# 18 years old, summer full time. Where do I start?



## ajmede (Jun 15, 2011)

Firstly my short term goal is buying a car so its obvious my best bet is to just save up what I make for the summer, after that I want to save up to buy my own place. I currently work minimum wage full time that ends around September and I'll be going back to school (I dropped out but I have plans on going back before its too late) and I want to take whatever I earn and save it up or double it.

I guess my question in a nutshell is; what are the best choices for my money to grow while unemployed? Whether it be saving, investing etc. I apologize in advance if what I'm asking is incoherent! I'm completely lost.


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## Mark Rose (Jun 14, 2011)

I'm going to bold and cap this, because it's so important *STAY OUT OF DEBT*. That includes student loans, unless you're guaranteed to make _significantly_ more money with the degree. You have to factor in the debt repayment, interest (which can only go higher), and lost time earning wages (4 years, average $25,000 is $100,000 lost! *plus* the cost of going to school!). Look at the numbers.

For most jobs, having experience and a proven track record counts for more than a degree. If you don't need a degree, it's hugely expensive to get one.

I'd check out this blog: http://www.fastlaneentrepreneurs.com/

Remember that real inflation is somewhere between 5 and 10%. With interest rates as low as they are, you're not going to make money in real terms with commonly considered "safe" investments. Stocks are in a long term bear market for the next ten years or so, while real assets are in a long term bull. If you want to store your money longer term, precious metals (bullion only, not numismatics!) are a reasonable way of going (though they're likely headed down for the next couple months or so). In the short term, cash is probably the best way to go. You'll lose some value to inflation, but with things as volatile as they are now, it's less risky for the short term.

If I were in your position, I'd keep working. Do well at your job, build a career. Look at the big picture.


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## ajmede (Jun 15, 2011)

I like the idea of continuing work. I didn't think diplomas meant much anyway, and theres no way I'd be able to stay in school with no cash flow, or just getting part time. I mean jeez, How can I get rich with just part time?? I'll check that link out, thanks


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

Yeah, to keep it simple, stay out of debt. Figure out what you want to do with your career/education first. IMO at your age the only good debt is school debt.


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## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

Rather than tell you what to do, or what not to do, I will tell you what *I* did.

At 18 I chose to go to school for Finance. It cost me about $12k for two years and I didnt even purchase textbooks. I did it ALL from my head. I did quite well, but my heart wasnt in it and I dropped out before my last year. I was working full time the entire time (nights) so I managed to keep myself out of debt. I bought a car when I first turned 16 from saved money I had from working from 14yrs-16yrs. I am now 21, still have not finished my last year in school, work full time for BMO and have started taking courses that will help me more or less advance my career and get experience.

I would _suggest_ you make sure that school is something you really want to do. Keep in mind what Mark Rose said in his first paragraph. School is expensive and it does not gaurantee you a job. Hard work, dedication, confidence, persistence and experience is what gets you the job.

But the greatest advice I can give you is to not buy a car. I love cars, I have owned 4 already, two of which I still have. They are the biggest money pits on the entire planet, no matter how cool they may be.


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## bmckay (Mar 10, 2011)

Your only 18 - what do you mean your going back to school before it's too late? It is never too late. People go back to school at all stages of life.

If your not interested in going to university I would suggest getting a 2-year diploma in a field where work is available. I did this and got a diploma in Correctional Services. There will always be work in this field, and there are plenty of opportunities. Or you could get into trades, but even these days you need to take courses to get into it (or at least it will help).

Save your cash, stay out of debt, and seriously think about what you want to do with your life


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## w0nger (Mar 15, 2010)

GOTO SCHOOL....

school is not a cost, it's an investement and a solid one of that with almost guaranteed dividends that no other investment in the market will ever get you. Education may not provide you right away with that 6 digit income, but it's the basis of your working life and will provide more stability for you in your career. 

I have a degree and a technical diploma and after being in the workforce for 8 years now, i'm going back to school part time to earn my MBA. 

Education... what other investment that costs about 20k will return a consistent 40k-150k per year for the rest of your life?


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## the-royal-mail (Dec 11, 2009)

Forget about making your money grow. This is not the time in your life where that will help you. The next several years will be costly and assuming you follow the excellent advice and stay in school, you will need every penny on things like living expenses, food, tuition and books. Your student loans and income from min. wage work will hopefully cover the money you will need.

Even if you get 10% growth on savings of $500 locked in for 12 months, you will get $50 for the effort.

$50 won't change your life.

