# Making your own beer



## Sherlock (Apr 18, 2010)

Anyone do it? I've read a few articles about it on the internet which seem to suggest it's a piece of cake, but if that were true then why have I never met anyone who actually does it at home? My dad makes his own wine but he has no idea how to make beer. I'm tired of spending $40 on a case of beer, what do they pay in the US, $20? Why is beer so expensive here?


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## nathan79 (Feb 21, 2011)

I used to do it all the time. It's fun. The kits cost about $12, plus the cost of dextrose, sanitizer, and bottle caps. You can re-use any type of beer bottles or buy them new. Total cost for a batch is about $20 if you get the bottles for free. And you get several dozen; I can't rememeber off the top of my head but I think it was around 9 dozen. My beer was never quite as good as the better microbrews, but competed well with the mainstream stuff.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

So, a batch of 108 bottles cost $20? That's not a bad deal. How much time does the process require?


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## leoc2 (Dec 28, 2010)

I did it years ago ... my wife made me stop ... she couldn't take all the gas it made me produce....


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## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

Hi:

Making beer at home needs much more finesse than making wine at home. I have never made a satisfactory batch at home. I have however been happy at the brew places, but then your cost is 1/2 or more Beer Store retail.

hboy43


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## nathan79 (Feb 21, 2011)

^ True. It requires patience and a very controlled environment. Even then, results tend to vary.

Primary fermentation takes about a week, then you bottle it and wait another week for secondary fermentation (for carbonation). You can extend these periods for better results. I usually do two weeks primary and two weeks secondary. Of course, I would suggest just following the instructions the first time.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I tried Upper Canada lager recently, and thought it was pretty good for a value beer. It was 29.95 incl. deposit.


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## w0nger (Mar 15, 2010)

cheap decent beer? Co-Op Gold....


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## Spidey (May 11, 2009)

I make beer once in a while, but like others I find the end product very inconsistent. Once I produced a very good beer that was very much like a European lager and the next time with the same kit it wasn't so great. However, I've never produced a batch that I considered not drinkable. 

I still make the odd batch, but now I usually stick to wine where IMO the product seems consistently good. (I buy the kits when they go on sale at Costco.) As for beer, I tend to stock up on brand beer when I'm in Quebec (where the price is cheaper).


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## canehdianman (Apr 7, 2009)

hboy43 said:


> Hi:
> 
> Making beer at home needs much more finesse than making wine at home. I have never made a satisfactory batch at home. I have however been happy at the brew places, but then your cost is 1/2 or more Beer Store retail.
> 
> hboy43


This is exactly what I found. I used to make wine and beer when I lived with my parents. The wine turned out decent/good 90% of the time. The beer turned out decent/good 15% of the time. 

Eventually I decided it wasn't worth it, so I built myself a keg fridge and have been happy drinking out of that ever since


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## lister (Apr 3, 2009)

I've got two Brooklyn Brew Shop kits sitting at home waiting for when I have some time to brew. I haven't tried their kits yet but I've read good things.

http://www.brooklynbrewshop.com

In Toronto they can be purchased at BYOB (http://www.byobto.com) on West Queen West and William Sonoma (Eaton Centre, not sure about other locations.)


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

I have dabbled in making kefir beer using apple juice, purely for probiotic purposes.
Adding hops to it makes it tastes closer to commercial beer, but it is still quite different.
It is alcoholic, but less than the 5% of commercial beer.
I'd guess about 2% - 3% or so.

It tastes slightly acidic so you can't guzzle it like commercial beer, which is probably a good thing.

Tried making mead as well using just honey and kefir grains but the fermentation time is so long to break down the complex sugars in honey that I feared contamination and gave up.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

When I lived in Vermont my landlord had a cider press and gave me the use of it along with seven of his apple trees; he also had carboys for making hard cider. With friends we spent a weekend picking and pressing apples, put some of the cider into the carboys with champagne yeast and waited. I walked in a few days later to discover that the carboys had exploded and there was half-fermented gunk all over the barn ceiling and walls, and a million yellowjackets had come in to feast on it. I think we didn't filter the cider carefully enough!


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## Young&Ambitious (Aug 11, 2010)

I go to a U-Brew place and I've since gotten family and friends into it too! A great alternative to the liquor store and doing it out of the house independently.

Cost is ~1$ a beer (depending on what you choose, availability of specials/discounts etc) but I prefer it to the mainstream liquor store stuff. A bit more healthy too  

I do wine as well and I've had some great batches (and some okay but none horrible non-drinkable). ~$5 a bottle (6-week batch), again depending on what you choose etc.

I would highly recommend this as an option, goodluck!


