# High net worth customer shopping for a new bank



## larry81

I am in the process of transfering my asset over at a new bank. I made it clear that i dont want to buy investment from them, i am already dealing with their brokerage branch and very pleased. I would like some example of perks i could ask :

- Their top CC ?
- Waive fee on bank account ?
- Annual meeting with their investment advisor (for free) ?
- Safety deposit box ?
- Prefered rate on personal line of credit ?

any idea ?


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## marina628

We get all these things at TD bank just for keeping $5000 in our select service account...We bank at a small Branch and everyone knows us and probably our net worth .IMO if you build a good relationship with the staff you will get the perks ,we get free Tim Horton's cards all the time from our branch lol


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## larry81

marina628 said:


> We get all these things at TD bank just for keeping $5000 in our select service account...We bank at a small Branch and everyone knows us and probably our net worth .IMO if you build a good relationship with the staff you will get the perks ,we get free Tim Horton's cards all the time from our branch lol


Do you also have a business account with TD marina ? If yes, wich one 

I want to consolidate all my account. I saw the TD Select and it look very good

Also, i would like a personal line of credit, TD currently offer 3%, is this rate negociable ?


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## Jon_Snow

TD Select Service account is excellent. Something tells me that you won't have trouble keeping a 5k minimum balance in there, Larry.


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## marina628

Larry ,
We deal almost exclusively with TD Bank and been at our current Branch about 5 years.We have kids RESP , Our TFSA ,RRSP ,Mutual funds and web broker accounts.We also have Small Business and a Commercial Business account and Business Credit Lines there.But I must say before we transferred the Business accounts in 2007 and only had the personal accounts we were treated just as well.I think the bank managers have a discretionary amount they can discount for case by case clients.We pay 3% on our credit lines , they will give a discount if you want to lock up security for a year .We do not require large credit for our business so we do have a 2.5% credit line for $35,000 and we have a GIC for same amount the hold ,I guess in old days they called it demand loans.


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## the-royal-mail

I am with RBC and you can probably achieve most of those things but maybe not all. I believe if you have three of their products they will wave the basic account fee. I have TFSA, RRSP, bank account and two of their no-fee credit cards. This means I get a free basic account (fees refunded).

The CCs I have are not their top of the line ones but they're both gold versions and are quite useful. If points and travel perks are your aim you might be better off with other rewards cards such as air miles, hilton honours etc anyway.

My LOC rate is prime plus around 3% I believe. I was able to negotiate this down by only 1/3rd of a % if memory serves.

Investment advisors? Those are mutual fund salesmen, are they not? I do have a personal account rep at my local branch who seems to be a good point of contact and I can call him up anytime to talk about most things. Very handy. He'll be happy to discuss MFs with me or meet with me anytime to discuss finances, MFs, different types of accounts etc etc. Would that work for you?

I don't think I can negotiate for a free safety deposit box. That one you'll like have to pay for on your own.


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## Oldroe

With banks it's NO for fees and I WANT LESS for interest. Everything is negotiable.

You need good credit rating and lot's of business at the bank.


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## marina628

you get a free SMALL safety deposit box with the select service account but we got a bigger one for no fee.I think it was just $55 difference in price for the year.I know the advisor service you are speaking of and the branch has offered to put us in touch with one of their people outside of the branch ,Years ago we did but I am committed to learning DIY so have not bothered .I think he comes to the branch for appointments a couple times a month ,probably same for your branch.All these things are reasonable so why not just ask your branch for them lol


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## larry81

marina628 said:


> you get a free SMALL safety deposit box with the select service account but we got a bigger one for no fee.I think it was just $55 difference in price for the year.I know the advisor service you are speaking of and the branch has offered to put us in touch with one of their people outside of the branch ,Years ago we did but I am committed to learning DIY so have not bothered .I think he comes to the branch for appointments a couple times a month ,probably same for your branch.All these things are reasonable so why not just ask your branch for them lol


Already did ! But you know it is, always trying to squeeze more at my advantage 

My current bank put a 5 day hold on anything over 20k on my monthly deposit. They are just generally lame, the uneducated small business rep change every 6 months or so, they wont call back, etc.

I am highly satisfed with TDWH, got a president account over there and everything is perfect. I really hope their bank division on par with the quality i see at TDWH.


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## larry81

marina, can you pay your business tax bill online with TD ?


