# Tenor of this forum



## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

I know I will never meet any of you simply because of the main topic ..money which is the base. 

So the tenor of this place is quite different from other hang-out Internet where I've been for quite a number of years. There are a number of retirees, or near there also. No we don't always talk about cycling, travelling, etc. But there is an espirit de corps ...so much that there are impromptu gifts sent to a member had surgery/sick or lost a loved one. Then of course, because it is predominantly men, there's some verbal horseplay and other minor hijinks. 

And we carefully post photos of whatever, including ourselves. Wearing cycling gear can mask a bit.  on the 'Net. For sure, some of these other folks, have met one another while on vacation or biz trips. The geographic spread includes all areas of the U.S. There's only these CAnadians: air pilot who flies worldwide billionaire's jet, a RCMP officer who is also a diver, a former long-haul cross-Canada truck driver and me.

And the women there, the few there, are like this forum, are people who strike me as pragmatic and confident (as a woman cycling on long trips, commuting one needs become very practical). I have met 1 member...in New Mexico. A great vacation place which I don't know if many Canadians even think to go there. Here is the profile of the other women who are /have been cyclists in the other forum: 

a former high school teacher, who has Down's syndrome young adult son
 an executive director for residential health facility with children with severe disabilities
a mountain biker with multiple sclerosis, who somehow sold some FANG stocks and built a house with nurse-hubby in Oregon
senior VP manager who is a kind person who has a frog avatar riding tricycle
 a woman who is a property manager for highrise condo retirement facility
Most people on the other place, know what I look like and my public blog.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Clearly I've lobbed a wierd football with this topic. 

I sense alot of visitors just get stick to the numbers and look for useful tips/financial stuff. And I know I won't be taken seriously unless I score a fantastic technique that is tax efficient or just sheer luck on stock market.
May I bow gracefully for this big perhaps accurate guess how I read this whole forum?


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I'd say you're not getting much engagement because you didn't really post a discussion starter/question.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I consider this forum to be mostly about Money topics much like Financial Wisdom Forum where Canadian investors meet for financial education and empowerment. I don't need to know anyone personally and actually one can be more frank/revealing in their postings if they remain anonymous. 

That said, over time, the volume of postings and topics by any one individual can result, in some cases, a fairly reasonable profile (but not identity) of who a particular member is in real life.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

andrewf said:


> I'd say you're not getting much engagement because you didn't really post a discussion starter/question.


Ok....how can we jazz up this place. I think the foundational topic of finance/money makes people very straight and tight in the online chatter.

This is why I have posted topics...which clearly are about money ...but more about attitudes, habits and people relationships. It is after HIGHLY influential. It can wreck marriages, family relationships and some friendships. It can also give a boost if given under the right conditions for folks who understand how to manage it.

I know I have lost credibility for folks who want know financial tips, legislative intracacies of tax law. Well, too bad. And being cyclist with no car, I have very little status here.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I don't see it that way. My opinion is you have had a reasonable response to topics you have started. Members will only respond if they have something they want to say.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

And I did work in a tax law library for a major global firm. Before that, I had not idea about the range of tax "havens". Obscure countries. Geez. Yes, I do now have an opinion about corporate tax and the very wealthy.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

I am the wrong person in some cases for folks here probably because where I did work....and also my family background, upbringing.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

All have to say I'm super grateful to have raised in the family....it keeps me super grounded. My mother doesn't speak English....she did get her citizenship..20 years later. We coached her how answer some of the questions. Now we can barely explain probate to her because of communication gaps...fluency when children lose mother tongue. This really happens more often than you can even dream of.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

I think you're making some assumptions @jlunfirst when it comes to other's opinions and reactions to you. I'm sure most people are neutral in their opinion of you and your credibility. After all, you only joined two weeks ago.

I read your original post but didn't know what to make of it, and didn't have anything to add, so I didn't write anything.


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## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

[This post intentionally left blank.]


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

james4beach said:


> I think you're making some assumptions @jlunfirst when it comes to other's opinions and reactions to you. I'm sure most people are neutral in their opinion of you and your credibility. After all, you only joined two weeks ago.
> 
> I read your original post but didn't know what to make of it, and didn't have anything to add, so I didn't write anything.


I'd kind of echo this position. I don't think the regulars here tend to care that much about the level of expertise others have or 'status'. Some folks here are kind of aggressively wrong about many subjects and proud of getting their 'education' from cable tv. But the vast majority of people who approach a topic with a degree of humility and intellectual honesty will tend to elicit pretty positive discussions.

Frankly, I think this forum has become a bit too much of a political discussion ground. There aren't many newbies asking for advice, or maybe I'm just burned out on responding to those threads so I don't pay them much mind.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

andrewf said:


> I'd kind of echo this position. I don't think the regulars here tend to care that much about the level of expertise others have or 'status'. Some folks here are kind of aggressively wrong about many subjects and proud of getting their 'education' from cable tv. But the vast majority of people who approach a topic with a degree of humility and intellectual honesty will tend to elicit pretty positive discussions.
> 
> Frankly, I think this forum has become a bit too much of a political discussion ground. There aren't many newbies asking for advice, or maybe I'm just burned out on responding to those threads so I don't pay them much mind.


Interesting. It goes to show maybe folks want to talk about interesting stuff which skitters off money. But not knowing strangers at all (what an oxymoron), maybe politics is the only thing to spice it up. For sure money.....we can't pretend how it is generated is totally, under our absolute control. It can be to some extent, by minimizing tv and not reading the news. 

I just think there is a deeply human side ...to money.


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

I am with Andrew and j4b. The regulars here don't take all that much notice of who comes and goes, their provenance, or what they have to say. 

My guess is that many here are like me. They have lives outside of this place and don't take time to read all that gets posted. I tend to look at the titles/subject of new posts. Often that tells me nothing of interest for me there and I don't read that thread. Sometimes a thread really has little, if anything, to say about money, finance, investing. Some are plainly about travel experience, experience or thoughts about Covid-19, etc. I often get drawn to non-finance "human interest" threads. Politics, not so much. I find any discussion there a waste of time, just as I find it a waste of time to vote in any election. I already know that, regardless of winner, my life won't change a whit, apart from paying more taxes. But, that's just me. Some really love the politics stuff. 

I recognize that I don't add a lot of value as a member. I don't invest in, or pay much attention to, stocks, bonds, or much else. I have a very static portfolio of real estate, including some forest lands, that is of interest to no one else. I have practiced law and now and again I can help out with a legal issue that gets bruited about the forum. 

