# The psychology of retiring



## TomB19 (Sep 24, 2015)

I've been thinking of retiring for 5 years. Easy year, I thought "let's put in one more year, just to be safe.". It never felt real.

Two weeks after my dad passed in March, I knew this would be my last year. I toyed with the idea of immediate retirement but decided to finish my current contract.

Now I don't know how I will make it to the end of the year. It seems like, now that my heart has decided to retire, my brain is having trouble staying on task.

Others must have been through this. I would appreciate some advice on managing this. It's not a financial problem but I know there are some smart people here and look forward to criticism, advice, anecdotes, or whatever. How did you hang on?


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

There's no formula for managing retirement, because each case is different. Some define themselves by their work, and as much as they looked forward to their retirement, they do a horrible job of the whole thing because their worth came from the work. Others hate their occupation and flourish once retired as they can finally pursue what they enjoy. 

The amount of finances available have a large effect. If you're able to do what you wish without worrying about the pennies, then it's a lot easier.

The first year or so is like being on vacation, and I don't believe anyone should make too many decisions in that honeymoon period. After that time has passed you start to feel retired and then you can decide. Be prepared for everyone who still works to ask, "what do you do all day?". My pat answer has always been, "whatever I want".

I set my own sights on retiring at age 55 and it was a bit distracting in the last year or so, but once I was 55 I pulled the plug and that was that. I've been retired for 11 years now and can't imagine how I found the time to work. What a nuisance it was. Now I do what I want. 

ltr


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

like_to_retire said:


> ...
> 
> I set my own sights on retiring at age 55 and it was a bit distracting in the last year or so, but once I was 55 I pulled the plug and that was that. I've been retired for 11 years now *and can't imagine how I found the time to work. What a nuisance it was. Now I do what I want*.
> 
> ltr


 ... quite inspiring despite your moniker says you would like_to_retire ... and you were determined to do that with Freedom 55. 

Unless you love your job to death, working seems to be prostituting your time.


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## RBull (Jan 20, 2013)

TomB19, just do it. If you're stuck ask yourself the real reason for staying at work and not retiring. Go from there. 

My story which may or may not be relevant to you. 

I retired at 55 - a few days after my birthday. That was nearly 3 years ago to the day now and it was a great decision for me and my wife. We are really enjoying retired life. 

I retired after 2.5 years working 24hr/wk (semi retired) in the same role I worked at 40 hours/wk for 2.5 years prior, in my "phase down" career of 5 years after selling a small business I owned, which was preceded by a challenging corporate sales management role for much of my working life. I had planned on retiring a few years earlier and I stayed on PT "just to be safe" as you described it, although it probably is real for us. What made me leave and fully retire was I like to give whatever I do my all and I was starting to lose the motivation to work really hard and do the most for customers. Although it would have been easy to still do fairly well "floating". To me that wasn't fair to anyone, and I wasn't going to be as happy so I pulled the plug, giving my employer about 4 months notice and haven't looked back since. I had no problem those 4 mths once I made the decision and knew my destiny; and had my most successful sales period then. LOL, made it harder to leave.....no.... not true! 

My wife fully retired about 6 mths before I went P/T. 

It's nice to do completely what we want now and choose how busy we want to be. Life is very good.

G/L whatever you choose.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

My take is the OP has made the decision to retire and finances are not a concern. What is debilitating right now is the obligation, or at least the moral and professional 'duty', to finish his contract. I found it tough, once I made the decision to retire, to make it to a 'set' date. In my case, it was the 3-4 months to get to a new birthday to reduce the discount I would have gotten with my DB pension. It was one of the longest 3-4 months of my life. My heart and mind was no longer in it and I could hardly wait to turn in my keys. 

It is a long way to the end of December. If the OP is counting the days and weeks, he really should find a way to cut the remaining time dramatically if possible. He is not doing his client/employer any real favours and is certainly not doing himself any favours.


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## GreatLaker (Mar 23, 2014)

I had a similar experience to AR and Tom.

I left a j*b where my company was downsizing to sell itself, then was bought by a US firm that downsized it even more. All of my age and experience peers got laid off years before I did, so I was like walking dead, but somehow still had the drive to keep w*rking because I had not planned to leave quite yet. Then after I left I investigated doing some freelance work and got one contract. It was not fun. Lots of arguing among different members of the team. Someone would give me info to w*rk from, then another person would say the first person's info was all wrong. And they could barely figure out how to pay me on a contract; you wouldn't think that would be very hard. While doing networking investigating freelance opportunities all I was was dweebs filing in and out of big offices. I had a plan, goals and enough money to do it... lost interest entirely.

What kept me going in the contract role despite the difficulties was the person that I was mainly working with had some hard deadlines and I would feel remiss if I let her down. So despite all the setbacks I did my best to communicate well with her and w*rk together complete the requirements.