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## marina628

Larry you can set up everything online ,here is the link http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/esrvc-srvce/tx/mypymnt/menu-eng.html


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## larry81

marina628 said:


> Larry you can set up everything online ,here is the link http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/esrvc-srvce/tx/mypymnt/menu-eng.html


You can use My Payment if you have an online banking account at the following financial institutions that currently participate in Interac Online:

BMO Bank of Montreal (personal accounts only)
Scotiabank
RBC Royal Bank
*TD Canada Trust*

AMEN !!!


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## marina628

Yes I pay all my biz stuff via TD.


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## Jon_Snow

Larry, how does one get a President Account at TDW? I assume you need a certain net worth to qualify...


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## petea4

Jon_Snow said:


> Larry, how does one get a President Account at TDW? I assume you need a certain net worth to qualify...


500k in your investment accounts like, brokerage, RSP, TFSA. One time shot. Once at 500, call in to upgrade to a presidents account, and it will stay that way forever even if your value drops to 50k. 



marina628 said:


> We get all these things at TD bank just for keeping $5000 in our select service account...We bank at a small Branch and everyone knows us and probably our net worth .IMO if you build a good relationship with the staff you will get the perks ,we get free Tim Horton's cards all the time from our branch lol


Same here. The Select Service account offers all I need. Pretty happy with them, but I don't get a Tim's card! Just the free coffee/juice/cookies up front.


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## Jon_Snow

Thanks Petea4... once my GIC's mature and I get that cash into TDW, I will be close to the 500k threshold. I suppose I will upgrade to the President Account, although on first glance the perks don't seem mind blowing.


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## Causalien

I ditched RBC, BMO and scotia for TD

Then they bought the credit card company I use, two of my brokerages and gave me a lot of great thing. They also make sure to have at least one hot chick at the teller for eye candy at all time.

It took me a year to get the safety deposit box though. There's a huge waiting list.


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## larry81

Jon_Snow said:


> Thanks Petea4... once my GIC's mature and I get that cash into TDW, I will be close to the 500k threshold. I suppose I will upgrade to the President Account, although on first glance the perks don't seem mind blowing.


Edit: I just called them to get a the details of "president account" perks. The rep informed me that there different level of president account, the >500k one is "diamond", its the highest rated. The perks are:

- Dedicated president account phone line
- Better interest rate on margin account
- Real time quote in WebBroker (they call it "streaming quote")
- Invitation to TDWH VIP events (ex: wine and cheese)
- Possibility of early participation in somestocks (ex: IPO)
- You can get a debit card to cash out money directly from your TDWH account (on demand only)
- Better looking statement send automatically in February
- All administration fee's are waived
- Holding a President account will make you feel warm and fuzzy on the inside !


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## Jungle

Causalien said:


> It took me a year to get the safety deposit box though. There's a huge waiting list.


A lot of people were on waiting lists the safety box, however, a co-worker of just got one no problem, td branch in Scarborough. He lots are available. 

TD had, or has, a recent promo where if you switch to select service, they give you $250. Not sure if it's over now. 

The only reason I don't like select service, is because you must keep $5000K earning no interest.


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## Jungle

So you only need $500K for free cheese and wine events? Sounds like my kind of party!


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## larry81

Jungle said:


> So you only need $500K for free cheese and wine events? Sounds like my kind of party!


It's probably a trap to get investors into their private wealth management


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## m3s

larry81 said:


> Edit: I just called them to get a the details of "president account" perks. The rep informed me that there different level of president account, the >500k one is "diamond", its the highest rated. The perks are:
> 
> - Dedicated president account phone line
> - Better interest rate on margin account
> - Real time quote in WebBroker (they call it "streaming quote")
> - Invitation to TDWH VIP events (ex: wine and cheese)
> - Possibility of early participation in somestocks (ex: IPO)
> - You can get a debit card to cash out money directly from your TDWH account (on demand only)
> - Better looking statement send automatically in February
> - All administration fee's are waived
> - Holding a President account will make you feel warm and fuzzy on the inside !


Based the on "preferred rates" I've see from TD, I'd be surprised if that "better interest rate" comes anywhere to close to margin rates certain competition offers to regular joes

I wonder if they send "better looking" online statements as well? (I don't like to waste trees ) Since people always claim TD has the best looking tellers, I wonder if the "diamond" account "better looking" tellers to match the statements? I bet they imported them all in from Brazil, Scandanavia, Eastern Europe and Québec 

It's all about the warm and fuzzy!


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## Eder

Hmm, I might have to look into TD. My CIBC is nothing special even though I have 7 figures in there...I opened a RBC account,,,,couldnt even get free checking after asking.
I like free sh*t.


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## Jungle

PC finanical, ING = free. 

