# What I know at 44



## tygrus (Mar 13, 2012)

I see a lot of young bucks looking for financial advice. Thats great. Let me share a few a few life lessons as I see it.

1. First, there is no more important asset in your life than your financial freedom at whatever age you can achieve it. The joy of plotting your own course in life without being tied to a paycheck or employer greatly outweighs anything else. Very few things will give you as much happiness in life.

2. You probably aren't going to find meaningful work. I was told the same stories in college about how we will all find wonderful jobs and save the world. What I found out there was a lot of corporate politics, endless administration, meetings and email that takes up too much time, stress, doing the same work over and over again, overbearing bosses that want you on a short leash, little flexibility, no meaningful promotion unless I sit in the office for 80 hrs a week, jaded co-workers etc. Overall it was a soul sucking experience and unfortunately polls say most people feel the same.

3. If you want to make big bucks, you will have to give up your life to the company. That means no more 40 hrs weeks, more like 60-70, always on call and probably traveling lots. Ok when you are young and single, but it doesn't fit the family mode. If you try it with a wife and kids, you will be divorced before you know it.

4. You can't save yourself rich. Unfortunately, the cost of living a normal life is so close to what real wages are, that its near impossible to put any money away and if you are relying on a corporate pension, you will have to wait until your are 60 to get it. You need some real assets helping you out and its best to get them when you are young. Stocks in a DRIP have exponential growth potential over time.

5. Don't blow your cash on stupid sh*t. I realize today we are bombarded by endless marketing about things you should have to make you happy but its all BS. A $30 pair of jeans is just as good as a $300 pair. A $25,000 car is just as good or better than a $50,000 one. Its tempting to start spending once you start making a little money but just make sure you buy wisely and keep what you can back and invest it religiously, but don't be a cheapskate either.

6. Lastly, you are going to have a mid-life crisis at some point, guaranteed. Not the kind of midlife crisis where you get depressed and freak out. No, it will be more like, you have been doing the same thing for 15 years, do I really want to keep doing this for the rest of my life. You will want a change of scenery, or more flexibility or a sabatical or to venture on your own. Expect it and plan for it.


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## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

As I (fast) approach 71, (next month), I agree with many/most of your points........(then again, I didn't start 'working' (semi-seriously) until I was in my 30s...and quit for good at 46).


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## indexxx (Oct 31, 2011)

Great post, Tygrus! I'd agree with everything here and I'm 48. Wish I knew then what I know now... In my 20's I was making incredible money and living very cheaply in Edmonton in the 80's. I blew everything on partying, guitars, clothes, etc. If I'd put away 15% every month I still could have had the fun and I'd be on easy street right now. And now I'm trying to get off the treadmill of looking for work in an industry I've grown too old for.


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## Jon_Snow (May 20, 2009)

Agree with most your points, except for #4. I am 41, and working on a year by year basis now, preparing to exit the rat race. I have arrived here mostly by saving 50% of our income in our early 30's, 60% in our mid 30's, and now we are socking away more than 70%. Investment gains have had little impact - only now am I sort of getting a handle on investing and its potential - but I have always had a knack for living on far less than most in my income bracket.

Now, admittedly, all this saving has been achieved with two incomes - I won't lie and say this would have been possible on a single income.

And your #1 point: That is the mantra that guides pretty much everything I do financially.


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## Jungle (Feb 17, 2010)

Love this post, thank you for sharing.


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## Mookie (Feb 29, 2012)

This is a great bit of wisom for everyone. 

Regarding #4, (You can't save yourself rich) I partially agree. Saving alone won't make you rich, but assuming you get above a minimum threshold to cover the basic cost of living, then saving will accelerate your path to wealth. 

I would also add one more item to the list: 

7. Marry the right person. If your spouse doesn't have a similar approach to finances, it's much more difficult to be successful.


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Great stuff tygrus. 

@Mookie, #7 is important, actually, very important.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

You can save yourself rich as long as your income is high enough relative to your spending. :chuncky:

I will never, ever understand the fascination with spending money on cars. :02.47-tranquillity:


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

But some cars look soooo good MG?!

I see your point though...probably why I still drive a 13-year-old car.


