# Florida Retirement Option



## sags (May 15, 2010)

I have been following this mobile home park in Florida for a few years.

It is resident owned, with an ownership fee of $22,000 and monthly maintenance fee of $200.

Lot rentals for RVs is available, and there are new/used mobile homes for sale or rent, with or without ownership share included.

It looks like a nice place and is resident owned, which is a plus.

The drawback for us is having to return to Canada every year, which means maintaining 2 places.

But some may be interested in looking at it. 

I give no recommendation on it, as I have never been there myself.

http://www.alligatorpark.com/info.php?pnum=3


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## OptsyEagle (Nov 29, 2009)

Have you checked into the issue with the alligators. Probably just a name, but I suspect it might have an effect on market values if every time you went out back an alligator was sunning himself on your deck.


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## uptoolate (Oct 9, 2011)

I think that we've decided to be serial renters. Too many potential complications with ownership of property in the US as well as the headache of two places and being tied down.


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## OldPro (Feb 25, 2015)

Being a snowbird is obviously a very popular thing to do in retirement. Heck, in Florida they even broadcast Canadian news every day in the winter.
http://canadacalling.com/2006/radio-broadcaster-keeps-canadian-snowbirds-dialed-in/

A lot of people when they retire like the idea of buying an RV to tour and to winter somewhere south in. Most of them also follow a pattern. They discover it's not so easy to stop along the way in a motorhome and tend to just drive directly to and from a destination where they park it for however long. ie. the winter. There goes touring. Then they discover it's not so easy to drive the RV into town to get groceries or something so they need a vehicle that they tow for doing that or change to towing a 5th wheel to have a separate pickup truck. Then they decide there's little point in driving it back and forth for the winter and having to deal with storing the RV back home somewhere. So they rent in an RV park by the year and leave the RV down their all summer. Then they discover that if you are staying in it for 4-5 months in the winter you need more space so they sell and buy a park model that never moves. Then they discover that paying for the year and being stuck with only going to that one place gets boring. Finally, they end up renting a park model for the winter and having the flexibility to change where they go every year if they want. So there you are uptoolate.

Florida is the most expensive place to actually snowbird. RV parks are the most expensive and rents are the highest. The only advantage it has is that people in Eastern Canada can drive down in a few days. We have rented in the southwestern USA several times for winter months. it's cheaper and we find more of interest to us there. But we are into deserts and hiking, not tarpon fishing. When we lived in BC, it was as easy for us to drive there as for Eastern Canadians to drive to Florida. Last year we drove from Ontario to Arizona and back. We decided it wasn't worth the drive, better to fly next time. Fly into somewhere like Phoenix or Palm Springs and rent a car by the month plus a place to stay. It will cost a couple of thousand more but will be worth it.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

A wise summary!

P.S. Winter in Florida is warmer than winter in the US Southwest, but there isn't anything relaxing about busy, crowded, expensive, flat soon-to-be-underwater Florida. Isn't there also the non-resident hostage tax if one owns?


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## Ihatetaxes (May 5, 2010)

AltaRed said:


> P.S. Winter in Florida is warmer than winter in the US Southwest, but there isn't anything relaxing about busy, crowded, expensive, flat soon-to-be-underwater Florida.


I'll try to remember that next time I'm walking the beach while my kids collect the morning shells near my house in Florida or having a cold beer in my pool after a few sets of tennis. :victorious:


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## uptoolate (Oct 9, 2011)

Yes I think that is how our thinking went OldPro. Although thankfully it was a mental exercise and we didn't actually do it. My understanding is that Florida taxes are somewhat punitive for non-residents. We have good friends in south Florida who plan to move to Tampa/St. Pete's when they retire and we are hoping that we can do a deal with them to upgrade to something that would let us stay for a month at a time without impacting them negatively. They want to leave south Florida more due to the hurricanes than the underwater thing - the former being a bit more of an acute issue. Other thing with owning in the US is personal tax and estate issues. Don't need the hassles.


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## OldPro (Feb 25, 2015)

Some people are happy to go to the same place year after year and some prefer variety. It's like vacations, some people go to the same place every year for their 2 weeks in July. Personally, I prefer to go to different places as well as re-visiting favourite places sometimes. Heck, some people can spend all their life working on the assembly line at Ford putting the nuts on the left front wheel of the car in front of them over and over and over and over and over. That would be my idea of the job from hell. There ain't nuthin stranger than folks.