The vexing issue of "retirement" gets a lot of play on the forum. Even there, my thoughts are never more than inchoate at best. So, I have nothing worthwhile to offer others. I tend to think, however, if in one's earning years (earning by whatever means), one has done a fair job, then one should largely be relieved what sounds like the burdensome task of "retirement planning". If you have your financial house in order, you should be okay without having to fuss with "spreadsheets" and engaging in a microscopic examination of one's finances. You know you are ready to retire, in my view, when you have confidence that you have sufficient resources to see you and your family to the end of your days, in comfort, living life as you want, regardless of financial meltdowns, rising or falling interest rates or bond prices, real estate crashes, and so on. At that point, the details are unimportant. 

So, please carry on jlunfirst. From what you have revealed, your background and experience is not typical of those here (not that any one of us can fairly be said to be "typical"). But that means you will have perspectives and views to share some of us here might find of interest/beneficial from time to time. No one here is forced to read anything that holds no interest for them.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Mukhang pera said:


> I am with Andrew and j4b. The regulars here don't take all that much notice of who comes and goes, their provenance, or what they have to say.
> 
> My guess is that many here are like me. They have lives outside of this place and don't take time to read all that gets posted. I tend to look at the titles/subject of new posts. Often that tells me nothing of interest for me there and I don't read that thread. Sometimes a thread really has little, if anything, to say about money, finance, investing. Some are plainly about travel experience, experience or thoughts about Covid-19, etc. I often get drawn to non-finance "human interest" threads. Politics, not so much. I find any discussion there a waste of time, just as I find it a waste of time to vote in any election. I already know that, regardless of winner, my life won't change a whit, apart from paying more taxes. But, that's just me. Some really love the politics stuff.
> 
> ...


Other than planning finances for retirement, I find I'm safer not to play around too much with stocks and TRY to stay happy with what I have so far. Part of career, has been a law librarian for over 15 years plus additional work in engineering libraries where part of it led to legal research because of casework our govn't engineers work involved as expert witnesses for court and coroner's inquests. So from info. provision and research side I've worked in all parts of Canada's justice system: in courts/for the judges (Ont.Court of Appeal), B.C. legal aid, regulatory enforcement (fire code), 1 global firm and 1 national law firm. 

My comment is: it is tough to be an unrepresented litigant. Yes absolutely, the rich have their lawyers, including tax lawyer. And posse of ordinary layperson can't even begin to attack the Income Tax Act, because it's so arcane and technical. I am aware tax law is many other lawyers in other practice areas is just too technical and boring to them. (well, building and fire codes are too, but they require engineers for proper use alot of the time).


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

I feel very much to have seen (at arm's length) in my career, problems of the very rich and....very poor, marginalized. Of course, in a way, I actually lived it also....in my childhood and now, a nice middle class life.


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## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

andrewf said:


> Frankly, I think this forum has become a bit too much of a political discussion ground. There aren't many newbies asking for advice, or maybe I'm just burned out on responding to those threads so I don't pay them much mind.


With political discussion, the bar is extremely low. I feel political discussions in this forum are a success, in that I have picked up bits of information by reading them. Sure, they are high noise, low content threads but they are better than I have seen anywhere else.

IMO, this forum has good discussions on a wide range of topics.

Even where intractable differences of opinion exist, nasty posts are limited to about 5 posters who are easily filtered with either the ignore feature or simply skipping their posts.

As for newbies, I wouldn't discount the idea that very few fresh questions exist, at this point. Any information you might want can be had with the search function. CMF is a beaver lodge that has the best reading library in the country, on matters of Canadian finance.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

TomB16 said:


> Even where intractable differences of opinion exist, nasty posts are limited to about 5 posters who are easily filtered with either the ignore feature or simply skipping their posts.
> 
> As for newbies, I wouldn't discount the idea that very few fresh questions exist, at this point. Any information you might want can be had with the search function. CMF is a beaver lodge that has the best reading library in the country, on matters of Canadian finance.


  Love the beaver lodge gathering imagery. A solo beaver is very clever, working underwater in their twig, branch mansion and disrupting a river waterflow. At least in our area. Just amazing creatures and um, kinda selfish, since they destroy trees around them, frustrating municipal staff trying to preserve the forest. I guess it's apt for folks here, trying to manage their portfolios.


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## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

Beavers tend to be highly disruptive in our area, also.


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## Numbersman61 (Jan 26, 2015)

I am here primarily to discuss financial and tax matters. I review titles and if a title appears interesting, I‘ll check it out. I participate in other forums - Red Flags, Financial Wisdom, and Serbinski. I’m a retired CPA whose career included - partner in public accounting firm, co-founder of a small boutique brokerage firm, senior officer (CFO, CEO) of junior public energy firms and independent director of a number of energy service companies. Other than CPP, I have no pension income; my wife and I enjoy a comfortable lifestyle due to the income from our investments. My wife does receive CPP and a monthly pension of about $3,500. 
Although I carefully follow political matters, I rarely participate in political discussions in any forums.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Numbersman61 said:


> I am here primarily to discuss financial and tax matters. I review titles and if a title appears interesting, I‘ll check it out. I participate in other forums - Red Flags, Financial Wisdom, and Serbinski. I’m a retired CPA whose career included - partner in public accounting firm, co-founder of a small boutique brokerage firm, senior officer (CFO, CEO) of junior public energy firms and independent director of a number of energy service companies. Other than CPP, I have no pension income; my wife and I enjoy a comfortable lifestyle due to the income from our investments. My wife does receive CPP and a monthly pension of about $3,500.
> Although I carefully follow political matters, I rarely participate in political discussions in any forums.


You're curious in a practical way.
It would be equivalent of me hanging out in a forum on reading literacy or technology literacy...2 areas that are related to my profession. But I haven't done that for awhile.  I personally find for past few years, my present job and demands of corporate software changes for a large, complex employer and internal client work, keeps me constantly learning something new every few days. A good thing. I also have a job where do group employee training for 4 different courses, so I must revisit and update the curriculum to keep pace with corporate broader changes.

Which means I'm not even monitoring recent professional literature for the past few years.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

My job is part of a central team that supports the entire organization. We are the last resort or better, they should come to us first to save confusion/ alot of wasted time. So I need to keep my knowledge and skill level on-point and strong ....to also continue to teach employees corporately as well guide them, with their problems.


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## Numbersman61 (Jan 26, 2015)

I’ve been retired for 12 years (current age 81) so I have lots of time on my hands. I subscribe to numerous publications- local paper, Globe and Mail, Washington Post, Wall Street Journal and The Economist. I also read all the decisions of the Tax Court of Canada.


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

Beavers are a scourge indeed, as the following exchange between the Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Quality and a landowner illustrates.

















