# Is early retirement bad for your health?



## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

Article on the CBC webpage quotes an article suggesting retirement is bad for your health.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/story/2013/05/16/business-retirement-health.html


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Garbage


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

I stopped working just over 24 years ago at age 46........work out pretty much daily, (OK..daily).....no medication other than a mild diuretic to combat a genetic tendency to (relatively) high blood pressure.........eat right....no depression.......happy.....(heading for 2 weeks in Prague/Czech Republic on Thursday).......and, as of last Friday, our assets (including our little condo townhouse), hit $1.6 million.........OK for someone who barely worked in the first place, (and then only so that I could quit).

'Retirement'? LOVE it!


----------



## Jon_Snow (May 20, 2009)

Amen to that, Nemo. I will be following your fine ER example shortly. 

If anyone finds themselves in a position to stop mandatory work at a young age and decides to sit on the couch and watch tv and eat Cheetos, then they deserve whatever dire fate descends upon them.


----------



## GoldStone (Mar 6, 2011)

Give me an academic study that claims X. I will find you a study that claims the opposite.

Among those who are healthy, work status has little relationship to emotional wellbeing



> PRINCETON, NJ -- Working Americans aged 60-69 have slightly better emotional health than those who do not work, according to the Gallup-Healthways Well-Being Index. This relationship is primarily evident among the relatively small numbers of Americans aged 60-69 who have fair or poor health. *Among the 75% of the 60- to 69-year-old population who have excellent, very good, or good health, however, there is virtually no difference in emotional health by work status.*


My dad worked until 78 because he LOVED LOVED LOVED his job. Heart issues forced him to retire, otherwise he would have worked past 80. I on the other hand can't wait to quit the rats race and hope to do so before 55.

It all depends on the person. (where is a study on that?)


----------



## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

Hawkdog, please note that the original article does not refer to *early* retirement, but retirement, period.
Basically, this is rhetoric for - _work till you drop_.

I call complete bull*th to this.

As a side note, there is a lot of rhetoric floating around these days about retirement, the cost of retirement, and govt. support for retirement in general.
For instance, this article/study/book claims that government austerity programs is bad for the health of its citizens.

http://www.euronews.com/2013/04/29/web-austerity-is-hurting-our-health-say-researchers-/

The author uses Greece and post-communist Russia to make his case :rolleyes2:

The article you posted, as well as the above one, is cheap rhetoric spewed by groups with vested interests or dogmatic affiliations.
There is nothing wrong with self-funded retirement (or even early retirement).
What is wrong is government funded "early" retirement programs to create fake employment, and a two tier society of privileged early retirees and work-till-you-drop wage slaves.

It is entirely possible to be a valuable and contributing member of society without being subject to the pigeon-hole definition of a full time wage-slave worker.


----------



## Daniel A. (Mar 20, 2011)

If people have other interests to keep busy and work gets in the way of living the chance comes along to bail do it.


----------



## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

If you love your job, fine, keep working if that is your choice.

If you don't (love your job), work until you don't have to or work until you have saved the means to do something else that you do love. 

Good on Nemo2 and Jon Snow who have and are ready to call it quits respectively. It's folks like you who give me more motivation to keep the hammer down on killing the mortgage and investing as much as I can, as often as I can.


----------



## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Why not do both? Love your job AND kill your mortgage / invest as much as possible, all at the same time! :chuncky:


----------



## Ponderling (Mar 1, 2013)

I did not read the original article, but I can see two sides to this argument-

If early retirement, becuase you were downsized and terminated and mid 50's or so and no one will hire you either at all, or at the same responibility level you were at when you were terminated, I can see that leading to excess stress. Unplanned interruption in cash flow, perhaps all sorts of outstanding financial obligations not adressesed. 

If early retirement is because you have been planning for it for years, have your fiscal house in good shape, and decide on your terms to pull the plug on your full time gig, I think the health outcomes would be much different than that of the other case positied earlier.


----------



## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Ponderling said:


> I did not read the original article, but I can see two sides to this argument-
> 
> If early retirement, becuase you were downsized and terminated and mid 50's or so and no one will hire you either at all, or at the same responibility level you were at when you were terminated, I can see that leading to excess stress. Unplanned interruption in cash flow, perhaps all sorts of outstanding financial obligations not adressesed.
> 
> If early retirement is because you have been planning for it for years, have your fiscal house in good shape, and decide on your terms to pull the plug on your full time gig, I think the health outcomes would be much different than that of the other case positied earlier.


