# Food Lines stretch out



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Notice anything different about these Covid induced food lines?









It’s ‘People, People, People’ as Lines Stretch Across America (Published 2020)


Lines for groceries, food aid and unemployment assistance stretch for blocks as the coronavirus crisis forces Americans into quarantine queues.




www.nytimes.com













Aerial footage shows miles-long line for food aid in South Africa


JOHANNESBURG – Aerial footage showed thousands of people queuing for miles down a dirt road in South Africa for charity food aid meant to relieve hunger caused by the coronavirus lockdown. Th…




nypost.com


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

Well one difference in the pictures are a lineup in cars and one lineup on foot.

But, further down in the article it shows lineups on foot for unemployment benefit applications and say people are lined up by foot for food as well.

I think it may depend on the location and distribution methods.

But it is..............ineups, lineups, and more lineups. There is a great despair growing among society. It is palpable in the interviews they give.

The stock markets are setting new records, which means nothing to most people......and the rich are getting richer during the pandemic, but that also doesn't benefit most people much either.

I read that Amazon's Jeff Bezos could gift $100,000 US to each Amazon employee and still retain all of his pre-pandemic wealth.

It isn't that simple of course, but it begs the question if the super wealthy couldn't step up more if they are benefiting so much from the pandemic.

I don't have any faith the super rich will volunteer their cash, so I believe it is inevitable that governments are going to make the redistribution for them.


----------



## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

sags said:


> I read that Amazon's Jeff Bezos could gift $100,000 US to each Amazon employee and still retain all of his pre-pandemic wealth.
> 
> It isn't that simple of course, but it begs the question if the super wealthy couldn't step up more if they are benefiting so much from the pandemic.
> 
> I don't have any faith the super rich will volunteer their cash, so I believe it is inevitable that governments are going to make the redistribution for them.


Man, you socialists love to spend other peoples money.

You do know that Jeff Bezos gives 1.13 million people a job at Amazon. Not bad for a days work.

ltr


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

And those people earned him a fortune during the pandemic, evidently about $100,000 more profit per employee than before the pandemic.


----------



## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

sags said:


> And those people earned him a fortune during the pandemic, evidently about $100,000 more profit per employee than before the pandemic.


And so in addition to providing jobs to those million people you also want him to share it equally with them so that the employees and the CEO make the same amount of money - sounds suspiciously like communism to me.

ltr


----------



## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

^ I didn't know leaders of communist countries are paid the same salary (or even remotely close) as the average worker.


----------



## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

Beaver101 said:


> ^ I didn't know leaders of communist countries are paid the same salary (or even remotely close) as the average worker.


No one said communism works for goodness sake - we all know that. 

Surely you're familiar with the famous Russian saying, “they pretend to pay us, and we pretend to work".

ltr


----------



## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

like_to_retire said:


> No one said communism works for goodness sake - we all know that.


 ... didn't say it works. And it works that way either ... for the past half a century even.



> Surely you're familiar with the famous Russian saying, “they pretend to pay us, and we pretend to work".
> 
> ltr


 ... I think that phrase is still applicable in the public sector ... only it's actually paying them, and them pretending to work.


----------



## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

agent99 said:


> Notice anything different about these Covid induced food lines?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I am not sure, what are you trying to say? (Not trying to be rude, I just don't get it.)


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Spudd said:


> I am not sure, what are you trying to say? (Not trying to be rude, I just don't get it.)


Also not being rude or picking on you, but what you posted may very well be part of the problem our society has.

It's just the stark contrast - Those people lining up on foot for miles in South Africa are poor, likely have no jobs and desperately NEED the food. There are probably much worse examples in other 3rd world countries. South Africa is a relatively well off country.

Those lining up in the USA in their SUVs and cars may (or may not) own those vehicles and have other valuable assets they could monetarize. Just the cost of the fuel they are burning could buy food - IF they really need it. An $80 fill up could buy a lot of food.

