# Trading based on panic journal



## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

I designed my trading system to be guided by fear & let panic take its course into pushing the panic button to buy or sell. Instead of trying to eliminate emotions (energy in motion) in my trading I did the opposite & include emotion in my trading so mind & emotion are in harmony.

To do this I view my trading not as speculative but as hedging. My system is often wrong but my back testing of my system puts the odds strongly to the system having an edge. Of course this could just be a fluke so I put a small amount on the table.
Even if I lose I will still have a positive cash flow for the year. By risking a small amount that can be compounded over the long run into a very large amount I view trading as a hedge to my financial independence. Putting to much on the table without a system that gives an edge would threaten my financial independence. By setting up my system as a hedge to protect that which I value ( financial independence) panic will guide me into following it.

I felt fear hours before the trades were placed then shear panic as they were placed. Then relieve after trades went through & after I checked for any mistakes.


Advanced Micro Devices AMD bought 1350 shares 2.85
Ciena 225 shares 12.75
gap gps 80 shares 36.07
Q logic 290 shares 9.89
Akami 78 shares 37.73
Spy put 90 dec 2014 (for hedge)

Market value $15798 @ end of day, cash in account 114


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Finished a good trade today by selling shares of Q logic @ 9.71 for a loss ?????????????????????

Some might be wondering why it was a good trade even though money was lost. The reason it was a good trade was because it was not a bad trade.

A bad trade is when you have no method & or not using proper money management & you make money.

A good trade is when you make or lose money but you follow your system that has an edge.

(do to time constraints I am not sure if I will continue this thread)


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

closed out AMD @ 2.11 for loss
closed out gps @ 33.72 for loss

Both good trades even though I lost money I followed my plan.
Because I never put more then I can afford to lose on the table I still will have the courage to follow my plan. Even if I lose all the money in my account I will still have a positive cash flow for the year.


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## Argonaut (Dec 7, 2010)

Closing out positions for significant losses are not good trades. Never lose money. Always make money. Avoid junk stocks.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Hi, Argonaut

Thanks for stopping by, You make an excellent point. I do value sacred money but not every seed grows when planted. A dust storm blew some of my seed away. A drought is to be expected now & then. I will look to the sky for better planting weather.


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

Kind of tough to never lose money but we try don't we? haha. Up @4:30AM trading futures because that's what it takes sometimes.

If U followed plan then win or lose you did the right thing. Maybe the plan sucks but execution was flawless.

I agree with Argo - just don't ever play junk stocks. I never missed a 10 bagger that anyone I know got - not for them trying, it just never happened haha.


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

I agree you are speculating with junk stocks.
Getting out of losing trades is a good move, but it still can't be called a good trade.
The only objective of such a move is to avoid losing more money, but that doesn't mean it was a good trade.

Sometimes a trade that is losing money can be a hedge for another position that is making more money, and that's ok.

You keep referring to a "system" and a "plan" - what is this system that you are following?
Have you designed this system on your own, or is this something you learnt at a seminar or in a book?
Does it involve making money at some point?


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

50% of my days more or less are spent losing money. If you follow your plan and execute it it doesn't matter if you win or lose.

Ask people how holding NT went - i'll bet they tell you they wish they had got out at only a 50% loss  selling for that huge loss was the best trade they could have made whether they knew it or not which if course only a rear-view mirror could have told them for sure.

The big issues here are always the same ones everyone have but refuse to see it for what it is. First and foremost as we all agree with, is that you're dealing in junk. OK, we're beyond that. That's easy enough to fix.

Possibly an even bigger problem are that no-one really has a good plan. Oh, they've got a plan, but it likely blows. If you do have a definable plan then you have a good start. I can't know that from where I sit but your options are to either trade it or back-test it a lot and see how good it is statistically over a fairly lengthy time period.

This is the harder part. You can avoid 90% of your problems by being hedge appropriately and that doesn't include that dec 2014 SPY put you have. That is next to useless. If it were me I'd dump that thing today for gains and walk away and find a proper hedge if you still want or need one after what's happened today.


