# How do you stop yourself from spending money on toys?



## Earl (Apr 5, 2016)

Lately I've really been thinking about one of these:










A BMW 435i coupe with all wheel drive, a twin turbo engine, and a 6 speed manual transmission. I have enough money in my TFSA to buy a lightly used one for cash. I could also afford to finance or lease a brand new one.

How do you ignore that voice in your head that says things like:
-"your life would be much better if you had this!"
-"you could die next week, enjoy life while you can!"
-"live for the present, the future will take care of itself"

My question is not specific to cars but any expensive things you want but don't need.


----------



## Userkare (Nov 17, 2014)

Aw c'mon, it's only 'starting from' $56K. You know you want a brand new shiny un-deflowered one that still has that new car smell. What's a little debt to have something like this to lord over your friends and neighbours. Go ahead, do it, you know you want to!

http://www.bmw.ca/en/all-models/4-series/coupe/2013/intro.html


----------



## gardner (Feb 13, 2014)

-your life would be much better if spent time with your kids and spent money on things that enrich the lives of your family
-you could die next week, and your family will need financial resources to support them

I find cars particularly bad because they are money pits in terms of maintenance, insurance and the rest. The more expensive the car, the faster it drains your wallet with ongoing costs. They also have no residual value to speak of. Even a used one will decline in value by 15% per year. A new one loses 50% of its value immediately.

The way I personally handle toys is to maintain a notional savings stream for those types of things. When I do something like cancel cable, the stream of revenue moves from cable (one kind of toy) to saving for another toy.

If you have set aggressive goals for savings and wealth building and you have met those, and you still have a "toy budget" that fits the beemer and its ongoing insurance maintenance and fuel costs, then, well, you can afford it. For me, the next calculation is, do I want this toy or that toy?


----------



## Earl (Apr 5, 2016)

So you have a separate savings account just for your "fun budget" and everything that is a want not a need gets paid for from that budget?

I don't have a wife or kids so the only person I need to worry about is number one.  Speaking of money pits, nothing is a bigger drain on money than the wife/kids. I'm sure a BMW is far cheaper to maintain than a little rugrat. My plan is to live life alone and then possibly get married and have a kid or two when I'm in my mid or late 40s, that seems to make far more financial sense than to get hitched while I'm young.


----------



## Karlhungus (Oct 4, 2013)

Earl said:


> Lately I've really been thinking about one of these:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I look at that picture and I get a bad feeling in my gut thinking about bringing that thing in for repairs. I once had a volkswagen GTI that I thought was cool until it never left the mechanic shop. The crap feeling of paying for repairs FAR outweighs the good feeling of a cool car IMO. If you are interested in a vehicle like that, I would suggest go rent one for a weekend and see if the feeling is gone by the end of the weekend.


----------



## Nelley (Aug 14, 2016)

Earl said:


> Lately I've really been thinking about one of these:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Need more info-what is your current vehicle and what is your current income, net worth?


----------



## tygrus (Mar 13, 2012)

A car is utility only. A $25,000 car gets you around reliably just as easy as a $50,000 one.

And when people look you in that car, they dont think wow. They think over compensating for something. 

I buy the best used vehicle I can then drive it into the ground. Other fools pay for the depreciation.


----------



## Earl (Apr 5, 2016)

I didn't want to make this a discussion about cars, but luxury items in general. For some it may be expensive vacations. For some it may be high end clothes, or jewelry, etc.

If you think of a car as just a utility, then you're not a car guy and that's fine, you probably don't get any more enjoyment out of driving a high end sports car than driving a toyota corolla, but there are others who do. Others may for example be unable to understand why someone would buy steak when you can eat kraft dinner which will fill you up just as well, or why buy an Omega watch when a $10 walmart one will tell the time just as well, or why send your kids to a private school when a public school will teach them just as well, or any number of other things that some people will pay more for.


----------



## Nelley (Aug 14, 2016)

Earl said:


> I didn't want to make this a discussion about cars, but luxury items in general. For some it may be expensive vacations. For some it may be high end clothes, or jewelry, etc.
> 
> If you think of a car as just a utility, then you're not a car guy and that's fine, you probably don't get any more enjoyment out of driving a high end sports car than driving a toyota corolla, but there are others who do. Others may for example be unable to understand why someone would buy steak when you can eat kraft dinner which will fill you up just as well, or why buy an Omega watch when a $10 walmart one will tell the time just as well, or why send your kids to a private school when a public school will teach them just as well, or any number of other things that some people will pay more for.


Now you are getting philosophical-my advice to you then (if this BMW is what you want) is to set some relatively difficult goal for yourself and then once you achieve it go out immediately and buy the BMW.


----------



## bds (Aug 13, 2013)

Coming from a fellow car guy, don't bother talking about cars (or any other depreciating item) on a financial forum, it's a waste of time.

Also coming from a car guy, old sports cars are far more fun, more interesting, and cheaper than a new one.


----------



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Here's how I stop myself:

Thinking of what a pain in the butt it's going to be to keep getting the car repaired, how upsetting it will be as it develops problems, and the lingering strange noise that sounds like a problem to me yet the mechanics say is nothing... and thinking how I spent 56K and still didn't get perfection and have to deal with that noise.

I'd also think about how I likely won't have enough money to retire as it is, and how a single purchase like this can set me further back.

If this kind of purchase really will NOT compromise your ability to retire or make your money last for the rest of your life, then by all means go ahead and spend it!


----------



## pwm (Jan 19, 2012)

*How do you stop yourself from spending money on toys? 

*Here's what I did: Got married, wife had baby and quit work, wife had another baby, I was sole breadwinner and responsible for all family income from that point on. Still am after 46 years.


----------



## new dog (Jun 21, 2016)

If you have to have it then buy it and not worry about the pain you caused your financial situation. Do whatever you want on everything if it makes you happy and live with it and don't look back. If however you feel you don't want to live with your spending problems down the road then don't do it.


----------



## tygrus (Mar 13, 2012)

Imagine having to drive into work and look at your bosses stupid face for another 3 yrs while you pay that thing off.

Freedom is the number one asset period. Nothing gets me as fired up as having FU money and nobody to ride me. I will drive a kids trike around the neighbor hood before I work for another man again.


----------



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

That's awesome, tygrus. Big respect for that


----------



## none (Jan 15, 2013)

I choose not to because I'm a god damn adult and can control my base impulses? Not to be crazy....


----------



## peterk (May 16, 2010)

Delete


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

bds said:


> Coming from a fellow car guy, don't bother talking about cars (or any other depreciating item) on a financial forum, it's a waste of time.
> 
> Also coming from a car guy, old sports cars are far more fun, more interesting, and cheaper than a new one.


I agree with that. I love the smell of gasoline in the morning.........LOL.

I miss my garage more than my house. 

Had a bunch of toys and rarely drove any of them. Just shined them up, started the engines and stood back and loved them all.

