# Coffee Talk



## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

So I am a little bored, as my kidlets are sleeping and I am sitting here in a quiet house drinking my cold brew coffee. I tend to ponder strange things when I have a moment to myself.

Let's talk coffee. I am curious on a money forum how much people spend on coffee in general. We hear so much about the 'latte factor' and how it eats away at your savings. I am curious about peoples coffee habits here. 

For me, I am pretty random. At work, I am part of a coffee club, the organizer has sourced in bulk sustainable, organic coffee. for .$50 a cup. However, sometime people drink it all before I get there, or I make a new pot and they drink it before I remember, so I give up. I will then buy the occasion Tim's, only because it's the closest place to my office coffee under $2. 
At home, I will just make my Keurig coffee because it's simple and quick. 

In the summers, I do really like cold coffee. The Mcd's $1 coffee has been my vice in the past. However, I have recently been introduced to cold brew coffee. At first, I thought it was the same as hot coffee cooled or iced, but it's not. It's so much richer and stronger. I bought myself a cold brewer. It uses almost twice the amount of grounds but I prefer it. It doesn't seem that frugal though, but the fancy coffee shops charge a lot more for a cup of cold brew coffee than regular coffee. 

My friend who is a coffee snob would go to the fancy coffee shops a couple of times a days. She ended getting a $1500 expresso machine to be more frugal. Her very detailed spouse who tracks everything calculated the return on investment. For her alone, they broke even in less than 8 months, including the cost of gourmet beans, organic milk, sugar, and everything else. The machine died after daily use of about 4 years. They are looking an even better machine cause its cheaper. 


As I sip on my cold brewed Kona roasted coffee, I wonder the habits of other coffee drinkers. Tea is fine too, as we drink a lot of tea too.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

Plugging Along said:


> Let's talk coffee. I am curious on a money forum how much people spend on coffee in general. We hear so much about the 'latte factor' and how it eats away at your savings. I am curious about peoples coffee habits here.


I drink about 2-4 mugs a day, just regular Costco colombian coffee so those costs are pretty low and add maybe 1 or 2 Timmy's mediums a week. Overall, not a big expense.

I used buy beans from a local roaster, grind them myself and the cost was much higher, likely 4-6 times higher than now. After a while I really didn't care much about it anymore ... it just went back to being a simple caffeine delivery system. 

I do enjoy a fine cup of coffee every once in a while but it's a treat now, not a daily thing.


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## Dilbert (Nov 20, 2016)

Hi P-A, we brew a cup of McD first thing in the morning. The percolator is on a timer for 7:00 AM. I only feed the machine water from a Brita, it just makes a better cup and I’m too cheap to install a fixed water filtration system.

Then, around 8:30 AM, I breakdown and head to McD for a senior medium for $1.50. 

Can no longer drink Timmies nor do I go anywhere near Starbucks or other, unless there is no option.


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## Userkare (Nov 17, 2014)

We buy un-ground beans, and grind enough for a day or two at a time. Once again, Costco is our source of quite a few varieties and roasts. 

When I was working, I would usually go to Starbucks at coffee break, and get a cappuccino in colder months, or a cold frappuccino in the summer. That cost starts adding up over time, but you have to balance that with how you'll feel after drinking the dreck that comes out of the office coffee maker.

Now, I make my own espresso based drinks. Not using a fancy $1500 machine, but it works fine. For summer, I cool the coffee, add milk, French Vanilla ice cream, maple syrup, and ice, then blend it. It tastes much better than the Starbuck's stuff - and I know exactly what went into it!


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

Userkare said:


> We buy un-ground beans, and grind enough for a day or two at a time. Once again, Costco is our source of quite a few varieties and roasts.
> 
> When I was working, I would usually go to Starbucks at coffee break, and get a cappuccino in colder months, or a cold frappuccino in the summer. That cost starts adding up over time, but you have to balance that with how you'll feel after drinking the dreck that comes out of the office coffee maker.
> 
> Now, I make my own espresso based drinks. Not using a fancy $1500 machine, but it works fine. For summer,* I cool the coffee, add milk, French Vanilla ice cream, maple syrup, and ice, then blend it*. It tastes much better than the Starbuck's stuff - and I know exactly what went into it!


