# Recession? What recession?



## bean438 (Jul 18, 2009)

People lined up for hours for the Apple Ipad2.

I guess things aren't THAT bad if you can drop 5-8 hundred bucks on one of these things.

I guess if you are lined up all day you aint working either.

What am I missing?


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

They were interviewing some of those dudes at Eaton centre.
Funny thing was that most of them already had iPad 1.0
They were simply "upgrading" their iPads.
These are just excuses for dumping more and more garbage into our environment and making fetishes out of useless mindless junk.


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## slacker (Mar 8, 2010)

It's called consumer whoring. I think it's pretty sick personally, but to each their own.


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

bean438 said:


> People lined up for hours for the Apple Ipad2.
> 
> I guess things aren't THAT bad if you can drop 5-8 hundred bucks on one of these things.
> 
> ...


Nothing.


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## dogcom (May 23, 2009)

This is really funny because I brought my son to Best Buy to buy a 360 head phone and was wondering why people were camping outside the store. I thought it was for the Nintendo 3ds but it was really for the Ipad2, so thanks for answering that for me bean438.


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## clovis8 (Dec 7, 2010)

I walked into my local futureshop at 4:30 and got mine no problem. It's pretty great so far. Typing this post on it.


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## Jungle (Feb 17, 2010)

bean438 said:


> What am I missing?


Debt is paying for the recovery.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Recessions are usually measured by car and house sales, not fads. People will always find money for fad purchases. Similarly, what kind of food are they buying. They will switch in hard times.

I hold LLL because I believe in the power of style and fad purchases. I also hold AAPL.

Right now I would bet on Android. I think it will power a whole new set of tablets and take share away from MS. Look at HTC.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

HaroldCrump said:


> most of them already had iPad 1.0
> They were simply "upgrading" their iPads. These are just excuses for dumping more and more garbage into our environment and making fetishes out of useless mindless junk.


As a shareholder, I'm glad people are buying [little wonder that I'm up almost 50% on that stock], but I agree with your comments & lol at the upgrade of *one year old iPad1.* 

Given the release date was on a Friday, I reckon people either took a vacation day or called in sick. 

*@dogcom:* what planet do you live on, you mean you had not marked on your calendar that March 25th at 5pm was Canada's release date of iPad2?


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## bean438 (Jul 18, 2009)

I just came back from future shop to buy an external hard drive for back up.

I also walked out with a "sold out" ipad. No line ups.

Of course I didnt buy the ipad for the kid in me, I bought it to support Toronto gal who is a shareholder.

I wont enjoy the ipad, I promise.

Seriously I would not have lined up for this thing, and I have the money to pay cash for it. I dont understand students and "youts" having that kind of money to slap down on one of these things.

I bought one cause I dont have one, and it will fill a need. If I already owned a version 1, buying the ipad 2 is beyond silly.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I'm amazed by the Apple worshipers. What kind of contempt must a company have for its customers when they release deliberately gimped devices and declare them obsolete a year later? The Futurama episode "Attack of the Killer app" (aka EyePhone) nailed it.


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## clovis8 (Dec 7, 2010)

andrewf said:


> I'm amazed by the Apple worshipers. What kind of contempt must a company have for its customers when they release deliberately gimped devices and declare them obsolete a year later? The Futurama episode "Attack of the Killer app" (aka EyePhone) nailed it.


Let me preface this by saying I am not an apple fan boy. I own two apple devices, one I bought yesterday.

That being said your view is very odd Andrew especially on a money/market forum. Obviously the vast majority of people do not think they are shown contempt or care about the supposed hobbling of the device. The market is clearly, and repeatedly saying, that Apple is doing the correct thing.


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## Ihatetaxes (May 5, 2010)

I'll be buying the new PlayBook. No separate data plan as it piggybacks my BlackBerry data plan, supports flash sites, faster response based on what I have read and reviews on youtube, 7" screen makes is easier to take with me and syncs with my outlook calendar, mail, tasks, etc. 

For the business user with an existing BlackBerry who just wants a bigger screen for web surfing, watching media, reading ebooks, the Playbook wins hands down imo.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

clovis8 said:


> Let me preface this by saying I am not an apple fan boy. I own two apple devices, one I bought yesterday.
> 
> That being said your view is very odd Andrew especially on a money/market forum. Obviously the vast majority of people do not think they are shown contempt or care about the supposed hobbling of the device. The market is clearly, and repeatedly saying, that Apple is doing the correct thing.