This contrast is a perfect encapsulation of what Michael Marmot, an epidemiologist, calls The Status Syndrome -- once you get over the poverty level, people with higher social standing live longer and are healthier than people with lower social standing. 

Good short book review: http://www.thegaragegymonline.com/2011/06/27/book-review-the-status-syndrome-by-michael-marmot/


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

Nemo2 said:


> 1. eat right
> 2. no depression.......happy
> 3. our assets (including our little condo townhouse), hit $1.6 million.
> 4. (heading for 2 weeks in Prague/Czech Republic on Thursday)


*1.* You have given us visual proof of that! 
*2.* Must be [big part at least] because of the woman in your life! :semi-twins:
*3.* Impressive considering you retired so young.
*4.* Šťastnou cestu! :cool2:

The answer to the thread is 'yes' for 'some'. 

*'Retirement is another time when depression hits people, especially men. All of people's working careers they save so that they can retire while still healthy with the ability to enjoy that time, however, work is what keeps people engaged in the world, feeling productive and gives identity and purpose to people. Without work, people are frequently lost and lose social networks as well as their daily routine.'
*
http://www.pbs.org/thisemotionallife/blogs/depression-during-life-transitions


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Toronto.gal said:


> *2.* Must be [big part at least] because of the woman in your life! :semi-twins:
> *3.* Impressive considering you retired so young.
> *4.* Šťastnou cestu! :cool2:


2: Been divorced once, widowed once, again happily married now......been lucky.....even the divorce, (we should never have married) was to a woman with character/standards.
3: As noted in the spiel on Robb's blog, (initial post plus two subsequent responses to commenters), it started with serendipity:
http://www.boomerandecho.com/the-effect-of-serendipity-on-retirement/
4: Děkuji Moc.


----------



## brad (May 22, 2009)

MoneyGal said:


> This contrast is a perfect encapsulation of what Michael Marmot, an epidemiologist, calls The Status Syndrome -- once you get over the poverty level, people with higher social standing live longer and are healthier than people with lower social standing.


I assume this is an "all other things being equal" comparison, such as habits like smoking or substance abuse? My parents enjoyed high social standing (my father earned the equivalent about about $250K/year in today's dollars; neighbours of ours included the comedian Jackie Gleason and the composer Aaron Copland) but they were both smokers and heavy drinkers; my mother died in her 40s and my father died at 71. He remarried after my mother died, and that stepmother was a heavy smoker too; she died in her late 40s. He remarried again to a heavy smoker who died last year at 73. So I wouldn't say social standing alone is enough to make you likely to live longer, unless the study considered people with similar habits but lower social standing, and observed shorter lifespans for those people.


----------



## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

brad said:


> I assume this is an "all other things being equal" comparison, such as habits like smoking or substance abuse? My parents enjoyed high social standing (my father earned the equivalent about about $250K/year in today's dollars; neighbours of ours included the comedian Jackie Gleason and the composer Aaron Copland) but they were both smokers and heavy drinkers; my mother died in her 40s and my father died at 71. He remarried after my mother died, and that stepmother was a heavy smoker too; she died in her late 40s. He remarried again to a heavy smoker who died last year at 73. So I wouldn't say social standing alone is enough to make you likely to live longer, unless the study considered people with similar habits but lower social standing, and observed shorter lifespans for those people.


It did. That book is worth reading; it's based on the Whitehall studies  (specifically Whitehall II) and meticulously controls for influences. Marmot actually received a knighthood in response to his work (he's English).


----------



## brad (May 22, 2009)

MoneyGal said:


> It did. That book is worth reading; it's based on the Whitehall studies  (specifically Whitehall II) and meticulously controls for influences. Marmot actually received a knighthood in response to his work (he's English).


Cool, I'll put it on my list! It does sound interesting. I was reading some statistics on class mobility recently that suggest "social standing" is more generally inherited than acquired: according to a study by the Pew Charitable Trusts, someone born into a US family in the lowest quintile of assets has a less than 20% chance of making it into the top 40% as an adult. That of course doesn't mean going from rags to riches is impossible, just not very likely for most people.


----------



## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

I was just throwing this out for discussion.