A warm summer night........a bottle of coke in hand and music playing on the radio, sparkling toys in the garage and the boys coming over for a chat..........heaven on earth.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

that sure is one helluva good-looking car. No wonder you feel wistful.

perhaps you could consult m3s? he used to race BMWs in europe, i believe. Not sure if he brought any back to canada, north american regulations prevent the importation of many european late model cars unless they were specifically manufactured to north american specs.

.


----------



## sags (May 15, 2010)

Be still my heart............


----------



## GreatLaker (Mar 23, 2014)

First of all, life is for living and money is for spending. The trick is balancing your consumption during your accumulation and spending years. A good financial plan done by a CFP helps show what you need to save and what you can spend both now and in the future. 

If you want to cut back on spending, try reading books like Millionaire Teacher or The Millionaire Next Door, or MrMoneyMustache.com. If that does not cure you of your spendthrift ways, try binge watching Gail Vaz-Oxlade shows like Till Debt Do Us Part or Money Moron. If watching her for hours does not cure your over-spending habits nothing will. 

A dollar saved (invested) today at 6% for 25 years, compounds to more than $4. So every dollar you spend now cuts your retirement spending by $4. By that measure your BMW 435 actually costs you $224k of retirement income. And that excludes gas, insurance, luxury car maintenance costs, etc.

For a long time I never spend more than $25k on a car, and usually much less. My last vehicle was a bottom of the line Honda Civic Hatchback that I kept for 18 years. It was so cheap even the right hand mirror was an option, but it was the best car I ever owned. For my 55th birthday I got me a Lexus IS350. Not the same vehicle dynamics as your coveted 435, but a great luxury sports vehicle that I know will last a long time. My goal is to keep it at least as long as I had the Civic. It has a lot of features that are common now but were only available on luxury cars back then like key-less ignition, backup camera, zenon headlights etc. Great car that I really like, but somehow I don't get the satisfaction I thought I would, because of the cost, insurance, premium gas, plus the ever present risk that some ID10T will crash into it or door it in a parking lot. So think carefully about what else you can do with the money, how you will feel paying big gas and maintenance and repair bills, when it gets that first door dent etc. And if you lease or finance it, think about what an anchor those payments will be, or if you have some financial setback like job loss or needs of aging parents or a market crash because of things that go Trump in the night.

Fancy watches, expensive clothes or booze, big houses don't mean much to me, but other things do and are worth spending on.

If you have thought through all the possible drawbacks, buyer's remorse, overall cost, and it still fits within your long term financial plan... why not?


----------



## tygrus (Mar 13, 2012)

In my experience, you cant save yourself rich. You give 30% to the govt, there is only living expenses left after that.

The way to riches is to own something that inflation takes a hold of and ride it and add value to it and take advantage of the taxation on it.


----------



## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

Earl said:


> I have enough money in my TFSA to buy a lightly used one for cash. I could also afford to finance or lease a brand new one.
> 
> How do you ignore that voice in your head that says things like:
> -"your life would be much better if you had this!"
> ...


I have had this question to myself and my spouse. Pick what ever your item is, I apply a different thinking to the voices you hear. I have heard them on occasion and usually because spouse is saying it out aloud to me. :tears_of_joy:

-"your life would be much better if you had this!" Rephrase to how would my life be better. Then I list off the reasons, and they have to be concrete, not because it makes my happy, but I keep asking why. once I figure out the roots cause, I often no longer want it. In my spouses case, he still wants it. So then I ask is there something that would meet the want you have or a less expensive way to do it. Sometimes, he just really really wants it. Then my next filter can we afford it. We have agreed upon definition which is we must be able to pay cash for it, no financing, it cannot impact our financial security, we need to still be able to meet our other financial obligations, which include maxing rrsp, tsfa, and Resp. Then we also have another filter are there other things we would rather spend our money on. If there are other things then I have the same discussion about those items. 

-"you could die next week, enjoy life while you can!" Reframe to if I don't die tomorrow, how does this impact my enjoyment of life later. 


-"live for the present, the future will take care of itself" rephrase to live for the present as long as it doesn't hurt the future . This is about having a clear plan of our future goals, and what we what to accomplished. I know very well what I want out of life and what makes me happy. Right now, I work for my kids, and they are my present and future. I wish I would have though about that before I had kids. If I would have reigned in spending then to the things that truly bring me joy now and in the future, I would have no worries now. I look back in retro spect, and we spent on crazy luxury things, and that now, don't matter at all. If I would have take pin that money saved, I would have had enough to retire before 40 and that's with kids. 

We have balanced living for now vs the future by getting understanding of what we want our future to look like.


----------



## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

How to convince yourself you don't need another toy: Go ahead and buy it. In a few weeks you will be wondering why you wanted it.

We all want things. Eventually we get a few of them. If we are smart we notice how they make us feel. Most of the time it's a big nothing once the initial thrill wears off which doesn't take long. Then you figure out you can run yourself into a heart attack or worse, chasing all the things you think will make you happy, but really won't.

As soon as this realization sinks in the spell is broken. That doesn't mean you won't want anything, you will. It means you will be smart enough to think it over and decide if it is really something you want, bad enough to commit to, or if it is just a whim.

Part of the process of growing up and learning wisdom.

Of course you could always work yourself half to death getting all the toys, then wise up. That way you would have the toys and the wisdom too. Just kidding.


----------



## STech (Jun 7, 2016)

Remember that coffins don't have pockets. 

A lifetime of experiences and good memories and $1 in the bank, beats $5 million in the bank and a lifetime of regret. I'm turning 40 in 2 years, and I'm looking for something to splurge on a little. I'm leaning towards a big truck or SUV. Or the more likely scenario of an older truck + a much nicer vacation for the family.

I work hard for my money, and I'm not a money moron. My house is paid for, my investment portfolio is big and growing, good pension, my daughter at the age of 5 has more RESP money to her name than my entire net worth when I started university. I certainly could afford to indulge a little, but I'll still be looking to maximize the value of the splurging money. 


Coming from another car guy. Skip the BMW. Actually skip anything German altogether. Expensive to buy, and even more expensive to repair and maintain. Add to that their woeful reliability record. A Lexus or Acura is a much smarter choice of indulgence. "German Engineering" has been marketed to us as the pinnacle of reliability and longevity, and it's *TOTAL BS*. German made tools, like Knipex pliers, are simply outstanding. German cars are not.


----------



## KevinWaterloo (Mar 5, 2015)

The other answer is to spend the time researching the toy you want, buy used, and only buy it when you can pay cash.

If you are really a car guy then spending the money on a nice car may be worth it. And if you aren't a car guy you won't understand. And learn to DIY.
I have a 2002 Porsche 911 and an older BMW 335i as my winter car. Both were paid for and well past the steep depreciation curve. The ownership cost is likely less than that of a new minivan. You just have to settle for an older car and dedicate more time to learning and maintaining it.


