# NBA championships



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

I was going to post something about the Toronto Raptors winning tonight, but then it occurred to me that I don't understand what they won. Can someone explain to me how the NBA finals work? Or point me to a web site for beginners, or children?

I can't make sense of it. My understanding of this is that the top team from the Western Conferences plays the top team of the Eastern Conference. But even here, there seems to be many games. Is this played in a "best of X" kind of fashion? Can someone please explain the methodology?

Does _every_ game throughout the NBA occur in "best of X" fashion? Or is it reserved just for games near the finals? At what point does it switch to "best of X"?

A google search for Toronto Raptors tells me they are "2nd in Eastern Conference". The official NBA web site shows the same, Raptors 2nd. The Standings tab shows the *Milwaukee Bucks* are 1st in Eastern Conference, and Warriors are 1st in Western Conference.

Does this mean that the Bucks are ahead of the Raptors? And do the Bucks now play Warriors for the overall, grand finale? Is there another game coming?

Or if the Toronto Raptors really just won the overall, grand finale, can someone explain this discrepancy with the Standings listing? What is the selection criteria... which teams proceed to the overall grand finale? Apparently it's not based on being 1st in the conference, based on the NBA web site.

And besides the East vs Western conference categorization, there is another kind of categorization by "Division". There's Atlantic, Central, Northwest, etc.

Again, I'm looking for criteria, methodology, and stages of progression through the season. For example, what criteria determines which team progresses after each match-up? How are winners assessed among these conferences and divisions?

I think this will be far too complex to describe fully in a reply, but if someone knows of a good introduction resource, please post it. How do children learn all this?


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## lightcycle (Mar 24, 2012)

There are 15 teams in the Eastern Conference and 15 teams in the Western Conference. During the regular season, they rack up wins and losses playing against each other

At the end of the season, the top 8 teams in each conference qualify for the playoffs. They play each other in a best of 7 format, with each conference playing its own series, until the winner of the Eastern Conference playoffs squares off against the winner of the Western Conference playoffs.

More info here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_NBA_playoffs#Playoff_qualifying


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

james4beach said:


> I was going to post something about the Toronto Raptors winning tonight, but then it occurred to me that I don't understand what they won. Can someone explain to me how the NBA finals work? ....
> I think this will be far too complex to describe fully in a reply, but if someone knows of a good introduction resource, please post it. How do children learn all this?


It is not hard, though I am guessing you are not much of a sports fan.
It is a fairly common setup with the NHL using the same format, though a few details may be different.

There is a regular season that all teams play. At the end of the regular season of eighty two games, some teams are eliminated and some have qualified for the playoffs. The playoffs are where the best of seven (i.e. first to win four games) starts.

For the regular season, the Milwaukee Bucks were 1st in Eastern Conference with the Raptors 2nd while Warriors are 1st in Western Conference. This means all three qualified for the post season. Here is a link to the regular season results. https://www.nba.com/standings

The Raptors already beat the Bucks in the Eastern Conference Final. Playing against a Western team can only happen in the Championship final. As the Warriors are a Western team, beating them means the Raptors win the Championship.

Here is a link to the playoff progression or bracket that shows what teams the Raptors and Warriors had to beat in the best of seven format to meet in the Finals.
http://www.espn.com/nba/bracket

The first round section shows all the teams that qualified for the playoffs, based on the regular season standings. The Conference SemiFinals sections shows the teams that played each other in that round, in order to keep playing. The Conference Final section showed which teams played each other to advance to the Finals.

Here is the NHL bracket, where they have the two divisions on the left and right edges instead of vertically.
https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nhl...s-times-tv-channels/jz00sao3jfza12620zljz3f24


The NFL works in a similar fashion with one of the main differences that instead of a best of seven series of games, it is a single game to determine which team moves on and which team is eliminated from the playoffs.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/postseason/bracket


Cheers


*PS*
In case you start watching the FIFA Womens World Cup Soccer (WWC) in France that the Canadian Womens team is currently playing in, the setup is a similar one. 

There's a series of matches all teams play. Depending on the standings, some teams will advance to playoffs, where it is a single game that decides which team keeps playing for the championship.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

I am getting old.

The television announcers commented that for many Raptor fans this is the only major championship they remember for Toronto.

They didn't watch the Joe Carter home run or remember the awesome Blue Jays teams and World Series championship. 

They also don't remember Elvis, the Beatles, the Vietnam War, Nixon's impeachment, landing on the Moon, past great sports teams and players........and a whole lot of other events.

