# Home heating/cooling & programmable thermostats



## Freedom45 (Jan 29, 2011)

I've recently purchased a new home, that is heated by natural gas, and also has central AC installed. I've got a programmable thermostat, but am wondering if there is a better option for controlling the temperature.

Am I wrong to think that if I set the thermostat to say 20*, that the house is going to bounce back and forth between heat/AC to stay there? IE: heat kicks on to 20, house rises to 21, AC brings it down to 20, house drops to 19, heat kicks on, etc...

I know what temperatures I'd like the house to be at, at which times of the day, I just hate the thought that during the day (when no one is home), it's cycling between heating and cooling non-stop. Is there a way to turn both systems off easily during the hours no one is home? I can't be the only one that thinks about this, am I?


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## dotnet_nerd (Jul 1, 2009)

It doesn't work like that. It's either in cooling mode or heating mode, but never both at the same time. Your thermostat will have a switch "Heat-Off-Cool" or something like that.

Then the A/C or furnace will cycle on/off as needed.


If you want remote control get something like Nest


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

In my experience, programmable thermostats have a heat/cool/off toggle. Either it's heating or it's cooling (or neither), it won't be trying to do both. You might need to open the cover of the thermostat to see it.


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## Video_Frank (Aug 2, 2013)

Most thermostats also have a sliding switch, labelled "Heat", "Off" and "Cool". With a programmable thermostat and the switch set to "Cool", the A/C will come on when the temperature rises about setpoint and turn the A/C off when the temperature gets below setpoint. So, if you've set the house for 20 degrees, the A/C will come on at 21 degrees and shut off at 19 degrees. The furnace will not come on.


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## Freedom45 (Jan 29, 2011)

Interesting. I think mine is currently on an "auto" setting. I know that it currently kicks on the AC when it's above the desired temp, and kicks the heat on when it falls below. I'll have to play with it this evening.


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## nobleea (Oct 11, 2013)

Freedom45 said:


> Interesting. I think mine is currently on an "auto" setting. I know that it currently kicks on the AC when it's above the desired temp, and kicks the heat on when it falls below. I'll have to play with it this evening.


They usually have different set points for heat/cool. For example, furnace turns on below 19C and AC turns on above 25C in auto. Then you can go to heat only, where AC never turns on, which you would do in the winter. If it gets too hot, open a window. Or cool only, that you'd do in the summer. If it gets too cold, open a window. A programmable one can also be useful.


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

nobleea said:


> They usually have different set points for heat/cool. For example, furnace turns on below 19C and AC turns on above 25C in auto. Then you can go to heat only, where AC never turns on, which you would do in the winter. If it gets too hot, open a window. Or cool only, that you'd do in the summer. If it gets too cold, open a window. A programmable one can also be useful.


That's how our's works. We leave it on auto year round. And we can enter different set points for time of day and even days of week. I would think that most new installations would have a programmable thermostat these days.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Freedom45 said:


> Interesting. I think mine is currently on an "auto" setting. I know that it currently kicks on the AC when it's above the desired temp, and kicks the heat on when it falls below. I'll have to play with it this evening.


Typically for home installations the fan is on or auto, and it is heating mode or cooling mode.

For commercial they will actually run both.


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## Freedom45 (Jan 29, 2011)

Well, figured it out last night. It has heat/cool/auto modes, as well as on/off/auto settings for the fan.

Thanks all! Now I won't be sitting at my desk, wondering if the AC and furnace are fighting one another all day.


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## OhGreatGuru (May 24, 2009)

Video_Frank said:


> Most thermostats also have a sliding switch, labelled "Heat", "Off" and "Cool". ...


Newer ones don't have a mechanical switch. (They were too easy to understand.) There is instead a programmable "mode" function to change from heating to A/C.


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## Video_Frank (Aug 2, 2013)

OhGreatGuru said:


> Newer ones don't have a mechanical switch.


You're right. I googled it and there's very few with a mechanical switch, just cheap Emerson ones. I guess I'm dating myself - I installed mine when we moved into our "new" house in '95 and it's worked perfectly ever since.


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## Brian K (Jan 29, 2011)

I installed a Honeywell Wifi T'stat in my house and it does have the Heat/Off/Cool/Auto mode. It also has either 2 or 4 transition settings per day to account for someone home all day (2 transitions) or if you get up and leave, then return after work (4 transitions). The Heat setpoint and cool setpoints are individually settable so there is no "fighting" between the furnace and the A/C. I think the default differential is 2 deg C. It is much cheaper than the Nest T'stat AND it will send you an e-mail if the temperature drops too low or goes too high (programmable settings). I really like this thermostat especially being able to use the App on the phone to remotely see and set the temperature. You obviously need a wifi setup in your house and it uses a fair amount of data (about 250-300mb per month). I did try phoning Tech support to see if they knew how much data it took and they didn't.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

Brian K said:


> You obviously need a wifi setup in your house and it uses a fair amount of data (about 250-300mb per month). I did try phoning Tech support to see if they knew how much data it took and they didn't.


