# Purchasing a 7 seater for a growing family - tips?



## rglempera (Apr 2, 2011)

Hi, I'm in the market for a 7-8 seater to accommodate my 3 children of 5, 3 and 18 months. Currently we have 3 car seats across the back of my RX400H, but it's super tight, so looking to go bigger with my 2nd car (currently a 2003 Forrester...my heart bleeds for trading 'er in). I'm looking across a variety of models; the Hyundai Sante Fe at the bottom end, Toyota Highlander in the middle and the Infiniti GX60 / GMC Acadia at the top end. I've ruled out the Honda Pilot (too trucky and feels a bit plastic on the finishes), the Kia Sonata (terrible access to 3rd row), and the Ford Explorer and Flex (they're Fords....haters gonna hate). Consumer Reports would say Highlander for sure, I drove it and it feels nice, but I really liked the Sante Fe which CR says has reliability issues long term. The Acadia is nice, but I'm just not sure the extra luxury finishes are worth the $. That's my situation, two questions:

1) Anything I should be considering, or a way of approaching this decision, that might be helpful? I feel like I'm drowning in data and also want to take my gut feel when driving into account...tough to get this sorted. Frameworks etc welcome!

2) Any tips for approaching the purchase negotiations? I live in Toronto so I should have access to multiple dealers - the approach my friends reco is figuring out exactly what model/features I want, and then approach multiple dealers in a bid mentality. Does that work? Are there any rules of thumb around what you should pay vs. the invoice price (and do they have to tell me what that is)?

Thanks for any tips!

RG


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

You might consider the Nissan Pathfinder, sister to the Infiniti GX60 at a lower price, and in the same price category as Toyota Highlander. I suspect the Toyota Highlander is the best overall package.

Have you considered an auto broker such as Automall Network to purchase on your behalf? My experience is there is not much room to negotiate on Japanese imports in particular.


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## atrp2biz (Sep 22, 2010)

What about the Sienna or Odyssey? I love my Odyssey and so do my kids. You can hook up an Xbox to the rear entertainment system.  Silver spoons...


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## KevinWaterloo (Mar 5, 2015)

I was going to recommend the Acadia (or the Traverse which is a bit less expensive). It is a big vehicle but it has a huge amount of cargo space (most in its class by a large margin). We have owned a 2012 Acadia for 4 years and have been super happy with it (although we managed to buy an almost-new Denali version from the US at the time).

There is a big range in prices depending on the model & options. Our primary motivation was for an 7-8 seater, large cargo space, and ability to tow > 4000lbs. The Traverse/Acadia/Enclave seemed like the best option after reviewing all of the options.

Fuel economy isn't great and the built-in Nav isn't the best. And it is a big vehicle which might be an issue when navigating Toronto. But otherwise I'd definitely recommend it.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Some folks don't want to have a minivan as a matter of preference, albeit, a minivan is still the most effective as a family people hauler.

There are many big SUVs that haul 7 people but the bigger and heavier, and less fuel efficient, ones are more truck based. Example: the Toyota 4Runner has same seating capacity as the Highlander but is heavier and less fuel efficient. Unless one needs the ruggedness or hauling capacity of a truck based SUV, there is no need to have one. The reason the OP ruled out the Honda Pilot. So why try to talk the OP into such a vehicle?


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## KevinWaterloo (Mar 5, 2015)

Actually the OP rules out the Honda Pilot based that it felt too "trucky". The Acadia is not a body-on-frame construction like a truck. It is built much more like a minivan (unibody) and really competes against the minivan in most areas including ride feel. Except it doesn't look one one since it is higher up and doesn't have sliding doors. But it seats 7 or 8, has lots of cargo space, and the seats fold very easily.

