# What are the trading platforms do you use?



## Tetsujin (Mar 17, 2016)

I wonder if you can suggest a good trading platform (NOT ONLINE but that has an extension for tablets or phones optional) with a good real-time market data to measure the Canadian Market or US also (optional)?

I've using one from a brokerage and $19 per month to get Canadian real-time market data, but planning to leave this brokerage because of the ECN fees.

I will move to a big bank's brokerage, because I am becoming an active trader, but they don't have a trading platform. This brokerage is one of the 2 brokerages in Canada AFAIK that don't charge ECN fees, because they assume them.

So what are you using and how much paying currently for real-time market data and L2?

Thanks in advance.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

It is my understanding a number of big bank discount brokerages provide access to real time L2 trading platforms, and free access at certain account sizes. I have free access to both BMOIL's Market Pro Trader and Scotia iTrade's Fight Desk.


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## Tetsujin (Mar 17, 2016)

AltaRed said:


> It is my understanding a number of big bank discount brokerages provide access to real time L2 trading platforms, and free access at certain account sizes. I have free access to both BMOIL's Market Pro Trader and Scotia iTrade's Fight Desk.


You mean that on their online system at the moment of placing an order you can see real-time market data? I doubt that they are real-time bid/ask and volume data. I think you need to agree some conventions in your account to have it, but I think these online platforms are not like these kind of platform --> http://www.esignal.com/images/trading-software/eSignal/OnDemand-Trading-Platform.png

Once I talked to an agent of a big bank brokerage and told me that these bid/ask prices are not real-time data and I needed to confirm some conventions from US market to activate it.

By the way, BMO and Scotia do they charge you ECN fees or they assume them?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I have real-time market bid/ask volume data on both platforms at Level 2. Same idea as your link. 

I can create and pull up any screen I want for whatever purpose, e.g. Watchlist, Alert List, Market Depth, Charting, etc. Here are a couple of images.














iTrade has ECN fees on the sale of US stocks. I don't know about BMOIL since I have never sold a US stock in that account.


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## Tetsujin (Mar 17, 2016)

AltaRed said:


> I have real-time market bid/ask volume data on both platforms at Level 2. Same idea as your link.
> 
> I can create and pull up any screen I want for whatever purpose, e.g. Watchlist, Alert List, Market Depth, Charting, etc. Here are a couple of images.
> View attachment 15802
> ...


I don't trade on US market regularly but agent told that I needed to agree all conventions from all stock exchanges including US market to have full real-time data and also to make accessible trades from mobile app also. But I don't like to trade on these simple online web platforms. 

I use Questrade IQ Edge, but you need to pay to have real-time market data monthly and RBC doesn't have a powerful trading platform but they assume the ECN fees and Questrade doesn't.

At the University I saw the bloomberg terminals that are awesome and 101% real-time but are around $24K per year for a particular. At University for free. (https://www.bloomberg.com/professional/solution/bloomberg-terminal/)

I want to know what others are using too.

iScotia looks good. But I don't have an account with them. Thanks for sharing. Really appreciated.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I've only provided a couple of simple images from Flight Desk. There's lots of stuff and configurations one can dvelop if someone is interested. BMOILs Market ProTrader does the same sort of thing. RBC DI didn't have anything comparable I don't think though when I was with them, I wasn't using much of anything from them anyway. I always had iTrade's Flight Desk up and running.

FWIW, I recall ticking off boxes to agree to various things when I first accessed them some years back.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

the agreements that we all have to sign to obtain real-time quotes are standard. Sign em & you'll get live data, usually for free at the bank brokers.

the agreements are for the exchanges, which provide the quote data in the first place. They don't want unauthorized parties re-selling their data. The agreements are to prevent retail investors such as ourselves from black marketing quote data. 

most investors find it easy to sign & comply.

.


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## Tetsujin (Mar 17, 2016)

humble_pie said:


> the agreements that we all have to sign to obtain real-time quotes are standard. Sign em & you'll get live data, usually for free at the bank brokers.
> 
> the agreements are for the exchanges, which provide the quote data in the first place. They don't want unauthorized parties re-selling their data. The agreements are to prevent retail investors such as ourselves from black marketing quote data.
> 
> ...


Thanks for your reply humble_pie. What platform are you using? RBC only has a web online platform to quote stocks (I am gonna call them today), but I want a tool to measure trends and a better watchlist. Questrade has IQ Edge (https://community.questrade.com/b/iqnews/archive/2013/07/16/iq-edge-gets-a-makeover.aspx) but even if you agree all the conventions with them the real time market data is not included (http://www.questrade.com/pricing/self-directed-investing/market-data) I am still learning with practice. Questrade was an error for commission fees for standard lots, ECN fees (not assumed by Questrade) and not real time market data. At the beginning was brokerage to buy and hold stocks.... but later I became an active trader with more than100 x board lots.


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

I use Think or Swim which was built as an options platform but does stocks and ETFs as well. Can't tell you how it compares because I haven't used any others except Scotia's which I didn't like as well.


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## Tetsujin (Mar 17, 2016)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> I use Think or Swim which was built as an options platform but does stocks and ETFs as well. Can't tell you how it compares because I haven't used any others except Scotia's which I didn't like as well.


Excellent. Thanks for your reply. That is what I am looking for, tools that others traders use currently to compare myself and migrate. Real solutions that have been proved already instead of using Google and land on pages from marketeers.

I think this is the purpose of this forum. You help me I help you when I know! This thread has around 230 views but yes 3 people opinions. Hope people can join more.

Thanks again.

Cheers.