So Tom if you would be leaving someone in the lurch by pulling the ripcord early, then have a frank discussion with that someone and ensure you can w*rk productively and get the j*b done. If not, don't torture yourself. Two guys I w*rked with got laid off then died within a couple of months. My 2 best friends died within 3 years, one of aggressive cancer, and the other I found sleeping with his eyes open after a heart attack. Life is too short...


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

> Two guys I w*rked with got laid off then died within a couple of months. My 2 best friends died within 3 years, one of aggressive cancer, and the other I found sleeping with his eyes open after a heart attack. Life is too short...


 This is very individual.... My former manager (and btw my friend) got divorced, got laid off and ... died from heart attack 2 months later  .. and he was 48!
My other friend died at 46 from cancer and he was really suffering last 6 months...

I was planning to retire at 55 , but I knew that very likely I will be laid off earlier as our company got sold to Indian one and outsourcing was very agressive .... and yes, I got laid off at my 50th B-day ... So far I;m retired ( or maybe better to say semi-retired as end of may I should start getting EI for 38 weeks) for 9 months...

So far I was enjoying my new status... Finally I was able to take better care of my health, as truly while working I couldn't afford going to doctors as I needed, signed into gym and enjoying workouts, started cooking , do more home chores, a bit renovate house , have more time to learn Spanish  ... 

My wife is still working and likes her job , so now she has more time to concentrate on her job ...
I hope she will retire in several years that we can enjoy life more...

btw, my dad also passed away at 48 from heart attack and major reason was his very stressful job... it was in USSR, but in this case country doesn't matter


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Very interesting insights...(from someone who is not retired and cannot do so yet).


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## pwm (Jan 19, 2012)

I worked at "MegaCorp" in a cubicle farm for 35 years and cannot even comprehend how someone would want to keep working one single day longer than they had to. I quit at 55 which was 12 years ago. Every day I wake up feeling blessed that I no longer have to drag myself in there. My advice is just finish up on a cordial basis and move on. Consider your career as a closed file. Your work place will have forgotten you faster than you can imagine.


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## birdman (Feb 12, 2013)

I had a great job as a CEO and made good money and did a merger in 2001 at the age of 55 and the deal was that I would be the only one losing their job. While I had been discussing the matter in confidence when my wife she just about fell off her chair when I told her it was going to happen. Her first words were "what are you going to?" with obvious panic in her voice. I think she was concerned that I would be under her feet all the time and would cramp her style. Anyways, it happened and while I was very happy in my work I just loved retirement and 16 yrs later have never looked back. The first week or two I really missed the people, the coffee break chatter, lunches, and day to day interaction with my business contacts, etc. However, this quickly passed. Two months later we took possession of a lovely house which required significant updating and on a large lot which was also in disrepair. Spent the next 9 months working side by side with my wife doing updates, often putting in 12 hour days. We loved every minute of it. What a change from sitting behind a desk! We were fortunate in that we both had joint and individual interests (wife: shopping, tennis, knitting, gardening, etc) (me: badminton, fishing, hunting, yard work, etc) (joint: skiing, hiking, travel, yard, socializing). We still live this active lifestyle and our health is good. Thought I had lots of $$ when I retired but inflation, kids, and spending does take its toll 16 years later and I do worry about this a bit but am sure we will be ok. Pension income of about $40,000.PA and investments of around $1.6(mostly GICS, MIC's, and $450,000. in the market) but I have some bad debts, ski condo special assessment, and gifts,etc this year which will bring the amount to about 1.45. Unfortunately my 15 yr sizeable annual payment when I retired finished last year. It does take money to retire and is the one thing I worry about a bit. In any event, life is great, work was great, but for us retirement is even better!


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## Ag Driver (Dec 13, 2012)

Deleted


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## CalgaryPotato (Mar 7, 2015)

pwm said:


> I worked at "MegaCorp" in a cubicle farm for 35 years and cannot even comprehend how someone would want to keep working one single day longer than they had to. I quit at 55 which was 12 years ago. Every day I wake up feeling blessed that I no longer have to drag myself in there. My advice is just finish up on a cordial basis and move on. Consider your career as a closed file. Your work place will have forgotten you faster than you can imagine.


I think a lot depends on the workplace. Where I work, many people work after they have already earned a full pension. And many others, retire with the full pension, and then return to work a few months later, and work for many more years while collecting their pension.


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

Today I woke up at 7:30, made a coffee and have been stressing about about whether to buy the Orvis flyrod or save money and go with Scientific Anglers rod. 

"FISH ON!"


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

None of this appears to be really relevant to the OP. ISTM Tom is wrestling with staying to the end of his contract now that his body and mind has now made the decision to retire. How and what does he do....to go from now (decision to retire) to actual retirement date. I repeat what I said originally... If he is really counting the days and weeks to get to the endpoint (marking them off the calendar so to speak), find a way to move up the retirement date. Life is too short to suffer through 8 months of clock watching. OTOH, if he can find a way to enjoy these 8 months at work....then the solution to the problem will have been found.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

CalgaryPotato said:


> I think a lot depends on the workplace ...