Nice tips. My cold brewing coffee takes enough grounds for 2-3 ice coffee. I will need to start sourcing beans again. Good to know that Costco is a good source.

So your cold concoction, does it taste like a Frappuccino. It sounds quiet delicious! I don't know why I never thought of that. Do you need to add the ice cream or will it be just less creamy with the ice. I don't know why I never thought of blending the coffee like that.


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## jargey3000 (Jan 25, 2011)

....as readers might know from the ever-popular "Free Mcdonalds coffee" thread, when i do, it's usually a senior's small black, cream on the side....with a couple of free re-fills :smiley_simmons:
....speaking of pondering things...
...as I see some things on the world news...arent we lucky that we live in a place where we indulge in such luxuries as a discussion around sustainable, organic coffees, lattes...$150 expresso (sic) machines etc. etc.:satellite:


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## jdc (Feb 1, 2016)

Plugging Along said:


> So your cold concoction, does it taste like a Frappuccino. It sounds quiet delicious! I don't know why I never thought of that. Do you need to add the ice cream or will it be just less creamy with the ice. I don't know why I never thought of blending the coffee like that.


The "secret" to making a frappaccino with the right texture is to add a pinch of xanthan gum to your recipe. It keeps the ice and milk from separating.


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## Userkare (Nov 17, 2014)

Plugging Along said:


> Nice tips. My cold brewing coffee takes enough grounds for 2-3 ice coffee. I will need to start sourcing beans again. Good to know that Costco is a good source.
> 
> So your cold concoction, does it taste like a Frappuccino. It sounds quiet delicious! I don't know why I never thought of that. Do you need to add the ice cream or will it be just less creamy with the ice. I don't know why I never thought of blending the coffee like that.


My "concoction" tastes a lot like the Starbuck's frappuccino, and about the same consistency. The ice cream is to make it thicker, but also the taste of the french vanilla and maple syrup really goes well with the espresso. 

So... If you're interested... I pull 4 double (long) shots ( 8oz ) of espresso. I pour it into the metal pitcher that I would normally use to froth milk. I add ~ 5 or 6 tbsp of maple syrup while the coffee is still hot. That metal pitcher gets put inside a bowl of very cold water ( not so much water that it makes the pitcher tip over though ). The heat from the coffee inside a metal container transfers to the water pretty quickly. 

While that's cooling, I scoop ice cream into the blender to about the 500 ml mark, then add milk to level it off at 500 ml. I add 6 ice cubes and finally the coffee/syrup mix. I blend it until the ice is all chipped up. Makes two large ( grande sized ) drinks.

If it sits too long, it does tend to separate, but nothing that a quick stir with a spoon can't solve.

Enjoy!


Edit: Also works well with ice yogurt - if you don't want the milk fat.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

^ thanks Userkare. I am going to have to get some ice cream and give that a try. I don’t have a metal continainer, but will figure it out.


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## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

I switched to MCD's decaffeinated recently (plus too lazy to brew my own) ... and reduced consumption (less hyper with continuous postings on CMF).


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

I got addicted to those $1 McD iced coffees last summer. I felt bad about the plastic waste so I learned how to make my own. I take 5 scoops of ground coffee, my personal recipe is 3 scoops of decaf and 2 scoops of regular vanilla flavoured. I put them in a 1L pickle jar, and then fill with filtered water and shake. Leave on the kitchen counter anywhere from 8-24 hours (basically, however long between when I decided to make it and when I decide to drink it, as long as it's the next day). I pour it through a regular coffee filter to get rid of the grounds, put it over ice, and Bob's your uncle. I like mine with cream but it is not bad black either. 

In winter I don't usually drink coffee at home, I go for tea instead. I will grab a coffee from McD's or Timmy's if I'm out and about and I want one.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

Spudd said:


> I got addicted to those $1 McD iced coffees last summer. I felt bad about the plastic waste so I learned how to make my own. I take 5 scoops of ground coffee, my personal recipe is 3 scoops of decaf and 2 scoops of regular vanilla flavoured. I put them in a 1L pickle jar, and then fill with filtered water and shake. Leave on the kitchen counter anywhere from 8-24 hours (basically, however long between when I decided to make it and when I decide to drink it, as long as it's the next day). I pour it through a regular coffee filter to get rid of the grounds, put it over ice, and Bob's your uncle. I like mine with cream but it is not bad black either.
> 
> In winter I don't usually drink coffee at home, I go for tea instead. I will grab a coffee from McD's or Timmy's if I'm out and about and I want one.


