# What to look for in a laptop - Help?



## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

Ok, my old HP Mini 110 (tablet?) seems to be giving up the ghost (prob. 8 yrs old??)... it's so s-l-o-w lately.
So, I'm in the market for a laptop. Being frugal, i'm hoping to pick one up on kijiji.
I'm not overly tech-savvy, and I'd appreciate any advice re what "key" specs i should look for in a new one.
Before you ask... I'm going to continue to use it for just the basics... surfing the web, emails etc. Don't want or need all the bells & whistles. Just want to upgrade from what I have, improve the speed, & reduce the "waiting"time. What's the standard these days in hard drive, RAM, etc or whatever the key specs are?
Would appreciate some input from the techies in here.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

For example here's one that caught my eye today - any thoughts on it , for the price?:
http://www.kijiji.ca/b-laptops/st-johns/c773l1700113


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

FWIW- here's some info on my current machine, to show where I'm coming from:
HP Mini 110-3000.Windows 7 Starter.
Processor: Intel Atom CPU N450 @ 1.66GHz 1.67GHz
Installed Memory (RAM) 1.00GB
System Type: 32-bit Operating System


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## zylon (Oct 27, 2010)

I'm no "techie", but I highly recommend that it have this logo on the lid:


image hosting 10mb limit

My recent purchase has such a logo, and I'm quite happy with it.
With a bit of patience, you can prolly get one for twice the price quoted in your post #2 (Acer)


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

I hear ya zylon... But still.... $$$


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## scorpion_ca (Nov 3, 2014)

I am not actively looking to buy a laptop now but I will have to buy one within 1-2 years. I have found one laptop from Shoppers Drug Mart and here is the specs -
HP Noterbook 15-ac130ca (1TB Hard Drive, 8 GB Ram)

http://support.hp.com/ca-en/document/c04842311

The price is around $450-$490 depends on the sale. I have optimum points that is worth around $170-$200. That means, I will have to spend only $300 for this laptop. I think this laptop should be sufficient for email, browsing websites, youtube and personal use.


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

jargey3000 said:


> For example here's one that caught my eye today - any thoughts on it , for the price?:
> http://www.kijiji.ca/b-laptops/st-johns/c773l1700113


That laptop is 5 years old. I wouldn't get it.


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

Buy a refurbished one. Either from dell outlet for a Windows machine. or Apple where they're ~15% off new. 

At least 4 gigs memory and an appropriately sized solid state drive


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

thanks people. anyone else care to comment?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

none said:


> Buy a refurbished one. Either from dell outlet for a Windows machine. or Apple where they're ~15% off new.
> 
> At least 4 gigs memory and an appropriately sized solid state drive


Refurbished from Dell are fine, but SSD hard drive may up the cost to double. If I was going to spend the $$ for SSD, I'd buy new to get the 6+ years out of it. 

I do agree minimum 4GB RAM and at least Windows 7 installed.


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## JC66 (Apr 6, 2011)

Apple? no way....that is not being frugal  and you will not be immune to problems, just do a Google search on hangs at boot up

I'd rather recommend anything from Acer or Asus over Apple or HP. They both are Taiwanese and give you a better bang for your dollar. 

Look for CPU (personally, I would not buy anything older then i3) , amount of memory (min 4GB for Win7, 8GB for Win10) and speed of hard drive. Touch screen is kinda nice for scrolling or reading pdfs, books. 

If you planning to buy a used laptop be prepared to replace the hard drive. To keep prices down manufacturers always throw in slow 5400 RPM hds which over time become slower and slower. If you have a geek buddy or you know how to replace hard drive get solid state and you are good for the next few years. 

If you buying brand new, check dell.ca bestbuy Microsoft's online store... even amazon.ca


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## DollaWine (Aug 4, 2015)

People still buy/recommend Dell and Acer? In 2016? Eh...


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

AltaRed said:


> Refurbished from Dell are fine, but SSD hard drive may up the cost to double. If I was going to spend the $$ for SSD, I'd buy new to get the 6+ years out of it.
> 
> I do agree minimum 4GB RAM and at least Windows 7 installed.