Depends on workplace, the people involved, any leverage etc. 

I can recall articles about retired IBM folk who were bored in retirement that did not want to work full time. IBM came calling with flexible working arrangements that would not have been offered during their career. Management came to understand that the software wasn't being taught anymore by schools plus newer employees were more likely to quit than learn what to them was old/archaic crap that was in their view, career limiting.


Like so many things ... YMMV. :biggrin:


Cheers


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## GreatLaker (Mar 23, 2014)

I don't understand people that say they cannot retire because they don't have 35 years or 85 points in a DB plan so they will not get a full pension. To me that's asking the wrong question. They should be asking if they have enough to retire on, given a good understanding of projected retirement expenses and a conservative assessment of expected investment returns plus a reasonable safety factor. But most of them probably have never run the numbers or even thought about it much, so they feel if they have a full pension it will be enough to retire on.

It's like being in a restaurant and refusing to stop eating until you have finished everything on your plate even though you are stuffed, don't need the excess calories and will feel awful.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

TomB19 said:


> .... Others must have been through this. I would appreciate some advice on managing this ...
> How did you hang on?


Not me personally ... but some of the strategies I have seen are:

a) mark a calendar so one can see the X's making one closer and closer to retirement (it was a visual type person).
b) talking to the contract holder to see if there were ways of shortening the contract that the other party was happy with.
c) bringing in a person for "training purposes" then when the other party was confident it the ability of the "trainee", pitch them as a replacement. 


That's all I can recall ... I'll add more if I remember anything.


Cheers


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

I retired from 3 companies. Each had its own issues. But in the last one where I was CEO was a 5 year contract that ended June 30th. The Board and CFO knew about it but the rest of the team demanded a transition period. So for 6 weeks, I had to put in the time. So I understand your feelings. But it will be over before you know it!


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## CalgaryPotato (Mar 7, 2015)

AltaRed said:


> None of this appears to be really relevant to the OP. ISTM Tom is wrestling with staying to the end of his contract now that his body and mind has now made the decision to retire. How and what does he do....to go from now (decision to retire) to actual retirement date. I repeat what I said originally... If he is really counting the days and weeks to get to the endpoint (marking them off the calendar so to speak), find a way to move up the retirement date. Life is too short to suffer through 8 months of clock watching. OTOH, if he can find a way to enjoy these 8 months at work....then the solution to the problem will have been found.


True, I don't really know what to add for Tom. He doesn't seem like the type of person who is going to have any struggles with retirement. He has a very full life and will doesn't seem like he'll miss the day to day grind of things. Also by the sounds of it, he'll still be maintaining many of his rentals for at least some period which is also a form of work.

I think there are many others who retire with absolutely no sense of what their life will be in retirement who can struggle, but that isn't he case here....


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

frase said:


> I had a great job as a CEO and made good money and did a merger in 2001 at the age of 55 and the deal was that I would be the only one losing their job. While I had been discussing the matter in confidence when my wife she just about fell off her chair when I told her it was going to happen.
> 
> Her first words were "what are you going to?" with obvious panic in her voice. I think she was concerned that I would be under her feet all the time and would cramp her style ...


Potentially a valid concern. 

My dad figured he was indispensable so that there would be some "how do we handle this?" calls once he retired. When they didn't happen, he started trying to improve how my mom was handling the cooking in the kitchen. She had to tell him "I have been doing this for forty plus years ... go do something else". 




GreatLaker said:


> I don't understand people that say they cannot retire because they don't have 35 years or 85 points in a DB plan so they will not get a full pension. To me that's asking the wrong question. They should be asking if they have enough to retire on, given a good understanding of projected retirement expenses and a conservative assessment of expected investment returns plus a reasonable safety factor ...


I suspect you are assuming a level of interest/knowledge that isn't there. It's easy to read off the pension pamphlet what is needed for full pension versus figure something they have likely avoided most of their lives.


Cheers


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

CalgaryPotato said:


> I think a lot depends on the workplace. Where I work, many people work after they have already earned a full pension. And many others, retire with the full pension, and then return to work a few months later, and work for many more years while collecting their pension.


 ... so where do you work? other than guessing it's in Calgary ... I would love to work there provided it's not a bank.


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## pwm (Jan 19, 2012)

Beaver101 said:


> ... so where do you work? other than guessing it's in Calgary ... I would love to work there provided it's not a bank.


I had the same question. What job is so excellent that someone would keep working at it if they didn't have to?


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

If it is being opened up beyond the MegaCorp cubicle farm, my brother-in-law's barber took about five years to follow through on his accountant's recommendation that he would do better financially by retiring then selling the building.

Based on the number of people who are on multiple boards as well as a full time occupation such as farmer or university prof or retired premier or PM that I read on annual reports, some of them must enjoy the role.

Our current DBA at work doesn't see every stopping working ... just cutting back to a more limited consulting role.


