# how to respond to car salesperson?



## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

(ongoing saga)
we got this reply from a car dealership, in response to a cash offer for a car ( vs financing)

_Dealers are less motivated to do cash deals actually because when we finance, the bank gives us a bit of "kick back" and we make a little extra money, which could potentially mean a little bit of a better deal for you, compared to if you paid cash. _

how would CMFers respond to this?


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

I would not respond. Or in person, just walk away. Let the rep come back to you. Show disinterest. Never call back or respond. 

They will contact you again. Your response is easy. Thank you for your time. I have no desire to consider financing unless it is 0 percent and has no impact on the bottom line price. Since this seems to be a challenge for your dealership I will get several other quotes or keep shopping (whatever the situation is)

You are in control. You are the customer. This clown is trying to shift some of the control to him and his dealership. Why would you be concerned about the dealership making extra money? Your only concern is the bottom line, drive away price without financing.

Don't get emotionally attached to the deal. If you do a deal, just remember not to get hosed by the so call $200 or $250. admin or paperwork/registration fee that shows up when you have decided on the deal. Work this into your negotiation. When you have a deal that you like, add the proviso that there will be no BS registration fee. They will hate you but so what.

I would not sweat this. A salesperson hates to see a qualified buyer walk out the door. The real issue is whether or not you really want to deal with this rep, with this dealership.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Yea I once bought a used car from a stealership and got this line. I asked to see the terms to check if I could just pay it off immediately, which I could. He offered me a better deal if I would wait 3 months or something before paying it off. When they tried to hit me with all the last minute "fees" he quickly removed them knowing he had no control over when I paid it off. At least he worked with me, some stealerships were just plain bad acting. I typically find better deals elsewhere.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

....love cmf-ers.....!
anyone else?


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

As an aside, years ago in Vancouver I was shopping for a new car. I saw a car that I wanted but we could not agree on price. They had my particulars. I walked out.

I was careful not to answer our home phone. I asked my spouse to and told her that if the sales rep or someone she did not recognize she was to say that I was out shopping for a car and she did not know when I would return. If it was the sales rep he would ask for my cel. He did, she did, and I got the deal that I wanted. BUT, at the end rep did try to sneak in $700 for PDI which was included in our agreed to price. Nice try. We did the deal. No PDI, no registration fee, and no thanks to the extended warranty etc. Just net, net bottom line. I don't think they like that.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

heres another tricky question...how much "leeway" on price can you reasonably expect to get from a dealer on his initial quote to you? 
this particular deal is for a used (traded-in) 2018 Hyundaia Elantra. 
sticker price was $17390, plus fees, taxes = $20300 on the road.
what do you think would be the best i could do?


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

I think the leeway would depend on the market situation. How long has that car been sitting in their lot? The longer the more leeway I would imagine. When I bought a used car from a dealer it just happened that they needed it off the lot for whatever reason and I couldn't find a better deal from private sellers like I normally do


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

My understanding is that there is typically much more margin in a used deal than in a new vehicle deal. The money is in the service centre, the pre ownded car lot, and the real estate.

One other difference is that the dealer is actually incurring the carrying cost of this inventory. He needs to move it. On the downside, if the dealership financial Y/E is fiscal, then they are only at the beginning of month 2 or the second quarter. This, plus the fact that it is early in the month may not help. On the other hand, sales of sedans are down, sales of SUV's are up so this may be to your advantage.

I hate the process of buying a car.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

jargey3000 said:


> heres another tricky question...how much "leeway" on price can you reasonably expect to get from a dealer on his initial quote to you?
> this particular deal is for a used (traded-in) 2018 Hyundaia Elantra.
> sticker price was $17390, plus fees, taxes = $20300 on the road.
> what do you think would be the best i could do?


What are the prices for similar 2018 Hyundaia Elantras in your area right now? If the price they are selling it for is in the same ball park (or less) then the deal is ok. Most often the price is what "you" are willing to pay, so make them an offer or wait for another one.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

good info.
yes ian...i think everyone dreads this process..