Pfft! Here's someone who doesn't have a **** clue. I installed a 256 SSD into my girlfriends old 2010 mac for about $125 and now it works great. Twice the cost? Give me a break. Dumb.

see here:
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00RQA6TEI/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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## peterk (May 16, 2010)

^ Is this troll/ fake scientist ever going to be banned?


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

Buy this:

http://www.apple.com/ca/shop/produc...nch-macbook-air-16ghz-dual-core-intel-core-i5

Or this:

http://dellrefurbished.ca/product/c.../latitude-e6430-core-i5-260-i53320m/si6851097


Put ubuntu on the latter one instead and that thing will scream.


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

peterk said:


> ^ Is this troll/ fake scientist ever going to be banned?


Is this grease monkey ever going to say something even remotely interesting?

But seriously, I have 23 referrals. You have zero. I drive membership. You don't. Too bad so sad.


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## peterk (May 16, 2010)

none said:


> I have 23 referrals.


Like when the bank gives someone $50 for bringing in a customer? I hope CMF pays you well for all your had work, sounds like you could use the money.


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

Hey as your mom says: $20 is $20. 

Reminds me of a joke actually:

What the difference between your mom and a washing machine?

Last time I put a load in a washing machine it didn't follow me around for a week. :tiger:


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## yyz (Aug 11, 2013)

Frugal would be a Chromebook if web surfing and gmail would get you by


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## indexxx (Oct 31, 2011)

zylon said:


> I'm no "techie", but I highly recommend that it have this logo on the lid:
> 
> 
> image hosting 10mb limit
> ...


I have to agree with zylon- and I find my Macbook has been FAR less expensive in the long run. I've now had it for 6 years and it still runs perfectly. The only thing I've had to replace was the power cord. My old PC laptops (one a top-of-the-ine Toshiba) started failing after a couple of years- hard drive replacements, DVD drive replacement, probably spent close to $1,000 on repairs, plus always having to run anti-virus programs and do maintenance- what a pain in the arse. Then they eventually began slowing down and bogging down hopelessly, to the point where they are now completely useless. Once you go Mac, you'll never go back.


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## pwm (Jan 19, 2012)

Last month I was looking for a portable device and ruled out a tablet because I wanted a unit with a keyboard. I didn't want to spend much to just do email and web browsing so I looked at chromebooks. Then I went to Uniway in Winnipeg and found that for the same price as a chromebook I could get:

Lenovo Thinkpad T420. 2.6Ghz i5 2540, 4GB, 320GB HDD, 1600X900 14" display with a battery that last about 5 hours. He even put Windows 10 on it for no charge. 6 month warranty. Office Suite 2007.
The price on the other more well used units was $299 but mine cost $329 because of it's almost new condition. As the guy said, it probably was used by a manager who never took it out of the carry bag.

I strongly recommend looking at used laptops, but buying from a "refurbished" dealer with a warranty is well worth it in my opinion.


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## yyz (Aug 11, 2013)

The question with used is how the battery is,that could get expensive to replace.Plus a mechanical hard drive like that ,they aren't built to last I'd rather have a ssd .But yes a Chromebook generally has alot less storage and less flexibility it really depends on what you want to do with it.


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## fraser (May 15, 2010)

Another vote for refurb. Don't buy the extended warranty.

Wait for two months if you can and grab one in the back to school sales. I think Costco provides a 2 yr warranty as standard.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

If you really are only using your computer for email and web browsing and don't need it for anything more than that, I agree with the suggestion to get a Chromebook. A new Chromebook would cost the same or less than a refurbished Windows laptop, and a Chromebook is designed for exactly what you're looking for: email and web browsing. If you need to do word processing and spreadsheets you can use Google docs and sheets; a Chromebook will work best if you're always online but you can store some files on the computer itself and some of the programs will work if you're offline.

Main advantage of the Chromebook, apart from price, is that the operating system is constantly updated in the background; it's one of the few computers whose performance is likely to actually increase over time instead of getting slower and slower like Windows machines do.


