# TD Canada Trust: increase mortgage amount, increase amortization period, reduce monthly payments?



## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Hi guys,

I hope everyone is surviving the pandemic intact! I have upcoming house repairs of about $80,000, I have oodles of equity in my house, an excellent long term credit rating etc, but I have reduced my income so I need to make some changes.

What I want to do is have my present mortgage increased by $80,000 to cover home repairs, up the amortization period to 25 years (or more), reduce monthly payments to the lowest possible, and get the lowest interest rate (naturally).

TD Canada Trust tells me there will be legal and appraisal fees, but I've heard these can be waived if I negotiate things well. Also, it seems to me that interest rates are unlikely to get much lower, so I might want to switch from variable to fixed at five years or longer.

Monthly payments: $1,600
Remaining balance: $45,000
Variable interest rate: 1.65% (prime minus .95)
Term: 60 months
Remaining amortization period: 2 years & 4 months
Maturity date: March 2024

What do you guys figure is the best way to go about all this? I have been with TD Canada Trust for decades, but I have found them to only be adequate when it comes to best rates, and annoyingly time consuming when to comes to waiving fees / reducing fees. I am prepared to go through a few weeks of fiddly email negotiations, but I'm thinking some of you guys likely have a bottom line scenario I can use for my negotiation template. I could switch to other than one of the big banks, as they sometimes are more competitive, but I guess we'll see how things go.

Many thanks!


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

A TD advisor or mortgage specialist hates deals like this. New borrowings of only 80,000 are not worth their time. And chances are if you’re in branch, you’re gonna get an inexperienced rep as the tenured ones know better to avoid these small deals. They don’t get full credit for the new larger amount.....they’ll get full credit for the 80k, and some much smaller credit for the existing balance. 

I’d suggest finding a non-bank broker and have them shop the deal around. What’s the total borrowing amount?


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

I’d look into a home equity line of credit (heloc). TD allows you to lock in portions just like a mortgage but, as you pay it down, the equity becomes available for future needs. You could also only pay thr interest if things go bad financially. Very flexible product.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks very kindly Money172375,

1. OK, a TD advisor or mortgage specialist might hate deals like this, may I ask what you mean when you mention they don’t get full credit? Are they commissioned?

2. I’ll take your suggestion to use a non-bank broker to shop the deal.

3. The total borrowing amount is the remaining balance $45,000 + upcoming repairs $80,000 = $125,000. Does that amount give you any further insight into your suggestions?


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Also thanks very kindly Just a Guy,

It did not occur to me to use an HELOC for this purpose. I'll contact TD and see how that might compare to a new mortgage as I initially outlined. I like the idea of paying interest charges only if things were to go terribly wrong (I don’t mean I like the idea of things going terribly wrong = bad joke).


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

Money Muffin said:


> Thanks very kindly Money172375,
> 
> 1. OK, a TD advisor or mortgage specialist might hate deals like this, may I ask what you mean when you mention they don’t get full credit? Are they commissioned?
> 
> ...


MMS (mobile mortgage specialists) are 100% commissioned. Branch staff are on a salary with an incentive plan. They earn “credits” for sales, with preference to “new“ money

going with a heloc is a god option, you’ll get more favourable terms (rate, fee waivers) if you apply for a LOC for 65% of the value of the home....or even 80%. They can then transfer your existing mortgage into a fixed rate portion of the LOC.....and the remaining amount will be available to you at an open and floating rate.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

That's intriguing Money172375, I did not know that there was such a position as an MMS versus a branch staff. If you have any further insights into the underbelly of the beast as it relates to my concerns, I would be very interested to hear about them.

I further appreciate your perspectives as to going with a HELOC versus a new mortgage. I wonder if I should bid that out via a non-bank broker in addition to doing so based on my initial idea? I.e. contact a non-bank broker to see which of the two options (new mortgage vs. HELOC) the non-bank broker can get the best deal on.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

You’re going to pay a penalty if you move away from TD. 3 months interest. Couple hundred bucks. sorry, don’t know how I missed that. when I was a MMS, the rates on mortgages vs fixed rate portions within a LOC were virtually identical. 

if you’re willing to apply for the max amount, you should be able to get a good rate and your fees waived. What’s your home worth?


