# Amazon VISA effectively over!



## leeder

I just received a letter from Chase. It looks like they will be closing accounts effective March 15, 2018. The letter says "the credit card relationship between JPMorgan Chase Bank, N.A. in Canada and Amazon.ca is ending and that Chase will be closing the Amazon.ca Rewards Visa Card program as of March 15, 2018... As of March 15, 2018, you will no longer be able to use your card for new transactions."

Any points accrued (even if it's below the $20 redemption mark) will be credited in the statement at $1 = 100 points.

Time to hunt for another no FX fee credit card. Any suggestions?


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## m3s

Seems like this happens to all good cards and was kinda expecting this

There's the Marriott Rewards Visa but it comes with a $120/annual fee


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## tdiddy

same here, there's a big thread about it on Red Flag Deals Forum 

try this one http://www.hometrust.ca/preferredvisa.aspx thats what I've applied for


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## My Own Advisor

http://www.greedyrates.ca/blog/travel-tip-avoid-foreign-transaction-fees-canadian-credit-card/

Crap - Amazon:
https://www.chase.com/credit-cards/mobile/canada/amazon.touch.html

I need to go shopping (for a new card as well)!

"As of March 15, 2018, Chase will be closing all Amazon.ca Rewards Visa Card accounts. Please update your credit card information for your Amazon.ca account and for any pre-authorized payments before this date.
You will continue to receive yourmonthly statements until any outstanding balance is paid.
The terms and conditions set out in the Cardmember Agreement for your account will still apply, and the annual interest rate on unpaid balances will not change once the account is closed.
These changes will not impact accounts that have already been closed.
You may have received a letter to notify you of this change."


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## leeder

tdiddy said:


> try this one http://www.hometrust.ca/preferredvisa.aspx thats what I've applied for


Yeah, Home Trust Preferred Visa is the only one I'm aware that has no annual fee with no FX fee as well. The other one is the Rogers Platinum Mastercard, which charges the FX fee, but gives 4% reward. However, the reward is only good if you are a Rogers customer. Then, you can apply the reward on your Rogers bill or any Rogers merchandise.

Any other worthwhile cards?


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## gibor365

Just got this letter too . need to shop for other card with no FX rates. Home Trust Preferred Visa looks good and most likely I would be able to use it in Cuba (couldn't use Amazon Visa)


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## gibor365

Just applied online for HT card


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## GoldStone

Ag Driver said:


> I was thinking of finding a VISA with road side. I would even pay a fee if it had a solid road side plan.


TD Cash Back Visa Infinite includes road side. You can get the annual fee waived if you also have TD All-Inclusive Banking Plan. The plan is $29.95 per month; waived if you keep a minimum $5,000 balance. The effective annual cost is the foregone interest on $5K after taxes.


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## kcowan

GoldStone said:


> TD Cash Back Visa Infinite includes road side. You can get the annual fee waived if you also have TD All-Inclusive Banking Plan. The plan is $29.95 per month; waived if you keep a minimum $5,000 balance. The effective annual cost is the foregone interest on $5K after taxes.


I don't think that is a contender. It seems that Rogers and Home Trust are the only ones. Neither gives cash advances at foreign ATMs though. Cannot find anyone that does that?

Although I have a Rogers paygo phone, I am leaning towards Home Trust that has no such restrictions.


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## GoldStone

kcowan said:


> I don't think that is a contender. It seems that Rogers and Home Trust are the only ones. Neither gives cash advances at foreign ATMs though


I didn't suggest that TD Cash Back Visa Infinite is a contender as a replacement for Amazon Visa. I mentioned TD card to Ag Driver because he was looking for a Visa than includes a road side club.


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## peterk

Ah crap.


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## ian

We use the Chase Marriott Visa. There is a $120. fee but it includes one free night a year at a Marriott property. We always use this and typically save anywhere from $130 to as much as $300 (in Australia). We use the points accumulation for hotels as well. We like the Marriott program. It seens much better than the Hilton program.

We keep a credit balance on the card in order to avoid any interest charges on the cash advances. When we travel we take a $500. cash advance in foreign currency from a local ATM. The Chase service charge is $5. minimum, 1 percent after the first $500. FX rate is perfect. Been doing this for five years. Just loaded up the account this week since we are leaving for two months this afternoon.


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## l1quidfinance

Ian

That card is being closed as well from what I understand.


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## ian

You are correct. I just checked the web site. We leave today, return March 15 which is when the card ends according to their web site. No mail notice yet. Not good. This card has saved us a great deal of money over the past five years.

Applied for the Home card today. Hopefully it will be in the mail when we return.


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## milhouse

Thanks for the heads up leeder as I haven't received my letter yet. 



peterk said:


> Ah crap.


My sentiments exactly.

I was also thinking "Who cares, I'll just roll over to the Marriott card" as I was thinking about migrating already to take advantage of the "free night" for our road trips. But then I saw the discussion it was wrapping up too. Doh!


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## ian

Our Marriott Visa letter arrived today. It adios on March 15.

Too bad.


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## bgc_fan

Ag Driver said:


> Damn!
> 
> I appreciate the home trust tip! I was thinking of finding a VISA with road side. I would even pay a fee if it had a solid road side plan.


Not sure why you are still looking as Home Trust indicates that it has Roadside assist club at no extra charge, as well as auto rental insurance coverage. Sounds like a winner to me.


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## fatcat

good riddance ... they have a lousy interface ... insist on sending paper statements and poor customer service ... bye bye

maybe amazon will get a relationship with a card company that is comfortable doing business in the 21 century


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## My Own Advisor

bgc_fan said:


> Not sure why you are still looking as Home Trust indicates that it has Roadside assist club at no extra charge, as well as auto rental insurance coverage. Sounds like a winner to me.


I agree. Seems like a winner.


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## peterk

Home Trust said:


> 2Foreign currency transactions are converted at the exchange rate set by Visa International, without additional surcharge.


Does that actually mean spot rate conversions though? Or just surcharges? What exactly is a surcharge?


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## humble_pie

peterk said:


> Does that actually mean spot rate conversions though? Or just surcharges? What exactly is a surcharge?




here's my tentative understanding, subject to clarification by others.

not a spot rate. The basic foreign exchange fee for USD used by credit card companies is 2.50% on top of spot. Some CCs levy additional "surcharges" on top of that.

if one looks carefully at the language, one can see that the reference is to the "Visa International" exchange rate. To the best of my knowledge MasterCard uses the identical structure, ie both charge 2.50% over spot. Both Visa & MC have countless card series where they levy no additional FX surcharge.

it's true that some cmffers who are longtime globetrotters post that they are the proud owners of credit cards which exchange CAD at spot rates. This is where i am unsure. The only way a cardholder could know for sure would be to obtain the spot rate - from XE.com for example - at the exact moment his hotel payment/cash WD/car rental was being processed (he might not get the post-conversion amount until he obtains the statement.)

i've never heard of a travelling cardholder who does this. It would require tracking payments, corroborating each payment with spot rate at the particular moment of processing from XE.com, then analyzing one's statement after the fact to see what FX fees had been charged, no?

i have difficulty imagining a business that would offer millions if not billions of tiny retail transactions at spot rates. There has to be some markup for the CC company somewhere.

entirely different are credit cards that operate in USD. Wells Fargo is said to offer one to canadians, the TD has one for its USD clients. These cards are more beneficial for travelling canadians with USD expenses to pay. The cardholder can fund or pay his credit card with no-FX-fee or low-FX-fee USD that he has obtained from gambit trading at his broker or from knightsbridge (larger amount) or any beneficial exchange house.

.


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## m3s

I don't believe chase amazon charged 2.5% because in all my trials it never got close to that. I only compared to the BoC daily average, which is probably what my work uses as well

They calculate fx fees when I provide a USD receipt and a CAD statement for work related expenses and it was very minimal. Maybe 0.5% but not 2.5%, I can understand under 0.5%



fatcat said:


> good riddance ... they have a lousy interface ... insist on sending paper statements and poor customer service ... bye bye
> 
> maybe amazon will get a relationship with a card company that is comfortable doing business in the 21 century


Very true. I definitely won't miss logging into that site or shredding the 1 visa statement I couldn't seem to make paperless

Truth be told it makes me hesitant to try Home Trust. How is their web interface?


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## m3s

humble_pie said:


> entirely different are credit cards that operate in USD. Wells Fargo is said to offer one to canadians, the TD has one for its USD clients. These cards are more beneficial for travelling canadians with USD expenses to pay. The cardholder can fund or pay his credit card with no-FX-fee or low-FX-fee USD that he has obtained from gambit trading at his broker or from knightsbridge (larger amount) or any beneficial exchange house.


I'm very happy I kept a TD account dormant all these years even though I got by with Tangerine just fine. One of the major inconveniences of working in the US is that it takes some time to establish US credit. Most US institutes won't recognize Canadian credit history but TD does if you have a Canadian history with them. First thing I intend to do is get a TD USD Visa. $1 USD bills are nasty and I hate prepaying for gas. The postal code trick doesn't always work anymore.


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## james4beach

I've been using the TD US Visa, which has no annual fee when part of the TD Borderless package. It includes rental car insurance, trip interruption, emergency travel assistance, delayed/lost baggage.

It's a USD card so there's no FX at all for purchases in USD. You also pay the bill by doing a USD transfer... I'm happy with it and have no reason to change to anything else. Basically I keep the TD Borderless account filled with some USD specifically to pay this CC. TD has also been pretty friendly and easy to deal with. They once offered to courier a replacement card to me while I was in the US.


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## peterk

humble_pie said:


> if one looks carefully at the language, one can see that the reference is to the "Visa International" exchange rate. To the best of my knowledge MasterCard uses the identical structure, ie both charge 2.50% over spot. Both Visa & MC have countless card series where they levy no additional FX surcharge.
> 
> it's true that some cmffers who are longtime globetrotters post that they are the proud owners of credit cards which exchange CAD at spot rates. This is where i am unsure. The only way a cardholder could know for sure would be to obtain the spot rate - from XE.com for example - at the exact moment his hotel payment/cash WD/car rental was being processed (he might not get the post-conversion amount until he obtains the statement.)
> 
> i've never heard of a travelling cardholder who does this. It would require tracking payments, corroborating each payment with spot rate at the particular moment of processing from XE.com, then analyzing one's statement after the fact to see what FX fees had been charged, no?


I've done the calculation for the Amazon Visa, and there was no currency charge above spot. Not actual live spot, mind you, I think I just looked up the closing exchange for the day at BOC. But I made sure to check my bill exchange rate a couple times vs. closing rate and it was always very very close.


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## humble_pie

m3s said:


> I'm very happy I kept a TD account dormant all these years even though I got by with Tangerine just fine. One of the major inconveniences of working in the US is that it takes some time to establish US credit. Most US institutes won't recognize Canadian credit history but TD does if you have a Canadian history with them. First thing I intend to do is get a TD USD Visa. $1 USD bills are nasty and I hate prepaying for gas. The postal code trick doesn't always work anymore.



indeed the TD US Visa card will work for you in the US or wherever you want to pay in USD with no FX fee. 

m3 since you are known to be one who can quickly research everything to the ends of the earth, could you perhaps let the forum know if you find a better deal than the big green USD Visa?

to my knowledge it's the only canadian bank that has so far been able to figure out that there's definitely a market for this CC product; but there might be competitors. Probably the amazon crowd will want to migrate to an all-USD card.

.


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## humble_pie

peterk said:


> I've done the calculation for the Amazon Visa, and there was no currency charge above spot. Not actual live spot, mind you, I think I just looked up the closing exchange for the day at BOC. But I made sure to check my bill exchange rate a couple times vs. closing rate and it was always very very close.



thankx for the info. BOC daily rates are a perfect check, i only thought of xe dot com because it's an easier quote to obtain when travelling than the BOC website, which i find to be a pain after its recent re-configuration.

i think it was amazing that amazon offered those deals. Perhaps that's the reason they're shutting down the service, it was just too amazing & they weren't making enough $$ at it.


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## milhouse

peterk said:


> Does that actually mean spot rate conversions though? Or just surcharges? What exactly is a surcharge?



No foreign currency conversion surcharges2
2Foreign currency transactions are converted at the exchange rate set by Visa International, without additional surcharge. 