Harold - sorry didn't mean to throw "early" in. my mistake.


I will have to look up the book suggested by Money Girl, it makes sense.


----------



## mrPPincer (Nov 21, 2011)

One small beef, sorry, but I can't help but find the use of the terms "class" and "social status" on this side of the pond mildly annoying; I still like to operate under the arguably false premise that we're all equal here.

The research does look interesting but I was just wondering if the title would have included the word status if it had been written by a north american instead of a brit, then MoneyGal mentions he recieved a knighthood for it and had to laugh.

From the back cover, "It is the psychological experience of inequality-how much control you have over your life and the opportunities you have for full social participation-that has a profound effect on your health".

I haven't read the book yet but it seems to me that the research points to autonomy and social interaction being the causal factors linked to longevity, and the fact that those factors are also linked to social status is a coincidence that only someone steeped in the British tiered society would then see it (social status) as being the causal factor.

I will add it to my very long summer reading list and hope to get to it, thanks for the recommendation MoneyGal.


----------



## the-royal-mail (Dec 11, 2009)

I agree with Harold. The 'net is filled with all sorts of propaganda being published by those with vested interests. The govt has a lot of spin doctors on its staff and this is what they do. They create these fake "news" articles to give the perception of public opinions being shifted to their side using the concept of saying something enough times until people start to believe it's true.

People, groups, govt, business etc only fight when there's something to gain. Follow the money.


----------



## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

so you think its all just a conspiracy?


----------



## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

I am all for retirement, sooner the better.
My wife on the other hand is in no hurry.

Definitely a slant to the article, as pointed out by Harold.


----------



## mrPPincer (Nov 21, 2011)

Hawkdog said:


> Definitely a slant to the article, as pointed out by Harold.


I don't know how scientific the study was, but I'm hoping the article is nothing but public policy spin as others have seen it for.. 
and also I hope Marmot was wrong about social status because if not I'm SOL on both counts 

At age 50 I've been semi-retired for over 10 years, did it on my own without any assistance or inheritances, and a fair few setbacks, all at poverty level income and manual labour jobs, so if those two brits are right I should drop dead tomorrow :rolleyes2:

I plan/hope to live a lot longer than those studies would indicate though.
I work for money 60 days of the year now and enjoy the physical activity and social interaction.
Gross income is less than 5% of net worth, yet I'm still saving approximately one third of it every year, home is worth 15%.

I hike every week with a group of mostly senior retirees; you don't have to be working a job to get physical and social activity.
Also cut my own firewood, butcher my own meat etc, even cut my own hair; I feel I'm in total complete control of own autonomy, and to a lesser degree social interaction, yet according to Marmot (author of The Status Syndrome), by pay grade and job description I'm on the lower end of the status ladder, and will have lower longevity.
(hope not, grandparents saw their 90's, parents are 80 & approaching 80; and I'd like to see what this world looks like in another 50 years).


----------



## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Actually what Marmot shows is that if you want to get and stay healthy, you should control your own automony and social interactions...almost exactly word for word what you wrote.


----------



## mrPPincer (Nov 21, 2011)

I'm interested to read it, my posts were more about the title and it's implications, either to the author's leap of logic and what it tells me about where he comes from, or his publisher's desire to sell books (understandable).

From what I've learned online, the research seems to be about the effects of one's feeling of control in one's autonomy and social interactions, and those things imo certainly are closely linked to status in most cases to at least some degree, but is it (status) really the direct causal factor in longevity?

Like I've said, I haven't read it yet so..


----------



## Barwelle (Feb 23, 2011)

mrPPincer said:


> Also cut my own firewood, butcher my own meat etc, even cut my own hair;


No wonder you were able to semi-retire at 40... you don't seem to pay other people to do things for you, you do it all yourself!

I think it's silly to say early retirement could be bad for your health... being a couch potato (in retirement and otherwise) is what's bad for your health.

Nemo2... Great write-up on Robb's blog. Enjoy your trip and please share stories when you return. I'd buy your autobiography for inspiration!


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

mrPPincer said:


> I hike every week with a group of mostly senior retirees; you don't have to be working a job to get physical and social activity.
> Also cut my own firewood, butcher my own meat etc, even cut my own hair; I feel I'm in total complete control of own autonomy, and to a lesser degree social interaction, yet according to Marmot (author of The Status Syndrome), by pay grade and job description I'm on the lower end of the status ladder, and will have lower longevity.
> (hope not, grandparents saw their 90's, parents are 80 & approaching 80; and I'd like to see what this world looks like in another 50 years).