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## Earl (Apr 5, 2016)

IBM sells refurbished laptops at decent prices: http://www-304.ibm.com/shop/americas/content/home/store_icueb2b/en_CA/pshp.html

I highly recommend getting a laptop with a solid state drive, it makes a huge difference. Or if you buy one without it, you can get a 240gb solid state drive for around $80 these days and install it yourself. It makes much more difference than upgrading the cpu, adding memory, etc.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

jargey3000 said:


> Before you ask... I'm going to continue to use it for just the basics... surfing the web, emails etc. .


Can you elaborate on what's included in "etc." above?

That will determine whether you need Windows (or Mac) or if you could get by with a Chromebook.

Buying a Windows machine just to read email and browse the web would be like buying a $200 professional-quality roofing nail gun so you can put a few nails into sheetrock for hanging pictures. It's way overkill.


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## pwm (Jan 19, 2012)

brad: I totally agree with your recommendation to consider a chromebook for casual use. I was almost ready to buy a chromebook but went with the used PC instead. It was a very close call. Could have gone either way, but I went with windows for a few reasons, such as:

I can easily sync my desktop and laptop using MS Onedrive. I installed my Keepass software and synced the database with the laptop so I now have all my passwords on it. I installed Adobe Digital Editions so I can load eBooks on my Kobo from my laptop. The laptop had better screen resolution than the cheap chromebook I was looking at. My laptop sold for around $1,200 5 years ago so it was good value.

Still I hear you. I'm a believer in chromebooks too and I would suggest the original poster consider one.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

I agree that if you want to do more than just surf the web and read email, watch a few videos, etc., a Windows machine will give you a lot more options. But a Chrombook might be the right solution here; it also doesn't require antivirus software, you don't have to worry about backups, etc.

Plus the OP just bought himself an Android phone, which should sync up well with the Chromebook, and more recent models of Chromebooks will soon be able to run Android apps.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

jargey3000 said:


> For example here's one that caught my eye today - any thoughts on it , for the price?:
> http://www.kijiji.ca/b-laptops/st-johns/c773l1700113


No. IMO, buying a used laptop on kijji, without at least the manufacturers 1 year warranty is like buying a "pig in a poke"..sometimes you get a good deal and it's trouble free (including the EXPENSIVE laptop battery..
...and sometimes not.

So you should never buy a laptop used from a private seller, unless you can verify they are the original owner
and the owner or you checks out a few things first.
1) Can you do a restart and it comes up trouble free.
2) Can you access the internet from it. Mail/youtube etc
3) Is the screen display functioning properly and bright enough to see easily in the daytime.
4) Will the laptop run on the original battery or will it need replacing?
Most laptops are kind of useless without the battery, although you can plug in an AC adapter, but that
ties you down to a wall plug.

The other problem is that the laptop will have the original users acct attached to it for updates..so unless you continue
to use that account without scrubbing the hard drive...it may be difficult when it comes to any Microsoft updates.
Also, most sellers will scrub the hard drive clean except for the OS. Sellers don't want buyers having access to their
own personal files. I know that I wouldn't, if I were selling one on Kijji.

Laptops can get stolen and resold again. I don't know how MS treats the laptop when it is declared stolen by the
original owner.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

thanks for all the good comments.... not sure i understand a lot of it...I'll try answer a few questions here & maybe ask a few - first, I never heard of a chromebook until this thread! (shows you how advanced i am)
- I'm using my current HP MINI (s it a laptop? or notebook? it has a keyboard, so i guess it's not a tablet?) Anyway i use it 99% of the time for email, websurfing (google mostly), i do watch some youtube, and, now i want to install itunes... but i'm afraid it'll slow down EVEN MORE! so, no, i dont need any fancy stuff - spreadsheets, reading books - I'm not even sure what APPS are!
- brad mention i just bought my first cell phone -yes! he mentioned about syncing that up to a Chromebook. what does that mean & what would that give me?
-re buying used: the last 2 desktop PCs i bought were used, from a refurb. dealer here in st. john's. quite pleased & had no real issues with them considering the price (current one cost me $130 which INCLUDED a larger monitor than the one i had), but he doesn't deal in laptops.
- I'm going to investigate some of the suggestions above, but I wonder if someone might clearly re-cap or spell out for me (like I'm a 5-year old) the main specs you guys think i should be looking for here, for my needs?
Tks again.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