I have been drinking way too many of those iced coffees. I ask for no straw, and recycle the bottom, but still feel bad. 

I have been making cold brew coffee which is essentially what you are doing. It's actually different than iced coffee. You can use a tea press or I have a cold brewer. Its much smoother and the flavours are richer. You can also take a sieve and drain it too.


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## Prairie Guy (Oct 30, 2018)

I have a decent grinder and grind beans daily. I only get takeout coffee once or twice a year usually when I'm not home to make my own.

I used to work with a guy who bought 3 takeout coffees per day...$6 x 5 days x 48 weeks is almost $1500 a year. I bought the grinder for $100 and spent less than $100 a year on beans.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

To me good coffee tastes good by itself and is also healthier than adding sugar/flavour/ice cream to the point you can barely recognize it as coffee anymore. At that point it doesn't matter what beans or how $$$$ the machine or beans are because any nuances in a good coffee would be masked by all that sugar. Starbucks coffee tastes absolutely atrocious alone because most order it with so much sugar they don't notice anyways.

A $20 Bialetti is the best bang for the coffee buck I have found. Most americans try it a few times and ditch it but it just takes a proper grind (slightly coarser than espresso) and some very simple techniques you can learn on youtube. There's nothing wrong with adding hot water (my preferred with Bialetti) If you're adding anything else the Bialetti is also great because it's so easy/simple and you aren't going to miss any nuances of a $$$$ machine anyways

If you're going to spend money on a high end machine or beans most people don't realize you'd be far better to spend that money on a grinder first. A high end manual grinder will compare to $$$$ grinders at a fraction of the price. If you can't stand to manual grind beans most people will recommend at least a conical burr grinder such as Sette 270 before you spend $$$ on any machine etc. Good consistent fresh grinds makes far more impact than a $$$ machine

I usually buy beans from a local roaster because I don't see the point paying more for "famous" roaster if it ages during unknown transport time anyways. With a $200 Kinu m47 traveller manual grinder and a $20 Bialetti I can make better coffee than most cafes at the campsite, hotel, office, home etc. I just need a heat source, water and beans. The only thing that can wear out on a Bialetti is the $1 gasket

I was thinking about buying an espresso machine but the good ones can take 30 mins to warm up anyways. Seems like a step back. The old La Pavoni lever espresso machines look interesting. They've barely changed since the '50s and you can find them for $300 used and can easily be repaired/restored to like new condition. Not for everybody but apparently can make the most nuanced coffee if you put in the effort


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## ian (Jun 18, 2016)

We have been buying beans, grinding them as required, using our Melita filters. No fancy machine. Been doing it for 40 plus years. We like European style coffee. Strong rich. We buy our beans at Costo. Usually Starbucks brand or the Costco branded Startucks French Roast. We also have a stove top manual expresso/cap. maker but we have not bothered with it for some time. 

Ourside we typically want Starbucks. Just a plain old dark roast. Pour Over or Americana.

We avoid Tim Hortons. Why? We find the service in their stores disorganized and poor. We find that their coffee is incredibly inconsistent. So we stopped. If want a coffee on the road and there is no Starbucks we will drive by a Tim Hortons in favour of a McDonalds.


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## AltaRed (Jun 8, 2009)

Pretty boring here. I have my Keurig K cup using Newman's Own special blend bold roast, while spouse insists on her Nespresso machine with a range of capsules. She recycles her capsules via Nespresso.

I have to order Newman's Own online now via Bed Barh & Beyond since I can't find them elsewhere. Like other Newman"s Own products, all profits supposedly go to charity. I have to keep some Tully Italian Roast on hand for SIL when she stays with us. Neither spouse nor I add anything to our coffee. Can't imagine contaminating the drink with creams, etc.


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## gardner (Feb 13, 2014)

We pretty much only have coffee at home. I wait for the PC dark roast beans to go on sale. The 900g pack goes for $13 a few times a year. We grind the beans and run them through a standard drip machine, but with a re-usable metal filter. It all seems fine and is pretty cheap to do.