See here for Visa exchange rate. 
I suspect Visa makes a bit on the currency spread/differential but for all intents and purposes, you're likely not going to get a better exchange rate as a basic consumer. (And you'll typically have a harder time getting a better rate when doing a conversion for hard currency as financial institutions will have a larger spread.)

The surcharge is an additional (2-2.5%) fee that most financial institutions make on top of the Visa exchange rate (or interbank rate?? for ATM transfers). The goal is to obviously find a card by a bank that doesn't have this fee.


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## leeder

The last time I used the Amazon VISA for a foreign transaction, there was a bit of a spread, but it was small and certainly not 2.5%.

What I will be interested with the Home Trust VISA is what the fees are for cash advances if I were to go to a foreign country and withdraw the country's local currency. I had been planning to do a Europe trip later this year and use my Amazon card to withdraw Euros...


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## tdiddy

I never checked the exact rate of conversion, but aside from doing a large gambit or using Investment brokers/currency house I don't think consumer will get much better than this type of card for everyday purchases. It was clearly much cheaper than my RBC visa that I sometimes used on the same day (ie for car rental with auto insurance) 

For me the USD account is far more inconvenient than surcharge free foreign exchange card. I get it if your a snowbird or do business in the US, but otherwise hard to see how keeping cash in USD and all the accounts that go with it is worth the effort. Not to mention the fact that doesn't help you for traveling abroad or ordering online from overseas (where I used Amazon CC the most) 

I really hope more Canadian banks offer this as I don't trust home trust to keep this card going much more than Chase/Amazon.


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## BC Eddie

I used my Amazon Visa for all our charges while travelling and I never saw a charge that was more than approximately 0.5% higher than the BOC day rate. Because of this card I now take next to nothing in cash when we travel anywhere. The saving was significant especially considering what the bank used to charge me when I bought foreign currency and again when I sold any excess back to them (or any lost earned interest if I just kept it in my drawer for the next trip). Plus you got 1% credit on any purchase. Quite the deal.

So, what is the conclusion, will the Home Trust card be similar to Amazon or does the "Visa Exchange rate" mean the fee is already included? Also, what are the odds of Home Trust cancelling this feature too?

Re the Chase Amazon site, I agree it was not state of the art but I happily used it as it was only for foreign charges. Plus they gave us $20 just for taking the card.


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## humble_pie

tdiddy said:


> For me the USD account is far more inconvenient than surcharge free foreign exchange card. I get it if your a snowbird or do business in the US, but otherwise hard to see how keeping cash in USD and all the accounts that go with it is worth the effort.



i think many intermittent or "lite" spenders of USD will be with you on this. At the very least, a 100% USD credit card requires a USD bank account plus both USD & CAD discount broker accounts where the card owner can gambit currencies in order to obtain USD at spot rates.


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## humble_pie

milhouse said:


> See here for Visa exchange rate.
> 
> I suspect Visa makes a bit on the currency spread/differential but for all intents and purposes, you're likely not going to get a better exchange rate as a basic consumer. (And you'll typically have a harder time getting a better rate when doing a conversion for hard currency as financial institutions will have a larger spread.)
> 
> The surcharge is an additional (2-2.5%) fee that most financial institutions make on top of the Visa exchange rate (or interbank rate?? for ATM transfers). The goal is to obviously find a card by a bank that doesn't have this fee.




the exchange rate calculator linked in your message is for regular CAD Visa cards, not for the new TD all-USD Visa, right?

there does appear to be a healthy FX fee in the regular Visa exchange rate, according to this calculator.

_*Visa rate today as of 10:00 am: 1.254475
spot rate today as of 10:00 am: 1.24600
*_
from these figures i'm getting a Visa FX fee of 1.007% in addition to spot. I entered 0% as an FX charge by my bank, so this 1.007% should be attributed 100% to Visa.

1% is a healthy percentage, we are getting close to bank retail FX rates here.


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## m3s

james4beach said:


> I've been using the TD US Visa, which has no annual fee when part of the TD Borderless package. It includes rental car insurance, trip interruption, emergency travel assistance, delayed/lost baggage.
> 
> It's a USD card so there's no FX at all for purchases in USD. You also pay the bill by doing a USD transfer... I'm happy with it and have no reason to change to anything else. Basically I keep the TD Borderless account filled with some USD specifically to pay this CC. TD has also been pretty friendly and easy to deal with. They once offered to courier a replacement card to me while I was in the US.


So you use a USD Visa from TD Canada? Isn't it tied to a Canadian postal code? Has that worked with all US gas stations? Can USD income go straight into borderless or are you juggling it around?

I plan to open a TD USA bank account to get a USD Visa with a zip code. I had TD borderless until they ironically excluded it from their "All Inclusive" account, seeing as Tangerine has a free USD account


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## Ihatetaxes

Chase is also cancelling the Marriott Visa here in Canada. I got one to pay for company events at the Ritz Carlton and ended up with a LOT of free nights there through the program but sadly no more. Never used the card for anything else though, still happy with RBC Avion Infinite Privilege for most spending, Tangerine for the 2% rebate on gas, groceries and recurring bills and RBC USD Visa for all US travel.


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## milhouse

humble_pie said:


> the exchange rate calculator linked in your message is for regular CAD Visa cards, not for the new TD all-USD Visa, right?
> 
> there does appear to be a healthy FX fee in the regular Visa exchange rate, according to this calculator.


Open to being corrected but I'm under the impression that the calculator is the rate used for forex conversions for all North American issued Visa cards. Apparently there's a different calculator for European Visa cards.


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## fatcat

it seems likely to me that amazon, who does business all over the world and allows sign-on in all its global sites with a single username and password will very likely come up with a replacement no currency conversion fee card

why would they just let something so important just drop ?


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## humble_pie

milhouse said:


> Open to being corrected but I'm under the impression that the calculator is the rate used for forex conversions for all North American issued Visa cards. Apparently there's a different calculator for European Visa cards.



but folks here are canadians talking mostly about USD purchases on credit cards, no?

it's easy to monitor your Visa calculator, just open a tab with XE.com & there's the spot rate. It does appear that Visa has a significant profit percentage built in for itself. One would have to monitor over a few days to develop a more accurate picture.

.


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## STech

Ag Driver said:


> Damn!
> 
> I appreciate the home trust tip! I was thinking of finding a VISA with road side. I would even pay a fee if it had a solid road side plan.



I'd like something with decent roadside too. The CAA mastercard offers 1% in CAA dollars. I'm not sure if that's good or not, but CAA road side is pretty good at about $150 a year.


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## fatcat

STech said:


> I'd like something with decent roadside too. The CAA mastercard offers 1% in CAA dollars. I'm not sure if that's good or not, but CAA road side is pretty good at about $150 a year.


i get really good roadside with my insurance policy ... gave up caa long ago as just not worth it


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## m3s

I think the last time I called a tow truck was 1999 and the last time I used a paper map was before that

So I figure I have a $3000 credit in my roadside assistance savings account by now


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## STech

fatcat said:


> i get really good roadside with my insurance policy ... gave up caa long ago as just not worth it



What insurance company? And what do you get for roadside assistance? I like CAA because they don't force you to tow to the nearest shop.


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## BC Eddie

STech said:


> What insurance company? And what do you get for roadside assistance? I like CAA because they don't force you to tow to the nearest shop.


My car insurance is with Economical Mutual and it includes a $250.00 per occurrence Emergency roadside Service.


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## fatcat

STech said:


> What insurance company? And what do you get for roadside assistance? I like CAA because they don't force you to tow to the nearest shop.


family insurance in BC ... 250 per occurrence, no limit ... only used it once for a jump and they were great, fast and helpful


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## kcowan

Ag Driver said:


> Side Note: I applied for the Home Trust Visa as my replacement.


Have you been able to determine how they treat cash advances on foreign ATMs?


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## ian

I could not determine this. I need the card for foreign travel but the ability to get cash advances is important. I could not tell this from the web site. In am hoping that this detail will be included in the doc when the card arrives


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## kcowan

Ag Driver said:


> Is the logic to overpay on the card and withdraw the US funds at zero fee (aside from possible ATM fee) at straight fx rate?


Well there is a flat fee of C$5 or 1%, whichever is greater. This covers the Plus exchange fee.


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## Karen

The Bank of Nova Scotia (Scotiabank) has a Visa Momentum credit card that pays 4% on groceries and gasoline, 3% on drug store purchases and 1% on other purchases. It is not a free card (charge is $100 per year - the first year is free) but my personal banking representative showed me that the high cashback would have still left me ahead financially for the year she showed me, so I switched, and it definitely paid off. I started putting everything I bought on my credit card and paying it off in full at the end of the month, and that first year I earned $269 in cashback. This past year, I had to pay the fee of $100, but I still came out ahead by $164. Well worth paying the annual fee for!


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## Koogie

Karen said:


> The Bank of Nova Scotia (Scotiabank) has a Visa Momentum credit card that pays 4% on groceries and gasoline, 3% on drug store purchases and 1% on other purchases. It is not a free card (charge is $100 per year - the first year is free) but my personal banking representative showed me that the high cashback would have still left me ahead financially for the year she showed me, so I switched, and it definitely paid off. I started putting everything I bought on my credit card and paying it off in full at the end of the month, and that first year I earned $269 in cashback. This past year, I had to pay the fee of $100, but I still came out ahead by $164. Well worth paying the annual fee for!


+1 That is the card my DW has. Between this card, the lamented Amazon card and the MBNA cashback MC that I have, we made a LOT of cashback last year. Well prefer cashback to phony travel points or other b.s. cards.


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## agent99

m3s said:


> Isn't it tied to a Canadian postal code? Has that worked with all US gas stations?


Any Canadian credit card can usually be used at gas stations in USA that require Zip Codes. 

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/lif...t-us-pumps-with-credit-again/article13463053/

Not that many require the zip code, but above works if they do.


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## ian

we are travelling now. The ability to get cash via a cash advance is huge. We travel outside Canada anywhere from 4 to 5 months a year.

We paid $3500 on our Chase Visa. We will charge on this but we do a lot of $500 cash advances- as we will do tomorrow in Thailand. Chase charge us $5 for the cash advance ($5 or 1%). The FX rate is market. When we get close to depleting our credit balance we simply top up the card's credit position. That way we do not get charged interest on our cash advances.

If we were to use our CIBC ATM card we would pay a $5 ATM fee to CIBC BUt they would calculate the Fx at about 2.5 to 3 percent higher than Chase. Essentially the same up charge that our former CIBC visa would charge for foreign visa transactions. In our first year of retirement we travelled outside Canada for sic months. We calculated the net savings on the Marriott card, including free hotel night and the card fee, to be roughly $650.

It is the reason why we use Chase Visa and one of the reasons that we like bank stocks. Canadians do not seem overly adverse to paying very high hidden bank fees.


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## m3s

agent99 said:


> Not that many require the zip code, but above works if they do.


Consumers should be prepared to pay inside the station if necessary. Since this tip can't be used at 100 per cent of gas stations in the U.S., consumers should consider this an option to try rather than a guaranteed solution," a MasterCard representative said.

Trust me, it varies drastically on the region, brand, card provider and alignment of the stars. That article is from 2013 and 5 years later the US is going through growing pains of the chip cards

Some people say 11111, 99999, 12345. I tried every trick known to google as recently as November and some gas stations still do not work. Zip codes are still required in some regions

YMMV..


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## My Own Advisor

Koogie said:


> +1 That is the card my DW has. Between this card, the lamented Amazon card and the MBNA cashback MC that I have, we made a LOT of cashback last year. Well prefer cashback to phony travel points or other b.s. cards.


I'm with you on cash back Koogie. No BS that way! I got my Amazon letter in the mail as well. Card done. Oh well. Will probably apply for this one soon:
http://www.greedyrates.ca/blog/home-trust-preferred-visa-review/


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## canew90

My Own Advisor said:


> I'm with you on cash back Koogie. No BS that way! I got my Amazon letter in the mail as well. Card done. Oh well. Will probably apply for this one soon:
> http://www.greedyrates.ca/blog/home-trust-preferred-visa-review/


MOA: why not just use the Costco Capital One card?
https://www.costco.ca/capital-one-platinum-mastercard.html


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## My Own Advisor

We're not at Costco too much. We get 1.5% cash back on everything and no fee. Costco one is a good card; highly recommend.


