# Need help finding my way through the wireless jungle



## Kalergie (Jan 7, 2011)

Hi there.

Im currently with Fido and I pay half a fortune for something I barely use. I decided to get rid of my iPhone and try one of the discount providers. Preferably pay-as-you-go.

I was on the website of WIND, PetroCanada and 7-Eleven and their offers seem ok. Are there any other discounters these days?

As my girl friend lives in another province, I probably need something with a decent long-distance rate.


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## leoc2 (Dec 28, 2010)

I used the search feature with the words "cell phone plans" and here is an example of what the search returned:

http://www.canadianmoneyforum.com/showthread.php?t=6073&highlight=cell+phone+plans

Give it a try!


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

I recently changed to the cheapest Rogers phone, designed for seniors.

It is cheap enough.........but the government fees add it back up.

After a $35 dollar administration fee and $55 for the phone, I found the phone cumbersome to use for anything but straight phone calls.

Text navigation is awful..........and incoming messages have no time attached, so you don't know when the person sent the message.

From past Rogers service.........it can take hours to get a text as they somehow get lost somewhere in space.

So, a text requiring assistance can be 3 or 4 hours old and you don't know it.

I would advise avoiding the Rogers deal...............


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## Spidey (May 11, 2009)

We are one of those rare families without cellphones. However, recently we've been searching for one for my daughter in university, as she sometimes needs to contact us. I can't believe how complex these contracts are for something as simple as a phone.  She probably needs unlimited texting (mostly due to having to respond to friends) and very occasional calls. So far I haven't found anything that wouldn't cost at least $400 per year, and probably will be more in the vicinity of $600 or more once the fine print is applied. I'm understanding why Bell is making such good profits. Any suggestions welcome.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Blame monopolistic marketing for the complexity

You can have a $20 iPhone plan in Canada if you find your way passed the smoke and mirrors, just like any phone, as other members have posted. In other countries they hand you a sim card in the airport and you pre-pay a few bucks at any corner store - simple!


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## Jungle (Feb 17, 2010)

I might start using a calling card for long distance calls. PC has one for 5 cents a minute. 

Just an alternative if you need cheap long distance.


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

Calling cards are great Jungle, I've got one speed dial programmed with access code under the "L" key on my smartphone, just press hold wait 6 seconds & can dial out anywhere.


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

If you live in an area with WIND home zone coverage I would just get them. Smart 25: unlimited local voice, unlimited NA texting for $25. There's a $5 add-on for Unlimited Canadian long distance and a $10 add-on for unlimited data. The most you'd pay all in is $40. You can do even better on the promotional plans.

Next year people can bring their phone with a Toronto number to Dalhousie (Halifax) and with the unlimited Canadian long distance add-on, a call back to Toronto won't incur long distance or roaming charges. Or a less extreme example without the long distance add-on, using your phone with a Whitby number in Toronto and calling back to Whitby or anywhere else in the GTA LCA (Hamilton, Cambridge, check the map) won't incur long distance charges. The big 3 nickel and dime you on long distance every time you leave your local calling area, who wants that?

http://windmobile.ca/en/Pages/UnlimitedLocalCellPlan-East.aspx

The only problem is unless you spend at least $40/month on a postpaid account they aren't going to give you a $650 phone for cheap. Wind subs up to $400 right now. 400/36 = $11/month of lost revenue, so there is a minimum you have to pay to be eligible and is also sustainable enough that they stay in business. All carriers have rules similar to this.

Support is nothing to brag about, but they do have 24/7/365 billing & technical support compared to 9 or 12 hour windows with the big 3.

Also if you travel to Quebec and want free calling you'll have to disable roaming, disable 3G data, and rely on wifi calling through Skype out/Dell voice, there's no home coverage there yet. Hopefully next time around.


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## Sherlock (Apr 18, 2010)

Kalergie said:


> As my girl friend lives in another province, I probably need something with a decent long-distance rate.


Do you both live in one of Wind's zones? All Wind plans offer free unlimited Wind-to-Wind calling across the country.


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## Kalergie (Jan 7, 2011)

The problem with WIND is that it doesnt work for iPhones. This isnt a problem for me if getting rid of my iPhone means saving 100s of dollars every year. 

Most countries I lived in, cell phone plans were made as complicated as possible. With the exception of the UAE which was as easy as described by Mode3sour. Buy a sim at the gas station, put it in your phone. GO! 

However, Canada is by far the worse country I have ever been in with regards to cell phone contracts. Pay for incoming calls, incoming texts, voicemail, caller ID......locked phones, 3 year contracts???? really?


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

Rogers pay as you go is an inexpensive option if you don't use your phone too much. You can use gmail on your computer to call your girlfriend, it offers free calling across Canada & the US. I have pay as you go on my iphone and I spend $10/mo on it. I occasionally splurge on a $1 data day pass, but most of the time I just use it on wifi (since I have wifi at home and work, it's rare I need the data plan).


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Spudd said:


> Rogers pay as you go is an inexpensive option if you don't use your phone too much. You can use gmail on your computer to call your girlfriend, it offers free calling across Canada & the US. I have pay as you go on my iphone and I spend $10/mo on it. I occasionally splurge on a $1 data day pass, but most of the time I just use it on wifi (since I have wifi at home and work, it's rare I need the data plan).


