medium rare when needed.


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## Plugging Along

Though I love my instant pot, both my spouse and I agree that putting a prime rib in it would be tragic. I had a friend when he was first learning to cook decided to slow cook a prime rib into a stew. It was meaty but the mushiest thing imaginable. That’s when he learned that different cuts of meat needed different cooking, and they could all taste good or bad depending on cooking method. It was the cook that made s9me taste good not the cut of meat. 

Also, my dad had a restaurant and they did have the ovens that went even lower, I think that’s how he got the idea from for home.


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## humble_pie

Plugging Along said:


> I do generally sear first even before my instant pot. However, I have had the tips from several chefs to roaste my carcasses i. the oven a high temp before turning them into broth. I can’t remeber the science, but it I still suppose to bring out the meaty flavours more ...
> 
> My dad (he had a restaurant) would roast the prime rib on the highest heat for about 25 minutes, then slow roast it for hours at 200 degrees, raised on a rack over some liquid. It was the most tender prime rib around. People would rave about it.




thankx so much for your dad's instructions on roasting beef ribs to rare/medium rare. I can't wait to try this out!

if i understand the approach correctly, the initial 25 minute roasting/searing at extremely high temperatures - as high as the oven can go - this would be higher than 500F - works to seal a delicious roasted crust on the skin. But at the same time, the 25 minutes aren't long enough to actually start cooking the roast. 

then your dad would immediately lower the oven temp down to 200F, where he'd roast the ribs for about six hours, on a rack sitting just above a bath of water, with some onions, celery & other veg in the water.

it looks like the only demand on the cook would be to keep checking the water level, adding more water when necessary. That's not too much to ask on a day when cook is going to be home anyhow. The result from a 3-5 pound roast would be 10-15 dinner portions, the extras could all be frozen, time-wise this method is a keeper.

it does sound terrific. Mille mercis.


.


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## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> thankx so much for your dad's instructions on roasting beef ribs to rare/medium rare. I can't wait to try this out!
> 
> if i understand the approach correctly, the initial 25 minute roasting/searing at extremely high temperatures - as high as the oven can go - this would be higher than 500F - works to seal a delicious roasted crust on the skin. But at the same time, the 25 minutes aren't long enough to actually start cooking the roast.
> 
> then your dad would immediately lower the oven temp down to 200F, where he'd roast the ribs for about six hours, on a rack sitting just above a bath of water, with some onions, celery & other veg in the water.
> 
> it looks like the only demand on the cook would be to keep checking the water level, adding more water when necessary. That's not too much to ask on a day when cook is going to be home anyhow. The result from a 3-5 pound roast would be 10-15 dinner portions, the extras could all be frozen, time-wise this method is a keeper.
> 
> it does sound terrific. Mille mercis.
> 
> 
> .


I would check the timing, as the roasts dad used to do we’re probably closer to 15 pounds, it filled the whole oven. If you have a smaller roast, the searing time wouldn’t be reduce a bit and the over cooking time is also reduced. If your oven goes lower than 200,then turn to almost the lowest setting. It reminds me of a sous vide oven style if there was such a thing.


I have to admit that there has never been cooked prime rib frozen even though I freeze almost everything else. Usually we eat it for a few days, or our guests take it home for leftovers. There never has been extras even with a 10+ rib roast.


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## Plugging Along

Ag Driver said:


> Sounds pretty accurate to me. Here is the dirt bag way to make a leather shoe tender as could be. Let it sit in a thick layer of salt to tenderize.
> 
> https://food-hacks.wonderhowto.com/how-to/make-cheap-cut-steak-taste-like-filet-mignon-0162708/


Thanks, I may try this. We usually get better cuts, but this may be worth trying Also, the me this reminded me, I want to make a salt bake chicken soon.


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## Plugging Along

james4beach said:


> Thanks for these suggestions everyone. I'm going to visit a couple grocery stores today and see if I can find some boneless lamb, or at least a good meat counter that can point me to the kind of shoulder cut that I can work with. I'm not too familiar with meats, but I'm eager to try something.
> 
> My dad tells me that he's found 1 kg bags of frozen and cut NZ lamb for stews (probably at Superstore).


James: 

I was thinking about you this week (not in a creepy way though). After reading about your lamb stew and the different types of meat, I went looking for different options. My Superstore had lamb shanks $15.98/kg, the bags of stewing lamb 20.99 for 1.25 Kg, and surprisingly lamb shoulder steaks for 13.98. I was expecting the stewing lamb to be the least , but it was the most expensive when you consider yield of meat. 




I felt like lamb shanks, which I would braise differently anyways. I seared 6 of them with flour, then put in my pressure cooker with broth, aromatics, plus mushrooms but I put too much liquid (I forgot to reduce the amount). The shanks still turned out great and were tender. I took off some of the meat off the bone and served it with the sauce, veggies, over rice, but then there was alot of liquid left in the pot. and I felt it was a was a waste to throw it out. (This is a frugal cooking thread. So I threw the bones back in with some of the remaining meat, then a big handful of pot barley. I cooked it some more, and turned into a delicious stew.


I ended up with two different meals using one preparation. The stew didn't even taste like leftovers. Thought I would share, as it was really a mistake on the too much liquid.


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## james4beach

Great stuff, thanks for the new ideas... I don't cook meat too often so I'm still learning all of this. I will take another stab at this.

On another trip to the grocery store, I found chicken quarters with leg on sale for $1.50/lb. I bought a couple pounds of this... just a little over $3 of meat... and roasted it in the oven. This turned out nicely and I can't believe how cheap it was. This is a real winner, and frugal as well except for the oven electricity. (However this works fine in the winter since I turn off my apartment's electric heating and substitute for oven heat).

I've been buying this stuff at Fred Meyer in the US pacific northwest. This store has an awfully similar style to Superstore. I have a theory that Canada's Superstore/RCSS was inspired by US's Fred Meyer (founded 1922). At the very least, I'm sure Loblaws has been visiting and studying these stores.


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## peterk

james4beach said:


> Great stuff, thanks for the new ideas... *I don't cook meat too often so I'm still learning all of this.* I will take another stab at this.
> 
> On another trip to the grocery store, I found chicken quarters with leg on sale for $1.50/lb. I bought a couple pounds of this... just a little over $3 of meat... and roasted it in the oven. *This turned out nicely and I can't believe how cheap it was*. This is a real winner, and frugal as well except for the oven electricity. (However this works fine in the winter since I turn off my apartment's electric heating and substitute for oven heat).
> 
> I've been buying this stuff at Fred Meyer in the US pacific northwest. This store has an awfully similar style to Superstore. I have a theory that Canada's Superstore/RCSS was inspired by US's Fred Meyer (founded 1922). At the very least, I'm sure Loblaws has been visiting and studying these stores.