Cheers


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## TomB19 (Sep 24, 2015)

I really appreciate the discussion in this thread. Thank you to every one of you.

To be clear, I wasn't asking for financial advice. Also, there is nothing wrong with my work or my employer. For what I do, there is not a better employer or work environment.

It's just the depressing March to the end. Differences of opinion seem more petty. I leave 20 minutes after the end of the day and walk past people, who I know will continue working for hours, and think, "if they only knew the futility of their effort...". In short, I'm a bad employee. Lol!

To be fair, I am doing work that is important to the company and I have been documenting every aspect of my job and really everything in the department for months. They will be left in good shape.

I harken back to my early days in the industry and recall savoring every moment of the day and extra time I out in. It was glorious and I would have done it for free.

You folks are a great support group. Thank you for sharing the insight.


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

Not a worry in the world cept is the tide gonna hit my chair...grats on choosing the blue pill!


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## GreatLaker (Mar 23, 2014)

TomB19 said:


> To be fair, I am doing work that is important to the company and I have been documenting every aspect of my job and really everything in the department for months. They will be left in good shape.


Hmph. My ex-employer had no policy or process at all for documenting people's knowledge or procedures when they left. 

My former manager sent me a message asking if I had some time to answer some questions. I knew through the grapevine he needed it for an important request for quotation.
My answer: I'm not willing to provide free services to Zxxx. My contract rate is $100/hr with a 40 hour minimum.
[email protected]$$e$


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

^^^^

Sometimes the policy is great on paper but between other priorities and replacements that figure "if person X could do it, I can figure it out without documentation".


One of the more ironic situations was the guy who was upset at his manager enough to find another job then quit. When the knowledge documentation schedule he had planned out was interrupted, he was livid. I asked him why he was letting it get to him as from my POV, as long as he documented that the shift was management's decision - why did he care? 

He could go the $140 an hour, 40 hour minimum route if anything came up later.

I don't think it was as calming as I would have liked but as he was already on his way out, I didn't see why he would waste some much time & energy getting his shorts in a knot.


Cheers


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## olivaw (Nov 21, 2010)

TomB19 said:


> I really appreciate the discussion in this thread. Thank you to every one of you.
> 
> To be clear, I wasn't asking for financial advice. Also, there is nothing wrong with my work or my employer. For what I do, there is not a better employer or work environment.
> 
> ...


Your situation sounds eerily similar to what I faced in my final work year before retirement. My employer was great so I did everything that I could to manage the transition. 

I didn't reply sooner because I was unable to manage my final months in a healthy manner. 

As a department head, my initial goal was to make sure that my department could run on autopilot indefinitely. That involved delegation and documentation. It was boring but I stayed engaged by reminding myself that it was for the good of a company that had treated me very well. 

Then we hired my replacement. I had hoped to spend the final three months showing him the ropes but it didn't work out. Our approaches were too different. I was a traditional technical type who had risen to a leadership role. He was a gregarious type of individual. Budgets, plans and implementation schedules were not something that interested him. It wasn't so much that we disagreed on the approach as that he didn't see such things as relevant to the role. It became .... awkward ....and not awkward in the healthy way either. Awkward in the unhealthy way where you try to remain polite and professional while stuffing the desire to drop kick somebody across the office. Awkward in the way that you start muttering to yourself on the drive home. Awkward in the way that you find yourself repeating the serenity prayer on an ongoing basis. :beaten:

Strange as this sounds, I had the occasional bad dreams about it for months after my retirement date. The bad dreams ended after my replacement "resigned". 

So yeah Tom. Don't listen to a word that I have to say on this topic. I am the poster child for how *NOT* to manage the final months before retirement.


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## NorthKC (Apr 1, 2013)

GreatLaker said:


> I don't understand people that say they cannot retire because they don't have 35 years or 85 points in a DB plan so they will not get a full pension. To me that's asking the wrong question. They should be asking if they have enough to retire on, given a good understanding of projected retirement expenses and a conservative assessment of expected investment returns plus a reasonable safety factor. But most of them probably have never run the numbers or even thought about it much, so they feel if they have a full pension it will be enough to retire on.
> 
> It's like being in a restaurant and refusing to stop eating until you have finished everything on your plate even though you are stuffed, don't need the excess calories and will feel awful.


That's because some of the penalty for taking an early pension is quite severe depending on the workplace. For example, at my father's workplace before he retired, if you're short 1 year, etc, you would only get 60% of full pension that he would have been entitled to which is a steep penalty. He was also thinking of protecting my mother as she would only get 65% of the pension that my father was getting should he pass away. So instead of $50,000 pension (making up numbers here) he would get for full pension, he would get only $30,000 because he was one day short of the necessary requirements. Then if he passed away, my mother would only get $19,500 (65% of $30,000) which is not enough for her for her medical needs. 
Sometimes, employees are thinking long-term and need to work longer. Just giving you my perspective.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

TomB19 said:


> ... To be clear, I wasn't asking for financial advice. Also, there is nothing wrong with my work or my employer. For what I do, there is not a better employer or work environment.
> It's just the depressing March to the end. Differences of opinion seem more petty ...


