# Do you think vaccine passports is a good idea?



## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Interesting article in National Post








Why some say vaccine passports will be 'inevitable' for people who get COVID vaccinations in Canada


Some people have feared immunity documentation would lead to discrimination and exclusion, a world of the 'immunes' and 'non-immunes'




nationalpost.com





_COVID-19 vaccine certificates similar to the “green” passes that will allow fully vaccinated Israelis in and out of gyms, pools, concert stadiums and other leisure venues are inevitable in Canada, say researchers studying the “feasibility and acceptability” of immunity passports in Canada. _

Bunch of EU countries and UK are going to introduce similar passes...
Maybe it's too early for Canada, but interesting what is your opinion?


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Don't like them.
A few thoughts.








The scientific and ethical feasibility of immunity passports


There is much debate about the use of immunity passports in the response to the COVID-19 pandemic. Some have argued that immunity passports are unethical and impractical, pointing to uncertainties relating to COVID-19 immunity, issues with testing, perverse incentives, doubtful economic...



www.thelancet.com





Also they're likely unconstitutional, unless you think that the government has the right to regulate your body and inject substances into it at their whim.
Or deny your freedom of movement, unless you consent to such acts.

So no on 
1 Functional grounds, we're not sure it's going to work.
2. Implementation problems
3. Human rights.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

Your employer is going to "strongly" encourage you to get one if you're in the business of travelling. JMO.


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## Thal81 (Sep 5, 2017)

Seems like a great idea at first glance, but it's not because there are people who can't get vaccinated for legit reasons, and people who just don't want to (and you have to respect that).

So by issuing vaccine passports they'll create two classes of citizens with different privileges, and that will create resentment and social unrest. It's better to just tough out the restrictions until the infection numbers indicate we've reached "herd immunity".

However, if numbers don't go down because not enough people are willing to get vaccinated, the government will have to come up with a solution. I suggest something like a substantial refundable tax credit for vaccinated people since people respond well to money.


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## Ponderling (Mar 1, 2013)

My office is not yet reopened, but current policy is that when it does, you will need to provide roof you have been vaccinated before returning to work in the office. 

I'm ok with that - we have a very open concept layout, and about 280 people per floor. It would not take long for one sick person at work, and then everyone might take it home, and the outbreak would flare quickly from there.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Ponderling said:


> My office is not yet reopened, but current policy is that when it does, you will need to provide roof you have been vaccinated before returning to work in the office.
> 
> I'm ok with that - we have a very open concept layout, and about 280 people per floor. It would not take long for one sick person at work, and then everyone might take it home, and the outbreak would flare quickly from there.


Actually such policies for a long time exist in schools, kids should be fully vaccinated to attend it...



> So by issuing vaccine passports they'll create two classes of citizens with different privileges, and that will create resentment and social unrest. It's better to just tough out the restrictions until the infection numbers indicate we've reached "herd immunity".


 Nobody really knows when and if there will be "herd immunity" and in any case many countries are doing some kind of " full vaccination proof" for traveling purposes. For example UK and Greece ...
Whatever it's fair or not, every country can make their rules who to let in.. Currently, in order to visit practically any Caribbean country , you need to show doc that you tested negatively in last 3 to 7 days. Same thing will be with vaccination proof.
imho, Canada also need to let in foreign nationals who has such proof


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Who would verify the vaccination records are legitimate ?


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

sags said:


> Who would verify the vaccination records are legitimate ?


Same people who currently verify that your negative test results are legitimate ...


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

There are countries that require proof of certain vaccinations for entry right now. No reason why a Covid vaccine could not be noted in our passports.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Eder said:


> There are countries that require proof of certain vaccinations for entry right now. No reason why a Covid vaccine could not be noted in our passports.


There is a concern with having to provide medical records to travel.

It is generally held that personal medical records are private. In some cases they are very heavily protected.


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## Covariance (Oct 20, 2020)

Forecast: Canadian Government stays away from issuing a vaccine passport as long as possible yet mandates requirement for visitors to prove before entry.

Businesses, schools, entertainment venues introduce requirements for people to be vaccinated to gain access to their facilities. These organizations are, to varying degrees, highly motivated to put something in place that allows them to get back to normal. As such they rapidly deploy processes for customers to become accredited through a one time procedure with credentials added to the individuals smartphone app for said venue, company. Manual procedures will be established to deal with edge cases that are so laborious people succumb to minor invasion of privacy and get credentialed.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

MrMatt said:


> There is a concern with having to provide medical records to travel.
> 
> It is generally held that personal medical records are private. In some cases they are very heavily protected.