You can have 0 figures. lol


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## larry81

Eder said:


> Hmm, I might have to look into TD. My CIBC is nothing special even though I have 7 figures in there...I opened a RBC account,,,,couldnt even get free checking after asking.
> I like free sh*t.


CIBC is probably THE worst bank in Canada.


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## Addy

Jungle said:


> The only reason I don't like select service, is because you must keep $5000K earning no interest.


It's not for everyone thats for sure. We had to weight the pros and cons. For us, we already were paying the annual fee for two Infinite Travel Visas (which we never pay interest on and we get at least $1K/yr in free travel... and I like that you can use it just like cash) so for us that was a big plus. I can't remember the annual fees but I think it was $240 or so (going by memory, I could be way off). My husband wanted a US CC which the Select Service account includes, which I think is a $39/yr "value". Then there were things that were nice but not really anything we would pay to have, ie the free cheques which can be a bonus, but we already get free cheques with TD, free security box, bonus % on US money, and a few other little things I forget.

That, vs 2.5% interest we make on our HISA made it worth it when we crunched the numbers, but if interest rates go up we will consider moving our $5K into a HISA and just paying for the TD Travel Visa's.

Another thing to consider is the interest you earn is taxable.... while the benefits from the Select Service (ie for us, saving the annual fees) are not taxable as far as I know.


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## larry81

Any existing TD Select client can give a quick pro/con of their top card, Infinite Travel vs Elite Gold ???


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## Jungle

CIBC EPS % growth in the last five years is beating their big brothers. They didn't have to write off losses in the US.


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## m3s

larry81 said:


> Any existing TD Select client can give a quick pro/con of their top card, Infinite Travel vs Elite Gold ???


I have Select Service but I use the free Smart Cash before the Infinite Travel. It's hard to imagine someone who travels more than I do but I'm just tired of redeeming rewards. Because Smart Cash charges 2.5% exchange and pays back 1-3% cash, it's about the same as using the US credit card (not sure if the US cc has the same plat benefits?)

I'm underwhelmed by Select Service, but in these markets I don't have much else to do with the cash anyways. The preferred rates are a joke and they still charge for things like receiving wire transfers etc (it's Not all inclusive) You could invest $5k in dividends and potentially earn far more as they increased


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## marina628

Jungle 
By keeping the $5000 there I am saving $300+ a year which in my eyes is like getting 6% on my 5k


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## Jon_Snow

marina628 said:


> Jungle
> By keeping the $5000 there I am saving $300+ a year which in my eyes is like getting 6% on my 5k


Bingo.


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## Jungle

True and you do have more banking needs than us right now.


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## Jungle

Addy said:


> It's not for everyone thats for sure. We had to weight the pros and cons. For us, we already were paying the annual fee for two Infinite Travel Visas (which we never pay interest on and we get at least $1K/yr in free travel... and I like that you can use it just like cash) so for us that was a big plus. I can't remember the annual fees but I think it was $240 or so (going by memory, I could be way off). My husband wanted a US CC which the Select Service account includes, which I think is a $39/yr "value". Then there were things that were nice but not really anything we would pay to have, ie the free cheques which can be a bonus, but we already get free cheques with TD, free security box, bonus % on US money, and a few other little things I forget.
> 
> That, vs 2.5% interest we make on our HISA made it worth it when we crunched the numbers, but if interest rates go up we will consider moving our $5K into a HISA and just paying for the TD Travel Visa's.
> 
> Another thing to consider is the interest you earn is taxable.... while the benefits from the Select Service (ie for us, saving the annual fees) are not taxable as far as I know.


Good write up.. didn't know you were a guuurl either. There's a lot of rich ladies here on the boards now a days.


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## Plugging Along

We've liked our TD Select account the most. We've been with CIBC, RBC, BMO, and just weren't very happy. 

We do find the TD business account is really expensive for what we use, so we've just moved to HSBC because their business account is free.


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## larry81

Plugging Along said:


> We've liked our TD Select account the most. We've been with CIBC, RBC, BMO, and just weren't very happy.
> 
> We do find the TD business account is really expensive for what we use, so we've just moved to HSBC because their business account is free.


From what i have read, if you keep 8k in the business account the fee's are waived


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## ddkay

Where can I keep my 10 figure networth safe from the leveraged banking system? http://www.pictet.com/


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## Plugging Along

larry81 said:


> From what i have read, if you keep 8k in the business account the fee's are waived


They still charged us fees, we have had well over $8 k and found there were still fees. So we're actually in the process of moving, which is ashame because we have our regular accounts there and really like them.


