# Google is creepy



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

When I log into gmail, and look at google calendars, I see that it has inserted several friend and family birthdays into the calendar.

I don't like this. It's creepy, and it shows that google is analyzing very private information (birthdays). Birthdays are private because they can be used to steal identities.

Does anyone know where google is getting this birthday information from? Perhaps it's mining emails I sent in the past in which I said "happy birthday". That's my best guess, since some of the dates match up with past "happy birthday" emails. The reason I'm curious is that, if it's something other than reading my old emails, this means there is a huge privacy leak somewhere which exposes people's birthdays.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

I would be surprised to learn that they are mining emails to look for that info....but I’m probably naive to such things, as are most Canadians. Interested to see what you find out. I wonder if your birthday friends have given their birthdate to Google at some point when setting up a Google account.....and now Google is consolidating all know info.

I do recall many years ago when Google first started.....someone from their team said they want to gather the full spectrum of all human knowledge. Reading between the lines, they said it went beyond the obvious consolidation of all historical info....they wanted the ability for someone to Google “what was I doing or what was james4b doing feb 20, 2014 at 1:42pm”. They want everyone’s personal history to be discoverable. Imagine your grandchildren being able to see your 5th birthday party from YOUR perspective. I think this was around the time Google glasses were being tested.
I digress.

my first realization with respect privacy was when I downloaded The info Facebook has on me. I’m not a regular user but there is a local Facebook page I reference for our neighbourhood. In any event, downloaded all the info. I noticed Facebook had the name and phone number for one of my friends who I know doesn’t use Facebook. I realized that FB had gathered the info from my phone’s contact list. When I told my friend thst FB had his name and phone number even though he had never opened a FB account, he was floored.
goes to show that we need to think broader....even though we may not use certain apps or programs....friends you know might be using these apps, and your info can flow from you to your friends, to these apps.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

FB also has record of every video you have been sent even if you never looked at it! One of the many surprises when I downloaded the 67 GB of personal data 5 years ago


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## Ricehammer4416 (Jan 6, 2021)

I believe it gets it from your google contacts.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

google...aka "big brother"....


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

kcowan said:


> FB also has record of every video you have been sent even if you never looked at it! One of the many surprises when I downloaded the 67 GB of personal data 5 years ago


 ... how did you manage to download personal data from FB? Is it the same for gmail? I'm curious.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

I guess nothing in this world is "free". 

Your personal data is worth a gold-mine ... as with your posts on CMF.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

Beaver101 said:


> ... how did you manage to download personal data from FB? Is it the same for gmail? I'm curious.


FB has a link buried somewhere that allows you to download all the info they have on you.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Google has a similar thing, I did it once for backup.

The thing is these companies link the data to make them more useful.
If you don't like it, use other services, there are other options.

However they aren't quite as useful, because they don't have all the personal information.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

^ So basically all email services have this download function?

As for other options, I agree - use pen and paper with invisible ink as an added security. Better yet, learn (or relearn) morse codes ... that would be neat going, backwards. Yah, I'm being nostalgic here.

It isn't the partial information that they have on you is the problem ... it's what they're trying to do with that information, known as "data-mining", drummed up by some brilliant overzealous exec-employee trying to earn his place on the totem pole. Or not do with it such as securing it properly or "open it to hackers". Worst off - selling it (likely happening anyways). 

And what happened to our so-called Privacy Act/laws? Does it still exist or just on paper (the irony here).

Also, do you recall Cambridge Analytica newspiece/scandal? I can see it re-surfacing ...


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## john.cray (Dec 7, 2016)

It's a setting you can control. Take a look at Control what others see about you across Google services - Computer - Google Account Help

On the display side - there's a calendar called *Birthdays* which displays other peoples' birthdays if they have allowed that as per the setting above. Here's the description they give:


> Displays birthdays, anniversaries, and other event dates of people in Google Contacts.


Hope this helps


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## off.by.10 (Mar 16, 2014)

A lot of services ask for your birthdate when you sign up. Facebook is one of those. Don't remember about gmail. I made it a rule a long time ago to never enter the correct date.


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## Retired Peasant (Apr 22, 2013)

Google Activity
sign in and have a a look; you can delete stuff and change settings. Be sure to check out ‘Other Google Activity’ as well

In facebook, get into Account Settings; then click on Your Facebook Information on the left and then Download.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Beaver101 said:


> ^ So basically all email services have this download function?


Well Google and Facebook aren't just email services. 

