# High Asset accounts at discount brokerages



## Guban (Jul 5, 2011)

It seems that most of the discount brokerages have specialized accounts for people with lots of $ and/or trade a lot.
iClub by Scotia iTrade
Royal Circle by RBC Direct Investing
President's Account by TD Direct Investing
5 Star by BMO Investorline
?? By CIBC Investor's Edge

They all seem to have exclusive phone numbers, and better interest rates, but is there much to set them apart? The upper levels of iClub seems attractive with $4.99 trades. The President's account apparently includes a dinner, but the official details are a bit sketchy. 

Any thoughts?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

It depends on what is important to an individual. I don't trade much so whether a commission is $5 or $10 or even $20 is not relevant to me. What I do like is: 1) the higher grade access to dedicated individuals who answer the phones promptly and often have answers to my questions, or are quick to get them, 2) elimination or reversal of certain fees*, 3) free Level 2 trading platforms. Perhaps access to more research although I don't know that for sure.

* Recent example at Scotia iClub: I needed iTrade to find a few 2008/2009 vintage statements from their predecessor (E*Trade Canada) days for a class action suit settlement claim. They found what I needed from their predecessor archives within a day or two and while I was initially charged their standard Research fee for that, I got an unsolicited personal email from a Relationship Manager telling me he would credit that fee for me. Now that was worth a big 'Thank you' and I gave them kudos for that.


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## janus10 (Nov 7, 2013)

AltaRed,

Does the Gold iClub level get you Level 2 quotes on US markets, and if so, do you need to use their advanced platform? I haven't seen it in their standard platform. TBH, I've not noticed any difference by moving into the iClub category, so I will look for some acknowledgement next time I log in.


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## avrex (Nov 14, 2010)

The Level 2 quotes (for both US and Canadian stocks) can be accessed through the *Premium FlightDesk Trading Platform* (it's not available on the Standard version).

Scotia iTrade Qualification Criteria and Benefits.

To qualify for the free Premium version, you'll need either,
- *$250,000* in assets with Scotia iTrade or
- 30 trades or more per quarter

If you don't have the above qualifications, then you would have to pay a monthly subscription fee to get the Premium version (i.e. Level 2 quotes).
iTrade Platform Fees


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## gardner (Feb 13, 2014)

Guban said:


> President's Account by TD Direct Investing


I have this, but I am uncertain what it gets me. Anyone know what the perks are, if any?

I see on the web site



> As a President's Account holder, you have direct access to a dedicated and knowledgeable team of Investment Representatives, 24/7. With their expertise and market experience, they'll provide you with the investment information, order placement and quotes you need to manage your portfolio with total confidence.


...but this just looks like the same telephone access everyone has.


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## GPM (Jan 23, 2015)

gardner said:


> I have this, but I am uncertain what it gets me. Anyone know what the perks are, if any?
> 
> I see on the web site
> 
> ...


I have the same. Unless the phone service is better, I don't see any perks like level 2 quotes etc. I'd be curious what I'm getting. I certainly didn't get supper!


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

janus10 said:


> AltaRed,
> 
> Does the Gold iClub level get you Level 2 quotes on US markets, and if so, do you need to use their advanced platform? I haven't seen it in their standard platform. TBH, I've not noticed any difference by moving into the iClub category, so I will look for some acknowledgement next time I log in.


As Avrex pointed out....Yes on Premium Flight Desk. BMO IL's product is MarketPro I believe. I've played with BMO's product, but am more familiar with Scotia's Premium Flight Desk and use that almost exclusively.


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## larry81 (Nov 22, 2010)

http://savvybuck.com/2014/09/13/td-waterhouse-presidents-account-complete-guide/

its mostly just the president phone line and level 2 quotes


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## Guban (Jul 5, 2011)

larry81 said:


> http://savvybuck.com/2014/09/13/td-waterhouse-presidents-account-complete-guide/
> 
> its mostly just the president phone line and level 2 quotes


Don't see the level 2 quote as a perk listed. Is that under point 5: "Additional Information in Markets & Research"?

Does anyone out there use level 2 quotes, and find them useful?