This should be a sticky in the Frugal section, because most Cdns think iPhone = $70 plan. If you buy your own, or one of many used phones it's not the case


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## Spidey (May 11, 2009)

Spudd said:


> Rogers pay as you go is an inexpensive option if you don't use your phone too much. You can use gmail on your computer to call your girlfriend, it offers free calling across Canada & the US. I have pay as you go on my iphone and I spend $10/mo on it. I occasionally splurge on a $1 data day pass, but most of the time I just use it on wifi (since I have wifi at home and work, it's rare I need the data plan).


Does this have unlimited texting?


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

Rogers PAYG: http://www.rogers.com/web/content/wireless-products/plans##Tabset1-1

$15.75/month
"Unlimited messaging" (within Canada only)
25c per minute restricted to your local calling area

$5 worth of PAYG minutes gives you 20 minutes ($5/0.25 = 20). $10 for 40 minutes. $125 for 500 minutes.

This is not attractive at all, unless you want your phone to be an expensive paper weight.

And yeah unfortunately Wind does not work with iPhones. Hopefully the next version will. It seems like they skipped it in the iPhone 4S because of the pending T-Mobile/AT&T merger down in the US. Most high end Nokia phones are pentaband 3G though. I'm using a Wind issued BB9900 for now but should be receiving an imported Nokia 700 (~$300) in a few days that I can use with all the providers here & other countries.

According to GSM arena there are only 26 pentaband 3G phones on the market


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

Spidey said:


> Does this have unlimited texting?


You can get the "Socialite 20" plan for unlimited texting, which is not the plan I have (I pay per text, I think 10c per). It would be $20 per month, which seems decent enough if you're going to be texting a bunch.

http://www.rogers.com/web/content/wireless-products/plans##Tabset1-2


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

It's an expensive paperweight... unless you use free WiFi or the free GPS sensor etc. That's like saying a laptop is a paperweight because you can't talk to grandma on the 401 with it


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

That's a bad analogy, it's like having a GPS in your car that can't preload maps and only works in your driveway because it needs wifi internet. Sorry guys took a detour and my GPS won't reroute unless I'm back home in my driveway. A 01:30 minute phone call every day for 30 days outside Rogers daily 3 hour "unlimited call window" costs $9.75. A phone that can't make phone calls is a paper weight, just my opinion..


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## Kalergie (Jan 7, 2011)

Great tip with the gmail call!!! I didnt know about that. 

I think Petro Canada and 7-Eleven support the iPhone as well. Does anyone know how much data the iPhone normally consumes without me actively downloading stuff? I am worried the iPhone does all sorts of updates in the background secretly using my data.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

You can double click to see active "background" apps or easily turn off data in settings. If you d/l your media and heavy data on wifi you're hard pressed to use the standard 500MB imo. Unless you stream HD youtube, radio or satellite maps etc on 3G you won't use 500MB on text and normal internet data.


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

Get an app to monitor your usage and disable data automatically if it comes close to your limit. I used one called 3G Watchdog with my Nexus one when I had Rogers. Not sure what the iOS equivalent would be.

Speakout and Petro will support the iPhone as they're using wholesale access to Rogers network. Just make sure its unlocked. And you might have to cut their SIM around the edges to make it fit in the iPhone 4.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

ddkay said:


> That's a bad analogy, it's like having a GPS in your car that can't preload maps and only works in your driveway because it needs wifi internet. Sorry guys took a detour and my GPS won't reroute unless I'm back home in my driveway. A 01:30 minute phone call every day for 30 days outside Rogers daily 3 hour "unlimited call window" costs $9.75. A phone that can't make phone calls is a paper weight, just my opinion..


What?

It can preload maps..... GPS sensor works independent of 3G/WiFi data. There is also a wikipedia of free routable worldwide GPS data nowadays. It can also preload anything else a computer can - games, music, docs etc. Most people talk by text away from home nowadays, I make free phone calls from home/wifi. If someone calls me it goes to email voice


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## jamesbe (May 8, 2010)

Petro Canada plan, + $10 monthly unlimited. Works with iPhone, can't get much better.


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

mode3sour said:


> It can preload maps....


"It" may be able to preload maps, you missed the point though. That analogy was for a GPS that a driver had to use but could not because the GPS only operates under specific conditions that are inconvenient to its owner.

I faced this problem all the time on my Android. Google Maps is useless outside about a 15km radius without a data plan. You have to load a bunch of third party apps and less detailed open source maps like OpenStreetMap to get (legal) offline continental coverage.

A phone that does not make phone calls when you need to make phone calls (e.g. inside arbitrary calling windows like 3pm to 6pm or 6pm to 7am) is equally useless.