----------



## KevinWaterloo (Mar 5, 2015)

STech said:


> Remember that coffins don't have pockets.
> 
> Coming from another car guy. Skip the BMW. Actually skip anything German altogether. Expensive to buy, and even more expensive to repair and maintain. Add to that their woeful reliability record. A Lexus or Acura is a much smarter choice of indulgence. "German Engineering" has been marketed to us as the pinnacle of reliability and longevity, and it's *TOTAL BS*. German made tools, like Knipex pliers, are simply outstanding. German cars are not.


Have you owned a german car? I agree that if your goal is reliability and longevity than Japanese would be a better bet. But if you are looking for fun-to-drive than the answer isn't nearly as simple. I've had both and still own 2 German cars with almost no issues at all. BMW reliability has improved dramatically since the later versions of the e9x. Sure you may have to replace the fuel pump and turbos more often (etc). But it is definitely worth it to me.


----------



## STech (Jun 7, 2016)

KevinWaterloo said:


> Have you owned a german car? I agree that if your goal is reliability and longevity than Japanese would be a better bet. But if you are looking for fun-to-drive than the answer isn't nearly as simple. I've had both and still own 2 German cars with almost no issues at all. *BMW reliability has improved dramatically* since the later versions of the e9x. *Sure you may have to replace the fuel pump and turbos more often (etc)*. But it is definitely worth it to me.



Thank you for proving my point.

And yes I have, and never will again. Fun to drive? Hell yes. Would I rent one? Hell yes. Would I ever own another one? Hell no.


----------



## Ihatetaxes (May 5, 2010)

STech said:


> Coming from another car guy. Skip the BMW. Actually skip anything German altogether. Expensive to buy, and even more expensive to repair and maintain. Add to that their woeful reliability record. A Lexus or Acura is a much smarter choice of indulgence. "German Engineering" has been marketed to us as the pinnacle of reliability and longevity, and it's *TOTAL BS*. German made tools, like Knipex pliers, are simply outstanding. German cars are not.


Speaking from PERSONAL experience I have owned 5 BMW's and Mercedes and NONE of them have been problematic. In fact, one service visit per year has been the norm (15,000 to 20,000 km between routine service is a great advantage if you hate visiting the dealer every 5,000 - 8,000 like most other brands). I had one BMW when I used to live out in the country that got flogged HARD every day commuting 150 km of country roads and through countless snowstorms, road trips without ever so much as a rattle. My current vehicle is a 9 month old $90,000 Mercedes loaded with technology (distronic radar cruise with steering assist is my favourite) and I just took it on a 5,000 km road trip and it was flawless, amazingly comfortable even after a couple of 13 hour days on the road. I love driving a nice car and I can afford it. German vehicles also fit my 6'3" frame very well (the only vehicles that have MORE legroom than I need). I do tend to flip them at 4 years though, because I like newer models and my total annual vehicle expenditure is a very small percentage of my income and miniscule percentage of my net worth. 

OP my opinion is that unless you have all your financial ducks in a row (RRSP, TFSA, RESP all maxed, mortgage paid off, lots of extra cash in your non-reg account and safety nets like HISA topped up and income in the HUNDREDS of thousands) you should buy a Honda Accord (which is honestly a great vehicle) or similar price range Japanese or Korean car. Luxury rides are being driven as status symbols by too many people that can't truly afford them (just like too many Canadians buying houses they can barely afford). How about something equivalent to <2% of your net worth as a guide? Taking money out of a TFSA to buy a car seems ridiculous to me.


----------



## STech (Jun 7, 2016)

Ihatetaxes said:


> I do tend to flip them at 4 years though, because I like newer models.



Even the magnificently unreliable Chryslers will give you 4 or 5 years of OK reliability, until the they start falling apart pretty badly. Just because you PERSONALLY experienced good reliability from a brand new car every 4 years, doesn't mean publications like Consumer's Reports is wrong. A 20 year old Honda or Toyota will still be on the road, with a higher resale value than a German car that's no longer worth the cost of repairing. 

I love DIY everything myself, and tinkering with cars and electronics is a big hobby of mine. Maintenance and repair costs of pretty much anything is minor to me. I even get parts at dealership costs. And even with that, when I'm looking for a toy to have fun with, I'd rather have something that's reliable. Harley Davidson guys are notoriously protective of their brand loyalty, yet they'll easily spend double the time and double the money of a Honda or Kawasaki rider and still tell you their Harleys are very reliable.


----------



## 30seconds (Jan 11, 2014)

I bought a motorcycle. Only thing that sucks is paying the insurance on it during the winter (1200 a year). It cost 4500$ plus around 1k in gear. While it is a bit expensive it has taken me to places I would have never ventured to and has brought me many new friendships. I also have 3k worth of guns which is a bit unnecessary but again I have been able to strengthen friendships, have a great time and experience new things with them.

My 4k honda accord is going strong and needs no repairs its awesome. Although its starting to show its age (2001), I will drive it till the tranny goes on it. The rust around the wheel wells is starting to grow which sucks but w.e.

I wouldnt personally buy a expensive carétoy unless it brought me closer to new people. My dad was in a van club in the 70`s and that sounded like a great time! I often see mazada miatas travelling in groups, or ATV/snowmobiles.


----------



## Mechanic (Oct 29, 2013)

Ha ha. Occasionally I wonder why I bought my Porsche ....... Then I go drive it and I remember :tickled_pink:


----------



## Earl (Apr 5, 2016)

STech said:


> Coming from another car guy. Skip the BMW. Actually skip anything German altogether. Expensive to buy, and even more expensive to repair and maintain. Add to that their woeful reliability record. A Lexus or Acura is a much smarter choice of indulgence. "German Engineering" has been marketed to us as the pinnacle of reliability and longevity, and it's *TOTAL BS*. German made tools, like Knipex pliers, are simply outstanding. German cars are not.


Unfortunately BMW is one of the few manufacturers still making fast manual cars. You can't get a manual Lexus or Acura any more.


----------



## STech (Jun 7, 2016)

Earl said:


> Unfortunately BMW is one of the few manufacturers still making fast manual cars. You can't get a manual Lexus or Acura any more.


I'll give you that. Sad trend actually as I thoroughly enjoy standard transmissions (unless you live and commute downtown).

At least Lexus and Acura (as far as I know) still offer something as simple and reliable as a dipstick to check your oil.


----------



## WGZ (Feb 3, 2017)

I'm sick of manual and crave my next car to be a proper DCT/DSG box with paddles. Much appreciated for a daily driver.

The Acura ILX is available with a stick shift, Acura's current entry level vehicle. But you can't get it fully loaded w/ stick. Audi has the S3, S4, S5, RS5, TT/TT-RS, etc. available with stick shift. BMW by comparison phased it out in the M5/M6 leaving it in M2, M3, M4.

Cadillac CTS-V/ATS-V with a stick shift :beguiled: especially the CTS-V wagon.