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## STech

My Own Advisor said:


> I'm with you on cash back Koogie. No BS that way! I got my Amazon letter in the mail as well. Card done. Oh well. Will probably apply for this one soon:
> http://www.greedyrates.ca/blog/home-trust-preferred-visa-review/




I quickly looked through the details and didn't find what I was looking for. Any info on their roadside assistance? 

I do some travelling outside of Canada, so the FX rate is a good thing, 1% plus the roadside seems like it'll do me well.


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## agent99

m3s said:


> Some people say 11111, 99999, 12345. I tried every trick known to google as recently as November and some gas stations still do not work. Zip codes are still required in some regions
> 
> YMMV..


None of those ever worked. 

But the system outlined in the article does. We are in the USA right now (2018). The large majority of major brand stations don't ask for a zip. We have been coming down here for 3 months every year for 10+ years and have never found a location where the method in article does not work. It worked even before Mastercard made it better known. This with various credit cards including the Amazon Visa  Our experience is anywhere on Eastern seaboard all the way to Florida and along the gulf coast.

http://www.bcsportbikes.com/forum/showthread.php/142231-Using-Visa-Cards-at-USA-gas-stations


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## leeder

m3s said:


> Consumers should be prepared to pay inside the station if necessary. Since this tip can't be used at 100 per cent of gas stations in the U.S., consumers should consider this an option to try rather than a guaranteed solution," a MasterCard representative said.
> 
> Trust me, it varies drastically on the region, brand, card provider and alignment of the stars. That article is from 2013 and 5 years later the US is going through growing pains of the chip cards
> 
> Some people say 11111, 99999, 12345. I tried every trick known to google as recently as November and some gas stations still do not work. Zip codes are still required in some regions
> 
> YMMV..


I haven't tried it myself, but my understanding was that it was the digits on your postal code and two 0's at the end. So if your postal code was A2B 6C8, your code would be 26800. Like I said, though, I haven't tried that yet, so please don't quote me!


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## milhouse

leeder said:


> I haven't tried it myself, but my understanding was that it was the digits on your postal code and two 0's at the end. So if your postal code was A2B 6C8, your code would be 26800. Like I said, though, I haven't tried that yet, so please don't quote me!


That worked for us using the Chase Amazon card for trips to the States. Chase Amazon posted that tip in the online account system.


----------



## agent99

leeder said:


> I haven't tried it myself, but my understanding was that it was the digits on your postal code and two 0's at the end. So if your postal code was A2B 6C8, your code would be 26800. Like I said, though, I haven't tried that yet, so please don't quote me!


Yes, that is what the Mastercard link I posted earlier says. We have been using that method in many parts of USA and with various cards for at least 6 years. Maybe more. Our zip is easy to remember 01000! Of course it won't work with Amazon Visa in a month or two  

We will probably get some sort of Canadian rewards card for use in Canada. Then do as we also do now. Use our BMO US$ Mastercard and generate the US$ funds needed to pay card balance free of exchange charges by selling dual listed stocks on US side if US$ dividends are insufficient. May require some tweaking of portfolio.


----------



## kcowan

ian said:


> We paid $3500 on our Chase Visa. We will charge on this but we do a lot of $500 cash advances- as we will do tomorrow in Thailand. Chase charge us $5 for the cash advance ($5 or 1%). The FX rate is market. When we get close to depleting our credit balance we simply top up the card's credit position. That way we do not get charged interest on our cash advances.


Home Trust Preferred Visa has the same deal but it is 1.5% instead of 1%. Still the best option available today (Mar 15th) for getting cash overseas.


----------



## bgc_fan

With all this talk about cash advances, I wanted to know what benefit there is over cash withdrawal. I assume the local bank would charge fees in either case. Is there a better exchange rate? Or is it because of the fee your current bank charges? TD's select has free ATM withdrawals worldwide, which I tested in Japan and Taiwan, although the Japanese ATMs do charge an extra fee ontop of it.


----------



## m3s

agent99 said:


> We are in the USA right now (2018). The large majority of major brand stations don't ask for a zip. We have been coming down here for 3 months every year for 10+ years and have never found a location where the method in article does not work. It worked even before Mastercard made it better known. This with various credit cards including the Amazon Visa  Our experience is anywhere on Eastern seaboard all the way to Florida and along the gulf coast.


Great, I'm telling you it doesn't always work at all brands in all regions. It seems to work on the I95 and places where you see large flocks of RVs, try going down some dusty backroads and you'll see what I mean.

From your Globe and Mail article itself:



> "T*his tip can't be used at 100 per cent of gas stations in the U.S., consumers should consider this an option to try rather than a guaranteed solution," a MasterCard representative said.*


----------



## kcowan

bgc_fan said:


> With all this talk about cash advances, I wanted to know what benefit there is over cash withdrawal. I assume the local bank would charge fees in either case. Is there a better exchange rate? Or is it because of the fee your current bank charges? TD's select has free ATM withdrawals worldwide, which I tested in Japan and Taiwan, although the Japanese ATMs do charge an extra fee on top of it.


You probably did not notice that TD charge you an extra 2.5% on the money you withdrew. That is what this is all about. They only started to do that 4 years ago. I hold TD stock but I refuse to be a patsy to their extra charges. Let the uniformed pay it.


----------



## agent99

m3s said:


> try going down some dusty backroads and you'll see what I mean.


Dusty backroads in the U S of A - Surely not!


----------



## bgc_fan

kcowan said:


> You probably did not notice that TD charge you an extra 2.5% on the money you withdrew. That is what this is all about. They only started to do that 4 years ago. I hold TD stock but I refuse to be a patsy to their extra charges. Let the uniformed pay it.


Fair enough. I never made the calculation until now. Back of the envelope calculations has 0.2% conversion over spot for Amazon VISA and 2.7% for the bank withdrawal.


----------



## Ag Driver

Deleted


----------



## BC Eddie

Ag Driver said:


> Anyone approved for the Home Trust Visa yet? How's the site? E-Statements?


I applied online about 10 days ago. So yesterday I followed up with an email to Home Trust asking about status and they replied that, because of demand, it might take 3-4 weeks for answer.


----------



## FrugalTrader

Here are some (free) ideas for the Amazon Visa replacement:

https://www.milliondollarjourney.com/top-free-credit-cards-when-travelling-out-of-country.htm


----------



## leeder

I did a FX transaction on January 31 with my Amazon Visa card, which posted on February 1 for $195 USD. It converted to $240.84 CAD. This amounts to an exchange rate of about $1 USD = $1.23507 CAD. When I check Visa International's exchange rate for Feb 1, it had the same exchange rate as mentioned. However, in comparison to xe.com and Bank of Canada's exchange rate, XE had an exchange rate of $1 USD = $1.22822 CAD and BoC had it at $1.2288. While the difference is minuscule (about 0.5% difference), just wondering if Visa has a hidden gross up within its exchange rate.


----------



## milhouse

BC Eddie said:


> I applied online about 10 days ago. So yesterday I followed up with an email to Home Trust asking about status and they replied that, because of demand, it might take 3-4 weeks for answer.


Yeah, I applied on the 18th and haven't heard back yet. Kind of figured they'd be swamped.


----------



## milhouse

leeder said:


> I did a FX transaction on January 31 with my Amazon Visa card, which posted on February 1 for $195 USD. It converted to $240.84 CAD. This amounts to an exchange rate of about $1 USD = $1.23507 CAD. When I check Visa International's exchange rate for Feb 1, it had the same exchange rate as mentioned. However, in comparison to xe.com and Bank of Canada's exchange rate, XE had an exchange rate of $1 USD = $1.22822 CAD and BoC had it at $1.2288. While the difference is minuscule (about 0.5% difference), just wondering if Visa has a hidden gross up within its exchange rate.


In practice, there's always a spread on the exchange rate. One can't get that actual exchange rate. And the spread varies based the interbank network being used, be it Visa, Mastercard, Plus, Cirrus, etc and currencies. Cannot get around this as the spread basically covers the cost of the network.


----------



## m3s

Can't find it anymore, but I showed the math for a few dozen amazon USD transactions and the spread from BoC seemed to gravitate between .5% and .3% with a few outliers towards 0 or even better than 0. If the rate moved against them they would lose money without that small buffer.


----------



## gibor365

BC Eddie said:


> I applied online about 10 days ago. So yesterday I followed up with an email to Home Trust asking about status and they replied that, because of demand, it might take 3-4 weeks for answer.


I applied on Jan 16... got application reference number... still nothing


----------



## Ag Driver

Deleted


----------



## STech

I applied Jan 30th, and only today I got this email to even acknowledge my application. 3-4 weeks should be good timing as the Amazon card will end just in time.




> We just wanted to let you know that we have received your request and you can expect to hear back in the next 3 – 4 weeks. Thank you for your patience and thank you for choosing the Home Trust Preferred Visa.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Home Trust Visa Customer Service


----------



## nathan79

I just got the email today and I applied 2 weeks ago... lol. They must be swamped.


----------



## fstamand

Had amazon for a while, but moved to tangerine when it was 1% back on everything, 2% on three selectable areas
I supplement it with the Visa momentum which has 4% on groceries and gasoline, 3% on drug store purchases and 1% on other purchases. However I am changing to the costco Capital one as it has no yearly fees.


----------



## Koogie

I applied on Jan. 13
Got my pin code in the mail today.
Indicates card will be received this week.


----------



## gibor365

gibor365 said:


> I applied on Jan 16... got application reference number... still nothing


Called 2.5-3 weeks ago, wastold that next week I should get answer by mail.... still nothing


----------



## BC Eddie

Cards finally arrived last Thursday (Feb 22). (My wife's and my card have the same card number and CVV on back - just different names and assigned PINs) I called hoping there was some way to change the assigned PIN but was told no :-(


----------



## gibor365

> Called 2.5-3 weeks ago, was told that next week I should get answer by mail.... still nothing


Wow! This company is a disaster! Just called them again and this time thae couldn't even find my application! So, rep said that she gonna send email to another department and call back in several days.... .


----------



## milhouse

gibor365 said:


> Wow! This company is a disaster! Just called them again and this time thae couldn't even find my application! So, rep said that she gonna send email to another department and call back in several days.... .


I called them a week and a half ago at the 4 week mark of my application. The rep said they couldn't easily find my application and recommended calling back at the 6 week mark if I still have my card yet. She said alternatively, I could submit another application as a second application wouldn't cause a second card to be created in my name. 

I'm going to call them again at the end of the week (6 week mark) and see what they say. I may submit another application at that point.


----------



## bgc_fan

In fairness, they probably weren't prepared for the influx from former Amazon VISA holders.


----------



## Ag Driver

Deleted


----------



## gardner

Does the HT Visa send paper bills or do you have to go on their web site to work out what they think you owe them?
Not being able to change the PIN is certainly an annoyance.


----------



## Ag Driver

Deleted


----------



## ian

I applied for a Home Trust card in early Jan. About the 10th just prior to leaving on a winter trip.

The first communication from Home Trust was a heads up that it would take thee weeks before they responded to the application. I did in fact get something a month later.

Two weeks ago I got a note from an administrator. Home Trust wanted a breakdown of my retirement income sources. Sent this to them. A few days ago they emailed me saying the card was in the mail. We are still travelling but we return before the 15th so it is not an issue.

Also got an offer from Amex/Starwood to replace the Marriott Visa. We can sign up and will receive the equiv. Of 75000 Marriott points. We are considering this.


----------



## bgc_fan

FWIW, applications for the Fido Mastercard were processed pretty quickly. Less than a couple of weeks.


----------



## larry81

I have taken advantage of a 50$ signup for the Amazon VISA, never used the card.

Thanks for the free money Amazon/Chase !


----------



## milhouse

Finally got my PIN with a note saying the Home Trust card will be arriving soon. Applied in mid January so it'll end up being a 7 to 8 week wait.


----------



## Koogie

It has been a pretty good card so far. No hassles and does what it says on the tin.

I must say their account website is pretty rinky dink though.


----------



## m3s

Koogie said:


> I must say their account website is pretty rinky dink though.


Can you at least download qfx quicken or csv for spreadsheets?

I think I'll hold off, although I'll miss the amazon card the next few months in Cali.