It means they are good at selling devices. It doesn't mean the devices are good, necessarily. A device like a phone or a computer should last 3 - 5 years. Cynically manipulating your customers into replacing every 12 - 18 months is great business but I don't admire it.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

Ihatetaxes said:


> I'll be buying the new PlayBook. No separate data plan as it piggybacks my BlackBerry data plan, supports flash sites, faster response based on what I have read and reviews on youtube, 7" screen makes is easier to take with me and syncs with my outlook calendar, mail, tasks, etc.
> 
> For the business user with an existing BlackBerry who just wants a bigger screen for web surfing, watching media, reading ebooks, the Playbook wins hands down imo.


I wish them all the success!

*"RIM can’t buy a break."* 

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/glob...ets-blog/rim-cant-buy-a-break/article1957311/

*@bean438:* thank you, lol!


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## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

IMHO, Micro$oft plays the same game with its software products.
I am sick and tired of being forced to upgrade my operating system (Windows), MS Office, and their other products every year.
They drop support for previous versions of the products within a couple of years of releasing the new version.
They also deliberately break compatibility with previous verisons of the product (e.g. Office XP can't open Office 2007 and above documents).

For most individual users, Windows XP and Office XP provides more than sufficient functionality.
In fact, even Windows & Office 2000 can probably meet more than 80% of user requirements.
Yet even Windows/Office XP have dropped out of support.
They were instead replaced with the crappy Windows Vista.
The same thing happened back in the late 1990s, when within 3 years, they had four versions of Windows (95, 98, 98SE, ME) - each worse and less stable that the previous one.

It is not just Apple that's doing it....they are just more visible than others.
Micro$oft gets away with it because the bulk of their users are corporate and the costs of new software gets absorbed in all the other, larger, expenses and budgeting noise.

This type of company behavior is a symptom of an industry where innovation has plateaued and the only way to keep the cash registers ringing is artificial obsolescence.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

andrewf said:


> Cynically manipulating your customers into replacing every 12 - 18 months is great business but I don't admire it.


It wasn't even 12 months as the last one was released in April, lol.

I just don't understand what held them back from releasing the thinner/faster iPad2 a year ago, I mean did they not have the technology savvy back then? 

And when taking production/distribution into account, this upgrade looks more like a 6 month one; it should have been called *iPad1.5.* 

Anyway, I'm not buying the gadgets, just the shares, but I definitely want others to buy AAPL & RIM devices!


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## Beleriand (Jan 31, 2011)

I´ll focus on two main point. Firstly, I assume that the IT investment is favorable for everybody. Ok, I understand these things are really expensive, but on the other hand, the own education presents the personal know-how. 

Secondly, I share the view of previous colleagues. It seems to me that it´s a clearly consumer hysteria.


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## steve41 (Apr 18, 2009)

I have to take MS's side here. I developed my stuff on an MS platform which they introduced in the mid 90s. The resulting software still works. In fact they have included virtualization in their new Windows7 (pro) such that my stuff still works 20 plus years after I first built the code... Windows 3.1 all the way up to W7. Big hat tip to Mr Gates.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I'm still happily plugging away on an OS that was released 8 years ago (XP).

Additionally, Office XP had plug-ins released to allow compatibility with Office 7 files. I do it at work all the time.


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## OptsyEagle (Nov 29, 2009)

Seeing how we are on the topic of IT and how they make all that money, I will repost a post I made on the FWF on Friday, in a "what did you buy" thread.
------------------------------------

OK, so last week I bought 0.0000046% of the Microsoft Corporation. 

Now this week I am thinking that I would like to buy all the rest of their outstanding shares. Do you think Bill Gates, Steve Ballmer, Paul Allen and the rest of their shareholders would take $40 per share?

If so, this is my plan. Tell me what you think. 

They have 8.6 Billion shares so I would need $344 Billion dollars. If I subtract $41 Billion for the cash they have in the bank, it leaves me needing to borrow $303 Billion dollars. The company should earn almost $24 Billion over the next year and about $27 Billion in free cash flow. If I can get the loan for 8% interest, that would be $303B x 0.08 = $24 billion dollars a year. Since it is tax deductible and I should end up in the top tax bracket, that is about $14.4 Billion, after tax. I take the $27 Billion I get from the company and pay the $14.4 Billion to the bank and I end up making about $12.6 Billion a year. Sounds good to me.

All I have to do now is find someone to lend me $303 Billion dollars. I tried clicking on the "Apply for a Loan" link on TD Bank's easyweb site, but the program must have gotten confused with some of the details, because the loan didn't go through. I was really hoping to be approved by this afternoon. Darn !


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

I own AAPL amd LLL but I use XP on a laptop I bought for half price on craigslist 8 years ago and I buy my sweats from Walmart. What is wrong with you people? Does everything have to be personal?