I just don't know how a meat eater ends up not eating meat very often. I am noticeably distressed if I end up shopping/cooking myself into a situation during the week where I don't have meat available to eat that day... Something that must by remedied immediately, by the very next day at the absolutely latest! :biggrin:

It's great your are learning about cheap meats. I remember being turned off by a lot of my parent's cooking as a kid because of improperly cooked cheap meats. Enough of that and one turns to sausages, bacon, hamburgers, M&M packages, as their go-to meats, as these are practically foolproof to cook properly, but very unhealthy. I didn't start eating pork or steak again until my 20s when I discovered that pork chops and mushroom soup in the over for 1hr wasn't the only way in the world to make pork.

And may I suggest that if you ever feel like branching out into more expensive meats (highly recommended) that you come on back and post about it here, so we can avoid any further pressure cooked prime rib debacles. :wink:

*Book Recommendation: Cook's Illustrated - The New Best Recipe*

https://www.amazon.ca/Best-Recipe-Editors-Cooks-Illustrated/dp/0936184744

This 1000 page text book is like a cooking school. Each recipe is prefaced by a full page of text retelling how the recipe was developed, alterations that did/didn't work, and the background explaining "why" to cook certain ways. I've had this book for 6 years now and still am realizing that there are sections I haven't touched - made my first cake last weekend -while other pages like spaghetti carbonara are well worn with sauce stains for authenticity.


----------



## humble_pie

peterk said:


> And may I suggest that if you ever feel like branching out into more expensive meats (highly recommended) that you come on back and post about it here, so we can avoid any further pressure cooked prime rib debacles. :wink:




+ 1. More expensive ingredients are highly recommended. (EDIT) (High or highest quality ingredients are recommended even though they will be more expensive). Especially for bachelor millennials with high energy needs & high salaries to match. If not now, when in your lifetime are you ever going to satisfy your inner craving for filet mignon + a fine red wine bio?

just before xmas i happened to be grocery shopping with a friend. Both he & his wife are famously good cooks. The finest ingredients. Il va sans dire, goes without saying that their grocery bills are sky-high. The way they see it, life is too short & there's not that much dollar difference between eating mediocre & eating heaven, so why not go for it.

in the supermarket, he swooped something off a high shelf, the kind of shelf where seldom-bought products get stored, where the aficionados know to look. It was Valrhona dark cooking chocolate, said to be the best belgian dark chocolate in the world. Cost $15.49 for a bar the size of the cooking chocolate that i normally buy for $4.99.

me i've heard off valrhona of course, but i'd never bought it. I'd have to get over some serious sticker shock first.

this is all my wife ever uses, he said. 

i looked doubtful. He put the bar back on the high shelf. Silently, i promised myself that some day in 2018, i'm going to buy a couple blocks valrhona chocolate. Chocolate mousse. 40% organic whipping cream.


.


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## james4beach

humble_pie said:


> + 1. More expensive ingredients are highly recommended. (EDIT) (High or highest quality ingredients are recommended even though they will be more expensive). Especially for bachelor millennials with high energy needs & high salaries to match. If not now, when in your lifetime are you ever going to satisfy your inner craving for filet mignon + a fine red wine bio?


I eat high quality foods, I just don't know much about red meat. I often shop for ingredients at my local farmers market, with prices 2x to 4x what I would pay at the grocery store. And I usually buy organic or naturally raised poultry. I get my bread from proper bakeries at the farmers market.

For red meats, I could use some guidance. I picked this up on sale today, does this seem like high quality stuff? "Natural ground beef - Vegetarian fed, no preservatives, no antibiotics, no added hormones."


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## peterk

james4beach said:


> I often shop for ingredients at my local farmers market, with prices 2x to 4x what I would pay at the grocery store. And I usually buy organic or naturally raised poultry. I get my bread from proper bakeries at the farmers market.


It's funny, growing up in SW Ontario, farmers markets were always the place for discount, fresh farmer's produce, not over priced yuppy produce. Here in Alberta, a farming province obviously, the farmer's markets are priced like they're an urban core grocery in the ground floor of a $1M condo building. 

Roadside peaches and corn stands are the place for wholesale bargain bin prices in Ontario...Stop at that little fruit stand in Alberta and you'll be paying $2 per BC peach.


----------



## james4beach

I also grew up in Ontario and saw those discounted prices from the farmers. We used to buy road side peaches in Niagara, entire boxes full of them. In Kitchener-Waterloo, I used to go to Herrle's Country Farm Market where I could get amazing corn, and the weekend farmers market north of town.

However where I am now, the "farmer's market" is a yuppie/hipster experience with obscenely high prices. Something I noticed is that shoppers have no sense of frugality and don't know how to do comparison shopping. You will see two stands side by side with the same tomatoes, and people just arbitrarily walk up and pay whatever the listed price is without even looking next door to see the lower price.

I haggle when I can, and I know I'm getting ripped off in this hipster-oriented experience. However the fact remains that the food quality is better than what I can get at the grocery stores. I only spend about $20 to $25 a week at the farmers market. Higher when the best fruits are in season.


----------



## Earl

Do any of you have an instant pot? I frequently use a slow cooker and understand an instant pot does the same thing, but faster. The rumor is that the food will be tastier than with a slow cooker because more flavor is infused. Not sure if I should get one, I already have a lot of kitchen appliances I never use.


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## Spudd

I have the instant pot and I've barely used my slow cooker since I got it. I am a big fan. 

I haven't used the slow cooking function (it has one) because I just use the pressure cooker function for everything, it works great. It's also nice that you can saute the food in the pot before you start the pressure cooking, so you get that browning. I always hated slow cooker recipes that said brown the meat, then put it in the slow cooker... if I'm using the slow cooker it's because I want to just dump everything in there! With the instant pot it's all in one so it's really easy.


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## heyjude

I recently bought an a Instant Pot and love it. First, it’s so versatile. Yogurt, cheesecake, ricotta, quinoa, risotto, stew, soup, meatballs, spaghetti squash, you name it, just so long as you are not looking for crispness. It’s efficient: the sauté function means fewer pots to clean, and the Pot in Pot method means it’s very easy to steam and reheat several foods at once. I’m using my stove less. I find the food tender and very flavourful, much more so than that cooked in the slow cooker. The yogurt is better than storebought. It’s a very user-friendly appliance. And there are tons of recipes online and on YouTube. My current favourite channel is Pressure Luck.


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## m3s

heyjude said:


> The yogurt is better than storebought. It’s a very user-friendly appliance. And there are tons of recipes online and on YouTube. My current favourite channel is Pressure Luck.


I'd considered buying a slow cooker, rice cooker, pressure cooker for years but never did because I didn't want to have cupboards full dusty appliances. Very happy with the value, versatility, simplicity of the Instant Pot, and it's Canadian apparently. Got the first one on Amazon Prime day and second during amazon Black Friday-week. I use it mostly for pressure cooking, rice and steaming veggies. Figured the yogurt button was a gimmick. As a YouTube chef/mechanic/technician myself I'll check out Pressure Luck


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## heyjude

m3s said:


> As a YouTube chef/mechanic/technician myself I'll check out Pressure Luck


Indigo Nili is another good channel. Also, Flo Lum, who is Canadian.


