# What dividend-paying investments are you holding?



## joncnca (Jul 12, 2009)

Well it seems that in searching for dividends, I get almost every thread in the forum returned to me. I know I've come upon people posting about their dividends in various posts, but can't find a single thread right now about dividend holdings, and I've come to like the philosophy behind dividend investing.

What dividend investments are good to buy and hold for the long run. I'e read about JNJ? PFE? The banks i guess, though they don't seem to increase their dividends. REI I guess...though, this isn't really paying dividends, is it?


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

joncnca said:


> [ ... ]
> 
> What dividend investments are good to buy and hold for the long run. I'e read about JNJ? PFE? The banks i guess, though they don't seem to increase their dividends. REI I guess...though, this isn't really paying dividends, is it?


The banks don't increase their dividends - say what? Or do you mean they don't increase them as fast as other companies?

Quick look at at a few shows the following:

BNS - 2001 dividends of $0.88 per year, followed by a 2:1 stock split and a 2011 dividends of $2.08.

BMO - 2003 dividends of $1.40 per year and a 2011 dividends of $2.80.

CIBC - 2003 dividends of $1.40 per year and a 2011 dividends of $2.80.

TD - 2003 dividends of $1.12 per year and a 2011 dividends of $2.84.


As other dividend payers I've had include TRP, EMA, ENB, IGM and now
the Pengrowth Energy is a dividend payer, PGF. Though it helps I bought a bunch at $10, just the as the TRP was good at $10, with something like a $0.75 dividends per year - long time ago.


Cheers


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Why not look at the holdings of CDZ, which is the dividend aristocrat index fund?

I think single-minded focus on dividends is probably ill-advised. Total return is what it's all about.


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## Square Root (Jan 30, 2010)

Agree that total return is the key. However, a focus on dividends has certainly helped my total return over the years.


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## joncnca (Jul 12, 2009)

hmm..my mistake, i guess the banks do raise their dividends.

then my question becomes, when you have a bank stock that goes for $60-80 per share, and it pays the standard 3-5% dividend, is there any difference in benefit if one were to buy some other ETF or stock with a lower unit price of about $20, which also pays 3-5% in dividends? Ultimately, if they pay the same dividend, they should be equal in that respect, should they not? ANd with a lower unit price, there's also more chance that it will increase, no?

I have some money in CDZ already. I think i can get away from that 0.6 MER with a little more effort =D

what else is anyone holding? I had some EIF before and was also looking into PFE.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

I said look at the holdings. If you want advice, that's a good place to look. You want to avoid the MER, buy what that fund holds directly. 

Share prices are not really all that important. The percentage changes matter. It isn't easier for a $20 stock to double in value than an $80 stock. Otherwise, smart CEOs would be splitting their shares continually to juice their bonuses.


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## Oldroe (Sep 18, 2009)