*Dear Mr. DeVries:*




*It has come to the attention of the Department of Environmental Quality that there has been recent unauthorized activity on the above-referenced parcel of property. You have been certified as the legal landowner and/or contractor who did the following unauthorized activity:*




*Construction and maintenance of two wood debris dams across the outlet stream of Spring Pond.*




*A permit must be issued prior to the start of this type of activity.  A review of the Department's files shows that no permits have been issued therefore, the Department has determined that this activity is in violation of Part 301, Inland Lakes and Streams, of the Natural Resource and Environmental Protection Act, Act 451 of the Public Acts of 1994, being sections 324.30101 to 324.30113 of the Pennsylvania Compiled Laws, annotated.*




*The Department has been informed that one or both of the dams partially failed during a recent rain event, causing debris and flooding at downstream locations. We find that dams of this nature are inherently hazardous and cannot be permitted. The Department therefore orders you to cease and desist all activities at this location,  
 and to restore the stream to a free-flow condition by removing all wood and brush forming the dams from the stream channel.  All restoration work shall be completed no later than January 31, 2010.*




*Please notify this office when the restoration has been completed so that a follow-up site inspection may be scheduled by our staff. Failure to comply with this request or any further unauthorized activity on the site may result in this case being referred for elevated enforcement action.*




*We anticipate and would appreciate your full cooperation in this matter. Please feel free to contact me at this office if you have any questions.