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## Argonaut (Dec 7, 2010)

I've seen a few posts lately where the user is content to lose the entirety of their trading account. Why? With that kind of attitude, you will lose it. Why not keep it in cash and read a book instead? You've got to have that fear of losing money to stay sharp. Like the new Batman movie says, sometimes fear is a good thing. Let's tighten up around here, we want everyone to make money.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Snuff_the_Rooster said:


> 50% of my days more or less are spent losing money. If you follow your plan and execute it it doesn't matter if you win or lose.


If you follow your plan and you consistently lose, it matters.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

HaroldCrump said:


> 1. Getting out of losing trades is a good move, but it still can't be called a good trade..... only objective of such a move is to avoid losing more money, but that doesn't mean it was a good trade.
> 
> 2. Does it involve making money at some point?


1. You're right, such are good moves.

Risk management & knowing when & where to make corrections is part of the investment strategy and if you can do so well overall, I would consider such moves successful. My own example of this week: on Monday, I exited a same-day BAC trade with a minimal loss; the next day I made another trade with same stock, but successfully. I had good reasons for having exited the trade when I did, and for having repurchased & sold the next day [wasn't just luck involved]. If I had to give a grade to each execution [or move], the one that gave me the loss would rank higher.

100% success is impossible, however, failures teach a lot, but no need to lose one's shirt in the learning process.

2. :rolleyes2:


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

MoneyGal said:


> If you follow your plan and you consistently lose, it matters.


uhg forget it haha that's just a brilliant comment unto itself


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

Argonaut said:


> .... we want everyone to make money.


for that to happen folks are going to have to re-think 90% of what they do.

It's not going to happen for that reason alone.

People can't even see how a good program can make you tons whilst only being profitable 50% of the time. They attribute the win-rate to profitability. True, most lose their butts being right 80% of the time. It's a sad fact.

That AAPL thread is a perfect example of what I'm referring to.

Walk close to the buildings today and watch for falling wallets with people attached to them!


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## Maybe Later (Feb 19, 2011)

I almost don't want to ask but how does one back-test a system that is based on emotion? Not a lot of long term data sets on how you were feeling on any given Tuesday.


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

lol beats me! If you find out, let me know.

I don't think there is a complete plan in place but I'll leave that up to the guy pulling the trigger on the trades to decide and let us know. I do enjoy a good panic and today looked pretty good to me. I could take a few more days in a row like this to soften up some bottoms and get people really worried.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Hi, guys

Thanks I appriciate the input

Some of you guys make an excellent point in regards to not calling a trade that causes a draw down a good trade.

I can not value losing money that is on the table over that of following my system. Or else I wont follow my system. The market is always right & my system is not always right but my system does give me an edge. ( I could be wrong but I think Iam right)

I can not pick & choose & only use the trades that will be successfull because I can not tell ahead of time which ones will make or lose money. If I could I would only use the trades that did make money & avoid the ones that lost money. If I highly value all the trades. The emotion love will guide me to follow through. ( love is an emotional response to that which one values most highly & cause one to come in contact or possesion of that which they value i.e., making the trade


It is the compounding gains my system will give me over the long run that I value. If I value not losing money over following my system fear will stop me from following my system.

Fear is an emotional response to that which threatens ones values & causes one to act to avoid that which causes the fear.

Dispite popular believe emotions can be your friend when investing if one values money as well as ones mental content is based on valid theories.( I value the possible long term gain over the potential short term loss)

Emotions are not your friend if ones mind is a junk heap of invalid theories. 

As I said in my first post I have a very small amount of my net worth on the table. 

I can not keep all of my knowledge & values in my focal awareness. In order to survive, I must have some means of triggering instataneous apprasils from my subconscious in response to the perceptions of the situations I encounter i.e., if a rock is traveling towards my head & about to hit me rather then go through a lengthy thought process. My subconscious will cause me to duck & avoid that which I fear i.e., death or getting hurt

If I did not value life & or understand that the rock could hurt me fear would not cause me to duck & avoid that which threatens that which I value. ( my highest value is life)

If my system does not give me an edge & I follow it I will simply fail.

I did my own research so I could trust in my own senses & build a system that fits my personality & was based on reflective thought from the logic ( logic that a thing is what it is & can not be something differnt @ the same time & in the same respect) that was recorded. Iam often wrong but from experience I have a better view of the truth when I look through my eyes.