I wonder what people in 3rd world countries would think of the pictures of those lineups in cars and what is portrayed and considered a dire situation in our Western world?


----------



## bgc_fan (Apr 5, 2009)

agent99 said:


> Those lining up in the USA in their SUVs and cars may (or may not) own those vehicles and have other valuable assets they could monetarize.


While I agree with the general sentiments that you have, I don't think they really have the option to monetize their assets. Given that it is a national issue, there's probably not a lot of buyers for those assets, or you are going to be forced to sell for pennies on the dollar. As for fuel, the problem is that the US is designed around cars, so walking and public transit aren't usually feasible.


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

bgc_fan said:


> As for fuel, the problem is that the US is designed around cars, so walking and public transit aren't usually feasible.


Walking is always an option. Those Africans don't have much in the way of public transport either and they certainly can't afford cars or the fuel they would need.

You are right that Americans would be unlikely to sell their cars. Many are likely owned by banks or finance companies anyway. If the choice is gas for car or food on the table, then maybe walking would become an option?


----------



## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

agent99 said:


> I wonder what people in 3rd world countries would think of the pictures of those lineups in cars and what is portrayed and considered a dire situation in our Western world?


Not sure the point but they'd probably think the same thing at any given time. Third world standard of living is obviously lower than ours. 

On some of the pics I see the terrible idea of grouping people close together during a pandemic, not good IMO.


----------



## OptsyEagle (Nov 29, 2009)

agent99 said:


> Notice anything different about these Covid induced food lines?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I am pretty sure Maslow would have put food way above a car when it comes to his hierarchy of needs. It is amazing how stupid we are at times. I would imagine most of those American's must be just looking for free food.


----------



## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

OptsyEagle said:


> I am pretty sure Maslow would have put food way above a car when it comes to his hierarchy of needs. It is amazing how stupid we are at times. I would imagine most of those American's must be just looking for free food.


There does seem to be something unsettling about seeing long lines of expensive SUV's and cars lined up idling their engines for hours waiting for free food compared to a line of obvious poor people standing in line for food.

ltr


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

People are now waiting in their cars at hospitals as well, because there is no room in the ERs for them.

I don't think the "lazy, no good over spenders" theory plays out that well when people are unemployed due to a raging pandemic in their midst.

Americans are suffering while the Democrats and Republican politicians in Congress attend Christmas galas and the wealthy post Instagram photos.


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

cainvest said:


> Not sure the point but they'd probably think the same thing at any given time. Third world standard of living is obviously lower than ours.


Disappointed that you too don't see the point. 

Driving cars to pick up free emergency food paid for by taxpayers is hardly a measure of our standard of living. More of our stupidity.


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

sags said:


> People are now waiting in their cars at hospitals as well, because there is no room in the ERs for them.


Off subject: 
We also saw long lines of cars waiting to get drive through covid tests. We had to do that ourselves. It was the only option. Our car was running in the line up for 1 1/2hrs. We were lucky. In another area of town, wait time was reported to be something like 6 hours. Several hundred cars at at any time with engines running emitting exhaust fumes. But the health authorities made us do it!


----------



## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

agent99 said:


> Disappointed that you too don't see the point.
> 
> Driving cars to pick up free emergency food paid for by taxpayers is hardly a measure of our standard of living. More of our stupidity.


I understand your point, but I don’t think it’s as easy as just selling a vehicle. I have seen many people who are in need that normally would be the ones donating to the food bank. If it is there only vehicle, they still need transportation. Not all areas are walkable and if you don’t normally take public transportation, this isn’t the time many will want to start. one Is also not going to try and pick up and move during these times. 

if you do want to sell your vehicle, it’s is tough to. We got rid of our extra vehicle, couldn’t sell very easily privately. We didnt want people coming over and then having to sanitize the car each. We ended up selling it back tothe dealer at at 40% less but we didn’t want to deal with it anymore. My food has a vehicle they are trying sell privately. They have had a few viewings and TWICE they received a call from the potential buyers that they tested positive. That is if they are honest and tell you. 

lets say you do end up selling, you may still need to buy another vehicle. If it was leased or owned by the bank, you may not be able to get a loan now if you aren’t working. If you owned the vehicle outright, you will most likely lose money. 