Sincerely, David L. Price 
District Representative and Water Management Division  

~~~



The actual response sent back by Mr. DeVries:

Re: DEQ File No.. 97-59-0023; T11N; R10W, Sec. 20; Lycoming County

Dear Mr. Price,*



*Your certified letter dated 11/17/09 has been handed to me.  

 I am the legal landowner but not the Contractor at 2088 Dagget Lane, Trout Run, Pennsylvania.
A couple of beavers are in the process of constructing and maintaining  two wood 'debris' dams across the outlet stream of my Spring Pond. While I did not pay for, authorize, nor supervise their dam project, I think they would be highly offended that you call their skillful use of nature's building materials 'debris.'

I would like to challenge your department to attempt to emulate their dam project any time and/or any place you choose. I believe I can safely state there is no way you could ever match their dam skills, their dam resourcefulness, their dam ingenuity, their dam persistence, their dam determination and/or their dam work ethic.

















These are the beavers/contractors you are seeking.  

 As to your request, I do not think the beavers are aware that they must first fill out a dam permit prior to the start of this type of dam activity*.

*My first dam question to you is: (1) Are you trying to discriminate against my Spring Pond Beavers, or (2) Do you require all beavers throughout this State to conform to said Dam request?

If you are not discriminating against these particular beavers, through the Freedom of Information Act,  I request completed copies of all those other applicable beaver dam permits that have been issued. (Perhaps we will see if there really is a dam violation of Part 301, Inland Lakes and Streams, of the Natural Resource and Environmental Protection Act, Act 451 of the Public Acts of 1994,  being sections 324.30101 to 324.30113 of the Pennsylvania Compiled Laws, annotated.)

I have several dam concerns. My first dam concern is, aren't the beavers entitled to legal representation?  The Spring Pond Beavers are financially destitute and are unable to pay for said representation so the State will have to provide them with a dam lawyer. The Department's dam concern that either one or both of the dams failed during a recent rain event, causing flooding, is proof that this is a natural occurrence, which the Department is required to protect. In other words, we should leave the Spring Pond Beavers alone rather than harassing them and calling them dam names.

If you want the damed stream 'restored' to a dam free-flow condition please contact the beavers -- but if you are going to arrest them, they obviously did not pay any attention to your dam letter, they being unable to read English.

In my humble opinion, the Spring Pond Beavers have a right to build their unauthorized dams as long as the sky is blue, the grass is green and water flows downstream.  They have more dam rights than I do to live and enjoy Spring Pond. If the Department of Natural Resources and Environmental Protection lives up to its name, it should protect the natural resources (Beavers) and the environment (Beavers' Dams).

So, as far as the beavers and I are concerned, this dam case can be referred for more elevated enforcement action right now. Why wait until 1/31/2010? The Spring Pond Beavers may be under the dam ice by then and there will be no way for you or your dam staff to contact/harass them.

In conclusion, I would like to bring your attention to a real environmental quality, health, problem in the area... It is the bears! Bears are actually defecating in our woods. I definitely believe you should be persecuting the defecating bears and leave the beavers alone.  If you are going to investigate the beaver dam, watch your dam step!  The bears are not careful where they dump!

Being unable to comply with your dam request, and being unable to contact you on your dam answering machine, I am sending this response to your dam office.*




*Thank you,*




*Ryan DeVries & The DAM BEAVERS
*


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Mukhang pera said:


> Beavers are a scourge indeed, as the following exchange between the Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Quality and a landowner illustrates.
> 
> View attachment 23969
> View attachment 23970
> ...


  So funny!


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

Mukhang pera said:


> Beavers are a scourge indeed, as the following exchange between the Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Quality and a landowner illustrates.
> 
> View attachment 23969
> View attachment 23970
> ...


 ... a dam excellent post!


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

jlunfirst said:


> Other than planning finances for retirement, I find I'm safer not to play around too much with stocks and TRY to stay happy with what I have so far. Part of career, has been a law librarian for over 15 years plus additional work in engineering libraries where part of it led to legal research because of casework our govn't engineers work involved as expert witnesses for court and coroner's inquests. So from info. provision and research side I've worked in all parts of Canada's justice system: in courts/for the judges (Ont.Court of Appeal), B.C. legal aid, regulatory enforcement (fire code), 1 global firm and 1 national law firm.
> 
> My comment is: it is tough to be an unrepresented litigant. Yes absolutely, the rich have their lawyers, including tax lawyer. And posse of ordinary layperson can't even begin to attack the Income Tax Act, because it's so arcane and technical. I am aware tax law is many other lawyers in other practice areas is just too technical and boring to them. (well, building and fire codes are too, but they require engineers for proper use alot of the time).


Interesting that you are a law librarian. I have a Master of Library Science degree in addition to my D. Juris. But, never really worked as a law librarian. 

You are right about the unenviable lot of unrepresented litigants. "Justice is open to every man; just like the Ritz Hotel."

Tax law is decidedly a specialized field. There is no such thing as having a law practice that involves doing "a little bit of tax". The only ones who can do a good job are the ones who do nothing but tax. I ran a successful tax appeal last year, but acting pro bono for a friend and I took it on because it involved a narrow tax issue I happened to know something about. As well, because he was not paying me, I was not too worried about what would happen if we did not succeed. 

I do not do pro bono litigation work unless I am confident of success. To work pro bono and lose would suck. But, I now try to avoid anything litigious. Not interested in fighting anymore. I have two Provincial Court matters outstanding and have promised myself no more once they are done.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Mukhang pera said:


> Interesting that you are a law librarian. I have a Master of Library Science degree in addition to my D. Juris. But, never really worked as a law librarian.
> 
> You are right about the unenviable lot of unrepresented litigants. "Justice is open to every man; just like the Ritz Hotel."
> 
> ...


Got my MLS awhile ago. Then threw myself into the fire of personal computers for work, Internet that transformed ours, everyone's work and business processes. I moved over to e-records and content management. It included working at a major engineering project for the Golden Ears Bridge for global foreign engineering firm in Metro Vancouver. When I mentioned engineering libraries....it was fire protection engineering meaning the disciplines of civil, mechanical, electrical and chemical are focused on fire safety design and fire code enforcement. It was the these govn't engineers working with assigned lawyer to craft fire code changes for Ontario (actually expansion) which put it ahead of the National Fire Code at the time. Then another subject area was firefighter, emergency planning, etc. I was with the Min. of Solicitor General and our group did work with OPP and Forensic Centre on certain investigative cases.

People think working in govn't is boring. They clearly haven't explored what all different govn't ministries/depts. do.
Well if they are looking for instant action and no collaboration, then to private. Govn't offers incredible array of functions and services....way more than any 1 private firm. However I would recommend to young graduate, to first work in private sector before joining govn't. One needs to understand the thinking and pacing of private sector so on govn't side, one develop better strategy and services.

My current role only has me working for limited time, 1 of our internal lawyers, on a narrow range of matters so we are in compliance. I am the staff person to work with the lawyer on behalf for my team, plus my boss occasionally. I still do legal research but it doesn't compare to the complexity I used to do and teach also. I don't have access to full range of fee-based specialty legal research tools that the general public can't normally access.

I was a little surprised by some of the arcane provisions in the Income Tax Act. Clearly it was a little clutch of tax lawyers that lobbied the federal govn't for the technical change to benefit a small group of tax payers. And all the flowcharts that tax lawyer maps out...um. Sure. A brother-in-law was a securities lawyer for the Ontario Securities Commission for 15 years or more before retiring. For certain, he is the right and only family person left to manage his 95 yr. old mother's accounts/portfolio. She is very lucky to have her son's expertise.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Beavers in any kind of populated area are seen as highly disruptive pests. My alma mater made national news after trapping and killing some beavers that were taking down some trees along a creek running through campus. I think the concern being that if they dammed the creek, it would cause significant flooding and water management risk.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Could one of these guys be The Tenor of this forum?


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## Faramir (11 mo ago)