Forget about investing and growth. That applies to people who are further along in life than you and have significant capital to deploy.


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## moneymusing (Apr 3, 2009)

Go to school. It's worth the investment! Not only will you gain the "paper cred" that you need to get jobs in certain fields. It will also allow you to open up new networks of people that you might not have met otherwise.

At such a young age you should be soaking up as much knowledge, culture, and experience as possible. 

For me, the 4 years of university have more than made up for the cost. The ROI is significant and not a waste at all. Of course YMMV.


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## I'm Howard (Oct 13, 2010)

MarkRose is right, you don't need a degree for a job, but you do need one for a career.

People will borrow hundreds of thousands to buy a bunch of bricks and sticks, but view student loans to invest in yourself as bad?

Cars are a cash sucker,insurance, repairs, tickets etc, not a good idea unless a must for transportation.

What's wrong with Night School, why can't you work during the day, take some courses at night, I did and I loved them, the students were more mature and great company.

DO NOT take a degree in something you like, take a degree in something that will get you a job.

There are tons of Ph.D's out there with huge debt and zero job prospects. 

18 good on you, good questions , and remember, a fool learns from his own mistakes a wise person from the mistakes of others.

All Work and No Play, makes Jack.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

I agree with Howard. You're very young, and this the best long term investment you can make on yourself is getting an education. 

I would make sure you get something that you can get a job in, so it doesn't have to be a degree, but whatever it is, make sure that there is a market for it. The longer you wait, the higher the opportunity costs will be. Right now, you're making minimum wage, it's not difficult to walk away to get an education. However, when you start to make better money, or start a family or have others relying on you, it's much harder then. 

I know people who are now older, and have hit a ceiling because they don't have a degree, but yet, cannot afford the time off because they have to have the income now.


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## the-royal-mail (Dec 11, 2009)

^*Very* well said, PA. I completely agree but hadn't really thought it through that way before. Bang on. I ran into that issue in the past, where some of the more substantial day courses at brick & mortar colleges pre-empty my ability to be at a full time, meaningful job. I always thought, "what if I start this 1-2 yr day course now and I have a job offer partway through?"

And I'm not really interested in working crap, part time low wage jobs either. I did enough of that in my youth to last me 5 lifetimes. Sure am glad I went right into college at 17 and not waste time taking a year off or working up north. You quickly become disconnected from mainstream life when you do that before getting a good educational foundation.


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## BarryD (Nov 8, 2010)

ajmede, every career path is different. Sometimes street smart works better than book smart, sometimes not. Finding that place in the middle - that's it - easier said...

The folks who posted above know what they're talking about. You've got your head on straight and good for you.

Stop worrying about the $ part. It'll look after itself. Have fun, buy a car, get a 90 inch TV, goof around Europe.... You don't want to be 50 and pissed off at yourself because you didn't. The window is wide open for you. Compared to a few kids I know that can't nuke a Pizza Pop at 18, you'll do fine.


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## Karen (Jul 24, 2010)

There's some very good advice in this thread, but I don't necessarily agree with the idea that young people should not worry about the future but concentrate on having a good time while they're young. There's nothing wrong with that advice, but what I question is people assuming that everyone's idea of a good time is the same as theirs. When I was young, I had absolutely no interest in things like trekking around Europe and staying in youth hostels. Some of my friends did that and invited me to come with them - the thought sent shivers down my spine! My friends went and had a wonderful time - I would have hated it. I also would have had no interest in owning a 50 inch TV set, even if such a thing had been available then - I still don't. There's nothing wrong with a person's goal being to establish some financial security early in lilfe. There's nothing wrong with delaying that goal, either, but it's a matter of an individual's values and priorities.


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## bmckay (Mar 10, 2011)

It is important to think about the future, or at least know the general direction you are taking. But I think us young people should try different things, have different experiences, and just generally have an open mind. This is important to becoming a well-rounded person. But I am only 22, what do I know


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## Karen (Jul 24, 2010)

> ...But I am only 22, what do I know


You know plenty, bmckay - about what's the right thing for you. The point I was trying to make is that what's right for you wasn't necessarily right for me when I was young. I'm quite sure I turned out to be a well-rounded person, even though my way of going about that might not be someone else's idea of how to accomplish it. I have always been interested in many different things that I have no intentions of actually doing - witness the fact that I thoroughly reading about the different outlooks of people on this forum, even though I don't invest in stocks myself. I read by the hour, about everything under the sun. (Right now, I'm reading a book called "Nicholas II, The Last of the Tsars" which I'm thoroughly enjoying, but I haven't the slightest desire to go to Russia to find out more about it.)


