# iPhone 4S



## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

I know it's a waste of money considering I have the iPhone 4,

But somebody talk me out of it.

Siri just seems so cool...

Not to mention I only have 200MB free on my current 16GB.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

Give us some input on what the differences are, and
whether your iphone4 will still have any value to somebody else,
if you upgrade to the 4s?

What are the limitations of your iphone 4G now besides 16GB memory? 
Can you just upgrade yours?
Voice activation built in will become standard on all of these ehanced
iphones. 
There is probably work going at Apple on the iPhone 5G, 
and when they announce that one, will your 4G or 4Gs become obsolete?


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

It's not really that big of a waste if it's something you use a lot. Most things you buy you'd never use them even a fraction as much, or carry everywhere you went. The good thing about the 4s is that it's the same size so you don't have to buy any new accessories

Siri only working on 4s is just marketing though, it could probably work on 4 and 3G as well. If you think it's cool how Siri can answer questions, just get the Wolfram Alpha app as that's the brains behind it. Wolfram won't integrate with your calender and contacts etc though. Google app also does voice search which I've found handy, Google translate also does voice translation

Lots of people are buying the 4 used because they see no difference with the 4s and also because they don't want a contract. I see no rush to pay full price for a new one or to sell mine in a rush. If you're patient there will be new ones for sale cheaper online and there will easily be suckers to pay just as much for a 4

5 won't make 4 obsolete. They are still selling new 3Gs and supporting them with the latest software. 5 might have a bigger screen, but they're kind of plateau'd in hardware. Until someone invents a better battery, any higher specs just burn more power for little gain. Lots of potential in software, and even if they block it to older phones even a 2 year old could use jailbreak


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## financialnoob (Feb 26, 2011)

It might be worth it if you're still on the 3, but the 4? You know they're going to release the 5 by the time you get used to the 4S...


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## FrugalTrader (Oct 13, 2008)

I've read that SIRI is severly limited for Canadians. Adding to calendar etc will still work, but finding restaurants based on location etc will not.


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## the-royal-mail (Dec 11, 2009)

This is what cellphones and the like are really worth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=viI--h7jXX0


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## LBCfan (Jan 13, 2011)

You could try the $.99 upgrade.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

KaeJS said:


> I know it's a waste of money considering I have the iPhone 4,
> 
> But somebody talk me out of it.
> 
> ...


In 9 months there will be an iPhone 5. If you must, buy that instead. You're welcome.


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## LondonHomes (Dec 29, 2010)

When I read about the upgrades from the 4 to the 4S I was disappointed was kind of expecting more. Easy choice to wait for the 5.

Besides Siri will be cool for about the first 5 minutes of having the phone and after that you'll never use it.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

the-royal-mail said:


> This is what cellphones and the like are really worth.



LAFF! I've seen that "Eastern European Pawn Shop owner" on Fido's
TV ads. Yes that's about the size of it. 

While some of the latest BB's (crackberries), and iPhones may still have some resale value, the way they are building in more and more features/memory with every new generation, these are destined for the recycle heap sooner with each
new generation that comes out.

How much are these things really worth when you lust for the next.. 
"voice activated and talks to you" techno-miracle-all-you-need-rolled-into-one-compact-hand-held-portable unit? It's like being on "crack", once they have hooked you..you can't escape the clutches of the service providers, who see 
more and more gold in these with every new release.

They have to make money somehow..and this is the way they know
they can do it..with lots of data charges. 

I watched a program on CBC (Marketplace) about Canada's most expensive
phone bill..it was in the thousands, because some woman signed up with
"Robers" for a "free" crackberry for her and her son, and because she was
being kicked out Canada to the US, she wanted to get out of the contract,
and it was going to cost her thousands!

While technology is wonderful, the problem is that the public is getting
used to it, wanting it, wanting more and more!..and it's similar to the service providers being "pushers" with these features, apps, and all the other things
you can do with them. 

However, it always comes at a personal cost...($$).

Standing joke last week when they had that huge global Blackberry outage'
for nearly 4 days...
"What did one BB say to the other one?
reply: "Nothing".


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Canada has the most expensive data plans in the world and yet I had an iPhone with a $25/month bill that did everything and I didn't even use all the data. Canadians are just suckers for contracts

$1000 to break a contract sounds wrong. If you take a subsidized "free" phone, you have to pay for it but they don't cost thousands. The problem with the free phone and contract is a) your device is carrier locked and b) you have no leverage or say in the monthly bill

You can actually break any contract when you leave the country. They all told me I had to pay and then I asked if they provided service in my new country.. if not, they have to break the contract. Again Canadians are mostly suckers for contracts and seem to have no clue when it comes to these plans. It's the same thing with internet, car insurance etc

Blackberries and Androids are mostly disposable plastic after a year but the iPhones I would say have a shelf life of at least 2 or 3 years. Heck you can sell an iPhone to Target for hundreds, and that's because they know they can resale them at 100% markup


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

It's not that the iPhone 5 makes the 4S obsolete when it is announced. It is that you should try to optimize your replacement cycle somewhat. Why buy the first new iteration (4S) after your phone (4), when you can wait a little longer for the 5 and keep your 4 for two iterations. It will be a bigger marginal improvement per $. And unless the 4 is a piece of junk, is there that much reason to throw away a 1 year old phone?