----------



## MrMatt (Dec 21, 2011)

Earl said:


> Lately I've really been thinking about one of these:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Allocate a budget to them.
Or just look at the per day cost and think of the other things you'd want.
Personally I just look at the per day cost and consider what I'm trading off.

Or just wait a bit, delaying a few months often turns into years. A long enough delay is the same as not at all. 
The delay gave me a chance to choose a vehicle that cost half as much. That $30 savings was nice.


----------



## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

to original OP thread: Learn to buy what you NEED, not what you WANT.
to Sags - thanks for the HD video! LOVED that sound all my life (my ears still perk up & a big smile whenever i hear it on the street)


----------



## Spidey (May 11, 2009)

Whether a purchase is worth it is very individual. I'm personally not into expensive toys but I have to admit that some people do seem to get a lot of satisfaction from their cars. Money is similar to time in that once those dollars are spent on one thing they are unavailable for all other choices. My measure of whether a purchase is worth it is:

- is the enjoyment you get out of the purchase commensurate to the amount of time/effort that went into earning that money? 
- is this particular choice preferable to all other options for those dollars?


----------



## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

If you own a motorcycle the way to save on insurance is to buy your policy in October or November. Then each year simply don't renew. In the spring call up your insurer and add the bike you your policy.

Only down side, no fire and theft over the winter.


----------



## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

humble_pie said:


> perhaps you could consult m3s? he used to race BMWs in europe, i believe. Not sure if he brought any back to canada, north american regulations prevent the importation of many european late model cars


I had a euro spec E46 M3 which, if in good shape and manual, was on a very short list of cars that actually increase in value. The newer BMWs had clearly let the marketeers into the engineering room like most manufacturers today. Going from a newer 1 series rental to an older E46 it is very clear how they are regressing. The new M4's speakers actually play engine sounds when you rev.. no German engineer came up with this!












STech said:


> Coming from another car guy. Skip the BMW. Actually skip anything German altogether. Expensive to buy, and even more expensive to repair and maintain. Add to that their woeful reliability record.


They are expensive to buy and maintain in Canada because Canadians perceive them as an expensive status symbol and so they are charged more and pay more for them. I went from a Honda to a BMW and the BMW was actually much easier and enjoyable to work on. Anything built to higher spec will be less forgiving for inadequate maintenance and most Canadians and even Canadians dealers don't maintain vehicles to spec

BMWs are a mainstream vehicle in Germany so they are familiar to mechanics and parts are readily available. Germans in general do their work very meticulously while I've found many mechanics in Canada cut corners. North American spec BMWs are hampered by Californian emissions (less reliable, less performance and less efficient ironically). In Germany 103 octane ethanal free fuel is readily available.. as is true Group IV synthetic oil

I miss the BMW but I'm glad I didn't bring it to Canada. I would hate to drive a performance BMW around on straight roads riddled with potholes. My BMW never saw an ice scraper, salt or frost heave in Germany. I lived within an hour of the Nurburgring and Spa-Francochamps race tracks where an M3 could be driven for what it was designed. Now I drive a Subaru STi and I think it's much better suited for the Canadian tundra










As for the OP, I think "toys" can be worth spending some excess saved money (not a loan or RRSP..) for the experiences. Don't buy a BMW to polish it all weekend in the driveway so you can drive it to Starbucks just to make your neighbours jealous. Buy it if you will actually use it for what it was designed. And if that is the case, you might as well buy a used one that has a few scratches at half the cost. Buy a BMW to experience not to show.


----------



## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

And if you're looking at a 435i, look at the 235i.. cheaper and better imho (based Jeremy Clarkson et al, haven't driven either myself)


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> If you own a motorcycle the way to save on insurance is to buy your policy in October or November. Then each year simply don't renew. In the spring call up your insurer and add the bike you your policy.
> 
> Only down side, no fire and theft over the winter.



rusty the way i figure it, your scheme gains 6 months with no insurance costs once but once only.

after the first cycle, the bike owner is right back to annual spring renewals, no?

.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

there are some highly refreshing quotes in this thread, the kind that make a stumbler-upon Laugh Out Loud .each:




Ihatetaxes said:


> My current vehicle is a 9 month old $90,000 Mercedes ... I love driving a nice car and I can afford it ... I do tend to flip them at 4 years though, because I like newer models and my total annual vehicle expenditure is a very small percentage of my income and miniscule percentage of my net worth.





30seconds said:


> I also have 3k worth of guns which is a bit unnecessary but again I have been able to strengthen friendships, have a great time and experience new things with them.


.


----------



## Synergy (Mar 18, 2013)

humble_pie said:


> rusty the way i figure it, your scheme gains 6 months with no insurance costs once but once only.
> 
> after the first cycle, the bike owner is right back to annual spring renewals, no?
> 
> .


That doesn't work. Premiums are almost fully earned during the riding season. Add the cancellation penalty and you're no better off. Same goes for boats, etc. Tried that back in the day when i had a bike.

OP - enjoy the car, you only live once and you can't bring your money with you. If you want to enjoy some toys simply figure out how to earn more and invest wisely. Some like cars, some like traveling, some rather hoard. To each their own. Enjoy. 2008 mint Mini Cooper S with red leather is my current summer go cart. If you're not drowning in cash at the moment i couldn't agree more, buy used.


----------



## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

humble_pie said:


> rusty the way i figure it, your scheme gains 6 months with no insurance costs once but once only.
> 
> after the first cycle, the bike owner is right back to annual spring renewals, no?
> 
> .


Not at all. It works like this. November: Renew car insurance, do not renew bike insurance. April: Add bike to insurance policy. November: renew car insurance, do not renew bike insurance. This way your bike is insured when you need it and you only pay for the months you use. The drawback is no fire and theft ins over the winter. If the bike is financed, the finance company may insist on insurance.

I did this for years. When I bought my first motorcycle it was possible to add or remove a vehicle and most guys dropped the collision and liability in the fall and kept fire and theft. Then the insurance companies decided they would make more profits by forcing their customers to pay for insurance they weren't using. So I did a one time change of insurance companies and renewed every fall after that.

Haven't had a bike on the road for 20 years so this info may be out of date. IE they probably have new ways to scam insurance customers.


----------



## STech (Jun 7, 2016)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> Haven't had a bike on the road for 20 years so this info may be out of date. IE they probably have new ways to scam insurance customers.


Yeah, that loophole is long gone, bike insurance is all prorated now. They make their biggest chunk off the riding season, but will spread the payments over 12 months. 

For your suggestion. First off, you can't buy 6 months insurance anymore. Everything is full year. Also, say you buy in April, and cancel in November, then you would have paid 95% of the annual premium. For that extra 5% it is well worth keeping the insurance for those extra 5 months.

Some companies will give you a small discount and allow you to drop liability for fire & theft only during the winter, but again, it's likely nothing to write home about.

If you could manage to get by with your bike only, you might be able to save a little bit by not having car insurance during the summer. Might be feasible for a single guy/gal.


