# 60+? what's in your RRSP?



## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

I'm curious what other geezers are holding in their RRSPs as we head towards our "golden years" 
Me and da wife? Mostly GICs, with some ZAG, and a little FTS for spice! Anyone else care to share?


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

100% GIC's since interest income is most highly taxed. 

Tax advantaged securities outside the RRSP.

ltr


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## pwm (Jan 19, 2012)

Retired 13 years. Both RRSPs have been converted to RRIFs. I hold TD eSeries funds TDB900, TDB902 and TDB911 in each. I like to keep things simple. I think it covers Canada, USA, and the rest of the world quite well.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Jargey, the question is very dependent on how large the RRSP is relative to the rest of the portfolio. If an RRSP is 10% of one's investable assets or 90% of one's assets will result in completely different asset allocations.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

AltaRed said:


> Jargey, the question is very dependent on how large the RRSP is relative to the rest of the portfolio. If an RRSP is 10% of one's investable assets or 90% of one's assets will result in completely different asset allocations.


Yes, no doubt......I’m still interested in seeing some more replies though...


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

jargey3000 said:


> Yes, no doubt......I’m still interested in seeing some more replies though...


Okay... 100% in a 6 year GIC/Bond/Debenture ladder BBB or higher credit rating.


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

jargey3000 said:


> Yes, no doubt......I’m still interested in seeing some more replies though...


Yeah, Alta is right. For someone that enjoys a fixed income allocation that aligns perfectly with their RRSP percentage portion of their entire portfolio, then they will probably assign all that RRSP to fixed income. For someone who's entire portfolio is in their RRSP, then it will be a completely different story.

What can you gain from these responses, knowing this information?

ltr


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

Yes,yes, I understand what you’re saying.I just want to get an idea of what some other geezers are doing. Sorry.


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## GreatLaker (Mar 23, 2014)

Mostly fixed income. This includes all my tax-deferred accounts (RRSP & 2 LIRAs, and will open a small RRIF this year).

50% bonds (VAB)
33% 5-year GIC ladders
5% Can equity (VCN)
5% US equity (XUS)
7% Global (XEF, XEC)

Non-registered is 100 % equities, mostly ETFs & a small amount in Mawer mutual funds.

I chose fixed income in tax-deferred accounts based on the conventional wisdom, and as recommended by Canadian Couch Potato. I have seen other analysis that says equities in tax deferred accounts makes more sense now due to current low interest rates and when looking in after-tax return in dollars. But you cannot re-allocate your portfolio just because interest rates change a few ticks.
http://canadiancouchpotato.com/2014/04/24/do-bonds-still-belong-in-an-rrsp/

Edit: at what age should I start to worry about geezerism taking hold? I am resisting it as long as possible.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

GreatLaker;1
Edit: at what age should I start to worry about geezerism taking hold? I am resisting it as long as possible.
:)[/QUOTE said:


> Thanks for that info GL!
> 
> re geezerism...I'm not sure ... for me , it was when i started looking around the space i was in...a bar, a concert. a gym class, a meeting ...church ...wait, no, NOT church...or whatever & realized i was one of the oldest - if not, THE oldest - person in the room..
> but hey - it's only a state of mind. when my friends tell me I "look like a million bucks" i say "thanks ....but ya know...a million bucks ain't what it used to be!"


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## 1980z28 (Mar 4, 2010)

Not 60 yet but fully retired

RRSP 100% is in 13 stocks all dividend payers and reinvest dividends


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## birdman (Feb 12, 2013)

like_to_retire said:


> 100% GIC's since interest income is most highly taxed.
> 
> Tax advantaged securities outside the RRSP.
> 
> ltr


I do exactly the same and for the same reason.


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

No company pension, RRSP's are 1/3 of invested assests.
RRSP's are 60% FI (strip bond ladder), 20% MAW104, 20% VGRO (In turn, MAW104 is ~40% FI and VGRO is ~20% FI). 
Along with CPP/OAS, these RRSP's>RRIF's will be our sole source of income beginning at age 72.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> No company pension, RRSP's are 1/3 of invested assests.
> RRSP's are 60% FI (strip bond ladder), 20% MAW104, 20% VGRO (In turn, MAW104 is ~40% FI and VGRO is ~20% FI).
> Along with CPP/OAS, these RRSP's>RRIF's will be our sole source of income beginning at age 72.


tks only (& others...) i'm curious about stirp bonds (never owned) where's a good place to learn a bit more? (and/or possibly purchase?)