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

I read your entire post above carefully, but I am no closer to understanding what this "system" actually is.
Is it using any TA buy/sell indicators? Which ones, and how?
Or is it based on some valuation metrics? Which ones?
You keep referring to it in every post but never clarify what it is.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Sold put @ 4.24


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## Sampson (Apr 3, 2009)

@Crump,

I think the system is emotion-based. So if it feels good, buy it and vice versa. That's as much as I can understand.


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

lonewolf said:


> Sold put @ 4.24


 i assume gain. if so nicely done. I would have chickened yesterday by close but i think about same numbers anyway.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

lonewolf said:


> 1. The market is always right
> 2. my system is not always right but my system does give me an edge
> 3. love is an emotional response to that which one values most highly
> 4. Fear is an emotional response....emotions can be your friend.....


1. You have reminded me that I still have to read 'The Market Is Always Right'. Did you/anyone else read it?
2. No system is perfect, but the one you understand best that gives you the most success, should give you the edge.
3. Love of your stocks?  True, and an uncontrolled emotion at times I suppose. 
4. I agree about not trying to eliminate emotions, as that is not even possible, and in fact, useful as you said. However, most times, emotions don't get out of control when you start with knowledge/a plan, AND a back-up plan. There are many people that start investing without having a clue about anything [there are a few here].

In an earlier post, you said:*'guided by fear & let panic take its course into pushing the panic button to buy or sell'* - I take it that by fear you meant awareness & caution, however, panic should always be avoided as such a negative emotion leads most times to irrational & devastating decisions.

As a guest on the Lang & O'Leary show said last night, the right place to be is between fear and greed.

The best systems are often the most basic of all, no need for complicated ones. JMHO. 

*Roller-coaster emotions:*


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

Toronto.gal said:


> Roller-coaster emotions:


Nice chart, TG.
Based on this, where would you say we are these days?
I'm guessing somewhere between denial and pessimism.
2008 - 2009 was around the panic mark.

I don't think any of us here have experienced capitulation (1929 style).

I'm speaking of equity markets, not others like bond market or real estate.
We know what point those are at :rolleyes2:


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

HaroldCrump said:


> 1. Based on this, where would you say we are these days?
> 2. I don't think any of us here have experienced capitulation (1929 style).


1. Until a few days ago, in the unease/denial section, but now I have to agree with your sentiment.
2. Not yet. 

In retrospect, all that is happening now should come as no surprise; the warning signs were there all along.


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

You know you are in panic mode when:

- Your morning ritual becomes increasingly painful
- You wake up in the middle of the night in sweat
- Your broker stops returning your calls
- You throw away your monthly statements without opening
- You remove the News/Business package from your cable programming plan
- You want to kill anyone at a party that asks you : _so, how are the markets doing_

You know you are in capitulation mode when:
- You stop your morning ritual completely
- You start planting vegetables in your garden
- You start a chicken coop for eggs and food
- You disconnect cable completely
- You stop going to parties
- You close your brokerage account, withdraw the remaining balance, and spend it all on a pizza and rented DVD
- You start working at the same pizza shop


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

lonewolf said:


> closed out AMD @ 2.11 for loss
> closed out gps @ 33.72 for loss
> 
> Both good trades even though I lost money I followed my plan.
> Because I never put more then I can afford to lose on the table I still will have the courage to follow my plan. Even if I lose all the money in my account I will still have a positive cash flow for the year.


The next time someone wants to armchair you for taking a loss and calling it a poor decision because of it, ask them to pony up on further losses.

I point you to AMD today down yet another 3% with you out on sideline in cash. Sure it could come back but that is not the point is it. How much more do we BBQ-off is my question to those holding and smoking, before we cry uncle and tap out.

Don't think I believe you should have ever gotten into AMD trash to begin with but we have that problem everywhere including irresponsible people on Uranium threads and similar all day long every day of year so sometimes I just ignore neighbors trading garbage at curb because bags are different colours and they don't match with car in driveway.

fwiw if have your positions thrown at me I do exact same thing so far as soon as i clear to trade.