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## Belguy (May 24, 2010)

When you turn 70, life doesn't seem so long as it does when you're 44. Also, you lose more and more old friends and relatives along the way and thus experience more sadness as life goes on. That said, retirement does have it's benefits if you don't dwell on what comes after it.


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## Jon_Snow (May 20, 2009)

My Own Advisor said:


> But some cars look soooo good MG?!
> 
> I see your point though...probably why I still drive a 13-year-old car.


I still love my 13 year old pickup... talk in other threads about me buying German supercars is just that... talk. It would have to be a mid life crisis of epic proportions for me to do such a thing. Early Retirement\Financial Indpendance is sexier than any car could be.


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## tygrus (Mar 13, 2012)

Financial freedom is not retirement. In fact I totally advocate never retiring, instead cultivate lifelong interests that you never get tired of. People without purpose are not long for this world it seems.


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## peterk (May 16, 2010)

Awesome post Tygrus. This is a very succinct conglomeration of approximately all the advice that I've gleaned from a wide variety of jumbled sources. 

An additional piece of advice that I would add, which is just a paraphrase of other's wisdom I've received (I'm only 26), is:

Don't spend a lot of money when you're young, it won't help your social life. No one cares that you're 25 with a fancy house and a lexus. Save that **** for when you're 40+. That's when the lexus, nice house, boat etc. will actually be helpful to improving your social life and increasing your quaility of life.


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## avrex (Nov 14, 2010)

Great thread post, @tygrus
I agree with your philosophy/advice.


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## donald (Apr 18, 2011)

I know this board is a ''extreme'' retirement board but i would think it is worth noting that:Most professionals/business owners/exc ects are prob likely just reaching peak earnings years?(i'm 34 and the way i see it is generally: 20's-getting started/30's- learning the ropes and somewhat advancing into more leadership/pay/40's seems like the true decade or maybe even 50's when your @ your peak in earnings and would likely be at the very top in every regarded.
It's rare i would think to peak in your 30's in your field and or earning ect
I think 44 is still quite ''young'' it certainly is in the business world!Most of the wealthy people i know are late 50's,early 60's and thriving and still working hard.
IMO we should not think 44 is that ''old'' because it is not.
My old boss hit his stride in his 50's and is quite wealthy(multi-million $ business)he wasn't that well off prior to that in his 40's(he didn't start his business till late 30's)


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## tygrus (Mar 13, 2012)

I would also add that finding a good money mentor is important. I didn't know jack about how money worked in my early 20s. My parents didn't really have the financial knowledge either to pass on to me. I recommend finding someone who does and spend some time learning.


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

donald said:


> I know this board is a ''extreme'' retirement board but i would think it is worth noting that:Most professionals/business owners/exc ects are prob likely just reaching peak earnings years?(i'm 34 and the way i see it is generally: 20's-getting started/30's- learning the ropes and somewhat advancing into more leadership/pay/40's seems like the true decade or maybe even 50's when your @ your peak in earnings and would likely be at the very top in every regarded.
> It's rare i would think to peak in your 30's in your field and or earning ect
> I think 44 is still quite ''young'' it certainly is in the business world!Most of the wealthy people i know are late 50's,early 60's and thriving and still working hard.
> IMO we should not think 44 is that ''old'' because it is not.
> My old boss hit his stride in his 50's and is quite wealthy(multi-million $ business)he wasn't that well off prior to that in his 40's(he didn't start his business till late 30's)


I don't think anyone here is arguing that 44 is "old" (I'm certainly not; I'm older than that) - I think the point was just to provide advice to "young bucks" (I don't know about the "does") who come in here looking for advice in their mid-20s. Mid-40s is 20 more years of experience.


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## Maybe Later (Feb 19, 2011)

I totally disagree with #2. There is a ton of meaningful work out there. It may not be compatible with achieving financial independence as quickly as possible, but it happens all the time and I see several examples within my own family and even more in my greater circle of friends. 

I also would put both my health and my family ahead of financial independence (and I have) AND have wound up in a meaningful career myself where my compensation is excellent and it is highly conducive to family life. Hard work and a lack of catastrophic mistakes when I was younger (certainly not no mistakes, but no crippling ones) is what it took.