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## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

brad said:


> When I lived in Vermont my landlord had a cider press and gave me the use of it along with seven of his apple trees; he also had carboys for making hard cider.


Making hard cider is my home brewing holy grail. I have an orchard with a bunch of fruit trees, mostly apple, that are just sucking. I've been at this 7 years and put a bunch of time into it and so far pretty much failure. I have put in over 2 dozen trees over the years, and about a dozen have out right died or had to be pulled. The climate is so harsh and I have been unlucky with insects (hello round headed apple borer).

This year might be a little better. Looks like I'll get some plums for the first time, and maybe a few sour cherries also for the first time. About 5 of the apple trees will give perhaps average a dozen fruits each. Of course, one good apple tree all by itself should be good for 100 or more apples.

I am in no hurry to complete the construction of the apple press I started building years ago.

hboy43


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

My family has a u-pick apple orchard. It's not easy work maintaining an orchard. I used to make apple cider as well

Many critters love apples. We had to tie deterrents to the tree trunks and spray the apples or they'd be full of insects. I never heard of apple beer, but I remember meeting a clearly drunken porcupine who got into some fermented apples


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

I'm making a second batch at a commercial establishment, that does the
brewing and all youy do is come in 15 to 17 days and can it yourself.
Right now, I'm doing a batch of Rickards's Red 6 "24s" for $125. taxes in.
Most popular red beers run almost $40 for a 24.

The blonde beers a bit cheaper and you can do only 3 cases, but the cost
is slightly higher.

While it may cost a bit more than doing it a home, you are garanteed excellent results with the carbonation at the right level. Nothing worse than
a flat beer!

The only non-green thing is the aluminum cans which you have to dispose
in the green box. You can also buy plastic bottles, but washing/sanitizing/rinsing 144 to 148 plastic bottles is not for me.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

mode3sour said:


> I never heard of apple beer, but I remember meeting a clearly drunken porcupine who got into some fermented apples


You must mean apple cider. There are a few brands around. BC Growers
make a nice macintosh apple cider and offer it in beer bottles at the LCBO
here in Ont. 

Porcupines..well they are like the hobos of the animal kingdom.
They will chew anything with salt in it..canoe paddles (or any wood that
has some salty taste to it...axe handles, outhouse toilet seats...


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Carver, don't feel bad about aluminum cans. They're readily recyclable, and probably greener than using plastic bottles, even if you use the bottles a few times (though most plastic is only usable once for food-grade).


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

I think someone on here should make a few batches of beer, invite us all over, then we can decide once and for all about this thread.


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## Financial Cents (Jul 22, 2010)

Good call Spidey. Buy beer across the river (in Quebec) when you can. The reason it costs so much in Ontario is b/c of taxes. I don't agree with it, just saying...

There are lots of good "discount" beers available in ONT:
-MacLays
-Trailhead
-Upper Canada Lager

You have to be very careful and aseptic when making your own brew. I prefer to pay a few extra bucks and not deal with all the hassles; more time spent on drinking the good barley and hops.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

andrewf said:


> Carver, don't feel bad about aluminum cans. They're readily recyclable, and probably greener than using plastic bottles, even if you use the bottles a few times (though most plastic is only usable once for food-grade).


I tried the brown plastic bottles once, and it was a bit of a nuisance 
with washing them to clean out the dried residue in the bottle, and sterilizing them with solutions of vinegar ( some even use household bleach)..which
may react with the plastic and leave a sanitized taste to the next batch of
beer. 

The aluminum can method is a bit more expensive, but that's what the
beer industry uses, so I'm at least assured that the last case of beer
in my basement won't take on an aftertaste from any residual chemicals
in the plastic after sitting for a month or two in the summer.


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## Sustainable PF (Nov 5, 2010)

andrewf said:


> I tried Upper Canada lager recently, and thought it was pretty good for a value beer. It was 29.95 incl. deposit.


It used to be a premium beer prior to being bought by Sleeman. Over $36 a case a few years back.

I used to make my own beer using a product called Festa Brew. The wort was already prepped - just pour into a sanitized bucket and add active yeast. Wait 5-7 days and it was ready to bottle. 7 days after that good to drink. Tasty too. I think it cost me $35 for 30L. Pretty idiot proof too.


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## Sustainable PF (Nov 5, 2010)

carverman said:


> I tried the brown plastic bottles once, and it was a bit of a nuisance
> with washing them to clean out the dried residue in the bottle, and sterilizing them with solutions of vinegar ( some even use household bleach)..which
> may react with the plastic and leave a sanitized taste to the next batch of
> beer.