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## cookoosnest (Jul 23, 2017)

Tetsujin said:


> I wonder if you can suggest a good trading platform (NOT ONLINE but that has an extension for tablets or phones optional) with a good real-time market data to measure the Canadian Market or US also (optional)?
> 
> I've using one from a brokerage and $19 per month to get Canadian real-time market data, but planning to leave this brokerage because of the ECN fees.
> 
> ...


Hi, I'm not sure what is being asked here - trading platforms, trading apps, data fees, trading fees, exchange agreements, real-time data and/or level II data??

Each, in theory, could be a thread in of itself!!!

Trading Platforms - most Canadian discount brokers offer a web-based and/or stand-alone platform. In all honesty, all of the Canadian Bank discount brokers' platforms are inferior to the platforms available in US!!! It’s a shame, there is no drive to innovate. In fact, they are not even matching what is being done in the US. See Scottrade, Fidelity, Schwab, & Tastytrade. The US brokers is Apple and Canadians are Palm Pilot - sad!!!

Web-based platforms are pretty much the same across the Canadian Banks - Research platform, Option chains, and Fundamentals from Thomson Reuters, Technicals from Recognia, Research reports from in-house & 1 or 2 from 3rd party (TD - CFRA & Argus, Scotia - ValuEngine & Sabrient). To my knowledge, Scotia iTrade is the only Canadian Bank Broker that offers Level II on their web platform and on its' app free. 

Stand-alone platforms, used typically by high volume traders/large accounts, are more varied among the banks. Typically, fees are waived and provide streaming and level II quotes. Scotia iTrade & QTrade uses a rebranded Quotemedia/QuoteStream platform. TD Direct uses a Thomson Reuters created platform called Advanced Dashboard. It is the worst piece of software I have seen since Windows ME and the worst among the Canadian Bank offerings. TD does however, for US listed securities only, offers the Think or Swim platform and is the best platform offered by a Canadian Bank. Unfortunately, you cannot trade Canadian securities on it. I have asked them to add Canadian securities, however, they claim it will cost them too much money and there is not enough interest. Please send them an email to [email protected] requesting they add Canadian securities to TOS to generate that interest...squeaky wheel gets the oil!!!

Canadian Banks do not have any API's that integrates with 3rd party platforms like eSignal, TC2000, Trade Station, VectorVest, Bar Chart, TMX, QuoteStream & etc. I find these platforms more robust in screening, charting, and monitoring. Why the banks do not learn from these 3rd party vendors is beyond me but I digress. I really like the new version of TC2000 & Trade Station. The issue with a 3rd party is the cost (platform costs & data costs) and lack of integration to a Canadian Bank Broker trading platform. However, you need superior technology if you are a serious trader. If you are successful with the Canadian Bank Broker technology, then 3rd party platforms will elevate your trading. A 5 cent benefit on a buy and sell on 2000 shares/20 contracts is $200 – is enough to pay for this technology. Do not skimp on learning and tools.

Unfortunately, trading fees will be charged at will by the Canadian banks unless we do something about them. Fees, in general, are higher in Canada than the US. Robinhood and/or Robinhood-like free-brokers are not in Canada and there is a lack of competition to drive fees lower and innovate. How much fees are charged depends on us. Everyone should negotiate fees with their broker. I pay $4.95 equity & $4.95 +$0.75 options. Obviously, high volume accounts/large assets/instrument traded will determine the amount of leverage you have to negotiate.

ECN fees/SEC fees and data fees are valid fees. You will be paying them either individually or embedded in the trade commission fee - either way you are paying and is the cost of doing business.

If you are daytrading/swing trading, you need real-time, low latency data. You cannot trade successfully this way if your data is delayed. The data at the Canadian Bank web platforms are all delayed even the real-time quotes are delayed. The charts are delayed anywhere from 15-30 minutes. The "real-time" bid/ask quotes are also delayed by the time they reach you and must be refreshed because they are not streaming. Even the real-time streaming quotes on the stand-alone platforms, I have found are delayed. To be fair this can be many issues - in-house wiring, router, distance, stability, processor load, etc. I have found that many of my trades are front-runned by the algos/HFTs/market-maker. It is especially noticeable in the Canadian Option market. 

The data we get in Canada is frequently provided by a 3rd party. It then goes to the Bank and finally to the end-user. By itself it is delayed then getting the data directly from the exchange. There is a reason why HFTs have set-up shop in next to the exchanges. Read Flash Boys: A Wall Street Revolt by Micheal Lewis for more information on HFTs/data/exchanges. Amusingly, I have yet to find one person at a Canadian Bank Discount Broker to have read the book!!!

In short, I am unable to answer your questions because I am not sure what is being asked but more importantly I do not know if you are a trader or investor, futures or equities or options, low or high trade volumes, large or small asset base, banking requirements or not, etc. For example, TD Direct does multi-leg US options on web platform but iTrade does not. ITrade’s app is better than TD direct. ITrade has Level II quotes in the app & web platforms and TD does not. QuesTrade has the cheapest trade fees, independent and not attached to a bank and iTrade & TD Direct are the opposite. 

In closing, I have yet to find the holy grail. You’ll need to test drive a couple brokers/platforms yourself to assess if they address your needs. Sorry……


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## jollybear (Jun 28, 2015)

What products is the original poster trying to actively trade? What about slippage? If you are placing market buy/sell orders and incurring ECN fees that should be considered a cost of doing business and a detail in your overall plan. I use Investor R/T for charting powered by DTN IQFeed data with VeloxPro Bookmap for order flow and executing trades. I spend over $400US/month and would not even consider day trading future`s markets without that level of software.


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