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## physik3r (Sep 10, 2012)

indexxx said:


> Great post, Tygrus! I'd agree with everything here and I'm 48. Wish I knew then what I know now... In my 20's I was making incredible money and living very cheaply in Edmonton in the 80's. I blew everything on partying, guitars, clothes, etc. If I'd put away 15% every month I still could have had the fun and I'd be on easy street right now. And now I'm trying to get off the treadmill of looking for work in an industry I've grown too old for.


Exact same thing happened to me in 2006 when I moved to Vancouver. Was pulling down $600/day and blew everything but a $20,000 RSP contribution. While I do wish I was smarter ( I could have still made $ on housing here!), I think I have learned my lesson and I still have time to make up for it.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

Maybe Later said:


> I totally disagree with #2. There is a ton of meaningful work out there. It may not be compatible with achieving financial independence as quickly as possible, but it happens all the time and I see several examples within my own family and even more in my greater circle of friends.
> 
> I also would put both my health and my family ahead of financial independence (and I have) AND have wound up in a meaningful career myself where my compensation is excellent and it is highly conducive to family life. Hard work and a lack of catastrophic mistakes when I was younger (certainly not no mistakes, but no crippling ones) is what it took.


+1. 

Not everything in life revolves around money.

Without health first, and this does not automatically happen by itself either, there would not be much opportunity [and motivation in certain cases], let along joy in plotting a future course.

I also know many people around me, who have meaningful jobs, but they came with commitment/sacrifice/years of study/tenacity & yes, long & hard working hours.

And yes, we can most certainly do our part, to not save the world, but to make it just a little better, and from early on, so no need to wait until you earn the big or small $s.


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## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

tygrus said:


> Financial freedom is not retirement. In fact I totally advocate never retiring, instead cultivate lifelong interests that you never get tired of. People without purpose are not long for this world it seems.


+1.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

I think of the retirement phase as giving up gainful employment but certainly not "giving up". The days of sitting in the rocker on the porch waiting for the grim reaper are long past. There are so many hobbies and interesting activities that it is amazing that there was ever 40-60 hours for gainful employment. And the ties to any given place are weaker now that kids go away to university and end up finding good jobs in different cities.

The main difference is that the pace of the day is self-imposed rather than "working for the man".


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## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Jon_Snow said:


> I still love my 13 year old pickup... talk in other threads about me buying German supercars is just that... talk. It would have to be a mid life crisis of epic proportions for me to do such a thing. Early Retirement\Financial Indpendance is sexier than any car could be.


I'll just drop one of my favourite Warren Buffet quotes in here: "Wall Street is the only place that people ride to in a Rolls Royce [substitute "Lexus" for CMFers] to get advice from those who take the subway."


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## banjopete (Feb 4, 2014)

MoneyGal said:


> You can save yourself rich as long as your income is high enough relative to your spending. :chuncky:
> 
> I will never, ever understand the fascination with spending money on cars. :02.47-tranquillity:


blasphemy! must acquire nice cars.... ugh......

I'm a car nut. You don't have to spend money to have a nice car, buy your highschool dream car, it's still cool, now it's just old, and not fancy, and most people you work with won't know who made it, who cares, it's still your dream car!

Thanks for post, what great advice, I'm in my mid 30's now and considering a wholesale career swap in order to chase that holy grail of enjoyable work for the next couple of decades...


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## Janus (Oct 23, 2013)

tygrus said:


> 2. You probably aren't going to find meaningful work.
> 
> 3. If you want to make big bucks, you will have to give up your life to the company. That means no more 40 hrs weeks, more like 60-70, always on call and probably traveling lots.


I agree with 90% of what you wrote, but these 2 I really disagree with. Having interesting, meaningful work is a privilege, but it does exist and it often goes along with a nice paycheck. It's an admitted rarity, though.

As for #3, you're forgetting that people can make money from companies in areas that aren't necessarily linked to time. Think about financial advisors who make money off assets or salespeople who get commissions. Neither need to work 60 hour weeks.

Edit: oh, and having a financial mentor is enormous. Good one there. I've recently convinced a friend to change his spending habits and start clawing his way out of credit card debt, it scares me to think what would've happened if I hadn't chimed in.


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## the_apprentice (Jan 31, 2013)

If I may add another perspective, here's what I've learned in my profession at 26:

Take action! Don't like your current boss or working long hours? Do something about it - go work for a competitor. Sometimes the only way to advance is by making that change. Whether you're seeking a promotion or more money, know your self worth and start taking action!