- If you are not tech savvy, buy either a new laptop or Chromebook, OR a refurbished PC from the likes of Dell (reputable dealer). Stay away from Kijiji if not a techie buyer.
- Get 4 GB RAM (minimum) and Windows 7 if getting a laptop (or a Win8.1 upgradeable to Win10 free before late July). Win 7 is as good an OS as anything more recent.
- Since you are not into major downloads of music, videos and movies, hard drive space is not a critical issue for you. I suspect you will get a minimum of 300GB or 500GB whatever you end up buying and that will be lots.
- I don't know about Chromebook myself, but my bro has an HP Mini as a secondary device to his laptop and you are right... .it is way too slow with 1 GB RAM and its resident processor. Techology has moved on.

- If you are into Google applications such as Gmail, Chrome browser, Google Drive (Docs, Spreadsheets, etc), Photos app..... then these will automatically sync across your Android and Windows devices with the appropriate apps installed. Even in you don't use Gmail for your email account, using Chrome browser and having a Google account lets you use either device for all that you do one one or the other. You only need to install the Google Drive app and Photos app on both your laptop and phone. I use the Google suite of applications across my laptop and my iPad (I don't use any of the Apple applications on my iPad and will move to an Android tablet if/when I decide to replace the iPad).


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

Okay, now we're getting somewhere.

You can't, as far as I know, install iTunes on a Chromebook, but you can use Google Play on a Chromebook -- it's pretty similar but a bit more limited. If you want to install iTunes because you want to (for example) copy music CDs so you can have them with you and listen to music on your laptop without having to bring CDs with you, then you may need a Windows laptop. If on the other hand you're just planning to buy some music online and you want an online player that can play music and videos, then a Chromebook might be enough for you.

As for syncing your Android phone with your Chromebook, the main advantage would be that your phone and your laptop would have the same/similar look and feel: your contacts on your phone will be the same contacts on your computer, your bookmarks on your phone's web browser will also be the bookmarks you have on your laptop, etc., because Google takes care of all that for you.

You'd be able to watch youtube and even watch movies and tv shows on a Chromebook.

The real basic distinctions are:

1. Chromebook: Cheap and good value for the money, but very limited: you can't do a whole lot more than browse the web, get email, listen to music, watch videos, manage and edit your photos, etc. although I'm exaggerating a bit: some people use a Chromebook as their only computer and brag that they can do nearly everything they could do on a Windows machine. Other advantages to Chromebook are no antivirus, no need to do backups, and the system software updates itself automatically. You can learn about Chromebooks here and check out a few models with their prices listed: https://store.google.com/magazine/chromebooks_platform_story. But there are lots of other models beyond the ones listed there.

2. Windows: Still cheap and good bargains available, much more flexible and capable than a Chromebook, but more bugs and more headaches: you need to install anti-virus, deal with Windows, etc. However, you know how to use Windows already so this option has the lowest learning curve and that's worth thinking about. Chrome isn't hard to learn, but it's not Windows. See if there are stores selling Chromebooks near you so you can compare and see what you think of it. Or you can simulate the experience by using your Windows machine running nothing but the Chrome web browser. That's pretty much what you get with a Chromebook.

If you get a Windows machine, I agree with everyone who said buy refurbished. Often refurbished machines aren't actually used, they're brand new but were returned unopened. They often go through more quality control than new machines and typically come with a one-year warranty. I buy all my electronics refurbished and have never had a problem. Don't buy a used laptop on kijiji etc.

