# What's Stephen Harper up to these days?



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Stephen Harper (and Stockwell Day) are working with former leaders of the Mossad, the CIA, and MI5 in a corporate venture.



https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/stephen-harper-fadden-israel-awz-cybersecurity-1.5989054



Yup that's healthy! The former top public official having a grand old time with heads of all the foreign spy agencies. These boys are up to a lot of fun, I'm sure!


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

Based on Jason Kenney"s performance over that last 18 months one thing is for certain....he no longer acting as a mentor and advisor to Jason Kenney.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

I want to also point out that Stephen Harper's new business colleague, James Woolsey, has tortured people and continues to support torture.









Ex-CIA chief: ‘I would use waterboarding again if it meant saving


James Woolsey said waterboarding is acceptable for extracting information




www.independent.co.uk





Harper is such a vile, disgusting man. Warmonger, religious fundamentalist, who now hangs out with torturers.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

james4beach said:


> Stephen Harper (and Stockwell Day) are working with former leaders of the Mossad, the CIA, and MI5 in a corporate venture.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Well with hostile actors working to undermine our democracy, institutions and infrastructure, we should be working to protect ourselves.

That should be a non partisan issue.


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## robertsclak (Feb 22, 2021)

james4beach said:


> Stephen Harper (and Stockwell Day) are working with former leaders of the Mossad, the CIA, and MI5 in a corporate venture.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I believe Harper was best politician Canada has had in a long long time.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

As long as he is no longer PM I could care less.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

robertsclak said:


> I believe Harper was best politician Canada has had in a long long time.


He was perhaps a very good operator, in a sociopathic way. He managed to rule the CPC with an iron fist.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

He might pick up some neat torture tips from his new friends.


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## fstamand (Mar 24, 2015)

He's probably petting poor soul-less cats.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

The ugly side of the Liberal gang is showing their true colours. They don't have to take a back seat to Trump when it comes to crude attacks and categorizations.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

zinfit said:


> The ugly side of the Liberal gang is showing their true colours. They don't have to take a back seat to Trump when it comes to crude attacks and categorizations.


Oh, you sell Trump short.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

andrewf said:


> Oh, you sell Trump short.


no just putting all the crud in the same pot.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

I believe that O'Toole's Conservative Party would do themselves more than a little good to reflect on their abysmal pooling numbers over the past year. Most especially in Ontario, Quebec, and British Columbia.

While they are spending time on those numbers, they might want to reflect on the negative effect that socons (and socon issues/policies) and climate denier dinosaurs within the Conservative Party are having in shaping voters' opinions and intentions. And overshadowing the positive aspects of the Party. Hardly a formula for success. 

Harper was able to overcome or at least corral these two groups and succeed. Successive leaders have failed miserably.

.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

ian said:


> I believe that O'Toole's Conservative Party would do themselves more than a little good to reflect on their abysmal pooling numbers over the past year. Most especially in Ontario, Quebec, and British Columbia.
> 
> While they are spending time on those numbers, they might want to reflect on the negative effect that socons (and socon issues/policies) and climate denier dinosaurs within the Conservative Party are having in shaping voters' opinions and intentions. And overshadowing the positive aspects of the Party. Hardly a formula for success.
> 
> ...


In the interim the wild. massive Trudeau spending will get him elected. In the medium and longterm Trudeau has created a massive structural deficit with a large pool of people who believe that the government owes them a living. When the the next recession comes it will be extremely painful and Trudeau will be dust. How will history treat Trudeau? I think of Peron and Argentina. Modern Monetary Theory is voodoo economics .


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

zinfit said:


> In the interim the wild. massive Trudeau spending will get him elected. In the medium and longterm Trudeau has created a massive structural deficit with a large pool of people who believe that the government owes them a living. When the the next recession comes it will be extremely painful and Trudeau will be dust. How will history treat Trudeau? I think of Peron and Argentina. Modern Monetary Theory is voodoo economics .


Only 1/3 of the country needs to vote for Trudeau to keep him in power.


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

zinfit said:


> In the interim the wild. massive Trudeau spending will get him elected. In the medium and longterm Trudeau has created a massive structural deficit with a large pool of people who believe that the government owes them a living. When the the next recession comes it will be extremely painful and Trudeau will be dust. How will history treat Trudeau? I think of Peron and Argentina. Modern Monetary Theory is voodoo economics .


