# What's going on with the Costa cruise line?



## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Costa Cruises must have a lot of bad luck for some reason...now their
sister cruise liner has had a major fire on board and is disabled..bloating around
in the Indian Ocean and being towed back without power by a couple of tugboats back to... Italy? 

I presume it's not "el Capitano" this time in charge, but another captain, 
who maybe forgot to lubricate something that was supposed to be
lubricated?..except maybe himself. 

Fortunately nobody hurt this time..and no lives lost..but without
diesel electric power..nothing works..probably even the toilet pumps won't
work to flush the toilets.

Costa is not receiving a very good reputation these days..it seems.


----------



## LondonHomes (Dec 29, 2010)

I'd never heard of this cruise line before their string of recent "accidents".

My impression isn't good and I know that I'll never be booking a trip with them.

Goods odds that they change their name within the next 6 months.


----------



## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

LondonHomes said:


> Goods odds that they change their name within the next 6 months.


They are part of a larger cruise line.... a British-American owned Italian cruise line, based in Genoa, Italy, and under control of the Carnival Corporation & plc.]

I guess Carnival may want to rethink their strategy when the lawsuits keep coming in or they have to refund money each time. How can a cruise line
make any money that way?

Maybe they should be bought out by Costco..and change their name to
Cosco Cruises & Crap Shoots? Throw snake eyes and you loose big time!


----------



## Kim (Jan 10, 2011)

The crusie line is offering the passengers of the Costa on Fire a coupon for a FREE cruise for their sufferings......uhhhh can you say "not a chance".

Going on a cruise isn't for me in the first place but I would expect a better "We're so sorry" souvenir for having something like that happen.


----------



## steve41 (Apr 18, 2009)

> disabled..bloating around
> in the Indian Ocean


 Now _that_ is clever. I have never been on a cruise, but that has to be one clever description of the diners lined up at the 24/7 smorgasbord.


----------



## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

Is Carnival cruises for real? 



> Maybe they should be bought out by Costco..and change their name to
> Cosco Cruises & Crap Shoots?


 ... or The Titanic Cruises, heading for the Land of Lawsuits if not, the Iceberg of Lawsuits.


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

Not just Costa having problems:

Bahamas Celebration-http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/03/06/canadian-woman-believed-to-have-fallen-overboard-cruise-ship-identified-as-fariba-amani-of-b-c-report/

Royal Caribbean Independence ship has Norovirus outbreak-http://www.cruiselawnews.com/

179 people have gone overboard since 2000-http://www.cruisejunkie.com/Overboard.html


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Drunks?

I don't go on cruises, but, 'back in the day', I've travelled across the Pacific (once), and the Indian Ocean/Red Sea/Med (3 times), from Oz to Europe on ocean liners.......never once heard of anyone lost overboard.


----------



## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Cal said:


> Not just Costa having problems:
> 
> Bahamas Celebration-http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/03/06/canadian-woman-believed-to-have-fallen-overboard-cruise-ship-identified-as-fariba-amani-of-b-c-report/


This latest one smells of foul play. She was a well-to-do single female of middle
eastern culture that was *pursued and controlled *by a suitor of middle eastern
culture. She already feared for her life,because he had threatened her in the past,
and had broken up relations with him, but for some reason decided to go on a cruise with him.

While it is always possible that this was a suicide, it smells more like..
_if I can't have you (and your money), then no one else will either_.. and over you go! 

The sister mentioned on the news interview, that he never came forward to offer his condolences
to them or act like he had actually cared in the first place. Another "Kingston locks" scenario..this
time it was at sea, and done under cover of darkness when nobody saw him (or her) being tossed overboard,
and probably strangled as they like to do..because somebody might have heard her screams otherwise. 

Just my opinion of course.


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

carverman said:


> This latest one smells of foul play.


Sounds like it by what has been reported thus far.

Not every problem/tragedy can be blamed on the cruise liner & it would not be the 1st time such a thing happened; have seen plenty such cases on 48 Hours Mystery on CBC.


----------



## BigGuy (Feb 11, 2012)

Well, they are probably going to have some serious deals in the next few months. People generally pay full 90 days ahead of the cruise so look for crazy deals in 2-3 months for this line. With the 2 accidents, you can be sure they are going to be watching everything to make sure nothing else happens


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...s-cuts-outlook-on-costa-wreck/article2364253/


----------



## OhGreatGuru (May 24, 2009)

Do 2 data points make a trend? 

OTOH if you believe trouble comes in threes, wait for the next one.

Could be symptomatic of serious management problems (as in - what idiot hired El Capitano?) or simple coincidence. There aren't that many major cruise lines not owned by the Carnival conglomerate.

*Carnival Corporation & Carnival PLC own:*
- Carnival Cruise Lines;
- Holland America Cruise Lines;
- Princess Cruises;
- Seaborn Cruise Lines; and
- Costa Cruises Group, consisting of Costa Cruises; AIDA Cruises, and Ibero Cruises
- P&O Cruises;P&O Cruises Australia; and Cunard Line

There can't be too many modern cruise ships afloat that aren't owned by Carnival.