Might just get the TD USD Visa or use cash for now


----------



## tdiddy

I've had my Home trust for a couple weeks now. Was in Chicago over the weekend but forgot my PIN so wasn't very useful lol I've also noticed that it doesn't seem to have tap which is pretty annoying. Hvaen't tried the online setup or gotten a bill yet.


----------



## Koogie

m3s said:


> Can you at least download qfx quicken or csv for spreadsheets?
> I think I'll hold off, although I'll miss the amazon card the next few months in Cali.
> Might just get the TD USD Visa or use cash for now


Yes, you do seem to be able to do that. Download to Quickbooks, Quicken or in csv or tab formats.

Got my first statement and was slightly panicked when they said you have to mail a cheque in ! I quickly checked though and they are an online payee at TDCT. That would've sucked otherwise.


----------



## m3s

Thanks. I see Home Trust Visa as a payee on Tangerine as well


----------



## m3s

fatcat said:


> it seems likely to me that amazon, who does business all over the world and allows sign-on in all its global sites with a single username and password will very likely come up with a replacement no currency conversion fee card
> 
> why would they just let something so important just drop ?


Word on the street is there will be a brim mastercard with 0% FX, 4% cash back on recurring bills and amazon, step up loyalty rewards for returning to the brands you chose, free Boingo wifi in airports and on planes, travel insurance, mobile device insurance..

https://brimfinancial.com/features/


----------



## nathan79

Still waiting for my Home Trust card. 

Went to make a purchase online today and realized the Amazon card was expired (must have expired right at midnight). Luckily the merchant accepted Bitcoin.

I do have another credit card but I didn't want to register it with PayPal.


----------



## ian

We have our cards. They came one week after we received the pin codes. Now we just have to figure out how to change the pin code to something we can remember. We only use the card when we travel or when we order on line from an out of country vendor.


----------



## Koogie

ian said:


> We have our cards. They came one week after we received the pin codes. Now we just have to figure out how to change the pin code to something we can remember. We only use the card when we travel or when we order on line from an out of country vendor.


Let me know if you can. I haven't been able to change the PIN and most people online say it can't be done.


----------



## BC Eddie

Koogie said:


> Let me know if you can. I haven't been able to change the PIN and most people online say it can't be done.


It can't be done. I called Home Trust a couple of weeks ago when I got my card and they told me there is no option to change. Hard to believe but true.


----------



## milhouse

BC Eddie said:


> It can't be done. I called Home Trust a couple of weeks ago when I got my card and they told me there is no option to change. Hard to believe but true.


Ditto when I called this week. Rep said cannot be done at this time. Might be rolling that function out later in the year.


----------



## ian

Thanks.

That is not very good. We like to change our PIN numbers on a regular basis. Both our banks recommend it as a safety precaution.


----------



## bgc_fan

ian said:


> Thanks.
> 
> That is not very good. We like to change our PIN numbers on a regular basis. Both our banks recommend it as a safety precaution.


A bit of an aside, I don't find that advice very useful. The assumption is that it makes it harder to guess the PIN. Think about that assumption. When is that really a concern? When your card is compromised or lost or stolen. In those cases you would be cancelling your card. There is a thought that changing PINs on a regular basis is actually worse, because people will write down the PIN and subsequently lose both.


----------



## ian

No. We never write it down. We use certain numbers that are very common to us.

A few years ago, while in line to return a car in Costa Rica, the gentleman in front of me was lamenting the fact that his hotel room was robbed and his in room safe was opened. He subsequently discovered that the thieves had taken money from his bank account. The reason....his pin was written down inside his wallet (which was in the safe).


----------



## m3s

Home Trust also has a small limit on the number of transactions per day. I'll pass because of that and the PIN limitations


----------



## ian

How small is small?


----------



## m3s

Word on the street is 10 transactions per day. I probably never hit that in a day but I've never counted and I'm sure if I need to make 10 transactions in a day I probably have a damn good reason for it.


----------



## bgc_fan

It appears to be 10 transactions a day.

Although it seems they may soon have the ability to change PINs... although they have been promising it since last December.

More discussion on RedFlagDeals.

https://forums.redflagdeals.com/preferred-visa-card-home-trust-1658841/55/


----------



## ian

10 is fine with me. We will really only be using the card for FX.


----------



## BC Eddie

Good to know about the 10/day limit though as I had not picked up on that from their site. My wife and I will just use it for travel but as our cards have the same number it could at some point be an issue. Better to know about in advance and be prepared.


----------



## STech

Almost 2 months later, and I haven't heard a peep from Home Trust. No email, no card in the mail, and when I spent over an hour on the phone, they told to wait some more.

I'll give them to the end of March, and then move on. I totally understand the sudden rush they got, but this is getting a little ridiculous. It's a shame I took a little credit hit because of this, but no biggie, and Home Trust isn't the only game in town. No tap pay, no way to change the PIN, limits on daily transactions?


----------



## STech

m3s said:


> Word on the street is there will be a brim mastercard with 0% FX, 4% cash back on recurring bills and amazon, step up loyalty rewards for returning to the brands you chose, free Boingo wifi in airports and on planes, travel insurance, mobile device insurance..
> 
> https://brimfinancial.com/features/


Looks good. I'll likely sign up for this next week and cut up the Home Trust Visa if it ever shows up. The FreeWifi while travelling is very nice. The only advantage Home Trust has is the free road side assistance, which is only for 5 KM tow. Not that appealing of a card really, and I'm dubious of their customer service now.


----------



## lightcycle

Any Brim or Home Trust card holders know if their card can be enrolled in the "Verified by Visa" online authentication?

One of the drawbacks of the Chase Amazon.ca card was that you couldn't use it with any online merchant requesting a "Verified by Visa" PIN. Chase never enrolled in this program, so all Chase cards are not "Verified by Visa".


----------



## gaspr

This article says pins can be changed at Canada Post...not sure when it was written though...

https://www.newswire.ca/news-releas...osts-pin-card-servicessolution-546273082.html

and yes there is an option to enroll in the "verified by VISA" program


----------



## STech

I just applied for BRIM. I'll update this as things progress. They say they are in the pre-launch state and will let me know when my application is processed. Home Trust is showing up on my credit history as approved credit, yet not a single word from them, and it's been 8 weeks. Couple that with their transaction restriction, and absolutely archaic PIN system, it'll end up in the trash as soon as my BRIM card shows up.

If anyone is going to sign up for BRIM, I could pass you my referral code, and you could help me buy lunch. I didn't want to just the post the code, it seems more spamy that way


----------



## kcowan

STech said:


> Almost 2 months later, and I haven't heard a peep from Home Trust. No email, no card in the mail, and when I spent over an hour on the phone, they told to wait some more.
> 
> I'll give them to the end of March, and then move on. I totally understand the sudden rush they got, but this is getting a little ridiculous. It's a shame I took a little credit hit because of this, but no biggie, and Home Trust isn't the only game in town. No tap pay, no way to change the PIN, limits on daily transactions?


I felt the same way, especially now that the amazon card is dead, but last Friday I got the confirmation email saying the card and PIN were being mailed. 8 weeks after applying.


----------



## kcowan

gaspr said:


> This article says pins can be changed at Canada Post...not sure when it was written though...


The article was written in 2012. This from redflagdeals in 2017:


> But there is no self-serve option anymore (they used to have an arrangement with Canada Post [as did AMEX] to allow you to change PIN at the Postal Outlet; neither AMEX nor Home Trust offer this any longer)


----------



## gaspr

^Thanks...Guess I won't try that then. Got my card though after a long wait.


----------



## gibor365

After 2 months of wait, we finally got our Home Trust Visas . So far, the biggest drawback that I cannot change my PIN . Are you (HT) serious?!
Also, don't like that they don't give you cash back on monthly basis as Amazon Visa did, but only in January....

generally speaking.....why Canada is so retarded?!

US Amazon card is amazing!
https://www.amazon.com/Amazon-Rewards-Visa-Signature-Card/dp/B007URFTYI

Just curious, US Amazon Visa doesn't have FX fees eighter, can I apply for it from here?


----------



## STech

gibor365 said:


> After 2 months of wait, we finally got our Home Trust Visas . So far, the biggest drawback that I cannot change my PIN . Are you (HT) serious?!
> Also, don't like that they don't give you cash back on monthly basis as Amazon Visa did, but only in January....



Really? The cash back is only once a year?? God I wish I knew about all this junk before I applied. Not that it matters a whole lot, but I liked that Amazon automatically credited my account as soon as I had $20 in rewards, unlike the $50 at my current card with MBNA.

I really see very little advantage to HT Visa, unless you travel a lot. I buy a lot from Amazon, and I really hope they have another card soon.


----------



## gibor365

STech said:


> Really? The cash back is only once a year?? God I wish I knew about all this junk before I applied. Not that it matters a whole lot, but I liked that Amazon automatically credited my account as soon as I had $20 in rewards, unlike the $50 at my current card with MBNA.
> 
> I really see very little advantage to HT Visa, unless you travel a lot. I buy a lot from Amazon, and I really hope they have another card soon.


I ordered it only for using abroad. For groceries and gas I have CIBC Visa with 4% rebate + 3 categories with 2% rebate from Tangerine...


----------



## ian

The Marriott Visa (same features as Amazon Visa) saved us a lot of bank fees. We travel three or four months a year. We used it for FX purchased, travel, and foreign ATM's. Very sorry to see it go.

We now have the HT Visa. It will be fine. Just have to memorize the PIN. Hoping we can use it in the same manner as we did the Marriott Visa, ie have a credit balance and then use it for cash advances in foreign ATM's without paying any interest charges. 

Really, we don't see the once a year rebates as much of a show stopper. If you don't like HT, send it back or destroy the card. I do not think that the folks at HT will be crushed if you decide not to move forward with their card.


----------



## gibor365

> It will be fine. Just have to memorize the PIN


 This is the major inconvinience for me . Have too many cards, PINs to memorize another one


----------



## BC Eddie

gibor365 said:


> After 2 months of wait, we finally got our Home Trust Visas . So far, the biggest drawback that I cannot change my PIN . Are you (HT) serious?!
> Also, don't like that they don't give you cash back on monthly basis as Amazon Visa did, but only in January....
> 
> generally speaking.....why Canada is so retarded?!
> ?


I don't understand your negative comment re. Canada. The problem you have with the cash back is a result of Home Trust's decision on how to admin their card. I don't think this justifies the Canada comment. 

From my experience of living in both US and Canada, Canada's Banking and financial systems are no worse than US and in some ways better.


----------



## ian

This is truly a 'don't sweat the small stuff' issue. A great example of a first world 'problem'.

If this is a 'major' inconvenience I can only image the disaster that could occur during travel.


----------



## gibor365

BC Eddie said:


> I don't understand your negative comment re. Canada. The problem you have with the cash back is a result of Home Trust's decision on how to admin their card. I don't think this justifies the Canada comment.
> 
> From my experience of living in both US and Canada, Canada's Banking and financial systems are no worse than US and in some ways better.


My home is not about specific HT policy, generally but about Canadian credit cards that are inferior comparing to US ones... Just see what US Amazon Visa offers ... superioe comparing to canadian Amazon Visa and even this one got discontinued in Canada


----------



## ian

It really does not matter to me if US, UK, or whereever cards are inferior. Makes no difference since I am limited Canadian cards. 

Same with bank charges. Canadian bank charges are scandalous because Canadian are apathetic and because there is not much competition. So, we buy Canadian bank stock and we have figured out how to avoid most bank charges-especially the hidden ones like FX charge on Visa transactions and ATM withdrawals.

No point in complaining about it. We just get on with it. After all, not being able to change our PIN number our HT card is not really the end of world for us. 

But, we tend to look at things from a glass half full perspective.


----------



## m3s

ian said:


> No point in complaining about it. We just get on with it.


You realize Canada's credit-to-GDB and debt-service-ratios are considered the highest in the world right now?

This is because many Canadians are very financially inept and apathetic to anything finance related.

Therefore we get the worst deals on credit cards and telecoms etc because no point complaining, eh?


----------



## gibor365

> Canadian are apathetic


 very true! When we came to Canada , I was very surprised how Canadians apathetic ... and this is practically for everything starting from waiting hours in line in government offices to Federal elections.
My first experience, waited with small kid 3 hours to order SIN when only 1 clerk out of 4-5 worked and he also mostly was talking on the phone - something completely not work related. There was a big line and everyone was just quietly standing and waiting. It was my 1st (but not last shock) in Canada .