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## MrMatt

heyjude said:


> I recently bought an a Instant Pot and love it. First, it’s so versatile. Yogurt, cheesecake, ricotta, quinoa, risotto, stew, soup, meatballs, spaghetti squash, you name it, just so long as you are not looking for crispness. It’s efficient: the sauté function means fewer pots to clean, and the Pot in Pot method means it’s very easy to steam and reheat several foods at once. I’m using my stove less. I find the food tender and very flavourful, much more so than that cooked in the slow cooker. The yogurt is better than storebought. It’s a very user-friendly appliance. And there are tons of recipes online and on YouTube. My current favourite channel is Pressure Luck.


My favorite channel is my own (http://youtube.com/mattinthekitchen).

I like the set it and forget it, and I think the cheapest meal I make is the Coconut Curried Red lentils, though I've been making it with Green lentils lately (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=meNchKANysw)



As far as electric Pressure cookers, one died, and I currently have a Salton and an Instant Pot. I find the Instant Pot annoying, but that's likely due to a few years of using a different design. Also the instant pot is much slower and more likely to burn, which I don't understand at all.


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## 1980z28

Being in NL since June 2017
My diet has increase in moose,cod,salmon and lobster as i fish here
As for root vegetables all potatoes,turnip,carrot and parsnip as i grow this 
Have increase the size of green house for this year,,,will start to bottle and pickle this summer
I did pick to many blueberries,strawberries,raspberries and cranberries all local from my property bag and in freezers
Love having the time to cook a full Jigs dinner every Sunday(salt beef really good) with moose roast slow cooked overnight
Learning as i go,,,have also increase crop area another 1/2 acre,nice to have backhoe saves a lot of work and keeps me busy
With all of this it does cut cost going forward as i now know what works,NL this summer has been the warmest and winter to date also the warmest and not much snow,
I have a river on property that i draw from for crops as needed,,,,,funny that not enough rain here


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## humble_pie

MrMatt said:


> Also the instant pot is much slower and more likely to burn, which I don't understand at all.



unusual but significant detail. A tendency to burn would be a deal breaker for me


----------



## humble_pie

1980z28 said:


> Being in NL since June 2017
> My diet has increase in moose,cod,salmon and lobster as i fish here
> As for root vegetables all potatoes,turnip,carrot and parsnip as i grow this
> 
> Have increase the size of green house for this year,,,will start to bottle and pickle this summer
> I did pick to many blueberries,strawberries,raspberries and cranberries all local from my property bag and in freezers
> 
> Love having the time to cook a full Jigs dinner every Sunday(salt beef really good) with moose roast slow cooked overnight
> 
> Learning as i go,,,have also increase crop area another 1/2 acre,nice to have backhoe saves a lot of work and keeps me busy
> With all of this it does cut cost going forward as i now know what works,NL this summer has been the warmest and winter to date also the warmest and not much snow,
> I have a river on property that i draw from for crops as needed,,,,,funny that not enough rain here




this is a story for the ages. 

costs & frugality are not the issue at this point in time. Clearly you are having too much fun & you are going to press on with the backhoe & get another half acre under cultivation, regardless of whether it costs you more in the short term or not.

at one point in the past you mentioned you intended to give away surplus vegetables. How is that going.

another thing to do involves recruiting extra people. Perhaps your wife could start as First Personnel. Could you preserve some of the harvests & sell these in an organized way?

right away i think of the berries because Who does not love a good homemade berry jam? but there are other vegetables & wild herbs that are suitable for drying or canning. Can you gather seaweed, for example. In the cities, dried & salted seaweed is a luxury culinary item.


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## 1980z28

I gave away many hundreds of LBS of product,,,,way more family and friends,no problem there

Need the extra crop room for cabbage and beets also will try rhubarb (pickles) 

Did find a great seed company,,only sell seed that grow here in this climate

I have collected many egg cartons will start seedlings and trans plant

I have also piled up many yards of bog soil(very black),,i will mix it with other soil this year,,, did not get any seaweed,others use it for fertilizer 

Learning from local older folks,they love to chat ,,lots of time passed chatting here,,,sometimes we have a cold one there wives phone for me to send them home(all are like kids),NL has a lot of older persons


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## bgc_fan

Since the topic of instant pot came up. I'm wondering if anyone has looked at sous-vide. Basically you seal your ingredients in a vacuum sealed bag, or ziplock bag and evacuate as much air as possible, and set it in a temperature controlled water bath.

It may be more complicated based on the type of recipe, but there is no chance of burning and because the ingredients are sealed, all the flavours are retained.

You can check some of the recipes here: https://recipes.anovaculinary.com/

We've done it ourselves and steaks come out great.


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## Plugging Along

MrMatt said:


> My favorite channel is my own (http://youtube.com/mattinthekitchen).
> 
> I like the set it and forget it, and I think the cheapest meal I make is the Coconut Curried Red lentils, though I've been making it with Green lentils lately (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=meNchKANysw)
> 
> 
> 
> As far as electric Pressure cookers, one died, and I currently have a Salton and an Instant Pot. I find the Instant Pot annoying, but that's likely due to a few years of using a different design. Also the instant pot is much slower and more likely to burn, which I don't understand at all.


Hi Matt. I think it’s great you have a channel and I have watched some of your videos and like the ideas. One area you may want to consider is putting the recipe at the beginning or at the end. I am pretty good with figuring our recipes, but it’s hard to see how much put in quantities, if you want viewers to come back, they will come back for the recipe, not necessarily watching you put ingredients in a pot.

I loved the idea of the pierogi lasagne, but now to make it, I am looking on the internet for a recipe and found some, it not yours, but will use their site because it give me a base to start with. People are more likely to save a site or recipe if there is actually a recipe and instructions posted.


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## Plugging Along

bgc_fan said:


> Since the topic of instant pot came up. I'm wondering if anyone has looked at sous-vide. Basically you seal your ingredients in a vacuum sealed bag, or ziplock bag and evacuate as much air as possible, and set it in a temperature controlled water bath.
> 
> It may be more complicated based on the type of recipe, but there is no chance of burning and because the ingredients are sealed, all the flavours are retained.
> 
> You can check some of the recipes here: https://recipes.anovaculinary.com/
> 
> We've done it ourselves and steaks come out great.


I don’t have the machine but have fiends and family that do, and it works wonderfully. You have to plan well in adapvance it’s not fast cooking, but the results are great. If you do it a lot, a vacuum sealer works well. Also, on the steaks, if yo7 sears them super high at the end to finish, it adds that little crust. Yum.