I used 500ml bottles which reduced bottling time.
Also used the sanitize feature on the dishwasher to clean the bottles.


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

Financial Cents said:


> Buy beer across the river (in Quebec) when you can.


If you want really, really good Québec beer (pricey but worth every penny), try this:

http://www.brasseursillimites.com/

We don't drink beer that often (once every few weeks), so when we do we get the good stuff. This is good stuff -- these people know how to make beer.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Can't get that in Ontario? Beer monopoly FAIL.

I'm not a big drinker, so fortunately I can afford to drink good beer.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Why does Canada import Heineken but not more German beer? (besides what, Beck's that nobody likes here) Or even Belgian beer? Seriously this stuff is way better and cheaper. Maybe because the bottles are too big?


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## brad (May 22, 2009)

You can get some Belgian beers in Montreal, and a few of the better German brews, and even some good Czech beers.

The Altbier made by Brasseurs Illimités that I linked to above is pretty exceptional, and their Scottish ale is very close to the real thing -- these are the best Canadian-brewed beers I've ever tasted.


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## Sampson (Apr 3, 2009)

brad said:


> Brasseurs Illimités -- these are the best Canadian-brewed beers I've ever tasted.


I'm quite partial to Unibroue myself. Thinking about this makes we want to pick up a bottle of La Fin du Monde right now.


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## Sampson (Apr 3, 2009)

andrewf said:


> I'm not a big drinker, so fortunately I can afford to drink good beer.


Like good coffee, good beer is worth my hard earned $. I know some people are able to brew good beer at home, but unless you are importing quality ingredients I find home brew mediocre at best.

I'd rather give up this forum before I gave up quality beer


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## Financial Cents (Jul 22, 2010)

Sampson said:


> I'd rather give up this forum before I gave up quality beer


With all due respect to this most excellent forum, heck ya Sampson!


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## Spidey (May 11, 2009)

Financial Cents said:


> Good call Spidey. Buy beer across the river (in Quebec) when you can. The reason it costs so much in Ontario is b/c of taxes. I don't agree with it, just saying...
> 
> There are lots of good "discount" beers available in ONT:
> -MacLays
> ...



One little tidbit - Apparently it is illegal to transport alcohol across provincial borders. I've never heard of this law being enforced or any other country that has such silly rules regarding transport within their own country.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Spidey said:


> One little tidbit - Apparently it is illegal to transport alcohol across provincial borders. I've never heard of this law being enforced or any other country that has such silly rules regarding transport within their own country.


Tis true. A few years ago there was a beer store strike in Ontario. Many
beer drinkers who lived close to the Quebec border ran over to the Quebec
"depanniers" to get cases of the typical commercial beer they had and at
cheaper prices than in ontario. 

Rumours that cops could be waiting at the bridges didn't materialize
as there is no restriction for shopping in Quebec. All you have to tell them
is that you went to a mall and bought something and a case of beer.
They aren't going to haul your butt in for that...even if there is some
minimum fine on the books. I guess Ontario (and other provinces) have taxes on the beer that they won't collect, if you buy elsewhere and
that is probably the illegal issue.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

From what I've heard, that law is actually an artifact from the Prohibition era. We should have a government department in charge of eliminating disused laws--it's absurd.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

andrewf said:


> From what I've heard, that law is actually an artifact from the Prohibition era. *We should have a government department in charge of eliminating disused laws--it's absurd*.


Gov'ts have trouble enough passing current laws, and going back into the
law books to repeal old laws that may not be necessary anymore is too
much of a burden..and too probably too costly to repeal. It would be
good if all the laws were on some Justice dept mainframe and a person
of authority could just delete it..but that's not the way the legal system
works. Laws on the law books are interpreted by lawyers and judges and
the cops. There are many obsolete laws on the books. Law books have
to be updated as well.There used to be a CBC show called ...

"This Is The Law started as a summer replacement, in 197l and l972, for Front Page Challenge, and proved popular enough to earn a prime time slot of its own in the 1972 season. 

This was yet another half- hour quiz show with an underlying educational premise, *it asked panel members to spot the obscure statute that was violated in a filmed, wordless sketch. *Paul Soles played the hapless lawbreaker and Robert Warner the constable (from 1974, when he was promoted, the sergeant) who put the arm on him after the deed was done. "

The show segment would end with "in <specific place in Canada...THIS IS
THE LAW!" Most of them were rather comical and nonsensical in today's
society..and some were local ordinances passed by the city fathers.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I should not be a huge challenge. All you need is one omnibus bill every year or two, repealing all the laws that everyone can agree are outmoded and unenforced. We just need some will.