Many email services offer POP or IMAP, which make it easier to download stuff, but typically not all info.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

james4beach said:


> When I log into gmail, and look at google calendars, I see that it has inserted several friend and family birthdays into the calendar.
> 
> I don't like this. It's creepy, and it shows that google is analyzing very private information (birthdays). Birthdays are private because they can be used to steal identities.
> 
> Does anyone know where google is getting this birthday information from? Perhaps it's mining emails I sent in the past in which I said "happy birthday". That's my best guess, since some of the dates match up with past "happy birthday" emails. The reason I'm curious is that, if it's something other than reading my old emails, this means there is a huge privacy leak somewhere which exposes people's birthdays.


Do you get facebook notifications for people's birthdays? Anything in your gmail account is fair game for analysis. I personally don't mind this. If you realize that eventually we will have AI assistants who are effectively an extension of ourselves, these aren't going to be built by each person for themselves, but offered as a service. What Google is doing is just the first inkling.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

james4beach said:


> Does anyone know where google is getting this birthday information from?


Some solutions in the link below to tell you when the items were added ...
https://webapps.stackexchange.com/q...t-when-i-added-an-event-to-my-google-calendar


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

off.by.10 said:


> I made it a rule a long time ago to never enter the correct date.


I do the same, all made up. It is good to write down (or remember) which date you used as some of them require that info as a security measure should you need to recover/change your account.


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## nathan79 (Feb 21, 2011)

Google being creepy is old news. I generally avoid using Gmail or Chrome for this reason. I only use Google for certain things such as their search engine or Google Earth. I mainly use my Shaw email, but I have a Hotmail account as a secondary.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

One thing I make sure NOT to do in synch my smartphone to any other account I have, like my e-mail. I do not set up my Facebook or e-mail account in my phone. I use the browser to log into those accounts. Sometimes I use DuckDuckGo as my search engine and sometimes I use Adblock as my browser.

I still use WhatsApp and have recently downloaded Signal but I haven't got any of my WhatsApp contacts to migrate over.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

I think I found evidence that Google read my emails to find the birth dates.

A couple of the birthdays are wrong. The dates match with when I sent the emails, not the real birthdays. That shows that it can't be getting the birthdays from the person's signup info.

Also, why would it show some people and not others?


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

cainvest said:


> I do the same, all made up. It is good to write down (or remember) which date you used as some of them require that info as a security measure should you need to recover/change your account.


Totally agree. I always fake my birthdates when doing internet signups. I've also started faking the gender and other bits of it as well.

The less data the marketing people have, the better.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

I'm surprised CMF didn't require my year of birth (just checked) as for a moment, I thought I listed myself as an 80 year old ... 

As for the data-miner who thought I was a new year baby - surprise!


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

james4beach said:


> Totally agree. I always fake my birthdates when doing internet signups. I've also started faking the gender and other bits of it as well.
> 
> The less data the marketing people have, the better.


You know it won't stop the ads and notifications but instead they will be suited to the fake traits you have uploaded.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Tostig said:


> You know it won't stop the ads and notifications but instead they will be suited to the fake traits you have uploaded.


Yeah, my goal is to wreck the data trails used for marketing and analysis. I don't like when others analyze me, so I want them to have garbage data.

I've also been messing with Facebook by logging in when I used to travel around the world. Facebook doesn't know where I live, and it's funny, it keeps asking me. Every once in a while it pops up a quiz and says something like "Your profile is incomplete, please select your city!" and it will show me options like: London, Sydney, Melbourne, San Diego, Toronto, Seattle

I like that they don't have a complete profile on me. I give false answers to those quizes too, just to screw with them more.


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

Google tracks a lot of things people aren't aware of.

Certainly if you have GPS enabled on your Android phone you can look at Google Timeline and it will show where you have been every second of every day.

I actually find it convenient as I can look back to where I've been when I need that information. Plus, when the police break down my door and accuse me of robbing a bank, I can prove I wasn't there. 

ltr


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

like_to_retire said:


> I actually find it convenient as I can look back to where I've been when I need that information. Plus, when the police break down my door and accuse me of robbing a bank, I can prove I wasn't there.


This GPS tracking can also be used in cases such as divorce lawsuits.

But beware, the example you give illustrates a major problem with evidence trails. Prosecutors are usually much better/more skilled at using evidence _against_ you, then defence attorneys are at using evidence to protect or defend yourself.

This is why I view most spying (like tracking my location) as a threat towards me. It's more likely to be used to harm me than to help me.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

Everything is creepy. That's why I own stocks in Google and Facebook. You can't really fight it although you can mess with it. And even through all the controversies they have gone through, like Cambridge Analytica or agreements or disagreements with China, India or other authoritarian states, and US Senate Committee hearings, they endure.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Tostig said:


> Everything is creepy. That's why I own stocks in Google and Facebook. You can't really fight it although you can mess with it. And even through all the controversies they have gone through, like Cambridge Analytica or agreements or disagreements with China, India or other authoritarian states, and US Senate Committee hearings, they endure.