Here is one of my favourite little hiking spots ihatetaxes. https://www.google.ca/search?q=borr...v&sa=X&ei=LiH7VPfPGYmvyQT-lIKoAQ&ved=0CBwQsAQ

I do have one favourite thing to do in Florida. You can rent a canoe at the campground in Ocala National Forest and canoe from Juniper Spring down to a bridge where they have a haul out and they truck the canoe and you back to the park. You can have a nice half day or so, picnic along the way and hopefully learn how to paddle a bit better than the guy in this video who keeps hitting the canoe with the paddle. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mhLzWyHdAyQ
http://www.tripadvisor.ca/ShowUserR...4-Ocala_National_Forest-Umatilla_Florida.html

I have a pet theory that any couple who get engaged should be required to go out together in any kind of boat for a day. Canoes and sailboats in paricular can be quite challenging to a relationship. If they get through that together then they may have a chance with their marriage.:biggrin:


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## Homerhomer (Oct 18, 2010)

AltaRed said:


> A wise summary!
> 
> P.S. Winter in Florida is warmer than winter in the US Southwest, but there isn't anything relaxing about busy, crowded, expensive, flat soon-to-be-underwater Florida. Isn't there also the non-resident hostage tax if one owns?


I would take winter in Florida over what we have been experiencing, however if the ocean level rise does materialize over the next few decades the investment can turn into a nightmare pretty quickly. 
One of many reasons I am also leaning towards not owing Florida or other foreign properties. Renting when desired seems like a no hassle and less expensive option.


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## OhGreatGuru (May 24, 2009)

The more I hear of these stories the more I think renting is the wisest solution. There's lots of discussion on this and other forums about snowbird issues. 

- health insurance gets progressively more expensive as you age;
- RV's depreciate in value a lot faster than a permanent structure;
- It was my understanding that Florida had discriminatory property tax rates for non-residents (presumably to make up for the fact they are not living there and paying sales and other taxes all year round - or maybe just because they can get away with it because non-residents don't get to vote) You need to check if this is going to be a hidden cost.
- Do you really want to risk coming within the orbit of the IRS by owning property in the USA.
- If you rent out your unit during times you are not there, you are definitely going to have rental income to report to both IRS and CRA. Do you need this headache?
- Florida is hurricane country, and mobile home parks are usually the hardest hit. The way the insurance industry operates, you probably can't get insured against it.
- Owning property ties you down in case your vacation interests change.


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## RBull (Jan 20, 2013)

I agree completely with what you're saying OldPro. 

We're recent retirees and have a fair bit of traveling in the past 9 months. For approx the past 5 weeks we have been renting in an RV park in south Texas where my folks have a park model, and have about another 5 weeks before we pull up stakes and start the journey home. I am 3rd generation to have visited here and seen some of the pattern you described with in laws, and have friends living through the same thing. Partly for that reason we had what you're saying about the evolution of snowbirds figured out, even before we got here. What we see and hear now confirmed it to a tee, along with how you've described it. 

We flew south and fortunately have access to a car here. We head home via both cruise ship and flying. It's been a great experience so far as winter Texans but confirms for us we want more flexibility to travel, stay in different areas, at least for quite a few more years. When the travel itch goes away a more permanent southern set up may have more appeal. However health insurance cost will be a serious consideration.


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

We go to Europe of some other exotic place for a month. But we spend 6 months in Mexico too.
1) It is cheaper than Canada
2) The other expats are interesting, being from many diverse places. The lady below is us from Paris. Most are from the US from west to east, and Canada, BC to Quebec.
3) Snowbird insurance covers us as a topup of our provincial medicare.
4) Medical care here is excellent.
5) We can have our pets with us.
6) We are not exposed to any potential tax grabs like in the US.

We have travelled the world but we want a place of some stability of experience.

Not for everybody, but after being retired for 13 years, it suits us.


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## avrex (Nov 14, 2010)

*Truck and RV Trailer*

I've removed my original post here and have moved it to a new thread about possibly using a Truck and RV Trailer in retirement.

I've created the separate thread here,
Retirement Travel - Truck and RV Trailer
and will let people comment there.
thanks.


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

Averex - interesting post (maybe even warrants its own thread?). We've been chewing on the same issue as it relates to traveling through NA (incl perhaps NWT, Yukon) in the first few years of retirement. 
We've kind of swung the other way recently, thinking we should instead travel lighter with a Honda C-RV and then 'rent-a-month' or stay in B&B/hotel for shorter term accomodation. Among our considerations though are other family commitments that make it uncertain how long and how many times we would be out on the road. Can certainly see pros to your plan. Interested to hear how others have traveled NA in retirement with or without their 'home' in tow.
Oops, also DW has ideas of more trips across the pond


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## avrex (Nov 14, 2010)

I like your idea. I'll create a separate thread.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

My dad traveled all over the US in an old car, with 2 tents in the trunk.

KOA campsites offer all the amenities, showers, washrooms, campfires..........etc.

Some people drive a small car and pull a pop up tent trailer. They have really changed over the years. They are hydraulic now and pretty nice inside.

There are also some nice micro trailers for 2 people, which are easy to tow and suit the purpose for many people.