> No point in complaining about it.


 Why not?! If we complain, the situation can change. In summer when there were extremely long line (waiting times 6-8 hours) in driving offices , I contacted City TV who came and made program about it and showed it on TV.... 
Hopefully something got changed..



> not being able to change our PIN number our HT card is not really the end of world for us.


 Sure not, but this is inconvenient and ...... just stupid . Another typical Canadian thing that people should wait 2 months after applying for card! For example, I ordered Amazon Visa over the phone, it took me 5 min and several days after this I got the card.
And now, HT Visa is monopoly for cards that don't charge FX fees! Amazing "competition"


----------



## ian

This is really straightforward. HT is not a public service. It is a business. If you don't like the product or the service then vote with your feet and with your wallet. Why whine about it endlessly? Just move on to another product.

So we don't complain. We make a choice based on our needs. We try not to fall asleep at the proverbial switch and just keep on paying monthly fees without testing the market.

We moved all of our investments away from the bank years ago. We use on line banks for HISA. The only bank fees we pay for are a safe deposit box and the odd internet cash transfer. Checking account is free. This does not preclude us from liking and acquiring equity in Canadian banks. We moved to buy our own phones five years ago so we would be absolutely free to select any cell plan and change without being tied to an uncompetitive contract. I recently took advantage of a Koodo offer. $20. per month for unlimited calling in Canada, and ww texting. Cut our cable down substantially simply through negotiation and acquiring a black box. 

Canadian companies will take advantage of you IF you let them. Yes, consumers do not have the edge in some areas (Gov't regs are helping them) but it is possible to skate around the marketplace and come up with something that suits. I don't like Canadian Tire so I don't shop there (even though I have owned their stock from time to time). It is as easy at that. I buy from other vendors. Whining about it is not as effective as voting with your wallet.


----------



## m3s

ian said:


> Whining about is not as effective as voting with your wallet.


Maybe when you grew up but no longer true now that people has discovered the internet.

Telus recently tried to screw Public Mobile customers after acquiring the company and the backlash of complaints online had them doing damage control by sms within 24 hrs. Also recently Brookfield Asset Management and Berkeley tried to screw over military families with a pre-paid Visa with undisclosed fees that skimmed $$$ off all movement expenses out of the members pockets. We don't have collective bargaining or the right to complain officially and yet within no time the backlash online had key individuals responding to families on Facebook and officials demanding results. Never saw this happen in Canada so fast before and nothing would have happened before until the grievances years later cost everyone significantly more time and money.

The US is far ahead in this regard. Internet complaints famously called out EA for selling a game with all the key features locked as additional "in game purchases" and their stocks plummeted in response. Nowadays companies pay attention to internet complaints and have the option fix things before they "vote with their wallets" and everyone loses.


----------



## fatcat

m3s said:


> Maybe when you grew up but no longer true now that people has discovered the internet.
> 
> Telus recently tried to screw Public Mobile customers after acquiring the company and the backlash of complaints online had them doing damage control by sms within 24 hrs. Also recently Brookfield Asset Management and Berkeley tried to screw over military families with a pre-paid Visa with undisclosed fees that skimmed $$$ off all movement expenses out of the members pockets. We don't have collective bargaining or the right to complain officially and yet within no time the backlash online had key individuals responding to families on Facebook and officials demanding results. Never saw this happen in Canada so fast before and nothing would have happened before until the grievances years later cost everyone significantly more time and money.
> 
> *The US is far ahead in this regard.* Internet complaints famously called out EA for selling a game with all the key features locked as additional "in game purchases" and their stocks plummeted in response. Nowadays companies pay attention to internet complaints and have the option fix things before they "vote with their wallets" and everyone loses.


have to disagree vociferously on this one m3s, as someone who lived there for a long time, i was stunned when i moved up here to see how much stronger, light-years stronger consumer protections were for canada

it's true that the usa is likely to to rise up in a loud voice if there is some egregious wrong but the overall state of consumer protection from shady lenders, payday lenders, credit card companies, banks, student loan brokers, real estate lenders etc etc is pathetic and highly skewed in favour of industry and business

the k street lobbyists have been raping the american consumer for years

if you live down there, you have to examine every bill, every contract and often spend long hours with customer service reps to remedy things

europe and canada and great britain are far ahead in consumer protection that the usa which is still the wild west for anything related to money


----------



## m3s

Yes I meant they are ahead at using the internet to call out bs practices to the point that a trending issue will very quickly impact stock prices and certainly online reputation is important to a company today. Canadians are just recently learning how to leverage this while US is far ahead at this

I'm surprised Canada doesn't have a regulation for Visa/MC to disclose FX fees on statements like in the US. Generally I can easily find much better deals for consumer goods in the US while I'm sure people who can't google get screwed all the time. In Canada we just get price fixing of everything including bread and oligopolies in cahoots


----------



## fatcat

m3s said:


> Yes I meant they are ahead at using the internet to call out bs practices to the point that a trending issue will very quickly impact stock prices and certainly online reputation is important to a company today. Canadians are just recently learning how to leverage this while US is far ahead at this
> 
> I'm surprised Canada doesn't have a regulation for Visa/MC to disclose FX fees on statements like in the US. Generally I can easily find much better deals for consumer goods in the US while I'm sure people who can't google get screwed all the time. In Canada we just get price fixing of everything including bread and oligopolies in cahoots


since i lived there so long i love shopping there ... i eagerly await the final number on the duty free negotiations ... australia can bring in $800 tax free ... we bring in $20 ... that is classic canadian passivity

this is a handy quick calculator for all in fx fees from xe http://www.xe.com/creditcard-charges-calculator/#


----------



## ian

I recently purchased a cell phone on line. Went to google and looked up vendors in Canada for the unlocked phone of my choice. Prices ranged for $139 on Amazon to $250. in Staples. Lots in between. I had no trouble shopping for the best deal on the web. Same for other products that we have purchased. Did our Christmas shopping this Nov/Dec. using this method. 

Agree on the credit card fees. The FX admin uplift on credit cards is highlighted....as are other charges, in the doc that you receive when you either apply or get the credit card. Our HT list was very clear. 

What I resent is the FX fee that the banks add when one uses a foreign ATM. It is why we used the cash advance feature on our Marriott Chase Visa for foreign ATM withdrawals instead of our bank ATM card.

We often brink back $100 or $200. worth of product from the US. We declare in at the border. Never been stopped or questioned or asked to pay tax. Plus, they never seem to question one bottle or wine or a 12 pack of beer if we have only gone down to gas up and have a look in Costco. I do not think that the limit should be $800 either. I think it should be $1000 or greater.


----------



## m3s

Never had a problem with Canadian customs. I declare everything honestly and even if over they just tell me I'm over yet don't charge me anything. I even often check off that I have unaccompanied goods (stashed away in work cargo) and they tell me not to bother checking that next time as it wastes them 30 seconds of asking me why while people are in line. Canadian passivity indeed, German customs very VERY different (took like 2 days to get a watch cleared from neighbouring Switzerland, and weeks to sell a vehicle to Netherlands) Online shopping is probably 100 to 1 chance of not being charged in my experience as long as you don't ship UPS or FedEx scammers. Or you can just dress like this


----------



## m3s

ian said:


> I recently purchased a cell phone on line. Went to google and looked up vendors in Canada for the unlocked phone of my choice. Prices ranged for $139 on Amazon to $250. in Staples. Lots in between. I had no trouble shopping for the best deal on the web. Same for other products that we have purchased. Did our Christmas shopping this Nov/Dec. using this method.


amazon.ca is getting better everyday but I've found far more variety and much lower prices for some specialty items on amazon.com

Canada doesn't have the same distribution that US has. For example all rec vehicles parts in Canada are distributed to all resellers by 1 distributor parts Canada. For specialty items you normally have a few choices in Toronto or Vancouver and that's it.

US market is obviously much bigger and has brands we don't get at all, and more competition obviously


----------



## ian

Our friend, a car enthusiast, in BC Lower Mainland buys all of his car parts on line from the US. He claims pays half or less of what he would pay in Canada for the identical item. Gets them shipped to a Blaine (US) site just south of town. This is a very common practice. For some items, the charge is $1. per parcel. Not a bad if you are saving a hundred dollars net by ordering and shipping to a US address. Not hard to take when gas is 1.60 litre in Vancouver. The drive alone and the savings on gas and on some dairy products more than pays for itself, let alone the savings on items ordered and shipped to the UPS depot.

He also keeps his US purchased fifth wheel and truck stored near Phoenix. Same story, cost much less to buy. He is an AC retiree so they can fly down on their pass, pick up the rig, and travel for weeks at a time during the winter. Some people in the Lower Mainland do exactly the same with sailboats. They buy them, and keep them in the US. The only rub is that they cannot dock in Canadian waters,


----------



## BC Eddie

fatcat said:


> have to disagree vociferously on this one m3s, as someone who lived there for a long time, i was stunned when i moved up here to see how much stronger, light-years stronger consumer protections were for canada
> 
> ...


I too lived/worked in US for an extended time and agree with fatcat 100%. 

And we have not touched on what it is like to use their medical system where every time you go to the doctor you have to double-check your provider's statement to see what they are ripping you off for this month. Then you have to call and complain and fight and on and on. No, my wife and I were more than happy to return home to Canada and I can live with the fact that I can't change my pin on my HT Visa but if I get seriously ill it will not bankrupt me.


----------



## BC Eddie

m3s said:


> amazon.ca is getting better everyday but I've found far more variety and much lower prices for some specialty items on amazon.com
> 
> Canada doesn't have the same distribution that US has. For example all rec vehicles parts in Canada are distributed to all resellers by 1 distributor parts Canada. For specialty items you normally have a few choices in Toronto or Vancouver and that's it.
> 
> US market is obviously much bigger and has brands we don't get at all, and more competition obviously


Plus the reality is Canada has 1/10 the population spread out all across the country. We just do not have the economies of scale the US does.


----------



## gibor365

m3s said:


> amazon.ca is getting better everyday but I've found far more variety and much lower prices for some specialty items on amazon.com
> 
> Canada doesn't have the same distribution that US has. For example all rec vehicles parts in Canada are distributed to all resellers by 1 distributor parts Canada. For specialty items you normally have a few choices in Toronto or Vancouver and that's it.
> 
> US market is obviously much bigger and has brands we don't get at all, and more competition obviously


One time I was looking for some specific items....didn;t find then on Amazon.ca , but found them on Amazon.com, wanted to buy, but got message that 9 of 10 items are not eligible for Canadian residents?! WTF?!
My co-worker had mail box in Buffalo, he orders stuff on Amazon and other websites and ships there...once per months he drives there and pick it up. Couple of time he also bought some stuff for me....


----------



## gibor365

> This is really straightforward. HT is not a public service. It is a business. If you don't like the product or the service then vote with your feet and with your wallet. Why whine about it endlessly? Just move on to another product.


But the point is that there is no other comparable product! HT is a monopoly for no FX fees cards....


----------



## ian

Then simply make a decision instead on constantly whining about it. Either stick with the card or bail. Choice is yours.


----------



## gibor365

I'm telling about my impression about this card (and this is what are forums for). If you have an issue, just ignore my posts.


----------



## m3s

ian said:


> Our friend, a car enthusiast, in BC Lower Mainland buys all of his car parts on line from the US. He claims pays half or less of what he would pay in Canada for the identical item. Gets them shipped to a Blaine (US) site just south of town. This is a very common practice. For some items, the charge is $1. per parcel. Not a bad if you are saving a hundred dollars net by ordering and shipping to a US address. Not hard to take when gas is 1.60 litre in Vancouver. The drive alone and the savings on gas and on some dairy products more than pays for itself, let alone the savings on items ordered and shipped to the UPS depot.


Yup

I have a few US models imported from back when CAD was worth more than USD. Had to pay Canadian dealer $500 for a recall letter to satisfy RIV (their way of discouraging this action.. still saved thousands)

My "unaccompanied goods" tend to be car or motorbike parts from the US. I always have a list of stuff to get while there and just ship it to the hotel etc. In Canada all aftermarket motorbike parts are monopolized by Parts Canada

I needed some special dampened bolts recently and they wanted over $100 CAD for 4 bolts with some rubber bits attached.. in the US they are a few USDs


----------



## Spudd

gibor365 said:


> But the point is that there is no other comparable product! HT is a monopoly for no FX fees cards....