Your plan may not be good but there's no point in finding out by losing all your cash in one swoop. 

good luck to U in future


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

By my count you saved yourself 4% of stash by stopping out on 3 plays when U did vs close today. That's 4% you don't need to make up which is huge.


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## Argonaut (Dec 7, 2010)

That's not the point, all decisions are rendered irrelevant after the initial terrible decision to buy a junk stock. Anyone can buy any old stock, sell on the way down and applaud themselves for a 'good decision'. And then be a few bucks poorer.


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

Argonaut said:


> That's not the point, all decisions are rendered irrelevant after the initial terrible decision to buy a junk stock. Anyone can buy any old stock, sell on the way down and applaud themselves for a 'good decision'. And then be a few bucks poorer.


you missed it at least 3 times in row. not yet a record though.

We already decide 99 times buying junk is bad. We told him every step along the way. You should remind Uranium guys please. Maybe you have better shot.

Next step is get out when your plan breaks down and tells you to before losing all marbles. Sooner or later he'll find out his plan is poor as selling naked options and other sorted donkey plays after he loses enough $$ then he goes back to drawing board to find another perpetual motion machine that has two pots of gold at end of rainbow with Kate Upton holding bathrobe. He'll meet most of the people on this board over several trips, sorry to say. Maybe everyone can car-pool in that fast lane on highway and save on gas going in circles.

it's not like we don't have enough evidence to disprove this. They say 90% of people lose in this game despite vehicle or driver alcohol rate and since I am odds guy I will assume everyone I meet is full time stock loser until I see otherwise. It only makes sense. I cannot confirm 90%. I think it might be more?

Anyway good luck 2 wild dog. People will only learn the hard way. Help them get over what they have on table now and suggest better food order next time.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Maybe Latter

Excellent question, it is wise to question everything I say. Iam often wrong & even when Iam right I fail in comunication so Iam misunderstood.


Your mind is a rational faculty, which means it has the capacity to reason. Reason is the facuilty that identifies & intergrates the material provided by mans senses. Perhaps ? other animal species are guided automatically & unerringly by instincts, man is given nothing automatically. Everthing he want & needs, food, clothing, shelter or method for playing the market requires that man volitionally choose to make the specific mental effort neccessary to focus his perceptions & thought outward toward reality. Only in this way can he gain knowledge.

Knowledge, like mans mind, has a nature. It has a foundation, consisting of fundamental ideas & principals. On top of this base, mans knowledge spirals in logical progression, toward higher & more complex, derivative concepts & principals. The hierarcal structure of mans knowledge can be most readily observed in mathematics where the fundamentals are addition, subtraction, multiplication & division. It is only on the basis of understanding these fundamentals that one may move logically, i.e., step by step, toward increasingly more complex derivative aspects of mathematics, such as calculas.

Mans basic method of gaining knowledge is logic. Logic is a means to establish truth. Logic is the art/skill of noncontradictory identification. No concept man forms is valid unless he intergrates it without contradiction into the total sum of his thinking. To arrive @ a contradiction is to confess an error in ones thinking, to maintain a contradiction is to abdicate ones mind & to evict oneself from the realm of reality. A is A 


Based on the first rule of life, which is to stop from dying & the fact that in order to survive man must be able to make instantious apprasals from the subconscious without a lengthy thought process i.e., the pedestrin lunging out of the way of the car about to hit him. I think man is programed for survival so emotions come before action. First fear then the lunge to safety.

Maybe Iam wrong but I try to have my system work based on my nature & that is for emotions then action. Just like everything else in the universe I must act in accordance with my nature.

Fear is only an emotion & not a tool for gaining truth. My goal is to have mind & emotion working togeather & it has to be designed so when I fear, the fear protects me. Fear is not always bad Iam glad I fear driving fast on icey roads


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## Maybe Later (Feb 19, 2011)

Very nice.

However, that didn't address my question at all, which was: how do you back-test a system that is based on emotion?


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Maybe Latter

I made a mistake in my title because nothing sits in a vacume by it self. I dont know how I could back test a system only with emotion. But would I not need an emotion to cause me to take action to back test ?

Reason & logic are tools that I used to back test my method. Would courage not also be needed so that to the best of my honest ability I would except the truth as my friend & not be afraid to back test. Wonder lead me to ask a lot of questions.