I think you can safely ignore the statistics. It sounds like you have a healthy lifestyle. I would watch cutting your own hair though. Those scissors and razors are sharp and well-worth the professional handlers....

As to butchering your own beef, I would say to watch your fat intake.


----------



## mrPPincer (Nov 21, 2011)

kcowan said:


> I think you can safely ignore the statistics.


thanks! 


kcowan said:


> As to butchering your own beef, I would say to watch your fat intake.


The last one was a road kill young buck deer I picked up on the way to a one hour job placing young chicks in a broiler barn, rolled him into the trunk and strung him up in a tree, butchered him, cut off all the damaged meat and brined him for a few days until my next job was done and then smoked the meat. 
I mostly work for chicken farmers so cull chickens are in unlimited supply.
I've only butchered beef on my own once, but you're right, fat intake is a concern, something I should watch more closely, but it tastes so good!


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Barwelle said:


> Nemo2... Great write-up on Robb's blog. Enjoy your trip and please share stories when you return. I'd buy your autobiography for inspiration!


Thank you. (In truth I'm somewhat dissatisfied by the presentation......it was intended as a first draft outline but ended up online.......to me it sounds like an "I" test, (I did this, I did that).) 

One thing I perhaps should have included was a purchase of COS.UN circa 1998, (after reading an article by Dunnery Best where he espoused their potential), in the ~$16 range which were sold just before they split 5-1...a nice capital gain of around $250K.


----------



## arrow1963 (Nov 22, 2011)

First of all, to address a point raised on the second page, sociodemographic disparities in health absolutely do exist in Canada. If you break down the population by income decile and educational attainment, you're probably looking at a 10 year spread in average life expectancy between the richest and almost poorest (1st and 9th decile) of income. So, while we might not like to think in 'class' terms, it doesn't mean that they don't exist (though Canada does display better intergenerational income mobility than the USA and England).

On the retirement & health question, people need to recognize that this is a classic example of a research question with a natural bias. Another is the impact of university on lifetime earnings. I think that's a simpler question, so I'll address it first.

It's common to read a newspaper report which references a 'study' that says that 'people who go to university have higher average lifetime earnings than those who don't'. Now, because it's in the newspaper, we can't know off hand whether the statistical controls used were adequate, so there's the chance that this is just a 'count and report' analysis, but let's assume that the study was really good. So, they've collected information on parental income, and high school marks, and standardized test scores and whatever they can think of, and it's been put into a well specified regression, and they've tried to spit out a fair guess at the income disparity.

The problem here is that a lot of things aren't measured, perhaps because it's difficult, or because the study is relying on data from a large database with limited terms. How do you equalize discipline, ambition and motivation across groups? For an observational study, where people self select into the group that they want to be in, there's always the chance that there is another variable which has not been accounted for which is driving the result.

So, on one hand, we could say 'if almost all of the studies say that going to university is a good deal, I should probably do it'. However, what I'm calling the 'natural bias' in this research is: the group of students who go to university are systematically different from the group that isn't (including hypothesized differences in relationships with authority, motivation, etc...). Thus, it's really easy for a poor study to show that university increases lifetime earnings, and really difficult for a study to prove that it is true.



So, what's the 'natural bias' in retirement/health research? Some people retire because they're not healthy enough to work any more. Others may be told that they have a limited time to live, and thus retire so that they don't spend their final days working, or because they want to maximize their pension returns. A bad study, or a study that relies on high level data without a lot of specific questions about health status, will not adequately account for these impacts on the average health of the population.

"Did you retire because you were ill" is a pretty simple question, and I'd hope that a version of it is included in any specialized questionnaire used to inform a study on the topic. However, many of the questions that drive people's decisions won't be so simple, like family medical history, or your lifetime history of working with asbestos, or a thousand other questions that you can think of. Many researchers don't collect their own information, they use the Canadian Community Health Survey, or the NHANES from the US, or the British Household Panel Survey to perform econometric analyses. These national datasets don't have that level of detail, and results from them can be expected to be systematically biased to suggest (especially in the hands of a reporter who is summarizing the press release, which translates the abstract, which summarizes the "study") that retirement causes death, when in fact we don't know.