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## atrp2biz (Sep 22, 2010)

^ Yes. If I want 2000 shares of ABC with offers of 

5 x 20.00
4 x 20.01
6 x 20.02
7 x 20.03
6 x 20.04

...I'll just bid 20.03 to lift all the offers up to 20.03.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

^ Does it work the same way for sells?


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

atrp2biz said:


> ^ Yes. If I want 2000 shares of ABC with offers of
> 
> 5 x 20.00
> 4 x 20.01
> ...


For me, there would be an excellent (almost 100%) chance of getting the 1500 at a weighted average price, i.e. picking up the 5x20 at 20, the 4x20.01 at 20.01, etc. Depends on how and who has the sells in. One would most likely accomplish the same thing with a Market order. 

And to answer the next question, if you wanted to sell all 1500 in one go, one would have to go down deep enough to find offers adding up to 1500 shares.

Getting back to the 1500 buy though, I would normally offer just $20 and get the 500 at $20. Then if no one else moved their Ask down to $20, I'd go in and revise my Bid to $19.99 to see if I could scare the 4x20.01 into dropping his/her Ask to 19.99 or 20. I can play around like that until near closing time when I have to make the decision whether to change my price to finish my order, or leave it to another day. Naturally, this doesn't work all the time depending on price movement of the stock....but it is fun! I love Level 2 quotes.


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## Guban (Jul 5, 2011)

^ Too bad I'm not around during the day to take advantage of these strategies!

@AltaRed. If you bid like this through the day, doesn't your trading cost change? ie. $10 for the trade at $20. Then another $10 for $19.99? Seems you'd have to do some math to make sure that it is worth your while.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

atrp2biz said:


> ^ Yes. If I want 2000 shares of ABC with offers of
> 
> 5 x 20.00
> 4 x 20.01
> ...




me i think u may be bidding a tad too high, although if you want to nail the job in one take & don't trade too often, over-paying is indeed a valid technique that's practiced by many ...

what are the *real* bids on the other side? what kind of bid pattern is visible in the level 2s? how are the ticks, news, markets today?

even better ... how were the bid & ask fields looking yesterday? because often yesterday's unfilled pro trader is still lurking & willing, except that today he's just not bothering to show his bid or his ask.


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## atrp2biz (Sep 22, 2010)

This really depends on the underlying. For thinly-traded securities such as prefs, this is the strategy I employ. I find by splitting the mid-point of the B/A spread with a bid (offer), the offer (bid) side ends up disappearing and I don't get the execution I want. For liquid names, this technique isn't usually necessary.

Altared--I never use market orders and never will.

Generally, being a long-term buy-and-hold investor, I'm buying because I want to own the company. I refuse to put in a low bid hoping that the price drops to that level and I get filled. Many times in my past have I seen a stock run away after putting in a low bid that never gets filled. I no longer quibble over the ticks--I just want to ensure execution.


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## RBull (Jan 20, 2013)

I can only speak for RBC but one of the bigger benefits I found was cheaper insurance for home and auto since you are buying under a Group Rate. Our rates dropped about 20% avg. for home, 3 autos, 1 motorcycle so worthwhile savings.

I also like the higher quality, faster service on phone calls with a dedicated staff and phone number.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

atrp2biz said:


> For thinly-traded securities such as prefs, this is the strategy I employ ... I refuse to put in a low bid hoping that the price drops to that level and I get filled



i'm also one who ensures execution, i do get my trades filled same day, almost never do i see a stock or an option running away & leaving my bid behind in the dust.

(thinking about how this works) ... i think probably because when buying, i mostly get busy on ambiguous or falling days, when i imagine there are more counter-parties out who are ready to pitch, catch, punt, feint & carry. On days when markets soar or plummet i hurry to the sidelines & take shelter behind a rock.

i devoutly believe that there are nearly always more players than what the level IIs are showing, i believe that on a slightly falling day it's often a question of coaxing one out onto the dance floor


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

larry81 said:


> http://savvybuck.com/2014/09/13/td-waterhouse-presidents-account-complete-guide/
> 
> its mostly just the president phone line and level 2 quotes




the big green discontinued the PA phone lines in november 2013. Calls have been routed to the general TD queue ever since, their website seems to be a tad out of date.