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

I am learning a lot thanks to you Money172375!

The assessed value is about 1.6 million, however (if it's of any consequence) I have no need (nor will I ever likely have need) to access any more than the amounts mentioned in my first post i.e. the total borrowing amount is the remaining balance $45,000 + upcoming repairs $80,000 = $125,000.

Monthly payments: $1,600
Remaining balance: $45,000
Variable interest rate: 1.65% (prime minus .95)
Term: 60 months
Remaining amortization period: 2 years & 4 months
Maturity date: March 2024

I do want to up the amortization period to 25 years (or more), reduce monthly payments to the lowest possible, and get the lowest interest rate (naturally) but that's for predictable and stable cash flow reasons only.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

Money Muffin said:


> I am learning a lot thanks to you Money172375!
> 
> The assessed value is about 1.6 million, however (if it's of any consequence) I have no need (nor will I ever likely have need) to access any more than the amounts mentioned in my first post i.e. the total borrowing amount is the remaining balance $45,000 + upcoming repairs $80,000 = $125,000.
> 
> Although I do want to up the amortization period to 25 years (or more), reduce monthly payments to the lowest possible, and get the lowest interest rate (naturally) for cash flow reasons.


If you’d be willing to set up a line for $200-$300k....you should find a MMS who Would gladly take on the deal.

I’m not saying someone won’t do the deal properly at the levels you want, but you may end up with a junior advisor or even an experienced one who won’t make it their priority. for A MMS to waive setup fees, they are directly absorbing this cost, so it comes out of their commission.
I can’t recall exactly, but a branch may only have budget to waive fees on half a dozen deals a month, so they like to reserve the fee waiving for larger deals. And given the size of your existing mortgage, they’re likely not going to care about losing it if you choose to go somewhere else based on fees/rate.

you can find a local MMS simply by googling them....and then calling or emailing them. I’m sure they’re quickly jump to upwelling you to a higher limit (remember, just because the LOC has a higher limit, you’re only paying interest on what you borrow). If you go this route, I’d be clear and upfront with them. Ie. I have a mortgage of $x, I need to brow an additional $x, can you waive the setup fees? If not, how big of a LOC would I need to apply for, if I don’t want to pay fees. That‘s all on top of finding out what their best rate is.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Much thanks for your insights Money172375, I've now got some knowledge!

I found a link to " Meet a TD Mobile Mortgage Specialist…" about ½ way down this page TD Mortgage Advisor - TD Canada Trust
Also, I'll see what a non-bank broker comes up with when shopping the deal around.


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## Retiredguy (Jul 24, 2013)

Do you have any non registered investments? Sell the investments, pay for the 125K mortgage and repairs and buy back the investments with borrowed (mortgage) money and deduct the interest.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Financing is one half the consideration. The other half is performing due diligence on the contractor you hire to do the renovations.

I had a female colleague who had similar plans as you and was spending about $80,000 for renovations to create an apartment in the second level of an old house.

She asked me for recommendations and I gave her some names of high quality contractors, and instead she hired her husband's "buddy" who was a self employed "contractor".

A few months later, some construction ripped apart, some big payments made in advance for "materials" and the guy never showed up again.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Hi Retiredguy,
My non-registered portfolio is already leveraged at very competitive rates through Interactive Brokers Canada. For example the blended rate to borrow $500,000 Cdn is 1.140% and yep the interest is tax deductable, but I like the cut of your jib my friend!

It's an interesting question as to whether additional margin (via home equity for example) to purchase additional securities is merited given my age, income, asset allocation, net equity, frothiness of global equities markets etc, but that's rather a complex topic to address here me thinks.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Hi sags,
Your points are well taken that home repairs are often fraught with incompetent tradesmen who do not have their Interprovincial Standards Red Seal, even if you reply on so-called "high quality contractors". Unfortunately due to anti-union activities and deregulation both the Canadian construction industry and the formalized apprenticeship program are in tatters, and may never recover. There is so much new crap being put out in both residential and commercial it's appalling.