I guess it all comes down to different interests and money.


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## fraser (May 15, 2010)

Our issue is the same. We do not want to be tied down to one place. But, 
we are always looking. Looked at Florida. Texas. AZ..big no. Next year we may rent in PV for two months to see how we like it. In the interim we travel in the winter. Left home on Dec 31 and plan to be back on April 4. So far Thailand is a favourite though we would not consider buying there. Too far to do it every year.


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## Guban (Jul 5, 2011)

fraser said:


> Our issue is the same. We do not want to be tied down to one place. But,
> we are always looking. Looked at Florida. Texas. AZ..big no. Next year we may rent in PV for two months to see how we like it. In the interim we travel in the winter. Left home on Dec 31 and plan to be back on April 4. So far Thailand is a favourite though we would not consider buying there. Too far to do it every year.


What is wrong with AZ? Haven't been, but it is on my list of possible places. Warm. Dry. Safe?


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

fraser said:


> Next year we may rent in PV for two months to see how we like it.


Let us know if you come. We are here from Nov 15th to May 15th after considering many different destinations for 10 years.


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## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

Hi:

If I had the $400,000 and a wife interested in acquiring the necessary skills, a Sabre 426 would do it for me. Though, I'd likely head to the Bahamas or places further south of Florida.

Gotta start working on the wife ... though we failed the canoe test as above, we survived the 18.5 foot sailboat test. Planning on doing a sailboat retest for 2 weeks again in the North Channel.

hboy43


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## OldPro (Feb 25, 2015)

What suits anyone differs just as much as with anything else. Generally, it all depends on what your interests are. My wife and I are into the outdoors, hiking, canoeing, biking, etc. and always have been. To spend 6 months in PV as kcowan does each year would never appeal to us but I am not suggesting it is the wrong thing for kcowan. To each his own.

The problem as I see it is that sometimes people invest MONEY and then discover it is not for them. So whatever someone THINKS is for them in retirement is fine but they need to go into it slowly and carefully if it involves investing money. Probably the worst is buying a retirement home in another country and then discovering it isn't for you. Buying an RV isn't as expensive but can still result in a signifigant loss of money if it doesn't work out.

RBull, when you say 'south Texas' that usually means the Gulf/Padre Island areas. When I say south Texas it means Big Bend National Park. Where in south Texas are you staying and what are you doing with your time there? As you say you are interested in trying different places, depending on your interests I may be able to give you some suggestions. My wife and I have spent a lot of time all over the US Southwest.

HBoy, since you like sailing, have you looked at taking a live-aboard course somewhere like the BVIs? Many sailing schools and colleges over courses which are actually cheaper than chartering. You can do a 5 day live-aboard on Lake Ontario for example for $1155 per person and then move on a 7 day Advanced in the Caribbean. Might be a way to get your wife more interested. :biggrin:


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## fraser (May 15, 2010)

Nothing wrong with Arizona....except that t is a bit far from the ocean.

We spent time analyzing our vacations/travels over the past years. Every one included a least some time by the sea.

Now thinking about two months in PV next winter. Two rentals of one month each in different PV locales. Big plus is that we can fly direct from Calgary or Vancouver and the route is somewhat competitive.


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## Jon_Snow (May 20, 2009)

I would never willingly spend extended periods of time away from the ocean...lakes of the B.C. interior can suffice for short periods, but the comparatively lifeless aspect of freshwater lakes eventually has me seeking the allure of the sea again. The Salish Sea and the Sea of Cortez provide all the wonderment my retirement years could ever want.


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

+1 We are landlocked but every vacation we've taken with the kids was to an ocean destination, whether beachcombing the west coast or scuba diving through the caribbean. Often thought that if we were going to buy any rec or retirement property it would have to be waterfront (which is apparently why we never have )
There is something primal and life sustaining about the ocean and its ceaseless waves.


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## RBull (Jan 20, 2013)

OldPro, we are in the San Benito area. Our time is pretty much spent in the park, reading, laying about, exercising, forum surfing, or doing some of the many activities available here, and of course socializing with my folks/others. We have access to a car but it isn't mine and I'm not comfortable abusing the privilege. We've done some day trips such as to south padre, mexico border and generally around the area. This is more of budget relaxation situation for us as we have been doing a fair number of cruises-3 in the past 5mths, 2 more booked in the next 2 months, 1 later in '15 and another spring '16 with an extended stay in Spain. For me this isn't a particularly pretty area but neither is parts of Florida I've been. And who knows what else will come up.We've also had some land tours in Canada and overall are away a lot from home. So as you can see we enjoy that as a travel lifestyle at least for now and if we're somewhere interesting we cram in all the excursions we can or add in land time at final or initial destination. We may be a bit spoiled living on the sea now and like that scenery particularly when the weather is good! We're physically active (I'm a former marathoner for years) and generally like the outdoors, but pretty laid back and don't have to be doing something all the time. 