Power Corp and financial ,Fortis and not a div. but RioCan plus 5 banks.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Here are the holdings of CDZ, for your perusal:


```
BIRD CONSTRUCTION INC . 	BDT 	5.74 %
ENBRIDGE INCOME FD HLDGS INC . 	ENF 	5.28 %
NORTH WEST CO INC (THE) . 	NWC 	5.00 %
KEYERA CORP . 	KEY 	4.71 %
AGF MANAGEMENT LTD CL B NON-VTG 	AGF/B 	4.39 %
SHAW COMMUNICATIONS INC 	SJR/B 	4.36 %
CANADIAN REIT TRUST UNIT 	REF-U 	4.05 %
TELUS CORP . 	T 	4.03 %
CORUS ENTERTAINMENT INC CL B NON-VTG 	CJR/B 	3.70 %
ROGERS COMMUNICATIONS INC - CL B 	RCI/B 	3.67 %
TRANSCANADA CORP . 	TRP 	3.53 %
FORTIS INC . 	FTS 	3.33 %
TRANSCONTINENTAL INC CL A SUB-VTG 	TCL/A 	3.06 %
ENBRIDGE INC 	ENB 	2.93 %
INTACT FINANCIAL CORP . 	IFC 	2.87 %
THOMSON REUTERS CORP 	TRI 	2.72 %
CANADIAN UTILITIES LTD CL A NON-VTG 	CU 	2.69 %
PASON SYSTEMS INC . 	PSI 	2.45 %
SHOPPERS DRUG MART CORP . 	SC 	2.43 %
ENSIGN ENERGY SERVICES INC . 	ESI 	2.16 %
CCL INDUSTRIES INC CL B 	CCL/B CN 	1.98 %
TOROMONT INDUSTRIES LTD . 	TIH 	1.83 %
CANADIAN PACIFIC RAILWAY LTD . 	CP 	1.83 %
FINNING INTERNATIONAL INC . 	FTT 	1.71 %
ATCO LTD CL 1 NON-VTG 	ACO/X 	1.68 %
CANADIAN NATIONAL RAILWAY CO . 	CNR 	1.63 %
COGECO CABLE INC SUB-VTG 	CCA 	1.57 %
METRO INC CL A SUB-VTG 	MRU/A 	1.49 %
TIM HORTONS INC 	THI 	1.47 %
SNC-LAVALIN GROUP INC . 	SNC 	1.43 %
CAMECO CORP . 	CCO 	1.41 %
EMPIRE CO LTD CL A NON-VTG 	EMP/A 	1.37 %
SAPUTO INC . 	SAP 	1.29 %
TALISMAN ENERGY INC . 	TLM 	1.22 %
HOME CAPITAL GROUP INC . 	HCG 	1.21 %
COGECO INC SUB-VTG 	CGO 	1.15 %
SHAWCOR LTD CL A SUB-VTG 	SCL/A 	0.96 %
IMPERIAL OIL LTD . 	IMO 	0.83 %
CANADIAN NATURAL RESOURCES LTD . 	CNQ 	0.81 %
```


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## gimme_divies (Feb 12, 2011)

My Canadian dividend holdings include:

BMO, BNS, FRU, FTS, GWO, HSE, REF.UN, SJR.B, SLF, T, TRP

Hope this helps.


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## Jungle (Feb 17, 2010)

I like to look at the Saturday edition of the Globe and Mail business section, it lists all the large cap high dividend paying stocks and shows the current yield and P/E ratios.


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## Cal (Jun 17, 2009)

It really can depend upon what sector you are looking at to balance out your portfolio.

EMA energy services and electricity
TA power generation
ARX oil, gas and energy
ENB or TRP oil and gas
FTS utility

The banks haven't increased the last few years, however other than that period they have been consistent. MFC and SLf have been beaten lately too, you don't mention your portfolio, so not sure if you need/want any exposure to the insurers.

T.A or RCI.B or BCE communications

REIT's are convenient to hold in a TFSA

US stocks are convenient to hold in an RRSP
WMT, MCD, KO or JNJ, PFE if you are looking for some health care.

Lots of choices in many sectors. You have to do your own dd. It is great to check to see what alot of the ETF's are holding and investigate those closer.


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## daddybigbucks (Jan 30, 2011)

I really like TotalSA (TOT on the nyse) which gives a dividend of $1.60 a couple times a year.

And Royal Dutch Shell (rds.b on the nyse) which gives an 80c dividend quarterly.

I bought these during the BP disaster, but am slowly adding since as they keep going up and increasing dividends.

At 5% yield, and capital growth, they would be hard to beat in my books.


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## ddkay (Nov 20, 2010)

Here's some TSX listed dividend-paying names I've come up with in my own research. I don't hold any yet, but planning to purchase some from this short list when & if the debtpocalypse leaves the US.

