# "Cheapest 21 year old I know"



## rossco12

Age: 21

Annual Income - 65 000+

*Assets:*

TFSA - 11 500 in stocks/cash (formerly 18 500, yeouch)

RRSP - 13 000 in REIT's/stocks, mutual funds, gold

Various checking and savings accounts - 30 000

2008 Civic - 9000

Other vehicles, parts, boat, guns etc. - 5000

*Liabilities:*

Credit Card - 500

Speeding Ticket - 117

I passed up on post secondary education and here's where I sit just after my 21st birthday. I guess you could say I've "cheated" a little, because I technically still lived at home and only paid $300/month rent while working at a tire shop until roughly a year ago when I changed industries and started working primarily out of town/camp, and living with my girlfriend in the states on my time off. I expect to move into a 6 figure income this year due to raises and more time spent working. Anyhow, my goal is to have a net worth of $1 000 000 before the age of 30. As you see above, I have been struggling to maintain liquidity because I'm essentially waiting for a recession before I throw a whole lot of money into the markets/real estate. I continue to play with gold miners in my tfsa despite some very educational losses last year, and have been picking up REIT's at attractive valuations in my RRSP, which I plan to max out for the foreseeable future for tax reasons. I am also very aware of the fact people like me pay a ton of tax, because I'm stuck in the employee quadrant (Kiyosaki, anyone?), which I do plan to get out of eventually.

People call me cheap, and I strongly disagree. I just have a huge problem with financial ignorance. I spend a lot of money, I eat in a lot of restaurants, I travel in the states quite frequently, I buy guns and reloading stuff and I have a nice laptop and phone. I also have guidelines which I strictly follow in order not to outlive my means which I'll post up in the frugality section. Avoiding consumer debt and depreciating assets (liabilities) are at the top of the list.


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## Beaver101

> *People call me cheap, and I strongly disagree*. I just have a huge problem with financial ignorance. *I spend a lot of money *...


 ... of course you would disagree with others on the being cheap since it looks like your definition of "cheap" differs from others. I'm not here to analyze your spending nor judge your spendings but merely, providing a small feedback (if that's what you're looking for). If this is not what you're looking for, please disregard this post.


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## rossco12

Beaver101 said:


> ... of course you would disagree with others on the being cheap since it looks like your definition of "cheap" differs from others. I'm not here to analyze your spending nor judge your spendings but merely, providing a small feedback (if that's what you're looking for). If this is not what you're looking for, please disregard this post.


Feedback is good, I gotcha


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## techcrium

Hey welcome. Just wondering...how come your TFSA shrunk almost half?

S&P 500 is up 30% year over year.


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## rossco12

techcrium said:


> Hey welcome. Just wondering...how come your TFSA shrunk almost half?
> 
> S&P 500 is up 30% year over year.


I learned a costly lesson about how timing relates to smart investments. I bought heavily into gold and miners before our little correction because I liked the hyperinflation/dollar crisis theory. I still like it, but I lacked critical understanding of QE's short term effects - such as the S&P being up 30% year over year


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## Nemo2

I'd say you're doing damn good.....keep it up.....rack up the cash, retire early...enjoy it! :encouragement:


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## RBull

Good story. Nice job rossco. Good luck with your goal. It's very ambitious. 

Take it easy on the speed. You want to get to 30 and beyond.


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## Plugging Along

I say good luck, it looks like you are doing well. I hope that your plan to hit $1 mil networth by thirty does not require to live with your parents the whole time. 

I think at 21 there has to be a balance between living for the moment and saving for the future. Most 21 years are on the live for the moment, I think it's important to have a balance.

If others are calling you cheap, you have to take a look why. Its a good way for self reflection.


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## rossco12

Plugging Along said:


> I say good luck, it looks like you are doing well. I hope that your plan to hit $1 mil networth by thirty does not require you to live with your parents the whole time.
> 
> I think at 21 there has to be a balance between living for the moment and saving for the future. Most 21 years are on the live for the moment, I think it's important to have a balance.
> 
> If others are calling you cheap, you have to take a look why. Its a good way for self reflection.