That's a fair bit of data unless you're using the App to monitor or change the temp a lot.
Do you have to use their App or does it have a web interface as well?


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## Brian K (Jan 29, 2011)

Yes it is lots of data. I have the App on my phone but you can also log into a Honeywell site and have a look with a PC. The data I mentioned is used up by the Thermostat to report back and get pinged by the web site - so how you access it to have a look is extra and of course will depend on how often you have a look.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

So they provide a cloud based interface via their site ... wonder if you can directly (via the ip address) connect to the Tstat's web interface? 
I've been looking at those, I like the temp monitoring features but will wait for the price to come down some more.


Edit -> Which model did you get?


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## Brian K (Jan 29, 2011)

Accessing the devices' IP address is part of the setup but after that it doesn't seem to be viewable - although I haven't tried typing in the IP address to see. From what I have experienced, accessing it to have a look or change something isn't the cause of big data usage because I don't constantly look at it (other than the first few days lol). It's the constant pinging that chews up the data. I installed mine at my cabin where I have a Bell Mifi device that only has the t'stat on it and the Mifi measures data usage. I do go through a Uniden booster and perhaps there is more data used because of the booster errors and retries (maybe) - but I doubt it and no way to check it easily - no error reporting.

I bought mine at Rona on the 1st Tuesday of the month - It's 10% off Seniors day - but they will come down in price (maybe).


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## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

cainvest said:


> That's a fair bit of data





Brian K said:


> Yes it is lots of data. .


Since when is 300MB/month a lot of data?

Maybe in the year 1999...


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

KaeJS said:


> Since when is 300MB/month a lot of data?
> 
> Maybe in the year 1999...


It's a lot of data since its "only a thermostat" ... just wasted bandwidth due to bad programming.

Jump ahead 5+ years in the future and its possible many homes will have a number of those devices pushing data that's not needed, total waste of bandwidth.


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## Brian K (Jan 29, 2011)

That was my thought too. I was hoping for a way to slow down the pinging to reduce the usage - perhaps a setting in the setup - but no way to slow it down was available.
There is no indication of bandwidth/data usage in any documentation and tech support couldn't answer my question about usage either. All in all though - I like the device.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

You might be able to block it on a schedule (like overnight), depends if your wifi router supports that. I like the wifi control, have a few devices at home that do that but I wouldn't by a cloud only based wifi device. I know some devices I have try to talk to their companies servers but I block that and manage them myself.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

cainvest said:


> It's a lot of data since its "only a thermostat" ... just wasted bandwidth due to bad programming.
> 
> *Jump ahead 5+ years in the future* and its possible many homes will have a number of those* devices pushing data that's not needed, total waste of bandwidth*.


Rogers and Bell are rubbing their hands with glee..and saying to themselves..
"Yes Bring it on!" We will charge them 10c for every extra bit of MB data they use in their thermostats, stoves, refrigerators,microwaves, smart TVs, smart cars, internet, intranet, extranet,... 'Oh, you don't like your last bill with all the extra usage on it outside your 300MB monthly contract?
Sign up for our lifetime super-duper favoured customer plan with 50GB per month on the data plan for for smart phone..$199.95 a month + taxes.


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## Brian K (Jan 29, 2011)

I have a Bell Mifi device that is a wireless/3G device that allows up to 10 devices to connect via its ability to be a wifi hotspot and connect to the Bell 3G network. When I initially got it the contract for $10/month allowed 100 MB of data and as Carverman pointed out, with expensive data after that. I got it because my wife wanted internet access when at our cabin with her IPad. Yes the IPad was a 3G version but we took an update, and it seemed that they reduced the power of the antenna (to save battery life???) and it didn't have the power to get a good 3G connection anymore. My BB worked with no problem, but it was a CDMA version and Telus was going to discontinue supporting that protocol. So I got the Bell Mifi to try to get web access. It didn't work well either because of large trees in the area, so I eventually got a Uniden cell booster with the antenna on a 30 foot pole and we now get reasonable internet access. 

The benefit of having the Mifi is that because I have Bell satellite as well, I get a total of $12 per month in "valued customer' discounts which I didn't get with only the satellite subscription. So by having it, I actually saved money. But I didn't use it much because of the 100 MB data limit and the IPad worked via the booster. So after 2 years, the contract was over and the plan could change. Now for $20 per month I can get up to 1 GB of data (I think - waiting for the first bill which is coming up). I did previously buy the Honeywell T'stat but the Mifi monitors the data usage and in 3 days, usage showed the T'stat would use up about 225-250 MB of data per month so I returned it and didn't use it but enjoyed my discount. Then when the contract changed because the 2 years was up, and the data increase to 1GB, I thought I'd try it again. There aren't any programming adjustments in the Mifi that I can find. But now with the 1GB data limit, I can run the Tstat and use the Mifi as a hotspot and not chew through my 300 MB of data I have on my phone account. (yes for some of us 300 MB is lots of data - this is the Frugality section after all lol).


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