There is still the Rogers/Fido mastercards, which will give 0.5% cashback on foreign purchases after May 23 (current is 1.5%). There is a new card from Scotia that has a separate thread here as well.


----------



## gibor365

Spudd said:


> There is still the Rogers/Fido mastercards, which will give 0.5% cashback on foreign purchases after May 23 (current is 1.5%). There is a new card from Scotia that has a separate thread here as well.


Rogers card charge FX fee


----------



## bgc_fan

gibor365 said:


> Rogers card charge FX fee


3% rebate on foreign transactions minus the 2.5% forex fee means 0.5% net overall. Not much, but it is an option.


----------



## m3s

BRIM no-fx mastercard is free or World Elite with annual fee and has a thread here

Scotiabank no-fx Passport Visa Infinite has annual fee and has a thread here as well

Rogers setup sucks if you have to reverse a large charge and get hit by double fx fees with no cash back


----------



## gibor365

bgc_fan said:


> 3% rebate on foreign transactions minus the 2.5% forex fee means 0.5% net overall. Not much, but it is an option.


and AFAIK it's not real rebate, you should us it to repay Rogers services.... If you are not Rogers customer (and I disconnected all their ervices 7-8 years ago), this card doesn;t make sense



> BRIM no-fx mastercard is free


 I read this thread and looks like it's not really no-fx


----------



## bgc_fan

gibor365 said:


> and AFAIK it's not real rebate, you should us it to repay Rogers services.... If you are not Rogers customer (and I disconnected all their ervices 7-8 years ago), this card doesn;t make sense


You can call in December to have it credited to your account, so it can be applied to your credit balance if you don't have either of fido or roger's account.


----------



## m3s

gibor365 said:


> I read this thread and looks like it's not really no-fx


It's the same as amazon was, no FX surchange but there's still a small charge by Visa as there was on amazon

Some say Mastercard has lower FX rates than Visa like amazon but that's TBD in the wild


----------



## Ag Driver

Deleted


----------



## ian

We used our Home Trust Card in the US last week. The exchange came over within the third decimal of the xe.com fx rate. Good to go. I still have to check the rate on a foreign ATM cash advance.

My spouse did not renew her auto club membeship. One benefit of the Home Trust card is that the vehicle assistance applies to both of us, not just one. Plan to try the service out soon because the battery on our summer card needs a boost. Rather than doing it myself I will see what the response time/service is from the Home Trust offering.


----------



## kcowan

Yes we used ours in Mexico. The PIN is fairly easy to remember. We called from Mexico to authorize the cards without incident.


----------



## peterk

Anyone know what happens with Amazons points/credits left on account? My bills are all paid up but I'm left with a negative balance from points. Are they just forfeit now?


----------



## ian

As an aside, we were in Vancouver last week. Bought gas in Bellingham. It worked out to .90 CAD with the exchange. In the Lower Mainland gas was 1.44-1.53. Huge delta. It was supposed to go again this week.


----------



## kcowan

peterk said:


> Are they just forfeit now?


They said they would issue a cheque.


----------



## BC Eddie

So last month I was travelling in Britain (no - not at the wedding  and being a senior I had problems remembering to use Home Trust's imposed PIN for their Visa card. The first time I screwed it up it seems like the system forgave me because I was able to use the card the next day and it worked fine (with the right PIN). However, the next time I screwed up the PIN the transaction was declined and my card was declined every time after that when I tried to use it. What I find interesting is that my wife also has the card with the same card number and even the same CVV on the back but she was better at remembering to use her PIN (which is different) and her card is still good.

So I called Home Trust today thinking it would just be a matter of them resetting my account. But NOOOOOOOOOO they say thge chip is now locked and they have to send me a new card!!! with a new PIN!!! and that is expected to take at least a couple of weeks. 

So my plan is now to keep screwing up my PIN on transactions, getting new cards+PINs and eventually I should get one with a PIN I am happy with


----------



## ian

Chase sent me a cheque for the credit balance on my Marriott Visa. Cheque arrived in 5 business days. Also rec'd another free Marriott night when they closed the card.

I have checked Home Visa's exchange rate on two seperate purchases. In both instances the rate matched xe.com's rate on that day to the third decimal point.


----------



## gibor365

> So I called Home Trust today thinking it would just be a matter of them resetting my account. But NOOOOOOOOOO they say thge chip is now locked and they have to send me a new card!!! with a new PIN!!! and that is expected to take at least a couple of weeks.
> 
> So my plan is now to keep screwing up my PIN on transactions, getting new cards+PINs and eventually I should get one with a PIN I am happy with


To tell the truth, I'm very disappointing with Home Trust Visa . You cannot change PIN, you cannot tap and major issue.... I called them twice and said that I will be in Jamaica for specific period and will be using card. However, when in Jamaica, my transaction was declined.... i tried to call HT, but it was impossible to reach them.... Really sorry that amazon Visa gone


----------



## kcowan

gibor365 said:


> i tried to call HT, but it was impossible to reach them....


I know you are capable gibor. Can you explain how you tried to reach them?


----------



## meepmer

BC Eddie said:


> So last month I was travelling in Britain (no - not at the wedding  and being a senior I had problems remembering to use Home Trust's imposed PIN for their Visa card. The first time I screwed it up it seems like the system forgave me because I was able to use the card the next day and it worked fine (with the right PIN). However, the next time I screwed up the PIN the transaction was declined and my card was declined every time after that when I tried to use it. What I find interesting is that my wife also has the card with the same card number and even the same CVV on the back but she was better at remembering to use her PIN (which is different) and her card is still good.
> 
> So I called Home Trust today thinking it would just be a matter of them resetting my account. But NOOOOOOOOOO they say thge chip is now locked and they have to send me a new card!!! with a new PIN!!! and that is expected to take at least a couple of weeks.
> 
> So my plan is now to keep screwing up my PIN on transactions, getting new cards+PINs and eventually I should get one with a PIN I am happy with


i know not the best idea but perhaps write the pin on the card in such a way that only you would be able to understand . eg. pin 0123 could be cdef or something you can remember but would not be easy for someone else to guess.


----------



## BC Eddie

meepmer said:


> i know not the best idea but perhaps write the pin on the card in such a way that only you would be able to understand . eg. pin 0123 could be cdef or something you can remember but would not be easy for someone else to guess.



Yes, I don't think I want to try and use a code - just some sticker on the card to remind me the PIN is different from all my other cards (that allow me to set the PIN myself)

Also I suspect their system is just swamped due to the unexpected interest in what is still the only exchange admin free card actually available in Canada. They allow you to set up alerts on their site in case you need to know about new transactions, trans. over a certain amt., etc. But due to their slow system all the alerts are delayed. So, for example, I used the card on June 1st in London. It posted to the account on June 3rd. I just got the alert now on June 6th.


----------



## kcowan

BC Eddie said:


> But due to their slow system all the alerts are delayed. So, for example, I used the card on June 1st in London. It posted to the account on June 3rd. I just got the alert now on June 6th.


Wow. I have not set them up other than payment reminder which works fine so good to know.


----------



## gibor365

kcowan said:


> I know you are capable gibor. Can you explain how you tried to reach them?


From Duty Free in Montego Bay airport I tried to call, waited for 10-15 min ,hung up and payed with "normal" card (with FX rate)


----------



## agent99

gibor365 said:


> To tell the truth, I'm very disappointing with Home Trust Visa . You cannot change PIN, you cannot tap and major issue.... I called them twice and said that I will be in Jamaica for specific period and will be using card. However, when in Jamaica, my transaction was declined.... i tried to call HT, but it was impossible to reach them.... Really sorry that amazon Visa gone


Interesting report Gibor. When Amazon Visa died, I switched to Scotia Momentum infinite card. Not free. I didn't jump on the HT bandwagon - didn't want to be with a small-time CC player. 

Scotia do have the Passport card with no FX for the frequent traveller. We went with the cashback card. First year, it is free, but our cashback in first month was enough to cover the annual card fees ($138 for 2 cards). We also got a $75 credit at Amazon for signing up through them. That is enough to cover the 2.5% FX charges that we would incur for first year if we used the card when snowbirding. We have a US$ M/C, and use that as well. 

Will see what else crops up, but will probably use US$ card + gambit in future.


----------



## kcowan

gibor365 said:


> From Duty Free in Montego Bay airport I tried to call, waited for 10-15 min ,hung up and payed with "normal" card (with FX rate)


Thanks. My experience is limited having only received the card with one month to go in Mexico. I have been using it back in Canada just to learn their system.


----------



## gibor365

agent99 said:


> Interesting report Gibor. When Amazon Visa died, I switched to Scotia Momentum infinite card. Not free. I didn't jump on the HT bandwagon - didn't want to be with a small-time CC player.
> 
> Scotia do have the Passport card with no FX for the frequent traveller. We went with the cashback card. First year, it is free, but our cashback in first month was enough to cover the annual card fees ($138 for 2 cards). We also got a $75 credit at Amazon for signing up through them. That is enough to cover the 2.5% FX charges that we would incur for first year if we used the card when snowbirding. We have a US$ M/C, and use that as well.
> 
> Will see what else crops up, but will probably use US$ card + gambit in future.


For day-to-day use we have CIBC Dividend unlimited (don't remember exact name), it's not free , but we get 50% discount on fees and it give 4% rebate on groceries and gas and 2% on Tim hortons and 1% on the rest + CDW.
But, I need to pay FX fees abroad - the major disadvantage.


----------



## gibor365

kcowan said:


> Thanks. My experience is limited having only received the card with one month to go in Mexico. I have been using it back in Canada just to learn their system.


The point that I called and notified HT 1 months in advance and then again 3-4 before trip and still it was declined


----------



## james4beach

These days, what's the best option for a no FX fee credit card, with no annual fee? I need a credit card for charging in EUR & AUD and all my current cards have pretty big fees on those.

Even better if it includes rental car insurance, but not necessary


----------



## agent99

james4beach said:


> These days, what's the best option for a no FX fee credit card, with no annual fee? I need a credit card for charging in EUR & AUD and all my current cards have pretty big fees on those.
> 
> Even better if it includes rental car insurance, but not necessary


Probably Rogers World Elite https://www.rogersbank.com/en 4% cashback on all foreign transactions. Still have to pay the FX. But it's a no fee card and it also pays 1.75% on everything else. There is also the Scotia Momentum Passport. I forget details, but it is good for world travel.


----------



## james4beach

agent99 said:


> Probably Rogers World Elite https://www.rogersbank.com/en 4% cashback on all foreign transactions. Still have to pay the FX. But it's a no fee card and it also pays 1.75% on everything else. There is also the Scotia Momentum Passport. I forget details, but it is good for world travel.


Thanks. I just have such a deep distrust of Rogers that I've been trying to avoid that one. Fool me once, shame on you (etc).

A few others mention the Home Trust Preferred Visa. It sounds pretty good, no FX fees, no annual fee, 1% cash back, rental car collision insurance. However it sounds like the downside is poor customer service. That might be OK.


----------



## ian

When I first got the card I found the Home Trust months customer service mediocre. The service was OK...the waiting time was not. Perhaps they were not geared up for the volume. 

However, the last two times I have called to advise them about foreign travel there was no call waiting time. CSR was good. I did ask about the hard wired PIN and was told changes were in the works for that. Their hours are limited to M-F, or at least they were as of six weeks ago.

Last month I had about 10 Home Visa foreign charges. Mexico, Australia, and Thailand. Plus I did a cash advance while in Mexico to check that out prior to our winter trip. All of the transactions came across to within the third decimal of the official visa rate. No additional FX fees. The cash advance came across with a 1.5 percent fee, as stated in their client doc. No interest charges on the cash advance because we had set up a credit balance to absorb it.

So,while I preferred the Marriott Chase card I have found the Home card to be fine for our needs.. Plus, it has an auto club service appended to it. We cancelled our auto club membership which had been $89. with a very low km tow allowance. I think we used the service twice in the past ten or fifteen years.