Absolutely not, a strategic real estate acquisition is definitely in the gameplan, but I don't particularly like my options right now and I usually work out of town for a month then come back for a week, and don't spend much time at the parents place anyhow.

As for being cheap, the people who call me on it are usually my friends, it's something I've become known for in my social circle and I'm okay with it. I'm not too cheap to buy them the odd meal or whatever, I just scrath my head watching them take out, for example, a 7 year loan on a vehicle that will lose 90% of its value by the time it's paid.


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## underemployedactor

Well done and congrats. But what's with all the guns?


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## nobleea

You have the potential to do very well. Being 'cheap' when you're around young guys who make lots of money and blow it on dumb things is a very good thing. A note of caution though, as a young, inexperienced investor you will not get wealthy by investing in gold stocks, penny stocks and aggressive equities. You will get wealth by saving a lot of your money and making smart investments. I speak from experience. When you're young (and making good coin) you feel invincible. But the mind is still malleable. Reading blogs and articles on why gold is underperforming, or there's manipulation by the man in this or that industry, or some miner is bound to do better with increased materials pricing, it's easy to get caught up.
Maximize your savings and invest them in a bunch of diversified ETF's or a selection of blue chip stocks (if you feel the need to satisfy a stock picker urge) and just let the plan do it's thing. And live a little, spend on big experiences, not things. No one looks back when they're 65 and thinks, man that 60" TV I bought 40 years ago still brings joy to my face. But replace it with an experience, like skydiving, or big game hunting in some foreign country, or watching the stanley cup final live, driving a lambo on a track....those things you won't regret or forget.


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## PoolAndRapid

..


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## rossco12

I guess I should also mention that I haven't always care about my finances this much. It definitely wasn't something I was born with. 3 years ago I had zero savings, $700 in debt on my 4x4 which I would spend about $7000 building up until I sold it for 4k. 

nobleea: I appreciate the advice, and I like your school of thought on spending. I have smartened up considerably with my investments. My TFSA bottomed out at $9400, I had been picking false bottoms on a lot of my gold stocks all the way down and averaging down. Solid companies with strong financials like Yamana Gold and Silver Wheaton, as well as some riskier juniors. Most of what I still hold I believe to be undervalued/oversold and have no problem waiting on them for a while.


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## My Own Advisor

RBull said:


> Good story. Nice job rossco. Good luck with your goal. It's very ambitious.
> 
> Take it easy on the speed. You want to get to 30 and beyond.


+10


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## underemployedactor

Big game hunting? Gun purchases? Is this the CMF or the NRA?


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## Nemo2

underemployedactor said:


> Gun purchases?


What, there's something wrong with owning guns?


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## Arshes76

Have you read the Millionaire Teacher? I would def recommend it. I look at all the gold stocks you own and cringe. If you want to retire young, i would recommend you put your money in investments that are better for the long term. Keep your more speculative stuff in a seperate "Fun Money" like account so its ups and downs wont affect your retirement accounts.


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## RBull

nobleea said:


> You have the potential to do very well. Being 'cheap' when you're around young guys who make lots of money and blow it on dumb things is a very good thing. A note of caution though, as a young, inexperienced investor you will not get wealthy by investing in gold stocks, penny stocks and aggressive equities. You will get wealth by saving a lot of your money and making smart investments. I speak from experience. When you're young (and making good coin) you feel invincible. But the mind is still malleable. Reading blogs and articles on why gold is underperforming, or there's manipulation by the man in this or that industry, or some miner is bound to do better with increased materials pricing, it's easy to get caught up.
> Maximize your savings and invest them in a bunch of diversified ETF's or a selection of blue chip stocks (if you feel the need to satisfy a stock picker urge) and just let the plan do it's thing. And live a little, spend on big experiences, not things. No one looks back when they're 65 and thinks, man that 60" TV I bought 40 years ago still brings joy to my face. But replace it with an experience, like skydiving, or big game hunting in some foreign country, or watching the stanley cup final live, driving a lambo on a track....those things you won't regret or forget.