MKP - 7.46% yield - Canadian Residential RE construction loans to homebuilders
TGA.UN - 6.70% yield - Canadian Residential RE apartment rentals
BRE - 7.80% yield - Canadian Residential RE broker sales commissions
D.UN - 6.67% yield - Canadian Commercial REIT
AAR.UN - 7.14% yield - Canadian Commercial REIT
PMZ.UN - 5.73% yield - Canadian Retail REIT
KEY - 4.35% yield - NatGas Processing
BRC.UN - 5.58% yield - Utilities/Renewable Energy
NPI - 6.52% yield - Utilities/Renewable Energy
IBG - 8.17% yield - Global Engineering/Construction
CN - 1.80% yield - North American Rail Transportation, derivative on resources
CHL.A - 4.22% yield - Canadian Charter Helicopter Transportation, derivative on resources
GLN - 1.62% yield - Retail Telecom/Wireless sales


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## cannon_fodder (Apr 3, 2009)

Any US dividend payers should be held in your RRSP for optimal retention of the dividends. And, if you plan on traveling or even vacationing in the US or a US dollar denominated country, it is not a bad idea to have a good portion of US dividend payers.

One of the interesting stocks I own is Methanex. They are listed on the TSX yet pay dividends in USD.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

joncnca said:


> hmm..my mistake, i guess the banks do raise their dividends.
> 
> then my question becomes, when you have a bank stock that goes for $60-80 per share, and it pays the standard 3-5% dividend, is there any difference in benefit if one were to buy some other ETF or stock with a lower unit price of about $20, which also pays 3-5% in dividends? Ultimately, if they pay the same dividend, they should be equal in that respect, should they not? ANd with a lower unit price, there's also more chance that it will increase, no?
> 
> ...


The advantage the ETF would give is to spread the money across several companies with one purchase. The disadvantage is that if the dividends are equal, the MER has reduced what you are being paid so that it is equal. A stock doesn't have a MER so nothing reduces the dividends.


As for unit price, if one has limited cash or is trading on an exchange that charges extra for odd lots (i.e. not a multiple of 100) - a smaller share price means less money is required to have a reasonable number of shares. However, in most cases a combination of the future of the business and the confidend (or demand) for the stock will drive the share price - not that the $20 versus $80 share price. 

So no - even though the dividends are similar, this does not mean that the stocks and more importantly, how they will grow or decline are the same.


Cheers


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## Oldroe (Sep 18, 2009)

I think etf's are good but the research is huge.

To do it right every stock needs in depth annalist so looks like 30 stocks then you need to check prospectus for derivatives bonds hidden performance bounces then you need to know they are the top 20% that means looking at 3-4-5 other etf's. 

Etf's are just mutual funds they aren't a day off.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

cannon fodder says:
_
" One of the interesting stocks I own is Methanex. They are listed on the TSX yet pay dividends in USD."_

canadian companies that pay their dividends in USD are an interesting group, because many investors are invisibly & secretly losing hidden foreign exchange fees upon their dividends even though they are not aware of this.

a significant majority of resource companies pay divs in USD. All the big miners pay divs in USD. We don't have very many big miners left, now that noranda, falconbridge, alcan & inco are foreign-owned, but when they were canadian companies, they all paid divs in USD. Barrick pays divs in USD.

also potash & methanex, as fodder writes. I believe agrium also.

among big energy, some pay USD divs & some pay canadian.

and then there are the mavericks that pay USD divs like thomson reuters.

so why does it matter ? and how could it possibly cost investors anything ?

the problem is that the transfer agents issue the USD dividends in bulk payments to the brokerage houses, who then distribute the appropriate amount of dividend monies into the accounts of the individual beneficial owners of the stock. These are usually canadian-dollar accounts.

as they do so, the brokers - god bless em - charge their usual horrific FX fees to convert USD into CAD. Clients never see or know anything about this. The FX charged is unrecoverable. It's never reported on statements. Almost no licensed representatives at discount brokers know anything about this practice. Yet it goes on, every single business day, at every brokerage house across the nation.

the solution is to keep all canadian companies with US-pay dividends in a USD account. They can go right in there along with your US telcos, banks & oh-so-beloved apples. The broker will be able to keep the canadians flawlessly separated from their yankee cousins. There will never be any problems with T-5 tax slips. These will show correct amount of eligible canadian dividends & their canadian dividend tax credits. These T-5s will be expressed in US dollars, so for tax return purposes the client will have to convert the amounts. This is not a big deal.

how to tell if a company dividend is initially paid in CAD or USD ?

i'll write about this later, if anybody is interested. Not much use asking the IRs at the companies, though. Often they don't know themselves. They'll obligingly tell the investor that he can have his dividend in whichever currency he prefers. What they don't tell - because they don't know - is that the brokers will charge to convert the currency.