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

andrewf said:


> It's not that the iPhone 5 makes the 4S obsolete when it is announced. It is that you should try to optimize your replacement cycle somewhat. Why buy the first new iteration (4S) after your phone (4), when you can wait a little longer for the 5 and keep your 4 for two iterations. It will be a bigger marginal improvement per $. And unless the 4 is a piece of junk, is there that much reason to throw away a 1 year old phone?



Like I mentioned in my reply, Andrew..it's a technology "upgrade game"
with these crackberries and iphones. Once they got you are hooked, they
keep working on the next generation, and the next one after that.

So those who get hooked (into very expensive service contracts), line up
in subfreezing temperatures, or camp overnight to be first at the door,at
the big box store's parking lot to be the first to get one, 
because supplies are always limited at first announcements.

They do this on purpose, to create a user demand..and the users
who are not fulfilled... want one even more, and will go to any lengths 
to get one. Some who buy the first offerings turn around and resell
them (or scalp them) at twice the price. So this is similar to the
drugs out there. 

It's a "techno drug" and users build up a dependency on them, 
and if they don't work, (as in last weeks BB outage), their lives
almost fall apart because they can't seem to function without them.

The existing iphone 4G only comes with 16GB (yes Gigabytes of memory)
the new 4s can be obtained in 16, 32 or 64GB! Wanna bet that the
next gen (5G) will be 64, and maybe even 128GB?)


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## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

I knew it was a waste of money from the beginning.

I'm just trying to justify buying it because I want it.

Obviously, from a financial standpoint, its not a wise move.

Frugal, is that really true about Siri and the Canadian mapping? If so, that's not very impressive at all.


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## FrugalTrader (Oct 13, 2008)

yes globe investor had an article on it. Who knows, maybe Canada will be supported in the future.


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## jamesbe (May 8, 2010)

I sold my old 3G today for $120, bought a 3GS for $170, the iPhones keep theiR value.

I wouldn't bother with a4s if you have a 4. Too bad Siri does not woRk well in Canada, googles data is awesome so google phones work well with this type of thing, too bad apple has to build their own database they do not have a huge pool of search engine history behind them.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

jamesbe said:


> I wouldn't bother with a4s if you have a 4. Too bad *Siri does not woRk well in Canada*, googles data is awesome so google phones work well with this type of thing, too bad apple has to build their own database they do not have a huge pool of search engine history behind them.


Siri is an artificial intelligence database..and these days there seems to be
a lot more artificial intelligence out there, than possibly "real intelligence"...
..if you know what I mean.

But for those techno geeks that just must have the latest phone gadget out
there...
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13772_3-20122116-52/apples-siri-wont-win-over-miss-manners/

Does "S" stand for Siri?

*Picture this possible scenario....*
Owner of Apple's iphone4S: "Siri..I'm looking for a hot date! Any ideas where
to look?"

Siri: "Wait..."searching in database..sorry! *eating hot dates, can lead to serious burns! *."

Owner: no Siri..."I'm looking for hot FEMALE date!

Siri: Dates are neither male nor female, but a fruit of the date palm..is that
what you are looking for?

Owner: no Siri,

Siri (in a puzzled expressive robotic voice) "I don't understand..please repeat
the request again."

Owner: (thinking to himself, if this is really worth going through all the trouble
explaining to Siri..what are the definitions and context meanings of 'hot"
and "date"..) finally arrives at a conclusion....

....."never mind, Siri I will think about it some other time. "


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## FrugalTrader (Oct 13, 2008)

Here is the video I was talking about:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...-hole-in-siri-voice-assistant/article2201727/


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

jamesbe said:


> I sold my old 3G today for $120, bought a 3GS for $170, the *iPhones keep theiR value.*


For you my friend..I give you dancing flower?..or if you prefer music, my old
collection of 33 1/3 rpm record Lawrence Welk dance tunes..no bubbles sorry..
is goot deal? yes/no?


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

FrugalTrader said:


> Here is the video I was talking about:
> 
> http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...-hole-in-siri-voice-assistant/article2201727/


"apple has hired a bunch of nerds"...
to program responses to stupid questions, 
like...
"what are you wearing (Siri)..."what is your bra size? (Siri)" and questions such as those to do with immature males that will come up with the stupidest sexist jokes just to hear a tailored response from artificial intelligence data base female voiced entity..

and it can't even give you a specific location of where you are at the moment.. so you still have to use GPS! 

"is goot toy" And for this you will want to pay extra? 

Why not wait for G5 or G6 when they merge GPS and all the current features
together. 

"you still want fries with that?"