----------



## james4beach

ian said:


> When I first got the card I found the Home Trust months customer service mediocre. The service was OK...the waiting time was not. Perhaps they were not geared up for the volume.
> 
> However, the last two times I have called to advise them about foreign travel there was no call waiting time. CSR was good. I did ask about the hard wired PIN and was told changes were in the works for that. Their hours are limited to M-F, or at least they were as of six weeks ago.
> 
> Last month I had about 10 Home Visa foreign charges. Mexico, Australia, and Thailand. Plus I did a cash advance while in Mexico to check that out prior to our winter trip. All of the transactions came across to within the third decimal of the official visa rate. No additional FX fees. The cash advance came across with a 1.5 percent fee, as stated in their client doc. No interest charges on the cash advance because we had set up a credit balance to absorb it.
> 
> So,while I preferred the Marriott Chase card I have found the Home card to be fine for our needs.. Plus, it has an auto club service appended to it. We cancelled our auto club membership which had been $89. with a very low km tow allowance. I think we used the service twice in the past ten or fifteen years.


Thanks ian that sounds really interesting. I'm about to apply for this tonight... just to confirm, is yours: Home Trust Preferred Visa ?


----------



## ian

Yes. One thing though. The credit limit is lower than our previous Marriott Chase Visa. 6K vs 25K but this is not such big issue. I may ask them to increase it.

As an aside, we had our previous Marriott Chase visa declined a few times. But always by discount airlines!. Once by Jetstar in Australia and twice by AirAsia in Thailand. I was making the reservation in Canada so I called the credit card company. They claimed to have no record of those three attempts. It also happened while we were traveling in those countries. Which is why we always travel with three different cards. This led me to wonder if these premium cards were simply rejected out of hand by the airlines and they did not even try to process or if the credit card info that I was given was incorrect. Even though it was declined by the airline, there was no issue in the subsequent use of the card with other vendors the same day or later.


----------



## james4beach

ian said:


> Yes.


Thanks... will see if I can get an application approved before my travel in a couple months. The auto features are very interesting. This means it can be used in place of CAA/AAA kind of membership?


----------



## ian

Yes. We cancelled our AMA coverage. AMA basic was no longer that great. I think we had a limit of about 5KM for towing. Their auto insurance, last time I checked was very expensive. Their home insurance, based on feedback from the home building industry in Ft. Mac. after the fire was very poor compared to others but this was purely anecdotal. So we canceled and saved the ninety dollars a year. And that was only for one of us. Home Visa apparently covers both of us.

Fortunately, we have not had to prevail upon their auto service so we cannot comment on it.


----------



## james4beach

ian said:


> As an aside, we had our previous Marriott Chase visa declined a few times. But always by discount airlines!. Once by Jetstar in Australia and twice by AirAsia in Thailand. ... Which is why we always travel with three different cards.


Ouch! I agree, one should travel with 3 cards. I used to think 2 is enough but cards are being rejected more often. Air Canada rejected my PC World Elite just yesterday and I had to talk with their phone reps to remove a block. Not a big hassle but it shows that the cards can be rejected even on "home soil" let alone foreign.

I will definitely be travelling with 3 credit cards from now on. I can't risk having an airline ticket or hotel rejected.


----------



## kcowan

One nice feature we experienced this trip to Mexico. We told them we would be in Mexico from Qct 16th until Apr 28th. After 2 weeks in San Miguel de Allende, we received an email with all the transactions noted. We just had to click YES to verify them.

We used their auto service in May. There is a limit of 4 per month, and our callout involved battery then towing which counted for 2 incidents.

They also send an email alert. We have one for 4 days ahead of payment due.


----------



## james4beach

kcowan said:


> One nice feature we experienced this trip to Mexico. We told them we would be in Mexico from Qct 16th until Apr 28th. After 2 weeks in San Miguel de Allende, we received an email with all the transactions noted. We just had to click YES to verify them.
> 
> We used their auto service in May. There is a limit of 4 per month, and our callout involved battery then towing which counted for 2 incidents.


Wow, very nice. Is there a way to extend the roadside service to other family members? Perhaps if I add them as additional card holders, or if they share the same address? (Meaning so they can call roadside service even if I'm not in the car)


----------



## l1quidfinance

Happy with the Home Trust offering so far.


----------



## bgc_fan

Another option is Brim Mastercard. I have it, but haven't used it overseas yet. Just for amazon for the 2% cashback. It provides free Boingo access. Useful for airports without free wifi.


----------



## james4beach

l1quidfinance said:


> Happy with the Home Trust offering so far.


Thanks! It looks like I've been approved. Hopefully I'll get the card before I leave on my next trip.


----------



## l1quidfinance

bgc_fan said:


> Another option is Brim Mastercard. I have it, but haven't used it overseas yet. Just for amazon for the 2% cashback. It provides free Boingo access. Useful for airports without free wifi.


The danger with the Brim is that they made a changed to the terms. The initial offering stated the Mastercard exchange rate. Now they state that it is no fee but at the Brim posted exchange rate.


----------



## FinancialPanther

I picked up the Scotia Passport Visa Infinite, and have been using it the last couple of months. $250 worth of points + $70 GCR rebate bonus, but need to pay $139 annual fee; still end up ahead.

I also considered the HSBC World Elite, but the Scotia Card narrowly beat it for me and the sign on bonuses at the time.

Since I will be overseas for much of the year, the NO FTF + 2% back on most of my spending (Groceries, Restaurants, Entertainment, Transit) is really good, combined with free lounge passes, and pretty good insurances.


----------



## james4beach

I just got the Home Trust card. I set up travel notifications (for time in the USA) and also received the PIN in the mail.

Any tips from other card holders? Is there anything I should do before leaving on trips? I recorded the roadside assistance and rental car insurance phone numbers.


----------



## l1quidfinance

I haven't had to call them and it's worked without issue in the States and the UK. 

The only couple of issues I would consider. 

There is a strange cap on daily transaction I believe 10. So be mindful of that. - I haven't hit this limit. 
Also the postcode trick didn't work at the couple of gas stations I had to use so had to go in first. If you are not aware of this then for example you would enter A1B2C3 as ZIP 123000 when prompted at the pump. This worked with Amazon but not Home trust.


----------



## james4beach

Thanks, l1quidfinance. Did you register for Verified by Visa? The URL they give in their welcome brochure is broken, goes to a 404 not found error.

I've also found their overseas call center to be very flaky. In two calls I made today (1 hour apart), the first call authenticated me without problem. On the second call, they insisted that my mother's maiden name did not match their records so the customer support was useless. I think one has to call during Monday-Friday instead.


----------



## peterk

james4beach said:


> I just got the Home Trust card. I set up travel notifications (for time in the USA) and also received the PIN in the mail.
> 
> Any tips from other card holders? Is there anything I should do before leaving on trips? I recorded the roadside assistance and *rental car insurance phone numbers*.


So we can confirm that the Home Trust has rental car damage waiver coverage??

That scam of a card Amazon Visa sure didn't, despite the Visa website clearly saying that all Visa cards of that type (Infinite, Platinum - I can't recall what the Amazon card was anymore) had rental car insurance, the Amazon Visa decided did not, and cost me 300 bucks for scratches on a car from a shady European car rental!


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## james4beach

peterk said:


> So we can confirm that the Home Trust has rental car damage waiver coverage??


Yes, I think so. When I phoned RSA Insurance and gave my Home Trust Preferred Visa card number, they said that I have collision coverage. The Home Trust brochure that came with the card also shows rental car insurance.


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## bgc_fan

peterk said:


> So we can confirm that the Home Trust has rental car damage waiver coverage??
> 
> That scam of a card Amazon Visa sure didn't, despite the Visa website clearly saying that all Visa cards of that type (Infinite, Platinum - I can't recall what the Amazon card was anymore) had rental car insurance, the Amazon Visa decided did not, and cost me 300 bucks for scratches on a car from a shady European car rental!


Scam of a Amazon Visa? The Amazon Visa wasn't any more than a plain vanilla Visa that had cashback and no FX fees. I don't ever recall it stating that it had rental car insurance. It was definitely not a premium Visa that had anything special.


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## peterk

^ Can't I use hyperbole even a little bit without someone getting wrinkled up?

It was a class of Visa card, for which Visa declared on their website that all of this class of Visa card comes standard with rental insurance. Except, apparently, the Amazon card, provided by an American bank Chase, for Canadian customers, somehow excluding itself from this coverage.


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## bgc_fan

peterk said:


> ^ Can't I use hyperbole even a little bit without someone getting wrinkled up?
> 
> It was a class of Visa card, for which Visa declared on their website that all of this class of Visa card comes standard with rental insurance. Except, apparently, the Amazon card, provided by an American bank Chase, for Canadian customers, somehow excluding itself from this coverage.


It wasn't the hyperbole that had me question your post, I just don't remember it ever implying that it had rental insurance. Like I said, I never thought it was any sort of premium Visa.


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## peterk

You're right, it was just a standard Visa of some kind. But I distinctly recall not seeing anything about whether it had rental insurance on the website, so I curiously went digging a bit for information and found info on Visa's website that said all Visa cards of that type are covered. Obviously not, though.

Without the original multi page agreement document that comes with the card in the mail (sometimes, or used to) it's hard to find actual info online. Often they don't seem to publish the whole agreement document digitally, they just have some webpage with a synopsis of info, without the fine print. Probably done intentionally.


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## m3s

...


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## m3s

m3s said:


> Actually this could be very useful for buying food, gas, accommodation and other foreign purchases with 1% rewards where you wouldn't use the warranty/protection/insurance for
> 
> For booking flights or buying big ticket items, I would still use a premium card


^Post from 2013 peter

amazon visa was great for food/gas and other foreign sundry expenses that wouldn't benefit from premium card warranty/insurance etc

I've since discovered that any Canadian can get a TD Bank (US based) Visa *signature* card with no FX fees, no annual fees, cash back, and premium card insurance coverage to boot

No card in Canada compares


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## james4beach

By the way, for those of you with the HomeTrust Preferred: have you done anything regarding Verified by Visa? When I called HT to ask about Verified by Visa, they said to forget about that program, but sign up for Visa Checkout instead as some retailers may require it. I'm more curious about whether other people have needed to do this, before I bother doing that.



peterk said:


> So we can confirm that the Home Trust has rental car damage waiver coverage??


I wanted to be careful with this so I looked into it a little more. RSA (the insurance company) recognizes the card number, based on first six digits, but categorizes it as Home Trust Equityline Visa Card. In their database, RSA is not aware of the "Preferred" card. Looking at the documentation mailed by HomeTrust, I also saw that the rental car insurance policy document mentions Equityline Visa -- which isn't the card they mailed out to me.

I called HomeTrust to get further clarification. Their phone rep was surprised to hear that RSA doesn't recognize their "Preferred" card. The phone rep assured me that the rental policy applies to Preferred visa. Their explanation is that the first six digits on the card are the same between Equityline & Preferred so they look the same to the insurer.

The problem I still have right now is that I have not yet seen any documentation that writes out, in a policy, that the Preferred card is covered by RSA insurance. I asked a HomeTrust supervisor to show me this document (since they never mailed me one) and she says she will look into it and send one to me.

So does the Preferred card have rental car insurance? The phone reps say "yes", the insurance company says "maybe" and it's probably fine. But I have not yet seen any policy document that spells out that the Preferred card is covered.


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## peterk

Was Amazon.ca card a "preferred" Visa too? I threw mine out already. I think it was, but I can't remember clearly.


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## james4beach

I never had the Amazon one so I can't comment on that.

HomeTrust Preferred update. RSA actually returned my call, and now the agent (at RSA insurance) confirms that HT Preferred is a recognized card that is covered. I don't know why the previous RSA agent didn't say the same thing.

So it appears that the insurer is on board, and agrees that the Preferred card has a valid policy.


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## l1quidfinance

The Amazon card offered nothing at all. It was a plain vanilla CC. 

It was as simple as a credit card could get

No insurance of any kind
2% rewards points on Amazon.ca spend
1% reward points on all other spend
No Forex charges

Points paid out as statement credit every for a $20 value every 2000 points. 


James - With regards to my card I have not used the verified by visa at this time. I admire your diligence with regards to validating the insurance coverage. I just jumped in the hire car when I visited the UK earlier this year and presented the rental company with my card.


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## james4beach

l1quidfinance said:


> James - With regards to my card I have not used the verified by visa at this time. I admire your diligence with regards to validating the insurance coverage. I just jumped in the hire car when I visited the UK earlier this year and presented the rental company with my card.