3. Mac: I won't get into the Mac/PC war, but I think this is off your list anyway due to the perceived higher price. Some people argue that Macs are cheaper in the long run and certainly fewer hassles/headaches, but it would be a big learning curve for you and likely an extra expense because Apple doesn't sell low-end machines.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

IF the OP really does have interest in a Chromebook, he should at least peruse https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromebook and http://www.techradar.com/us/news/mo...romebooks-top-5-chromebooks-in-the-us-1233696

Also, many of the Android apps are not yet available on Chromebook but that is changing http://www.engadget.com/2016/05/19/android-apps-google-play-on-chromeOS/ and http://fieldguide.gizmodo.com/everything-you-can-do-offline-with-a-chromebook-1780519966

That all said, as Brad said, sticking with a MS Windows machine is the least learning curve and the Google apps work there already.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

guys... thanks again for taking the time /interest to post!
let me try to digest / understand some of the above & we can go from there.
FWIW ... no, I'm def. not tied to itunes ... it's just that that's what i've been using. one question: I've been meaning to have a go at downloading (is that the right word?) some of my songs that i have on itunes on to a little USB stick (is that the right word), so i could plug the USB into my laptop? (or other device) & play it through that device. Could I do that with Chromebook (bearing in mind that the music would be coming "off" itunes , and then presumably playing back on a Chrome book with google play?
would there be conflict between itunes and google play? would it work? 
arrrghh gimme the ol' days - when we made "mix cassette TAPES"!


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

AltaRed said:


> That all said, as Brad said, sticking with a MS Windows machine is the least learning curve and the Google apps work there already.


...thinking I probably WILL go this route.......:stupid:


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

AltaRed said:


> - If you are not tech savvy, buy either a new laptop or Chromebook, OR a refurbished PC from the likes of Dell (reputable dealer). *Stay away from Kijiji if not a techie buyer.*


My advice as per my post agrees with this statement. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I have bought ONE used desktop from a 'fixer-upper-techie" from Kijjii. it is the one that I am using right now. When I bought it for $130, it came with a "pirated" (no license Win 7 software copied from a CD that he had for himself to put
these cobbled together desktops.

After 30 days MS started to nag me by blanking out my screen background to BLACK and warning me to
purchase their licensed OS for $199..the Bas*ARDS! 
The guy I bought it from refused to help me with a "workaround key" and after numerous phone calls
and messages left for him that were purposely ignored, I got fed up,
and ordered my own genuine MS Win 7 from a online store.

Then I had to start from scratch, reloading the OS, then the additional Win 7 platforms from MS, as well as the drivers..it turned out to be over 7 or 8 hrs of work to get it back to proper form for me to use again.

With a laptop,from a private seller, you could run into the same thing..and much more, UNLESS you have the laptop to use for a couple of days to test for little things that annoy or even make it unworkable. 

you won't know that at the time you are buying the laptop, unless the seller is willing to let you try it before you buy it and that is usually not possible with Kijiji.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

jargey3000 said:


> g
> FWIW ... no, I'm def. not tied to itunes ... it's just that that's what i've been using. one question: I've been meaning to have a go at downloading (is that the right word?) some of my songs that i have on itunes on to a little USB stick (is that the right word), so i could plug the USB into my laptop? (or other device) & play it through that device. Could I do that with Chromebook (bearing in mind that the music would be coming "off" itunes , and then presumably playing back on a Chrome book with google play?


The easier solution is to get the free Google Play Music Manager, which will upload all your music to Google's cloud. From there you can play it all back using Google Play on any device (even an iPad). If you have a lot of music, it could take a long time to upload and you might have to pay bandwidth fees to your internet provider if you go over the limit. But I did this and it worked great for me. You do have to be online to listen to Google Play music, although you can download specific tracks or albums to your device if you want to.

The problem with transferring it to a USB stick is that some of your tracks in iTunes are likely protected by DRM (Digital Rights Management) and can't just be copied from one computer to another. But you can still upload DRM-protected music from iTunes to Google Play, so that's the easiest solution I've found.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

me i'd never buy a used machine but i did notice that those links to used Dell machines upthread were to a US website owned by Walmart USA.

the prices were in USD & already - for used Dell laptops - the prices looked ridiculously high.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

humble_pie said:


> me i'd never buy a used machine but i did notice that those links to used Dell machines upthread were to a US website owned by Walmart USA.
> 
> the prices were in USD & already - for used Dell laptops - the prices looked ridiculously high.