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Unlocked iPhone 4's are selling for €500 in Europe (they cost this much locked with a 2 year contract here, plus tax). I can buy a new 4s for that. I need to find some used winter rims first and then maybe I'll put the effort to upgrade the phone for free (just takes some leg work etc)

Siri has no real "new" technology, it's just that Apple actually tries to make features people will use beyond the first 5 minute wow that sells the product. Knowing how well google search works, I've been using Google voice search for awhile instead of typing on the go. Wolfram Alpha is like an advanced search engine, and Siri uses it to answer any questions about facts. The random questions are just for fun obviously


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

Preorder an iPhone 4S on 36 month contract for $159, pick up the phone on launch day, sell the phone to people lining up outside the store for full MSRP, sell the contract, keep the profit.

Lather, rinse, repeat. Works with other trendy phones too. $$


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## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

FrugalTrader said:


> Here is the video I was talking about:
> 
> http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...-hole-in-siri-voice-assistant/article2201727/


This video just convinced me to not buy the 4S.

No directions or maps in Canada? Bite me.


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## carverman (Nov 8, 2010)

KaeJS said:


> This video just convinced me to not buy the 4S.
> 
> No directions or maps in Canada? Bite me.


Use GPS..a million taxi cab drivers can't be wrong. 

Seriously, buying a 4s just so you can ask Siri about the square root of 36?
Or you are so busy in your life that you have "It" (her?) make an appt for a 
haircut?

Perhaps that "haircut" is the financial drain on your wallet for buying
basically a voice activated "artificial intelligence database prototype" right now. 
Wait about 3 to 5 years, and they will come up with much more apps and capabilty than you ever pssibly dreamed of.....

and you could be that guy on the Fido commercial...
asking the eastern european pawn shop owner..
"how much can I get for this iphone4s?":. 

A: "for you..I give you dancing flower..my friend"


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## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

mode3sour said:


> Wolfram Alpha is like an advanced search engine, and Siri uses it to answer any questions about facts.


Wolfram Alpha is one of the apps with the greatest potential. I am anticipating great things when it is more developed.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

ddkay said:


> Preorder an iPhone 4S on 36 month contract for $159, pick up the phone on launch day, sell the phone to people lining up outside the store for full MSRP, sell the contract, keep the profit.
> 
> Lather, rinse, repeat. Works with other trendy phones too. $$


Don't contracts have a negative present value without the phone?


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

All subsidized phones are made available on condition of signing up with "select 3 year plans". These hardware bundled plans usually give more bang for your buck than the standard offerings. So for people that already have a phone but want to switch carriers or want specific features it could still be a good deal.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

The price of the phone is basically worked into the contract. In Europe you pay €100-300 euro for the phone and an extra €10/month for 2 year contract (plus your phone is carrier locked which is a huge disadvantage to Europeans or Canadians who travel abroad) If you break the contract, the fee you pay is to cover the subsidized phone however you phone is useless on another carrier..

In many countries, you can't buy the phone unlocked directly. In Canada you can buy the phone directly and I was able to negotiate a much better deal having the leverage to go with any carrier. In Canada though, you're pretty much screwed and might as well take the contract if you don't travel

If you have an unlocked iPhone, I'd sell it online. Here they are asking ~€600 for iPhone 4 32GB and even 16GB are selling easily for €500 (what they cost new in Canada) Tax is another huge factor, as you can save $100 ($200 in Europe) in tax by buying used. iPhones being gorilla glass and aluminum, they usually still look and work like new


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## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

Mode, iPhone 4 16GB goes for 500 EURO?

I could sell mine and get the iPhone 4S if I did that...

Whats the conversion rate on EUR TO CAD?

500 EUR is like 700 CAD

and the 32GB iPhone 4S is $759.99 CAD.


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## KaeJS (Sep 28, 2010)

The most I can find a 4 going for is $500, BNIB.

Looks like $400 for a used 16gb 4.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

$500 sounds right in Canada

I'm on a Euro forum that has very strict rules to join (makes a safe place to buy/sell etc) They are asking €600 for a unlocked 4 32GB shipped. I'd sell mine or see what you could get for yours, but I'm busy flying over sandy places


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## consto (Nov 8, 2011)

*Is the iPhone 4S worth it?*

My 3 years contract is up this month  and I'm thinking of upgrading to the iPhone 4S, but I'm hearing that there are some issues with the battery. So I have some questions to help me decide:
1- Is it isolated cases or all phones are experiencing this shortage?

2- Apparently SIRI is not fully functional in Canada. None of the carriers is promoting it on the iPhone 4S page. With SIRI not functioning well is the 4S worth it over the 4?

3- Given all this shouldn't I just wait for the the iPhone 5 which I'm guessing will be out next year? 

Thanks for any help in making this decision.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

The battery shortage is software, because it happens to iPhone 4 who updated the OS I think. I never update until the glitches are ironed out

You could get a 4s and wait for them to update the software or save some money and get a 4, or wait for the 5. Depends on if you really care about Siri or if you can wait for 5. When the 5 comes out you'll have to wait for glitches to be fixed etc and I doubt it will be substantially better


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## robertmarks62 (Nov 15, 2011)

Apple is making the most margin of them all ...it means they ripped me off the most. They sell me a cheap product at a high price and when I compare it, it doesn´t justify the premium price.

eg song from legalsounds are as good as from itunes for half the price

i am leaving the apple ...and as Adam..i should never have gone for it in the first place


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