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## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

I would never buy from a dealer. For one thing there are the multiple hustles and scams that just make you tired. Then, the government (at least in Ontario) charges more sales tax on a car sold by a dealer. I can get a better car and a better deal privately than I can from a dealer. Pro tip: buy from a rich person, they will have a better car and will sell it cheaper because it does not mean much if anything to them. A poor person will try to squeeze every penny out of a tenth hand junker. I am sure you know where the rich neighborhoods are in your area.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Luxury cars are often a steal used. Wealthy people usually want new luxury cars and not many people buying used want luxury. I know some who seek out these deals and then all the jones' talk smack about it when it cost far less than their new suv/trucks lol


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

i would imagine most rich 'luxury car' owners would rather simply trade in their current car on a new one, rather than have to be bothered haggling with the rabble over the price on a private sale...?


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> I would never buy from a dealer. For one thing there are the multiple hustles and scams that just make you tired. Then, the government (at least in Ontario) charges more sales tax on a car sold by a dealer. I can get a better car and a better deal privately than I can from a dealer. Pro tip: buy from a rich person, they will have a better car and will sell it cheaper because it does not mean much if anything to them. A poor person will try to squeeze every penny out of a tenth hand junker. I am sure you know where the rich neighborhoods are in your area.


dont necessarily agree with this.... how do you think the rich got rich in the first place?😜😜

but yes, i always try to avoid dealers... but there's nothing viable from private sellers at present, whereas there are a no. of cars available from dealers right now


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

I bought a three year old full load Accord several years ago. In the process I almost purchased two other cars-privately. Two were Honda's, the other an Acura. Both told me no accidents. I ran Carfax on them. Both had been in acciddents. The Acura had sustained major damage. Market was tight at the time because of Toyota Camry recalls etc. We bought from a dealer who provided a Carfax report. Despite that, we ran our own. It only cost $25 at the auto club and I was able to do it on line. Trust but verify. Car was three years old, 40Kms, and I was able to speak with the previous owner.

Bought my Solara convertable on line in another city. Did a Carfax even before we drove 3 hrs to look at it. Checked out OK and did the private deal. Also did a lien report. Lots of people skipping on loans where we live. Skip tracers must be doing a land office business in Calgary these days.


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## OhGreatGuru (May 24, 2009)

jargey3000 said:


> (ongoing saga) ..._Dealers are less motivated to do cash deals actually because when we finance, the bank gives us a bit of "kick back" and we make a little extra money, which could potentially mean a little bit of a better deal for you, compared to if you paid cash. _
> ...


The first half of his sentence is true. The Financing company makes money, and they likely pay a commission of some kind to the dealer for the referral. Why else would dealers always be pressuring people to buy on credit? But the second half (that they would pass some of this on to you) is a fantasy part of his sales pitch.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

OhGreatGuru said:


> The first half of his sentence is true. The Financing company makes money, and they likely pay a commission of some kind to the dealer for the referral. Why else would dealers always be pressuring people to buy on credit? But the second half (that they would pass some of this on to you) is a fantasy part of his sales pitch.


Because most people buy based on monthly payment.
Since they buy by payment, the manufacturer incentives often include low interest loans for a long time, i've seen 7 years (84 months)

One time I actually bought with "0%", then went and paid off the loan immediately because there were NO cash incentives, but there were significant financing incentives.


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

MrMatt said:


> One time I actually bought with "0%", then went and paid off the loan immediately because there were NO cash incentives, but there were significant financing incentives.


I always pay cash for my cars and it truly drives them to distraction. They pass you off to a special salesperson to attempt to talk you out of it. I suspect a lot of their profit is in the financing.