What has usually helped me is similar situations is to book time doing stuff I want to do that is also of company benefit that is separate from whatever the irritation points. Knowing yourself is key.




olivaw said:


> ... Then we hired my replacement. I had hoped to spend the final three months showing him the ropes but it didn't work out. Our approaches were too different ... It became .... awkward .... Awkward in the unhealthy way where you try to remain polite and professional while stuffing the desire to drop kick somebody across the office. Awkward in the way that you start muttering to yourself on the drive home. Awkward in the way that you find yourself repeating the serenity prayer on an ongoing basis. :beaten:
> 
> Strange as this sounds, I had the occasional bad dreams about it for months after my retirement date. The bad dreams ended after my replacement "resigned" ...


Never understood why there would be bad dreams etc. ... unless one owned the business. I have had to do something physical to work out the "drop kick" desires but so far, these types of issues have never affected sleep/dreams.


Cheers


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## Daniel A. (Mar 20, 2011)

Retirement is a process, in my case I'd worked for 39 years in that time I was out of work for a total of 6 weeks.
After so many years of time commitment to wake up and realize I could do anything I wanted no more working shifts being awake at 3-4 am.
In the first three years of retirement I would not make any time commitments, I slowly realized how much of life I'd put into the company things I didn't need to do anymore.
Funny thing is when we are absorbed in routine we don't see the forest for the trees, I'd never really seen the politics until I left, so much energy helping make a company successful, going to work even when I didn't feel well, trying to schedule family life around work. Its been seven years now and I don't miss anything about work.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Trying to leave an organization on autopilot seldom works. You need to think of your departure as death because it is to the organization.

Do what you can while you can and then move on without looking back!


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## CalgaryPotato (Mar 7, 2015)

TomB19 said:


> It's just the depressing March to the end. Differences of opinion seem more petty. I leave 20 minutes after the end of the day and walk past people, who I know will continue working for hours, and think, "if they only knew the futility of their effort...". In short, I'm a bad employee. Lol!


I know for some it can actually be a freeing experience. It's like playing at the casino with house money. Someone raises a ridiculous idea because of a political reason, you can call them out on it, because what are they going to do, fire you? That idea you've had in your head for the last 5 years, but didn't want to bring up, because you were worried about fall out? Raise it up.

Although you don't seem like the type to shy down from speaking your mind anyway, it can still be an interesting shift, that I've seen in some people retiring where they can be highly effective on their way out the door of being an agent of positive change.


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

"I know for some it can actually be a freeing experience. It's like playing at the casino with house money. "

I could totally see that.

In our organization, there is a request that you "speak your mind" and "be open and honest" but the reality is they don't want to hear what you have to say. You're sometimes shown the door if you do.

.....so if you've ..... "seen in some people retiring where they can be highly effective on their way out the door of being an agent of positive change" then that's a great thing.


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## atrp2biz (Sep 22, 2010)

I'll be temporarily retired in about a week. With the recent addition to the family, I'll be taking a paternity leave for the balance of the year. I'm not sure what to expect. My wife thinks I'll be extremely bored. I'm definitely excited about it. I was amused by the reactions I received when I informed colleagues about my intentions. A couple of old-school execs looked at me like a had a third eye. They were likely thinking "can't say that...can't say that..." so they just said it was great.

I'm not sure what's in store for me when/if I return. Whatever happens, the next few months will likely provide me with greater clarity as to what is important in my life.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

I walked away and never looked back. Hard at first because I was used to 12 hour days and phone calls at unsocial hours. Had lots to do with getting our house ready to sell, downsizing etc. Don't miss work at all. So very glad I went early rather than later.


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## olivaw (Nov 21, 2010)

Eclectic12 said:


> Never understood why there would be bad dreams etc. ... unless one owned the business. I have had to do something physical to work out the "drop kick" desires but so far, these types of issues have never affected sleep/dreams.


Difficult to explain. I did not own the business but I was part of the core management team. The company treated us unbelievably well and I came to view it as a sort of secondary family. I didn't dream about the job before I retired so I didn't expect to dream about it after I retired. I think the dreams had something to do with letting go of decades of stress, responsibility and self-doubt. The dreams lasted for roughly six months. 




kcowan said:


> Trying to leave an organization on autopilot seldom works. You need to think of your departure as death because it is to the organization.
> 
> Do what you can while you can and then move on without looking back!


You're right, no organization can go on autopilot but a well run department can continue indefinitely after the loss of the department leader, IMO. 

Letting go without looking back is the healthy way to deal with it. I chose the other way - not intentionally.


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## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

Quick update.

This thread was started at a low point, for me. I was having a tough time.

Since then, it's been a wild ride.