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## Mortgage u/w (Feb 6, 2014)

You definitely have to pay for appraisal fees and solicitor fees to reregister the mortgage.

You can get your amortization as high as 30 years if you want low payments.

I recommend setting up a HELOC where you can unlock up to 65% of equity as a LOC. You use what you need and once its in place, you will never need to reregister a mortgage if you need additional funds.

I suggest a fixed mortgage of $125,000 on a variable rate and the balance made available as a LOC which will most likely be priced at Prime +0.50%. Seek a mortgage broker if you want to explore all the best options out there.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks very kindly for your input Mortgage u/w, I'm hoping to reduce and/or waive fees (you mention I can't and you may well be correct).

I've got prime minus .95 at present, so I can't see why I cannot continue with that, should I go for an adjustable rate equivalent, unless of course I go for fixed as may well be the better choice, given rates are unlikely to get any lower. Even if I go for fixed, I should be able to do better than the big six banks' posted rates, even if I stay with TD, don't you think?

On the other hand, since the total mortgage amount of $125,000 is rather low, I could afford the interest rate risk without undue concerns, especially considering that if interest rates did rise by any consequential amount, the entire world would have plenty more to worry about than fractionally more in my relatively small domestic mortgage payments, don't you think? In other words, if interest rates did rise by any consequential amount, global bond and equities will not only tank but stay tanked for some time, and my fractional mortgage payment increases will be inconsequential by comparison to my (and most everyone's decrease in net worth).

I'm told that Scotiabank will cover legal fees, discharge fees, and appraisal fees up to $1,200 if applying for a $100k + mortgage, and I would qualify. Of course, the devil is in the details but at the least I can use this as leverage with my TD branch.

I'll guess we'll see which way the wind blows, and of course my crystal ball is pretty shabby at seeing into to future.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

I am not sure why my above message has be flagged "This message is awaiting moderator approval, and is invisible to normal visitors." but rest assured I have responded in kind to your posting Mortgage u/w!


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

I figure I'll simply repost following:

Thanks very kindly for your input Mortgage u/w, I'm hoping to reduce and/or waive fees (you mention I can't and you may well be correct).

I've got prime minus .95 at present, so I can't see why I cannot continue with that, should I go for an adjustable rate equivalent, unless of course I go for fixed as may well be the better choice, given rates are unlikely to get any lower. Even if I go for fixed, I should be able to do better than the big six banks' posted rates, even if I stay with TD, don't you think?

On the other hand, since the total mortgage amount of $125,000 is rather low, I could afford the interest rate risk without undue concerns, especially considering that if interest rates did rise by any consequential amount, the entire world would have plenty more to worry about than fractionally more in my relatively small domestic mortgage payments, don't you think? In other words, if interest rates did rise by any consequential amount, global bond and equities will not only tank but stay tanked for some time, and my fractional mortgage payment increases will be inconsequential by comparison to my (and most everyone's decrease in net worth).

I'm told that Scotiabank will cover legal fees, discharge fees, and appraisal fees up to $1,200 if applying for a $100k + mortgage, and I would qualify. Of course, the devil is in the details but at the least I can use this as leverage with my TD branch.

I'll guess we'll see which way the wind blows, and of course my crystal ball is pretty shabby at seeing into to future.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

Money Muffin said:


> I figure I'll simply repost following:
> 
> Thanks very kindly for your input Mortgage u/w, I'm hoping to reduce and/or waive fees (you mention I can't and you may well be correct).
> 
> ...


You may be able to port or transfer your existing VIRM into the new LOC. I can’t recall exactly the virm port rules at TD for refinances. Be sure to ask about porting it over to the new LOC.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

I did not know that and thank you Money172375, i.e. I may be able to port or transfer (I assume without charges?) my existing variable interest rate mortgage into the new HELOC.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

Money Muffin said:


> I did not know that and thank you Money172375, i.e. I may be able to port or transfer (I assume without charges?) my existing variable interest rate mortgage into the new HELOC.