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## tomsun (Jul 10, 2019)

My office has those coffee ground packet but we order way too many of them. So I just put a packet of coffee ground in a jar, put cold water in it, and keep it in the fridge over night, run it through the filter and that yields two days of iced coffee. So during the work week I pay $0 out of pocket for coffee. 

Weekends I make coffee at home, Costco ground, not sure what the per cup cost is. 

I buy coffee occasionally, usually catching up with a friend.


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## Longtimeago (Aug 8, 2018)

We use a proper Espresso machine. Not only does it let you make any kind of coffee you want, ie. espresso, latte, cappuchino, americano, etc., etc. it does it for less cost. We were using a 'pod' type machine before ie. Keurig, Nespresso, etc. They do not produce as good a cup of anything, you have no real control over anything and you spend more money overall as well.

Here is the model we use: https://www.bestbuy.ca/en-ca/produc...-80Y9RSmRb9PtYzZApRoCNHkQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Not only do you get a better cup of coffee, my wife always adds a little heart on top of my latte. When she doesn't, I know I've done something wrong. Ah, the art of communication!
https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1...jAhUaa80KHbYJCKAQsAR6BAgEEAE&biw=1366&bih=657


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

m3s said:


> If you're going to spend money on a high end machine or beans most people don't realize you'd be far better to spend that money on a grinder first. A high end manual grinder will compare to $$$$ grinders at a fraction of the price. If you can't stand to manual grind beans most people will recommend at least a conical burr grinder such as Sette 270 before you spend $$$ on any machine etc. Good consistent fresh grinds makes far more impact than a $$$ machine


Interesting about the grinder. I have to admit I don’t want to buy any ther appliance thing as I don’t have the space and don’t drink enough coffee at home. I have been using my magic bullet blender to grind the beans. Do you think it really makes that HMU her of a difference with the coffee.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Plugging Along said:


> I have been using my magic bullet blender to grind the beans. Do you think it really makes that HMU her of a difference with the coffee.


I'm saying it makes more sense to spend money on a better grinder before a better coffee maker.

This is because the heat generated by high speed blades burn some of the coffee and don't produce as consistent of grinds. Burr grinder turn slower and give you more control over the size of the grind which makes a real difference in the extraction of coffee. Fresh ground coffee (dialled in) from a good grinder will make far more impact than any $$$$ machine possibly can.

As we've both discovered you can make excellent coffee with very simple methods. Machines are mostly for the convenience and consistency factors than the coffee quality itself. Hand grinders are even better and cheaper for a bit of work (don't want another appliance either) It's really no more work than chopping your own veggies or shredding cheese etc

It's not intuitive that the grinder is more important than a machine and it's the constant advice when people ask about $$$ machines on forums/groups


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

m3s said:


> I'm saying it makes more sense to spend money on a better grinder before a better coffee maker.
> 
> This is because the heat generated by high speed blades burn some of the coffee and don't produce as consistent of grinds. Burr grinder turn slower and give you more control over the size of the grind which makes a real difference in the extraction of coffee. Fresh ground coffee (dialled in) from a good grinder will make far more impact than any $$$$ machine possibly can.
> 
> ...


Really interesting m3s. 

I had read a few times that the burr grinder was better, but saw the prices to be quite a bit more than my standard KRUPS blade grinder and decided it was a minor issue that maybe only coffee connoisseurs cared about. I'd never read the explanation why.

I always buy beans from Kicking Horse (I like the 454 Horsepower Dark Roast the best). I wait until Amazon has it on sale for $9.99 and get a couple pounds. 

I use a single cup drip device with a metal permanent filter. To me it's really good, but maybe I should rethink this burr grinder thing. They all seem to be such big devices compared to the little KRUP blade grinder where I can grind enough for only a couple cups and it cleans really easy too (important to clean it well I find). The burr grinder looks like it would be more effort to clean.

ltr


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

There was talk of a $1500 espresso machine at the start and espresso machines are really picky with the grinds. Grinds can be all the difference with espresso. Basically you are better to spend money on a grinder before spending on a machine, but like most things there are diminishing returns. I use a $20 Bialetti and a $200 Kinu manual grinder and can make better coffee than most cafes, but not as conveniently as expensive machines.