Medical and vaccination records are 2 different things.... When 20+ years ago we came to Canada, we should've prove that oyr son had all required in Canada vaccination in order to go to school and obviously no one was requesting his medical records


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

So there would be a central database to verify vaccinations, and venues would have to authenticate each person before entry ?

Sounds complicated and impractical.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

It would be funny (maybe a better word than "waste") that by the time we got things ironed out (passport or no passport requirements, accompanying logistics, etc.), the pandemic will be over.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

If it weren't for those Covid-cheats who went on vacation but tried to hide it by pretending to still be working from home, or those others who keep on trying to by-pass the authorities, I would have have said "no" a vaccination passport should not be required.

But those cheats ruined it for all the other travelers who really did need to do their personal business and now made it unaffordable for some people to return home.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

gibor365 said:


> Medical and vaccination records are 2 different things.... When 20+ years ago we came to Canada, we should've prove that oyr son had all required in Canada vaccination in order to go to school and obviously no one was requesting his medical records


Vaccinations are a medical intervention.
Vaccination records are medical records.

I'll leave it up to you to think about how much of your medical history is public knowledge, but I have concerns with any mandatory sharing of medical history.
We really need privacy rights in Canada.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

IMHO, official doc in your passport (for example like US Visa in your non-Canadian passport) that you are fully vaccinated is a good idea

_We really need privacy rights in Canada. - _this is on paper_ ..._imho, everyone who needs to know, know everything about you


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

gibor365 said:


> Do you think vaccine passports is a good idea?


Give me the vaccine and then I'll make a decision. Apparently, it's going to be a long wait.

ltr


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

like_to_retire said:


> Give me the vaccine and then I'll make a decision. Apparently, it's going to be a long wait.
> 
> ltr


No doubt  , this is why I wrote in the 1st post that it's may be too early for Canada ... LTC residents don't need any "green passports" as they don't live their LTC ...
Just was thinking if miracle is happens and we gonna get vaccines before 2022 ... we just want to go to travel anywhere in the World w/o current hassles ! We're so freaking tired to spend our lives n GTA


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## Juggernaut92 (Aug 9, 2020)

I am not a fan of vaccination passports but I did see this coming. 

@Ponderling : Are you in Canada? it is the first time I am hearing of a Canadian company doing that and making the vaccine mandatory for returning to work. It goes against some peoples beliefs/feelings but I don't blame businesses wanting to get back to normal. 

It will be interesting how this plays out. I was hoping that by the end of this year covid would be done but it does not seem like it.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

How do schools make it mandatory? Can you not be banned from school if not immunized? Or is that myth?


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## peterk (May 16, 2010)

There will be much talk about passports, and various other mandates and coercive language to convince as many people to get the vaccine as possible. Pressuring those who might not be interested in it (I'm not sure myself - I get all my vaccines, but I don't like this one) into complying with fear inducing tactics.

I suspect none of it will be followed through on with legislature or lasting corporate/social policy. It will just be an ongoing threat and news story over the next 12+ months to get the uptake rate from ~70% voluntary to 90+% "voluntary".

I suspect if you're a die-hard and willing to see it through, you can go about life un-vaccinated just fine after a brief period during year 2022 of being occasionally being denied some services or freedoms.


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## Ponderling (Mar 1, 2013)

I am in Canada, but I work for a big global engineering services company. We are about 54,000, I think, at last count


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Juggernaut92 said:


> It will be interesting how this plays out. I was hoping that by the end of this year covid would be done but it does not seem like it.


I was also hoping that it will die like SARS, but it does not seem like it. .... Or Chinese invented something of good quality or it's mother nature got pissed off. but looks like it will be on and off and no lockdowns gonna prevent it


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

> I get all my vaccines, but I don't like this one [/QIUOTE] I don't like it too ...and I never got any optional vaccines ...never got flu shot and never got flu ...(but I'd get Covid one ASAP simply because I want to travel


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

The way Canadians are trying to shame snowbirds show how those unvaccinated will be ostracized. If you're younger I don't see a problem not taking it, I wouldn't either. I'm near death so need it lol.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

Being vaccinated is not mandatory.
Being a snowbird is not mandatory either.
Neither being employed is mandatory.

To be or not to be ... vaccinated ... your choice.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Some people believe the fairy tales that Covid vaccine is once and done unlike the flu and common cold. How often do we need a booster?