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## Assetologist (Apr 19, 2009)

Very interesting Humble!
I would like to learn more about this when you have the time.
I have been holding Canadian Dividend payees including those paying USD in a CDN account and US ones in a USD account (taxable).

Cheers


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

humble_pie said:


> as they do so, the brokers - god bless em - charge their usual horrific FX fees to convert USD into CAD. Clients never see or know anything about this. The FX charged is unrecoverable. It's never reported on statements. Almost no licensed representatives at discount brokers know anything about this practice. Yet it goes on, every single business day, at every brokerage house across the nation.


I don't see why Cdn brkoerages won't let Cdns hold USD, and why Canadians can't all stand up and demand this. Questrade lets me hold USD and CAD simultaneously - wow 2 currencies in one acct? I'm not sure if Questrade pays USD dividends, but I can't see why not.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

hello assetolo yours is a typical configuration. I used to do exactly that myself until something clued me in a few years ago to the fact that a considerable number of true north maple leaf canadian companies are actually paying their dividends in USD.

(mode R U perhaps talking about rrsps) (but this sub-topic is about non-registered accounts only)

clients can & usually do hold both CAD & USD non-registered accounts. They are free to store their canadian interlisted stock in either account. What i am focusing on are canadian stocks that pay dividends, first & primarily, in US dollars. There are at least 40 of these & they tend to be well-known blue chip large caps.

please notice that companies do not simultaneously pay dividends in 2 currencies. They pay, in the first instance, in one currency only. Any investor who receives that dividend in the opposite currency is going to forfeit a currency exchange fee.

take for example a canadian company with USD dividends like barrick. Most canadian investors would innocently keep barrick and all their other canadian stocks with US dividends that they own in their canadian dollar account, right. But that's what is going to cause the problem. When the broker allocates barrick dividends into the canadian accounts of all its clients that hold barrick, the broker will charge an FX fee.

on the other hand, if client has placed his barrick holding in his US dollar account, the broker will just docilely distribute the US dollars of the full dividend payment into such account.

moving on. I observe in this forum that some people are aware of this but they fear that by holding canadian stocks in US account the dividends will somehow be subject to US non-resident tax. Answer: no, not at all. Broker's mainframe system will easily distinguish between, say, abx & an american company like mrk. It will know that abx is a canadian company whose US divs are to be paid into investor's USD account in full. It will know that mrk is a US company whose divs are subject to NRT.

i also observe that some people fear they will lose their canadian dividend tax credits if they store canadian stocks in USD accounts. Answer: no, not at all. In february the broker will send investor a T-5 setting forth dividends, grossups & dividend tax credits for his canadian stocks held in USD account. This T-5 will be in US dollars. For his tax return, investor will have to convert the figures.

if investor has other canadian stocks with canadian dollar dividends that he keeps in his canadian dollar account, broker will also send him a separate T-5 for those, with their grossups, tax credits, etc. This one will be in canadian dollars, of course.

how to tell if a company dividend is initially paid in CAD or USD

search the company's website. For example, thomson reuters says very clearly on its website that its dividend is paid in US dollars.

failing that, a good method is to compare the dividend amounts for a canadian interlisted, in both currencies, out to 4 decimal places. The amount in nice round numbers, like 1.275, will be the original & primary currency. The amount in ragged numbers, like 1.1928, will be the post-conversion amount of the same dividend.

the most outrageous recent story of a dividend heist by all of Canada Broker Inc was last december's payout of a $1 USD special dividend by uranium one. The total amount being distributed through this special dividend was something north of USD 50 million, as i recall.

uranium one had no dividend history, didn't really trade in the US, was essentially a canadian company in all respects. I had left my 1000 shares in my canadian account because i didn't twig on what would happen with the dividend. Came payout day & the blasted broker had subtracted something like 130.00 from what should have been, i thought, my nice round amount of one thousand US greenbacks even.

i complained. They meekly paid me back. Every penny. Others were not so lucky. It was an outrageous heist. Collectively, with a USD 50 million dividend to distribute, Canada Broker Inc stung canadian investors in uranium one to the tune of something like $750,000 in FX fees.