You can buy Dell refurbished equipment direct from Dell at https://dellrefurbished.ca It's good stuff; I'm using a refurbished monitor on my computer that I got from Dell for nearly half price and it works flawlessly.

@humble_pie, here in Montréal there is a great organization called Insertech that employs at-risk youth to refurbish old computers (mainly corporate laptops); they sell them at great prices and because Insertech is a nonprofit there is no sales tax. We're planning to buy our next Windows laptop from them, and I donated two of our old machines to them last year. Their machines are in good shape and they do repairs/tuneups, etc. for very reasonable prices. Unfortunately they only ship to locations in Québec, otherwise other Canadians could take advantage of their excellent deals.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

Agreed on the faster processor, but I would lean toward i5 over i7. I have a Surface tablet with an i7 processor and the battery drains twice as fast as on the same machine with an i5 processor; it has never lasted more than 3.5 hours. And for the OP's purposes (mainly web browsing and email, watching videos), an i5 would be more than adequate.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

brad said:


> You can buy Dell refurbished equipment direct from Dell at https://dellrefurbished.ca It's good stuff; I'm using a refurbished monitor on my computer that I got from Dell for nearly half price and it works flawlessly.
> 
> @humble_pie, here in Montréal there is a great organization called Insertech that employs at-risk youth to refurbish old computers (mainly corporate laptops); they sell them at great prices and because Insertech is a nonprofit there is no sales tax



all good news, thankx


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

brad said:


> here in Montréal there is a great organization called Insertech that employs at-risk youth to refurbish old computers (mainly corporate laptops); they sell them at great prices and because Insertech is a nonprofit there is no sales tax.




Insertech is located in the Angus yards. I have such a soft spot for the Angus yards. 

long since closed, the historic CPR Angus railyard sheds were canada's biggest - possiby canada's first - locomotive & railcar rebuilding shops. Several city blocks. Thousands of workers were housed nearby in what might be called tenements.

i have a friend who was raised in the Angus yards. She was a single child, her policeman father was killed when she was a toddler, there was not much pension in those days for a policeman who died young, her widowed mother had no choice but to go back to her family in the Yards where she herself had been born.

adrienne grew up the neighbourhood gang leader, the universal babysitter for the entire community, the caregiver. She remembers how close-knit the community was, how layoffs were so common, how shared poverty was the rule, how the CPR bosses never even knew the french speaking workers who laboured to rebuild their railcars in the east end of montreal.

she remembers how many street festivals they'd have in the Angus yards. How she'd mobilize 20 kids from the neighbourhood & look after them all day long while their mothers cooked & hung out at the festival.

adrienne was one tough little girl. "I could have gone either way," she says today, meaning prostitution or drugs. There wasn't much choice for poor kids, especially not for girls, from the Angus yards. They either worked in their fathers' machine sheds at the Yards or else they were on the street.

adrienne was lucky. Someone - her mother, her elementary school, her priest, maybe all three - enrolled her in a catholic school board program for disadvantaged girls. Even 35 years ago, the catholic school board had a forward-looking program like that.

she was sent to a posh private school, a french convent school. She loved it. The nuns were endlessly encouraging & wonderfully kind, she says. She was a bright, engaging little girl who made friends easily, so the fact that her background was different from most of the student population didn't turn out to matter a heck of a lot.

*adrienne grew up to marry her teenage sweetheart, earn an MBA from the HEC of l'université de montréal, hold down a glorious career, mother two strong teen-age boys & live happily ever after.
*

.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

Beautiful story, humble! There's an inspiring interview with the directrice/fondatrice of Insertech here: https://bricabacs.com/2016/01/26/agnes-beaulieu/

It's one of the reasons we plan to buy all our future Windows computers there.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

FYI, I learned today about one big reason NOT to go with a Chromebook: apparently Google only supports them with updates for five years. After that you can still use your computer but its performance will start to degrade and it won't get the latest security patches. I know a lot of people only keep laptops for 3-4 years, but in most cases that's a waste unless you truly need the latest and greatest; I've kept Windows and Mac laptops running for 8-9 years with no problems, even with the original batteries.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

brad said:


> I've kept Windows and Mac laptops running for 8-9 years with no problems, even with the original batteries.



thankx for info about the batteries. I've noticed that one of the first things the OEMs will try to sell are new replacement batteries. I've been told that batteries only last a year ... rundown batteries cause slowdowns ... rundown batteries cause every problem in the book ... rundown batteries are going to devour my machine pbyte by byte ...

so far i've resisted. My 3, 4 & 5 year old lithium batteries seem fine. They're always fully charged. In a neighbourhood power failure they work properly. 

i never checked with anybody so i'm glad to hear that these batteries can last for years. They're expensive to replace.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

humble_pie said:


> i never checked with anybody so i'm glad to hear that these batteries can last for years. They're expensive to replace.


It depends on the particular machine and the battery, though. My girlfriend's old ThinkPad went through batteries once a year, whereas the batteries in my ThinkPads typically lasted 6-7 years. 

We have an original iPod Touch from 2008 that still keeps a full charge on its original battery after 8 years of use, despite all the dire warnings that the batteries would only last three years and then would be very expensive to replace. The batteries on all my Mac laptops have been champs, running for years beyond their expected end of life; my two nieces are using 9-year-old iBooks with their original batteries.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

brad said:


> It depends on the particular machine and the battery, though.



if a battery remains fully charged, gives no sign or symptom of trouble & works fine when the power is cut, would there be any reason to replace it though?

put another way, what would be the signs or symptoms of a failing battery if the above criteria were all met positively?

yours was the first message i'd ever seen that an older battery can be perfectly ok, so i was glad to read it.

(signed)
pie who has been pressured by the OEM to buy new batteries


EDIT one OEM rep went so far in his sales pitch as to say that a battery more than a year old would leak acid & destroy the machine. However i don't believe that is true for lithium batteries ...


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

humble_pie said:


> i
> EDIT one OEM rep went so far in his sales pitch as to say that a battery more than a year old would leak acid & destroy the machine. However i don't believe that is true for lithium batteries ...


Right, I've never heard of lithium batteries damaging computers simply because they were old, although just because I haven't heard of it doesn't mean it can't happen!

As for symptoms of a failing battery, it boils down to how long your laptop can run on a full charge. If you used to be able to get 6 hours from a full charge and now you're down to 2, that's a sign of a failing battery. Depending on your mobility needs, you may not have to replace it until it stops taking a charge altogether: we kept my girlfriend's old ThinkPad running for a year as a desktop machine when we got tired of replacing the battery every year, although the flashing "low battery" light was a distraction and eventually we gave it away (to Insertech, as it happens).

My biggest expense last year was a Microsoft Surface tablet, in my failed attempt to switch from using a Mac at home (I use Windows for work and my girlfriend's home computer is Windows so I figured life would be easier with just one operating system). One reason I ended up switching back to the Mac is because the Surface's battery life has never exceeded 3 hours, despite the advertised "all day battery life." Maybe the MS employees who made that claim were based in Nome, Alaska in early winter where there are only three hours of daylight.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

yyz said:


> ... a Chromebook generally has alot less storage and less flexibility it really depends on what you want to do with it.


Does it require wifi access to use apps?


Cheers


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

brad said:


> ... As for symptoms of a failing battery, it boils down to how long your laptop can run on a full charge. If you used to be able to get 6 hours from a full charge and now you're down to 2, that's a sign of a failing battery ...


Or it's a sign that the latest update has turned on a bunch of stuff that drains the battery that one had turned off ... *sigh*.


Cheers


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

My experience has been that battery performance simply deteriorates with time. By the time my last HP laptop was 6 years old, the battery did little more than be a UPS for perhaps an hour of service. Shortly after that, it just died with zero capacity. I used the laptop on AC only for another year or so before purchasing a new laptop. Keeping a PC for longer than 5-6 years just does not seem practical any more. Systems and software move on, upgrades get buggy and expensive, and performance bogs down. Spending $500-900 every 5 years is pretty inexpensive for the peace of mind and enjoyment of having a machine serve you, rather than the other way around.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

Eclectic12 said:


> Does it require wifi access to use apps?