I've been given a new assignment that is the most interesting thing I've done in 20 years. What's more, I'm working with someone who is a positive, high energy, person and I am enjoying my job more than I can ever remember doing. Really odd.

They talk about keeping me and I'm starting to wonder if I will stay, minus an extended winter vacation, of course. We'll see.


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## janus10 (Nov 7, 2013)

That sounds great! If you are really enjoying it, why not stay? If you're paired with someone who also adds to your enjoyment of working, why break that up? I think one of the best scenarios is not needing to work, yet working because you really want to without it concerning financial gain.


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## Userkare (Nov 17, 2014)

I informed my employer a year in advance that I would be retiring. I requested that in my last 6 months, I step down from an R&D management position and work in the customer support department to train the CSRs about the inner workings of the product. They thought it was a good idea. I spent most of the time writing manuals and giving courses. I came to appreciate the job that CSRs do, and they appreciated the opportunity to pick my brain; I was one of the original designers of the software contained in the product. This made the transition from a high stress position to a low stress position to a no stress retirement position much smoother.

As it happens, I got into computers and electronics as a hobby that evolved into a career. Now retired, I have gone back to designing and building things that I want.... with no delivery schedule, no clueless product manager, no Gantt charts... just one fussy customer.


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## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

I wanted to check back to this thread but my post doesn't contain the meat of what I'm going through. It would be nice if this thread would be helpful to others going through what many of us are going through, with the excellent anecdotes and advice shared by the folks here. Each and every post in this thread has been read and appreciated. My sincere appreciation to all of you.


Let me take another shot at the emotional side of this.

Life:

- phase 0: Wait to be an adult
- phase 1: Wonder why phase 2 isn't coming more quickly. Will you ever be old enough to do stuff?
- phase 2: You are given a chance in the workforce and throw yourself into it. It's the first thing you've done that seems to really matter in the world.
- phase 3: Job less interesting. Take vacations to avoid the monotony.
- phase 4: Hey! How did you get this old? Now the workplace is full of assholes. How many more years do you have to go? You know you can't save enough for retirement but maybe it's time to consider it.
- phase 5: Retirement is all that matters. Work simply buys bullets for the retirement gun.
- phase 6: When do you pull the plug? You would like to have a spare $100M in your retirement account because you're apprehensive about what might happen in the next 35 years but a quick check of your balance indicates this may not be realistic.
- phase 7: Parents, friends, family, people at work... all dieing. Everyone seems to be sick or dieing. The only people who don't have a major ailment are the youngsters in phase 2 and they spend every weekend making themselves sick and trying to kill themselves.
- phase 8: Stay? Go? There isn't enough money but somehow you must make it work.
- phase 9: More death. You find yourself oddly equipped to deal with it. Life seems more precious but less critical. Dieing isn't as scary as it used to be. 20% of your school age peers have gone. How can this happen? You're only in your 50s? You hate cancer. This is the first you realize you or your wife could literally be diagnosed with cancer at any moment. You begin to truely understand how fortunate you are for having some reasonable, but far from perfect, health but the beat of the life drum is slowing. The pettiness of workplace squabbles over minutia takes on a new clarity.

I am here -> phase 10: You have a certain amount saved. It doesn't matter how much it is; it's simply a matter of living within what you have. You realize you've developed a whole new outlook on work. You can leave at any time but most of your friends are at work and that will clearly isolate you further than you have done in the years of pursuing financial gain. You find yourself enjoying work more than you can recall. You get to work early, every day. You notice people you once respected engage in passionate squabbles over ridiculous things like the proper way to neaten cabling at an installation and what color the velcro should be. You realize they have an irrational perspective on life but you continue to respect them as friends and you know they will succeed at what they do.

Thoughtful speculation -> phase 11: How lonely will you be when you retire? Will you be able to make new friends at this age? Your wife is great and thoughts of retirement have deepened your love for her but you understand you need to socialize with other people too. You like the idea of moving to a warmer city and making new friends but if you only have a small handful of friends in the city you've lived in for 50 years, how successful can you be in kindling new relationships in a foreign location? You know you will be busy but how will you deal without having a purpose in life? Will you still have drive?


Rearview lessons, from my perspective:

- I started saving from a very young age but have been set back to zero twice. Each time, it's been far easier to reach a comfortable financial level. It actually isn't that hard but it takes time and energy. Things you don't have when you get old.
- It's too late to do almost all of the things I thought I would do some day. They should have been listed, prioritized, and executed.
- I should have taken more risk. Way more risk.
- I should have spent more time with friends, although I am fortunate to associate with excellent people who have responded warmly to rekindle relationships after years of neglect
- During my middle age, I completely lost track of the importance of friends. I was blinded by career and the pursuit of financial independence.
- Anyone can be successful if they roll up their sleeves and engage in life. The proper way to view money is that it is an investment tool. Maximize the purchase of both appreciating assets and productive assets while minimizing outright consumerism and purposeless compulsive purchasing.
- Watching television beyond a bare minimum is the enemy of success.
- Friends and communities (such as this site) can provide a lot of support. This has surprised me. I've always been the most independent person I know but I've only recently realized how much I need other people in my life.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

^ Thanks for sharing the above details. 