I usually use one of these services like auto123 to get the so-called price the dealer pays for the vehicle and then do my best to bring the asking price down. They do this for a living, so it's hard for me to compete. It's not an enjoyable process. They know every trick in the book. With mid to low price cars there's not a huge amount of wiggle room. I think dealers make a lot of their profits in servicing vehicles.

ltr


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

thanks all...

sooo....we've kinda narrowed things down ...to a place called "CARS 'R US" 
( lol.....I can see the replies now! haha...)

question: are these CARFAX reports supplied by a dealer worth the paper they're printed on????

I've never seen or used one in previous purchases (usually with private sellers...) so i have no experience with them


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## Emjay85 (Nov 9, 2014)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> I would never buy from a dealer. For one thing there are the multiple hustles and scams that just make you tired. Then, the government (at least in Ontario) charges more sales tax on a car sold by a dealer. I can get a better car and a better deal privately than I can from a dealer. Pro tip: buy from a rich person, they will have a better car and will sell it cheaper because it does not mean much if anything to them. A poor person will try to squeeze every penny out of a tenth hand junker. I am sure you know where the rich neighborhoods are in your area.


I think that used to be true before HST came into play. Now everything gets nailed with HST, dealer or not.


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## Gumball (Dec 22, 2011)

jargey3000 said:


> dont necessarily agree with this.... how do you think the rich got rich in the first place?&#55357;&#56860;&#55357;&#56860;
> 
> but yes, i always try to avoid dealers... but there's nothing viable from private sellers at present, whereas there are a no. of cars available from dealers right now


With the low canadian dollar many used cars are being bought by wholesalers and exported to the USA, we are experiencing inflated used car pricing in Canada due to this. Its mostly SUV / Trucks that get shipped south, so you may find the savings of buying a used vehicle to be not as great compared to buying new, whereas in the past there were better dealers to be had in the used car market.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

Many dealers supply Carfax reports with their vehicles. Ours did. After our experience in shopping the private market I decided that I would run my own for piece of mind. Hard copy of anything does not mean much to me these days. The auto club was doing it on line for about $25 a throw.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

ian said:


> Many dealers supply Carfax reports with their vehicles. Ours did. After our experience in shopping the private market I decided that I would run my own for piece of mind. Hard copy of anything does not mean much to me these days. The auto club was doing it on line for about $25 a throw.


sorry i guess i didnt literally mean the "paper"....rather, the Carfax report itself, provided by the seller? is it meaningful reliable information?

and, if you ran your own report, thru the auto club or whatever, with the same VIN number, would you not get the same report, with the same information?


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

like_to_retire said:


> I always pay cash for my cars and it truly drives them to distraction. They pass you off to a special salesperson to attempt to talk you out of it. I suspect a lot of their profit is in the financing.


I'm a cash buyer as well and have never come any special salesperson or have had them try to talk me out of it. Financing is always on the table but I've never had it work out better than a cash deal so far. Often I deal directly with the sales manager but a salesperson is involved at some points during the process.

BTW, don't totally rely on Carfax and other reports for used. While they are good for "reported accidents" they miss some. I've seen a number of used cars with "clean" reports that had obvious repairs done.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

True. I have been told by people in the business that Carfax can miss rental car damage/repairs. It seems that some agencies simply do or make repairs without the need to report.


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## lonewolf :) (Sep 13, 2016)

Years ago i watched a show on the best way to get the best price for a car. According to the expert the way to get the best price is walk into the dealership tell the salesman your going to be buying a car today tell the salesman exactly the car you want & ask them the best price they can give you then walk out & repeat @ another stealership . You have to do your home work ahead of time before doing this so you purchase the car you want. Would also check prices on line.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

above is kinda basically what Im doing.....legs & mouth getting tired ...lol


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## nobleea (Oct 11, 2013)

They probably only paid 13-14K for the car at wholesale.

I bought a used car from a dealership a few years ago. It was discounted due to hail damage. Written off and paid out by the insurer. However, this didn't show up on the carfax.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

We bought our vehicles at GM retiree prices (dealer invoice) and 0% interest, so it is basically a cash purchase paid over time. 