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## andrewf

> Jungle
> By keeping the $5000 there I am saving $300+ a year which in my eyes is like getting 6% on my 5k


I think this only applies if your next best option is to pay $300+ on fees. I expect that you could also use a no or low-fee banking service that doesn't require a minimum balance.

So the right way to think about it is that your 'free' banking costs the minimum balance required * the rate you could get on a HISA. So, $5,000*2%=$100 per year.


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## m3s

andrewf said:


> I think this only applies if your next best option is to pay $300+ on fees. I expect that you could also use a no or low-fee banking service that doesn't require a minimum balance.
> 
> So the right way to think about it is that your 'free' banking costs the minimum balance required * the rate you could get on a HISA. So, $5,000*2%=$100 per year.


I agree that opportunity cost is a better way to value Select Service however I don't think most people who use it would actually leave that $5k in a 2% HISA. It doesn't count as emergency fund because it would cost $30 for 1-30 days whereas a $5k LOC for 30 days costs 1/2 of that, or 1/8 for a week etc. Therefore HISA and LOC both make better emergency funds because they are cheaper and calculated daily vs monthly. The $30 fee is like an overdraft fee if you happen to spend too much, so really the opportunity cost is on $5500 or $6k.

Anyone who has Select Service can afford a LOC and also probably has investments. If their LOC is already maxed, they should put the $6k on it instead and use free banking anyways. That $6k is locked in long term not as liquid as a HISA or LOC. A better comparison would be a $6k of dividend shares. Dividends go up, earning exponentially more over time. Therefore the opportunity cost of Select Service goes up exponentially over time IMO. That "$100" savings could become "$1000" of dividends over time. Depends how many of those free drafts you need I guess


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## MoMoney

larry81 said:


> Edit: I just called them to get a the details of "president account" perks. The rep informed me that there different level of president account, the >500k one is "diamond", its the highest rated. The perks are


Diamond is 5Mil
Platinum is 2Mil
Gold is 1Mil
Standard is 500K


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## larry81

MoMoney said:


> Diamond is 5Mil
> Platinum is 2Mil
> Gold is 1Mil
> Standard is 500K


Err, i as misinformed !

Do you have any idea what perks the higher level give ?


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## MoMoney

larry81 said:


> Err, i as misinformed !
> 
> Do you have any idea what perks the higher level give ?



Discounted commissions is the only standout one to DIY investors.


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## humble_pie

commish at 7.00

margin at prime or less.

very nice range of free USD & CAD banking services.
tdw dispatches a liveried footman to pick up & deliver any offline banking that the diamond needs done.

(signed)
plain granola pie

first the age of gold.
then the age of iron.
now it's the age of granola.


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## marina628

For what we use we can justify the Select Service account ,we use all the services that they give for free and the safety deposit box as well.Also I use a high number of transactions , this is our main checking account and with 5 investments properties at end of the month loads of transactions.One time when i did not have 5k in the account i had 81.00 in service fees.Since then I won't do that again.
As for the business account we have usually low - mid $xx,xxx float in our business account and always pay the bank fees.


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## Cal

I believe you can....I can pay my personal taxes, property taxes etc... online through their site.

Also...CC fees will be waived...not sure where you fit in, but I just had to ask them to waive the fees for the travel visa's.


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## larry81

humble_pie said:


> commish at 7.00


having 5M+ with TDWH get you a 2.99$ rebate on comm, I CANT WAIT !


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## m3s

marina628 said:


> For what we use we can justify the Select Service account ,we use all the services that they give for free and the safety deposit box as well.Also I use a high number of transactions , this is our main checking account and with 5 investments properties at end of the month loads of transactions.One time when i did not have 5k in the account i had 81.00 in service fees.Since then I won't do that again.
> As for the business account we have usually low - mid $xx,xxx float in our business account and always pay the bank fees.


Isn't it just $30 if you go below $5k though? I had $70 bank fees when I was younger and using a debit card everywhere. Heck, I had a extra $30 fee last month for receiving an international wire and I had the darn $5k in there. You could run those transactions through a LOC and CC instead. But anyways, if SS is for anyone it's for someone like you. I guess it's small change to millionaires but bank fees just don't compound and grow like investments


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## larry81

Just found out that a TD president account also give access to 'special' research through WebBroker:



> As a President's Account member, you can now enjoy four premium market reports prepared specifically for active and high net-worth investors by the TD Waterhouse Portfolio Advice and Investment Research team.
> 
> Available by clicking the 'Reports' tab in our Markets & Research site, these reports offer exclusive insights on the markets and include:
> 
> * Before The Open - highlights of overnight market activity
> * Weekly Insights - ideas and analysis for the previous week
> * Monthly Perspectives - commentary and analysis with a longer-term focus
> * Monthly Income Report - analysis for income-oriented investors


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## larry81

Behold:


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## larry81

the-royal-mail said:


> Investment advisors? Those are mutual fund salesmen, are they not? I do have a personal account rep at my local branch who seems to be a good point of contact and I can call him up anytime to talk about most things. Very handy. He'll be happy to discuss MFs with me or meet with me anytime to discuss finances, MFs, different types of accounts etc etc. Would that work for you?