I'm sure every working stiff (and/or human being) shares at least one item or one of those issues in each of your phases listed above. Without a doubt, phase 7 -no one will bypass that and will be an eye-opening (or enlightenment) phase for each of us. 

Hope you don't mind this silly question - what is your age spread of each of those phases? I can't see phase 0 as being 5 years old or that they do not follow a consistent age spread (eg. 5 yrs or a decade?), just they are your life experience phases.


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## Dilbert (Nov 20, 2016)

TomB16: +1 - Nicely put!


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## Userkare (Nov 17, 2014)

Well, everybody is different. We each respond to the phases of life, as you call them, in different ways.

Career is an important factor for a large part of one's life. If you really love what you're doing, and can't wait each morning to get into work, then there's no reason to retire. Work until they carry you out the door in a zipper bag. 

For others, work is just a necessity to put food on the table, and roof over head; there's absolutely no joy, or feeling of fulfillment in it. For them, working becomes toxic; they dread every morning that they have to go to work. In that environment, their death is hastened by their sad life attitude. If they retire, and have no outside interests, nothing to do with themselves other than mope around the house day after day, they won't last for very long.

Friends are important, but I mean true life-long friends. I know someone who had a lot of 'friends'; the best friends money could buy! As long as the free beer tap was open, they would be right there. Everyone thought he was such a popular guy. When he retired, and the party-money was tight, he found himself very lonely, gained over 100 lbs, and died within 18 months.

So, I don't know what you're looking for. Nobody can give you the step by step instructions for retirement emotional bliss; those are somewhere in your own head - you just have to dig them out.


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Dilbert said:


> TomB16: +1 - Nicely put!


Wow, that's insightful...thanks for sharing.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

> Career is an important factor for a large part of one's life. If you really love what you're doing, and can't wait each morning to get into work, then there's no reason to retire. Work until they carry you out the door in a zipper bag.


 ... so this is no truth in this headline?

*



People Start Hating Their Jobs at Age 35

Click to expand...

*https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-08-21/people-start-hating-their-jobs-at-age-35

Man, after reading the above article, retirement can't come fast enough now ...


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## Userkare (Nov 17, 2014)

Beaver101 said:


> ... so this is no truth in this headline?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


_Johanna Bodnyk worked as a culture and communications coordinator at the Center for Middle Eastern Studies at Harvard University for six years. At a certain point, her friends were nearly all married and starting families, and she realized her current relationship wasn’t going to last. That prompted her to reevaluate a lot of things in life—including her job.

Two years ago, at age 34, she switched careers and learned how to code. “Your 30s are both personally and professionally a time when people take stock and make a change,” she said._

Wow, she became a coder? There's a job that can't be outsourced to some kid in Bangalore who will do it for a tenth of what she's paid. No stress there, eh?


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

Userkare said:


> ...
> 
> Wow, she became a coder? There's a job that can't be outsourced to some kid in Bangalore who will do it for a tenth of what she's paid. No stress there, eh?


 ... well, that's the unfortunate headwinds the boomers' kids will be facing in the workforce.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

TomB16 said:


> I wanted to check back to this thread but my post doesn't contain the meat of what I'm going through. It would be nice if this thread would be helpful to others going through what many of us are going through, with the excellent anecdotes and advice shared by the folks here. Each and every post in this thread has been read and appreciated. My sincere appreciation to all of you.
> 
> 
> Let me take another shot at the emotional side of this.
> ...




lovely writing Tom

a great perspective - from many angles, at many depths - on life at a certain stage

don't let this piece get lost, it should be re-published somewhere some day


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Aside from the middle where I had a number of different positions, the chronology is very typical.

I took a step to change up my life 22 years ago, but I would encourage you to look ahead. If you don't see opportunities to make new friends, find a place where you can. Retirement is a new beginning, not the beginning of the end. For the first time you are free of the daily grind. Find out how to leverage that freedom.


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

Could not agree more. Move forward, leverage your freedom, embrace change to your advantage.

Forget about any norms that may be weighing you down and preventing you from thinking out of the box and doing something unconventional if you so wish. Grab those opportunities.


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## TomB16 (Jun 8, 2014)

Beaver101 said:


> Hope you don't mind this silly question - what is your age spread of each of those phases? I can't see phase 0 as being 5 years old or that they do not follow a consistent age spread (eg. 5 yrs or a decade?), just they are your life experience phases.


These are the mindset phases of life, from my perspective. There is no consistent age spread.

This was generated from an introspective walk through the memory of my life. I remember when I tore into work like there was a prize inside the box. I remember when I went to work to feed myself and nothing more. Now, I go to work because I enjoy the people I work with.