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## bgc_fan

Plugging Along said:


> I don’t have the machine but have fiends and family that do, and it works wonderfully. You have to plan well in adapvance it’s not fast cooking, but the results are great. If you do it a lot, a vacuum sealer works well. Also, on the steaks, if yo7 sears them super high at the end to finish, it adds that little crust. Yum.


Yeah. You want to sear it to give the nice finish to the steaks. We did use vacuum sealers, but they only work for dry mix. If you have liquid in it like a marinade, it doesn't work.


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## Plugging Along

bgc_fan said:


> Yeah. You want to sear it to give the nice finish to the steaks. We did use vacuum sealers, but they only work for dry mix. If you have liquid in it like a marinade, it doesn't work.


It takes a little more planning, but for a wet marinade freeze the marinade in ice cube trays, or flat small flat sheets (like a thin layer on the bottom of a square plastic container) then put frozen marinade on the meat and vacuum wrap it. The technique works really well when you double (or trip up you marinades. An alternative is to freeze the marinade in with the meat (if you are planning to freeze meat anyways), lie the bag down, clip it so it doesn’t leak, then suck out the air after it’s solid. That latter works really nicely because once you defrost it, it marinades at the same time.


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## bgc_fan

Plugging Along said:


> It takes a little more planning, but for a wet marinade freeze the marinade in ice cube trays, or flat small flat sheets (like a thin layer on the bottom of a square plastic container) then put frozen marinade on the meat and vacuum wrap it. The technique works really well when you double (or trip up you marinades. An alternative is to freeze the marinade in with the meat (if you are planning to freeze meat anyways), lie the bag down, clip it so it doesn’t leak, then suck out the air after it’s solid. That latter works really nicely because once you defrost it, it marinades at the same time.


That's an interesting tip. Thanks. I'll have to try it the next time.


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## MrMatt

Plugging Along said:


> Hi Matt. I think it’s great you have a channel and I have watched some of your videos and like the ideas. One area you may want to consider is putting the recipe at the beginning or at the end. I am pretty good with figuring our recipes, but it’s hard to see how much put in quantities, if you want viewers to come back, they will come back for the recipe, not necessarily watching you put ingredients in a pot.
> 
> I loved the idea of the pierogi lasagne, but now to make it, I am looking on the internet for a recipe and found some, it not yours, but will use their site because it give me a base to start with. People are more likely to save a site or recipe if there is actually a recipe and instructions posted.


Feedback is always important. 
I put the recipe in the comments, but I'm thinking of captioning them, though that takes a surprising amount of work, and I'm clearly not a pro video producer.

Oh yeah, pierogi lasagna is amazing, it's a no leftovers meal.


----------



## humble_pie

bgc_fan said:


> Since the topic of instant pot came up. I'm wondering if anyone has looked at sous-vide. Basically you seal your ingredients in a vacuum sealed bag, or ziplock bag and evacuate as much air as possible, and set it in a temperature controlled water bath.



i'd never heat or cook with a ziplock bag or any other type of plastic bag.

you've never heard of polymer breakdown under heat conditions? those sometimes-toxic atoms can transfer directly into food & particularly into fat molecules. Is why we are so extra-careful about baby food containers & baby bottles.


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## humble_pie

MrMatt said:


> Feedback is always important.
> I put the recipe in the comments, but I'm thinking of captioning them, though that takes a surprising amount of work, and I'm clearly not a pro video producer.



the matter of recipe copyright is a big internet issue, it seems

recipes are seldom original. Many posters of "recipes" are visibly possessive about their internet presentations, even though they might have purloined the version in the first place. 

many cooks ask readers to re-write a recipe in their own words while also acknowledging themselves as the source. This seems like an aitch of a lot of extra work.

some recipe posters get around these rules by simply linking to the original recipe site; however this approach is rarely as appealing.

mr Matt i haven't looked at your cooking site yet although i will certainly do so. But it's possible that your presentation of video explanation plus no recipe complies effortlessly with copyright law, while being visually very attractive at the same time.


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## bgc_fan

humble_pie said:


> i'd never heat or cook with a ziplock bag or any other type of plastic bag.
> 
> you've never heard of polymer breakdown under heat conditions? those sometimes-toxic atoms can transfer directly into food & particularly into fat molecules. Is why we are so extra-careful about baby food containers & baby bottles.


Not when we're talking about the heat level used for sous-vide. Usually we're talking about 50-60 deg Celsius. Nowhere near boiling. It's not the plastic, it's the type and the additives. BPA was the main additive that was an issue, and using PVC, but Ziplock are using polypropylene and polyethylene which are food safe.

https://www.cnet.com/how-to/why-ziploc-bags-are-perfectly-okay-to-use-for-sous-vide-cooking/


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## humble_pie

^^


thankx for the explanation. Polyprop & polyeth bags may be safe if one never makes a mistake & lets the pot temp rise to boiling in error ... still, to each his own.

when preparing food, my mother used to sometimes refer to what she called "the association of ideas." And i happen to have a persistent notion that unfortunate molecules do break down & detach themselves from plastic items & alas they dp get into the food & water chains, where they can interfere with human DNA in ways that human beings have never experienced in all of evolutionary history.

for example, a lot of old sewer pipes that were laid down generations ago in older cities are now leaking badly. They are being lined with polymer composite inner pipes that are said to be "guaranteed for 40 years," says my city's engineer. 

the problem, as i see it, is that after 40 years those inner pipes are likely to begin shedding molecules, perhaps quite rapidly. Nor will we be able to remove those plastic inner pipes, since 40 years of grit, corrosion, fractures & bacteria will have glued them in place.

i don't come by my concern with plastics contamination lightly. For years i used to edit a journal for chemical engineers. Many of them specialized in engineered polymers.

.


----------



## bgc_fan

humble_pie said:


> ^^
> 
> 
> thankx for the explanation. Polyprop & polyeth bags may be safe if one never makes a mistake & lets the pot temp rise to boiling in error ... still, to each his own.


Hence the use of ANOVA type heaters. You prepare a water bath and it keeps it at the set point. Unless you actually put the set point to boiling, it will never reach it.

https://anovaculinary.com/

I would say it is a bit of a variation on the slow cooker, though you have a greater control on the temperature.


----------



## Plugging Along

MrMatt said:


> Feedback is always important.
> I put the recipe in the comments, but I'm thinking of captioning them, though that takes a surprising amount of work, and I'm clearly not a pro video producer.
> 
> Oh yeah, pierogi lasagna is amazing, it's a no leftovers meal.


I didn’t realize the recipe was in the comments. Maybe mention that. I am going to take another look


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## james4beach

Thanks for the earlier tips and encouragement. I made another lamb stew with the method I wrote above, this time using Australian shoulder cuts that I found for $6 / lb ... great deal I think. Maybe the price of Australian lamb is coming down?