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

^ Flu-shot is "once, annually". Don't know about the Covid-vaccine though. We can all pray and hope that it is once only. I certainly will so we can get those "special people=whiners" off our backs.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

We have a vaccination passport of sorts. It is an International Record of Vaccinations. A yellow booklet the size of a passport. Some countries require certain vaccinations so we do travel with them. About the size of a passport. All of the entries are hand written. Having said that, I cannot remember being asked for mine...even in some countries in Africa where vaccinations were required for entry.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Money172375 said:


> How do schools make it mandatory? Can you not be banned from school if not immunized? Or is that myth?


In Ontario it's a provincial law managed by the Health unit.

However it is important to note that you can simply opt out by saying you object to vaccines.
I was seriously considering opting out because the morons auditing didn't understand how a vaccine schedule works.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Money172375 said:


> How do schools make it mandatory? Can you not be banned from school if not immunized? Or is that myth?


When my kids attended school, we got a letter that if we don't bring vaccination proof by specific date (they had a list of required vaccines), our kids won't be allowed to attend school ... so we did all required vaccines...
btw, i don't understand why at least vaccination records aren't digitized.....we needed to drive to family doctor who entered all data manually


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

imho, some kind of "green passes" it's a good idea


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

gibor365 said:


> When my kids attended school, we got a letter that if we don't bring vaccination proof by specific date (they had a list of required vaccines), our kids won't be allowed to attend school ... so we did all required vaccines...
> btw, i don't understand why at least vaccination records aren't digitized.....we needed to drive to family doctor who entered all data manually


I’ve entered vaccine data myself online To our public health unit. Not sure how they monitor it, but it can be self -reported.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

gibor365 said:


> When my kids attended school, we got a letter that if we don't bring vaccination proof by specific date (they had a list of required vaccines), our kids won't be allowed to attend school ... so we did all required vaccines...
> btw, i don't understand why at least vaccination records aren't digitized.....we needed to drive to family doctor who entered all data manually


You’re in Peel No?



https://peel.icon.ehealthontario.ca/#!/welcome


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Money172375 said:


> You’re in Peel No?
> 
> 
> 
> https://peel.icon.ehealthontario.ca/#!/welcome


Probably it's something new... I remember very well that we need manual records from the doctor...
Also, it would be better if doctors' offices input vaccination data


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

gibor365 said:


> When my kids attended school, we got a letter that if we don't bring vaccination proof by specific date (they had a list of required vaccines), our kids won't be allowed to attend school ... so we did all required vaccines...
> btw, i don't understand why at least vaccination records aren't digitized.....we needed to drive to family doctor who entered all data manually


Because of the Liberal E-Health scandal, they're scared to tackle it.

Honestly it's an embarrassment, as many providers are on electronic health records already.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

gibor365 said:


> Probably it's something new... I remember very well that we need manual records from the doctor...
> Also, it would be better if doctors' offices input vaccination data


Doctors office? 
Do you realize many people don't have a doctor?


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

MrMatt said:


> Doctors office?
> Do you realize many people don't have a doctor?


Probably those should've go to walk-in clinic to get shots and manual record...


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

Urban thinking.

I never appreciated the doctor shortage until I left the city for a rural home. No doctor for the first 2 years and the walk-in clinics will only see you if your family doctor works there. For 2 years, we were not allowed to be seen at the clinic. Our hospital is full of non-emergencies who don’t have a doctor. We had to go to emergency to get a wart removed before we found a doctor. 

online virtual clinics are popping up now...at least you can get a simple script for minor issues.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Money172375 said:


> Urban thinking.
> 
> I never appreciated the doctor shortage until I left the city for a rural home. No doctor for the first 2 years and the walk-in clinics will only see you if your family doctor works there. For 2 years, we were not allowed to be seen at the clinic. Our hospital is full of non-emergencies who don’t have a doctor. We had to go to emergency to get a wart removed before we found a doctor.
> 
> online virtual clinics are popping up now...at least you can get a simple script for minor issues.


What can you say... OHIP is disaster (don't know what's going on in other provinces)... Was hoping Ford gonna re-organize OHIP, but looks like it's impossible..


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

Kinda related 









Health officials can’t provide data pointing to hotel quarantine decision


Public health officials testifying at the House of Commons health committee couldn’t point to the data used to determine how hotel quarantines will curb the spread of COVID-19 and its variants. Officials from the Public Health Agency of Canada (PHAC) were responding to questions posed by Tory...




ipolitics.ca





Quote of the day lol...