By the way, it has become clear that I will not extend the current contract. When it ends, we will move on. It's the only decision which is fair to my wife. It's her life, too. So, I shall savor each day.

My perspective seems to mostly be a common view, based on reading other people in this thread and others. My story is that of one ant in a massive colony. I appreciate the helpful words from those who were on point in this.


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## awesomeame (Nov 15, 2011)

psychology of retiring? Man, I would retire tomorrow if I could eek out 35k/yr income off investments and had a home paid for. Hit the ball a few times, do some motions on the exercise machines and drink coffee with all the other geezers at the health club every day...I could start tomorrow, that's paradise

Matt


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

> Hit the ball a few times, do some motions on the exercise machines and drink coffee with all the other geezers at the health club every day...I could start tomorrow, that's paradise


That's what pretty much I'm doing....  Partially retired from Sep 2017


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## awesomeame (Nov 15, 2011)

gibor365 said:


> That's what pretty much I'm doing....  Partially retired from Sep 2017


soooo jealous!!

Matt


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## atrp2biz (Sep 22, 2010)

Well, I'm 3 months into my 'retirement' at the age of 38 (actually on pat leave). So far I'm not bored at all, but the kids will be back in school in a couple of weeks. When they do, I'll fill my time with the gym, biking, golf, trading and making sure all 'house-stuff' is in order. I'm supposed to go back to work in January, but DW and are discussing if that's what I actually want. What I don't want is a desire to go back to work while I've been off work for a couple of years. It's hard to get back in with a gap like that in the CV. But as it is right now, life is great and I don't miss work at all!


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

atrp2biz said:


> Well, I'm 3 months into my 'retirement' at the age of 38 (actually on pat leave). So far I'm not bored at all, but the kids will be back in school in a couple of weeks. When they do, I'll fill my time with the gym, biking, golf, trading and making sure all 'house-stuff' is in order. I'm supposed to go back to work in January, but DW and are discussing if that's what I actually want. What I don't want is a desire to go back to work while I've been off work for a couple of years. It's hard to get back in with a gap like that in the CV. But as it is right now, life is great and I don't miss work at all!


After not working almost 1 year, I don't miss it at all! As you, I fill my time with gym, started playing golf, following markets, finally have time to paint all house, started cooking (and like it ).


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

I'm still working on telling my employer to take the job and shove it ... or maybe it'll go the other way? Anyhow, thanks for sharing these retirement experiences ... indeed looking like a new beginning as kcowan puts it ... more time for self which is priceless.


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## vern1 (Sep 14, 2017)

TomB16 said:


> I wanted to check back to this thread but my post doesn't contain the meat of what I'm going through. It would be nice if this thread would be helpful to others going through what many of us are going through, with the excellent anecdotes and advice shared by the folks here. Each and every post in this thread has been read and appreciated. My sincere appreciation to all of you.
> 
> 
> Let me take another shot at the emotional side of this.
> ...


Damn man, thats almost spiritual. I just came across this website yesterday and joined because of all the insights esp yours.

There are many parallels with what you have described here with what i am currently going through. I have had a long career in the financial industry and currently in my mid 50's. My heart is no longer in the job and i am spending way too much time thinking "whats next?". Its a great job but am tired of the BS with clients etc. The young guys always trying to steal my clients etc etc

I have decent money tucked away and my ace in the whole is my wife is making +$200k, has no intention of retiring for 5-8 years and she is fully supportive of me doing whatever i want. I can leave most of my money for when she retires and we can live off her earnings in the meantime. Maybe a few extra bucks for me to do a few things on my own

So i am trying to figure out why i should stay and am not coming up with a lot of good answers. But i am equally thrilled/scared with retiring, the concept of now what? I will do some alone time, maybe bike down the west coast of the US, drive my car down to CA next winter etc. Who knows

Cheers, thanks for the means of venting with people who have been through this


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## vern1 (Sep 14, 2017)

TomB16 said:


> I wanted to check back to this thread but my post doesn't contain the meat of what I'm going through. It would be nice if this thread would be helpful to others going through what many of us are going through, with the excellent anecdotes and advice shared by the folks here. Each and every post in this thread has been read and appreciated. My sincere appreciation to all of you.
> 
> 
> Let me take another shot at the emotional side of this.
> ...


Brilliant and well said! Having many of the same thoughts. Want to grab a beer 

Cheers


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## Pluto (Sep 12, 2013)

tomb16,
In reading your lengthy phases post, it seems to me that finacially you have reached your goals and feel financially able to retire. But you have an attachment to the people you have been working with, as you say most of your friends are at work. i think that before you retire, you need to plan how you will keep in touch with them. You could, for example, invite them for barbecue, and try to plant the idea in ther heads to take turns hosting. don't know what you do for recreation, but suppose you like camping, and so does some people at work. Coordinate a trip so you are together on vacation. Invite some over to watch hockey or whatever. There are lots of ways to stay their friends while making new friends in retirement.


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