As to the kickback for financing, the banks (TD and Scotiabank in our case) don't lend money for 0%, so GM reimburses them for the interest. I doubt they also pay the dealer.

I would also caution about Hyundai vehicles. Their problem with engine fires is a $6000 fix which Hyundai has refused to pay.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

which Hyundais - models? years? - are prone to the engine fires?


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

There have been numerous recalls of different models and years, which originally involved their 1.6 liter engine.

Lately they are recalling vehicles with the 2.0 liter turbo charged engines and their 2.4 liter engines.

It doesn't appear they have completely resolved their engine issues.

https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/...and-hyundai-engines-more-likely-to-catch-fire


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

seems the 2018 Elantra GT's engine , the model we're considering is OK fire- wise...?u


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

I would be staying away. There are just too many engines to trust either manufacturer and they are less than forthcoming about the need for massive recalls. Why would you risk the worry about an engine blowing up at any time?

Added: if you are set on that kind of vehicle, consider a Mazda 3. They have a good rep. Wifes sister bro, and neice's family have had a series of them for ages.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

AltaRed said:


> I would be staying away. There are just too many engines to trust either manufacturer and they are less than forthcoming about the need for massive recalls. Why would you risk the worry about an engine blowing up at any time?
> 
> Added: if you are set on that kind of vehicle, consider a Mazda 3. They have a good rep. Wifes sister bro, and neice's family have had a series of them for ages.


thanks alta..i was under the impression the mazda 3 had been discontinued..&#55357;&#56860;


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

jargey3000 said:


> thanks alta..i was under the impression the mazda 3 had been discontinued..��


https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/mazda/mazda3 Re-designed for 2019.

Added: Scanning the article very quickly, sales of the Mazda 3 appear to be declining but don't know if that was a function of declining sales of the 'long in the tooth' 2018 model, or is representative of the new design. Clearly it undersells the Toyota Corolla and Honda Civic, but then those two have always been way out front.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

I notice they rank the Kia Forte ahead of the Mazda 3 ( #2 & #3) in the hatchback category....despite the engine fires...?


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

If I were shopping for a pre owned sedan (and both of our current vehicles were pre owned), I would only be looking at Honda, Toyota, and some Mazda product. Low mileage, three-four years old is the sweet spot for the high end, full load models in my limited shopping experience.

In the past I have owned Corolla, Celicas, Accord, Camry, Solara. All of them, new and used, were streets ahead of those GM and Ford company cars that I got new every year...including the Lincoln. And in general, I found the dealer service was much better in all respects. Especially Ford dealerships of which I had to visit far too often for new car delivery or warranty issues.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

jargey3000 said:


> I notice they rank the Kia Forte ahead of the Mazda 3 ( #2 & #3) in the hatchback category....despite the engine fires...?


The rating may not take into account all the recent publicity on engine fires. The point really is..... Do you really want to buy a new car knowing that the brand(s) have ongoing issues with engine fires and are not being overly responsive to customer concerns, i.e. are known to be denying customers a comprehensive recall? Do you want to go to bed at night wondering if that new Hyundai or Kia just might catch fire tomorrow? 

It is your call, but I can assure you I wouldn't let that possibility anywhere near my property, never mind on my property. It is akin to taking a dare and standing in the middle of the freeway. There are too many other highly recommended choices out there.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

ian said:


> In the past I have owned Corolla, Celicas, Accord, Camry, Solara. All of them, new and used, were streets ahead of those GM and Ford company cars that I got new every year...including the Lincoln. And in general, I found the dealer service was much better in all respects. Especially Ford dealerships of which I had to visit far too often for new car delivery or warranty issues.


I agree with you, but we are getting into personal preferences here, much like talking politics and religion.