Yes, I am getting old.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

The Warriors were lucky to get their second win in Toronto, winning by just one point. The win last night was also very exciting with the Raptors leading going into the third period. Then they fell behind and only regained the lead late in the fourth period.

We used to get free tickets to the Vancouver Grizzlies. At the end of the first period, we would go up to the restaurant and have dinner right on the rail. But they could never get enough fan support to justify the growing costs of maintaining the roster.


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## OptsyEagle (Nov 29, 2009)

Is it possible to contact the citizen's of St. Louis and ask if they would be interested in trading their Stanley Cup for the Larry O'Brien NBA trophy. In my opinion, I would throw in Poutine and a Beavertail for everyone, as a bonus.

The 4th quarter is really the only interesting part of an NBA game, if you ask me. Better then Baseball though.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Eclectic12 said:


> It is not hard, though I am guessing you are not much of a sports fan.
> It is a fairly common setup with the NHL using the same format, though a few details may be different.


Ah, so there is a common structure across many sports... that explains a lot. I thought each of these leagues might have their own method.



> For the regular season, the Milwaukee Bucks were 1st in Eastern Conference with the Raptors 2nd while Warriors are 1st in Western Conference. This means all three qualified for the post season. Here is a link to the regular season results. https://www.nba.com/standings


Ah, interesting. So even though Raptors were not 1st in their Conference, they were high enough in the standings to qualify for the post season. Thanks!

Can you also explain why there are Divisions in addition to the Conferences? Where do the Divisions factor into all of this?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

https://zonecoverage.com/2018/timbe...the-unique-structure-of-divisions-in-the-nba/

https://sports.stackexchange.com/questions/20687/whats-the-purpose-of-division-standings-in-nba

P.S. I am more familiar with the NHL where division rivals play each other more often than teams in other divisions. They are "generally" geographically closer to each other too which creates greater rivalries.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

AltaRed said:


> https://zonecoverage.com/2018/timbe...the-unique-structure-of-divisions-in-the-nba/


Thanks


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

The party was good for business.

Moneris reported that credit card spending in Toronto was 700% above normal after the game, and 300% across all of Canada.

The Raptors, Blue Jays, Maple Leafs and Argos bring a lot of business into downtown Toronto. It is time for an NFL franchise in Canada.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

does anyone else find "We the North" somewhat...I dunno... racist....?


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

anyhoo...interesting to see so many multi- cultured, ethnic folks - who wouldnt know a full court press from a foul ball, a 5-second violation from a slapshot, or an alley-oop from touch-down, jumping on the raptors bandwagon...
mob mentality at its best!


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

jargey, basketball is extremely popular everywhere in the world. I would actually assume that the immigrants seen on TV celebrating the Raptors are serious basketball fans.

Great for the city and country's cohesiveness. My friends from Toronto report that the parties have started and are going straight through the weekend...


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Even the CBC National has featured The Raptors for the last 2 days...


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## Prairie Guy (Oct 30, 2018)

sags said:


> The Raptors, Blue Jays, Maple Leafs and Argos bring a lot of business into downtown Toronto. It is time for an NFL franchise in Canada.


Money spent on sports is money diverted and not spent elsewhere. People only have so much disposable income and every dollar spent on tickets is a dollar that won't be spent elsewhere. Other than hotels for visiting teams, there is little economic gain from sports franchises.

"If you ever had a consensus in economics, this would be it,” says Michael Leeds, a sports economist at Temple University. “There is no impact.”

Economists say the biggest reason sports teams don’t have much impact is that they don’t tend to spur new spending. Most people have a limited entertainment budget, so the dollars they are spending when they go to a game is money they would have spent elsewhere, maybe even at a restaurant or small businesses where more money would have stayed in the community."

https://www.marketplace.org/2015/03/19/are-pro-sports-teams-economic-winners-cities/


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## OptsyEagle (Nov 29, 2009)

Prairie Guy said:


> Money spent on sports is money diverted and not spent elsewhere. People only have so much disposable income and every dollar spent on tickets is a dollar that won't be spent elsewhere. Other than hotels for visiting teams, there is little economic gain from sports franchises.
> 
> "If you ever had a consensus in economics, this would be it,” says Michael Leeds, a sports economist at Temple University. “There is no impact.”
> 
> ...


Couldn't agree more. I enjoy Hockey and Football on TV, but could easily live without them. I have never personally bought a ticket to any professional games, since I have always felt the players way too over paid. I have no personal problem with it. If I was a player I would negotiate the highest price I could get as well. All I want to ensure, is that I do not contribute to it, except for the contribution I make watching the commercial on TV (I usually record 60 minutes minimum in advance of the game on Fibe so I can fast forward past commercials and intermissions anyway).