In an ideal world people shouldn’t be buying expensive vehicles they can’t afford. However, at the time, they thought they could still just hang on.


----------



## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

agent99 said:


> Off subject:
> We also saw long lines of cars waiting to get drive through covid tests. We had to do that ourselves. It was the only option. Our car was running in the line up for 1 1/2hrs. We were lucky. In another area of town, wait time was reported to be something like 6 hours. Several hundred cars at at any time with engines running emitting exhaust fumes. But the health authorities made us do it!


Wow that is a long time. I have sadly been tested in the drive thru 3 times now. The most was two cars on front me plus, the cars in the bay where they were getting swabs, We were asked to turn off our engines while waiting. We did have book a couple of days out (walk thru almost always a has appoint the next if not the same day). We felt safer waiting in the car. Why is your health authority booking less people?


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Plugging Along said:


> Wow that is a long time. I have sadly been tested in the drive thru 3 times now. The most was two cars on front me plus, the cars in the bay where they were getting swabs, We were asked to turn off our engines while waiting. We did have book a couple of days out (walk thru almost always a has appoint the next if not the same day). We felt safer waiting in the car. Why is your health authority booking less people?


There was no booking at the time. There were simultaneous Covid outbreaks at several public locations. Everyone that had been to those facilities were advised they must get tested and self isolate until they received a negative result. Thus the overload despite addition of additional Sunday drive through testing.




Plugging Along said:


> I understand your point, but I don’t think it’s as easy as just selling a vehicle. I have seen many people who are in need that normally would be the ones donating to the food bank. If it is there only vehicle, they still need transportation.


I wasn't really suggesting that they should sell their vehicles. More just contrasting the difference in our outlook on things. It's hard to have sympathy for people who have enough money to buy gas for their SUV, yet are prepared to take advantage of free food handouts. I am sure there are many in USA who really need that food, but doubt they drive SUVs.


----------



## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

agent99 said:


> There was no booking at the time. There were simultaneous Covid outbreaks at several public locations. Everyone that had been to those facilities were advised they must get tested and self isolate until they received a negative result. Thus the overload despite addition of additional Sunday drive through testing.


They stopped doing drop in testing in our area as the lines were huge. Our pharmacies were given testes for those with no symptoms, however they stopped because they are focusing on the on those with symptoms, health car, and people in close contact. At one, point, appoints where taking up to a week to book, now its faster. 

I did a walk in once, and though it was done very safety, I would choose waiting my my vehicle everytime, if I have a choice. 

Normally, I wouldn’t be very empathetic to those that overspent and are in mess or in the SUV and getting free things. However, I have seen there are so many more factors with this pandemic. Very few people have the luxury of being able to not work for months and still be able to keep things afloat. i Have personally been paying for groceries for a few friends because I know they are struggling. These are professionals. It’s easy to judge when you are retired, working, or have a large chuck of savings.


----------



## bgc_fan (Apr 5, 2009)

agent99 said:


> Walking is always an option. Those Africans don't have much in the way of public transport either and they certainly can't afford cars or the fuel they would need.
> 
> You are right that Americans would be unlikely to sell their cars. Many are likely owned by banks or finance companies anyway. If the choice is gas for car or food on the table, then maybe walking would become an option?


It's hard to judge personal circumstances based on a bird's eye view of a bunch of cars. It could be that some are still working at poverty level wages, but still "need" a car for transit and to pick up children from school, etc. Not having a car could mean hours of commute for work, and then arrange for someone else to transport the children. It's just a theoretical situation that I'm pointing out.