for some hi value clients 18 months ago, losing access to the experienced PA reps was the last straw (at the time, TD was also still singing the rrsp mono-currency blues.) A fair number of valuable clients migrated elsewhere.

but that was then & this is now. What i see at the TD these days is a new cohort of representatives who were all hired during the past 2 years, who have all been well trained, who are each working to the max to do the very best job possible.

there's something refreshingly democratic about abolishing the elite phone queue for elite clients. There's something admirably egalitarian about saying they-have-to-phone-just-like-everbody-else.

abolishing the PA phone numbers at the TD meant speeding up phone response time across the board. Most TD clients will confirm that, these days, the big green is answering all phone calls within one or 2 minutes. Not just calls from the PA clients, but all calls from all clients.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Guban said:


> @AltaRed. If you bid like this through the day, doesn't your trading cost change? ie. $10 for the trade at $20. Then another $10 for $19.99? Seems you'd have to do some math to make sure that it is worth your while.


Not if I use one order and keep revising it. Say I got [email protected]$20. I can then revise the remaining 1000 of the order to a new price, and so on until my order is completely filled. There is only one trading commission if the trade is completed on the same business day.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

atrp2biz said:


> This really depends on the underlying. For thinly-traded securities such as prefs, this is the strategy I employ. I find by splitting the mid-point of the B/A spread with a bid (offer), the offer (bid) side ends up disappearing and I don't get the execution I want. For liquid names, this technique isn't usually necessary.


Lurking is almost essential on prefs. I lurk until I see enough in Level 2 at a price I am willing to pay. Then I put in the full order and it gets filled without the game playing, i.e. asks moving against my order. Same when I am selling. 

I swapped out FTS.PR.H for SLF.PR.G a month ago on the belief GOC5 might rise in the month of May AND I got crystallize a tax loss on FTS.PR.H for 2015. I waited for the price I was willing to sell FTS at and put in/executed the full order. Did the same for buying SLF.PR.G. Would have never accomplished this at the prices I did without having Level 2 on my screen.


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## janus10 (Nov 7, 2013)

avrex said:


> The Level 2 quotes (for both US and Canadian stocks) can be accessed through the *Premium FlightDesk Trading Platform* (it's not available on the Standard version).
> 
> Scotia iTrade Qualification Criteria and Benefits.
> 
> ...


Thanks. Couldn't actually launch the platform on my Mac. Just froze... Maybe I need to reboot or try Safari rather than Chrome. 

IB gives you so many ways to trade but only the downloaded PC app gives you all functionality. Their mobile app is pretty good and they also have a browser based platform.


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## pwm (Jan 19, 2012)

It appears that to get streaming quotes and level 2 quotes at TDDI you need to subscribe to Advanced Dashboard, which is free if you make 30 trades per quarter, otherwise $29/month. President's Account doesn't help any.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

janus10 said:


> Thanks. Couldn't actually launch the platform on my Mac. Just froze... Maybe I need to reboot or try Safari rather than Chrome.


Flight Desk uses Java. Don't think I've ever tried making it work on an Apple product.


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

I also have the TDDI President's account, and it's hard to tell if I'm getting any faster access to phone agents when I call in, even using voice-print (which is quite insecure in my opinion... their system is vulnerable to what are known as _replay attacks_, and I worry that TD thinks this is somehow secure).

The lower margin rates are a nice perk. I look at my margin account as a LoC (if I ever need it), though I've never borrowed from TDDI yet.

I'm interested in that free dinner. Where is it?


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## janus10 (Nov 7, 2013)

james4beach said:


> I'm interested in that free dinner. Where is it?


Patricia Lovett Reid's house


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

janus10 said:


> patricia lovett reid's house


lol


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## gardner (Feb 13, 2014)

pwm said:


> at TDDI [...] President's Account doesn't help any.


That's my assessment.


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## larry81 (Nov 22, 2010)

james4beach said:


> I'm interested in that free dinner. Where is it?


The mysterious free diner is basically a simulation where you are acting as a fish in a barrel while TD salesman try to get you to move your asset with one of their full service broker. Their guys are so good at making money for other people that they have a 40-50k job as a broker at TD. How could you pass on that deal ?