Granted it is heavier than the Honda Odyssey, mileage is worse, and it is a bit more expensive. It is typically AWD though and has great towing capacity. But as always it depends on personal priorities.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

We have our individual biases when it comes to vehicles. Almost as passionate about that as opinions about religion and politics. I was trying to stick to the OPs reference point and not bring in anything that deviates from that. FWIW, I also have a bias. Nothing that looks or feels like a truck! :cower:


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

I have to say we went with a SUV, Acura MDX because we refused to get a mini van and wanted a four wheel drive. Now, I wish we would have bought a mini van, next vehicle is a Toyota Sienna. My spouse is still in denial, but that's what we should have done in the first place


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## SW20 MR2 (Dec 18, 2010)

I agree. I would prefer to have an SUV for aesthetics, but the functionality of the minivan is awesome. Hauls people comfortably, and loading the trunk with stuff is so easy. IMO, it's not like the SUVs drive like a sports car, so you're driving a big vehicle no matter what. Might as well go all in and get the most useful vehicle. Again, just my own preference.



AltaRed said:


> Some folks don't want to have a minivan as a matter of preference, albeit, a minivan is still the most effective as a family people hauler.


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## gardner (Feb 13, 2014)

I guy I work with bought one of these for his family:

http://www.mercedes-benz-vans.ca/en/sprinter/passenger-van

I think it seats 12. It's a diesel and gets pretty good mileage for its size. Very utilitarian, but vast and surprisingly economical.


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## nobleea (Oct 11, 2013)

If we all shopped for value in terms of vehicles as we shop for company stocks, everyone here would be driving a minivan. In terms of volume and capacity per $ spent, it's easily the best value out there.


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## 319905 (Mar 7, 2016)

^ Ummm, no ...


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## madmoney (Jan 17, 2015)

After driving a 7 passenger SUV (2002 Buick Rendevous) for the last 9 years, we decided to purchase the 8 seat Toyota Sienna in January. 

Fabulous vehicle, waaaay more room than the SUV. Not terribly fuel efficient, but great value and capacity per $ spent . Kids love it, lots of room for their school and team mates. 

.99 financing, money is almost free.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

It is not for us to 'dissuade' the OP from the homework already done and the narrowing of prospects. That decision is already made.

To the OP: I used a buying service 10 years ago for a high demand Japanese luxury sport sedan because no dealer would even discuss a discount off list price. The buying service succeeded in getting a 5% discount off list, which at that time the dealer markup was typically about 10% for most Japanese imports. Unless things have changed, I think the best the OP can do is a 5% discount off list + whatever factory incentives, if any, are being provided by the dealer. By using a buying service, that is about the only guarantee you are likely getting the best price one can.


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## SW20 MR2 (Dec 18, 2010)

For buying a new car, I've used apa.ca on a number of occasions. They will give you the dealer invoice price, including anything like dealer incentives. From there, you have 2 options: 

1. Go to their affiliated dealer who is willing to sell you the car at a "reasonable" price. Depending on what car you're buying, this will be $500-1000 above invoice. There will only be one dealer in the GTA, so it may or may not be convenient for you.

2. Take the invoice, walk into any dealership, and negotiate. I just took the affiliate dealer price, knocked off a few bucks for the sake of it, went into my local dealer, and gave them a take it or leave it offer. No negotiation and ready to sign if they accept. I was out of there in less than an hour.


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## Curiouscreature (Jan 3, 2016)

There are strong rumors that the 2017 CRV will have a 7 seat option as well. We're holding out on buying a car to see what Honda comes out with, hoping for Hybrid with similar pricing to what Rav4 did (where the hybrid was only ~$1k more). Currently driving a 2002 Honda Odyssey with 240,000k been very happy with the vehicle, that I have very little concern about the quality of Hondas!


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## coptzr (Jan 18, 2013)

rglempera said:


> 7-8 seater to accommodate my 3 children of 5, 3 and 18 months
> *We went down this road for several years recently, from a dependable vehicle for new child, to awd SUV, to fitting 3 car seats and luggage.*
> 
> Currently we have 3 car seats across the back of my RX400H, but it's super tight
> ...