Is there a roasting date on the Kicking Horse beans? I have amazon prime but beans are one thing I haven't bought online because I want beans that were roasted recently. I wonder how long it takes those beans to get from Kicking Horse to amazon and then how long they stock them before shipping? I usually google for local roaster and figure that's as fresh as it gets without roasting my own. I enjoy trying different local roasters


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

m3s said:


> I use a $20 Bialetti and a $200 Kinu manual grinder and can make better coffee than most cafes, but not as conveniently as expensive machines.
> 
> Is there a roasting date on the Kicking Horse beans? I have amazon prime but beans are one thing I haven't bought online because I want beans that were roasted recently. I wonder how long it takes those beans to get from Kicking Horse to amazon and then how long they stock them before shipping? I usually google for local roaster and figure that's as fresh as it gets without roasting my own. I enjoy trying different local roasters



Yeah, I find the vacuum packed Kicking Horse beans I get from Amazon have dates that are usually around 2 months old. I am willing to accept this because of the vacuum packaging. The price of $9.99 for a pound of this quality coffee is pretty good in my world. In the grocery store this coffee is anywhere from $15.99 to $20.99 a pound.

There are so many variables with making coffee. 

Consider the case where I grind enough coffee for two days, and seal the second day in a Tupperware container. This happens a lot.

Day 1 - I boil my water and then I wait until it reaches its optimum 200 degrees, and then dampen my grounds to release the bloom. 
Then I add the full amount of water to the filter. 

The difference in the reaction after this step between day one of those grounds and day two of those grounds is really significant with regard to bloom. 
It shows how finicky coffee actually is.

Your discussion of burr grinders has me wondering if I might gain some taste value if I actually put out the money for one of these devices.

ltr


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

If you notice a difference between day 1 and 2 then you would probably notice the difference of a burr grinder. The grind changes how much water touches how much coffee surface

Temp control is critical. The simple design of the Bialetti forces the water up before it can get too hot. Temp control is a biggest let down of a lot of more complicated machines I've considered (especially warm up times and temp surfing)

It's an endless pursuit. If you enjoy the scientific experiment of playing with the variables check out the EspressoForge or Flair. I haven't used either but I'd like to try a manual machine


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

m3s said:


> There was talk of a $1500 espresso machine at the start and espresso machines are really picky with the grinds. Grinds can be all the difference with espresso. Basically you are better to spend money on a grinder before spending on a machine, but like most things there are diminishing returns. I use a $20 Bialetti and a $200 Kinu manual grinder and can make better coffee than most cafes, but not as conveniently as expensive machines.


OK m3s, as always you've inspired me to take action.

After much research, (although not the most expensive), I find that the best bang for buck burr grinder is the OXO Conical Burr Coffee Grinder.

It seems to come out ahead in many reviews.

Here's a  YouTube review of the device. I like the way it comes apart for cleaning.

So, once Amazon delivers this thing, I'll give it a try and see if it makes a better cup of coffee than my spinning blade type grinder that I bought for $19.99. How could this new and fancy grinder not do a better job? Time will tell.

ltr


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

Good luck with your new grinder. We settled on a little Braun (blade type) and it works fine. I like its small footprint.

IMO the only difference you are likely to notice with a different grinder is size & consistency of grind which will require an adjustment in the amount you use for a brew. The type of beans/coffee you use and brew temp are more likely to determine your enjoyment of your java.

Someone else noted the Starbucks French Roast from Costco. That's what we buy as well, a 2.5lb bag seems to be on sale frequently.

Generally have 2 cups in the morning. Only occasionally in the afternoon, but never after 3 or 4pm.


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## Zipper (Nov 18, 2015)

I have one large superstrong serving of the lightest roast I can find. I use a mesh filter, no paper, 3 teaspoons of organic sugar and stir well. I swish and drink the fine sediment at the bottom and have 2 tbs of MCT oil as a chaser.

That seems to do me all day.