I specifically asked not to be dealing with MF salesman. They forwarded me to a broker from their private wealth management division, he agreed to do one or two meeting each year. Not sure what he is worth but he is doing it for free, even after i told him i did not want full service brokerage or transfer any assets to private management


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## marina628

If you have the 5k in there you do not pay other bank fee charges , that is where my husband tends to get in trouble lol.Anyway I do feel it is a good deal for myself and my circumstances.


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## Addy

marina628 said:


> For what we use we can justify the Select Service account ,we use all the services that they give for free and the safety deposit box as well.Also I use a high number of transactions , this is our main checking account and with 5 investments properties at end of the month loads of transactions.One time when i did not have 5k in the account i had 81.00 in service fees.Since then I won't do that again.
> As for the business account we have usually low - mid $xx,xxx float in our business account and always pay the bank fees.


Marina if you're interested, you can ask them to put a $5K Manager hold on the account, this is what we did. It's essentially locking in the 5K so you don't go under. Only a manager can take the hold off. I guess that can cost you in NSF charges though if you're not careful... but I bet one or two or maybe three NSF charges is cheaper than $81 in fees!


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## marina628

Addy
I use quicken and reconcile my bank statements so no chance of NSF , plus online 16 hours a day lol.It was My husband's use of his debit and ATM all the time that sometimes put me below the $5000.About 3 months ago I started sending him to the bank once a week to get cash for the week and got him using his credit card for gas etc , finally my budgets stay balanced.BTW today i went to my bank and they had free cheese and fruit and I did not need 500k in the bank


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## Oilers82

larry81 said:


> From what i have read, if you keep 8k in the business account the fee's are waived


Larry I'm looking into TD business accounts now too. I have Select Service for myself and my wife, as well as our TDW accounts.

$8k is fees waived for the lowest transaction #'s. (I believe its 12/month). If you need more than that, you need higher balances to get your fees waived. That's what I'm aware of so far.


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## larry81

Oilers82 said:


> Larry I'm looking into TD business accounts now too. I have Select Service for myself and my wife, as well as our TDW accounts.
> 
> $8k is fees waived for the lowest transaction #'s. (I believe its 12/month). If you need more than that, you need higher balances to get your fees waived. That's what I'm aware of so far.


I do >12 transactions, i worked hard to optimise the billing part of my business.


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## larry81

marina628 said:


> Addy
> I use quicken and reconcile my bank statements so no chance of NSF , plus online 16 hours a day lol.


Same thing here


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## marina628

What kills us is the amount of wires we do in a month ,even in the commercial account when we have about $100,000 sitting we still have to pay the $40 monthly fee for that clicky thing to send wires from the office .But to be honest I have not asked the bank manager to do anything on our business accounts ,it is only at year end when i see what we pay for the year I even think about the fees.Maybe I will say I am a friend of Larry ,he seems to own the bank anyway lol


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## Oilers82

Here's the breakdown of small business fees. So basic account is $15/month with 15 transactions included, waived if $8k min balance. The amount required to waive the fees goes up, as do the fees themselves as you require more transactions.

http://www.tdcanadatrust.com/products-services/small-business/serv-plans.jsp


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## m3s

marina628 said:


> What kills us is the amount of wires we do in a month ,even in the commercial account when we have about $100,000 sitting we still have to pay the $40 monthly fee for that clicky thing to send wires from the office .


Yea wire transfers should be cheaper. They are regulated to be cheap in the EU so that is what everyone uses for private transactions. Why should it cost $25-50 to make an electronic transfer in this day and age?.. I haven't seen any min balance games here either


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## Causalien

Are there any difference between standard president's account and gold president account besides the commission?


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## humble_pie

waiting to serve your banking needs
the Green Footman
for diamonds only
polished or in the rough


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## andrewf

I'm puzzled why you bank treats you like garbage, marina. I'm further puzzled why you put up with it. If they want to charge you fees, you should call your manager and tell them to stuff it if they want to keep your business. You are a nice profitable customer for them, why the heck are they nickel and diming you on account fees?