This forum is definitely dominated by liberals. Which I don't quite understand. If you are a MSNBC watching liberal should you not be participating in the profit culture of the stock market? I mean all profit should go to the worker, correct? As Marx described. I've always wanted to ask this question and I am not trying to be rude.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Faramir said:


> This forum is definitely dominated by liberals. Which I don't quite understand. If you are a MSNBC watching liberal should you not be participating in the profit culture of the stock market? I mean all profit should go to the worker, correct? As Marx described. I've always wanted to ask this question and I am not trying to be rude.


?
That's the world we live in, where people thing liberal means socialist.

Look at the actual classical definition, real liberals recognize the threat of government control.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Faramir said:


> This forum is definitely dominated by liberals. Which I don't quite understand. If you are a MSNBC watching liberal should you not be participating in the profit culture of the stock market? I mean all profit should go to the worker, correct? As Marx described. I've always wanted to ask this question and I am not trying to be rude.


 Hopefully in real life, you don't think this black 'n white way. The real world is not like that and when it is, serious hurtful war starts.

For some of us, who have seen real people, some family members NOT get legislated holidays, NOT get paid vacation which is illegal for many provincial jursidictions, then that has nothing to do with "liberal" views. Any time, decency, humane treatment people is required that's not even liberalism. It is really is civil order, equity, occupational safety because you shouldn't overwork employees. That's why we have such legislation in place, though I realize new, non-English /non-French speaking immigrants can be/are exploited.

Hiring people according to the posted skills requirements, education/formal training, etc., but not on marital status, colour/race nor ethnicity is not liberal nor "woke" requirements. 

I do feel because I have worked hard, trained formally and appropriately to get to where I am now, that I might have some thoughts to offer to some younger folks, if they need it. If they don't care, carry on and learn in whatever you want, fall hard in whatever hole you wish.

It isn't all about Me, me, me, me and offering nothing.


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## Faramir (11 mo ago)

jlunfirst said:


> Hopefully in real life, you don't think this black 'n white way. The real world is not like that and when it is, serious hurtful war starts.
> 
> For some of us, who have seen real people, some family members NOT get legislated holidays, NOT get paid vacation which is illegal for many provincial jursidictions, then that has nothing to do with "liberal" views. Any time, decency, humane treatment people is required that's not even liberalism. It is really is civil order, equity, occupational safety because you shouldn't overwork employees. That's why we have such legislation in place, though I realize new, non-English /non-French speaking immigrants can be/are exploited.
> 
> ...


My conclusion came to be after seeing how many here read the far left Globe and Mail. And CBC. And CNN. And worst of all leftist organizations - MSNBC.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Faramir said:


> My conclusion came to be after seeing how many here read the far left Globe and Mail. And CBC. And CNN. And worst of all leftist organizations - MSNBC.


I don't spend alot of time figuring out the political tendencies of Internet forum members, Faramir. It's not useful to begin assuming about Internet people when one hasn't even met them in person.

Understand that both Globe and Mail plus CBC, both cover a much wider range of news topics on a daily basis. National Post simply does not have that wide diverse subject matter coverage. Financial Post is restricted to biz/finance. They probably can't afford to pay for more reporters to write more different articles daily. CBC is FREE which makes a huge difference....to all Canadians. Global, CTV and City news websites I find are very weak in breadth of daily news, international news...in writing. Not just video broadcasts which are often soundbytes anyway. Unless I want the evidence of live video footage.

David Thomson, the owner /CEO for Woodbridge co. in north of Toronto, owns Reuters, the worldwide news publishing and fee-based legal, business research databases also. He has said publicly that his company treasures Globe and Mail, and sees it as important news media nationally. I'm glad he wants to maintain this newspaper. It's abit like J. Bezos owning Washington Post.

Just because a person gives CBC links, doesn't mean they are left-leaning. It's ALL about access --or if you are willing to pay to get beyond the paywall.

It is unfortunate but for Canadian news developments we can't go to international sources, because other countries don't have a priority to report on anything often about CAnada. Their primary audience is barely/not even interested.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

jlunfirst said:


> I don't spend alot of time figuring out the political tendencies of Internet forum members, Faramir. It's not useful to begin assuming about Internet people when one hasn't even met them in person.
> 
> Understand that both Globe and Mail plus CBC cover a much wider range of news topics on a daily basis. National Post simply does not have that wide diverse subject matter coverage compared t Financial Post is restricted to biz/finance. They probably can't afford to pay for more reporters to write more different articles daily. CBC is FREE which makes a huge difference....to all Canadians. Global, CTV and City news websites I find are very weak in breadth of daily news, international news...in writing. Not just video broadcast.
> 
> ...


Sorry to do this analysis: I do have an interest in news media, journalism in general....and professionally, I do know something more about the publishing industry and paywalls: library directors and librarians must negotiate thousands, even hundreds of thousands $$$ of dollars for group licensed access to research content worldwide. We know some of the tactics...including content embargos.


----------



## Faramir (11 mo ago)

In all honesty I find CTV-Global-City to offer no variation. Meaning they cover the same news in the same way as one another. As far as international coverage a large number of Canadians follow CNN. Not sure why, as CNN is way at the bottom of ratings in the US.


----------



## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Faramir said:


> In all honesty I find CTV-Global-City to offer no variation. Meaning they cover the same news in the same way as one another. As far as international coverage a large number of Canadians follow CNN. Not sure why, as CNN is way at the bottom of ratings in the US.


CNN really? I've never considered CNN for Canadian news. How laughable. Why would they think that? 

If I were to be providing research advice as ...a librarian online or by phone, I would be citing Globe and Mail,CBC and your local news mainstream sources to try first. There are additional published sources with trained reporters for alternative local news. 

Honest, this is part of a librarian's paid role and to help people develop smarter information literacy. No, I would not be recommending Huffington Post as a priority.


----------



## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

andrewf said:


> Beavers in any kind of populated area are seen as highly disruptive pests. My alma mater made national news after trapping and killing some beavers that were taking down some trees along a creek running through campus. I think the concern being that if they dammed the creek, it would cause significant flooding and water management risk.


The thing is that in nature beavers are generally considered great for environmental health.
Beavers & Wetlands | Beavers: Wetlands & Wildlife << obviously a biased source

The problem is that human development is often at conflict with the nature of the area.


----------



## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

The G&M is Canada's national treasure when it comes to news reporting. It is rated highly factual and center-to-slightly-right-of-center biased per Media Bias Fact Check which is likely the best rating organization out there. As long as one stays away from the Opinion sections, which G&M clearly identifies as being columnist opinion and not that of the paper, I believe we are getting objective material, just like we would from Reuters itself.

I think G&M does admirably in separating opinion from news/facts, far more so than nearly any other media source out there. Most sources purposely obfuscate materials to match their bias.


----------



## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

While we were in Europe, we had a choice of four news channels: Fox, CNN, MSNBC, and BBC Europe.

I'll bet you will never guess which channel had the least information. BBC Europe.

BBC Europe has 3~5 stories at any one time. They scroll a one line, 6 word bullet on the bottom of the screen and have 2~3 minute video clips of the same few issues in the video coverage part of the screen. They don't even scratch the surface of the issue. If your only news source was BBC Europe, you would not know anything.

Fox did an OK job of covering the natural gas situation in Europe. They presented throughput numbers for the Norweigan pipeline, the two remaining Russian pipelines, and the 28 LNG ports including the new LNG port Germany was just about to bring online that would handle 8% of Germany's NG needs. Let me be clear: I do not watch Hannity, Fox and Friends, or the mindless crap they prosecute on their moronic audience.

MSNBC? They covered Trump 24/9. That's what they do. I seem to recall they literally spent 2 weeks on Trump's dinner with Kanye and Fuentes. Two weeks. MSNBC is an embarrassment.