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## Financial Cents (Jul 22, 2010)

I'll take my chances coming back to Ontario with one case of beer now and again. If they want to stop me, knock themselves out. 

I would hope our law enforcement bodies have more important things to worry about than my wife and I coming back to Ottawa South (from Gatineau) with a case of beer. 

Then again, maybe they don't?


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Financial Cents said:


> I'll take my chances coming back to Ontario with one case of beer now and again. If they want to stop me, knock themselves out.
> 
> Then again, maybe they don't?


It's a $200 fine + court costs. I don't think they would bother with a single
case of Molson etc. What they would be after is a van full of beer that
one probably couldn't drink themselves. ..bootlegging?

This would only take place in a situation like a beer strike (brewers retail..not
the beer drinkers, which never go on strike..)...however, if such an
occurrance happened again, and the taps ran dry..the cops could just
post a cruiser at the Ont side of the bridge..as a reminder..usually seeing
the police presences, keeps one's desire to "break the law" under control.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

andrewf said:


> I should not be a huge challenge. All you need is one omnibus bill every year or two, repealing all the laws that everyone can agree are outmoded and unenforced. We just need some will.


I can see outmoded, but any law can be enforced, including the "beer running" cross provincial borders. It depends on whether it's worth their
while to set up a police dragnet to catch all the perpretrators or just the
major smugglers..like trucks full of cases of beer/booze/wine from Quebec
during the LCBO or Brewers retail strikes.

Does the law apply equally to a family with one case of Quebec bought
beer (beer sales taxes not paid to Ontario)? Or just applies to
the guys that fill up with as much as they can carry in a large van 
and try to resell it to their friends (at some profit),
or even some pubs...on the sly.

If you buy a draft beer or bottle in a pub, there is sales and liquor taxes
applied to that bottle that the pub owner has to remit to the province.
In case of a beer strike, there are no deliveries, so once the taps run
dry in the pubs, they stay dry..unless some other form of delivery is
available...and this is what the provincial liquor license boards want to
prevent.


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## dogcom (May 23, 2009)

I have been going to a U-brew place for the last 10 years in Richmond BC and I have to say the quality and taste I get from that is far superior to the liquor store beer. I can make any kind of beer I want and they cook it for me and do all the work and all I have to do is add the yeast.

It is cheaper then the liquor store except for the first batch because I needed to buy the bottles. You can provide your own glass bottles but I found buying bottles all the same sizes made bottling quick and efficient. You might think it is a cost you don't need but I wouldn't be bottling 10 years later if I used time consuming different size bottles.


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## realist (Apr 8, 2011)

If you are homebrewing to save money… you’re doing it wrong 

Some of the best beer I have ever had was homebrewed by a friend of mine. I have done about a dozen batches myself and they ranged from drinkable to excellent. If you like beer that actually has flavour, that it’s surprisingly easy to make a decent pale ale or stout at home (think Mill Street Tankhouse, or Fullers, Guinness). My next batch is going to be a sour cherry beer. If it’s successful, I will have 20L of beer for under $100 comparable to the Belgian stuff that goes for more than $20 for a 750ml bottle south of the border!

Brewing something mainstream comparable to Molson Canadian or Labatt Blue at home is actually surprisingly hard. If you like that I suggest you just switch to something like Laker or Lakeport that basically tastes the same anyways for less money. Some of the best beer “bang for buck” deals at the LCBO are the 500 ml cans of German beer.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

realist said:


> If you are homebrewing to save money… you’re doing it wrong


I dunno about that. I saved $120 by brewing 6 cases (24) of Rikards Red at a brewing company. 
They did the brewing for me and all I had to do
is spend 1.5 hours of my retirement time,
(which isn't worth anything anyway)..to can it. 

Saved about $120 on those 6 cases..so lets see..if I calculate...my actual time spent there
vs t he savings realized..it's $80 an hour!

I should do that more often.


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## liquidfinance (Jan 28, 2011)

Dragging up an old thread but have been talking about doing this recently and got myself a starter kit on Friday.
The first brew is currently underway. I just hope everything was correctly sanitized. I started with a simple IPA from the brewers store where I got the kit from. 

Liquid Malt, Dry Malt, Hops etc and the full instructions, so it should be fail safe for a newbie.

It also included a book "Home Beermaking" The complete beginners guidebook. by William Moore. I've read through this and it seems like the only book you could ever need with a good selection of recipes to try out as well. 

Next thing is to get a simple white wine on the go. 

Happy Brewing


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Good luck Liquid!