Maybe. I forgot the policy of transferring a VIRM mortgage into a heloc With a virm portion. Worth asking


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## Mortgage u/w (Feb 6, 2014)

Banks are very aggressive these days and are offering lots of incentives to attract clients. Your offer from Scotia seems very typical. Just make sure that the money they are giving you is not conditioned to be repaid should you ever break your term.

I always recommend a variable rate, regardless how close the spread is to a fixed rate. Banks have horrible penalty calculators when it comes to fixed rates. Variable rates carry a standard 3 month interest penalty. So just like you are breaking your current mortgage to get more money, you would incur a much higher penalty if your rate was fixed. Currently, your penalty to break your $45000 mortgage will be only $185, roughly.

Just like you don't time the stock market, you also don't time mortgage rates. Choose benefits and flexibility over pricing alone. Don't lock yourself in. If it makes you feel better, BoC announced rates will not move for at least another 2 years. Also, if rates drop further, you gain if you choose variable. On a fixed, you don't have that option. You pay a premium to lock in a rate because you believe rates will increase. Assuming you're right, are you willing to pay another premium once your term is up?

You may or may not get -0.95%. Rates haven't moved much since.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Hi Mortgage u/w,

As to the penalties of variable versus locked in, I did not know that the penalties would be higher for locked in, so thank you very much indeed for your insights!

Of course you are correct that no one can predict long term interest rate trends with any reasonable degree of consistency, to the point where profitability can be reasonably assured (taking into account opportunity costs etc). Having said that, I'll bet you that interest rates will be substantively higher in ten years, and I may be willing to take that gamble to lock in, if the spreads are thin enough between fixed and variable, given I have no reason / intention to pay off the $125,000 quickly.

Question 1. Why would I pay another premium once my term is up (if by premium you mean the spread between fixed and variable)?
Question 2. You mention that I may or may not get -0.95% because rates haven't moved much since. What does prime minus .95 have to do with your viewpoint?

Thank you so much!

PS: I've used variable-rate mortgages for most (if not all) of my real estate as I did not feel the additional costs of fixed were worth the potential benefits, but we are in a very unusual set of circumstances now, arguably historically unprecedented plus (as mentioned) I have no reason / intention to pay off the $125,000 quickly.
PPS: I place little importance on the predictive announcements by the BOC. I listen to the US Federal Reserve, Europe Central Bank, Bank of Japan, People's Bank of China, etc. The BOC is pretty much irrelevant compared to that group. So, regardless of what Poloz or the new hireling Macklem might claim, the BOC cannot maintain an independent interest rate policy.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Again I got "This message is awaiting moderator approval, and is invisible to normal visitors." so I've re-posted following: 

Hi Mortgage u/w,

As to the penalties of variable versus locked in, I did not know that the penalties would be higher for locked in, so thank you very much indeed for your insights!

Of course you are correct that no one can predict long term interest rate trends with any reasonable degree of consistency, to the point where profitability can be reasonably assured (taking into account opportunity costs etc). Having said that, I'll bet you that interest rates will be substantively higher in ten years, and I may be willing to take that gamble to lock in, if the spreads are thin enough between fixed and variable, given I have no reason / intention to pay off the $125,000 quickly.

Question 1. Why would I pay another premium once my term is up (if by premium you mean the spread between fixed and variable)?
Question 2. You mention that I may or may not get -0.95% because rates haven't moved much since. What does prime minus .95 have to do with your viewpoint?

Thank you so much!

PS: I've used variable-rate mortgages for most (if not all) of my real estate as I did not feel the additional costs of fixed were worth the potential benefits, but we are in a very unusual set of circumstances now, arguably historically unprecedented plus (as mentioned) I have no reason / intention to pay off the $125,000 quickly.
PPS: I place little importance on the predictive announcements by the BOC. I listen to the US Federal Reserve, Europe Central Bank, Bank of Japan, People's Bank of China, etc. The BOC is pretty much irrelevant compared to that group. So, regardless of what Poloz or the new hireling Macklem might claim, the BOC cannot maintain an independent interest rate policy.
PPPS: I'll make an additional bet, the BOC will drop rates further sometime in the next few years, if the US dollar fails to appreciate against a basket of foreign currencies (no I am not a currency speculator and I have no dog in this hunt)!