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## 0xCC (Jan 5, 2012)

From my experience the only thing that a PA account at TDDI gets you now is the reduced margin rates.

My wife opened a SDRSP account a little over a year ago and we had a President's Account at the time. We were doing the paperwork in a branch and the advisor we were working with asked how much she was planning to put into the account. I asked specifically if she needed to put $25k in to avoid the annual service charge even though we had a President's Account. He had to go ask someone else but he came back and said that the $25k minimum balance was required to waive the annual fee. So no perk there from my experience.


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## Guban (Jul 5, 2011)

So it would seem that there is very little benefit to these accounts besides the level 2 quotes at Scotia iClub. The $4.99/trade only applies for very active traders from the looks of it, upon reading the fine print.
Doesn't seem to be a definitive answer for level 2 quotes with BMO.
The dedicated line for RBC Royal Circle members is nice too.

Looks like there are a lot of TD people out there, but the President's Account doesn't seem to be much. 

I am surprised that CIBC is absent from the game.


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## Guban (Jul 5, 2011)

BMO does offer level 2 quotes.

http://www.bmo.com/self-directed/fees-investment-account-types/fees


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## atrp2biz (Sep 22, 2010)

Yes.

https://www.bmo.com/self-directed/fees-investment-account-types/fees#5-star-program


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Guban said:


> BMO does offer level 2 quotes.
> 
> http://www.bmo.com/self-directed/fees-investment-account-types/fees


At the Gold level, Market Pro software is competitive with Scotia iClub Premium Flight Desk. As I mentioned upthread, I've used both but prefer Flight Desk, probably due to familiarity.


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## pwm (Jan 19, 2012)

BMO beats TDDI in this regard.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

Guban said:


> ....
> 
> I am surprised that CIBC is absent from the game.


 ... heard from a friend, CIBC IE offers level II quotes for free with a $1M account, and also lower commissions for active traders. Previously, CIBC IE gave level II with $250K or $500K but then they upped it.


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## 0xCC (Jan 5, 2012)

It also seems as though there are different levels of President Accounts at TDDI. They don't seem to provide much information anywhere on what the levels are and what the benefits are at each level. Very strange marketing strategy there.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

As has already been mentioned indirectly, the type of software level offered for Level 2 quotes also depends on account size. In the links to BMO 5 star above, the type of Level 2 quotes offered at the Gold and Platinum levels (a trading platform) are quite different than that offered (quotes only) at the Silver level. The trading platforms are real time dynamic platforms. 

I am surprised TDDI keeps things a secret.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

it appears that TD is focusing more on rewarding trading volume, less on rewarding the numerous 250k-500k accounts that sit there year after year but are not particularly active (do we hear the couch potato kazoo quartet playing softly in the background.)

the big green discontinued its PA phone queues more than a year ago, routed all calls into the general queue, then made sure that all calls got answered within a minute or 2.

the TD offers sleek Advanced Dashboard - which includes detailed level II quotes plus other treats such as customizable heat maps - free to accounts with 30 trades per quarter. This is a modest number of trades, only 10 per month, or 2.5 per week.

while Dashboard can be leased for $29 per month by investors doing less than 10 trades a month, it noticeably cannot be acquired for free by even a $1M account, unless that account is also doing ... the required ... 10 trades ... per month ...

as a business plan, i think the big green has the right idea. They'll profit most from increased trade volume. The size of a broker's book - the aggregate money under management - is irrelevant, when a large portion of that money is sitting passively in indexed pools.

they say royal bank's discount side has the biggest book among discount brokers, but a limited trade execution profile since royal is known as an important offeror of fixed income products & many of their clients are sitting in these year after year.

on a lighthearted note, nobody has mentioned the TD diamond PA clients. Do those guys get perks or not, i ask you. Reportedly they even have their own dedicated call centre located in the landmark Mies van der Rohe TD tower complex in downtown toronto. Where the fabled TD art collection is housed.

the rest of us peasants have to make do with the rank & file reps who answer from low-rent call centres located in the burbs.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

humble_pie said:


> This is a modest number of trades, only 10 per month, or 2.5 per week.