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

hboy43 said:


> Making hard cider is my home brewing holy grail. I have an orchard with a bunch of fruit trees, mostly apple, that are just sucking. I've been at this 7 years and put a bunch of time into it and so far pretty much failure. I have put in over 2 dozen trees over the years, and about a dozen have out right died or had to be pulled. The climate is so harsh and I have been unlucky with insects (hello round headed apple borer).
> 
> This year might be a little better. Looks like I'll get some plums for the first time, and maybe a few sour cherries also for the first time. About 5 of the apple trees will give perhaps average a dozen fruits each. Of course, one good apple tree all by itself should be good for 100 or more apples.
> 
> ...


If you want to make good hard cider you need sour apples to give it flavor. Sweet dessert apples are kind of insipid unless you add some crab apples or wild apples.

Wild apples grown from seed are what the old timers used in the 18th and 19th century. You can find wild apples along any country road, they grow from apple cores thrown out car windows. If you keep your eyes open you can hardly go 1 mile without seeing 3 or 4 trees. Free for the picking apples.


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## liquidfinance (Jan 28, 2011)

I'm going to have a go at making a decent cider. At the moment I do have a simple Cider on the go which consists mainly of PC Pure apple juice a touch of sugar to bring it to around 5.5-6% ABV and some yeast. Main purpose was to get an idea of flavour and give myself a base to work with. 

The beer has now been racked to secondary from dry hopping. I took a bit of what I was siphoning for a test and actually very pleased with the results already


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## none (Jan 15, 2013)

I used to do this: Beer, Cider, wine, port. I find that for a few bucks more I can have it done with a you-brew. For about $160 I get 50L of beer. Made from scratch: you go in, you add the hops boil it up, they let it ferment for 2 weeks and then they have CO2 injector so no yeast on the bottom. A ton less work, generally more consistent, really good and about 1/2 the liquor store. I am drinking some now (my last bottle -- eek!)


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

Plain apple squeezings will turn fizzy and "hard" in a few days or a week. I used to buy cider from the orchard a gallon at a time and just let it sit around where it was cool in the fall. Now they pasturize the juice so you would have to get some apples and a juicer and make your own cider. No yeast or other substance required. There is enough natural yeast on the apples.


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Or you could just buy a few buck-o-beers like Maclays, Upper Canada Lager and others. Takes less effort than homebrew but I can appreciate some folks love doing it.


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## nathan79 (Feb 21, 2011)

No such thing as Buck-O-Beers in BC. The cheapest six pack I can find is about $8. We also have tall cans for $2-2.50.

I noticed the prices of the beer kits have been going up in the last few years. Some people seem to be paying quite a lot for their kits. I can still make 23L of beer for about $25 though.


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

It is possible to make apple juice beer on your own by using kefir grains to ferment the apple juice.
You start with pure, unfiltered, and not-from-concentrate apple juice, add kefir grains and hops, and let it ferment for about 10 days.
It doesn't taste anything like commercial beer, but it does have alcoholic content and pro-biotics.
I never measured it, but I'd guess about 3%.

I used to make this beer at home occasionally.
I stopped a few years ago because it was too much work, and I decided I don't like beer any way.

Cultivating the kefir grains was a lot of work too, esp. if you don't like kefir milk.
The grains can only multiply by fermenting milk, and not in apple juice (or any other non dairy source).


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## liquidfinance (Jan 28, 2011)

Well...... I know for one thing. After completing the bottling today if I was to factor in the cost of my time then home brew is not at all a money saver. 

Everything is primed and bottled now so fingers crossed it all carbonates ok. 
I did prim an early sample last week and that turned out ok.  Cheers :very_drunk:


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## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

liquidfinance said:


> Well...... I know for one thing. After completing the bottling today if I was to factor in the cost of my time then home brew is not at all a money saver.
> 
> Everything is primed and bottled now so fingers crossed it all carbonates ok.
> I did prim an early sample last week and that turned out ok.  Cheers :very_drunk:


Hope it turns out well for you! It really adds to the cost if you have a batch that doesn't work out!!


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## liquidfinance (Jan 28, 2011)

So far the home brew is doing good. Currently got the 4th batch brewing. 

I need to be a little more patient with letting them age after bottling but otherwise it's quite rewarding to enjoy some home brew over the weekend.

The Cider actually turned out well considering it was just PC Apple Juice, Sugar and yeast.


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## RBull (Jan 20, 2013)

^good to hear. I enjoy making my own and have 2 batches on now. Aging isn't an issue once you build up enough stock. I usually have 60-70 litres kicking around. 

I find the shelf life varies but up to 6 months is possible. If refrigerated I've had some 2 years old and still fine. 

Cost is a major factor for me as government sucks a lot of taxes from commercial beer-$24 for a 12 pack= way too much.


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