I can't remember the last time I had a Timmies, Starbucks, McD's etc.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

M3. I am startîng to think it will be good idea to get a manual grinder instead of my blad one. Are all of them pretty much the same.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

lol all this talk about grinders reminds me, somewhere in the country house i've seen a long-ago meat grinder that belonged to the ancestors. Last person to use it was a grandmother probably half a century ago.

m3 would know the type. Every farm kitchen had one. Big. Heavy. Not cast iron but just about the weight of. One had to attach it to edge of a kitchen table, it had its own kind of C-clamp base. A hand crank. A hopper. Finely machined spiral turning blades that could easily crush meat bones into powder. Operator could adjust the fineness of the grind.

they really took their tourtieres seriously in those days

hmmmn i believe i will look for this forgotten beast. I have lots of spices that i like to grind/grate fresh (cardamom, nutmeg, cinnamon sticks, flax seeds, chia) & it's always a huge job to grate them on a hand-held metal grater.

now would it do coffee beans. Or would it - oh the horror - heat the beans up too much, thus affecting their delicate tropical roast aroma


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

i once tried grinding flax seeds in a handheld pepper mill but - to my great surprise since flax seeds & pepper corns are about the same size - the drat flax would not grind at all


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

humble_pie said:


> l
> 
> hmmmn i believe i will look for this forgotten beast.


We have one of those forgotten beasts. Belonged to my granny. Probably dates back to about 1940 or so. It has been used in our home to make venison burger. Still does the job. We also have her crank coffee grinder that came from Norway. Load beans into the top and, when done, pull out the wooden drawer below to receive the ground product. Perfect for off-grid. No electricity required.

Seems to me my wife grinds flax seeds with a mortar and pestle. Not great if large quantity needed, but satisfactory otherwise.


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## like_to_retire (Oct 9, 2016)

humble_pie said:


> ....now would it do coffee beans. Or would it - oh the horror - heat the beans up too much, thus affecting their delicate tropical roast aroma


Personally, I wouldn't recommend grinding your coffee beans in a sausage meat grinder, regardless whether you appreciate good coffee.

ltr


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

Mukhang pera said:


> Seems to me my wife grinds flax seeds with a mortar and pestle. Not great if large quantity needed, but satisfactory otherwise.



i was afraid of something like this, from an expert. Fresh flax seeders we izz doomed.

then there was the time i tried to grind up bayberry roots. I would have settled for very coarse particulate, ie pieces 1-2 mm diameter. But bayberry roots are tough.

i ended up taking em outside in heavy duty plastic bag & pounding em upon a stone with a hammer. The roots resisted & eventually the plastic bag began to break & shred. At that point the roots - i'd chopped em into 4-5 inch lengths - had only just begun to separate into individual lengthwise fibers.

had to change bags. Eventually i got a partial root breakdown but nothing like the ground bayberry root i was hoping for.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Plugging Along said:


> M3. I am startîng to think it will be good idea to get a manual grinder instead of my blad one. Are all of them pretty much the same.


I’ve only owned the one Kinu m47 traveller after watching youtube reviews

It’s expensive for a manual grinder but holds its own against even far more expensive electric ones. I don’t doubt there’s a better deal but these things can last forever and get used daily

James Hoffman has some good recent videos on manual grinders



OnlyMyOpinion said:


> IMO the only difference you are likely to notice with a different grinder is size & consistency of grind which will require an adjustment in the amount you use for a brew. The type of beans/coffee you use and brew temp are more likely to determine your enjoyment of your java.


Brew temp makes a huge difference for sure. People often worry about a lot of less important things and overlook the grinder though. Depends if you’re looking for more or not

If you drink coffee with cream and sugar you may not notice the difference. Coarseness of the grind makes a huge difference though and a blade can’t control fine vs coarse

With espresso the grinds make the difference of a shot you pour out or not (grinder has to be dialled in when you change beans because grind changes the pressure profile)


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## OnlyMyOpinion (Sep 1, 2013)

Black coffee, no c&s. 
I can understand needing a more advanced grinder for expresso.

I'm not much of a connoisseur I'm afraid. I still recall the glass coffee carafe on the hot plate at work. Let that cook for an hour or three and you were drinking a pretty foul brew. After many years of that, nearly anything tastes better.

Our c maker brews into a stainless steel thermos-style carafe. We preheat it with a flush of hot water before using and the coffee stays quite well through the morning.