The other problem with our focus on professional sports is it can't help but instigate a focus on amateur sports. Specifically my concern is sports within the elementary/high school level. Even sport outside school but for children of that age group, can have an affect on their academic performance. All people tend to aspire for some amount of self-esteem. If their parents are sports focussed they tend to have a tendency to garner their self-esteem through sports. If their parents were not sports focused, they might attempt to garner their self-esteem from academic performance, since almost all parents are academic focused to some extent, with their children.

If I were Premier, all school sports, outside of physical education class, would be banned. It would save money, but more importantly it might save children...or it might not. I would probably do it for only the money savings alone and hope the children spend more time focussing on things that may have a larger impact on their lives, then sports.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Playing sports teaches kids a lot about teamwork. Physical activity does wonders for physical and mental health. Coachable kids develop a good work ethic etc. Too much focus on either sports or academic has its downfall.. a balance is best imo

But spectating sports is different than playing sports yourself. Unless you're watching a sport you play for the inspiration and knowledge of the game. I purposely try to spectate less and do more myself for the sake of my limited time. I refuse to watch any reg season but I will bandwagon on a good playoff run. I'll go to a professional game for the experience but I don't feel the need to go again, certainly not at playoff prices.

I never watched NBA before and I enjoyed watching Kawhi since his game 7 buzzer beater. The irony is not lost on me that he is not from Toronto nor Canada. Lots of US colleagues were cheering for Toronto so it was interesting to follow along


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I agree sports teaches a lot about teamwork, dedication, hard work and disappointment. It is a character builder, but of course as you say, moderation and balance is key. My sons played community soccer leagues as they grew up and have been better for it. Never encouraged them to play hockey since minor hockey was too 'nasty', having lost sight of what the program was meant to do in the first place. Think it has improved some but still obsessive with 'win at all costs' attitudes.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

I'm not sure there's much of a link between being a fan of professional sports, and actually being involved in sports and fitness.

Over the last few years I've been on various sports teams, which has been really fun -- good team experiences and personal growth. Sport is a routine in my life. And yet I have never been drawn to watching these big brand professional events, and have never bought a single ticket.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

james4beach said:


> And yet I have never been drawn to watching these big brand professional events, and have never bought a single ticket.


Maybe for the same reasons as I have: Big money, primadonna athletes with obscene salaries, outrageously high ticket prices, excessively long seasons (financial greed). When both hockey and basketball stretch into June, it is pretty obvious. Both sports should be done before the regular baseball season starts.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

AltaRed said:


> When both hockey and basketball stretch into June, it is pretty obvious. Both sports should be done before the regular baseball season starts.


and CFL Preseason is in full swing with regular games in a week or so.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

james4beach said:


> Ah, so there is a common structure across many sports... that explains a lot. I thought each of these leagues might have their own method ...


A lot depends on the number of teams and the time frame. The NHL, NBA, NFL have set number of teams with a relatively long regular season so they use this method.

Something like the FIFA World Cup has many more teams plus have a short time for the tournament so they are a bit different. There's years of qualifications to make the tournament. Draws to determine the four teams in each group (be the only strong team in the draw, you have an easier time getting to the knock out stage where other groups may have three strong teams - potentially meaning a contender is going to be eliminated). After that, it is win or go home with a set path to the final.

A tennis tournament is also random draw but is knock out all the way through (i.e. lose and you are out).

MLB plays an insane number of games for their regular season with few teams making the playoffs. Several times the Blue Jays had a really good year compared to what they had been playing but because another team had a slightly better year, they didn't make the playoffs.


The format is used by so many as it makes for an efficient way to determine the championship while maintaining interest.


The CFL has a small number of teams so while they follow the Division setup where normally, a Western team can only met an Eastern team in the final - there is the cross-over. If the fourth team in one division has a better regular season record than the third place team in the other division, the fourth place team "crosses over" to be the other division's third place playoff team (i.e. four teams from one division and two from the other in the playoffs instead of the usual three from each division).




james4beach said:


> ... Ah, interesting. So even though Raptors were not 1st in their Conference, they were high enough in the standings to qualify for the post season.