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## Assetologist (Apr 19, 2009)

Thanks for taking the time to clarify this situation!

I was not aware of this FX loss on my Canadian dividends which are paid in USD. I do have both US and CDN accounts and wonder if I can simply move these stocks into the US portion or whether I will have to sell, move funds (incurring a FX hit although now is a good time) and repurchase which would also necessitate brokerage fees. 

I also held UUU at the time of the special dividend but was happy to receive more than I paid for the shares so didn't look too closely at the actual deposit.

Thanks once again for the valuable insights.


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## joncnca (Jul 12, 2009)

for a canadian stock that distributes dividends in USD: if this is kept in a USD account, then the initial purchase of the stock would incur a FX fee (buying a canadian stock using USD in the USD account), correct?

I'll look into some of those dividend paying stocks that everyone's suggested, and yes, that's a good idea to look into the holdings of some dividend ETF like CDZ....i actually already do that, guess i didn't realize, but thanks for articulating it more clearly for me! =)

my portfolio is mainly a balance of e-series index funds with TD. There're some others in other RRSP and TFSA accounts, and i've been trying to figure out the proportion of various sectors/industries/countries/etc as a proportion of the total....and i'm trying to balance everything out.

there're so many options out there, i'm also trying hard not to make it too complicated as that would be contrary the spirit of the simple set/forget/rebalance portfolio i'm trying to build.


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## Charlie (May 20, 2011)

often those stocks trade on both US and CDN exchanges. So, if you have a US account, you could buy in US $. Or you could buy in CDN $ and transfer the shares to your US account if this wasn't available. 

humble's point is a good one. Minimize your foreign exchange conversions. More and more the banks, brokerages and other money handlers are sneaking in an extra spread. 

Some holds for credit cards and bank accounts. If you do a lot of US denominated stuff, it may be worth your while to do those transactions in $US. My folks use their US dividends (paid by CDN banks) to pay their US travel costs -- racked up on US denominated credit cards. Saves a lot.


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

Questrade has accounts that have both USD and CAD cash balances, so you ought to be able to buy the stock with CAD and receive USD dividends without any FX cost.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

just to keep things clear, in this thread i'm posting about dividends in non-registered accounts only.

jon - all brokers offer both canadian & US accounts. These are usually satellite accounts with the same account number. Investor can instruct the broker to journal interlisted stocks to the opposite currency & hold them there. Using barrick again as an example, an investor can buy abx in CAD on toronto & ask broker to journal the shares over to the US account. Investor will then receive his abx dividends in USD without any FX fee.

btw when selling the same barrick, investor should decide ahead of time whether he wishes to take the proceeds in USD or CAD. If he wants CAD, with some online brokers he may have to get the stock journalled back to his CAD account. With other brokers, all he will have to do is specify the currency when placing his online sell order.

if on the other hand he wishes to take proceeds of his barrick sale in USD, his account is already good to go. He may not realize it, but he will be completing a gambit trade !! in slow motion, of course, but definitely a gambit (ie he will obtain US dollars from his sale without any foreign exchange fee whatsoever.)

different brokers have different methods of jounalling & holding stock to & within the 2 different currency sub-accounts. Variations depend both upon the mainframe system that the broker has leased and also upon the trading platform that the broker has built on the mainframe. There are only 2 mainframe systems in wide use among brokerage houses. They are ISM, older but imho more reliable, and ADP, newer but imho subject to glitches.

it pays for a client to get to know how his online broker operates.

an additional hint. Don't assume, just because an account presents both canadian & US holdings together in certain formats, that this automatically means that dividends for canadian-stocks-paying-US-dividends will, in fact, be paid in USD. BMO is an online broker with mixed formats like these, but it definitely charges FX on US dividends from canadian companies unless the client has contacted bmo & specifically instructed that such companies be held on the US side of the account.

bmo is built upon ADP. If Penson is using ADP, then its client questrade is likely following the bmo model.