I think I put $8 worth of meat in the stew, it was very easy to cook, and I'll get at least 4 meals out of it. Even with potatoes, beans etc this is probably working out to $3 a meal or something.


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## milhouse

I'm dying to get a Joule sous vide machine by ChefSteps. While it's only $250'ish, I really need to confirm if we're going to use it somewhat regularly. Otherwise, I'll never hear the end of it from the missus.


----------



## Plugging Along

james4beach said:


> Thanks for the earlier tips and encouragement. I made another lamb stew with the method I wrote above, this time using Australian shoulder cuts that I found for $6 / lb ... great deal I think. Maybe the price of Australian lamb is coming down?
> 
> I think I put $8 worth of meat in the stew, it was very easy to cook, and I'll get at least 4 meals out of it. Even with potatoes, beans etc this is probably working out to $3 a meal or something.


Did you put figs in this time? $6/lb is a great price for lamb. I haven’t seen it at that price. If I do, I may break my no stocking rule. It’s my favorite meat. 



milhouse said:


> I'm dying to get a Joule sous vide machine by ChefSteps. While it's only $250'ish, I really need to confirm if we're going to use it somewhat regularly. Otherwise, I'll never hear the end of it from the missus.


There is a less expensive one by instant pot. I saw it for about $100 on sale. I want a sour video machine too, but my frugalness stops me. I have a friend that wired her slow cooker up with a temperate monitor and breaker and that works.


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## james4beach

Plugging Along said:


> Did you put figs in this time? $6/lb is a great price for lamb. I haven’t seen it at that price. If I do, I may break my no stocking rule. It’s my favorite meat.


I didn't add figs to this one. Just the tomato sauce base, garlic, onions, veggies, green beans, potatoes. Oh, and a bit of hot sauce.


----------



## milhouse

Plugging Along said:


> There is a less expensive one by instant pot. I saw it for about $100 on sale. I want a sour video machine too, but my frugalness stops me. I have a friend that wired her slow cooker up with a temperate monitor and breaker and that works.


Good to know, thanks! Did a quick search and they seem to be out of stock at Amazon and Best Buy. At around $100, it might be more reasonable to give it a go.


----------



## Plugging Along

james4beach said:


> Thanks for the earlier tips and encouragement. I made another lamb stew with the method I wrote above, this time using Australian shoulder cuts that I found for $6 / lb ... great deal I think. Maybe the price of Australian lamb is coming down?
> 
> I think I put $8 worth of meat in the stew, it was very easy to cook, and I'll get at least 4 meals out of it. Even with potatoes, beans etc this is probably working out to $3 a meal or something.


Darn you James! After reading this post, I decided to check out lamb prices, the sirloins were the same but they had big legs of lamb on sale for under $6 lbs. I have been trying to not buy stuff but couldn’t resist.


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## james4beach

I finally bought an Instant Pot. I'm really enjoying it so far! I've made the same kind of beef and lamb stews as before... it's _much_ faster with the instant pot. I also just tried the rice cooking mode and it works really well.

This is very popular throughout the US and not many people seem to know it's a Canadian invention, created by ex-Nortel employees.


----------



## heyjude

james4beach said:


> I finally bought an Instant Pot. I'm really enjoying it so far! I've made the same kind of beef and lamb stews as before... it's _much_ faster with the instant pot. I also just tried the rice cooking mode and it works really well.
> 
> This is very popular throughout the US and not many people seem to know it's a Canadian invention, created by ex-Nortel employees.


There are now several imitators out there. But Instant Pot Rules. 
If you like yogurt, give it a try. Mine turns out great and saves me a bundle. 
One thing I had not expected when I bought my Instant Pot a year ago was that my electricity bills would go down. I am using my stove and oven much less frequently.


----------



## Plugging Along

Feeling the desire to be more frugal and the desire to get our food spending back under control during the holidays. I had gotten in the bad habit of not cooking at home or throwing too much stuff out.

Today, I had some hard French bread that I bought earlier this week and forget to eat. I was going to throw it since when I started cutting, it started to crumble I made an extra densefrnch toast, kids had a great breaks, and the. I froze the rest. 

The had beautiful pork belly at Costco for a great price. I bought 10 lbs, and froze some seperately, and hav e been making slow roasted pork belly for Raman, and as a topping. 

Let’s see if I can get back into my old frugal cooking habits.


----------



## ian

Every so often we buy large pieces of beef tenderloin or pork tenderloin. We cut them up into steaks or roasts and freeze them. No fat, no bone, and very tender. The price is considerably less than buying cut product in the store. It is also much less expensive than buying cuts of both that may have a lower cost have lots of fat and bone.


----------



## Plugging Along

^. Good reminder Ian. I usually buy the large tenderloins when they go sale or are in season. I actually picked up 3 full beef tenderloins Christmas week. I ended up with some thing like 4 large roasts, 20+ Bacon wrapped tenderloins, plus a whole bag of cubes for skewers for under $150.

I have to admit I buy pork tenderloin and just make roasts, and never considered making pork chops. I think I will do that thanks for the reminder.


----------



## Butter

I found a promo code on the internet and bought makegoodfood EZ Prep for $2. (the regular box was free).

Delivered straight to the house. Got 3 different unique meals that each feed 2 people. Probably at least $20 worth of food. Just have to cancel the subscription because it jumps to $80 the next week. I've heard of people doing this with HelloFresh as well.


----------



## humble_pie

Butter said:


> I found a promo code on the internet and bought makegoodfood EZ Prep for $2. (the regular box was free).
> 
> Delivered straight to the house. Got 3 different unique meals that each feed 2 people. Probably at least $20 worth of food. Just have to cancel the subscription because it jumps to $80 the next week. I've heard of people doing this with HelloFresh as well.



helloFresh delivers its vegetables pre-peeled-pre-chopped

so what's wrong with that? only that veggz start losing vitamins, enzymes & other beneficial plant properties as soon as their peels are removed & air hits their cells

i for one wouldn't think of buying stale old veggiez that were cut up maybe a couple days ago, are likely to be bagged with mold inhibitors

i don't even buy pre-cut fresh veggz in sacs at the supermarket. Frozen cut-up are probably OK w the vitamins because they're frozen soon after cutting. But stale old sacks of fresh carrots/greenbeans/squash that were sliced or julienned in mexico last week are off-putting


----------



## Plugging Along

humble_pie said:


> helloFresh delivers its vegetables pre-peeled-pre-chopped
> 
> so what's wrong with that? only that veggz start losing vitamins, enzymes & other beneficial plant properties as soon as their peels are removed & air hits their cells
> 
> i for one wouldn't think of buying stale old veggiez that were cut up maybe a couple days ago, are likely to be bagged with mold inhibitors
> 
> i don't even buy pre-cut fresh veggz in sacs at the supermarket. Frozen cut-up are probably OK w the vitamins because they're frozen soon after cutting. But stale old sacks of fresh carrots/greenbeans/squash that were sliced or julienned in mexico last week are off-putting


I have used HelloFresh along with other food boxes. I actually found hellofresh to be great, but don’t post for the frugality section. Surprisingly, the produce in hellofresh was really good, in fact fresher than most other box companies. They use a lot more locally sourced food, or at least made in Canada, and their supply chain was better than the others. I have been using them on and off for almost two years. I started using them when I was working that crazy job with really long hours. I wasn’t able find the time to eat, little less than grocery shop and cook. 