----------



## cashinstinct (Apr 4, 2009)

STech said:


> First off, you can't buy 6 months insurance anymore.


That's false for cars at least.

When I added a second car to my insurance policy, it was added mid-year but the end of contract was the same date as the first car.


----------



## STech (Jun 7, 2016)

cashinstinct said:


> That's false for cars at least.
> 
> When I added a second car to my insurance policy, it was added mid-year but the end of contract was the same date as the first car.


You're looking at it very narrowly. You didn't buy 6 month's insurance. You added your 2nd car to your 1st car's policy for the remainder of the term. When your policy ends, both cars will renew for the full term in the subsequent years, unless you cancel of course. What I'm getting at, is you simply can't call up and say I'd like a 6 month policy please. When I first got my bike license in the late 90s, I did buy 6 months worth of insurance only and it was doable on a high school student's budget. Now, you could technically get 6 months insurance, but like I said, so much of your premium is paid during those 6 months, that it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to cancel and reapply every 12 months. 


And yes they do treat cars differently. I used to have a diesel pickup that I kept for towing our camper only, and the odd Sunday ice cream run. They'd let me add and cancel the insurance very easily, and I'd switch between full coverage or fire & theft only very easily. I could've added insurance to that truck on monthly basis if I wanted to. The bike was absolutely not allowed, and I shopped around quite a bit. Their logic is to spread the risk over 12 months to increase their profits. Deep down, I can't really blame them, even though it sucks to pay for something when you're not using it.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Along the same lines as GreatLaker....life is for the living - absolutely.

My wife and I are in a constant discussion (of late) about "what's next" and what's our balance.

I've had friends pass away in their 30s and 40s. Do you think they're worried about retirement now?

I've also seen family members live with great health until their mid-90s. Impressive.

At the end of the day I feel rightly or wrong it's all about balance. We're still trying to figure our optimal balancing act out...

Regarding the question - we don't stop ourselves. 

What we do is pay ourselves first by maxing out the TFSAs every year; then have monthly contributions flowing to our RRSPs (one account maxed); and then after that we make additional mortgage payments to slay that dragon. After all those "fixed costs" are budgeted for/saved we spend money leftover on whatever we want.


----------



## hboy54 (Sep 16, 2016)

Hi:

I don't any more stop myself from spending money on toys. I have two advantages here: my definition of a toy is quite modest, and my net worth is sufficient.

It helps to keep the eye on the ball. The saying in the sailing world is that the sunset is no more spectacular from the cockpit of a 50 foot sailboat than it is from a 30 foot sailboat, or in my case even 22 feet.

What I do value though is things that work well. I will be much happier sitting in a highly functional 22 foot boat that I have $30K or $40K time and energy in, than a 30 foot POS with same $30K or $40K. For a given quantity of dollars spent, I value things working well over having standing headroom in the cabin.

I am not there yet, but when I get my 22 foot boat to where I want it to be, if I were to do the same on a 30 foot boat would likely need an extra $50,000: bigger sails, bigger motor, bigger rigging and lines, more square feet of stuff to fix, $5,000 under deck autopilot vs $900 tiller pilot etc. Sunset, same. Actually might be better from the 22 foot boat, as it will go places a 30 foot boat cannot with a 5 foot draft.

So that is how it will come to pass that in 2 or 3 more seasons, I'll have $30K or $40K money, and time and effort (I value my time at $50/hr) in a 22 foot sailboat that I will be able to sell for ... $5K. Hopefully, I'll also at the time be able to report that I spent a season on Lake Superior ... talk about sunset potential.

hboy54


----------



## janus10 (Nov 7, 2013)

I'm pretty lucky because I haven't had that voice in my head inciting me to spend inadvisedly. Maybe when I was young, but I prefer seeing my money make more money until it doesn't matter how much something costs.

As of yet, either because I don't have enough money, or my brain hasn't adapted to be looser with the purse strings, I'm still leery of spending more than 2% of our NW on a vehicle. And it almost certainly will not be a brand new one.

I should point out that I used to own a 325i which was the most enjoyable car I had... Until we traded it in for a 330ci which we still have. We got both of them as 3 year old cars.

The 330 is a 2005 with less than 150k on it, and I enjoy driving it every time except when there is traffic. Which is often. We live in the GTA, so, it's to be expected. Maybe it's the traffic, and not the car!

It's my wife's car and every once in a while she needs to take my 2002 Hyundai Santa Fe. That makes her appreciate the Beemer even more.

I'm guessing that the vast majority of the time when I see posts like this in various personal finance threads, the OP goes onto make their purchase.

Later this year I'll finally have to get rid of the Santa Fe as the transmission is starting to become a serious liability. My promise to everyone at CMF is I won't post a thread asking if I have your blessings to go ahead and buy a vehicle that is more than I need to go from A to B.


----------



## CalgaryPotato (Mar 7, 2015)

janus10 said:


> Later this year I'll finally have to get rid of the Santa Fe as the transmission is starting to become a serious liability. My promise to everyone at CMF is I won't post a thread asking if I have your blessings to go ahead and buy a vehicle that is more than I need to go from A to B.


Clearly you didn't read the terms of service when you signed up, if you think you can make a major purchase without clearing it with us first. 

Anyway like everything else I think toys comes down to balance and priorities. I've been pretty frugal on some large scale purchases (owning a much cheaper home than others I know, holding onto cars for much longer) but at the same time splurged on other things like vacations and a hot tub. Sometimes I think I've gone over the top, but then I remember that even a small home upgrade would have equaled out to many of the other "luxury" items our family has purchased.


----------



## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

STech said:


> Yeah, that loophole is long gone, bike insurance is all prorated now. They make their biggest chunk off the riding season, but will spread the payments over 12 months.
> 
> For your suggestion. First off, you can't buy 6 months insurance anymore. Everything is full year. Also, say you buy in April, and cancel in November, then you would have paid 95% of the annual premium. For that extra 5% it is well worth keeping the insurance for those extra 5 months.
> 
> ...


You don't understand. I know you can't buy insurance for 6 months. But, they can't force you to renew insurance.

You set it up so your insurance policy expires November first. When you renew, you tell them you want to renew your car insurance and not renew the bike insurance. This is completely legal, I did it several times. 

Then in April you phone them and add a vehicle to your policy. The bike. This is done all the time when people buy new vehicles.

The following November when your policy expires, you buy a new policy covering only your cars. I hope this is clear.


----------



## STech (Jun 7, 2016)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> I hope this is clear.



It is clear. I suppose, but very doubtful, you might find a company that hasn't caught onto this and will allow it to your advantage. Like I said, bike insurance is prorated now. In the the 6 or 7 months (aka riding season), they'll charge about 95% of the full season. So in your example, from April to November, you'd pay $950 of a $1,000 yearly policy. I'd say the majority will view that extra $50 as a good deal and hang onto it Nov - Apr.

You don't have to take my word for it, google will bring up dozens of threads on this same topic on all the bike forums. Note: I'm talking specifically about Ontario.