They will continue to love him. His father ran the country into the ground the same way and everyone thinks he was great.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

ian said:


> I believe that O'Toole's Conservative Party would do themselves more than a little good to reflect on their abysmal pooling numbers over the past year. Most especially in Ontario, Quebec, and British Columbia.
> 
> While they are spending time on those numbers, they might want to reflect on the negative effect that socons (and socon issues/policies) and climate denier dinosaurs within the Conservative Party are having in shaping voters' opinions and intentions. And overshadowing the positive aspects of the Party. Hardly a formula for success.
> 
> ...


Why they are bending over backwards to pander to Alberta O&G interests is beyond me. They already have those votes. Even if they don't turn out, they will still win in Alberta. If they want to win government, they need to appeal to the marginal voter in Ontario, BC, etc.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

MrMatt said:


> Only 1/3 of the country needs to vote for Trudeau to keep him in power.


True of any government. That's how our system works (I don't care for it).


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

andrewf said:


> True of any government. That's how our system works (I don't care for it).


Well in the US you get about 50%, and they've become hyper divided. Not sure that's better.

That's why if we were going to change we should go for STV (aka ranked ballot). I'm okay with a compromise leader we can all agree isn't horrible, who understands that the reason they're in power is because he's actually acceptable to most people.

If the leaders get elected on balancing interests, and showing compromise, maybe they'll govern like that?


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

MrMatt said:


> Well in the US you get about 50%, and they've become hyper divided. Not sure that's better.
> 
> That's why if we were going to change we should go for STV (aka ranked ballot). I'm okay with a compromise leader we can all agree isn't horrible, who understands that the reason they're in power is because he's actually acceptable to most people.
> 
> If the leaders get elected on balancing interests, and showing compromise, maybe they'll govern like that?


The US is winner take all, which makes things rather high stakes. And they reinforce in countless ways the primacy of the two party system.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

MrMatt said:


> Well in the US you get about 50%, and they've become hyper divided. Not sure that's better.
> 
> That's why if we were going to change we should go for STV (aka ranked ballot). I'm okay with a compromise leader we can all agree isn't horrible, who understands that the reason they're in power is because he's actually acceptable to most people.
> 
> If the leaders get elected on balancing interests, and showing compromise, maybe they'll govern like that?


With STV it is remarkably unlikely to win a majority, but you also are incentivized not to have to many splinter parties. Also, unlikely to have big shifts in outcome without big shifts in vote-share. That should make minority governments more stable and constructive.


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## robertsclak (Feb 22, 2021)

MrMatt said:


> Only 1/3 of the country needs to vote for Trudeau to keep him in power.


It is the same old story,the lack of a credible and strong opposition party.Trudeau gets re-elected by buying our votes with our money.Over simplified but the whole topic gets me going.If we are not careful we will have a federal NDP party running the country.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

andrewf said:


> The US is winner take all, which makes things rather high stakes. And they reinforce in countless ways the primacy of the two party system.


The Canadian system is super winner take all, you control the legislative and executive branch.
It's even worse that you can win all that with only 1/3 of the vote.

At least they somewhat break theirs into 3 different elected bodies

I also think a bunch of compromise STV winners could make a minority parliament work a bit better. It would mean crazy out there policies would get quickly killed by the more reasonable people.
It would result in "tyranny of the majority", but hopefully it would be a more conciliatory majority. I also can't think of any way to stop abuses by the majority in a democracy.

The closest I get is small government to at least minimize the extent.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

andrewf said:


> Why they are bending over backwards to pander to Alberta O&G interests is beyond me. They already have those votes. Even if they don't turn out, they will still win in Alberta. If they want to win government, they need to appeal to the marginal voter in Ontario, BC, etc.


I wish I knew. From my perspective this is a simple math question. Give up 10 points in Alberta and Sask. Perhaps loose 2 seats. But secure at least 10-20 more-especially in ridings where the margin was less than 1000 to 1500 votes.

O'Toole has nothing to loose. If he carries on as before, catering to socons and climate change deniers, he will loose the next election and will be dumped by his party. I suspect there are a number of Sloan and Bernier type members in the party who are already thinking just that.