+1000000

This is very sage advice.


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## rossco12

So, just a little update. I stayed somewhat busy with work through March, but it seems like this year is a bit of an anomaly, as both companies I have worked for in the drilling industry are slow for a bit. Contracts are firing up again within a month, so I have decided to just cut expenditures and spend time with the GF, get in better shape...just play a bit of catch up on life in the mean time. My net worth was helped out a little by my $6000 tax return, which could have been more had I been aware of the t2200 form which was available to me. Oh well, next year. I maxed the TFSA again and my investments were doing quite well, but have shrunk a little over the last month or so. 

I ended up making about $63 000 last year, but I had approximately 4 months off. I've only worked about 3 months this year so far, and I'm sitting at about $22 000, and $5000 tax free for living expenses.
Hopefully I can stay busy for the rest of the year after this slump. 

*Assets:*

TFSA - $17 529.79 At the bell today.
RRSP - $13 225.90
Savings/Checking - $29298.27

Civic - $9000
Personal Belongings - $5000

*Liabilities:*

Credit Card - $1100

So I guess net worth is sitting around $73 000. Not an impressive increase so far at all. I'm actively watching for the right piece of income property to pick up once I get back to work, but I'm still not seeing any gems out there which isn't too surprising.

EDIT: I'm going to call my net worth $59 000 at this time, and not include other tangible assets in my future calculations.


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## Barwelle

rossco12 said:


> My net worth was helped out a little by my $6000 tax return, which could have been more had I been aware of the t2200 form which was available to me. Oh well, next year.


I'm not familiar with the t2200 form but I do know that you're allowed to submit changes to your tax return within a few years (I think going back 7 years Edit: 10 years, actually). So if it's a considerable amount that you would get back, it might be worthwhile to sit down and do it. Seeing as how you're not busy anyway :biggrin:

See here: http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/changereturn/


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## Mortgage u/w

rossco12 said:


> *Assets:*
> 
> TFSA - $17 529.79 At the bell today.
> RRSP - $13 225.90
> Savings/Checking - $29298.27
> 
> Civic - $9000
> Personal Belongings - $5000
> 
> *Liabilities:*
> 
> Credit Card - $1100
> 
> So I guess net worth is sitting around $73 000. Not an impressive increase so far at all. I'm actively watching for the right piece of income property to pick up once I get back to work, but I'm still not seeing any gems out there which isn't too surprising.


You are definately on the right track so keep it up. 'Cheap' is not to be confused with 'frugal' so don't anyone tell you otherwise. I personnaly define 'cheap' as someone who will benefit at the cost of others.....and that is definately not your case.

Just a side note: do not include personal belongings and vehicules as assets. They are usually depreciating assets and do not sit well on the balance sheet. Set the bar high and you will achieve more than you imagined.


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## OurBigFatWallet

That is impressive for sure. What's even more impressive is listing "guns" as an asset


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## rossco12

Mortgage u/w, I like your view on NW. You are of course correct, and by that logic, a real estate (house specifically) isn't an asset unless it is generating income. I actually was contemplating leaving vehicles and the like out, but I decided to follow the trend on here which seems to be to including them.

As for the guns, I'm not too concerned with depreciation on my WW2 Mauser with intact swastikas. 

Unfortunately, it could be a few more weeks before the drills start turning again, so I spent part of the day looking for construction work to stop the bleeding and pick up a new skill set.


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## financialuproar

rossco12 said:


> Mortgage u/w, I like your view on NW. You are of course correct, and by that logic, a real estate (house specifically) isn't an asset unless it is generating income. I actually was contemplating leaving vehicles and the like out, but I decided to follow the trend on here which seems to be to including them.
> 
> As for the guns, I'm not too concerned with depreciation on my WW2 Mauser with intact swastikas.
> 
> Unfortunately, it could be a few more weeks before the drills start turning again, so I spent part of the day looking for construction work to stop the bleeding and pick up a new skill set.