CNN was not the worst channel. Their perspective is limited but they did have some retired generals on to discuss the Ukrainian war effort. Most of their content is mindless but there is a bit of information there.

News is dead. I feel I get better information from Reddit, YouTube, and even CMF. You have to be able to filter the grain from the chaff but it is possible to have a bit of a clue of what's going on in the world.

In the summer of 2016 when every news outlet was posting that Tesla had no demand and wasn't building cars, I was looking at pics and video posted on Reddit of car haulers streaming out of Fremont, California. It was shortly before an earnings call and they were moving cars out of that place like it was on fire. I'm confident the news was intended to kill the price before the EC. It worked.

I was able to buy TSLA with confidence in the summer of 2016 because I am extremely selective with the news I ingest. It takes work but the information is out there and a bit of it is even in here.

My regards to Pavoratti.


----------



## Faramir (11 mo ago)

AltaRed said:


> The G&M is Canada's national treasure when it comes to news reporting. It is rated highly factual and center-to-slightly-right-of-center biased per Media Bias Fact Check which is likely the best rating organization out there. As long as one stays away from the Opinion sections, which G&M clearly identifies as being columnist opinion and not that of the paper, I believe we are getting objective material, just like we would from Reuters itself.
> 
> I think G&M does admirably in separating opinion from news/facts, far more so than nearly any other media source out there. Most sources purposely obfuscate materials to match their bias.


Nah, I would rate it far left of centre, with National Post slightly left of centre. Canada is without any news service print or otherwise that is right of centre. The problem is people in general are always far more to the left than they think they are. And the population, here and in the USA, are far more to the left that they were in say the 1980s.


----------



## Faramir (11 mo ago)

TomB16 said:


> While we were in Europe, we had a choice of four news channels: Fox, CNN, MSNBC, and BBC Europe.
> 
> I'll bet you will never guess which channel had the least information. BBC Europe.
> 
> ...


You sound like you might be in the center politically. The fact Rachel Maddow has such a massive audience is scary. But the whole NBC family is a joke, especially CNBC. Yes news is dead and I don't feel it is the problem of the audience to save it, like they are trying to do with bail outs in the USA. The fact that US news media is fighting against free speech is disgusting. They make their living on free speech yet want to restrict it on Joe and Jill Sixpack. 

The problem is skepticism of the other side of the spectrum is at highs we have never seen before. If you are conservative you would discount Huffington Post, VOX, CNN and MSNBC. If you are on the left you would avoid Fox News, and the NY Post. The problem is there is not an unbiased media catering to the centre. One just does not believe what they are getting from all of these sources. So we distrust them all and what are we left with? 

A good example is the media coverage of the destroyed pipeline in the North Sea. The media is blaming Russia which is laughable. Why would Russia destroy one of its streams of income?


----------



## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Faramir said:


> Nah, I would rate it far left of centre, with National Post slightly left of centre. Canada is without any news service print or otherwise that is right of centre. The problem is people in general are always far more to the left than they think they are. And the population, here and in the USA, are far more to the left that they were in say the 1980s.


That is from your perspective which may be well right of center. I will take the assessment of a credible organization like Fact Check Media Bias over anyone else's opinion.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Faramir said:


> You sound like you might be in the center politically. The fact Rachel Maddow has such a massive audience is scary. But the whole NBC family is a joke, especially CNBC. Yes news is dead and I don't feel it is the problem of the audience to save it, like they are trying to do with bail outs in the USA. The fact that US news media is fighting against free speech is disgusting. They make their living on free speech yet want to restrict it on Joe and Jill Sixpack.
> 
> The problem is skepticism of the other side of the spectrum is at highs we have never seen before. If you are conservative you would discount Huffington Post, VOX, CNN and MSNBC. If you are on the left you would avoid Fox News, and the NY Post. The problem is there is not an unbiased media catering to the centre. One just does not believe what they are getting from all of these sources. So we distrust them all and what are we left with?
> 
> A good example is the media coverage of the destroyed pipeline in the North Sea. The media is blaming Russia which is laughable. Why would Russia destroy one of its streams of income?


In our imperfect world, there would be very few people remaining long-term in the centre in perspective/opinion. Could we argue it would be the scientists with empirical evidence? What happened with the anti-vaxxers and those tearing apart the hardworking doctors and nurses, has been a very serious *huge *wake-up call, that even with evidence of dying people, some people still refused to vaccinate.

So let's not get overly academic and too blind in this exploration of "centre" as best and ...hence, the world will be wonderful because we are objectively centrist. When pressed to the wall, to SURVIVE and live, most people do make choices even when scientific evidence is proven and laid in front of their face...with photos of dead people.

Same if alot of news content became "centrist". Whatever that means. I still think things won't be much better nor will people be able to interpret information correctly and take best course of action.

I'm sorry, some of us had parents who lived as children and teens through dictatorship countries prior to immigration to Canada. Mine came from mainland, Communist China...each parent left in their 20's, just as Mao was closing the borders. Each of my parents lied to border authorities, cross the border into Hong Kong.

My partner was born in Nazi Germany. He immigrated as a 7 yr. old boy to CAnada in early 1950's.

So with 2 authoritarian, true dictatorship political left and right, family experiences, so I don't even worry if I seem a bit left of centre. I don't even consider myself extreme...but I know for certain some folks might see me that way. No way, my parents experienced extreme left as a dictatorship, because that what was and still is. It just doesn't look like it but you will get thrown into jail with no recourse if speaking against the govn't. Some Chinese-Canadians are still trying to get their relatives out of Chinese jail. And now what we witness, with China's real censorship on their citizens.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

NM


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

I have some extended family who have been living in present day, near-dictatorships (certainly oppressive countries ruled by authoritarians). I also have friends who escaped from China and Hong Kong for better lives in Canada.

I wonder if these people in Canada screaming about our "fascist dictator government" know how stupid they sound.


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## MrBlackhill (Jun 10, 2020)

Faramir said:


> Nah, I would rate it far left of centre, with National Post slightly left of centre.


Wow, you must be on a very clear right yourself to believe they are far-left and center-left as they are actually both considered center-right.









National Post


RIGHT-CENTER BIAS These media sources are slightly to moderately conservative in bias. They often publish factual information that utilizes loaded words




mediabiasfactcheck.com












The Globe and Mail


RIGHT-CENTER BIAS These media sources are slightly to moderately conservative in bias. They often publish factual information that utilizes loaded words




mediabiasfactcheck.com













National Post Media Bias Rating


Learn the AllSides Media Bias Rating of National Post. AllSides rates the media bias of hundreds of news outlets, media sources and writers.




www.allsides.com












The Globe and Mail Media Bias Rating


Learn the AllSides Media Bias Rating of The Globe and Mail. AllSides rates the media bias of hundreds of news outlets, media sources and writers.




www.allsides.com


----------



## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

TomB16 said:


> While we were in Europe, we had a choice of four news channels: Fox, CNN, MSNBC, and BBC Europe.
> 
> I'll bet you will never guess which channel had the least information. BBC Europe.
> 
> ...


When we were in Japan and Seoul, it felt pretty wierd not knowing what was going in Canada. Not that it was critical at the time. Or interesting just to go south of the Canada-U.S., not very far and have no clue what was happening in Canada if one went by just local news and U.S. TV national news. The Internet does help...abit. When we were cycling in Vermont just 40 km. south of Quebec border, back in 1993, it just floored us that we didn't even know what the weather was like back in Canada, etc.

Every time I visited the U.S., it makes me realize how much Canadians living all along near the border within 300 km., are fed U.S. dominant / topic news --daily. I actually found being in Seattle, not too bad getting some Canadian news. 

We need to realize that huge hunks of the U.S., still don't know anything about Canada nor do they care. And they don't get any of our CAnadian tv news..not even over the Internet because the broadcast signal stops/news feed stops.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

MrBlackhill said:


> Wow, you must be on a very clear right yourself to believe they are far-left and center-left as they are actually both considered center-right.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Last time I read the globe I felt it was more centrist.