If he moves the party platform to the center, and is SEEN to do it he may just have a chance at a minority Government. If this happens he can start managing the party properly. Listening to the 60 percent and listening to the majority of Canadian voters.

At the end of last week the Conservatives were 10 points behind the Liberals in key rich urban areas. Big hill to climb. I would give it a month and we will be able to tell whether O'Toole has chosen door A or door B. Whatever door he chooses he desperately needs to replace his current senior political advisors with competent, politically savvy operators. The bunch he currently has have done him a great disservice.

If he tries to straddle the middle like he did with his climate change announcement I believe he will toast. It will be interesting to see the show and to see who comes out of the Conservative woodwork to start stabbing their Leader in the back. Just my opinion and I could be way off base but this is what I see.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

ian said:


> I wish I knew. From my perspective this is a simple math question. Give up 10 points in Alberta and Sask. Perhaps loose 2 seats. But secure at least 10-20 more-especially in ridings where the margin was less than 1000 to 1500 votes.
> 
> O'Toole has nothing to loose. If he carries on as before, catering to socons and climate change deniers, he will loose the next election and will be dumped by his party. I suspect there are a number of Sloan and Bernier type members in the party who are already thinking just that.
> 
> ...


This all bodes well for the emerging Western Separatist movement. The belief in Western Canada is that we are little more than a colony to be exploited and kicked around by Central and Eastern Canada. It is my prediction that O'Tool will become a gift for that movement. All we need is few lectures from eastern elitists to accelerate the process.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

zinfit said:


> This all bodes well for the emerging Western Separatist movement. The belief in Western Canada is that we are little more than a colony to be exploited and kicked around by Central and Eastern Canada. It is my prediction that O'Tool will become a gift for that movement. All we need is few lectures from eastern elitists to accelerate the process.


Can someone explain to me why the wealthiest part of Canada also complains the most? There are many parts of Canada with much bigger problems, poverty, and poor quality of life and yet, there's hardly a peep from parts which have much more justified complaints. Alberta is not a disadvantaged part of Canada.

Alberta is actually the wealthiest, most privileged province with the highest wages and highest per capita GDP.

I think Alberta picks up this sad behaviour from rich American conservatives, who also complain a lot about being disadvantaged.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

james4beach said:


> Can someone explain to me why the wealthiest part of Canada also complains the most? There are many parts of Canada with much bigger problems, poverty, and poor quality of life and yet, there's hardly a peep from parts which have much more justified complaints. Alberta is not a disadvantaged part of Canada.
> 
> Alberta is actually the wealthiest, most privileged province with the highest wages and highest per capita GDP.
> 
> I think Alberta picks up this sad behaviour from rich American conservatives, who also complain a lot about being disadvantaged.


It's not being disadvantaged, it's being taken advantage of.
Look at Quebec, they actively discourage investment, then demand handouts because their economy isn't doing well.

It's like the lazy brother who makes bad decisions, but keeps expecting mom and dad to bail them out.

When you say "more justified complaints" what do you mean?


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

james4beach said:


> Can someone explain to me why the wealthiest part of Canada also complains the most? There are many parts of Canada with much bigger problems, poverty, and poor quality of life and yet, there's hardly a peep from parts which have much more justified complaints. Alberta is not a disadvantaged part of Canada.
> 
> Alberta is actually the wealthiest, most privileged province with the highest wages and highest per capita GDP.
> 
> I think Alberta picks up this sad behaviour from rich American conservatives, who also complain a lot about being disadvantaged.


It appears so until you analysis equalization and other programs that seriously disadvantage Alberta. It is something like 20 billion per year [a net negative]. Quebec says it doesn't want Alberta's dirty oil or its pipelines but it gladly takes 13 billion per year from the equalization program. The golden goose has basically supported the equalization program over the past 30 years. It is interesting what will happen when the golden goose dies because of anti-oil policies being adopted by Ottawa. If Alberta was out of Canada they they would have 20 billion plus more dollars in their budget and their per capita level of debt would be much lower. Both SK and Alberta would be seen as very attractive new prospective new states fr the US. At the very least they could gain a much trade relationship with the US with none of the protectionism hangups that exist in central Canada. In terms of trade these two provinces have a much bigger relationship with the Asia Pacific region and the USA. Sk had great natural resources [water, potash , uranium, oil &gas] . Alberta and Sk do not have the anti-American hostility that is prevalent in Eastern Canada. We have none of the baggage that that came with the loyalists. Our cultural heritage is more German, Nordic, Eastern European and Irish. Through separation SK.AB would gain much being freed from the colonial power elites in Quebec and Ontario. Eastern Canada would lose a lot.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

That is echoing the rhetoric of Alberta's Premier Jason Kenney, and Albertans don't seem to agree with him.