I had an early Blackberry in 1999 and it was wonderful. But i did not buy the stock because it failed my DD. There are two separate worlds: what I invest in and what I buy. if you insist on a unified approach, you may lose a lot of opportunity to make money!


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## slacker (Mar 8, 2010)

Ihatetaxes said:


> I'll be buying the new PlayBook. No separate data plan as it piggybacks my BlackBerry data plan, supports flash sites, faster response based on what I have read and reviews on youtube, 7" screen makes is easier to take with me and syncs with my outlook calendar, mail, tasks, etc.
> 
> For the business user with an existing BlackBerry who just wants a bigger screen for web surfing, watching media, reading ebooks, the Playbook wins hands down imo.


Please keep us posted. I'm very interested.


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## slacker (Mar 8, 2010)

Toronto.gal said:


> It wasn't even 12 months as the last one was released in April, lol.
> 
> I just don't understand what held them back from releasing the thinner/faster iPad2 a year ago, I mean did they not have the technology savvy back then?
> 
> ...


The first-mover's advantage. By releasing first, along with Apple's amazing marketing, it creates an advantage that the competition could not easily overcome. The iPad had over 60% marketshare last I heard.

Compare to RIM, who announced the PlayBook almost a year ago, and has announced to deliver sometime next month. *sigh*


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

slacker said:


> 1.The first-mover's advantage. By releasing first, along with Apple's amazing marketing, it creates an advantage that the competition could not easily overcome. The iPad had over 60% marketshare last I heard.
> 
> 2. Compare to RIM, who announced the PlayBook almost a year ago, and has announced to deliver sometime next month. *sigh*


1. True, but that had not been my point. What I meant is couldn't the iPad1 have had the same speed/thinness or whatever other features iPad2 now has? It's not like iPad1 is even 1 year old; I guess that's rapid advancement of technology, still, I'm just not convinced that today's features were not available 11 months ago & probably they already have iPad3 in production & ready by Christmas. 

The market share I believe is in the high 70's, but with now over 100 tablets released or in production, we shall see what 2011 numbers will be.

2. Can't argue with that.


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## clovis8 (Dec 7, 2010)

Toronto.gal said:


> 1. True, but that had not been my point. What I meant is couldn't the iPad1 have had the same speed/thinness or whatever other features iPad2 now has? It's not like iPad1 is even 1 year old; I guess that's rapid advancement of technology, still, I'm just not convinced that today's features were not available 11 months ago & probably they already have iPad3 in production.


This is probably true but would be horrible business. They sell out every model in one day. Shareholders would rightly sue for gross negligence if they didn't release a new model every year.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

clovis8 said:


> Shareholders would rightly sue for gross negligence if they didn't release a new model every year.


Either that or start paying a dividend.


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## financialnoob (Feb 26, 2011)

Toronto.gal said:


> 1. True, but that had not been my point. What I meant is couldn't the iPad1 have had the same speed/thinness or whatever other features iPad2 now has? It's not like iPad1 is even 1 year old; I guess that's rapid advancement of technology, still, I'm just not convinced that today's features were not available 11 months ago & probably they already have iPad3 in production & ready by Christmas.
> 
> The market share I believe is in the high 70's, but with now over 100 tablets released or in production, we shall see what 2011 numbers will be.


Maybe they do have the iPad 3 ready for Christmas  That would probably make investors very happy.

But in Apple's defense, it isn't just about the advancement of technology. They need to have time to test the hardware, coordinate with software developers, manufacture, distribute, and market. It would be impossible to halt the product cycle halfway through to add a new processor or incorporate a second camera or make the device slimmer. 

Plus there are all sorts of things they've learned from the first round of development that they can incorporate immediately the second time around. While there are similarities to the capabilities of an iPhone, it's still a different type of device and I'm sure Apple made some mistakes and learned from those mistakes.

One year is really short, but then again, new smart phones/laptops/TVs are introduced on a much more frequent basis.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

I think the frequent release of new products with "must have" features is a brilliant marketing strategy. Like you did not know that everyone wanted 2 cameras? Hey, give me a break! You are just a brilliant marketing company and worth every penny that I am paying for your stock.

OTOH RIMM says: Oh you want a tablet? OK let's respond to that! Sorry you cannot respond to demand that is being created by your competitors and hope to maintain your stock price! If you are not a leader, get out of the way!

(BTW I was a big believer in RIMM in 1999 but lately I think they have just been eclipsed. The techie is overwhelmed and the real CEO has been focused on buying a hockey team for Hamilton. OK so Jobs might be dying. That would be the only salvation for these guys.)


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## cosmica76 (Jan 31, 2011)

Maybe it´s a true, but on the other hand, Apple´s instrument is always good investment.


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