----------



## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

It floats again:

http://news.ca.msn.com/top-stories/costa-concordia-refloat-operation-succeeds-in-italy-1


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

I have been on a couple of cruises and enjoyed them immensely.

Not sure if I will go again though, after watching the "Why Ships Sink" documentary on Netflix the other day.

They could make the ships safer.......by "double hulling" them all the way to above the waterline, instead of just along the bottom and part way up the sides. But that would cost more money the cruise lines don't want to spend.

They are also making the ships much taller............to hold more passengers (than could probably be effectively managed or safely evacuated in a crisis).........and the added height changes the center of gravity and makes the ships much less stable. There is also a "sail effect" in high winds which makes the ships more difficult to control. There was one ship that simply keeled over on one side.......because of a tight turn during high winds.

Typically a ship will list 10 degrees from centre......but the taller the ship......the slower the sway (for passenger comfort) but the greater the list from side to side. (more susceptible to rolling over).

In a rough sea...........these "giants" of the sea...........could tip completely over on their sides.

The training of the crews leaves much to be desired as well. The crews are often comprised of foreign students and inexperienced sailors.

And there is the issue of a shortage of experienced captains and high ranking ships officers. As more cruise ships have been built.......the experience of the captains has diminished and mandatory training and reviews have not been part of the mandated safety precautions (unlike the airline industry).

If we cruise again...............it may well be on a small ship with a low number of passengers...........and I WILL pay attention during the evacuation drill............and I will always carry a working flashlight with me on board. (almost always the ships lights go out and people stumble around in the dark interior of the ship)


----------



## Cdnwife (Sep 10, 2013)

sags said:


> The training of the crews leaves much to be desired as well. The crews are often comprised of foreign students and inexperienced sailors.


What? Are you talking about all crew members or bridge officers? Having worked on a cruise ship for 3.5 years, I can assure you that there is significant training for every crew member on a vessel, regardless of size. We undergo safety training every time we are assigned to a vessel and for some this can mean a week of afternoon training every two months. Doesn't matter that I was a three stripe officer, I still attended three years into my career onboard. If you are talking about bridge officers, I can assure you every officer standing on that bridge has put in their time and the officer in charge has years of training. Yes there may be some newer officers, sailors keeping watch, but they sure as he'll aren't making decisions or steering the ship.



sags said:


> And there is the issue of a shortage of experienced captains and high ranking ships officers. As more cruise ships have been built.......the experience of the captains has diminished and mandatory training and reviews have not been part of the mandated safety precautions (unlike the airline industry).


Most lines retire older vessels so even though they have come out with five new ships, you will find that the fleet has also retired a number so the net growth is actually only one or two ships. If you think that there are no mandated safety precautions this is simply not true. Ships are constantly under scrutiny for safety and are inspected by bodies such as USPH, Coast Guard, Lloyd's. 

I for one feel much safer on a ship that I do on the roads. As for those who have jumped/fallen, sometimes you can't fix stupid.

http://cruisefever.net/0615-photo-carnival-cruise-passenger-climbs-onto-lifeboat-during-sea-day/


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

In the 1960s I travelled twice, (it was the cheapest ship available), from Australia to Piraeus on the, (approx 17k ton), Greek liner 'Patris', (which had once previously run aground in the Suez canal).......on one of my trips it broke down in the Red Sea, and the captain, (in order to give the crew something to do, and the passengers something to watch), 'organized' a crew only lifeboat drill.

They tried lowering one boat, which got jammed at a 45 degree angle, and then just hosed down the decks.........a few of us decided that, if we encountered real trouble, we'd ignore the lifeboats and try for one of the dinghys. :biggrin:


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

wife u are truly funny & you are going to get a ribbing here :biggrin:

ships' officers are so well trained? what happened off gigli, then?

terrified passengers who jump because there's no one to help them are "stupid?"
ooh là


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

I remember this incident:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dX0EX3Xkmvw


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

humble_pie said:


> terrified passengers who jump because there's no one to help them are "stupid?"


I suspect Cdnwife is alluding to those, for whom "alcohol is generally a factor" who go overboard, (mostly at night), in calm seas.


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

Humble is probably referring to the human chain of passengers who had to use a rope to climb down the side of the Concordia in the pitch black of night........while the Captain was on land refusing orders from the Italian Coast Guard to return to the ship.


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

sags said:


> Humble is probably referring to the human chain of passengers who had to use a rope to climb down the side of the Concordia in the pitch black of night........while the Captain was on land refusing orders from the Italian Coast Guard to return to the ship.