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

Finiki has a good summary: http://www.finiki.org/wiki/Strip_bonds

Bond investment quality is something you need to consider (don't buy junk); larger purchases will get you an incrementally better rate; accrued interest is taxable each year outside of a sheltered account; and consider/compare what competing rate you could get for a GIC of similar term.

Your online brokerage should have a purchase screen in their fixed income area, e.g. TDDI (3-5yr filter, ranked by yld):


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

Thanks omo
Any other codgers care to chime in on this thread?


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## Oldroe (Sep 18, 2009)

11 stocks and riets you don't likely need me to detail.

I've been out of weed stocks for 3 months it was less that 2% but very healthy return.


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## hboy54 (Sep 16, 2016)

Not yet 60 ...

BBD.B
BTE
ECA
PEY
HCG
HSE
GE
CM
POW
CWL

Not very balanced ATM in the RRSP, I look at balance across all holdings.

hboy54


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## canew90 (Jul 13, 2016)

We are in our mid 70's and our RRIF's represent 53% of our total investments. In both our RRIF's we hold 8 DG stocks. We hold 13 DG stocks in all our accounts and are 100% Cdn equities. We currently hold $100k in cash but usually average $30k.
Our TFSA now represent 9% total of 6 DG stocks in both.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

DG stocks?


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

jargey3000 said:


> DG stocks?


Jargon Jargey. DG= dividend growth


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> Jargon Jargey. DG= dividend growth


TWIT,only...tks


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

jargey3000 said:


> TWIT,only...tks


BTW...not calling you a twit!
(TWIT= that's what I thought) LOL.....oh dear..........


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> No company pension, RRSP's are 1/3 of invested assests ...
> 
> Along with CPP/OAS, these RRSP's>RRIF's will be our sole source of income beginning at age 72.




the math here seems a bit confusing

if RRSPs/future RRIFs are only 1/3 of invested assets, one is left wondering why they would be "sole source of income" at 72. Surely the larger 2/3 portion of invested assets will generate income of its own.

it's difficult to find quality securities that will pay no dividends nor any other kind of distribution in non-registered accounts. The choice is even more limited in canada than it is in the US. Yet these are the investments that a party planning to avoid income from non-registered accounts would be forced to purchase.


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

Sorry Humble, some had mentioned that RRSP in isolation is incomplete. My effort to provide some context only provided confusion.
The 2/3 unsheltered is currently providing living income from 58-71, but is also being gifted away over those years with the intention of being gone by 72. We'll be left with RRIF's, TSFA's and home which will be sufficient.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> The 2/3 unsheltered is currently providing living income from 58-71, but is also being gifted away over those years with the intention of being gone by 72. We'll be left with RRIF's, TSFA's and home which will be sufficient.




on the face of it, it's a brilliant plan. A double helix of perfection. Designed to provide fun & amplitude now, heading towards simple & ever more simple in old old age.

i hope you won't mind if i poke at it a bit though? me i don't think i'd do away with the entire 2/3rds in non-registered unless my last name were pattison or bronfman or something similar. You might live to 95, one cannot predict the future. 

what if, in 2038, one has to pay cash for all decent medical services or else languish in a wait queue that's three years long? (no, wait, that's what's happening today)

there could be all kinds of emergency scenarios (what if spouse elopes with young gold-digging nurse & demands half the patrimoine?)

me i'd keep a little something. The kids will be alright without it.


.


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

humble_pie said:


> i hope you won't mind if i poke at it a bit though?


Point taken. RRIF's should easily be sufficient, but we are retaining a portion (~25%) of the unregistered assets until 71 and could hang on to them if we feel the need (and after things like a new roof, vehicle, etc.). It is not all going to the kids, there are some others who need a hand. 
My expiry date is 85, sooner if those medical services become necessary. Wife is not as decided though so she may live longer and enjoy the residual of my RRIF and TSFA. 
Wouldn't quashing the ambitions of a young gold-digger warrant giving it all away sooner? Let them live in love and poverty


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## spdr1812 (Apr 8, 2016)

1980z28 said:


> Not 60 yet but fully retired
> 
> RRSP 100% is in 13 stocks all dividend payers and reinvest dividends


I'm still a ways away from retirement but this is what i have started to build as well , was thinking 15 , maybe 20 max . My issue is i dont have 200K to dump into a bunch of stocks so i need to build over time . 