Speak up! Stop worrying about other people's feelings and speak what you think. Those who speak up more are seen as leaders; leaders = success.

Take risks! Make calculated risks of course (EVERYTHING has a risk), stop fearing the consequence, and always have a reason to support your decisions. "It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed".


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## kewlthing (Jan 30, 2010)

Like with most things in life balance and moderation and being aware of your situation is always the way to go. I saved when I was younger but I also traveled too. The travel was mostly budget trips to the U.S, (e.g: Grand Canyon, Las Vegas, etc.) but never a high dollar trip to Europe for example. I've owned motorcycles and nice cars but only for a short period of time before I resorted to more affordable and economical vehicles. My point I guess is too live a little too while your young and healthy. Pretty soon your knees go, your hips go, your eyesite, etc. and if you deprive yourself of some small luxuries in your younger days you may not very easily be able to do them later in life. Plus now I have to tend to my immediate family and some elderly parents that need attention. Sure I saved/invested and am sitting pretty right now but missed out on some prime experiences in early years when it was much easier to get away.


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

Would like to add, that you should start saving and investing as soon as possible. Time and compounding alone can make you rich. The sooner you start the richer you will get.

And, you will have to educate yourself about money. I don't know any school that teaches even basic money management let alone investing. To me this is criminal. Your financial decisions will affect your life every day, and none of us are properly prepared to make good financial decisions.

I had to revise my whole way of thinking. What I knew from the news media, school, family, neighbors, was not only wrong, it had me looking totally in the wrong direction. It took years of study to even start to see.


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## hystat (Jun 18, 2010)

Having a trade makes #2 and #3 N/A for me. 
Teaching others the trade for a living makes the work meaningful to me (and them by most accounts). 
#1 and #4 are certainly bang on.


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## richard (Jun 20, 2013)

A lot more people could find meaningful work, it just takes... work to get there. You can't expect the best relationship if you marry one of the first 3 people you go out with and careers are not unlike that.

But generally a lot of good things to think about.


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## Taraz (Nov 24, 2013)

#8: Marry rich.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> Would like to add, that you should start saving and investing as soon as possible. Time and compounding alone can make you rich. The sooner you start the richer you will get.
> 
> And, you will have to educate yourself about money. I don't know any school that teaches even basic money management let alone investing. To me this is criminal. Your financial decisions will affect your life every day, and none of us are properly prepared to make good financial decisions.
> 
> I had to revise my whole way of thinking. What I knew from the news media, school, family, neighbors, was not only wrong, it had me looking totally in the wrong direction. It took years of study to even start to see.



I agree about saving early. However, when I went to school, basic finance was covered in grade 9 and 11. The problem is most kids don't have the hands on experience to care. Schools can teach all the want for any subject, but until it becomes meaningful for the learner it won't sink in. 

I had a great financial education from my parents, siblings and school, I still made a lot of mistakes. I have an accounting degree. I could calculate compound interest and do all the present value calculations amount other concepts before graduating high school. I graduated with both school and consumer debt, not because I didn't have the knowledge, it was because I didn't have the self discipline. 

That is something families have to teach. I have been teaching my kids self discipline and delayed gratification since they were babies. Let's hope that helps.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

Taraz said:


> #8: Marry rich.


If it isn't for love I guarantee you will still earn every penny.

re #4 - I agree you can't save yourself rich, but you can invest those savings to do so.

re #2 - made me think about my grandparents generation, when they were just happy to find work, if you didn't like what you were doing, too bad, feed your family and enjoy another aspect of your life.


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## donald (Apr 18, 2011)

Your bang on Cal,my grandfather was just happy to be on canadian soil!
His def wasn't reading deepak chopra and phil mcgraw bullshit books and trying to ''find'' meaning ect
It was pretty cut and dry......he hung drywall when he first got here and the wired thing was he was happy somehow and supported 5 people and somehow raised successful children....go figure!


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

If the end of the line is the goal......

Most people are happy in retirement just to watch some television, putter around the yard, visit different shops and restaurants, take in a movie matinee, spend the day at the beach, read a novel.........spend time with family and friends.

It doesn't take a lot of money to be happy in retirement.

Government benefits........and a few dollars tucked away for extras......is enough for most people.


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