I'd like to keep trying some warmer places probably in the US to enjoy 1-3 months stays renting in the winter. Just want to try different places and see what we like. We may consider driving to them and/or adding on some other world travel from there too. We're pretty versatile as to type of accommodation and focus largely on value- getting as much as we can for our dollar. 

Generally what we find is we're younger than pretty well everyone else now here and ideally like to be able to find places/people that are a bit more at our pace. In 10-15years plus this kind of place would be much more appealing for regular long term visits. 

Thanks for listening.


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## OldPro (Feb 25, 2015)

I actually don't care where I live. What I mean by that is I am content wherever I happen to be. I've lived in a lot of different places and always felt 'at home'.

I once went to a Greek island(after my retirement) expecting to stay for a week or so before travelling on. I stayed for 7 years. I'd meet a lot of tourists and when they found out I had been there for some years, they would often ask what made me decide to stay. I would honestly answer that I had never decided to stay, I just hadn't decided to leave yet. That is after all one of the advantages of being retired, you are free to do as you wish. The only reason to leave is if you are not content where you are. The only reason I left was to be with a woman who is now my wife. It's always about a woman isn't it. ;-)

Many tourists I met would tell me that they couldn't imagine leaving family and friends to live elsewhere and some even confessed to being 'homesick' by day 4 of a one week vacation. I understand the concept of homesickness but I have no idea what it feels like. Home to me is simply where I live now. I've lived by the sea, in mountains, in desert, in cities and currently live in a small rural Ontario town. I've been just as content in all of them. I would never say I have to live near water or near mountains or near desert, etc. To me, the more I have seen and experienced life in different places, the more I have come to understand that place doesn't matter. 

That has nothing to do with a desire to travel though. Most people but not all, enjoy seeing new places and cultures. Travel is great but I do think that in retirement, some people can confuse what they like about travel with where they would prefer to live. You may love beach vacations but it doesn't necessarily mean you will be happier moving to a house on a beach. 'Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose.' I often wonder if people who move to another country in their retirement realize that. I've met a fair number of people who were moving not just for a better climate or lower cost of living but because they thought they would be happier living somewhere else. Maybe I'm getting a bit too heavy here, so I'll leave it at that.

RBull, there is a little place in Southern California that I found about 30 years ago and have returned to off and on many times since then. Borrego Springs sits in the middle of the Anza Borrego Desert State Park which is one of the largest state parks in the USA and is the largest California State Park, but not that well known. As a place to spend a month or two in winter I would put it at the top of my list. That's my list of course and it may not appeal to someone else but you might want to do a little research and consider it for your list of future places to visit.

It's about an hour and a half from Palm Springs and over the years various big developers have attempted to turn it into another Palm Springs. All have failed. The people it appeals to seem to be more interested in what it isn't rather than interested in what Palm Springs is if you know what I mean. It's quiet and laid back rather than in your face ostentatious. The hottest spot in town is Carlee's Bar &Grill which has great comfort food, entertainment some nights and just a great atmosphere. It's what a southwest desert town bar & grill is supposed to be like. All kinds of accommodation can be found at pretty much any price level incluidng park models renting by the month. Seeing the desert bloom(some years better than others obviously) really is one of those you 'have to see it to believe it' kinds of things. Have a look here at what is happening this year: http://www.desertusa.com/wildflo/ca_abdsp.html It's hard to imagine a literal carpet of flowers stretching across the desert.

Here's some more links to look at if you want.
http://www.desertusa.com/anza_borrego/du-abpmain.html

We've sat having our lunch out of our packs in this canyon (easy hike) while California big horn sheep have been cropping the vegetation no more than 20 feet away from us. https://www.google.ca/search?q=borr...&ei=OXsAVdGwCIStyAS1jYHgCQ&ved=0CC8QsAQ&dpr=1 Gives a whole new meaning to lunch companions.


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## RBull (Jan 20, 2013)

^thanks for the info. I'll certainly have a look.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

I am amazed at how much travel some people have done in their lives.

I have ventured to Florida many times and out to Saskatchewan a couple of times, but not a whole lot of travel in my past.

Maybe when they perfect the Google glasses, I will take a few VR "trips".

It seems like I am missing something, but really have no desire to travel around a lot.

But I am better than some in the world. 

A couple friends of mine were in Tennessee and stopped in a small town near the Interstate for lunch. In the café, they asked the waitress the best way to get back to the Interstate and she had no idea. She told them she had never been beyond the town's borders. She was born there, went to school there, and worked there...........all within a few blocks.

She also told them she earned $2 an hour plus tips, so that might have been a big factor in her lack of travel.


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