----------



## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

janus10 said:


> I should point out that I used to own a 325i which was the most enjoyable car I had... Until we traded it in for a 330ci which we still have. We got both of them as 3 year old cars.
> 
> The 330 is a 2005 with less than 150k on it, and I enjoy driving it every time except when there is traffic. Which is often. We live in the GTA, so, it's to be expected. Maybe it's the traffic, and not the car!


2005 330ci is a very classy and sensible driver's car for the GTA. If I lived in southern Ontario where it hardly snows that specific model would be on my very short list, and 2005 was the last year of the E46 (bloated 2006+ is a downgrade imho).

I considered bringing a 330d (diesel e46) back from Germany. The "touring" version was quite common in Europe but never sold in Canada as far as I know. Now with the 2 series being properly balanced and proportioned again like the E46 was, there's that


----------



## Synergy (Mar 18, 2013)

Rusty O'Toole said:


> You don't understand. I know you can't buy insurance for 6 months. But, they can't force you to renew insurance.
> 
> You set it up so your insurance policy expires November first. When you renew, you tell them you want to renew your car insurance and not renew the bike insurance. This is completely legal, I did it several times.
> 
> ...


The majority of insurers require motorcycles to be written up on a separate policy. So adding and removing doesn't generally work. Policy must be cancelled, with a fee! Additionally, as mentioned up thread, motorcycle premiums are almost fully earned throughout the ridding season. Insurers aren't the sharpest tool in the shed but they have caught on to this many years ago.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

I would love to get a Beemer but I can't afford it yet - meaning - there are other priorities for our money now. 

My hope is when the mortgage debt is gone + when dividends are flowing into the account to cover most expenses, then any part-time job I have can be used to fund a nice car fund - and I can pay cash for a 3-5 year old Beemer.


----------



## janus10 (Nov 7, 2013)

My Own Advisor said:


> I would love to get a Beemer but I can't afford it yet - meaning - there are other priorities for our money now.
> 
> My hope is when the mortgage debt is gone + when dividends are flowing into the account to cover most expenses, then any part-time job I have can be used to fund a nice car fund - and I can pay cash for a 3-5 year old Beemer.


If it's still important to you I'm sure you'll make it happen. I like the 3 year used because there is at least one year of warranty (certified series can have up to 6 years of warranty IIRC).

One thing about Beemers is that certain technology features lag well behind non luxury brands who might include it as standard.

So you either have to pay extra or it isn't even an option.


----------



## Rusty O'Toole (Feb 1, 2012)

I did warn you I hadn't done this in 20 years and the insurance companies probably had new ways to scam their customers by now.


----------



## olivaw (Nov 21, 2010)

I pay more for motorcycle insurance than car insurance. I own three motorcycles. I pay the full rate for every bike, with no discount for second and third bikes.

(My wife doesn't mind me spending on motorcycles so long as I don't try to park one of them on her side of the garage. I have precisely the number and size of motorcycles that can fit in my half of the garage along with my car.)


----------



## Earl (Apr 5, 2016)

That's ridiculous that they force you to pay the full rate on 3 separate bikes. You can't ride all 3 at once. I can see theft coverage on all 3, but the liability at least should go with the driver and not the vehicle. We Canadians really get hosed when it comes to insurance. They're making insane profits off us. I wonder which companies I should invest in to get in on some of those profits.


----------



## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

Earl said:


> That's ridiculous that they force you to pay the full rate on 3 separate bikes. You can't ride all 3 at once. I can see theft coverage on all 3, but the liability at least should go with the driver and not the vehicle. We Canadians really get hosed when it comes to insurance. They're making insane profits off us. I wonder which companies I should invest in to get in on some of those profits.


Government insurance in BC - ICBC - works the same way. Years ago I used to keep an old truck on an island where I spent every other weekend away from Vancouver. The idea was that I would have a vehicle there and not have to take my car on the ferry each weekend in order to have a vehicle on the island. I just kept the statutory minimum of liability coverage. It then cost about $500/yr. I probably drove that truck about 300 miles a year. Well over a dollar a mile for limited coverage. I finally stopped doing it and went back to paying to take my car on the ferry.

Like you, I thought it would be sensible if the liability coverage followed me. I can accept having to pay for each vehicle if you want each covered for theft, etc. I was quite willing to be on the policy as sole driver, so the policy would be void if I loaned the vehicle. But no. It had to be full coverage for however many I owned if I wanted to be able to drive them, even though, as you say, you can only drive one at a time.


----------



## trance.god (Jun 8, 2016)

The one thing that really helped me refrain from buying toys was a paradigm shift in my image of what having wealth looks like.

The youth of today (I'm 24 btw) are obsessed with appearing rich but haven't really thought much of actually being truly rich. 
I'm not saying this is OPs problem, I'm just stating what really helped me not care for fancy cars and what not. Oh and by the way, I'm a true petrolhead, car fanatic.

Now days, when I see a bimmer/audi/benz drive by, I just think "hah. I wonder how broke that guy/girl is". Because really, 9/10 times they probably lease/loan it and have nothing in savings.
And then, not to be stereotypical/racist, but when I see an old asian man/woman driving a brand new Toyota I think "Wow. They probably have millions". Because lets be real, they might not have a million but they definitely have sizeable savings.

Think about it. 2% of Canadians make $200k+/year. Lower end BMWs will cost like $35k.
But way more than 2% of. cars on the road are bmw/benz/audi/lexus/infiniti/etc. Wonder where all that $$ came from? Debt obviously.


----------



## 30seconds (Jan 11, 2014)

humble_pie said:


> there are some highly refreshing quotes in this thread, the kind that make a stumbler-upon Laugh Out Loud .eac
> 
> .


Living in the city many of my friends have never shot a gun before. Making a day out of going to the gun range is exactly what I described. Glad I could provide you with a laugh though


----------



## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

trance.god said:


> Think about it. 2% of Canadians make $200k+/year. Lower end BMWs will cost like $35k.
> But way more than 2% of. cars on the road are bmw/benz/audi/lexus/infiniti/etc. Wonder where all that $$ came from? Debt obviously.


Although I do agree with you overall people overextend themselves, I bought what I consider a pinnacle BMW in prime condition for under $30k CAD and actually made money on the sale (one of the best resale besides Porsche 911, but also thanks to luck with currency exchange)

Buying a new vehicle is never a wise financial decision whether it's Toyota or BMW imho. There are people who claim 0% makes a better deal than used.. it's not, the financing cost is baked in and if you don't have cash you shouldn't be buying it.. but I digress

A colleague drives a brand new Jeep Cherokee Trailhawk ($50k SUV?) and drove a brand new Jeep Wrangler Rubicon before that ($$?) He's mentioned a few times he doesn't have a downpayment for a house or room on his Visa while I drive used sports cars on the same salary and save half of it

An entry level BMW is not that far from an entry level Honda. Audi/Lexus/Infiniti I can see as those are premium brands of VW/Toyota/Nissan. Used luxury cars can actually be found for stellar deals because the majority want either a new luxury car or a beater used one..