That's a cool gun. And I don't even like guns.

Rossco12, you're off to a terrific start, and you have the right attitude too, which is a hugely underrated aspect of getting wealthy. I also like your value focus, trying to buy stocks that have sold off (although I'm not really a fan of the gold stocks). I'd recommend using your time off to read investing books. Avoid the ones that tell you just to index. I'd start with _The Intelligent Investor_ and go from there.


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## peterk

What kind of drilling are you in to?


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## rossco12

peterk said:


> What kind of drilling are you in to?


financialuproar: Thanks, I just downloaded The Intelligent Investor. So far I like it...it's my style. I've never been a fan of the whole 'you won't get it so don't even bother' mentality. 

peterk: I started diamond drilling but when that got slow I got into geotechnical. They complement each other well because diamond drilling is in the mining sector while geotechnical is more construction related. It's all cyclical though, case in point my current time off.

I have an interview in the morning for work framing out of town, sounds pretty promising.


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## Mortgage u/w

rossco12 said:


> Mortgage u/w, I like your view on NW. You are of course correct, and by that logic, a real estate (house specifically) isn't an asset unless it is generating income. I actually was contemplating leaving vehicles and the like out, but I decided to follow the trend on here which seems to be to including them.
> 
> As for the guns, I'm not too concerned with depreciation on my WW2 Mauser with intact swastikas.
> 
> Unfortunately, it could be a few more weeks before the drills start turning again, so I spent part of the day looking for construction work to stop the bleeding and pick up a new skill set.


A house is an asset because it appreciates in value - even if it doesn't generate income. If it generates income, then it becomes an investment as much as an asset. So anything real estate (homes, land) should be included in the Assets column. Collectables can also be considered an asset - as long as it is a true collection item and easily tradable. Cars - unless it is already a collectable which is not driven on a regular basis = not an asset....more of an expense, really.


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## rossco12

Time for a little update... During the couple months off from my career job, I found a $28/hr job with a local logging company that also put gas in my car as part of the deal, which helped stop the financial bleeding pretty well. I then went back to work drilling with only a handful of days off over the next couple months. This was pretty good for the ol' net worth and I'm currently enjoying a couple weeks off before I head back up north. 

Assets:

Savings/Checking accounts: $15 872.01
Term Deposit: $25 000 
RRSP: $15 357.61
TFSA: $18 987.02
Margin: $5002.75
Recievables: $200

Assets: 5000 Conservatively

Payables: $1500

Net worth is currently $78 919.39 not including personal assets. It would be nice to hit $100 000 before I turn 22 in December, which should be possible with the contribution of a company profit share and 25% matched RRSP. I bought the term deposit a couple months ago on a whim because I didn't have time to manage the capital, but I'm going to cash it and move the money to my margin account where I will add some Canadian bank exposure (I like Laurentian), as well as forestry. Still no real estate deals in the making, I want a bargain.


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## peterk

Awesome update! Sounds like you're keeping busy. Is camp life/drilling something you want to keep doing for a number of years?

Have you heard about / looked into MWD drilling before? Could be right up your alley and you might a foot in the door with your diamond and geotech experience.

I'm sure you are paid well anyways, but MWD guys with only 1-2 years under their belt are pulling in ~$500/day dayrates, plus ~30k salary, plus per diem, bonus, etc.

I'd recommend reading up on it if you are feeling like you might want to stick with drilling for your career. All sorts of sweet international gigs to be had with MWD and Directional Drilling as well.


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## rossco12

peterk said:


> Awesome update! Sounds like you're keeping busy. Is camp life/drilling something you want to keep doing for a number of years?
> 
> Have you heard about / looked into MWD drilling before? Could be right up your alley and you might a foot in the door with your diamond and geotech experience.
> 
> I'm sure you are paid well anyways, but MWD guys with only 1-2 years under their belt are pulling in ~$500/day dayrates, plus ~30k salary, plus per diem, bonus, etc.
> 
> I'd recommend reading up on it if you are feeling like you might want to stick with drilling for your career. All sorts of sweet international gigs to be had with MWD and Directional Drilling as well.