Yes ... an usually to encourage teams from compete to the end of the season instead of "we are in the playoffs, let's rest" - some sort of advantage is granted for finishing higher in the regular season standings. For example, in the CFL, finishing first in your division gives you an extra week off as well as home field (the second and third place teams have to play each other at the field of the second place finisher).




james4beach said:


> ... Can you also explain why there are Divisions in addition to the Conferences? Where do the Divisions factor into all of this?


Usually means there are a lot of teams in a close geographic area.

The NBA playoff format does not seem to factor in the divisions. In the NHL playoff format, winning the division means making the playoffs, even if compared to teams in other divisions have a better record.


Cheers


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

james4beach said:


> I'm not sure there's much of a link between being a fan of professional sports, and actually being involved in sports and fitness ...


Most of the fans I know have played the game they are watching (most not at the professional level). There's also many who play for fun then go to a bar to get some food/drinks and watch the pros.

I can only think of few who played zero sports but became interested in watching a pro sport.


Cheers


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

jargey3000 said:


> does anyone else find "We the North" somewhat...I dunno... racist....?


In what way?

I see it as highlighting that the Raptors is the one team left that is outside the US.




jargey3000 said:


> anyhoo...interesting to see so many multi- cultured, ethnic folks - who wouldnt know a full court press from a foul ball, a 5-second violation from a slapshot, or an alley-oop from touch-down, jumping on the raptors bandwagon...
> mob mentality at its best!


What makes you think few would know about basketball?
According to links, something over twenty six million Americans play basketball while world wide, over four hundred and fifty million play.


Cheers


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

kcowan said:


> and CFL Preseason is in full swing with regular games in a week or so.


Not this year ... the last pre-season game was June 7th.

The regular season started with game one on June 13th, game two was last night June 14th and games three and four go tonight.
https://www.cfl.ca/schedule/#week-1

The CFL decided the games were too crammed and decided to start the regular season earlier as well as give more bye weeks during the year.


Cheers


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

Eclectic12 said:


> In what way?
> 
> I see it as highlighting that the Raptors is the one team left that is outside the
> 
> ...


why is it "We the North"
and not "We are the North"


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Better hashtag perhaps? https://toronto.citynews.ca/2014/04...nch-we-the-north-campaign-celebrating-canada/


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Yea it's an internet thing. Probably dates back to archives such as ICHC "I can has cheezburger" Kind of like not capitalizing names and dropping vowels/words such as jalopnik "because racecar"

Wiki: ICHC popularized snowclones such as "I'm in your (noun), (verb ending in ing) your (noun)"; " [some activity or emotion], ur doin it right/wrong"; and "I gave/brought you [something] but I eated it/uzed it all up"

NBA has apparently done well to attract a younger and more diverse fan base than say the Leafs with their basic gray suit fans and Don Cherry calling out anything nontraditional like the classless North Carolina "bunch of jerks"

Anything "traditional" is the fastest way to turn away potential young fans today. The Raptors are apparently worth more than the Leafs now


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

The economic costs and benefits were heavily debated in our city, when a new arena for our Junior A team was contemplated.

The building went ahead and the city has benefited enormously. 

The hockey team sells out for every game (9000 fans) and the venue hosts all kinds of top level entertainment that previously didn't visit our city.

This week the Cirque du Soleil Corteo is in town and tickets are sold out for all performances. 

The venue was built downtown and has anchored major redevelopment in the area. Luxury apartments and condos, restaurants and bars have sprung up around the building.

The local community college has located some off site programs in the immediate area as well. The area used to be run down and falling apart.

The adjacent main street was turned into a "flex street" that is closed for local festivals or events. The entire road is available for vendors and people.

It was recently used for a local Jurassic Park for the Raptor playoffs. The area used to be run down tat parlors and pawn shops.

The city is now debating a new casino/hotel in the city. Hopefully, they can work out a fair deal because these types of projects have a big impact.

Like the old saying goes.......you have to spend money to make money.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

deleted


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

jargey3000 said:


> Eclectic12 said:
> 
> 
> > jargey3000 said:
> ...


Leaving out the word "are" makes it racist? :rolleyes2: 

I still don't follow what is potentially racist.



Cheers


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## Prairie Guy (Oct 30, 2018)

sags said:


> The economic costs and benefits were heavily debated in our city, when a new arena for our Junior A team was contemplated.
> 
> The building went ahead and the city has benefited enormously.
> 
> ...


It has been proven time and time again that stadiums and arenas create very little new money...they just redistribute money that already exists.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Eclectic12 said:


> Leaving out the word "are" makes it racist? :rolleyes2:
> 
> I still don't follow what is potentially racist.


We Da North might be racist but We The North is just internet/twitter speak.


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