----------



## DollaWine (Aug 4, 2015)

m3s said:


> Although I do agree with you overall people overextend themselves, I bought what I consider a pinnacle BMW in prime condition for under $30k CAD and actually made money on the sale (one of the best resale besides Porsche 911, but also thanks to luck with currency exchange)
> 
> Buying a new vehicle is never a wise financial decision whether it's Toyota or BMW imho. There are people who claim 0% makes a better deal than used.. it's not, the financing cost is baked in and if you don't have cash you shouldn't be buying it.. but I digress
> 
> ...


Agreed. Used luxury is the way to go. You get the good performance, ~10 year old luxury cars still turn heads, AND they hold their value well. When I sell my Infiniti in about 2 years I will probably break even or lose 1k at most. People think you're rolling in dough when they see you in a Benz... little do they know it's a 2008 paid for in cash for half the price of their brand new Camry :excitement:


----------



## trance.god (Jun 8, 2016)

m3s said:


> Buying a new vehicle is never a wise financial decision whether it's Toyota or BMW imho. There are people who claim 0% makes a better deal than used.. it's not, the financing cost is baked in and if you don't have cash you shouldn't be buying it.. but I digress
> 
> 
> An entry level BMW is not that far from an entry level Honda. Audi/Lexus/Infiniti I can see as those are premium brands of VW/Toyota/Nissan. Used luxury cars can actually be found for stellar deals because the majority want either a new luxury car or a beater used one..





DollaWine said:


> Agreed. Used luxury is the way to go. You get the good performance, ~10 year old luxury cars still turn heads, AND they hold their value well. When I sell my Infiniti in about 2 years I will probably break even or lose 1k at most. People think you're rolling in dough when they see you in a Benz... little do they know it's a 2008 paid for in cash for half the price of their brand new Camry :excitement:




Sorry, I forgot to mention-- I'm not suggesting buying a brand new Japanese non-premium car. I'm suggesting forever buying a 2-3 year old, 50-100km, toyota/honda. Because reliability, relatively cheap, holds it's value, cheap to repair on the rare occasion that it needs repairs. I just meant that, when I see an asian man driving a brand new Toyota, it occurs to me that, he probably has a ton of money if he is buying a brand new. 

I honestly cannot justify spending $400 to change a headlight because BMW decided the entire headlight had to be removed and replaced , instead of just changing a bulb. At least not until the cost of the vehicle + cost of maintenance over the it's life is less than, say 10% of my income.

I get it though. Passion, thrill, ego, etc. But really, it just isn't worth it in the long run, especially not for a 24 year old like myself. 
I'd rather invest my savings and watch that grow than drive around an unreliable, high priced, expensive to repair, depreciating asset.

Related rant: The biggest scam of the 20th century is probably the trope "German Engineering". People have it equated to "Superior/Advanced Engineering" in their minds. Everyone thinks they ooze of engineering marvel. But in reality, some German mechanical products are best in class, top of the world (think: heavy machinery, industrial equipment, etc), but consumer vehicles are definitely not. Now days when I see German car drive by, I think "beautiful shitbox". Beautiful they are, no doubt about it. Shitbox they usually are, especially after 100,000km, no doubt about it.


----------



## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

trance.god said:


> I honestly cannot justify spending $400 to change a headlight because BMW decided the entire headlight had to be removed and replaced , instead of just changing a bulb. At least not until the cost of the vehicle + cost of maintenance over the it's life is less than, say 10% of my income.
> 
> I get it though. Passion, thrill, ego, etc. But really, it just isn't worth it in the long run, especially not for a 24 year old like myself.
> I'd rather invest my savings and watch that grow than drive around a unreliable, high priced, expensive to repair, depreciating asset.
> ...


Do you mean LED headlights?.. because Japanese cars use LEDs nowadays too.. don't they all? I don't have any experience with them but I see them on just about all new vehicles regardless of brand. They are supposed to be much brighter, use less power, and last much longer. $400 = 4 fake "ultra" halogen bulbs from crappy tire (huge scam in NA btw)

BMW sells entry level vehicles that are comparable to other brands entry level vehicles and they also sell performance vehicles that are inherently less reliable like all performance vehicles are inherently less reliable because sports car. BMW is a mainstream brand in Europe like Ford in NA. An Escort and a GT40 are both Fords.. blanket statements are just that

Germany is very wealthy today because their intellectual property is built into just about everything.. German engineering is very good, as is Japanese engineering, American engineering, Russian engineering. I've owned 3 BMWs and all were extremely well designed and reliable. I wouldn't recommend them to someone who sees a vehicle as its badge though


----------



## OutofBounds (Dec 7, 2016)

I have the opposite problem of the OP. After I deduct my savings, vacation pay and debt repayment, I give myself 10% of the remainder as "fun" money to do with as I please. 

I'm currently sitting on about $1000, since I haven't spent a penny on my hobbies or myself in about 8 months. There's plenty of things that I want (a new smoker would be nice, or that scope for my rifle I've been wanting...) but I just can't bring myself to spend the money. Budgeting and saving has really turned me into a miser. "Sure, I could spend $600 of my fun money. But then I won't have that $600 if something else I want comes along..." CRAP!! LOL


----------



## trance.god (Jun 8, 2016)

m3s said:


> Do you mean LED headlights?.. because Japanese cars use LEDs nowadays too.. don't they all? I don't have any experience with them but I see them on just about all new vehicles regardless of brand. They are supposed to be much brighter, use less power, and last much longer. $400 = 4 fake "ultra" halogen bulbs from crappy tire (huge scam in NA btw)
> 
> BMW sells entry level vehicles that are comparable to other brands entry level vehicles and they also sell performance vehicles that are inherently less reliable like all performance vehicles are inherently less reliable because sports car. BMW is a mainstream brand in Europe like Ford in NA. An Escort and a GT40 are both Fords.. blanket statements are just that
> 
> Germany is very wealthy today because their intellectual property is built into just about everything.. German engineering is very good, as is Japanese engineering, American engineering, Russian engineering. I've owned 3 BMWs and all were extremely well designed and reliable. I wouldn't recommend them to someone who sees a vehicle as its badge though



I know I'm a month late lol but:
German engineering is great but German cars are not reliable. Reliability is not baked into the product; it just isn't a key design consideration.
German cars are very well engineered (performance, handling, technology, etc) but reliability is oft the last consideration. 

Toyota(+most Japanese middle class brands) pride themselves in making a great product for not only the first owner, but even the second. Reliability is an inherent feature.


Then there is the cost of maintenance. Even if German cars are exceptionally reliable and can butt heads with the Japanese, German cars generally much more expensive to maintain. Premium gas. $100 oil changes. exorbitant parts costs. etc.


the light bulb I was referring to was from a friends experience (went from Toyota to BMW). In a Toyota, they changed the bulb for <30$. in the bmw they had to remove and replace the entire headlight- casing/bulb and all. 
This may no longer be the case but, the underlying problem has always been a typical German car issue: Want to fix the door locks? replace the door.