Interesting, thanks for the info! The diamond drilling company I worked for had significant experience with Navi drilling, I was intrigued but never actually worked around the technology. I have made somewhat of a personal commitment to continue on this path until I'm on the levers, but from there I will definitely be looking to broaden my horizons. I work an appropriate mix of out of town jobs/camp work/shop work near Vancouver to keep me sane, but the lifestyle will inevitably come to an end in the foreseeable future.


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## rossco12

Well folks, I've been gone a while, at least from this post. I think it's time for a little update now over a year since my last post! I can report that I followed very little of the sensible investment advice given to me on this thread. I spent the remainder of 2014 and half of 2015 day trading resource stocks, short selling while working in and out of wifi or cell reception, and leveraging heavily. I made some money, lost some money, made some more, lost a lot, etc. Just like someone with a gambling problem, I was "so close" to making 40k on my Seabridge Gold position, I just had to hold it for another 2 weeks. "So close" to making 20k shorting PAA after their oil spill. The problem was I consistently failed to pull it off and it got to a point where I gave myself a little intervention a couple months ago. I closed my margin account and TFSA (TFSA due to foreign tax implications). I restructured my RRSP as well as my mindset towards it. Retirement funds and long term holdings. Needless to say, I missed my net worth goal set in the beginning of this thread (100k by age 22). Fortunately frugality and work ethic has allowed me to avoid total ruin.

Work has been cyclical as always. The mainstay company died from December 2014 through April 2015, so I went back diamond drilling for a couple months in the -50 northern Saskatchewan (should have also collected some EI but I didn't due to some weird pride complex). Work is now back to it's regular business and I've had one day off of the last 36. 92.5 hours last week! One thing I'm pretty excited about is the progression of my company matched RRSP. I contribute $216 per week and the company contributes $54 (25%). Every month the sum is forwarded to Manulife where I remain 25% cash and 75% funds (CIG11109 and DYN040). The money is mine if I leave the company and they do not withdraw their contributions.

I have recently made a few commitments which I know will help me increase net worth at a better rate. The first is to cook for myself more when working out of town and living in hotels. Aside from the stock market of course, dining is by far my greatest fiscal vice. I'm provided with $60 tax free daily living out allowance which often cultivates complacency "Oh I only spend two thirds of it". My goal is to spend no more than 30% of that, or $18 per day. I just bought a very nice indoor grill and plan to put myself together a proper "care package", which will allow me to cook properly in any regular hotel room. My second goal is to be sure to apply for EI immediately after being laid off if work slows down again. I max out EI contributions year after year but have never once claimed. That has probably cost me several thousand dollars over the last few years. I also need to open some term deposits with the cash left from closing my TFSA and margin accounts.

Time for some math!

Personal RRSP - $19 181.64
Holdings - FTS.to, REI-un.to, RSI.to, CPX.to, Gold bullion

Company RRSP - 5028.26
September contributions not deposited yet - $810

Checking account - $1000.00
Savings account - $59 699.35
Term Deposit - $25 000

Other banks - $250.77


Credit Card - $998.24

Net worth almost 3 months shy of age 23 - *$109 971.78*


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## peterk

Doing good my man.

When I was 22 I was right in the middle of failing university. As a form of irresponsible procrastination, I stumbled upon CMF and thought it would be a good idea to start asking around about ways to invest my OSAP student loans! ha!

Keep working 90 hours/week, cooking your own food and setting a budget, and you'll have a million bucks in the bank by the time you're 30, I don't doubt. But remember don't be afraid to spend a bit of money on awesome vacations and experiences during your time off (you do get some time off don't you?). I don't remember much from my early 20s anymore except for the cool, awesome, adventurous things that I did. The rest of life (classes, work, etc) is just a boring blurr of a hazy memory now. And I'm only 28! I imagine it's just going to get worse from here on out...
Be sure to make some memories that will "stick", along the way.


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