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## Argonaut (Dec 7, 2010)

Reason and logic are mutually exclusive to this strategy. 

I am someone who is a proponent of reason and logic for use in life and investing. I choose capitalism for market theory, libertarianism for politics, deism for religious thought, Aristotle to Aquinas for scholarship, 18th Century enlightened despots for rulers, and Spock for pop culture. Logic, this strategy is not. Logic says that AMD has its fate tied to the declining PC industry, and therefore should not be bought.

lonewolf is his own unique individual, and I believe he will do what he will. But I've taken an interest in this thread because I don't wish to see untruths and poor strategy go unanswered, lest some novice investor or forumite stumble upon this thread.


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## Maybe Later (Feb 19, 2011)

Lol, I have to agree. It is for the same reason that I pointed out the ridiculousness of backtesting such a "system", which seems to amount to, "I do whatever the hell I feel like on any given day" which, in my mind, is the antithesis of a system.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Hi, Harold

Thanks for question & very interesting posts. (thanks to everyone that has posted)



I could have failed but I tried to make my system so I would develope & or have the precise nature to make money in the market. 

I had to value money i.e., if I thought money was evil what are the odds of me keeping it. ( I view money as a medium of exchange that represents lifes energy)

To keep my self committed to reason I used committment to reason as my standard of gauging esteam.

Reason is the antithesis of faith, faith is the blind exceptance of ideas without any sensory evidence.

Self -esteam A term widely used but much misunderstood. is the result of a positive apprassil flowing from the recognition that one is committed to that which is true & good. It entails the sense that one is both able to live & worthy of living. The need for esteem is inescapable. It is inherent in everyone & is expressed as an omnipresent, basic phychological need.

Since "esteem" is an evaluation. It presupposes a standard of value. The quality of ones esteem & degree of his ambition will hing on whether or not the standard used is rational. In my opinion this is the most important value judgement an individual can make, since it will effect not only all other value judgements but also motivation.

Those who habitually measure thier self-worth by a comparitive standard often have a difficult time understanding why thier confidence yo-yos. Living in a comparison-neurotc society, many base thier esteem on how much money, how many cars or whatever they have to someone else. The acquistion of existenial values depends , to some extent, on factors that one does not have volitional control over, such is an inappropriate, or irational standard.

Using "commitment to reason" (mans biological distinguihable trait) I can always choose to use it. Confidence does not yo yo if Iam always committed to reason & it is far more likely to lead me to truth which is needed for survival in the market then doing the opposite.

Toronto girl I think is on to something regarding pain is great teacher. 

There are all types of methods that work but the investor & method must match & the best method I can think of is to do your own thing because your understanding & knowledge from your experience will be differnt then mine as mine will be then yours. But every person I have seen post on this forum I truely believe is smart enough to increase thier odds by doing thier own thing.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Toronto.gal

If your words were any more picture perfect for cultivating understanding of concepts they would not be letters but numbers. Instead of reading a book you should maybe wright a book. I have thought of writing a book & in it I might say "@ some point it might be best to stop reading & start thinking". No I have not read the book. Appriciate reading your posts.

Argonaunt Thanks

Iam fallable, as I mature & gain knowledge, mistakes remain inevitable. To be successfull I must view mistakes rationally. Rather then being put off by them, I regard them as valuable tools of self correction that motivate me to actively seek the knowledge necessary for achieving further mastery.


Snuff the roaster

Thanks for pointing out that the put was not really protecting me. I did not blindly accept what you said but after further thought I agree it would not protect me in all situations. Always enjoy reading your posts.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Toronto.gal

Is it really best to trade in the middle of the chart of roller coaster of emotions ? Often a valuable learning experience results from the thinking that is done after feeling sad from the death of a loved one. Is best to examine ideas in their entirety @ all degrees of trend for both negitive & positive results before one follows through on an idea ?

When Prechter won the United States trading championships ( around the 1980s) I remember him saying the stress was so great he had to lay in the fetal position.