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## Longtimeago (Aug 8, 2018)

I don't understand this 'don't go near' kind of comment about one make vs. another etc. Can anyone name any make of vehicle that has not had recalls and that has not had deaths caused due to a problem. Anyone remember the Ford Pinto? https://www.popularmechanics.com/ca...e-engineering-failures-ford-pinto-fuel-tanks/

Vehicles will always have issues, just like the current Boeing 737 issues in planes. To suggest that someone not buy a particular make simply because there is a current issue with some of them is ridiculous. If the advice was, don't buy one with this particular engine, I could see that. Or don't buy one that has not had the issue dealt with, I could see that but to say don't buy any of this make at all is just plain silly.

I have owned a 2006 Kia Sportage since new. I have never had a problem with it other than normal wear and tear. I have had 3 recalls on it, all for things that were not safety concerned. One was to do an additional spraying of rust coating inside the frame members. Can you imagine Ford doing a recall because they detected a bit more rust than they deemed appropriate in a 15 year old model? By year 15, there isn't a Ford out there that isn't rusted out everywhere if left to do so.

The media love to make a big deal out of any possible reason. The more sensational the headlines they can come up with the better. In this case, only ONE death has been possibly attributed to the problem. Some people listen to the media rather than using their own common sense to assess the facts.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

AltaRed said:


> I agree with you, but we are getting into personal preferences here, much like talking politics and religion.


just for the record....im a 'virtual' life-long honda/toyota owner. family has bought a couple of used hyundais in last no. of years. the biggest headache-problem i can recall with ANY of my cars in the last 20 years or so, was with a Honda Accord, which i did buy new (company car at the time) For some reason it started burning a tremendous amt. of oil. couldnt keep it full! wasnt leaking, and dealer was no help in solving why. traded it in on a used elantra & got another 9 years out of that car.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Longtimeago said:


> I have owned a 2006 Kia Sportage since new. I have never had a problem with it other than normal wear and tear. I have had 3 recalls on it, all for things that were not safety concerned. One was to do an additional spraying of rust coating inside the frame members. Can you imagine Ford doing a recall because they detected a bit more rust than they deemed appropriate in a 15 year old model? By year 15, there isn't a Ford out there that isn't rusted out everywhere if left to do so.
> 
> The media love to make a big deal out of any possible reason. The more sensational the headlines they can come up with the better. In this case, only ONE death has been possibly attributed to the problem. Some people listen to the media rather than using their own common sense to assess the facts.


A 2006* Kia Sportage is different from the 2009 model, the first year of the engine recall in one of the engines, and the engine issue expanded to different ones thereafter through new generations of the model. That part is troubling, issues across various engines. Who knows if the most recent models have fixed the problem? Why take a chance? 

* 2004-2007 generation. My spouse had a pre-2004 generation version.


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## Longtimeago (Aug 8, 2018)

AltaRed said:


> A 2006* Kia Sportage is different from the 2009 model, the first year of the engine recall in one of the engines, and the engine issue expanded to different ones thereafter through new generations of the model. That part is troubling, issues across various engines. Who knows if the most recent models have fixed the problem? Why take a chance?
> 
> * 2004-2007 generation. My spouse had a pre-2004 generation version.


More nonsense, no offense intended AltaRed. Why take a chance on ANY car from any manufacturer? They have all had problems at different times with different models, just like the Pinto. Again, if you said, don't take a chance on one with one of the subject engines, I could see that but to suggest not taking a chance with any vehicle they make just doesn't make any sense. Who knows if Ford isn't still building cars with fuel tank problems? So don't buy any Ford? Boeing has built a plane that crashes, so don't take a chance flying on ANY plane EVER built by Boeing?

There is nothing wrong with avoiding a known problem. The problem however is certain engines, not all vehicles made by the company. Buy a Kia or Hyundai with a 6 cylinder engine. Heard of any problem with those engines? 