Last I saw the poll numbers, the NDP would win a majority government in Alberta.









Notley's NDP opens wide lead on Kenney and UCP in latest poll


The poll found 40 per cent support for the NDP compared to 20 per cent for the governing UCP with the opposition party leading in all areas of the province




calgaryherald.com


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

MrMatt said:


> When you say "more justified complaints" what do you mean?


Impoverished communities, 'boil water' advisories, First Nations areas with no infrastructure and epidemics of suicides, remote areas where people can't get any health care, coastal fishing communities starved for income because of marine mismanagement, towns where manufacturing has collapsed and people have been chronically unemployed since the 1980s

Meanwhile, Albertans are driving around in luxury vehicles and have high incomes, and the highest GDP per capita.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

james4beach said:


> Impoverished communities, 'boil water' advisories, First Nations areas with no infrastructure and epidemics of suicides, remote areas where people can't get any health care, coastal fishing communities starved for income because of marine mismanagement, towns where manufacturing has collapsed and people have been chronically unemployed since the 1980s
> 
> Meanwhile, Albertans are driving around in luxury vehicles and have high incomes, and the highest GDP per capita.


Don't live in those communities.
I'm sorry, but I moved hours away from friends and family, you yourself have moved across North America for employment.

These people are making a bad choice, if that place can't provide a decent life they should leave.

I'd love to live in the medium North of Canada, that's where I choose to vacation when I can.
But I know it just isn't practical for the life I want to live.
so I live here in a decent city doing okay, and spend a few days a year visiting those places.

Those other people choose to live in those communities, and that's fine, but there are trade offs. One of them is that some of them are not very nice places to live.

As far as reserves, they have their own unique problems.
The ones with the most problems tend to reject investment, so of course their economies suck.
Also some have serious governance issues.

Some have good governance and have accepted investment and are doing quite well.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

james4beach said:


> Impoverished communities, 'boil water' advisories, First Nations areas with no infrastructure and epidemics of suicides, remote areas where people can't get any health care, coastal fishing communities starved for income because of marine mismanagement, towns where manufacturing has collapsed and people have been chronically unemployed since the 1980s
> 
> Meanwhile, Albertans are driving around in luxury vehicles and have high incomes, and the highest GDP per capita.


You haven't been to Calgary for a long time. Half the downtown towers are empty , over 10 % unemployment , housing prices are depressed and big companies like Encana have moved to the US. You listen to much to CBC and Liberal propaganda. In regards to your first paragraph you give me another reason to want to leave. The Liberal record on aboriginal matters is dreadful . The problems in Atlantic Canada are the result of building an economy around glorified government welfare programs. Regional development authorities ,equalization payments ,seasonal unemployment and other failed government interventions have created a permanent culture of defeatism and dependence. This is an indictment against the failure of Liberal government policies. Its seems that the fat cats at corrupt outfits like SNC and Bombardier and their people have no trouble driving luxury vehicles and living high off the hog. Trudeau's insiders extends well beyond these two. The family compacts in Quebec and Ontario have lived well beyond the 19th century and they seem to do well with generous government protection and handouts. I find it interesting that both Quebec and New Brunswick have found significant deposits of oil and gas but provincial governments prevent them from developing resources because they will lose money under the equalization program because the formula plays a large emphasize resources revenues and income.


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## fstamand (Mar 24, 2015)

MrMatt said:


> These people are making a bad choice, if that place can't provide a decent life they should leave


Do you honestly think they can just leave ?


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

Years ago I recall a humorist story W F Buckley told. He said he travelled by land to Ontario, The border agent asked him what was the purpose of his visit. His response "he was coming to wipe out socialism in Canada". the border agent with a straight and unaffected face said " do you expect to be here very long"


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

fstamand said:


> Do you honestly think they can just leave ?