I hope the governments break apart Google, Facebook, Amazon and separate their operations into smaller companies.

They are too large and have too much power. The USA has broken up monopolies before, for exactly this reason. Both Democrats and Republicans want to break them up.

One reason American capitalism works so well is that they (historically) have done a good job monitoring for this kind of thing and busting up companies which become too large and dominant. Capitalism doesn't work well when some giants gain too much monopolistic power.


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

james4beach said:


> This is why I view most spying (like tracking my location) as a threat towards me. It's more likely to be used to harm me than to help me.


But if you shut GPS off, basically nothing works on an Android phone. I figure I'm such a boring guy, that if they want my information, have at it, as long as I get added convenience. 

Convenience, at the loss of privacy, is pretty much what smartphones are all about. Lots of people go through all sorts of gyrations to make themselves feel that they are outsmarting big-brother, but they're just making their life annoying, when it could be quite convenient. Man, the things that smartphones can do is amazing.

ltr


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

like_to_retire said:


> But if you shut GPS off, basically nothing works on an Android phone. I figure I'm such a boring guy, that if they want my information, have at it, as long as I get added convenience.


I disagree with that. I keep my GPS off unless I am doing navigation with maps. Every other time, my GPS is off and my phone still works fine.


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

james4beach said:


> I disagree with that. I keep my GPS off unless I am doing navigation with maps. Every other time, my GPS is off and my phone still works fine.


So every time you use a map, you turn GPS on and they mark your timeline where you are. How is this protecting you from Google knowing your location? It seems like an annoyance more than anything else - you're kidding yourself. Just leave it on and get on with your day.

ltr


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

like_to_retire said:


> So every time you use a map, you turn GPS on and they mark your timeline where you are. How is this protecting you from Google knowing your location? It seems like an annoyance more than anything else - you're kidding yourself. Just leave it on and get on with your day.


Because I only check a map or do navigations once or twice a week. This is far less intrusive to my privacy than having a constant recording of everywhere I go at all hours of the day. The constant monitoring reveals so much about you, even shows your daily patterns and habits. It's a gold mine of information.

Turning off GPS is not an annoyance. You hit one button to turn on/off GPS. Is that a lot of work? Plus keeping GPS off extends my battery life.

Google knows some things about my location, yes. But they have no idea what my daily patterns are. All they get is a GPS location on me a couple times a week, and I want to leave it at that.

Remember LTR... conservatives believe in personal freedom and independence from government. The last thing you want is too much monitoring and government watching your every move.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

like_to_retire said:


> Plus, when the police break down my door and accuse me of robbing a bank, I can prove I wasn't there.


Well that proves you didn't take your phone to the bank! 



like_to_retire said:


> But if you shut GPS off, basically nothing works on an Android phone. I figure I'm such a boring guy, that if they want my information, have at it, as long as I get added convenience.


BTW, if you sign up for Google rewards they pay you for the data!


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

james4beach said:


> Turning off GPS is not an annoyance. You hit one button to turn on/off GPS. Is that a lot of work? Plus keeping GPS off extends my battery life.


You can control GPS usage at the App level. Just don't give permissions to apps that you don't want to have GPS data.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

cainvest said:


> You can control GPS usage at the App level. Just don't give permissions to apps that you don't want to have GPS data.


I generally think it's better to turn off transmitters/receivers that you don't need.

Same reason I don't walk around with Bluetooth on. On the rare occasion I need it, I'll turn on bluetooth. Similarly on the rare occasion I need GPS, I'll turn it out. And same with Wifi... I leave it off until I need it.

From a security standpoint, this also reduces your "attack surface" to various kinds of malicious attacks and hacks and is the recommended practice in computer security. These things we're carrying around are very advanced computers, and using them safely takes some care.

This practice also extends the battery life a lot. I can usually go 2-3 days without having to recharge my Moto phone. That's very useful on days I do trips, go out hiking and exploring, etc.


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## Tostig (Nov 18, 2020)

Sometimes Google Maps doesn't always work properly. When I was vacation in Barcelona, I had purchased an EU Sim card. Then we boarded our cruise ship and started sailing the Mediterranean. Just before we were docking at France, Google Maps said we were in Israel.


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

cainvest said:


> Well that proves you didn't take your phone to the bank!


You'd be surprised how often police use this data to eliminate suspects. They have to subpoena it, as generally this location data is only available to you.



james4beach said:


> The constant monitoring reveals so much about you, even shows your daily patterns and habits. It's a gold mine of information.