My point is that there is nothing unusual in this problem they are having. All manufacturers have had or do have similar issues since the mid-60s when Ralph Nader first outed them in his book Unsafe At Any Speed and crusaded to make auto makers accountable. The MEDIA have got your attention AltaRed with their sensationalism and you are interpreting that as 'don't buy any' with simplistic thinking. At any given time, I am sure that there are several auto makers doing recalls for various safety reasons, equally as bad but not all are being sensationalized by the media and so getting your attention.

I guess you will suggest not buying anything made by any of the auto makers on the following lists: https://www.newsday.com/classifieds/cars/latest-auto-recall-news-1.7936335

https://www.cars.com/news/recalls/

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/recalls/

Do I need to go on? If you don't buy a car from all the companies on those lists, I think you will have a pretty hard time finding anything left to buy!


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

The Honda/Toyota/Mazda Japanese brand loyalty is kind of out dated imo (owned Honda/Mazda/Subaru) I haven't owned a Hyundai/Kia but it seems like Korea is overtaking Japan in a lot of markets especially electronics.

I'm driving a 2019 Sante Fe Htrac rental on its first tank. The engine/transmission feels kinda crap compared to what I normally drive but it has the most comfortable seats and most intuitive infortainment system I've used even compared to luxury brands. Apparently all the safety gizmos are standard and integrated with steering now - I thought there were wheel ruts in the road but it gently nudges the steering to the center of the lane instead of annoying alerts when you get near a line.. I turned this off on a winding road but might be nice on a long highway drive.. 

I haven't compared them myself, but I imagine if you compare feature for feauture you'd get more bang for your buck with the Korean brands. Not sure how they compare on long term reliability and resale, warranty etc


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

Longtimeago said:


> There is nothing wrong with avoiding a known problem. The problem however is certain engines, not all vehicles made by the company.


One just has to do a little research, check out carcomplaints.com for a given vehicle and specific year. If you want to dig deeper, hit the forums related to the car and see what people are asking/complaining out. Every brand has models with bad years, some worse than others so just steer clear of those or be prepared to fix (if possible) the know issues.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

cainvest said:


> One just has to do a little research, check out carcomplaints.com for a given vehicle and specific year. If you want to dig deeper, hit the forums related to the car and see what people are asking/complaining out. Every brand has models with bad years, some worse than others so just steer clear of those or be prepared to fix (if possible) the know issues.


Agreed! Every buyer should do that kind of homework.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Sometimes a dealer will throw in some incentives.

Our dealer gives an extra 2 years of free oil changes, a free shuttle service, washes the vehicle after every service, and gives us coffee and cookies. :cocksure:


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

Here is some detail on the Hyundai/Kia issue:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/ca...e-knowingly-sold-defective-vehicles-1.5073563


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

I can't believe people paid $50,000 for a Hyundai Santa Fe.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

sags said:


> I can't believe people paid $50,000 for a Hyundai Santa Fe.


_my thought exactly!!!_


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

ian said:


> Here is some detail on the Hyundai/Kia issue:
> 
> https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/ca...e-knowingly-sold-defective-vehicles-1.5073563


thanks for article....
how the heck to you find out if your car has a Theta, Nu, or Gamma engine????
and......based on the problem vehicles/model years listed in this article....would you feel "safe" with a 2018 Elantra (which is not listed)?


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

sags said:


> I can't believe people paid $50,000 for a Hyundai Santa Fe.


Yikes.. driving a brand new 2019 and the transmission is especially clunky. The interior is better than what I'd expect from a Japanese brand but not $50,000 better

My neighbours (block away) vehicle blew up in the middle of the night last winter and burnt down their house.. not sure what vehicle it was


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

My issue would be more that the faulty product. I would have a bigger issue with how the company did or did not respond to customer issues and defective product.

In my career, some of my most loyal customers were the ones that had a product or service issue that was resolved immediately to their satisfaction. Every manufacturer or service provider can have a challenge from time to time. The time to judge the vendor is how well they respond and what they do to make it 'right'.