Turns out the insurance looks ok  I've now made my first purchase in a foreign currency and wow... it came through almost right at the spot market rate.


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## humble_pie

l1quidfinance said:


> The Amazon card offered nothing at all. It was a plain vanilla CC.
> 
> It was as simple as a credit card could get
> 
> No insurance of any kind
> 2% rewards points on Amazon.ca spend
> 1% reward points on all other spend
> No Forex charges
> 
> Points paid out as statement credit every for a $20 value every 2000 points.
> 
> 
> James - With regards to my card I have not used the verified by visa at this time. I admire your diligence with regards to validating the insurance coverage. I just jumped in the hire car when I visited the UK earlier this year and presented the rental company with my card.




liquidfinance i'm just going by my memory here ... but some years ago cmf forum had an amazing member who was, in fact, the very first pioneer of a no-FX credit card, namely the Amazon. It was the only such FX-free CC at that time.

IIRC his name was a variation of yours, he was a "liquidfinance" too.

also IIRC, it was original liquidfinance who gave cmf forum that valuable resource which was the link to the list of british ADRs. It's a big list & it has big value for canadian investors, since dividends paid by british ADRs out of the US are not subject to either british withholding tax nor to US withholding tax.

if you are original liquidfinance, then welcome back! & if you are not, then welcome & happy new year.


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## ian

The card was offered by Chase Bank Canada. They also offered a Marriott premium version that we subscribed to. Someone told me they offered a Sears version.

Sure wish I could get one of the US cards-from a US financial institution not a Canadian bank. The latter are less than competitive. I have to wonder how long Home Trust will offer the one that we currently use.


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## m3s

ian said:


> Sure wish I could get one of the US cards-from a US financial institution not a Canadian bank. The latter are less than competitive. I have to wonder how long Home Trust will offer the one that we currently use.


You can get the US based TD Bank card online/phone via cross border banking. Their cash reward card requires a US mailing address to initiate a US credit file but you don't require a US SSN or ITIN. This is not to be confused with TD Canada Cross Border accounts that are Canadian based and not the same at all

Getting an ITIN would open up the door to many US financial institutions after a year of US credit history. Anyone can get a ITIN very easily.. say you plan to sell a book or whatever on amazon.. I intend to get the US amazon card and Chase travel card once I establish US credit, but the TD Bank cards are actually pretty good.


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## humble_pie

ian said:


> The card was offered by Chase Bank Canada. They also offered a Marriott premium version that we subscribed to. Someone told me they offered a Sears version.
> 
> Sure wish I could get one of the US cards-from a US financial institution not a Canadian bank. The latter are less than competitive. I have to wonder how long Home Trust will offer the one that we currently use.





ian with all due respect i note that you joined cmf forum in june 2016 but upthread i was referencing a former member named liquidfinance a good number of years ago, ie long before your time.

in those bygone years, it was liquidfinance who was the first to noticeably post in cmf forum about the zero FX fees for the Amazon credit card he was using at that time. Other members benefited from his sharing & they also obtained & used amazon CCs, following his example. They also posted here in the forum.

was there an Amazon connection to Chase? if so, no one mentioned this fact particularly visibly in cmf forum. In any event, it's important to give credit where credit is due. I for one can assert that a cmffer whom i believe went by the username of "liquidfinance" brought the first news of no-FX fee credit cards to this forum something like 4-5 years ago.

the credit card story that's unfolding in full bloom right now is part of the ongoing consumer-driven movement against egregiously high FX fees - many of them hidden - that were or are still being charged by big financial institutions. I've done my part over the years with respect to hidden FX fees charged by brokers. However the credit card story is much bigger. It involves many millions more consumers, most of whom don't even know that a few leaner, better, zero-FX CCs are now available.

many thanks to yourself & others for posting this information so frequently & so accurately.


.


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## l1quidfinance

humble_pie said:


> liquidfinance i'm just going by my memory here ... but some years ago cmf forum had an amazing member who was, in fact, the very first pioneer of a no-FX credit card, namely the Amazon. It was the only such FX-free CC at that time.
> 
> IIRC his name was a variation of yours, he was a "liquidfinance" too.
> 
> also IIRC, it was original liquidfinance who gave cmf forum that valuable resource which was the link to the list of british ADRs. It's a big list & it has big value for canadian investors, since dividends paid by british ADRs out of the US are not subject to either british withholding tax nor to US withholding tax.
> 
> if you are original liquidfinance, then welcome back! & if you are not, then welcome & happy new year.


Humble I am the original. I had some time away from the forum and my credentials were not accepted. I used the site contact information several times to try and have an administrator unlock or reset the password for me but didn't ever get any response. In the end I decided just to open up the new account.


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## humble_pie

l1quidfinance said:


> Humble I am the original. I had some time away from the forum and my credentials were not accepted. I used the site contact information several times to try and have an administrator unlock or reset the password for me but didn't ever get any response. In the end I decided just to open up the new account.




oh, wonderful! welcome back

the forum was sold by the original founders, probably during the time you were away. Very soon thereafter the forum website was discovered to have been seriously hacked, so all the members had to change their passwords.

many like yourself also discovered they could no longer use their original usernames; so all those folks were obliged, like yourself, to invent new usernames. It was a fairly common occurrence.

there was a way to get back with the original username; but by now no one would remember how to do it. 

in any event, you were also the cmffer who linked the british ADR list, right? this has also been such a valuable resource since it's a way to hold US dollar securities - the british ADRS - in TFSA accounts without any US withholding tax.

as you can see, your pioneer work with the Amazon credit card has borne fruit. A consumer-driven campaign against egregiously high FX fees on credit card foreign purchases is visibly underway. The first new-generation zero-FX credit cards have appeared. Word is spreading in the internet via forums such as this one.

kudos to the cmf forum pioneers who are leading this campaign - yourself, m3s, ian, spudd, jas4beach plus several others


.


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## ian

Yes, there was a connection between the Amazon card and Chase Bank Canada, a schedule 11 bank. Amazon is not a bank.

The card said Amazon on the front but the issuer was Chase Bank. Same with the Marriott Visa however this was a premium card. 

Why do I know this? I actually had both cards. Applied for the Amazon and got it. Then I saw the Marriott card. It gave me Marriott points and a free night every year and a few other benefits that I wanted. 

The odd thing? I filled out both applications exactly the same way. The applications were identical and were from Chase Bank Canada The Chase Amazon card gave me a $5K credit limit. I needed more. The Chase Marriott card gave me a $15K credit limit. I did get $20 for my trouble from the Amazon card. There was a credit posted on my Amazon account as a bonus for signing up for the card.

My understanding is that the Sears no FX card was also issued by Chase Bank. 

I cannot think of an affinity card that has not been issued by a financial institution.


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## l1quidfinance

Humble - Yes I did provide information on the British ADR's and advise they are suitable TFSA investments due to lack of any withholding taxes. 

All cards were offered through CHASE Bank Canada. 

The majority of the Chase offerings were sold to Scotia with Chase only continuing to offer Sears, Amazon and Marriott. 




> October 15, 2015 10:43 ET
> 
> Scotiabank to Acquire JPMorgan Chase Credit Card Portfolio in Canada
> 
> The Credit Card Portfolio Includes Approximately 2 Million Active Customers and $1.7 Billion in Outstanding Receivables; Scotiabank to Become the First Bank in Canada to Offer Customers All Three Leading Credit Card Brands: Visa, AMEX, and MasterCard


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## bgc_fan

Just a bit of an update on Home Trust. I remember one of the complaints was the fact that they didn't do electronic delivery of statements. I just checked in and it is now an option.


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## Ag Driver

Deleted


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## l1quidfinance

Just received the Brim mastercard. Very fast application so they seem to have the bugs worked out now. Apparently people were waiting for months at the launch. 
I have yet make a foreign currenty transaction with card. 

Thats great news about the pin number for home trust.


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## m3s

According to reddit leak, amazon visa to return for Canadian prime members. No foreign transaction fees and 2.5% cash back amazon/restaurants/groceries


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## l1quidfinance

m3s said:


> According to reddit leak, amazon visa to return for Canadian prime members. No foreign transaction fees and 2.5% cash back amazon/restaurants/groceries


Does it say who will be issuing the card?


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## agent99

Reddit thread says it was an Aprils Fool joke:

https://www.reddit.com/r/PersonalFi...a_amazonca_visa_relaunching_soon_preapproval/


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## m3s

It wasn't that post, it was posted yesterday by someone claiming to work at a financial institution.. post is probably deleted but I'm on a different computer now


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## agent99

m3s said:


> It wasn't that post, it was posted yesterday by someone claiming to work at a financial institution.. post is probably deleted but I'm on a different computer now


Funny, the rewards you mentioned were same at the April Fools post.


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## m3s

agent99 said:


> Funny, the rewards you mentioned were same at the April Fools post.


Also a watered down version of the existing US amazon card.. user was deleted but the comments still exist. Looks like they doxxed him from previous posts including his picture


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## agent99

With Scotia Infinity going up in cost later this year with lesser cashback (for us), I would love to find a better card. But not holding breath on this one 

One other thing with the Scotia Momentum Infinity. We used it at Walmart in the USA for groceries and got 4% back (on total of cost+FX). We don't normally buy groceries at Walmart in Canada, but when my wife did the other day, we did not receive any cash back. She contacted the store and the head office but got nowhere. Just gobbledygook and no effort to investigate. We won't be buying groceries there again!


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## m3s

agent99 said:


> With Scotia Infinity going up in cost later this year with lesser cashback (for us), I would love to find a better card. But not holding breath on this one


Word on reddit street is mbna Canada (TD Bank) will reincarnate a Canadian amazon card to amazon prime members with no FX fees and mastercard benefits


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## kcowan

Chase just sent me a letter saying that my credit balance of $0.40 on my amazon card will be mailed to me by check!


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## m3s

I tried to use Uber and it requires me to verify my defunct chase amazon card details.. it was easier to just open a new Lyft account than figure that out


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## bettyboop

Has anyone seen this new card? I just noticed it today and was worried it was a phishing attempt.

https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B07MJM4F44?plattr=CACBCCSWM&ref_=cacbcc_gw_swm_en_acq


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## m3s

> When the credit card will earn 2.5% back on eligible purchases at Amazon.ca, Whole Foods Market stores in Canada, and *foreign currency transactions*, and 1% back on all other eligible purchases:
> If the Amazon.ca account from which you apply for your credit card, or such other Amazon.ca account that you select to associate with your credit card in accordance with the process established by AmazonA, has an eligible Prime membership, your credit card account will automatically earn 2.5% back on eligible purchases at Amazon.ca, Whole Foods Market stores in Canada, and foreign currency transactions, and 1% back on all other eligible purchases‡. *“Note that in most cases, FX fees apply to foreign currency transactions and such fees may be less than, equal to or greater than the % back you earn on such transactions.*
> 
> When the credit card will earn 1.5% back on eligible purchases at Amazon.ca, and Whole Foods Market stores in Canada, and 1% back on all other eligible purchases including foreign currency transactions:
> If your selected Amazon.ca account (that is, the Amazon.ca account from which you apply for your credit card, or such other Amazon.ca account that you select to associate with your credit card in accordance with the process established by Amazon) does not have an eligible Prime membership, or if your selected Amazon.ca account has an eligible Prime membership and a different credit card has subsequently been linked to itA, your credit card account will automatically earn 1.5% back on eligible purchases at Amazon.ca and Whole Foods Market stores in Canada, and 1% back on all other eligible purchases, including foreign currency transactions‡. “Note that in most cases, FX fees apply to foreign currency transactions and such fees may be less than, equal to or greater than the % back you earn on such transactions.


2.5% amazon credit on foreign transactions for prime members?

Not bad but 2.5% amazon credit is not as good as 1% cash back and 0 foreign exchange at Home Trust. If you ever have to return something in a foreign transaction you get hit twice

The US amazon Chase card is 5% back on eligible purchases so.... blame Canada


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## BC Eddie

bettyboop said:


> Has anyone seen this new card? I just noticed it today and was worried it was a phishing attempt.
> 
> https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B07MJM4F44?plattr=CACBCCSWM&ref_=cacbcc_gw_swm_en_acq



As of 6/21 I went to site and it now says:

"We're sorry, but the application for this card is temporarily unavailable. Please check back later."


----------