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## Dilbert (Nov 20, 2016)

Might have mentioned it before, but my wife and I notice a large improvement in flavour using Brita treated versus plain tap water in our Cusinart coffee machine. I just keep the water handy nearby.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

humble_pie said:


> i was afraid of something like this, from an expert. Fresh flax seeders we izz doomed.
> 
> then there was the time i tried to grind up bayberry roots. I would have settled for very coarse particulate, ie pieces 1-2 mm diameter. But bayberry roots are tough.
> 
> ...


I have yet to find anything that either my Bamix hand blender or Magic Bullet couldn't grind up. Both of them did flax seed without any problem, I have never done bayberry roots though, so can't say. I also don't know if the fast blades impact the outcome due to the heat and speed like it does coffee.


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

m3s said:


> I’ve only owned the one Kinu m47 traveller after watching youtube reviews
> 
> It’s expensive for a manual grinder but holds its own against even far more expensive electric ones. I don’t doubt there’s a better deal but these things can last forever and get used daily
> 
> ...


Wow, that is an expensive grinder. Since I put way too much milk and sweetener in my coffee, it may not make that much of a difference for me. Super informative information on a better cup of coffee. I may play with the other variables first before buying any thing else. Though I really love my cold brewed coffee and have been enjoying the results. Maybe I play around when the weather gets cooler and I start drinking hot coffee in the fall again.

Thanks for the very useful information. Always a good thread when I learn something.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

Plugging Along said:


> Wow, that is an expensive grinder. Since I put way too much milk and sweetener in my coffee, it may not make that much of a difference for me. Super informative information on a better cup of coffee. I may play with the other variables first before buying any thing else.


From someone who's been there and back by far the biggest difference is the beans IMO. Find a bean (and roast type) you like from a local coffee roaster. Even with milk/cream/sugar/sweetener you can still make a better cup of coffee. Just remember, it's what *you* like to drink, not someone elses idea of how it should be. Some bean/roast combinantions can be soooo smooth while others will slap you in the face, lol.

Years ago, a few friends and I stayed many nights after the local roaster's coffee shop closed and learned all about coffee. From roasting beans, learning first to second crack, to coffee cupping sessions. It was fun learning and seeing the skill it takes to roast properly.


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## 30seconds (Jan 11, 2014)

I used to never drink coffee till I met my gf. Since then I have become more and more of a coffee snob. I ended up buying a Breville smart grinder pro and a Gaggia Classic to make expressos. It is a lot of fun making latte art and I drink 1 americano a day for the most part. I got the gaggia used and the grinder for christmas but it is a $700+ set up if you were to buy everything new. I have tried many different local roaster from around Toronto but Carvalho is my favourite. I highly recommend them for espresso or for drip coffee as well. Very friendly guy who works there and tells you all about the process. 

For drip coffee Kicking Horse Hola is my go to blend!


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## Plugging Along (Jan 3, 2011)

^Cainvest: I do agree about it's a personal preference. We have an all organic sustainable 'high end' coffee club at work, and I find that I just don't love the coffee. Fortunately, I like kicking horse, and I pick up right from their main store a couple times a year, so get a pretty decent bean, but I have found their prices going up, so have been buying it less. Some of the best coffee I have purchased was in Colombia and Hawaii. I am just finishing off my supply, and will be so sad to see it gone. I have been trying to get a source directly from Colombia but no luck yet.


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## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

Two of my favs of years ago were Mexican Altura H.G. and Brazil Santos. It's been a while, might have to take a drive to pick some up.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

30seconds said:


> I ended up buying a Breville smart grinder pro and a Gaggia Classic to make expressos. It is a lot of fun making latte art and I drink 1 americano a day for the most part. I got the gaggia used and the grinder for christmas but it is a $700+ set up if you were to buy everything new. I have tried many different local roaster from around Toronto but Carvalho is my favourite.


I see the Gaggia Classic highly recommended all the time. I used to drink Tims but after discovering espresso and local roasts Tims is a last resort (I also prefer americano daily now, cortado when I feel like a milk drink) I had a entry level Saeco that I modified with some better Gaggia parts but lately rediscovered the Bialetti while working remotely. I’ll be looking for a used espresso machine when I move again. Maybe like a used La Pavoni lever machine to toy with and modify


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