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## Ihatetaxes

I'm part of RBC's Royal Circle. Not too sure of the benefits, only thing I use is a dedicated phone line that pretty much eliminates sitting on hold. I also pay no fees for the RBC VIP banking program. It is supposed to cost $30/month and covers all bank fees, an Avion Visa card, deposit box, etc.


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## marina628

Andrew I have not asked them on the business accounts , I do not pay fees on personal accounts and honestly I am VERY happy with my bank.They come to my house to bring docs when i need to sign stuff.Paying a service fee IMO does not mean they treat me like garbage.I need the write offs anyway


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## yyzvoyageur

HSBC Premier offers no-fee accounts and a no-fee credit card (their top tier, though you can get better within the Canadian marketplace). Having Premier has allowed me to open accounts and obtain a credit card in both the US and Hong Kong, free of charge. Transfers between those global accounts are instantaneous and cheap. Their discount brokerage, while not having the prettiest website, works well with $6.88/trade commissions for Premier clients. Due to their limited branch network, they also refund the $1.50 convenience fee charged by other banks for withdrawals at non-HSBC cash machines. To qualify for Premier, one needs to hold $100 000 with HSBC in Canada (funds held with their discount brokerage included).


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## yyzvoyageur

Ihatetaxes said:


> I'm part of RBC's Royal Circle. Not too sure of the benefits, only thing I use is a dedicated phone line that pretty much eliminates sitting on hold. I also pay no fees for the RBC VIP banking program. It is supposed to cost $30/month and covers all bank fees, an Avion Visa card, deposit box, etc.


What do you pay for equity trades?


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## Ihatetaxes

$9.95


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## larry81

Finally opened my accounts at TD.

They mixed up the info... i need to call them back monday morning.

Same old same old BLEH!


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## larry81

Anyone used the 'new' TD expedia website ?

I have a trip to book and since i now have their top tier infinite travel card, the deals look interesting


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## larry81

Been with td for a couple weeks now, here a few quick impressions:

- The basic bank rep are retarded (same level as my old bank)
- The phone support is very good for basic operation, utter **** for complex one
- In general, they have better products than RBC, CIBC, etc.
- Everything is negotiable (rate, credit card fee, etc).
- It pay to meet with your local branch manager when you open your account and tell them that you want to "establish a relationship"
- If you make enough noise, they will take care of you
- There no communication between TDWH and TD Bank.

So far, i would say i am satisfied


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## kcowan

larry81 said:


> - There no communication between TDWH and TD Bank.


They will offer to authorize documents required to add RESP beneficiaries at any TD branch and communicate it to TDW electronically.


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## Square Root

Jungle said:


> CIBC EPS % growth in the last five years is beating their big brothers. They didn't have to write off losses in the US.


 They wrote off $10 billion due to the financial crises. Other banks: RY-$4billion, BMO- $2 billion, BNS- $2bilion, TD $700 million. CM had huge US related write offs in the late 90's/early 00's. Known as the bank that couldn't shoot straight in the industry. Also, the only bank stock I don't own. Agree they have done better recently- strategy seems to be " shrinking their way to glory" CIBC retail bank has a lot of work to do.


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## Square Root

mode3sour said:


> Yea wire transfers should be cheaper. They are regulated to be cheap in the EU so that is what everyone uses for private transactions. Why should it cost $25-50 to make an electronic transfer in this day and age?.. I haven't seen any min balance games here either


Agree. A pet peeve with me also. I think it is because wir transfers are manually intensive plus they think people making wire transfers are price insensitive and probably fairly well off.


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## kcowan

We contemplated a wire transfer to pay for our Paris apartment. The charges would have been $30 at our end and $50 at their end. We used Visa instead.

But for our upcoming Adriatic cruise, we just gave them a personal cheque.


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## Square Root

agree that Credit cards or cheques are better if accepted. Some places want to charge a % to use a card. This makes wire payments cheaper for large amounts. Have been using wire payments to pay for our Phoenix rental as this is all they will accept.


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## kcowan

We had to pay our annual timeshare maintenance fees (in Mexico) to a firm in Phoenix. We asked them to quote the figure in C$ then mailed them a cheque for that amount.


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## larry81

Oh oh oh !


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## DanFo

I wonder if they were do polls about customer service how skewed the results would be for small town service compared to big cities..I'd bet the small towns would score higher. I've never had any issues dealing with the service reps at TD in town here or the previous small town I was in...but with the two i usually deal with one is my neighbour and the other is my co workers wife and I'd assume these relationships help improve the service i receive when i go into the bank. In a big city the reps are probably far more busy and less likely to ever see you outside of the banks. I know I've done a phone survey for TD about customer satifaction but I'm not sure if geography was going to be a part of results.