Petro seems to sell Unlimited Talk+Text+Data for $50/month: http://mobility.petro-canada.ca/en/features/531.aspx. You pay additional 25c/min for long distance though and there are no long distance add-on options available. In this case to avoid extra long distance fees, for outgoing calls you can use a calling card that has an access number in the city you're visiting and don't answer any incoming calls from home.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Ahh yes and people said the same about wikipedia a few years ago, but who still uses a real encyclopedia today? In my experience open source maps have far more info than the paid already (both have different holes though). Yes they are inconvenient, but so is getting anything for reasonable price in Canada. You can always buy a 3rd party map for a fraction of the cost of a GPS device, and a fraction of buying a basic program like Office for Windows.

Maybe a better analogy is to say a computer is useless without a printer - yet computers have evolved far beyond the need to print anymore.


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

A printer is useless without paper. Just because it scans as a secondary function when you need to print doesn't make everything good again. You are mixing up peripheral functions with core functions. A phone needs to be able to make phone calls. A GPS needs to be able to retrieve coordinates and display them on a map. 

I don't think I'll live to see the date voice functions or video calling are obsolete and we just write bit sized messages to each other, but who knows..


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## Kalergie (Jan 7, 2011)

I am not sure what "Canada-wide" means. At least it says "Canada-wide anytime minutes" on top of the Monthly plan fee schedule.

http://mobility.petro-canada.ca/en/features/396.aspx

Long distance calling rate from anywhere in Canada to anywhere in the US is 25 cents per minute, on top of the Canada-Wide calling rate. 

Not sure what Canada-wide means for Petro Canada


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

They don't publish a map/guide so I have no idea either.

If you can live without data, Koodo (Telus flanker brand) have decent value for voice-only plans. Your iPhone will work in every city across Canada so no roaming and no long distance bs to deal with.

$40 gets you CID+voicemail, 50 texts, unlimited incoming minutes, 250 outgoing minutes, and unlimited outgoing time window from 5pm-7am: https://shop.koodomobile.com/plans/plans/index.html. All plans come with unlimited family calling (should be able to hand over any 5 numbers of your choice). You can optionally add unlimited international text for $5 and the expensive data add-on $25 for 2GB.


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## Kalergie (Jan 7, 2011)

Thanks guys. 3 pages within a few hours on a Sunday afternoon. This appears to be a topic of interest!


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## Sherlock (Apr 18, 2010)

Why do people like iPhones so much? A good Android phone like the Google Nexus is much better and can do a lot more stuff.


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## Kalergie (Jan 7, 2011)

I am asking myself the same question everyday. I can quantify exactly how much I have spent more because I got hooked on the 3 year iPhone premium contracts from way back when they released the 3GS. Its nuts how stupid I was to go for it!


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## Sherlock (Apr 18, 2010)

Well when the iPhone came out in 08 there was nothing else like it so I can see why people went for it. But now, things are different.


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

I think its just a matter of effective marketing and product design. There is little end user cost difference otherwise. It was the same for BlackBerry before Apple came along and rocked the boat. Apple has been consistent in delivering software updates and attractive product design.

Android is an eclair gingerbread honey icecream jelly bean salad. There has been too many major changes between versions. In 4.0 they added a permanent Google search bar on the home screen and there's no way to remove it without voiding the warranty.. that's very annoying. Many 2.3 apps don't work in 4.0. You don't get a smooth user experience.

Also so many people are invested into iOS apps and used to the interface already, it doesn't make sense for them to start over from scratch on a new platform.


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## bayview (Nov 6, 2011)

I agreed Canada has one of the worst cell phone plans in terms of pricing. Since i arrived in Canada 5 months ago, I resisted getting lock up in a 3 year contract and has survived so far on Rogers Pay as You Go simply because it is the only reliable provider I know (besides Fido) that can support my GSM phone. To cut out the inconvenience of mandatory monthly top ups of $20-30 I suggest to go for the $100 top up which allows one to top up as late as 12 months later if your usage is low. The downside is since it is loaded with credits it is bad if you lose your phone or if it conks out often.

Rogers is also promoting no contract plans for $32-35/mth before tax ( not bad...) BUT if you want optional caller ID its another $8/mth which is why I feel Canadian cell plans are pricey and not consumer friendly! I also use free skype and Gmail talk (Nth America) and iPad wifi (without 3G) for surfing & data when I'm outside like in Starbucks; Chapters etc.


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## financialnoob (Feb 26, 2011)

ddkay said:


> You can optionally add unlimited international text for $5 and the expensive data add-on $25 for 2GB.


Mobile data in Canada is quite expensive, but $25 for 2 GB is actually a pretty good deal for users who require a lot of data. As a comparison, Rogers would cost $35 for 2 gigs, while Telus would be $45. 

It's really dependent on the user's needs. There are lower options available (Rogers has the $1/day option, while Koodo has a "data saver" that can run as low as $5/25 megs, or $10/100 megs). But the 2 gig price is actually pretty decent compared to alternatives.


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## Torrey (Feb 26, 2012)

To the original poster and anyone else interested. I don't mind sharing my family & friends wireless discounts to my Canadian Money Forum "friends" 

Here's the portal link: https://teamwebstore.telusmobility.com/

Feel free to *PM me* for my referral credentials, if interested in wireless discounts. They are mainly for new customers, but the site does offer handset discounts if you want to buy a phone outright.

Just noticed there's no inbox, post up your email if you want me to directly message you the information.


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