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

humble_pie said:


> an additional hint. Don't assume, just because an account presents both canadian & US holdings together in certain formats, that this automatically means that dividends for canadian-stocks-paying-US-dividends will, in fact, be paid in USD. BMO is an online broker with mixed formats like these, but it definitely charges FX on US dividends from canadian companies unless the client has contacted bmo & specifically instructed that such companies be held on the US side of the account.
> 
> bmo is built upon ADP. If Penson is using ADP, then its client questrade is likely following the bmo model.


I think BMO is following Questrade but this is the one thing Questrade does very well (they have patents apparently) I set the acct to "*settle in currency of trade*" and voilà that's it that's all.. no more auto currency fees and USD dividends are added to the USD balance within the same acct always just as one would expect. If it wasn't for this I would be fine paying $10 for trades, but paying double and getting screwed on currency is just too much for me to take

I think IB is also ahead in this regard though I only hold CAD in non-reg. IB has great exchange rates and allows you to hold multiple currencies in a single account. "For each account a single base currency designation must be made that determines an account's statement and margin requirement translation currency. However, deposits and withdrawals may be made in any non-base currency in AUD, CAD, CHF, EUR, GBP, HKD, JPY, MXN, SEK or USD."  I'm not 100% sure how the dividends work as I only get CAD dividends in IB, but I assume it's the same as Questrade and unlike the big-bank-schemes.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

_" I think BMO is following Questrade but this is the one thing Questrade does very well (they have patents apparently) I set the acct to "settle in currency of trade" and voilà that's it that's all.. no more auto currency fees and USD dividends are added to the USD balance within the same acct always just as one would expect."_

this thread is about dividends & the direction it has veered off in, therefore the sub-topic being discussed, is USD dividends paid by canadian companies.

mode you are discussing 1) actual trading at questrade, ie buys & sells, which i am *not* discussing; and 2) what appear to be US dividends paid by US companies, which i am *not* discussing.

this is so unlike you. Mode you are perfectly capable of focusing on a minute, finely-tuned subject. Won't you please imagine it's some tiny, near-invisible but important part of your bike engine, the kind you have to carry around with tiny pliers & keep on a contrasting velvet background so as not to lose it.

if you would be willing, it would be a favour to all in cmf forum to clear up this issue about questrade pays of US dividends from canadian corporations. Would you be willing to go to your questrade account & identify one canadian stock in it that definitely pays its dividends in USD as primary currency. This step will take some research. The broker won't be able to tell you & there's no master list. Likely candidates are the big cap canadian resource stocks. It may even turn out out that you don't presently own any of these companies.

stock has to be in non-registered account.

next, if you own one, could you please determine exactly what USD amount, expressed in pennies or dollars per share, that stock actually did pay out to you on its last dividend pay date.

next, determine from the company's website exactly what the per share dividend in USD actually was.

how do the figures compare ? if questrade is paying US dividends from canadian companies in the full & original amounts of the US dividend, then these amounts per share will be identical.

and no, bmo is not following questrade. BMO's online brokerage predates questrade by several decades.


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## cannon_fodder (Apr 3, 2009)

Charlie said:


> My folks use their US dividends (paid by CDN banks) to pay their US travel costs -- racked up on US denominated credit cards. Saves a lot.


this is what we do. The annual dividends fund any cash related needs whenever I travel to the US on business or any country where my wife and I travel to a USD based country. 

I use IB. I bought MX on the TSX with Canadian dollars and my dividends are denominated in US from MX and CDN from all other TSX listed stocks I own.