Maybe for a trader, but an investor? Ten trades is closer to an annual number for me.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

AltaRed said:


> Maybe for a trader, but an investor? Ten trades is closer to an annual number for me.


then you would not fit the new desirable market profile at the big green at all .each:

how could a broker earn any $$ from such a client
10 trades could not begin to pay for the custodial & administrative costs of such an account, especially not if it included registered accounts ...


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## Guban (Jul 5, 2011)

humble_pie said:


> then you would not fit the new desirable market profile at the big green at all .each:
> 
> how could a broker earn any $$ from such a client
> 10 trades could not begin to pay for the custodial & administrative costs of such an account, especially not if it included registered accounts ...


Does such a client carry a substantial amount of cash? Many such clients, pooled together, would make money for a brokerage.

I haven't read my account agreement lately, but I seem to recall that brokerages can lend out clients' securities. Am I wrong about this? Don't some mutual funds use this to improve their bottom line?


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## larry81 (Nov 22, 2010)

humble_pie said:


> then you would not fit the new desirable market profile at the big green at all .each:
> 
> how could a broker earn any $$ from such a client
> 10 trades could not begin to pay for the custodial & administrative costs of such an account, especially not if it included registered accounts ...


hehe they still cashed my cheque ! They made 131$ in trading fee's from me last year, how fantastic is that !


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

humble_pie said:


> how could a broker earn any $$ from such a client
> 10 trades could not begin to pay for the custodial & administrative costs of such an account, especially not if it included registered accounts ...


I agree completely. Yet, iTrade especially appears to treat me like royalty and BMO IL gives me a courtesy call every 6 months or so. I suppose firstly, I save them postage (electronic statements, trade confirmations) and secondly, issuers must pay them to distribute paper proxy materials, annual reports and the like. They wouldn't want my business if they were losing money.

And per Guban, I don't carry loose cash in my accounts though I do hold healthy sums in the in-house HISAs for which the brokerage gets a 25bp trailer. Still not much though. At $100k HISA, annual trailer would only be $250.


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## 0xCC (Jan 5, 2012)

humble_pie said:


> then you would not fit the new desirable market profile at the big green at all .each:
> 
> how could a broker earn any $$ from such a client
> 10 trades could not begin to pay for the custodial & administrative costs of such an account, especially not if it included registered accounts ...


I agree with this, a client that trades frequently is likely more valuable than a client that trades very infrequently but that has a higher overall account value.

If TD also agrees with this then why have President's Accounts based on account value at all? Or why not have the qualifying account value at a higher level?

From what I can tell the only real benefit left for President's Account status is lower margin rates. And those margin rates are not really any lower than what I can get from a HELOC anyway so what is the point? Is it just hold-over from a bygone era where account value did actually generate extra revenue somehow?


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

as everyone knows, there are huge numbers of other variables to consider, in addition to raw account size or raw trade executions. 

only a few of these variables might be: size/importance of client's business relationship with the parent bank. History of client's relationship. A long relationship over time probably indicates not only a loyal client but also an aging client, which in turn could signify possible discretionary wealth management (high fees) or possible estate execution or management (also high fees.) Spreading of goodwill. Familiies often bring other family members to the parent bank, especially when there was a strong business relationship to begin with.

ie there are countless reasons to treat high-value clients like the gold mines they are, even if they only carry out one trade per month.

it's possible that, in reducing the historic PA benefits & in turning the focus upon active trading accounts, the big green is making a serious mistake. Certainly a number of PA clients did leave last year, complaining that they could not get the service they were used to. Overall 2013/2014 will never go down as vintage glory years for the big green, although at the very end of the period they did finally manage to roll out the long-awaited dual currency RRSP.

did i mention the TD Diamond PA clients? i believe they are served by personal green footmen. There is nothing the Diamonds cannot have, if they but speak a wish. I hear the minimum to qualify is $10 million. I suspect we might have at least one Diamond amongst us peasants in the forum .each:


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

AltaRed said:


> I agree completely. Yet, iTrade especially appears to treat me like royalty and BMO IL gives me a courtesy call every 6 months or so. I suppose firstly, I save them postage (electronic statements, trade confirmations) and secondly, issuers must pay them to distribute paper proxy materials, annual reports and the like. They wouldn't want my business if they were losing money.
> 
> And per Guban, I don't carry loose cash in my accounts though I do hold healthy sums in the in-house HISAs for which the brokerage gets a 25bp trailer. *Still not much though*. *At $100k HISA, annual trailer would only be $250*.