_*Rempel Garner twice asked PHAC officials to point to the data used to make these decisions at the Friday afternoon hearing.*_
*
“Anyone?” she furthered, when none of the six PHAC agents present at the meeting answered her question. 
*
_*“Is there anyone at PHAC that provided that advice?”*_


Man theres a bunch of dolts working at the federal level.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

MrMatt said:


> Doctors office?
> Do you realize many people don't have a doctor?


I found the same thing when I lived in the US by the way.

Many of my coworkers didn't have a doctor. They really could only go to walk-in clinics or urgent care... basically the same thing I did when I lived in Manitoba.

It was very difficult to find doctors in Oregon. I finally did find an absolutely amazing doctor, somewhat by luck. But getting an appointment was incredibly hard. Often he'd be booking many weeks out, even for urgent matters. And keep in mind you're also paying about $300 (out of pocket!) for each basic visit, plus several hundred dollars more for lab tests. *That's with insurance. *People don't realize that in the US, even when you have health insurance, you still pay out of pocket.

I got used to paying $300 to $500 for most doctor visits. That's just a cost of living in the United States. Not a problem for me, but disastrous for low income people.

One of my coworkers (this is the US) had a very unfortunate skin infection which turned out to be a serious staph infection. He was coming to the office every day with it. I suggested he goes to a doctor and he said he doesn't have one. He had been going to walk-in clinics but they had been failing to diagnose it properly. (I told him my own guess that it was a staph infection, which turned out to be the case)

In December, I emailed my previous US doctor to just say thank-you, told him he is the best doctor I have had in 20 years. He replied with "thanks" and told me he's retiring. Really sad to see him go. But that's what happens. These doctors who have become the best, through decades of experience, hit retirement age and then they're gone.

Just sharing this because as bad as our doctor situation is in Canada, I want people to know that it's not all rosy in the United States. For many people in the US, first you pay thousands of dollars out of pocket, and you STILL can't find a doctor.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Eder said:


> Kinda related
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Liberals just want to steal more money...it's called "Covid tax" LOL


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

james4beach said:


> I found the same thing when I lived in the US by the way.
> 
> Just sharing this because as bad as our doctor situation is in Canada, I want people to know that it's not all rosy in the United States. For many people in the US, first you pay thousands of dollars out of pocket, and you STILL can't find a doctor.


And here, in Milton Hospital , with broken leg, I was waiting 7! hours...in those 7 hours they measured my temperature, blood pressure and did X-ray (even though I had X-ray from Mississauga lab with me). After 7 hours I was told to come next day .
For MRI, me and my wife were waiting 4-6 months (in US it cost $600 w/o any insurance next day).
Maybe "it's not all rosy in the United States", I didn't have experience there (btw, in Israel it's 1000 times better ), but in Ontario this is disaster.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Eder said:


> Kinda related
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You really want to take the position that quarantines don't slow the spread of communicable diseases?
That's IMO just stupid.

Of course not having the data to support a government policy is stupid.
The fact that they don't have a report suggesting that quarantining returning travellers could help is just not being prepared.
This government is really acting like a dictatorship, not a democratic government, and definately not a minority government.


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

I think if you read the article you would see quarantining is not in question, it was asked where the science was to show how the hotel gulag was better than the already in place program Alberta was successfully running and has data on for 4 months. Of course none of the experts could explain as we all know its all punitive not preventative.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Eder said:


> I think if you read the article you would see quarantining is not in question, it was asked where the science was to show how the hotel gulag was better than the already in place program Alberta was successfully running and has data on for 4 months. Of course none of the experts could explain as we all know its all punitive not preventative.


I agree... What was bad in 14 days quarantine after arrival?! If government doesn't trust people, they can do spot checks and fine people who is going outside


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

I support vaccine passports for travel , public gatherings and events. Individual enterprises would be free to adopt such policies The are a number of reasons to support such measures. One of the main reasons is to get outliers and young people vaccinated. I realize there are civil liberties arguments but it seems public health has taken precedence over our individual liberties.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

gibor365 said:


> ... LTC residents don't need any "green passports" as they don't live their LTC ...


If you mean "don't leave their LTC", you may be in for a surprise.

Most LTC's I have visited more than one had residents leaving:
a) by scooter to go around the neighbourhood
b) by taxi or booked transit to go to restaurants, shopping or shows to meet up with friends
c) on the LTC's bus for events arranged by the LTC

And that's ignoring when family or friends took them out to visit parks, take them to a community event like Canada Day and whatever else was of interest.