The South African situation that is being presented is slightly different in that they are migrant workers and likely aren't working or have family with them.

I'm just saying that we can't judge based on a photo and temporary circumstances. There's lots of articles about people who used to donate to food banks and volunteer time, but now they have to make use of them because of change in life circumstances outside their control.


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

bgc_fan said:


> The South African situation that is being presented is slightly different in that they are migrant workers and likely aren't working or have family with them.


Actually the Africans lining up are from what they call informal settlements. About 1/2 the residents are undocumented migrants from other African countries. Just like the desperate migrants from central america who the US have been turning back.
So not migrant "workers", just migrants with their families who are not eligible for government assistance. They exist on whatever casual work they can pick up. There are similar situations in many countries


----------



## bgc_fan (Apr 5, 2009)

agent99 said:


> Actually the Africans lining up are from what they call informal settlements. About 1/2 the residents are undocumented migrants from other African countries. Just like the desperate migrants from central america who the US have been turning back.
> So not migrant "workers", just migrants with their families who are not eligible for government assistance. They exist on whatever casual work they can pick up. There are similar situations in many countries


You kind of sidestepped, or missed my main point: you can't really compare situations between different countries since things are relative to the standard of living within the country. Doing so, leads to the gatekeeping of deciding what really is considered "poor" or deserving of help. Would you agree with Bill O'Reilly that even if people only make $10k/yr that because they have stuff like TVs and a truck they aren't poor?


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

bgc_fan said:


> You kind of sidestepped, or missed my main point: you can't really compare situations between different countries since things are relative to the standard of living within the country. Doing so, leads to the gatekeeping of deciding what really is considered "poor" or deserving of help. Would you agree with Bill O'Reilly that even if people only make $10k/yr that because they have stuff like TVs and a truck they aren't poor?


I didn't sidestep. Why can't we compare situations in different countries? In fact, that is what we SHOULD do and is what struck me when I saw those two line ups for food. I was interested in how others here would view them.

Those $10k/yr Americans that own TVs and trucks are not poor relative to the migrants from other countries that seek a better life in USA or South Africa. If you have less than the people in your immediate society, you may be considered by them to be poor. But you may not be poor when comparison is on a national or global basis.


----------



## bgc_fan (Apr 5, 2009)

agent99 said:


> I didn't sidestep. Why can't we compare situations in different countries? In fact, that is what we SHOULD do and is what struck me when I saw those two line ups for food. I was interested in how others here would view them.
> 
> Those $10k/yr Americans that own TVs and trucks are not poor relative to the migrants from other countries that seek a better life in USA or South Africa. If you have less than the people in your immediate society, you may be considered by them to be poor. But you may not be poor when comparison is on a national or global basis.


There's an inherent problem when you make that comparison. Basically you're saying there are no poor people in Canada and the USA because a refugee in Syria has no possessions and can barely survive. Let's cut all funding to support the so-called poor and send them to Syria where they'll be rich. Is that what you are suggesting? Obviously not, and I'm being sarcastic, but you have to consider cost of living is different in different countries. Rather it sounds like: "The poor have it good here, why are they complaining?" USD$10k/yr may get you a lot living in India, but not so much in Norway.


----------



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

One of the great insults to the American poor these days is just how their government refuses to help them. In the 2008, the government was tripping over themselves to provide close to $1 trillion of free money to Wall Street. They couldn't get the money out the door fast enough.

Fast forward to now, you've got a national emergency that is basically _one 9/11 every day_, immense job loss, and the US government still refuses to pay out anything to people. This is on top of Trump's corporate tax cuts that significantly helped the rich over the last 4 years.

And now after years of handing more money to the rich (during good times), the government is withholding support and stimulus to the poor (during a catastrophe). WOW. *They are really asking for it.*

This kind of thing is potentially fatal to the country! The rich can only get away with screwing the nation like this for so long before people catch on. And man oh man when the public turns on the rich (historically), they usually do it with conviction.