The Post is more right leaning IMO.

Also is the G&M owned by the NYT now?


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## Eclectic21 (Jun 25, 2021)

jlunfirst said:


> I know I will never meet any of you simply because of the main topic ..money which is the base ...


Odd ... whenever I have met up with people from discussion boards, the conversations were not limited to the topic of the board. There was a lot of general chit chat to get an idea of what people's backgrounds, interests and what they were willing to discuss.




james4beach said:


> jlunfirst said:
> 
> 
> > I am the wrong person in some cases for folks here probably because where I did work....and also my family background, upbringing.
> ...


I agree that there seems to be some assumptions and/or over reactions.

Despite reading in this thread some of the work/family background, I have not idea if one is the wrong or right or neutral person. 


Cheers


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## Eclectic21 (Jun 25, 2021)

jlunfirst said:


> ... Every time I visited the U.S., it makes me realize how much Canadians living all along near the border within 300 km., are fed U.S. dominant / topic news --daily. I actually found being in Seattle, not too bad getting some Canadian news.


As someone who grew up about forty five Km from the US, I'm not sure why one would need to go to the US to understand this US dominance. A twenty foot TV antenna tower with rotor meant we could receive something like twenty seven TV stations. Of those, maybe five were Canadian stations.

IMO, now it has spread much further into Canada with a similar dominance on the cable tv networks. 




jlunfirst said:


> ... We need to realize that huge hunks of the U.S., still don't know anything about Canada nor do they care. And they don't get any of our CAnadian tv news ...


Whether it was Americans I was chatting with, American co-workers or American relatives - the "don't care" and/or "America is all that matters, everything else is noise from a wanna be America state" seemed to be the driving factor. There are a few pockets and a few Americans who are interested but not that many.

Another odd thing to me was to hear Americans talk about how their close friend with the inside scoop who happened to the be the president had let them know what was going on in the world. With some chatting with them, it was clear that the "close friend with the inside scoop" was the White House press secretary, talking to reporters!!




jlunfirst said:


> ... not even over the Internet because the broadcast signal stops/news feed stops.


Do you mean the American internet companies are blocking the web sites for Canadian news sources?
Odd as I have not had a problem with this while in the US. I tend to read the web articles rather than watch the presenters though.


Cheers


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Eclectic21 said:


> Odd ... whenever I have met up with people from discussion boards, the conversations were not limited to the topic of the board. There was a lot of general chit chat to get an idea of what people's backgrounds, interests and what they were willing to discuss.
> 
> Cheers


You mean meeting people from Canadian Money forum? I certainly get the powerful impression people here in this forum, who participate (never mind the lurkers), are far more protective about many details about self, even ordinary stuff. Less topics, stories outside of money stuff. And no one posts any photos of anyone, even with sunglasses on. 

That's ok. I'm in the same boat with all of you. I know the etiquette/culture here. Even if I seem to crash into the living rm. at times.  Well, we have to stimulate the forum at times.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

People are (should be) protective of their identity in a public forum that can be read by the 'world'. It might be different in private forums where only members can access and read contents. If individuals want to get to know each other, there is the provision for Private Messages for individuals to decide how and when they may wish to get together.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

MrMatt said:


> Last time I read the globe I felt it was more centrist.
> 
> The Post is more right leaning IMO.
> 
> Also is the G&M owned by the NYT now?


No, Globe and Mail owned by the Canadian company, Woodbridge. Located just north of Toronto. David thomson, owns Woodbridge and....he owns Reuters plus a whole global empire of international fee-based research databases on Canadian & international law, business and other news sources. You know the guy, probably billionaire, son of late Ken Thomson who had a love for Group of 7 paintings and his donation to Art Gallery of Ontario. Woodbridge Acquires Direct Ownership of The Globe and Mail (newswire.ca)

Law librarians ...know some stuff.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

AltaRed said:


> People are (should be) protective of their identity in a public forum that can be read by the 'world'. It might be different in private forums where only members can access and read contents. If individuals want to get to know each other, there is the provision for Private Messages for individuals to decide how and when they may wish to get together.


I don't see Private Messages feature, here. But that's ok. (Ok, I figured it out how PM works here. Duh.) My needs are filled elsewhere. There are ways of handling of stuff... there is a reason I make it clear I've worked in legal and regulatory sectors for while. As well as 2 personal near scam stories.

I'm not that clueless and if didn't know, feel comfortable to seek out authorized information and other people's opinion in person. I realize some people don't "trust government" sources/whatever.

Sometimes they are our last resort....they provide the legislative foundation base before layering on policies, procedures, services and forms for us to fill. Control of covid has been a strong reminder we couldn't be safe and vaccinate without govn't coordinating and recording all info. Not the private sector at all. We just bought necessities from them...and they got their money. Very simple, laid bare.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

jlunfirst said:


> No, Globe and Mail owned by the Canadian company, Woodbridge.


I only ask because I logged in and the NYT asked to verify my account, and they have a discount if you also order NYT.

I assume they have Canadian rights to distribute it, but it seems like it's more prominent than G&M.





New York Times Subscriptions


The Globe and Mail offers the most authoritative news in Canada, featuring national and international news




www.theglobeandmail.com


----------



## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

MrMatt said:


> I only ask because I logged in and the NYT asked to verify my account, and they have a discount if you also order NYT.
> 
> I assume they have Canadian rights to distribute it, but it seems like it's more prominent than G&M.
> 
> ...


Wonder who owns NYT. I like NYT for US. news, though Washington Post is good. Of course, the paywall shuts me out....


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

NYT is too left-of-center for me. Look at the link for ownership et al.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

AltaRed said:


> NYT is too left-of-center for me. Look at the link for ownership et al.


Doesn't bother me. One should know by some volunteer activities and my background. No point for me to hide.

I may be more synch with my 84 yr. ex-cyclist friend in Airdrie....who lived in Metro VAncovuer for 40 yrs. She has had to spend extra time trying to figure out folks her age bracket in her present retirement home. She grew up on a farm near Goderich, ON. So life has changed her due to various personal circumstances and activities. She was a rabble rouser...re cycling advocacy in Metro Vancouver. Always gracious, polite and not raving maniac.


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## Faramir (11 mo ago)

jlunfirst said:


> In our imperfect world, there would be very few people remaining long-term in the centre in perspective/opinion. Could we argue it would be the scientists with empirical evidence? What happened with the anti-vaxxers and those tearing apart the hardworking doctors and nurses, has been a very serious *huge *wake-up call, that even with evidence of dying people, some people still refused to vaccinate.
> 
> So let's not get overly academic and too blind in this exploration of "centre" as best and ...hence, the world will be wonderful because we are objectively centrist. When pressed to the wall, to SURVIVE and live, most people do make choices even when scientific evidence is proven and laid in front of their face...with photos of dead people.
> 
> ...


Appreciate that. What China taught us is the fallibility of the idea that economic liberalization would lead to political freedom. I use to believe that.


----------



## Faramir (11 mo ago)

james4beach said:


> I have some extended family who have been living in present day, near-dictatorships (certainly oppressive countries ruled by authoritarians). I also have friends who escaped from China and Hong Kong for better lives in Canada.
> 
> I wonder if these people in Canada screaming about our "fascist dictator government" know how stupid they sound.


I think the point is the direction the trudeau government is leaning towards. Such as bills to control our free speech.


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## Faramir (11 mo ago)

NM


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## Faramir (11 mo ago)

AltaRed said:


> NYT is too left-of-center for me. Look at the link for ownership et al.


The problem with the NYT is that the family owns the VOTING shares. B shares. So even if the mass of investors own the A shares there is nothing they can do about the direction of the NYT. Or even bad business decisions.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Faramir said:


> Appreciate that. What China taught us is the fallibility of the idea that economic liberalization would lead to political freedom. I use to believe that.