I suspect it's similar in retirement homes as the neighbour across the street has been bringing her 90+ year old parents home to sit out in the sun, chat with neighbours etc. for over half of 2020 and has continued this in 2021.


Cheers


*PS*
One seventy seven year old my sister knew would take her walker to go to the docks to see the lake, the ferry traffic and the fishing vessels, on her own. One way was 1.6 km where she was back in time for meals/events.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

I just heard that Rutgers University is imposing proof of vaccination to attend classes in the fall. I think this is good news


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## :) lonewolf (Feb 9, 2020)

Who am I to think & judge ? If Nazi passports were good enough for Nazis its good enough for me. My brainwashing has been complete I have received the kill shot


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

zinfit said:


> I just heard that Rutgers University is imposing proof of vaccination to attend classes in the fall. I think this is good news


Except that's clearly a rights violation.

I think everyone should get vaccinated.

I do not think you should be forced to undergo a medical procedure to exercise your constitutional rights.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

:) lonewolf said:


> Who am I to think & judge ? If Nazi passports were good enough for Nazis its good enough for me. My brainwashing has been complete I have received the kill shot


No they don't force anything on you. It looks like you will have to do this if you want to travel to numerous international destinations. I guess you can declare war ion these other countries.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

MrMatt said:


> Except that's clearly a rights violation.
> 
> I think everyone should get vaccinated.
> 
> I do not think you should be forced to undergo a medical procedure to exercise your constitutional rights.


I guess the university has legal obligations to insure the students have a safe and healthy classroom environment. If the student doesn't want the vaccine they can complete their classes on-line.


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

Office Depots here in USA are laminating CDC vaccination cards for free...Hawaii will use them for test & quarantine free travel to Hawaii & between islands. There is talk of using them for concerts, football etc but receiving more push back on this.


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## :) lonewolf (Feb 9, 2020)

zinfit said:


> I guess the university has legal obligations to insure the students have a safe and healthy classroom environment. If the student doesn't want the vaccine they can complete their classes on-line.


Gates with his monopoly on world health has said something along the lines of it best to vaccinate everyone & lose 700,000 people from the vaccines. The lawyers are going to love this one with the wrongful death suits against those that make vaccine passports mandatory. If you cant go after they drug pushers since they were granted immunity go after those that make it mandatory.

This game can go the other way so those that are vaccinated will be denied entry ? vaccines in the past have made people more susceptible to a virus or other viruses. This is not a vaccine since it does not contain a piece of the virus. It is a genetic cocktail that has not been fully tested & the results made public.

Locking down the healthy in the last 6000 years has never happened until our mafia world health system has made it happen. The world is to big to control for long the world health mafia will fail. The cycle will go back the other direction & people will realize it makes no sense to lock down the healthy.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

zinfit said:


> I guess the university has legal obligations to insure the students have a safe and healthy classroom environment. If the student doesn't want the vaccine they can complete their classes on-line.


You shouldn't have to submit to a medical procedure to exercise your constitutional rights. The courts have already ruled nurses are not required to get vaccinations, or wear masks to do their job.
If they aren't required to take those actions, to stop the spread of infectious diesease, the idea that you, as a private citizen should have to is ridiculous.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

:) lonewolf said:


> Gates with his monopoly on world health has said something along the lines of it best to vaccinate everyone & lose 700,000 people from the vaccines. The lawyers are going to love this one with the wrongful death suits against those that make vaccine passports mandatory. If you cant go after they drug pushers since they were granted immunity go after those that make it mandatory.
> 
> This game can go the other way so those that are vaccinated will be denied entry ? vaccines in the past have made people more susceptible to a virus or other viruses. This is not a vaccine since it does not contain a piece of the virus. It is a genetic cocktail that has not been fully tested & the results made public.
> 
> Locking down the healthy in the last 6000 years has never happened until our mafia world health system has made it happen. The world is to big to control for long the world health mafia will fail. The cycle will go back the other direction & people will realize it makes no sense to lock down the healthy.


go find some Russian sites who are great a creating conspiracy theories. You would improve your inventory of conspiracy stories if you did this. Good luck I think you need some fresh material.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

zinfit said:


> go find some Russian sites who are great a creating conspiracy theories. You would improve your inventory of conspiracy stories if you did this. Good luck I think you need some fresh material.


Are you refering to me?
I'm in favour of vaccination, I think it's silly to not get vaccinated.
I also think your body your choice, and consent is required for all medical procedures.

If someone pressures you into a medical procedure, that you don't want, that isn't consent.