Obviosly painful right now with the Div payers buy my question is , with most people into GIC's , Bonds , MF's ..

Should i just be going for growth , risk etc now and whatever i come up with in 15 years dump that into the Div payers of the future and ride that into the sunset , or stick to plan of building for the next 15 ( hopefully not 20 ) years ? 

The curiousity of the Lucky 13 for me is huge .. i know we are in line with 4-5 from your previous posts.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> Point taken. RRIF's should easily be sufficient, but we are retaining a portion (~25%) of the unregistered assets until 71 and could hang on to them if we feel the need (and after things like a new roof, vehicle, etc.). It is not all going to the kids, there are some others who need a hand.
> 
> My expiry date is 85, sooner if those medical services become necessary. Wife is not as decided though so she may live longer and enjoy the residual of my RRIF and TSFA.





i'm intrigued by your retirement-to-final plans because not only are they so original, but they also reflect a vast & compassionate spectrum of human life that far depasses the mere dollar-counting strategies set forth by ordinary decumulation plans.

first of all, i think taxwise your plan probably makes good sense, if not the most sense.

but more than that, the idea of keeping your footprint upon this earth as small as possible while benefiting others along the way is dynamite. It's rich in meaning because it is the opposite of rich in greed. 

i for one would like to see so much more about your plans. I hope you'll post more from time to time. I hope some financial planners catch on that yours is a pathway towards Going in Style. Thankx for telling us.


PS i'm happy to see that you'll retain roughly 25% of non-registered portf until you are on the cusp of RRIFs at age 71 though. Always good to keep something for the unexpected.


.


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## 1980z28 (Mar 4, 2010)

spdr1812 said:


> I'm still a ways away from retirement but this is what i have started to build as well , was thinking 15 , maybe 20 max . My issue is i dont have 200K to dump into a bunch of stocks so i need to build over time .
> 
> Obviosly painful right now with the Div payers buy my question is , with most people into GIC's , Bonds , MF's ..
> 
> ...


I started investing in early 80`s
I have made many mistakes
Over time i have a understanding of risk
Before i retired i purchased land,new house and all stuff i would need vehicle,tractor,atv,built 2 story garage and filled it
So no debt
I hold about 6 to 8 years in cash
Set up accounts to get about 44k in dividends and rising,i do reinvest the dividends 
The equities i own are most large cap company`s that raise dividends,,,,not to concerned about CG or fast growth
I have a nice balance sheet,,,also HELOC @ prime,,,,it is for emergency if needed

If you can get the required amount of dividends to support your family IMHO that is where you would want to be,,,markets will go up and down dividends keep coming and rise with inflation


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## spdr1812 (Apr 8, 2016)

Quick question , all CAD/TSX equities ?


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## 1980z28 (Mar 4, 2010)

pretty much
have a small amount of SO a 1000 shares
All of what i hold have interested in other places on the planet such as BNS only bank i hold 2400 shares,,i am only buying EMA going forward


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## spdr1812 (Apr 8, 2016)

I'm using EMA as my anchor for Div paying retirement build as well . Also building on AQN , ITP , MFC ( dont have any banks yet ) , NPI , PKI , RUS & HR in REIT space .


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

question for the divvy buyers....do you take all the divs in cash? or drip? or some combo of both?


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

jargey3000 said:


> question for the divvy buyers....do you take all the divs in cash? or drip? or some combo of both?


In cash. 

Dripping in a non-registered account is an accounting nightmare that is easily avoided by taking cash. Once the cash builds up in your HISA, it can be deployed to balance to your asset allocation.

ltr


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## TomB19 (Sep 24, 2015)

We aren't 60+ but we aren't far from it and we are recently semi-retired and intend to start drawing down our RRSPs next year. I will respond in case someone finds it useful.

We have R-E revenue, FI, and dividends.

At one time, the R-E revenue dominated but, after diverting all of our spare money into equities for a few years and several sweetheart market years, the dividends are now relevant.

The core of our investments are a pair of REITS which have done extremely well. I've tried to diversify into financials, utilities, etc. and they've done OK but they have lagged the REITs.

We also have some fixed income in the form of mortgages. One of the mortgages is about to go away and we'll be left with one. I expect this final mortgage will go away in the next few years, also. The mortgages are portable but TD has been prickly about transferring them so the holder will end up with a mortgage underwritten by a bank.