----------



## WGZ (Feb 3, 2017)

Friend had a 2011 328i XDrive. It was a bit of a headache towards the end, and he would've had to shell out 6000 had it not been for warranty. Interiors are highly overrated and I'm never impressed by E46 or E90/92 3 series interiors.

He ended up trading it in after those repairs, as it doesn't have any warranty left. He, and I quote, "upgraded to a new Ford Focus ST". I agree with him, it is a nicer car than that piece of junk BMW. Ford is the only domestic brand I really like, and want to own.


----------



## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

I had six or seven new Fords. Company cars. Kept them for one year. Lincoln, Taurus, Escapes.

Would not buy another Ford. Delivery problems with all of them. Lots of other issues, cars in the shop for several weeks at a time. Poor dealer service. Perhaps I had seven lemons in a row. Just thankful that I did not own them or have to pay for rentals when they were in the shop.


----------



## KevinWaterloo (Mar 5, 2015)

I owned a 2008 Ford Escape Hybrid for several years. There is no way I would claim that it was better or more reliable than a German car. 4x4 transfer case failed, rear glass shattered because of a poor mounting design, several significant engine issues etc. And I'm comparing that to my tuned BMW 335i which sees significantly more drivetrain abuse.

Having said that, I'm happy that people are trashing German cars. It helps keep the price down on used ones. The total ownership cost of my Porsche 996 has likely been lower than a Toyota Corolla. But __way__ more fun.


----------



## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

Same here. Transmission replacements, power steering cable issues, engine monitor module failures. Last time the service advisor drove it up to the front door of the dealership for me, after it had been in the shop for a new transmission at 18K, the engine trouble light was actually on. I had to wait for every part. Apparently there was a backlog. Absolutely no comparison to the service experience that we have had at Toyota and at Honda dealerships.


----------



## vega (Mar 22, 2017)

*hot diggity dog*

You know that you cannot take your cars with you in the afterlife. You can just rely on self-control and save money in case of emergency. You will need it especially when you have a family to take care of.


----------



## CalgaryPotato (Mar 7, 2015)

vega said:


> You know that you cannot take your cars with you in the afterlife.


Wait, so you can bring your cash with you now? 

I jest of course, you obviously want to make sure you have enough to take care of your family, and account for emergencies, that is most important.

But at the end of the day, whether you spend it or save it, you still can't take it with you. It isn't about spending money, but you have to enjoy the time while you have it.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Thoughts about a hybrid Toyota RAV4 or something similar size in a hybrid? Looking at 2018 for purchase. 

It would be nice to get a toy, i.e., sporty BMW but I hear from many people they are a money pit for a used car. Not cool.


----------



## GreatLaker (Mar 23, 2014)

vega said:


> You know that you cannot take your cars with you in the afterlife.


That's why frugal people drive such beater _cars_. No point leaving a nice set of wheels behind.


----------



## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

My Own Advisor said:


> It would be nice to get a toy, i.e., sporty BMW but I hear from many people they are a money pit for a used car. Not cool.


If you're like the poster above who would agree to pay the dealer to replace the door to fix the locks, then stay away. BMW has a reputation of being expensive in Canada because Canadians are gullible and pay inflated prices

I was surprised that it was actually much easier to work on my BMW than my previous Honda. But when the dealer tries to sell me x BMW part that can be sourced from the actual supplier at a fraction of the cost I can see where people get the idea

The price and quality of BMW models vary drastically so painting a brand with one stroke is futile. Soon there will be front wheel drive BMWs made in Mexico that are comparable to any other mass market slush box


----------



## GalacticPineapple (Feb 28, 2013)

Earl said:


> My question is not specific to cars but any expensive things you want but don't need.


In the case of BMWs in particular I think they used to be cool but I believe they're almost universally perceived as mid-life crisis purchases now, which puts them right up there with taking public transit or smoking.


----------



## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

Not a fancy car, but my most recent rental car was a Nissan Sentra. I was very impressed, handled well on the highway and amazingly good on fuel.

The data sheet says 37 mpg on highway but I got close to 40 mpg. That's a similar fuel efficiency to dinky cars like Toyota Yaris (and the Sentra is a much more solid car). Even hybrid cars I think don't get that much more than 40 mpg highway.


----------



## Earl (Apr 5, 2016)

I just did a brake job on my car. 4 new rotors, sets of pads, and bled the brakes. The old ones were very worn. Dealer wanted over $1000 to do the work. I found all the parts for $300 and did it myself. So I basically just made $700. You can save a lot of money by doing basic maintenance yourself. For the complex stuff I'd still have to take it in as I have neither the skills nor the specialised equipment required to do major work. The people who bring their car in to the shop for every bit of work must pay a fortune to maintain a car. The car brakes smoothly now, previously there was a bit of vibrating when applying the brakes. I think I'll keep my old car for a while longer, it drives great.


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

GalacticPineapple said:


> In the case of BMWs in particular I think they used to be cool but I believe they're almost universally perceived as mid-life crisis purchases now, which puts them right up there with taking public transit or smoking.


There is little doubt that one of their main reasons for success was being a dream driving machine, and many cars have caught up. The price point also dictates certain attainment of financial success.

In BC, we see young people driving them, probably with Daddy's money.


----------



## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

They are very popular in Calgary. 

I know several people who have only owned one, then moved to another brand because of the outrageous cost of dealer maintenance-routine and otherwise. 

Jaguars were very popular as well when Ford was popping them at huge discounts to seed the market. People soon caught on. They were lemons. We hardly see one anymore.

Land Rovers still seem to be in style for the horsey types and wannabes.


----------



## KaoruChiwa (May 21, 2017)

I love my BMW X5. Get it! If you can get it second hand and slightly used - I think it's well worth it. Significant discount from list price + good brand.
I only ask myself if I can make more then what I just about to spend...


----------



## Earl (Apr 5, 2016)

There are about a hundred cars I'd choose over a BMW X5. I'm not a fan of SUVs in general, if I wanted a large vehicle I'd rather have a pickup as they're more practical. But I like light, fast, good handling cars.


----------



## awesomeame (Nov 15, 2011)

I blew all the money I made on cars and other motorized toys in my 20s. I had a lot of fun, but wish I had another few 100k in my bank account now. I could retire earlier, and say FU to the man a lot sooner, lol. I was driving an $80 000 car when I was 23, blowing a grand on insurance every month to boot. Then I had race cars, dirtbikes, quads, sleds, trucks, you name it. I'm on my 14th car now, a paid-for toyota matrix which I plan to drive into the ground. And no more motorized toys the past 6yrs. I'm still on track for freedom-55, but it could have been freedom 45 or freedom 50. That's what I think about when faced with luxury items choices...Freedom 55.

Matt


----------