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## brocko

All this stuff about TDW is fine but I want to know where is my free toaster? Tim's cards, no way!


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## uptoolate

Good luck Larry. I have had good luck with TD for both personal and business. Pretty much everything waived with no minimum balances. I deal directly with the manager rather than any other reps. I do occasionally have issues with the transactions between TD and TDW but never anything major and usually when I am asking them to do something fairly complicated.


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## fraser

Over that past few years we have moved all of our investments away from our bank. The reason was straighforward-substandard service, high fees-MER and direct, questionable advice, and staff turnover with senior folk being replaced less experienced people at an increasing frequency.

At the same time, we have moved virtually all of our cash savings out of the traditional bank and into ING and Ally because of the higher interest rates. 

The minimum balance in our chequing account ($2K I think) makes all of the normal service fees disappear. We never buy foreign currency at the bank-we always deal with an exchange store. About the only fees we now pay are safety deposit, US credit card annual fee, and an enhanced Visa. We do a cost benefit each year to compare the value of the Aeroplan points, net of airline taxes and fees, to the cost of the card.

We do pay a few dollars a month at another bank where we have our on line investment account. In this instance, we are forced to have this account in order to do business with the on line brokerage.

I expect that some of these charges may be reduced or eliminated when I turn 60 in a few months. I am certainly going to find out.

I think that bank fees have a habit of creeping up on you. The traditional banks count on Canadians being so docile that they simply pay the fees instead of review them. 

On the other hand, I have been very pleased with the performance of the two bank stocks that I have held so maybe there is something to those high bank fees!


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## larry81

uptoolate said:


> Good luck Larry. I have had good luck with TD for both personal and business. Pretty much everything waived with no minimum balances. I deal directly with the manager rather than any other reps. I do occasionally have issues with the transactions between TD and TDW but never anything major and usually when I am asking them to do something fairly complicated.


can you make me a quick list of what they waived 

They screwed so much that i am in a position to ask whatever i want, i am prepared to quit them on the spot.


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## larry81

I ran in another problem with TD.

I am subscribed to 'paperless' statement, which mean i should be able to view check copy without any fee, behold the major fvckup:



> 20 jan. 2012	CHQ-Fee Image	1,50
> 20 jan. 2012	CHQ-Fee Image	1,50
> 20 jan. 2012	CHQ-Fee Image	1,50
> 20 jan. 2012	MONTH END S/C 1,50
> 20 jan. 2012	MONTH END S/C 1,50
> 18 jan. 2012	CHQ-Fee Image	1,50
> 18 jan. 2012	CHEQUE COPY SEARCH 3,00
> 16 jan. 2012	CHQ-Fee Image	1,50
> 16 jan. 2012	CHQ-Fee Image	1,50


I am at my 3rd call with support related to this, first they told me it was normal to be billed (even if i am paperless), then they told me its free unless i click 'print' and they finally blamed it on a computer glitch related to a future update in march 2012 blablabla.

Its super fun having to call support for a frigging 1.50$ refund.

Way to go TD !!!


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## uptoolate

Yes I would agree that those nickel and dime charges are killer and moreso when you then get the run around. This is why I try to deal with the manager. If something like that comes up I just e-mail him and wait until he gets back to me rather than dealing with 'support' staff - especially telephone staff. I do agree with the post above regarding the pain when branch staff are moved and having to get a new manager used to you.

I'm not sure what all is free these days. Sometimes I wind up specifically asking if it is something I don't use very often. 

My personal select service account is waived with no minimum balance. My USD personal account has no fee with no account minimum. TD Visa Gold Elite is also waived as are extra cards on the account. That is their 1% cash back card. Canadian and USD money orders, drafts and certified cheques are free. Fees on all of the family's RESPs, RRSPs, and TFSAs are waived (these are all with TDW). I have had less luck on the business side with getting account fee waived but I haven't battled that one as I almost always have the minimum balance there. I don't do any foreign currency exchanges with the bank. I can't think of other things off the cuff but if you are wondering about specifics let me know.


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## marina628

We usually have to go in once a month and our account manager credits us for all the fees.Not ideal situation but I usually go in once a month anyway.


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## Jon_Snow

Out of the blue, TDW started charging me $29 per trade, despite the fact that I've been well over the 50k threshhold of assets which qualifies you for $9.99 trades. This is actually the second time this has happened. And they can't really explain why this is going on. Very irritating.