Good luck with your search


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## olivaw (Nov 21, 2010)

We recently went through the same research when buying a 7 seater for my wife. We read Consumer Reports and initially hesitated on the Santa Fe. Then we dug deeper into the reliability rating we realized that the overall rating on the Santa Fe was inconsistent with the detailed ratings (i.e. everything was very good or excellent in the details but the overall rating was poor????). The Santa Fe uses the same 3.3L engine as the Kia Sorento which got the top rating. 

We rejected the Pathfinder due to the CVT reliability issue. The Sorento was nice but small. The Highlander was good but the dealership alienated my wife with pressure tactics. 

The Mitsubishi Outlander is another 7 seater. It is as small as the Sorento but it is far less expensive than any of the other models and it comes with a 10 year warranty. The big worry about Mitsubishi are the rumours about them exiting the North American market.

We went with the Santa Fe XL.


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## Prospector (Jul 25, 2014)

Whatever you buy, make sure the car seats all fit. Install them and ask the kids to play musical chairs. You may be surprised at how poorly the seats fit even in large vehicles.

We went with an older Sienna, but refuse to finance vehicles. So far all we've needed is oil changes and tires.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

olivaw said:


> We rejected the Pathfinder due to the CVT reliability issue.


You are right that the 2013 and early 2014 releases of Nissan Pathfinder had CVT issues. That has been fixed with a re-design and many of the earlier designs have been swapped out with the newer transmission. We went through that experience but are happy campers now. I do agree the 7 seater Santa Fe appears to be a 'value' buy and we did look at it briefly when it first came out. BWTFDIK.


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## fraser (May 15, 2010)

My pick would be Honda Ody. or Toyota Siena.

I am partial to Honda and Toyota. Had a new top line company Ford Escape every year for four years. The Lincoln and the Taurus' were not much better. Lots of delivery issues and transmission issues. Would not touch a Ford product. Dealer service org's were second class in all respects (at least the three that I dealt with) compared to the Honda and Toyota dealers I have dealt with.


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## olivaw (Nov 21, 2010)

AltaRed said:


> You are right that the 2013 and early 2014 releases of Nissan Pathfinder had CVT issues. That has been fixed with a re-design and many of the earlier designs have been swapped out with the newer transmission. We went through that experience but are happy campers now. I do agree the 7 seater Santa Fe appears to be a 'value' buy and we did look at it briefly when it first came out. BWTFDIK.


Interesting. The Nissan dealership offered a very good discount on the 2016 Pathfinder. If the CVT issue is resolved then it would definitely have been an excellent choice for my wife. They did tell us that issues had been fixed and that Nissan was eager to get more Pathfinder on the road to restore their reputation. She decided on the Hyundai due to the availability of her color/trim and the five year warrantee.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

At the time we picked the Pathfinder because it gave us what we needed at the time. The new 7 seater Sante Fe was not yet out and the Toyota Highlander was long in the tooth (since updated). Had we been able to wait a year, it would most likely have been the Toyota Highlander. Regardless, we are happy with our choice, notwithstanding the original CVT issue. We tend to keep vehicles 12-15 yrs or so. And notwithstanding Honda's stellar reputation for lasting forever, they just don't have products that 'excite' me any more. At one time, they had a high tech hot Acura but one never hears much from them any more.


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## coptzr (Jan 18, 2013)

+1 on the Hyundai Sante Fe, I've seen them develop over the past 10 years and it has always been positive.


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## tyhatts (Nov 27, 2013)

Honda odyssey ! 

Bought our 2005 from a friend with 260,000 kms on it for $4500. That was four years ago. We now have 340,000 on it and I just sold it today for $1250. 

Granted it will need about $1500 worth of work to get it saftied/e-tested and working back to 100%, but other then oil changes and a set of tires, it didn't cost me a thing.


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