We are also about to sell down the R-E. The properties have been extremely reliable and not very problematic but we'd like to spend a lot less time in Canada and I don't want to hire a manager.

Our goal is to structure our holdings into 100% equities. I only have one equity holding that predates the 2008 financial crisis and it paid dividend the entire time. Still, we are aware that dividends could stop at any time.

I've grown to like having some cash around. I like to place long-term, low ball, limit orders that more often than I would have expected at a 5~10% discount.

We have a DB pension so we won't need a lot of living cash when we retire but I imagine we will keep a couple of years in cash.

Next year, I plan to watch for a stock that stumbles and then transfer it out of our RRSP in kind where it will stay in an investment account until it recovers or we require the money. I don't know how effective this will be as TD has been slow to transfer money but I'll try to optimize, where possible.




jargey3000 said:


> question for the divvy buyers....do you take all the divs in cash? or drip? or some combo of both?


For us, it depends.

The performance of my wife's account is nearly identical to the performance of my primary RRSP which I reinvest based on a formula. For a while, she was doing a bit better than me although we hold different ratios of the same equities so that is another variable.

I think doing your own reinvestment is more valuable as a way to balance equities into desired ratios than it is to optimize reinvestment.


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

TomB19 said:


> ... Next year, I plan to watch for a stock that stumbles and then transfer it out of our RRSP in kind where it will stay in an investment account until it recovers or we require the money...


I'm not sure why you'd do this? You can transfer in kind but it doesn't accomplish much. You'll report the withdrawl as 'other income'. Any acb, gain or loss in the RRSP is moot. 
I'd be more inclined to not have a loser in my RRSP and/or to sell at a high price within the RRSP to withdraw profits. If your RRSP has a depressed stock that you want to own outside of it, use new outside money (and hope the stock recovers in both accounts - presumably you are buying it becasue you expect it to recover).


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## TomB19 (Sep 24, 2015)

OnlyMyOpinion said:


> I'd be more inclined to not have a loser in my RRSP and/or to sell at a high price within the RRSP to withdraw profits.


I appreciate your take. In our case, we will pay tax on our RRSP withdrawals so the thought is to squeeze what we can into the TFSA and withdraw the rest.

I'm not working and have no pension so I expect CG and dividend income to be taxed lower than RIF withdrawals. I haven't made a close study of it, though.

We're earning about $1000/mo in the TFSA and we live cheap so it's getting to the point the TFSA is really something great for retirees.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

TomB19 said:


> We're earning about $1000/mo in the TFSA and we live cheap so it's getting to the point the TFSA is really something great for retirees.


earning $1000/ mo? sounds pretty good.....how are you accomplishing that?


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## canew90 (Jul 13, 2016)

Our dividends generate $783/mo from both our max'ed out tfsa's (if we were withdrawing, but we reinvest them).


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

We keep income focussed investments inside our RRSP's. We do the same with TFSA's to a certain extent. We keep growth equities in no registered accounts.


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## TomB19 (Sep 24, 2015)

jargey3000 said:


> earning $1000/ mo? sounds pretty good.....how are you accomplishing that?


Two REITS, set to synthetic DRIP at TD.


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## TomB19 (Sep 24, 2015)

Further....

The $1000/mo is combined from both TFSAs.

Also, we were couch potatoes in our TFSAs for years so the growth was extremely low until 3 years ago.

Also, I've noticed other CMFers who have built their TFSAs to the same level or a bit higher than ours by using lower yielding equities. I prefer ours because of the income stream. It will be probably do better in the case of a financial meltdown but growth oriented holdings might be preferable for younger people.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Are you sure you are not counting return of capital as income?


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## TomB19 (Sep 24, 2015)

Yep. Dividends only.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

TomB19 said:


> Two REITS, set to synthetic DRIP at TD.


ok then ...TWO TFSAs generating that much combined??
(which REITs?)


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

TomB19 said:


> Two REITS, set to synthetic DRIP at TD.


ok then ...TWO TFSAs generating that much combined??
(which REITs?)


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## TomB19 (Sep 24, 2015)

Mostly NWH-UN but we also have some DRG-UN. Three months ago, it was the opposite. Both TFSAs set to DRIP. DRG-UN is the oldest holding in our TFSAs and has done extremely well for us but I've been converting some of it to NWH-UN, the past couple of months.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

thanks for the info Tom.


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