It’s more expensive than getting everything yourself, however, I found their ingredients to be equivalent or better than what I would get at the big box grocery store. My bonus was the recipes were put together well enough that my kids, 8 and 11 could cook a lot of the meal. It taught them some good basic cooking skills too, along with my spouse. 

That being said, not as fresh as going to your local farmers market. If you have the time to do it yourself, that’s good, but there have been times this has. Been a god send. I still use the service when I know I will have some extended weeks of being Uber busy. 

Just wanted to throw in a review as hellofresh is expensive, but much cheaper and healthier than eating out.


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## peterk

Finally got the present I wanted this Christmas. A large enamel cast iron dutch oven.










Made a great pot roast a few weeks ago, which I'd never really done technically as a "pot roast" before!

Seems much more convenient than a slow cooker, which doesn't hold as much food, unless you get the huge ones which takes up a whole closet to put away, and you can't brown in a slow cooker either.

Plus it just goes on the stove and in the oven like any old pot, doesn't take up half the counter space all day while cooking.


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## james4beach

Plugging Along said:


> Just wanted to throw in a review as hellofresh is expensive, but much cheaper and healthier than eating out.


I tried it as well (in the US) and agree that the ingredients were surprisingly good. It might even be a nice way to try cooking different dishes than you are used to. The recipe cards and instructions are very nice.

However, I cancelled it as the cost per meal is much higher than what I prepare on my own, and I can make meals that are just as healthy. Plus I don't like being on "their" schedule about when the box arrives, how much food is in the box, etc. I've heard the same complaint from friends who use Blue Apron... difficulty cooking all the food in the delivery.


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## Plugging Along

james4beach said:


> However, I cancelled it as the cost per meal is much higher than what I prepare on my own, and I can make meals that are just as healthy. Plus I don't like being on "their" schedule about when the box arrives, how much food is in the box, etc. I've heard the same complaint from friends who use Blue Apron... difficulty cooking all the food in the delivery.


I found that using the delivery every week was often too much, as there were some weeks, I would barely get through the 3 meals. I have found the right balance for us when we are really busy is to order the box once every two weeks. When I am on a more normal schedule which is still busy but not crazy, I order the boxes only on the weeks that I know I will be extra busy, like in two weeks when I know I am doing extra consulting which adds about 30 hours to my normal work schedule. I also order if there is a recipe that looks really good, or I am not as familiar with. That's how a found out about farro, and fantastic shrimp and grits. I leave my subscription on hold/skip week until I see something I like.

Though I do enjoy the convenience, I do the cost per serving a little high. My little frugal tip has been on most of the recipes, they are very generous for vegetables (or we don't eat enough), so I add a little bit more of the protein (I have lots in my freezer) and I can get lunch for everyone which reduces the cost per serving by almost half.


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## Plugging Along

I thought I would revive my other thread about frugal cooking with a twist due to the COVID 19 pandemic. This is similar to my eat down thread I started somewhere. I figure I could use this as an outlet for my social isolation.

I already mentioned elsewhere about going through my non-perishables and eating the old stuff that we can. I am going to try and not go grocery shopping for two weeks or more unless I can get delivery or pick up which currently is not an option. We eat a lot of fresh produce diary, and breads normally, so this could be interesting. My goal is to not go into the grocery store and not waste anything I currently have (other than that which already not safe due to way past bb).

So far some things I have made which I probably would not have made if it was not for the pandemic:

Korean Jap Chee with noodles I had no idea I had, and random veggies
Potato hash with sad little potatoes that were going, sad kale, some random veggies that weren't enough to make a meal, a frozen smoke ham I didn't know I had, topped with green onions we are regrowing, and some old cheese that need grating. All the ingredients probably would have been tossed in other times. It was delicious with a perfect sunny side egg.
Rice bowl - with roasted broccoli and cauliflower that was looking sad, kim chee (I don't really know why I have), seared trout that was in my fridge.
I also won't lie, I have been eating more junk as I always buy treats and sweets but then realize I like them more than my kids. It also doesn't help that I am Girl Guide Leader and we cannot no longer sell cookies, so I am stuck with almost a 100 boxes. So have been eating those too. I have been giving them on doorsteps to those in need when I drop off groceries as a treat. 

To lighten things up, what kind of things are you guys eating that you might not normally eat because of quarantine/isolation, not getting groceries, or unable to get your normal things?


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## Money172375

Plugging Along said:


> I thought I would revive my other thread about frugal cooking with a twist due to the COVID 19 pandemic. This is similar to my eat down thread I started somewhere. I figure I could use this as an outlet for my social isolation.
> 
> I already mentioned elsewhere about going through my non-perishables and eating the old stuff that we can. I am going to try and not go grocery shopping for two weeks or more unless I can get delivery or pick up which currently is not an option. We eat a lot of fresh produce diary, and breads normally, so this could be interesting. My goal is to not go into the grocery store and not waste anything I currently have (other than that which already not safe due to way past bb).
> 
> So far some things I have made which I probably would not have made if it was not for the pandemic:
> 
> Korean Jap Chee with noodles I had no idea I had, and random veggies
> Potato hash with sad little potatoes that were going, sad kale, some random veggies that weren't enough to make a meal, a frozen smoke ham I didn't know I had, topped with green onions we are regrowing, and some old cheese that need grating. All the ingredients probably would have been tossed in other times. It was delicious with a perfect sunny side egg.
> Rice bowl - with roasted broccoli and cauliflower that was looking sad, kim chee (I don't really know why I have), seared trout that was in my fridge.
> I also won't lie, I have been eating more junk as I always buy treats and sweets but then realize I like them more than my kids. It also doesn't help that I am Girl Guide Leader and we cannot no longer sell cookies, so I am stuck with almost a 100 boxes. So have been eating those too. I have been giving them on doorsteps to those in need when I drop off groceries as a treat.
> 
> To lighten things up, what kind of things are you guys eating that you might not normally eat because of quarantine/isolation, not getting groceries, or unable to get your normal things?


poutine today with some powdered gravy and leftover cheese


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## m3s

Plugging Along said:


> To lighten things up, what kind of things are you guys eating that you might not normally eat because of quarantine/isolation, not getting groceries, or unable to get your normal things?


Since I have the time I started making flatbread. The ingredients are very basic (no yeast) however I noticed flour has been sold out already.