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## Mortgage u/w (Feb 6, 2014)

If I had a nickel for every time someone told me that rates can't go any lower.........

Its over ten years I've heard that line and in that period of time, rates did the exact opposite - they went lower, and lower, and lower....

The spread between fixed and variable is irrelevant. Variable rates have consistently out-performed the fixed rates. Fixed rates do not increase or decrease at the same rate as variable rates do so it is not fair to compare the two.

When choosing a fixed rate, you are paying a premium to secure it (fixed rates are normally higher than variable). My previous point on paying a premium upon renewal is you will end up paying another premium by choosing again the fixed rate. So if you are consistently right where rates keep going up, that means you will keep paying a premium to secure the highest rate available - all the time. When rates go down, however, you miss out. On a variable, you benefit. Even if a variable rate goes up, you still saved several months in your term at a lower rate.

Then there is flexibility. Breaking a mortgage mid-term (which many, MANY do), will save you tons of money on penalty costs. Stats support the fact that the majority of borrowers do not make it to the end of their term - yes, more than 50%. Banks are not making all their money on lending their money for a 2% return when they need to borrow it themselves.

The choice is yours but there is a price to pay for security and a bigger price to pay when you predict the market.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

A thoughtful and much appreciated reply my friend Mortgage u/w, my all-seeing all-knowing crystal ball is rather murky!


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Hi gang, I've hit a snag!

Everything was going swimmingly, and I was pretty happy with the numbers, and TD is good with waiving fees etc, and I'm OK with prime minus .95 (which is not outstanding but...) however it turns out that TD wants me to repay the deferred property taxes of about $30,000 before they will proceed.

I figure there's got to be a way to have really low mortgage payments, without repaying the deferred property taxes, even if that means I postpone the $80,00 repairs and stick with the existing remaining balance of about $45,000.

The final plan was to have my present mortgage increased by $80,000 to cover upcoming home repairs, increase the amortization period to 20 years (or more), reduce monthly payments to the lowest possible, and get the lowest adjustable rate for a five year term or so. The total borrowing amount would be the remaining mortgage balance of $45,000 + upcoming repairs $80,000 = $125,000. The problem is I did not realize the repayment of the deferred property taxes was a consideration.

Here are the way things are now:

Assessed value about 1.5 million
Monthly payments about: $1,600
Remaining balance about: $45,000
Variable interest rate: 1.65% (prime minus .95)
Term: 60 months
Remaining amortization period: 2 years & 4 month
Maturity date: March 2024


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## Mortgage u/w (Feb 6, 2014)

Can you explain why your property taxes are deferred? And if your obtaining a mortgage, why wouldn’t you pay the taxes owed?


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Hi Mortgage u/w, good to hear from your again! I hope you are keeping well during this insane period of the pandemic and social unrest. Have a look-see here as to who qualifies etc Defer Your Property Taxes

The reasons I did this are:
1. I qualify for it.
2. The interest rate is very low.
3. My cash flow is improved.
4. I'm willing to bet that the interest costs on the deferred taxes ends up being less than the appreciated value of the property for the period of time in question.
5. I'm willing to bet that the total unpaid taxes will never get large enough to be a concern in my lifetime given I have no interest in selling the house or leaving the house until my timely demise.
6. It is common practice here in the Lower Mainland of BC for the reasons outlined above, and if the whole thing becomes an unmitigated disaster, then misery loves company.

Of course the BC Tax Deferment Program and my rationale for doing so, do not change the fact that TD wants me to repay the deferred property taxes of about $30,000 before they will proceed. Which is odd, because once the new mortgage is in place, they told me they have no problems with me reapplying and being accepted again for the BC Tax Deferment Program. From what I could gather, it seems this is standard policy for TD here in BC, even if I had just one year of deferment (I have not confirmed this with certainty though).

Also rather odd it seems to me, is that the BC Tax deferment program does not affect in any way the financing that would naturally take place every five year term on a 20 year mortgage (assuming you used five year terms).

I am curious, have you not heard of the BC Tax deferment program?