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

_" My folks use their US dividends (paid by CDN banks) to pay their US travel costs -- racked up on US denominated credit cards."_

charlie i hate to break this to you but your folks are paying a helluva FX conversion fee on those canadian bank dividends.

canadian banks all pay dividends in CAD as the primary issue. Thereafter, investors may choose to receive those dividends in their US accounts, but they will pay the broker's FX fee.

investors may even choose to keep those canadian bank shares in their US accounts, since the big 6 chartered bank stocks are interlisted. This will make no difference. Such investors, also, will pay the broker's FX fee on the bank dividends.

the crucial detail is What is the Primary Currency of each Dividend. Investors taking delivery of such dividend in any currency except this primary currency are paying the broker's FX fees.

it doesn't matter where investor bought it, or whether he paid in CAD or USD if it is an interlisted stock.

what i am trying to show with these posts - and it's a bloody difficult task - is how so many, many, many investors are being nipped & tucked by their brokers for FX fees when they don't even know it.

what makes the effort even bloodier is that the brokers leave zero trace to explain what they doing & they deliberately do not train their call centre representatives to answer questions in this area properly. It is common to find broker reps, especially the junior reps, denying that such shenanigans as FX fees on dividends are going on.

even someone like you, charlie - & you are a super cool guy imho - isn't quite getting it, if you sincerely believe that canadian bank dividends somehow arrive as USD payouts with no FX fee ever being subtracted along the way.

and if charlie isn't getting it, then i guess i'll just have to accept that nobody gets it ... except me & fodder & CC ... although i distinctly remember that scomac always got it ...


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## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

I don't know if I "get it" or not, but I believe you can get US$ dividends from your Canuck banks without any FX as long as you have a US$ account (Questrade, RBC, QTrade).

However, you have to buy the stock on the US exchange, which of course means potentially converting your CAD$ to US$ (unless you already have US$).

For example if you bought BMO on the NYSE and elected to keep your dividend payments in the same currency (which you can do at Questrade), you should see the dividends pile up in US$ in your account without having been switched to CDN$ first.

Now, Humble is suggesting that Canadian banks pay all dividends in CDN$ as the initial currency which makes sense. Since the divs start out as Canadian, at some point they have to be converted to US$ in order to be paid out in a US$ account. I don't think this conversion happens at your normal broker-rip-off rate which Humble is saying (I think). I would guess that maybe BMO or one of their exchange companies would do the exchange at a rate which is probably somewhat reasonable.

Unfortunately, I don't know what I'm talking about on this specific issue, other than that I don't think Humble has it quite correct.

*awaiting the wrath of Humble*


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## andrewf (Mar 1, 2010)

How can one online brokerage predate another by decades, when the commercial internet is barely two decades old?


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## m3s (Apr 3, 2010)

Four Pillars said:


> *awaiting the wrath of Humble*


ho ho 

humble has a good point to watch for this convenient oversight. I have no Cdn-USD dividends to verify how they are paid out. My USD dividends are paid in USD and I use it to buy more USD shares. What I hate is forced conversion, as I prefer to convert once when I agree with the exchange rate and only when I need to


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## Charlie (May 20, 2011)

humble_pie said:


> _"
> charlie i hate to break this to you but your folks are paying a helluva FX conversion fee on those canadian bank dividends.
> 
> ..._


_

BMO, and possibly others, issue some classes of pref shares in $US and those shares pay divs in $US. (BMO.PR.V for example). But you're right...it can get very muddy out there._


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

charlie what a good point. I wasn't thinking about preferred shares at all, only about the common.

the fact is i know nothing about preferreds. I only have a TD pfd because my dog parsley learned about it in the dog run from an investment banker's dog who said basil 3 or somebody with a herbal name like that would cause early redemption of certain preferreds.

but who could know for sure. I mean it sounded as if it had bolted & gone to seed, even for a dog run.


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## tombiosis (Dec 18, 2010)

humble_pie said:


> charlie what a good point. I wasn't thinking about preferred shares at all, only about the common.
> 
> the fact is i know nothing about preferreds. I only have a TD pfd because my dog parsley learned about it in the dog run from an investment banker's dog who said basil 3 or somebody with a herbal name like that would cause early redemption of certain preferreds.
> 
> but who could know for sure. I mean it sounded as if it had bolted & gone to seed, even for a dog run.


hunh?


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

talisman is the latest canadian large-cap resource stock to switch to all-USD financial reporting including paying its dividends in USD.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/05/04/idUS213281+04-May-2011+MW20110504

to avoid FX fees on tlm dividends, keep the stock in US account. Holders of tlm in canadian accounts may have gotten dinged by the broker on the june 30 dividend. It was 13.5 US pennies.


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