# Shutdown of investor visa program



## Causalien (Apr 4, 2009)

The harper government shutdown the program where, with $800 000 loan to the CDN government for 5 years, an investor can get a visa. A smaller program in Quebec is still running, with the limit at 1500 per year I believe. 

This news is making the rounds in Asia. All official channels reported on this change in the morning. What do you guys think the impact will be? Will Vancouver drop? Will Montreal rise? I had no idea that the anti Asian buyer sentiment is this acute until this official announcement. The other countries are doing fine with similar programs. I mean an increase in the amount of loan or changing the clause to a permanent investment that cannot be returned would be reasonable, but outright shutting it down means the anti HAM sentiment is probably a lot more pronounced.

Reading through some of the comments on CBC was eye opening for me. This is Canada, the melting pot of culture.


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## Addy (Mar 12, 2010)

Why on earth would the Harper Government shut down this program? Any explanation as to why?


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## Janus (Oct 23, 2013)

This has nothing to do with culture - it's about rich mainland Chinese officials being able to buy visas so they can get their families (and their assets) out of China. 90% of these applications are from China.

I'm calling it now - this is the turning point for the Vancouver housing market. Probably toronto too. This is going to cut high-end demand right off.


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## WillyA (Apr 14, 2011)

Financial Post has an article on how it could affect the Vancouver market, apparently the government may come up with a "better" program
http://business.financialpost.com/2...-rules-could-slow-high-end-real-estate-sales/


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## cedebe (Feb 1, 2012)

Causalien said:


> <snip> This is Canada, the melting pot of culture.


Canada is not a melting pot, as aren't most countries. A mosaic at best.


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## GoldStone (Mar 6, 2011)

Addy said:


> Why on earth would the Harper Government shut down this program? Any explanation as to why?


To cool real estate markets in TO and Vancouver? Flaherty tried every measure in the book to slow them down. Another try, maybe? 

If it works, great!! Maybe my daughter will be able to afford a home of her own one day.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

This has absolutely nothing to do with voter anxiety about HAM, and everything to do with government anxiety about stubbornly buoyant and overpriced markets like TO and Van. Country-wide cooling measures are no longer desirable due to pronounced weakness in Quebec and Ottawa. So now they have to take targeted measures, such as this one, that cools Van/TO and does not impact Quebec.


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## dogcom (May 23, 2009)

Zerohedge just posted about this as well so we will see if house prices drop.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-02-12/did-canada-just-pop-its-housing-bubble


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## Causalien (Apr 4, 2009)

dogcom;22.045 said:


> Zerohedge just posted about this as well so we will see if house prices drop.
> 
> http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-02-12/did-canada-just-pop-its-housing-bubble


If this change doesn't bring the price down, it will be worst than before. It means that the demand is not actually from HAM... So we got a bigger problem on our hand...

My money is ready to buy once it drops.


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## wendi1 (Oct 2, 2013)

About time to end this program - Canadian citizenship should not be for sale.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

HAM is small on the scale of the Canadian housing market. It might play a small role, but it can't explain the run-up in prices.


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## CanadianCapitalist (Mar 31, 2009)

Pardon my ignorance but what is HAM?


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

HAM = hot asian money


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## CanadianCapitalist (Mar 31, 2009)

Thanks Spudd.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

It's the boogeyman of the Vancouver housing market.


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## steve41 (Apr 18, 2009)

HIM is the boogeyman of the West Vancouver RE market. Hot Iranian Money.


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## MoreMiles (Apr 20, 2011)

steve41 said:


> HIM is the boogeyman of the West Vancouver RE market. Hot Iranian Money.


Every Richmond Hill Markham resident knows Iranians own a big part of their cities, especially around Highway 7. Guess who is behind those developer corporations. It's no secret.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

This program has been on hold since June 2012 and had developed a significant backlog. There are still other ways to get in:
Start a business
Get provincial support

Both of these programs generate small businesses rather than just allowing passive investment. I think they are smarter ways to encourage immigration.


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## MoreMiles (Apr 20, 2011)

Yeah. It forces people to open doomed businesses like clothing store in Pacific or Splendid China malls in Toronto. Who wants to buy in those small retailers when you can return / exchange easily from Walmart and Futureshop? Every immigrant knows that it's a lost money but they still open it. Sad...


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## atrp2biz (Sep 22, 2010)

MoreMiles said:


> Every Richmond Hill Markham resident knows Iranians own a big part of their cities, especially around Highway 7. Guess who is behind those developer corporations. It's no secret.


Really? I never really noticed that when I was living there. Around Bathurst you have the Jewish and east of Yonge are where the Asians are. Never seen too many mid-easterners. 

Interesting.


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## realist (Apr 8, 2011)

MoreMiles said:


> Yeah. It forces people to open doomed businesses like clothing store in Pacific or Splendid China malls in Toronto. Who wants to buy in those small retailers when you can return / exchange easily from Walmart and Futureshop? Every immigrant knows that it's a lost money but they still open it. Sad...


I have no idea if it is true or not but I remember hearing something about convenience stores in Ontario basically rotating through different owners who were "investing" as part of a program like this.


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## Causalien (Apr 4, 2009)

realist said:


> I have no idea if it is true or not but I remember hearing something about convenience stores in Ontario basically rotating through different owners who were "investing" as part of a program like this.


Yeah, people basically invest in those small doomed business as shareholders to become an investor and get in. ( Not necessarily 100% owner) these business were operating at about 1% margin back in the 2000/ These days I am guessing that margin is negative. There are different version of this in all countries. USA has no such easy program as the business you start needs to be a real operating business. My experience getting interviewed at their consulate showed me that the screening process is extensive enough to filter out most of the pretenders.


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## emperor (Jul 24, 2011)

Yay for globalization, ruining the world one country at a time.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Ruining how?


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## Sherlock (Apr 18, 2010)

Anyone know how much you have to loan to the US govt to get US citizenship?

edit: I googled it. You have to invest $1,000,000 USD, and you have to create 10 jobs. During this time you must live in the US, and you must be involved in the daily management of the company you invested in (board member is ok). After 3 years you can take your million back. Also you don't actually get citizenship, you get a permanent resident card, but you can usually convert that to actual citizenship after a few years.

edit: Originally posted this in the wrong topic.


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