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## zylon (Oct 27, 2010)

*off topic*

post deleted ... off topic

sorry


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## Karen (Jul 24, 2010)

Yes, it's a very interesting book, Zylon. I have a particular interest in British history and the history of the British royal family, which led to some of their relatives, including Nicholas' wife, Alexandra, who was a granddaughter of Queen Victoria. Along with so many people, I read and was fascinated by "Nicholas and Alexandra" when it was so popular (was it in the 1970's?), but eventually went on to other things. My interest was renewed earlier this year during our federal election when I wanted to learn more about our Liberal leader, Michael Ignatieff, and his grandfather's position as a Russian count and a member of Nicholas' government. So I read Ignatieff's book "The Russian Album" and that got me back to the Romanoffs, and here I am reading "Nicholas II, The Last of the Tsars." 

Oh dear, I'm going to be lectured for going off topic again - it seems to be a weakness of mine that I've got into trouble for before - so I'd better let the thread get back on track. Maybe we need a forum Book Club!


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## crazyjackcsa (Aug 8, 2010)

There is some good advice in the thread, and I'd like to add mine.

I'm 30, but I fully remember what it's like at that age. My advice is save, and sit on cash/gic/bond. You aren't to the point where growth is an issue. I say buy what you want. Hell, at 20 I bought a 1971 Buick Riviera. The trick is avoiding debt. Period. Go to school, it's a good move, find something you're good at, and that pays. 

I went for something I love, and it doesn't pay. BUT since I came out of school with zero debt, I'm smelling like a rose. 

You're young, and at this age it's time to keep things easy. Spend less than you make, and sock the rest away in the bank.


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## financialnoob (Feb 26, 2011)

Just taking a stab in the dark without numbers here, but at minimum wage over the summer, I'm guessing you might save up to $5K over the summer, so you're probably better off opening up a TFSA if you don't have one already. 

Considering your goals (going back to school, buying a car) are more shorter-term, saving is probably better than investing short-term, which carries a lot more risk. The TFSA will give you some return on principle while giving you easy access to the cash.

As for the question of degree or not, I think a degree is becoming almost mandatory for most industries. Depending on what you do, you should look into how essential it is. There's no one-size-fits-all thing here. But I like PA's advice, look into how important it may be for your future, and think longer-term here if it is necessary.

On Karen's advice, I think that is good as well. I was thinking about the Millionaire Next Door, and how self-made millionaires often spoiled their kids to have things/do things they couldn't, but it only made the kids less responsible/self-reliant. It's natural to wish for the next generation to not have to be limited or concern themselves with finances, but there are valuable life lessons to be learned in budgeting and understanding finances.

Like in KaeJS's thread, life is about balancing. I think the OP should be budgeting for some fun and experiences as many have suggested, but not with the entire amount earned. Otherwise the goals of school and car may not happen.


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## ajmede (Jun 15, 2011)

If it helps any (Oh and I have read all of your replies, absorbing the information, thanks!) I plan on opening my own little Computer hardware shop in long term, or doing something along the lines of Computer engineering. And yes I'll have about $5,000 after the summers done (Minus bus fare, food and some bills my parents want me to help them pay) So maybe about $2000 - $3000 

Again, thanks for all the replies!


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## donald (Apr 18, 2011)

I agree with the others,focus on a education,i dont have one,but its your best bet!!i would honestly go after computer engineering if i were you and had a passion for it,over opening a small company.

Going into business for yourself has nothing to do with computers even thou thats what you will be marketing.If business and self employment intrest you more than computers get enrolled in business school,mba,finance ect.

I dont know your personality but i would say enjoy life as much as you can now.dont "try" to grow up to fast!it will come fast enough.


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## I'm Howard (Oct 13, 2010)

Computer Hardware, as is, Best Buy and Walmart are my competition, and the IPad could make the PC obsolete?


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## Zara Mari (May 19, 2011)

Back in my summer job days, staying out of debt and saving money was a very easy thing to do. That was back in high school when I was still living with my folks, since I have left, everything was different.

Having tons of debts was easier and saving up was a very hard thing to do. But you know, after some self discipline moves, saving up can be not too difficult. Spending it is another issue though.

I remember saving up for my first car, I was supposed to buy a second hand car but after going to the bank and having to tell my story to one of the teller, (since I have savings for some time) they gave me a car loan. I guess having a good bank history helps.


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