Some apps will work offline, but for most of them you need internet access. Later this year you'll be able to install Android apps on some newer Chromebook models; many of those will presumably work offline.

Note that Chromebooks usually have very little storage capacity, 16-32 gigabyte SSD drives are common, because it's assumed you'll keep all your files and data in the cloud rather than locally on the machine. That limits the number of apps you'd be able to have and use offline.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

AltaRed said:


> Spending $500-900 every 5 years is pretty inexpensive for the peace of mind and enjoyment of having a machine serve you, rather than the other way around.


For me it's not a money issue, it's a waste issue. Why throw away an otherwise perfectly good computer just because it's getting old? New features are great, but they come with such frequency that most of us don't have time to learn how to use them or even to remember that they're available. For me, there's a lot of value in stability and stasis in a computer: if I have one computer and keep it for 8-9 years, I can be much more efficient at getting work done because I know how everything works and where everything is. If performance slows down or the machine starts crashing, then it's time to either get it fixed or upgrade, but I wouldn't upgrade until then, personally.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

brad said:


> As for symptoms of a failing battery, it boils down to how long your laptop can run on a full charge. If you used to be able to get 6 hours from a full charge and now you're down to 2, that's a sign of a failing battery.



thankx! makes sense, i'm glad to know that.

btw re Agnes Beaulieu whom you linked upthread - working with Insertech youth at the Angus Technopole - she does look a bit like my friend Adrienne, perhaps they both went to the same convent school. Gotta hand it to those nuns, some of them turned out a pretty awesome squadron of graduates.

i believe that one of Insertech's powerful roles is as an electronics recycler. This is far & beyond the goals of providing employment for youth along with e-services to the community. Just the recycling can be a moneymaker for them. It's the motherboards, if they know how to take them apart to get the gold out, along with the copper.

here's a hint from a while back in my low-paid freelance editing days. There's a dutch gold dealer in amsterdam to whom some canadian recyclers send their reclaimed gold from motherboards. Evidently he stores the AU in individual accounts, when he has enough he sells the gold in london & credits the recyclers' accounts pro rata.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

brad said:


> For me it's not a money issue, it's a waste issue. Why throw away an otherwise perfectly good computer just because it's getting old?


+1 ... then too, I don't hammer the personal machine anywhere near as hard as the work machine that is basically on 24 x 7.

With the far lighter use at home, I can't remember the last time I had to replace something on a personal machine. I have had friends complain about their laptop battery life declining but the ones I recall who bought new ones were buying the bigger capacity ones to add to the mix instead of needing to outright replace the battery.


Cheers


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## DealClaimer (Apr 1, 2016)

jargey3000 said:


> Ok, my old HP Mini 110 (tablet?) seems to be giving up the ghost (prob. 8 yrs old??)... it's so s-l-o-w lately.
> So, I'm in the market for a laptop. Being frugal, i'm hoping to pick one up on kijiji.
> I'm not overly tech-savvy, and I'd appreciate any advice re what "key" specs i should look for in a new one.
> Before you ask... I'm going to continue to use it for just the basics... surfing the web, emails etc. Don't want or need all the bells & whistles. Just want to upgrade from what I have, improve the speed, & reduce the "waiting"time. What's the standard these days in hard drive, RAM, etc or whatever the key specs are?
> Would appreciate some input from the techies in here.


I'm not that techie too but our computer technician would always advise us to buy a Lenovo or a Dell laptop instead. By the way, the specs needed will always vary according to your needs. Both laptops brand that I've mentioned are also good in gaming and multimedia functions and they have good specifications available for that. You could check on the budget laptops for 2016 online also to give you an idea.


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## nate5 (Jun 16, 2016)

Tablet or laptop?


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## nate5 (Jun 16, 2016)

Dell XPS 13 http://pc4u.org/best-13-inch-laptop/


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