I still mostly believe that.

Where is the Chinese example of economic liberalization?


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## Faramir (11 mo ago)

MrMatt said:


> I still mostly believe that.
> 
> Where is the Chinese example of economic liberalization?


Well I guess it depends who you talk to but they have embraced trade with the world since Nixon. I know much is smoke and mirrors. For example the government builds buildings that end up mostly empty. Use prison labour, ect, but no one in the West seems to care about that. You seem to be of an opinion they have not liberalized? What Nixon sold us on, and then Clinton, was that opening up trade and giving China most favoured nation status would lead to a free China. It hasn't.


----------



## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

MrMatt said:


> I still mostly believe that.
> 
> Where is the Chinese example of economic liberalization?





Faramir said:


> Well I guess it depends who you talk to but they have embraced trade with the world since Nixon.


Trading with the world, but not allowing foreign ownership and operations isn't economic liberalization.



> You seem to be of an opinion they have not liberalized?


Yes, because I don't think they have.
You seemed to suggest that they have, that's why I asked for an example.



> What Nixon sold us on, and then Clinton, was that opening up trade and giving China most favoured nation status would lead to a free China. It hasn't.


Of course not, because we never insisted on any sort of freedom to go with that economic access.

We just opened up to allow in their factories output. they're still largely state owned enterprises.
Even the "private" companies are controlled or "influenced" by the government.

Jack Ma isn't hiding in exile because he likes it.


----------



## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

MrMatt said:


> Trading with the world, but not allowing foreign ownership and operations isn't economic liberalization.
> 
> 
> Yes, because I don't think they have.
> ...


Methinks there's enough evidence, doing business in China means some graft is involved. Not that it doesn't happen here. It's just there, it happens more regularily and part of daily biz..which wrong and unfair.


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Anyway, this wasn't intended to be much on political leanings.
More about the esprit de corps of this forum. I just came back from other place, where someone had major surgery so he got a gift of liquid protein from a forum float fund, 4 other members have family sick seriously with covid or of other sickness.... anyway, amongst someone's wife had her inflatable nativity scene stolen off the lawn, another prepping for her elder hoarder sister for a dinner she's worried about, etc. It's wonderful active, flawed forum where there's less hiding of weaknesses and problems. In between bike rides (for southern members), jogging and walking..there's a collective online tracking of total forum mileage for 2022.

Money discussion, gives illusion here as serious (it is), business-like and in the conduct of this forum. It's ok. Kinda dry.

And for the few women here, they gotta start off serious, intelligent and informed or she's a (financial) ditz. Thank you. I've read that tenor right. In a way, it's no different from the cycling world: show your bike love and you'll be embraced. And just don't say it. Do it, show it with a photo sometimes. Then you can kick back and shoot the breeze about useless other topics.


----------



## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

james4beach said:


> Could one of these guys be The Tenor of this forum?


And when will we have threads for soprano, alto and bass?


----------



## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Mukhang pera said:


> And when will we have threads for soprano, alto and bass?


 And have the same bombastic effect?


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## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

jlunfirst said:


> And for the few women here, they gotta start off serious, intelligent and informed or she's a (financial) ditz. Thank you. I've read that tenor right.


Feel free to wear those manacles, if you wish. I am not here to judge anyone. If you make this choice, keep in mind this will be passing judgement on a behavior you are projecting from outside of base reality.

This is not a group of misogynists. Although I'm sure some folks with this tendency exist in here, this group does not deserve that title. Go read any thread started by someone with less than 5 posts. They will receive help and guidance 100% of the time.

Newcomer questions are _always _answered but usually they involve questions from the knowledge trust here before they can be answered properly.

This is a group that can be proud of it's conduct. CMF helps people directly.

Please don't interpret the jousting between Beaver and I to be indicative. These exchanges are in fun. Beaver and I would help each other on any topic.


----------



## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

^ Obviously your Signature doesn't apply to me.


----------



## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

jlunfirst said:


> And for the few women here, they gotta start off serious, intelligent and informed or she's a (financial) ditz.


I don't think I've seen that. I think polite people are treated well, and rude/aggressive people are responded to in kind.

Secondly other than the assumption of names such as Mr/Mrs, nobody actually knows the sex or gender of the poster, unless they post it.

I think for newbies this is actually a pretty decent forum, because we were all newbies and honestly for those types of questions you'll get a variety of responses, most of which are quite good. Because in general the users on this forum are knowledge and the basic theories of finance are pretty much accepted.


----------



## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

Beaver101 said:


> ^ Obviously your Signature doesn't apply to me.


Einstein mentioned he knows you're relative.


----------



## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

TomB16 said:


> Einstein mentioned he knows you're relative.


 ... so is that how came out with the equation of *E = mc2? *Well, you can tell your Einstein friend, I'll use the equation of *mEcu2 *here instead.


----------



## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)




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## Eclectic21 (Jun 25, 2021)

jlunfirst said:


> Anyway, this wasn't intended to be much on political leanings. More about the esprit de corps of this forum ...


For better or worse, after financial matters - one of the topics that generates comments and/or sidetracks threads is politics.




jlunfirst said:


> ... Money discussion, gives illusion here as serious (it is), business-like and in the conduct of this forum. It's ok. Kinda dry.


To each their own ... I prefer the money topics to a lot of the political jousting.




jlunfirst said:


> ... And for the few women here, they gotta start off serious, intelligent and informed or she's a (financial) ditz. Thank you. I've read that tenor right. In a way ...


After being around here for over a decade, it seems more to me that you are projecting what you have experienced elsewhere. For some posters, I suspected based on their name that they were women and for others, I had discussions for years before finding out they were women.

Some of both sex posted for years in the Off-Topic Lounge without anyone being concerned about being serious or call them names. Where I can recall name calling is where the same old topics were being covered with repeated arguments or politics.


Cheers


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## Eclectic21 (Jun 25, 2021)

MrMatt said:


> I don't think I've seen that. I think polite people are treated well, and rude/aggressive people are responded to in kind ... I think for newbies this is actually a pretty decent forum, because we were all newbies ...


I agree as that has been my experience as well. In some other places, posting a first message was all it took to be insulted.


Cheers


----------



## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

With money/finance as our core primary focus, I think it's easy to talk about other related topics without getting political. That's why I've initiated such topics and also stimulate why we do certain things, habits ...involving money in general. And we don't have to talk about actual dollar values for such human behaviours/preferences. Money by itself is pretty dry. 

I'm not trying to be irrelevant either. Money can affect relationships, purchase preferences and priorities.


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## Eclectic21 (Jun 25, 2021)

jlunfirst said:


> You mean meeting people from Canadian Money forum?


No one has volunteered to try to arrange one lately so no. 
On the other hand, the other meetups I have attended for a range of interests have always had a range of topics with general chit chat mixed in.


Cheers


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## jlunfirst (1 mo ago)

Eclectic21 said:


> No one has volunteered to try to arrange one lately so no.
> On the other hand, the other meetups I have attended for a range of interests have always had a range of topics with general chit chat mixed in.


This group is very different from the other group where I hang out (cycling in general with primarily Americans, which often we devolve to many other topics, trivia. Alot more humour, joking and fun stuff.). WHich is fine by me for different "etiquette" in Canadian Money forum. I realize people might be more serious and stay focused on pure finance/tax matters. At other place, it's an "easier" topic to form a base interest, etc.

There's also greater probability by coincidence a higher chance some members here might actual relate to each other 10 degrees away via friends, business associates..since some of us live in same Canadian cities. So I respect the need for privacy.


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