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## uptoolate

I am like Marina except that I just monitor it online and then rather than going in I just send an e-mail. I do drop in once in awhile just to say hi and remind the manager that the guy pestering him is actually a real customer. 

Managers have a lot less discretion these days and although they do journal into your account for things like drafts and money orders, they still have to go in every 6 months at TD to do the same for account fees and Visa. It used to be yearly and before that it seemed like it was just a one time thing.


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## uptoolate

Jon_Snow said:


> Out of the blue, TDW started charging me $29 per trade, despite the fact that I've been well over the 50k threshhold of assets which qualifies you for $9.99 trades. This is actually the second time this has happened. And they can't really explain why this is going on. Very irritating.


I've had that happen too, Jon. It usually is with a new account that hasn't been 'linked' to the others in terms 9.99 trades. Last time it happened the support person just said that I should have made the trade and they would have credited it back but I didn't feel like taking the chance. I haven't had it happen on older accounts that I can recall.


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## larry81

Causalien said:


> Are there any difference between standard president's account and gold president account besides the commission?


Anyone have any detailed info about the perks related to the different levels of president account ? All i can find is outdated stuff.

bump an old thread


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## MoMoney

larry81 said:


> Anyone have any detailed info about the perks related to the different levels of president account ? All i can find is outdated stuff.
> 
> bump an old thread



There is a special line to an account manager for diamond president accounts (exclusive from the regular presidents account line)

Some exclusive research material. Remember TDW is technically not a full service brokerage.

Honestly, even at the 5mil threshold you're not considered all that high net worth. If you're looking for exclusive service the only option is to go into private banking and pay for it.


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## Fee

*Hsbc*

Today HSBC announced that profits had doubled to 6.35 billion. I telephoned their business line and asked to discuss the opening of a business a/c with a "Relationship Manager" . My husband and I both hold full-time jobs, but wish to convert our basement suite into a little, one-bedroomed B and B. We do not have the financial acumen to risk our meagre savings on the stock market, but wish to have another stream of income to put directly into our six children's RESP accounts! We have been Premier Account Holders (huh!) since moving to Canada in 2008 and do not require any money to set it up, nor do we have/need a line of credit. 
Before I could say anything, the HSBC associate informed me in three crisp sentences that they do not negotiate on interest rates; that my business would have to bring in a minimum of $3million per annum and that they would charge me $55 pcm. I said that I would have to cook a lot of sausages and bacon to earn that sort of revenue, but she just said that it wasn't the right sort of bank account for us. 
I am now thinking of just using one of our other many personal bank accounts given to us by HSBC when we first moved here and designate it for the business. We have seen the accountant, sorted out the insurance; I just didn't think it would be so difficult to give our money to a bank :numbness: I also have TFSAs at TD...so that may be my next port of call...
All we have learned about the Canadian Finance has been gleaned on the pages of this forum. We would appreciate any suggestions. Thank you guys... a lot! :sentimental:


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## none

I wouldn't deal with HSBC - weren't they charged with money laundering? Forget that, I'm not the most ethical investor but I'm certainly going to give a black mark to any company that knowingly and willingly abetted in murder, prostitution and drug smuggling. Forget that.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/money-laundering-and-the-drug-trade-the-role-of-the-banks/5334205


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## Fee

Thanks, *None!*
Yeah, it was the only Canadian bank that had branches in our home country (UK). It was great being able to be given a cc and so start to establish a credit history when we first moved here, but the bank charges are something else! Our lives here in BC have been quite spendy, (just on day-to-day living costs) so our net worth is not looking so high now. 
Hopefully, we can get this b&b idea off the ground. Just a bit disappointed that one of the biggest banks sneered at our little enterprise like that. From little acorns etc etc... :soap:


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## sags

Just curious,.............. why are high net worth clients of any value to the banks?

Some banks in the US and recently in Europe have talked about charging fees to hold money for high net worth individuals.

Is Canada different?

Do banks need deposits when they can borrow money for 1% at the central bank?


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## fraser

The banks want to attract high net worth individuals because they are 'well qualified' prospects to whom they can potentially sell bank advisory services, bank brokerage services, high commission mutual funds, estate planning, etc. 

Boomers and their aging parents are prime targets. The bank would consider us as HNW clients but they would not be very happy with us. We get our chequing for free (over 60), we use other institutions for high interest savings accounts, and we do not avail ourselves of any of their investment services or products aside for one lonely TFSA each that we mistakenly set up at the branch. But we do rent a safety deposit box.


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