... multiples of that $250 still makes up nicely to a bigger market share for the banks' d.b.. 

Speaking of BMOIL providing a courtesy call, do they actually phone you or offer these "customized" promotions like get $4K cashback for $3M of assets transfer apart from usual $1K cashback or 500 free trades (within 90 days)? If I had $3M of assets, why would I want to trade anyways? And who as a DIY trader can actually perform 500 freetrades with one account all within 60 business days? ... lol.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

Guban said:


> I haven't read my account agreement lately, but I seem to recall that brokerages can lend out clients' securities. Am I wrong about this? Don't some mutual funds use this to improve their bottom line?



brokers cannot borrow from paid-up cash accounts & my understanding is that they cannot borrow, either, from margin accounts whose margin is still intact. However the mere selling of short options is enough to impair a margin account.

my further understanding, as far as i've been able to take this line as a plain simple-minded crumpet is that, once margin in a margin account is impaired, the broker is free to borrow whichever securities it needs. 

ie in a margin account, it's not a question of which security was paid for in the past & which is still held on margin. A margin deficit opens the entire account, goes my understanding. This means that anyone holding stock long & selling calls short has impaired margin & the broker could borrow, theoretically speaking.

a while ago i did inquire of a friend who's worked in the discount biz for 23 years including more than a decade at a broker with exceptionally busy margin accounts & he replied to the above in the affirmative but said the IIROC regulations allow each brokerage house to set its own borrowing rules, some may be more aggressive than others. He also affirmed that brokers cannot borrow from paid-up cash accounts.

Guban you usually carry out meticulous research, if you would have time to look into practices at your own broker & get back to us, it would contribute so much to general knowledge here in cmf, i do believe.

i'm also believing that the broad issue of broker borrowing securities from clients in order to support short selling is not a topic that brokers actually wish their clients to know much about.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Beaver101 said:


> Speaking of BMOIL providing a courtesy call, do they actually phone you or offer these "customized" promotions like get $4K cashback for $3M of assets transfer apart from usual $1K cashback or 500 free trades (within 90 days)?


A bit of both. I am asked the usual questions about my satisfaction with them in a variety of ways and then what they could do to get more of my business (they know they are not my #1 brokerage in terms of Assets). They, of course, will also mention any current offers, which for me would always have to be cash back, not free trades... and they already know that from their likely profile on me. I usually take the occasion to suggest to them a few ways they could improve their website/tools, etc. and that is it.


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## larry81 (Nov 22, 2010)

Beaver101 said:


> "customized" promotions like get $4K cashback for $3M of assets transfer


Where does this come from ? anymore information on this ? is this a real promotion ???


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## james4beach (Nov 15, 2012)

As soon as you use any kind of margin, the broker is allowed to borrow assets from your account.



> ie in a margin account, it's not a question of which security was paid for in the past & which is still held on margin. A margin deficit opens the entire account, goes my understanding. This means that anyone holding stock long & selling calls short has impaired margin & the broker could borrow, theoretically speaking.


Yes that is also my understanding. If you don't want the broker borrowing anything from your account, then make sure you fully pay for all purchases and don't use any margin.

When my parents opened their discount brokerage account I recommended they open a non-margin account, because then you can be sure you don't accidentally use margin.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

here's another sign that the TD is encouraging active trading by offering strong support for options trading. At present the big green will execute agent-handled phoned-in option spread orders at web commission. These cannot be done online as spreads via webBroker, although Think or Swim can handle spreads for US options only.

even better, the TD reps are charging the base commission only once. For example, a buy/write consisting of 500 shares plus 5 calls would cost $16.24 (9.99 for the shares plus 6.25 for the options.)

by contrast, many discount brokers will charge full agent-handled commissions for each side of a buy/write or contingent order. The above example could cost more than $100 (roughly $43-60 for the stock plus roughly $10-50 for the options) at some prominent discount brokers.

alas, some prominent discount brokers have problems that are worse yet: they do not even accept buy/write orders or option spread orders.