My very first new car, 1977 Toyota Corolla had a rust spots appearing on the roof. The dealer told me to come back on a certain day when the regional rep would be at the dealership. I was expecting the usual push back. Instead, he looked at the car. Then he said we need it for one week to repair and paint. Please tell us in advance so we arrange for a loaner car from the regional office. 

Since that time I have had a few Toyota Celicas and Camrys. Almost bought a Maxima at one point but went back to Toyota because of that experience.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

m3s said:


> Yikes.. driving a brand new 2019 and the transmission is especially clunky. The interior is better than what I'd expect from a Japanese brand but not $50,000 better
> 
> My neighbours (block away) vehicle blew up in the middle of the night last winter and burnt down their house.. not sure what vehicle it was


WHAT???!!!


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## crooked beat (Jan 19, 2011)

ian said:


> My issue would be more that the faulty product. I would have a bigger issue with how the company did or did not respond to customer issues and defective product.
> 
> In my career, some of my most loyal customers were the ones that had a product or service issue that was resolved immediately to their satisfaction. Every manufacturer or service provider can have a challenge from time to time. The time to judge the vendor is how well they respond and what they do to make it 'right'.
> 
> ...


That is exactly why we left Honda. Our 2002 Civic had the fuel door release cable snap at 60,200 km, 200 km beyond the warranty. Honda refused to fix it. Honda Canada told us "we don't know of any problem with it". This is a well known documented problem with Civics/Acuras. There is a Canadian offering a DIY fix on youtube. Next car was a Toyota and we have bought them ever since. Toyota stands behind their products and do the right thing when their products fail.


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## Mechanic (Oct 29, 2013)

I absolutely hate shopping for a new vehicle. I have shopped a few times recently and not found any local dealers where they treat you fairly. After resigning to the fact that they are wanting full msrp for their vehicles, they then offer you 1/2 of the trade in value of your trade. I think it's worse when they know we don't want their finance but I know why, they get kickbacks on finance, warranties, loan insurance etc. One dealer even went so far as to tell me I couldn't have a 2019 model because he had potential sales for them (financing), but they had 2018's on the lot with $1000 off, lol. I told him anyone that took that deal would be a fool and left. One sales manager said if I liked the vehicle that the numbers didn't matter, right before he offered nothing for the trade, lol. I had to tell the last salesman the differences between the updated model specs as well, he didn't even know what type of transmission it used. At some point I will sell the trade and maybe just email an assortment of dealers for the best otd price on the specific vehicle we decide on and see if that works any better.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

_At some point I will sell the trade and maybe just email an assortment of dealers for the best otd price on the specific vehicle we decide on and see if that works any better._

....it doesn't, trust me....

took me a second to figure out what "otd price" meant....around here, we use the phrase "on the road"price , not "out the door" LOL


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)




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## marina628 (Dec 14, 2010)

A family member use to work for car dealership ,generally they have more room if you do not take the financing deal as they buy down the rate (usually to 0%) .Maybe a second hand car? If so maybe it is different.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Yes I was referring to buying a used car (2 year old trade in) from a dealer that needed it off the lot. Buying new you'd want to pay cash.. some actually claim it's cheaper to buy new with 0% than used but they must compare the best deal new to "sticker" price used, or smoking something that may or may not be legal nowadays


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

My Dad always drove his cars into the ground. So he had had the car towed away by an auto wrecker. For a couple of weeks, he was in denial saying he could get anywhere on the TTC. But he could not drive into the country to see us once a week.

So one Saturday (the last day of the month), I picked him up and we drove to all the dealerships that interested him. We found a one-year old loaner with original warranties and offered 9% off asking price at 5:35 pm. It was accepted if all cash. He did not have the cash so I gave him an interest-free loan which he paid off when his GIC came due. I simply used a margin loan to cover.

I am sure they took a loss on the deal but the extra sale must have put them into a higher bonus level for the month.


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