# 20 year+ Long term lease?



## Bucci (Jan 12, 2015)

What do you think about signing a long term with LL for a cottage on their property? Say for 20 years. What happens if they sell the property for example? Or they pass away. That would be my main question.

If i'm paying $1300 a month including utilities do you think it would be better to get a separate meter, maybe negotiate down to $1000 a month? What about tax increases? I'm thinking of spending 5-10k in renovation after that it would be a good place. It would be worth it. Perhaps 1-2 months free while renovating.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

I would view it as the tenant holding all the cards.

From a landlord's perspective............

It would devalue the landlord's property, as the lease would have to be included and honored in any sale of the property. 

If the tenant passed away, the lease would be nullified.

If the tenant experienced financial troubles, the length of the lease would be of little value to them.

The lease would have to include yearly increases in the rent, as the landlord's cost rose over time.

As a tenant..............I would welcome my landlord offering a long term lease. We have spent considerable money renovating our rented town house with our own money and it would protect our investment. Our landlord is a private family business who own 1200 rental units, and kicking us out is unlikely, but there is nothing legally to prevent them from deciding to liquidate part or all of their rental units. As I understand it, according to the rental act we would have first option to buy our unit if it is put up for sale, and most likely would do that. It could become a problem if all the units were sold to another company or REIT.

We love where we are, the rent is affordable, we are retired so we don't have to move for work, and we have and will continually upgrade the unit with our own money to keep the monthly rent at the current level, so I would consider a long term lease as a bonus.

We have already been here for 10 years, and it feels like we moved in last week...........so 20 years isn't that long a time really.

I am not sure the landlord would consider it in the same light though.

I think they are happy to collect the monthly rent on time, have no problems, and watch us upgrade the unit for them.


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## OhGreatGuru (May 24, 2009)

What happens if you no longer want to rent the cottage? (A lot can change in 20 years.) Can you terminate the lease or assign it to someone else?

Otherwise, it sounds like a good deal for the tenant.


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## MoreMiles (Apr 20, 2011)

You really have to stop dreaming. You already want to sue her then you expect her to sell you or lease you at unfavourable terms? Am I the only one here finding your dream unrealistic here?

http://canadianmoneyforum.com/showthread.php/32153-Buying-a-cottage


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## birdman (Feb 12, 2013)

I would suggest you consider getting legal advice and in particular in regards to whether or not the lease should be registered on title. I would think this would provide you with protection should the owner decide to sell the property or dies as I would think that the lease, if registered on the title, would still be in effect-similar to a mortgage. My understanding that the lease is of little value unless it is registered. When I was in the lending business and registered a mortgage (usually commercial) there were often registered leases and our mortgage would be behind these and in the case of foreclosure our mortgage would be subject to the lease. You would need to check this out further to ascertain the advantages and disadvantages of registering.


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## Berubeland (Sep 6, 2009)

There is no reason for your landlord to sign a long term lease, or even a one year lease for that matter. The facts are that 99% of the time tenants break leases there is no ramification. And you cannot file for eviction for persistent late payment of rent or use by family until the term of the lease is over.


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## Just a Guy (Mar 27, 2012)

First off, I think reading your other post is more than enough evidence as to why this would be a very bad idea for a landlord. If not bad enough, go read the other self proclaimed "ideal tenant" none's postings.

"Ideal tenants" such as the two of you makes me wish there was a website where we could report the names and use it as a first point of screening.

While I have no issues renewing a lease to a good tenant for many years, often without any rate increases to keep them, I'd never go much longer than a single year at a time.

Many things can happen. The costs could increase substantially due to hyperinflation (rare, but possible). In that case, taxes could easily outstrip the rent, even though the actual "cost" relative to income doesn't really change.

The good tenant can run into problems and become bad tenants...alcohol, drugs, divorce, depression, accidents, job loss, etc. can all change people in dramatic ways.

There is no upside for a landlord to signing a long term lease, and many pitfalls. Heck, I'd bet that even renting to family members in such a case may be cause for regret.


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## MoreMiles (Apr 20, 2011)

Bucci, you obviously like that place A LOT! It is very apparent that you are trying to find every excuse possible to get that place for cheap. So far you have tried to complained about her furniture and house quality. It's almost as if you wish there is a way just to take her house title without any payment.

If the real issue about how bad her place is, you would have come here to ask how to leave the rental. But no, you have come to here to ask how to take over the place, either to buy it or lease it long term with no possibility of lease cancellation. Why would you want to rent it more if it is really that bad as you claimed?

I really hope you are not trying to scam this poor 80 something year old woman.


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

In England such long leases are common. 21 years, 50 years, 99 years, I have heard of 500 year and 1000 year leases.

The remainder of such leases can be sold by the tenant if he wishes to move. They survive the tenant's death unless the lease says different, and they go with the property if the owner sells or dies.

You will need to consult a lawyer, and leases of 3 years or longer can be registered against the deed at the registry office.


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## MoreMiles (Apr 20, 2011)

I think people are talking apples and oranges here. For example In China, real estate cannot be 'owned' so you buy this long term lease right. I guess in UK you can buy something similar. But the lease itself is consider an asset or real estate interest, with an expiration date. 

I think the OP is trying to sign a long term lease for free. I am pretty sure he is not interested in paying let's say $100,000 lump sum in exchange for a transferable secure long term lease. I have a feeling that he thinks he is doing the landlord a favor by offering such long lease. But I may be wrong.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

With the hot-house market the way it is now, no residential landlord in his/her right mind would sign a lease for more than 2 years (even with all months' rent pre-paid) in Toronto, let alone 20 years.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Long term leases are fairly common in vacation property.

There are a few cottages in Algonquin Park and on native band lands all around Ontario that are long term leased..........like 50 or 99 year leases.

Condo and fractional share has become more common in expensive areas.

Someone comes in and buys an old established resort on a lake.........and then sells the cottages individually with shared lands or sells timeshares by the week.

Given the press coverage of the different situations, it seems to create some problems.


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## Davis (Nov 11, 2014)

In a previous string, Bucci has described his landlord as a bully and a liar who is trying to scam people. He says she forced him to sign a lease prohibiting overnight guests in a cottage with would in the walls and no vents. And now he wants to sign a 20-year lease with her? I am beginning to smell a troll here. If this is a real situation, the executors of her estate could apply to have the lease annulled on the basis that it would make no sense for an 84-year-old to sign a 20-year lease unless she was being pressured or scammed by the tenant.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

From time to time, we have a few posters who ask the same questions in different ways, or strange kinds of questions.

I remember one poster who wanted to know how he could force his parents to give him his inheritance right away. He wanted advice on how to "take over" of his parents finances.

That went over like a lead balloon............LOL..........


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