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

Money Muffin said:


> Hi Mortgage u/w, good to hear from your again! I hope you are keeping well during this insane period of the pandemic and social unrest. Have a look-see here as to who qualifies etc Defer Your Property Taxes
> 
> The reasons I did this are:
> 1. I qualify for it.
> ...


News to me...never heard of it. Don’t believe anything like that exists in Ont.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

I may have missed it, but can you share the reason for the need of lower payments and extended amortization? Is a reverse mortgage another option?


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## Mortgage u/w (Feb 6, 2014)

Money Muffin said:


> Hi Mortgage u/w, good to hear from your again! I hope you are keeping well during this insane period of the pandemic and social unrest. Have a look-see here as to who qualifies etc Defer Your Property Taxes
> 
> The reasons I did this are:
> 1. I qualify for it.
> ...


I have definitely heard of the program but was questioning as to why you choose to take part of the program.

You hardly have a mortgage so why wouldn't you take advantage of paying them off now that the interest rates are at an all-time low.....you're redoing your mortgage anyways.

I get the cash flow, etc, etc,. I don't know what your income is like but if you can afford it, I would suggest paying them. Just my 2 cents here and I respect your decision for not choosing to as well.

My concern with tax deferring is if the program ever ceases to exist or the time comes to start paying them with borrowed money, how many people will have to choose to sell instead? 

I cant comment on TD's rules for requiring you to pay them off....but maybe they see something in the future we don't.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Hi Money172375, I have not searched other provinces as to what Property Tax Deferment Programs might be in place as I live in BC. Here's a copy-paste quote as per this link Property Title Changes While in Tax Deferment

"Property title changes you can’t make while in the tax deferment program
Situations where you would have to pay off your deferment loan include:
Selling your property
Adding someone to title who isn't your spouse
Removing someone from title who isn't deceased
Refinancing with most lenders (check with your lender to confirm)
When refinancing, some lenders want their lien to have priority over the property tax deferment lien to protect their loan in certain situations, such as bankruptcy. However, we won’t give any new liens or charges on title priority over our tax deferment lien."

To respond to your question about sharing the reason for doing all this and the prospects for a reverse mortgage:
a. Although I sincerely appreciate your input and I look forward to your continued contributions I'd rather keep certain aspects private, as it is a public forum.
b. As to a reverse mortgage, I figure that would be like trying to kill a mosquito with an M16 rifle when viewed from the perspectives of benefits versus costs versus risks as compared to a refinancing of the type we are discussing.


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## Money Muffin (Oct 3, 2019)

Hi Mortgage u/w, have look-see at my responses to Money172375 as that might shed some light. Plus I'll try and respond directly to your points as follows:

1. That's cool that you have heard of the program and I hope I have answered why I choose to take part of the program.

2. As to your view that I hardly have a mortgage so why wouldn't I take advantage of paying it off now, here's my rationale:
a. Given that interest rates are at an all-time low, it does not make sense to pay off debt for an appreciating asset (as long as the numbers crunch nicely as they do here). In other words the interest rate environment the world finds itself in now, penalizes savers and rewards borrowers.
b. Given that I only have just over two years left on the mortgage, the monthly payments are almost entirely principle pay down, so there is no consequential interest to be paid in any case, Effectively, this last few years of mortgage payments are an interest free loan, so again I see no reason to pay it off now.

3. That's cool that you get the cash flow, etc.

4. As to your concern that the program might end, or I'd need to pay out with borrowed money, and whether people will have to choose to sell instead. Yes all those things are not outside the realm of the possible, but I am not concerned with having to make lump sum payments of this type if I must. Plus I cannot be responsible if other people find themselves in a position to have to sell their house to repay the deferment. But keep in mind that the purpose of the program (as I understand it) is to allow people to stay in their houses without having to sell, by deferring property taxes until such time as they choose to sell. After all, property taxes in the Lower Mainland of BC are onerous to say the least, and older folks may be house-rich but cash-poor (relatively speaking).

5. I understand that you can't comment on TD's rules for requiring repayment prior to refinancing. My best guess is not because they see something in the future that we don't, I think it is simply lien priority and risk assessment from TD's point of view. The link I provided seems to imply this.


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