Energy that causes one to think progressively negitive before buying into the market or energy that causes one to think progressively positive buying into the market. Which is more likely to protect the investor ? I know from experience I feel fear before I place a trade which seams to be porportional to the bet size.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

lonewolf said:


> 1. Is it really best to trade in the middle of the chart of roller coaster of emotions?
> 2. Often a valuable learning experience results from the thinking that is done after feeling sad from the death of a loved one.
> 3. Is best to examine ideas in their entirety @ all degrees of trend for both negative & positive results before one follows through on an idea?
> 4. Energy that causes one to think progressively negative before buying into the market or energy that causes one to think progressively positive buying into the market.
> 5. I know from experience I feel fear before I place a trade which seams to be proportional to the bet size.


1. It depends what you mean by 'in the middle of the chart'? Do you mean like buying/trading on a day like when the S&P stripped the US of its AAA credit rating, that had been held since 1941? 

I think that in life in general, there are times when it's not possible for any of us, to maintain emotional control because after all, the mind is central in all that we do, and so when that happens [lose emotional control], we, at various degrees, are limited in mental & physical functionality, and so what should we do when this happens? The answer is obvious I think. As 'Prechter' said in your comment below, it's true that stress can totally incapacitate a person & while some cope better than others, we have all been there.

2. During periods of severe depression/sadness, our mental/physical potential is limited, no doubt about that, but it's true, too, that we can become better/stronger individuals as a result of life experiences. One could also say that we learn things after it's too late, like for example, we come to appreciate someone after such person is gone. But relating it to stocks, one becomes a better investor after some valuable [painful] lessons have been learned.

3. I'm not sure I understood you, but if I were to interpret your sentence literally, then the answer would be yes.

4. You lost me here. Are you talking about optimists and pessimists; fear vs. greed? Any kind of negative mind-pattern certainly is not positive for any investor.

5. That is perfectly normal.

You often talk about emotions and mental energy, and though I don't automatically think in such terms when investing, breathing, etc., it's certainly part of our existence & everything we do.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

account value before trading this morning is down 14851

Today
purchased US steel 212 shares @ 21.11
purchased ak steel 1195 shares @ 3.66


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

rising tide tends to raise all ship as per gun to head to buy CCJ last week, but the question i ask is why do you continually gravitate towards worse dogs in pen?


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Good question Snuff the roaster 

Perhaps the reason Issac Newton lost money in the market was because he did not take his theory far enough into that of cycles.

Take a look @ T. Gals chart no straight line but that of cycle. Now the big question did I get the cycle right. I did some more research & put the odds even further in my favour. Now did this new research just cause me to follow herd into another losing position ?


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## Snuff_the_Rooster (Oct 26, 2012)

of course market more in your favor as i been screaming all last week during fall to get butts long as decent odds.

as i said in previous rising tide fix a lot of trading errors but not long term fix for bad traders.

Let's skip newton dead-guy and discuss why you buy dogs all day long.

perhaps less philosophy and more brain work needed. you not need to think long and hard for bad Put buy but you need to think and feel position to see I was clearly right to dump that dog too? I have glass pipe that makes me think similar silliness but I stow it away when trading.

Start using your head man.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

Today

Ciena sold 225 shares @ 14.52
Akam sold 78 shares @ 36.37

Went long the following today

Lennar (len) 56 shares @ 38.36
KB homes 151 shares @ 14.47
Owen illionis 88 shares @ 19.61

Total account value before open 15,267 (funds are always in American dollars)


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## Mall Guy (Sep 14, 2011)

I think this just might be the Seinfeld of threads . . . and tonight the part of Cosmo Kramer is being played by . . .:biggrin:


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

account value as of close last trading day 15 522

today
sold 1195 shares ak steel @ 4.11
long 248 shares owen illionios 19.76

I have a lot of respect for Snuff the roaster does seam to know his stuff & I think he most likely is successfull @ trading. From experience he has differnt knowledge & understanding then I have as I have differnt knowledge & understanding then Snuff has. I decided to go with my understanding & played my game following my method. I had a few strike outs & the beer soaked fans were calling me a bum but I had the courage to swing @ what looked like a good pitch & never let the star pinch hitter bat for me.


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## lonewolf (Jun 12, 2012)

account value before open today $16,626

Made a few trades today, need more time for research & skiing so future updates cancelled

Thanks everyone


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