There is no conspiracy, other than a belief in human rights.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

MrMatt said:


> Are you refering to me?
> I'm in favour of vaccination, I think it's silly to not get vaccinated.
> I also think your body your choice, and consent is required for all medical procedures.
> 
> ...


The lonewolf not you..by any means


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

zinfit said:


> The lonewolf not you..by any means


Ignore feature is great. Lonewolf adds zero value for me.


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## milhouse (Nov 16, 2016)

MrMatt said:


> You shouldn't have to submit to a medical procedure to exercise your constitutional rights. The courts have already ruled nurses are not required to get vaccinations, or wear masks to do their job.
> If they aren't required to take those actions, to stop the spread of infectious diesease, the idea that you, as a private citizen should have to is ridiculous.


Are you sure the *courts* have ruled on the health authorities requiring nurses to get the flu vaccination or wear a mask? I thought that was the case too, that nurses didn't have to get the flu shot, but did a quick search and didn't find any supporting info on a court decision.
Instead, I found this article by Howard Levitt the employment law lawyer in Dec 2020 says the issue was addressed via *arbitration* that isn't binding on other arbitrations let alone courts. He actually thinks employers will be able to make vaccinations required depending on the nature of their work with exceptions made for religion and disability.
And in this article by CBC in Dec 2019, it mentioned the agreement that nurses in BC came to where they didn't have to get the flu shot or wear a mask but still has to report to their employer if they had a flu shot or not. So, they're giving up a measure of their privacy.

EDIT: And I concede I don't fully understand the practical differences between litigation vs arbitration. So if one of the legal minds on the board want to help weigh in, that would be handy.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

milhouse said:


> Are you sure the *courts* have ruled on the health authorities requiring nurses to get the flu vaccination or wear a mask? I thought that was the case too, that nurses didn't have to get the flu shot, but did a quick search and didn't find any supporting info on a court decision.
> Instead, I found this article by Howard Levitt the employment law lawyer in Dec 2020 says the issue was addressed via *arbitration* that isn't binding on other arbitrations let alone courts. He actually thinks employers will be able to make vaccinations required depending on the nature of their work with exceptions made for religion and disability.
> And in this article by CBC in Dec 2019, it mentioned the agreement that nurses in BC came to where they didn't have to get the flu shot or wear a mask but still has to report to their employer if they had a flu shot or not. So, they're giving up a measure of their privacy.
> 
> EDIT: And I concede I don't fully understand the practical differences between litigation vs arbitration. So if one of the legal minds on the board want to help weigh in, that would be handy.


The article I read said court decision, however it seems to be an arbitration hearing. Again, bad reporting.. 

Not a lawyer, but I believe for the parties involved an arbitration ruling is very similar to a court decision, but it isn't a court ruling.
That being said, we have a very very bad way to address conflicts in human rights in Canada.
IMO the Ontario Human rights tribunals are an excellent example.


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## :) lonewolf (Feb 9, 2020)

zinfit said:


> . Individual enterprises would be free to adopt such policies The are a number of reasons to support such measures.


If you are required to get vaccinated for your job & the none FDA approved genetic cocktail kills you or makes you sick it is a work related. The drug dealers have been granted immunity the employers have not been.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

MrMatt said:


> There is a concern with having to provide medical records to travel.
> 
> It is generally held that personal medical records are private. In some cases they are very heavily protected.


Not when you enter other countries. Years ago people carry a vaccine card which was necessary to travel into certain countries. Covid has interfered in many rights and freedoms. At large gatherings like a football game it seems to make immense sense.


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## Retiredguy (Jul 24, 2013)

Federal court in Texas ruled in favour of a hospital firing employees who fail to get vaccinated. Obviously appeals and higher court rulings will follow but an interesting first ruling.


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## damian13ster (Apr 19, 2021)

You got link to the ruling?
I find it particularly interesting considering it is illegal to promote, let alone mandate, any medicinal product that is under Emergency Use Authorization. Once vaccine is fully approved (from each specific company), then it can be legally mandated. At least that is what is written in the law, but I guess it can be interpreted differently, hence why I would love to see the decision.


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## Retiredguy (Jul 24, 2013)

Judge dismisses lawsuit by Houston hospital employees over Covid-19 vaccinations


The lead plaintiff, Jennifer Bridges, likened her employer's vaccination requirement to forced medical experimentation during the Holocaust.




www-nbcnews-com.cdn.ampproject.org


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## damian13ster (Apr 19, 2021)

Interesting use of employment at will argument.


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