Wheat berries are still readily available online so considering ordering a hand grinder online.. I'd like to do sour dough if I get some yeast

Also since I have the time I tried my first cheese cake in the Instapot. Came out perfect and a lot easier than I expected!

I believe I even found green onions popping up in a raised garden (first spring in this house) Thinking of adding some tomato plants


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## Plugging Along

Money172375 said:


> poutine today with some powdered gravy and leftover cheese


That’s on my list for later this week. I found a random bagel frozen fries from a kids camp. 



m3s said:


> Since I have the time I started making flatbread. The ingredients are very basic (no yeast) however I noticed flour has been sold out already.
> 
> Wheat berries are still readily available online so considering ordering a hand grinder online.. I'd like to do sour dough if I get some yeast
> 
> Also since I have the time I tried my first cheese cake in the Instapot. Came out perfect and a lot easier than I expected!


Nice. Yeast has been hard to find. I am trying to work out a deal with a bakery. I did find a recipe for sourdough with no yeast. It may be a little tricky. Also you can call the bakeries and ask if they have fresh yeast. You need double the amount of dry yeast I heard. I am just getting ready for sour dough myself.


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## cainvest

m3s said:


> I'd like to do sour dough if I get some yeast


Good idea, sour dough bread is awesome ... might make some this week!


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## Ag Driver

Deleted.


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## m3s

Ag Driver said:


> If you buy it, it is very expensive. If you have a clean coffee grinder, or a magic bullet, you can easily make it yourself like I do. Blend rice slowly and pulse up maybe a cup at a time so you don't create too much heat. Pulse to the consistency of corn meal and there you have it, for pennies on the dollar.


Gave me an idea to look up blending wheat berries and yes it apparently works - so I don't even need to buy a grinder to make flour. Steel cut oats in the Instapot has become a staple for me w chia, cinnamon and raisins. Might try the rice and that might also be good for a camping breakfast









Grinding Grains in a Blendtec Blender


Blendtec makes it easy and convenient to make your own flours from multiple types of grains. This article shares quick blending tips for grinding your own grains.




www.blendtec.com


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## Eder

Plugging Along said:


> Yeast has been hard to find. I am trying to work out a deal with a bakery.


If you have a "Bulk Barn" in your area they have yeast.


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## Plugging Along

Eder said:


> If you have a "Bulk Barn" in your area they have yeast.


Unfortunately they don’t. It seems to be yeast is the new toilet paper in my city.


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## cainvest

Plugging Along said:


> Unfortunately they don’t. It seems to be yeast is the new toilet paper in my city.


Yup, all the young people did a run on bread, all the older people got flour and yeast.


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## Money172375

Some ideas for yeast here...never tried any.









Trying to bake your own bread? Here's how to make yeast at home


IF you wanted to make your own bread after supermarkets ran dry but don’t have all the ingredients, fear not as an expert has shared how to make your own yeast. It’s one of the key ingredients in a…




www.thesun.co.uk


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## newfoundlander61

I always look for the 50% discount salad kits.


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## Prairie Guy

If anyone has a bread maker lying around, most of them have a setting for pizza dough.


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## Plugging Along

Money172375 said:


> Some ideas for yeast here...never tried any.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Trying to bake your own bread? Here's how to make yeast at home
> 
> 
> IF you wanted to make your own bread after supermarkets ran dry but don’t have all the ingredients, fear not as an expert has shared how to make your own yeast. It’s one of the key ingredients in a…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.thesun.co.uk


I looked at that. I found some raisins, I may if it a try if I don’t find some yeast. I have found a baker who may be willing to sell me some fresh yeast. I actually worked with fresh yeast, but it’s got to be easier than making it from raisins.


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## Money172375

Lots of yeast at our local Food Basics. My son baked bread.


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## m3s

I learned you don't even need yeast for sourdough. Just daily mix of flour, water and time.

I'm now making this scallion pancake with discarded sourdough, fresh green onions from the backyard and some soy sauce

Downside of sourdough is I'm going through 1/2 cup of flour a day and have yet to make bread


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## Plugging Along

m3s said:


> I learned you don't even need yeast for sourdough. Just daily mix of flour, water and time.
> 
> I'm now making this scallion pancake with discarded sourdough, fresh green onions from the backyard and some soy sauce
> 
> Downside of sourdough is I'm going through 1/2 cup of flour a day and have yet to make bread


I have not been successful in getting starter without yeast. It’s the wrong humidity and temperature in my co. That’s why San Fran has the best sour dough is due to their humidity, and environment which is a breading ground for wile yeast. I didn’t want to waste my flour. The good news I managed to find a baker who willing to sell me a pound of yeast 

I think I am set on the bread front now. I have a bread machine so will use that to Rise my doughs and then I can bake in my oven. 

I have been trying to clear out my freezer to make room for my big shop. I have been hesitant to goto costco since is all starter, so my next big grrocery shop will be in about 2 weeks will be there. 

I have cleared the most rodnon things. I cleared out a large continues of home made cheese sauce and made Mac and cheese along woth random meatloaf slices I had. One good thing about not groccery shopping is I am finally clearing it my freezer and cupboards.


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## Plugging Along

For this last week, we have been clearing out freezer and cupboard stuff. Most really good a couple of meh.... for my frugal this week.


Made pizza last week using my bread machine, the dough didn't quite turn out well it wouldn't stretch for me, so was very dense and oddly shaped but it was a good other wise. I had no grate mozzarella but found some remain fresh mozzarella and cut off some fresh basil.
Did a virtual pub night, got rid of old fish in the freezer that I probably wouldn't eat any other way, but battered with home cut fries and home made tartar sauce with old pickles was amazing
Lots of noodle bowls putting the reminder of the fresh wilting veggies
Homemade butter chicken with random naan and flat breads found in the freezer and used up the last bit of almost old greek yogurt
Random dim sum lunch with things found in the freezer.

This weekend I am going to cook up a storm and bring some over to my dad who has been by himself for over almost a month.
-Making seafood chowder with random seafood I found in the freezer, no clams, so will have to improvise

Prime rib with frozen veggetables, canned cream corn, Yorkshire pudding, maybe cheddar biscuits
Going to try and make my own cinnamon buns, bagels, and bread this weekend.
I may attempt making my own yogurt but have chickened out for some unknown reason

I have been finding with self isolating at home, I am eating a lot more variety other than the fresh produce. 

What is every one else doing?


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## peterk

Made a good batch of beef stock yesterday in the instant pot. Beef bones were leftover scraps from steaks and grilling ribs that I've been piling up in the freezer for a couple months. Plus I added some onion skins (just the outside, so to not waste good onion). Total cost was $0 for ingredients, plus electricity.