back to the TD, it occurs to me that their above-mentioned support for option trading is deliberate. They are anticipating that the option trading clients will form part of the order volume they intend to capture.

so how is low-commission option trading going these days at the big green? i'd say better than ever. All representatives taking the phone orders are noticeaby well-trained. All representatives are able to handle complex strategies rapidly & perfectly.

the actual option trade control desk at the big green - the guys who field the orders onto the exchanges - is staffed by experienced personnel who have worked that desk for years. IMHO they are extremely capable, repeatedly landing excellent fills that are even better than the net credit or debit which a client had specified in the first place.

bref, right now it's salad days, it's a vintage year, for options trading at the big green. I'm sensing that this is part & parcel of a grand TD design to support active trading.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

larry81 said:


> Where does this come from ? anymore information on this ? is this a real promotion ???


 ... from BMOIL's management? as passed on by a friend ... as said, this is a "customized" promotion. Perhaps I should have been clearer and said an "Offer" instead of promotion. 

If you're with BMOIL, you might want to call and ask them for any special offers outside their usual promotions.


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## larry81 (Nov 22, 2010)

Beaver101 said:


> ... from BMOIL's management? as passed on by a friend ... as said, this is a "customized" promotion. Perhaps I should have been clearer and said an "Offer" instead of promotion.
> 
> If you're with BMOIL, you might want to call and ask them for any special offers outside their usual promotions.


I dont imagine myself calling their helpdesk and asking 'hello i heard on the internet that you were offering 4k for 3M of asset switch'.

I am with the big green but would switch portfolio to BMO in a heartbeat for 4k


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

^ Come-on larry81, with your investing savvyness, you can certainly call them up and say "I got this many $M of assets, what can you do for me or what "special" can you offer me to move over"? if you're not interested in their smaller value promotions on lower-range of assets transfer that's currently in place.


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## larry81 (Nov 22, 2010)

probably but the 1-800-helpdesk have no power over this kind of 'deal'.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

^ Ask for their "supervisor" or management then. Frontdesk only answers phones and recite from a help manual - minimal "deal' authority level.


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## PDLD (Jan 3, 2014)

*TD Webbroker Streaming Quotes and Advanced Dashboard*

So I received an online notice from TD this morning that Streaming Quotes will be discontinued starting December 15. Later on in their message, they say "As a valued client and based on your current relationship with us (i.e., executing a minimum of 30 trades per quarter or maintaining $500,000 in household assets), you'll enjoy access to Level 1 real-time streaming data on Advanced Dashboard at no charge."

Is this "$500,000 in household assets" qualification something new? I've used Advanced Dashboard twice in the past, and have been charged the $29 both times, even though I have well over $500k in assets (I do trade, but not 30 trades per quarter). There doesn't seem to be any mention of this $500k requirement anywhere else on the Advanced Dashboard page.

Paul


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## larry81 (Nov 22, 2010)

PDLD said:


> So I received an online notice from TD this morning that Streaming Quotes will be discontinued starting December 15. Later on in their message, they say "As a valued client and based on your current relationship with us (i.e., executing a minimum of 30 trades per quarter or maintaining $500,000 in household assets), you'll enjoy access to Level 1 real-time streaming data on Advanced Dashboard at no charge."
> 
> Is this "$500,000 in household assets" qualification something new? I've used Advanced Dashboard twice in the past, and have been charged the $29 both times, even though I have well over $500k in assets (I do trade, but not 30 trades per quarter). There doesn't seem to be any mention of this $500k requirement anywhere else on the Advanced Dashboard page.
> 
> Paul


Sad saddddd.. TD is getting greedy...

the 500k is the threshold for president account


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

PA accounts at TD have gone the way of the dodo. The big green doesn't care - up to a critical threshhold - what your asset base might be.

the new mantra is trading activity. 30 or more trades per quarter = free dashboard. Coming soon if not here already is new dashboard with customizable levels of streaming quotes. Depending on your aggregate trades, you might have to pay for some of the finer streaming details (was i hearing level II streaming quotes for options? gosh, never thought i'd see that day.)

for folks with very large assets but low trading activity, TD has an elite squad of "relationship managers." You could have your very own personal green footman, oops relationship manager. You only need a minimum $10 million account.


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