I hung around the house, then I shoveled my driveway, then I went for a walk, then I worked on my bike in the basement replacing the chain, then I read my book, then I checked CMF forum. A gold mine.

ltr


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

james4beach said:


> This practice also extends the battery life a lot. I can usually go 2-3 days without having to recharge my Moto phone.


I place my phone in it's wireless charger station every day I go to bed and it's charged in the morning. I couldn't wear my battery down in a day if I tried.

ltr


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

james4beach said:


> I generally think it's better to turn off transmitters/receivers that you don't need.


I only have a few apps that I allowed GPS access. If I don't run those apps the GPS is off.


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## Money172375 (Jun 29, 2018)

james4beach said:


> Because I only check a map or do navigations once or twice a week. This is far less intrusive to my privacy than having a constant recording of everywhere I go at all hours of the day. The constant monitoring reveals so much about you, even shows your daily patterns and habits. It's a gold mine of information.
> 
> Turning off GPS is not an annoyance. You hit one button to turn on/off GPS. Is that a lot of work? Plus keeping GPS off extends my battery life.
> 
> ...


Can’t this info be obtained from cell tower pings?


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Money172375 said:


> Can’t this info be obtained from cell tower pings?


It's much coarser data, but yes, it's possible. Reality is that we're carrying around tracking devices with us.

Also keep in mind, bad people such as criminals, abusive boyfriends and husbands do make use of these phones (e.g. install software on their girlfriend's phone) to track their every movement.


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## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Money172375 said:


> Can’t this info be obtained from cell tower pings?







__





Welcome to My Activity







myactivity.google.com





Not to that level of accuracy.
They use GPS, and inferred locations based off the wifi networks, but that's how they predict direction times so well.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

MrMatt said:


> Not to that level of accuracy.
> They use GPS, and inferred locations based off the wifi networks, but that's how they predict direction times so well.


MrMatt, do you know how location tracking happens in a 911 call?

If someone is lost in the back country and calls 911, this helps rescuers find them. What happens during a 911 call? Are they just using cell tower data (which is only very rough) or does something special happen in case of 911. Like, does the GPS receiver automatically send coordinates through the 911 system?


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

james4beach said:


> If someone is lost in the back country and calls 911, this helps rescuers find them. What happens during a 911 call? Are they just using cell tower data (which is only very rough) or does something special happen in case of 911. Like, does the GPS receiver automatically send coordinates through the 911 system?


Really depends on your location. In back country areas you may only have access to one cell tower and if that tower doesn't have enhanced 911 (access to your GPS data) you'll only have a very gross location, at best.

I made a back country 911 call last year to report a fire, they had no idea where I was and asked me for directions to the fire. A few of my friends use a Spot GPS tracker when out in the forest just for this reason.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

cainvest said:


> I made a back country 911 call last year to report a fire, they had no idea where I was and asked me for directions to the fire. A few of my friends use a Spot GPS tracker when out in the forest just for this reason.


Ok, that's good to know. I have a GPS app which shows latitude and longitude. If I had to make a 911 call, I guess I would read out the GPS coordinates to them on the phone.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

james4beach said:


> Ok, that's good to know. I have a GPS app which shows latitude and longitude. If I had to make a 911 call, I guess I would read out the GPS coordinates to them on the phone.


That should be ok, just test the app works without data and/or wifi available.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

james4beach said:


> Because I only check a map or do navigations once or twice a week. This is far less intrusive to my privacy than having a constant recording of everywhere I go at all hours of the day. The constant monitoring reveals so much about you, even shows your daily patterns and habits. It's a gold mine of information.
> 
> Turning off GPS is not an annoyance. You hit one button to turn on/off GPS. Is that a lot of work? Plus keeping GPS off extends my battery life.
> 
> ...


You need to turn off wifi if you are worried about this. It is trivial to geolocate you based on what networks your device can see.

I don't know why people are so fussed. People know where you are based on CC transactions, etc. as well.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

andrewf said:


> You need to turn off wifi if you are worried about this. It is trivial to geolocate you based on what networks your device can see.


Of course I turn off Wifi.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

I downloaded all my Facebook data. This is what I learned.


Facebook knows your political and personal beliefs. Here's how to find how you're being described and targeted.



www.usatoday.com






Beaver101 said:


> ... how did you manage to download personal data from FB? Is it the same for gmail? I'm curious.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

kcowan said:


> I downloaded all my Facebook data. This is what I learned.
> 
> 
> Facebook knows your political and personal beliefs. Here's how to find how you're being described and targeted.
> ...


 ... thanks for the link. Not that I have a FakeBook page, it's interesting to know that they have that feature. 

Perhaps "(very) concerned" users can download everything and terminate their account ... will everything be gone ... like forever? I know some email services claim (ie. they can't retrieve the email(s) you deleted) as those emails do not reside on their servers permanently).


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