----------



## bgc_fan (Apr 5, 2009)

Just another article about the US situation.








Millions of hungry Americans turn to food banks for 1st time


The deadly pandemic that tore through the nation’s heartland struck just as Aaron Crawford was in a moment of crisis...




apnews.com





One thing that caught my eye at the beginning of the epidemic was the fact that people were worried about schools shutting down... and not because that they were missing the education, or that the parents had to arrange for alternate child care, but the fact that so many depended on the free breakfast and lunch programs that were offered.


----------



## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

bgc_fan said:


> There's an inherent problem when you make that comparison.


There is if people don't believe it is true. It is 100% factual, but I will leave this discussion at that. I didn't start it to get into an argument of what poor is.

Move on to something lighter and try and explain why the inventor of the knock-knock game may be awarded the Nobel prize?


----------



## s1231 (Jan 1, 2017)

It's very thankful we've able to have a good foods.
Let's see keep work on reducing food waste &
better create transportation system to reach farmers or their products.
We can also grow more nutritious foods in any season, any place.
improving food securities system would help better health + reducing stress (better immune system).
* avoid opposite.
---








Facing Food Insecurity on the Front Lines: Agroforestry Solutions in the Amazon Rainforest During the COVID-19 Crisis - Amazon Conservation Team


As COVID-19 spread quickly in South America, rapidly transforming it into an epicenter of the pandemic and drastically affecting its economy, the number of people experiencing severe food insecurity in the region grew substantially. The forecasted contraction of the regional economy for 2020...




www.amazonteam.org




Posted in Colombia, News
November 23, 2020 byIsidoro Hazbun

As COVID-19 spread quickly in South America, rapidly transforming it into an epicenter of the pandemic and drastically affecting its economy, the number of people experiencing severe food insecurity in the region grew substantially. The forecasted contraction of the regional economy for 2020, estimated at 9.4%, will be the biggest drop in the region’s history, hitting hardest those who rely on daily earnings in the informal sector.

.....Something that we defined with the field staff is that every time they do a site visit, they need to first, have biosecurity protocols in place; second, emphasize the protection of native seeds, as well as water sources, and promote food sovereignty; and third, compare the baseline in the communities with the status in the cities and towns of the region that are wholly dependent on food and don’t have clean sources of water.
It’s important to note that 80% of the food in Caquetá is imported, so it’s not only a food crisis in the urban sector, but in rural areas as well.

We’re glad to see that partner communities have sustained during this crisis relatively well. In this period of time, we’ve heard from families that they now want to stay in lands that they had previously considered selling, seeing as they have ample space, clean water, and sustainable food systems.
---


https://www.thestate.com/news/article247668190.html


*Pandemic pushes newly hungry Americans to crowded food lines *
By SHARON COHEN AP National Writer
December 07, 2020 02:59 PM
--








Malnutrition: the silent pandemic


Healthy diets are a human right and the foundation of just, resilient societies Public health has come to the fore in 2020 like no time in recent history, yet well before covid-19 the world was already witnessing a much quieter pandemic: malnutrition. The number of people affected by...




www.bmj.com




Research increasingly points to a role for nutritional status in resilience to infection and as a mediator of its effects.56 Adequate intakes of energy, macronutrients, and micronutrients are critical for immune functioning.7 Undernutrition can lead to immune dysfunction and increased susceptibility to infectious diseases. In turn, immune responses to infectious diseases enhance nutrient requirements, reduce appetite, and impede the absorption of nutrients creating and perpetuating a vicious cycle.8

--




How Our Winter Garden Survived -23°F (-31°C) With No Heat


----------



## bgc_fan (Apr 5, 2009)

I guess there's always the option to shoplift.








Stealing to survive: More Americans are shoplifting food as aid runs out during the pandemic


Early in the pandemic, Joo Park noticed a worrisome shift at the market he manages near...




www.chron.com


----------