She may well be....but Cdnwife linked to a totally separate incident under her comment.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

Nemo2 said:


> She may well be....but Cdnwife linked to a totally separate incident under her comment.



nemo did cdnwife return & post another link *under* my comment? i don't see it ...

wife has a grand total of 20 posts in this forum ... i don't click on the embedded links of strangers so i have no way of knowing what his or her link in the solitary original post above referred to.

i went by the text in the body of that solitary post, which talked about cruise passengers who fall overboard as being "stupid."

it wasn't just the passengers who jumped or otherwise struggled out of the sinking concordia. There were quite a few others - i believe more than 30 passengers have never been accounted for - who are thought to have drowned below deck, lost in the darkness among the inside cabins so they never made it up on deck.

the shocking thing is that no crew members searched or alerted in the corridors below. The failure of nearly all the crew members including the captain was well documented in the reportage at the time.

as for inebriated cruise passengers climbing over railings & falling into oceans - if that's what wife's link is all about - how many of those does the world see per annum? four or five persons who actually drown? how many people died on the concordia, for no reason other than ghastly incompetence beginning with the captain?


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

'umble.......Cdnwife's link was directly below her comment about 'stupidity' and it pertained to individual idiotic passenger actions, although, as you say, the overall numbers are minute when compared to the result of criminally idiotic actions by the Concordia's 'captain'................(similarly, in B.C. albeit with far fewer casualties, the _Queen of the North_ http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...r-years-in-sunken-ferry-case/article12773903/ )


----------



## Cdnwife (Sep 10, 2013)

Humble: Never said that the incident with the Concordia wasn't tragic. It was. Everyone I know who has had an affiliation with ships was shocked, saddened and grateful it wasn't them that day. That said, Sags was outlining the lack of training/experience by the ships bridge and having walked the walk for 3.5 years, I can tell you that those who are in charge do not lack from either. Did the captain make a bad decision. Absolutely. But to paint all captains with the same brush is not fair. I was offering up from my experience what training does occur on a vessel and the fact that all members of the crew, not just bridge and those who make up the safety teams (fire, man overboard, bomb threats, etc.) regularly hold drills and are evaluated by external bodies as to their competency.

Yes, my comment for those who are overboard was not a reflection of those on the Concordia. Do I think they should have found water ~ perhaps. Given how close to land they were and the condition and the progress of the rescue, perhaps my decision would have been to flee as well. My comment was directed towards the passengers who put themselves in harms way for the sake of a better picture, a better view at Sail Away or just don't appreciate that they are on top of the equivalent of a 10 story building. Cruise lines do also get bad press based on the bad decisions of passengers.

Do I think Captains are infallible? Hell no. They are human and being human they can make bad decisions. This is true of any industry. Pilots never make mistakes? Train conductors never make mistakes? Just saying... don't let a few bad apples ruin the bunch.


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

I was referring primarily to the safety training of the entire crew............but the training may largely be redundant.

On today's cruise ships that can carry 6,000 passengers and 2,000 crew members.........evacuation of the ship in an emergency is near impossible. Where would 8,000 people be evacuated to ?

Today's cruise ships have the best of technology........but are designed to avoid serious problems........not to endure them.

The height of new cruise ships makes them vulnerable in heavy seas and bad weather. The centre of gravity on these ships has changed with the height. There is a greater danger of the ships rolling over in rough seas. 

Engineers know the facts........but the plan is to avoid situations where this would occur.

Think of driving of high sided van on a highway.........during a windy day. The cruise ships are designed for maximum passengers and maximum luxury.......not maximum safety.

I wouldn't tell people not to cruise...........just ensure you know the layout of the ship, bring your own light..........and stay alert. 

I also would no longer book a cabin in the lowest bowels of the ship to save money..........as I have in the past.

Those passengers are the ones who don't survive an emergency.

Save a little longer and book a cabin above the main deck..............is my motto.

*Edit.....the Concordia tragedy was entirely the fault of the Captain...but the other officers and owners played their own part in the tragedy.

Had he maintained the course already pre-set in the ship navigation electronics.........he would not have hit rock shoals and split open the ship.

He manually deviated from the pre-set course...........to do a "sail by" beside the island.

A terrible mistake by the captain...........but where were the other "bridge officers"?

None of them saw a problem with the captain's actions? Did the cruise line not monitor the path of the ship and was the captain not concerned they would notice and question the deviation from course?

It looks like the captain made the terrible decision...........but everyone else went along with it.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

it's clear that one should book a luxury cabin with balcony just above the water line plus one should carry on board:

- 2 working flashlights (one is the backup)
- personal flotation device, aka life vest
- ISPLR inflatable one-man life raft
- ruggedized water-resistant phone with independent satellite connection
- flares
- waterproof lighting device for setting off flares
- police/referee whistle on neck chain
- bottled water with electrolytes
- energy bars sealed in waterproof pouch
- shark cage, depending on the water


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Especially if you're going on the _S.S. Minnow_ for a three-hour tour.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

roro ferryboats are safe in many countries but too much diesel fuel smell


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Peripherally, (inasmuch as there are oceanic connections), associated with a portion of the topic at hand, (but mainly because I'm impressed with this guy's life), here's an obituary:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/10971443/Anthony-Smith-obituary.html


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

humble_pie said:


> it's clear that one should book a luxury cabin with balcony just above the water line plus one should carry on board:
> 
> - 2 working flashlights (one is the backup)
> - personal flotation device, aka life vest
> ...


Will there be extra costs for the "luggage".................?


----------