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## Plugging Along

peterk said:


> Made a good batch of beef stock yesterday in the instant pot. Beef bones were leftover scraps from steaks and grilling ribs that I've been piling up in the freezer for a couple months. Plus I added some onion skins (just the outside, so to not waste good onion). Total cost was $0 for ingredients, plus electricity.


nice. Thanks the reminder about the skins. Another cheap hack is to throw in the washed carrot, peels, garlic engage, celery ends, any uneaten veggies that are too said to eat in a freezer bag and make either a veggie stock or add in with your stocks. Make sure peels are washed.


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## m3s

I don't know much about broth but I clicked on an ad for some hipster brand and it was like $10/carton. Might try making some

Got 20lbs of flour today on sale and it was almost sold out again. Never been so exited to find fresh flour..

Oh and our grocery stores have masked cops now and 1 way aisles


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## peterk

m3s said:


> *I don't know much about broth but I clicked on an ad for some hipster brand and it was like $10/carton. Might try making some*
> 
> Got 20lbs of flour today on sale and it was almost sold out again. Never been so exited to find fresh flour..
> 
> Oh and our grocery stores have *masked cops* now and 1 way aisles


What are the cops doing??

It's unlikely that even the fanciest store bought broth is actually "stock", i.e. made from meat and _bones _with the collagen extracted from the bones, turning your soup base into a near Jello state in the fridge.

Collagen is an expensive health supplement you can buy in powdered form, supposedly it is great for the bones, joints, hair, nails, and that we all don't consume enough collagen in our bone-less diets. 

Pure bone-only stocks though, made from carcasses cleared of all meat remnants, don't taste very good. Still has the collagen, but it needs the meat as well to develop full flavour and deep colour.


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## andrewf

Isn't meat full of collagen? I mean, isn't that what the intercellular matrix is made of?


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## Prairie Guy

We stocked up at the grocery store...I snagged 2 large striploin roasts (on sale) that will be cut into steaks. Cheese was also on sale and today we'll be making a dozen or so homemade pizzas and freezing them.


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## Plugging Along

m3s said:


> I don't know much about broth but I clicked on an ad for some hipster brand and it was like $10/carton. Might try making some
> Got 20lbs of flour today on sale and it was almost sold out again. Never been so exited to find fresh flour..


Bone broth has become really trendy. My coworker who follows all the hippest was sipping a bottle of organic bone broth bought from a high end health store. It' was $12 for the bottle. It looked like it had little bits of organic herbs. I have always made my own so I guess I was ahead of my time.

I can also see why flour is going to be a shortage. I normally go through a 20lb bag in about year. Since we started baking last weekend, I have already gone through a 1/4 of a bag. I am not much of a baker but my kids and I have found with us being home and our desire for treats, its been crazy. My kid asked next time I go grocery shopping to by a cake and cookies, I told her bake it. I think at this rate, I may grab two 20lb bags if I find them. 



Prairie Guy said:


> We stocked up at the grocery store...I snagged 2 large striploin roasts (on sale) that will be cut into steaks. Cheese was also on sale and today we'll be making a dozen or so homemade pizzas and freezing them.


Nice, do you freeze the pizzas all assembled, or just the dough. I am still trying to get my pizza dough right.


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## Prairie Guy

Plugging Along said:


> Nice, do you freeze the pizzas all assembled, or just the dough. I am still trying to get my pizza dough right.


We are making small individual pizzas so we are freezing the rolled out dough beforehand so that we can then add the toppings to a stiff crust to make it easier to put into a large freezer bag without collapsing. Other times we have just put a completed pizza in the freezer on the pan, but today we're making 12 - 15 and don't have enough pans.


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## cainvest

m3s said:


> Downside of sourdough is I'm going through 1/2 cup of flour a day and have yet to make bread


In the beginning you don't have to toss out half the starter but it does depend on the jar size you're using. On a sad note I may have killed my starter by using tap water (wasn't thinking) instead of filtered water. Guess I'll find out tomorrow if I killed it.


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## m3s

I was using filtered water to ferment kombucha at first, but I haven't noticed any difference using my tap water

My sourdough starter seems more active with fresh flour now. Temperature makes a huge difference though it could just be warmer


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## cainvest

Yup, having the right temp is a key factor and normally easier for me to do in the summer months.


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## Prairie Guy

We made 24 pizzas (about 11") and froze them. We didn't do an accurate cost analysis but they probably came in at $3 - $4 each. The good thing of course is that they are customized to our personal preferences.

No Frills had striploin roasts and sirloin tip roasts on sale. I bought one of each (1 per customer) and cut them into steaks.


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## Plugging Along

Nice, I tried to get the tenderloin on sale last weekend and the striploin. Both were sold out, and now I don't go shopping for two more weeks. I did buy some extra toppings for homemade pizza and will try it again this week. I have bought many cheese, pizza meats, pesto, etc. Can't wait to make some

I think I am doing something wrong with my dough, it doesn't stretch out. It just springs back like an elastic. I use my bread machine to make the dough, so it must be something in the final rolling piece I am doing wrong.


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## cainvest

Plugging Along said:


> I think I am doing something wrong with my dough, it doesn't stretch out. It just springs back like an elastic.


Let the dough rest for a bit after working it. If that's not enough then the bread machine may be over working it.


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## cainvest

Update on my sourdough ... coming along just fine. I split it into two containers at the last feeding as someone else wanted some starter. I'll test it out on Sunday to see if it's ready for bread making.


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## Plugging Along

Still haven't tried the start yet. I am still pretty busy and the idea of having something that I have to care and feed that aren't my children or spouse is not very appealing. Though I do see that the starter will feed me too. That being said, I have a ton of yeast right now, so have been cooking a lot still. Things I did over the last week:

Made a couple of pizza nights. I am still inconsistent as the same dough is giving me different results. I know that means it's how I am stretching it. I have been letting it rest (sort of) which has also shown me that I am impatient. I don't like waiting for specific times, as it's not my nature.
Made bagels again. They are getting better. Still inconsistent but less so. Again, it's because I am not waiting for the dough to loosen.
I used the buttermilk left over from the butter (which I still have) to make the most amazing brioche buns and loaf served that with tart cherry compote that I found an old bag of cherries I picked a few summers ago, and of course the butter.
I have been putting cold water with an ice cube in the butter jar, it's seems to keep it fresh
Have been eating noodle bowls or rice bowls using us random bits of leftovers and sad veggies
My spouse cooked some sausages and we opened up a can of beans and rice, what a cheap satisfying meal. I added a heavy wheat bread with it.

So far we have been eating better and cheaper (despite higher grocery prices) since this has started. I am guessing we are spreading about $30-40 a day in groceries for all of us which is quite the change when that's how much one meal per person would be in a restaurant. We are spending more on 'snacky' foods and almond milk because it's twice the price of regular milk but last longer.


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## Prairie Guy

Update to our homemade pizzas. We found that the best results were obtained when we cooked the rolled out dough first. After cooling we added the toppings and then froze them. Because the crust was already cooked they just had to be re-heated. But if you start with a frozen uncooked crust the toppings will be overdone by the time the crust is ready.


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