My ancestors from Ireland did. Its okay to be a self-reliant contributing member of society and not being a burden on society and being charitable too those with handicaps and physical /mental impediments. To many have become defeated dependants. The ones that move have little to regret.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

Since people are slagging Harper and brought mess on reserves. Harper negotiated an big increase in education funding with the Grand Chief. It include measurement in the skill areas. The Liberals and the corrupt chiefs make a big stink. They ended firing the Grand Chief and cancelling the package. . Then Harper with the Accountability Act required reserves do do public annual audits. When Trudeau became the PM one of his first order of business was repealing this act. This sort of stuff reveals the corrupt nature of Liberals. I like Sir John A's quote " not all Liberals are horse thiefs but all horse thiefs are Liberals.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

zinfit said:


> Then Harper with the Accountability Act required reserves do do public annual audits.


Some reserves have public budgets, just like public companies, governments.
I think Unions are the only other holdouts trying to keep their books secret.


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## zinfit (Mar 21, 2021)

MrMatt said:


> Some reserves have public budgets, just like public companies, governments.
> I think Unions are the only other holdouts trying to keep their books secret.


Good for them. To bad that wasn't the case with the large majority of reserves. Harper through legislation attempted to make it mandatory for all reserves. Trudeau repealed that act. The Liberals insist on perpetuating the poverty, misery, social problems and the corruption that exists in most reserves .


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

zinfit said:


> Good for them. To bad that wasn't the case with the large majority of reserves. Harper through legislation attempted to make it mandatory for all reserves. Trudeau repealed that act. The Liberals insist on perpetuating the poverty, misery, social problems and many cases the corruption that exists in most reserves .


The Liberals need government dependance to get votes. 
Helping people and organizations become self sufficient isn't in their electoral interest.


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## Karlhungus (Oct 4, 2013)

james4beach said:


> Can someone explain to me why the wealthiest part of Canada also complains the most? There are many parts of Canada with much bigger problems, poverty, and poor quality of life and yet, there's hardly a peep from parts which have much more justified complaints. Alberta is not a disadvantaged part of Canada.
> 
> Alberta is actually the wealthiest, most privileged province with the highest wages and highest per capita GDP.
> 
> I think Alberta picks up this sad behaviour from rich American conservatives, who also complain a lot about being disadvantaged.


Yes, because capitalism the greatest economic system ever invented. Scary that the federal liberals are trying to destroy that.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

The native reserves needed money and Harper gave them more government legislation, restrictions and red tape.

He did the same with military veterans and seasonal workers in Atlantic Canada. It cost him the election.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Stephen Harper's legacy as PM is well documented for history. It speaks for itself and no amount of attempted revision is going to change that.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Karlhungus said:


> Yes, because capitalism the greatest economic system ever invented. Scary that the federal liberals are trying to destroy that.


Your reply seems to have no relation to what I posted, and is just an ideological statement.

I asked why Alberta, the most privileged and wealthiest province, complains so much more than poorer and disadvantaged parts of Canada. Your response was "capitalism is great and Liberals are trying to destroy it"

???

Are you trying to say that Alberta is a bastion of capitalism, the defenders of capitalism, being attacked by Liberals? Do you really believe this nonsense?

Maybe one day you will wake up and realize this is American right wing propaganda.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

sags said:


> The native reserves needed money and Harper gave them more government legislation, restrictions and red tape.


I'm sure that some reserves need more money.
But the question remains, with the billions being given to the, what are they spending it on?









Theresa Spence, controversial chief of Attawapiskat First Nation, earned $82,000 tax-free in 2013


Chief Theresa Spence, controversial head of the Attawapiskat First Nation, earned more than $82,000 tax-free in 2013 — an 18.8% increase from 2011.




nationalpost.com




Auditors found “no evidence of due diligence in the use of public funds.”

I'm sure they can use more money. But the government has a responsibility to ensure that the money is being spent responsibly. 
Quite honestly I'd love to live in that geographic area, but as I've said, it's not economically sustainable to do so, so I don't. Maybe they should move to where there are jobs?


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Most of Canada is "economically unsustainable" geographically.


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