----------



## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

I have started cutting my own meat as well, just deer so far! don't have to be to concerned about fat with deer unless you add fat to your hamburger.
whoops, getting off target now.......



mrPPincer said:


> thanks!
> 
> The last one was a road kill young buck deer I picked up on the way to a one hour job placing young chicks in a broiler barn, rolled him into the trunk and strung him up in a tree, butchered him, cut off all the damaged meat and brined him for a few days until my next job was done and then smoked the meat.
> I mostly work for chicken farmers so cull chickens are in unlimited supply.
> I've only butchered beef on my own once, but you're right, fat intake is a concern, something I should watch more closely, but it tastes so good!


----------



## Barwelle (Feb 23, 2011)

Nemo2 said:


> Thank you. (In truth I'm somewhat dissatisfied by the presentation......it was intended as a first draft outline but ended up online.......to me it sounds like an "I" test, (I did this, I did that).)
> 
> One thing I perhaps should have included was a purchase of COS.UN circa 1998, (after reading an article by Dunnery Best where he espoused their potential), in the ~$16 range which were sold just before they split 5-1...a nice capital gain of around $250K.


I see what you mean, it was essentially a quick run-through of your life thus far. But it was inspiring to see that somebody could have so many adventures and still retire early, comfortably.

I've had this idea in my mind that if I travel, I wouldn't be able to save money for investments for retirement and investing in the family farm; the best option for me would be to stick around home and slug away at work. But perhaps there is a way.


----------



## avrex (Nov 14, 2010)

Toronto.gal said:


> 'Retirement is another time when depression hits people, especially men. All of people's working careers they save so that they can retire while still healthy with the ability to enjoy that time, however, work is what keeps people engaged in the world, feeling productive and gives identity and purpose to people. Without work, people are frequently lost and lose social networks as well as their daily routine.'
> http://www.pbs.org/thisemotionallife/blogs/depression-during-life-transitions


I am engaged outside of work. *check.*
I feel productive outside of work. *check.*
I have an identity outside of work. *check.*
I have social networks outside of work. *check.*

Now I just need to save enough to stop working.


----------



## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

avrex said:


> I am engaged outside of work. *check.*
> I feel productive outside of work. *check.*
> I have an identity outside of work. *check.*
> I have social networks outside of work. *check.*
> ...


----------



## the-royal-mail (Dec 11, 2009)

Great post by avrex. 100% agreed. I too have all those things in check and in fact am *MORE* engaged etc outside of work.


----------



## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

the-royal-mail said:


> Great post by avrex. 100% agreed. I too have all those things in check and in fact am *MORE* engaged etc outside of work.


You need to take one of them courses called _Employee Engagement_ ;o)


----------



## Emma (May 18, 2013)

A friend's father retired at 65, had a bypass at 75, passed away recently at 102. He had very little retirement income, received income isupplements. He was healthly until his late 90's and then physical limitations forced him into retirement living and he was able to cover the costs. As for activity in retirement he mostly helped out with his children and grandchildren. I think its in the genes, how you treat your body and maybe just plain luck.

Personally, my husband retired at 60 and I thought that might be the end of me, very stressful adjusting to "what's on for today". I decided to keep a job jar to keep him busy. He did have all those check marks above.....


----------



## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

(I don't yet have a published source for this but) Canada's Chief Actuary recently said advances in heart disease treatments (principally stents) have added about 7 years *on average* to a 55-year-old Canadian man's life since the 1970s. It used to be, if you had heart disease and then a heart attack, you died. Not anymore. Amazing!!!


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

A good friend here in Mexico was a walking heart attack. His BP was 220/160! (We had taken our BP monitor to his place to illustrate the problem.) Long story short, he got 3 stents installed at the VA hospital in Houston and put on some pills daily. Probably will live for at least 10 more years (to age 75).


----------



## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

avrex said:


> I am engaged outside of work. *check.*
> I feel productive outside of work. *check.*
> I have an identity outside of work. *check.*
> I have social networks outside of work. *check.*





Hawkdog said:


> So you have an Xbox


Now that was funny! :encouragement:


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

avrex said:


> 1. I feel productive outside of work
> 2. I have an identity outside of work
> 3. Now I just need to save enough to stop working.


*1.* I'm sure you have 'productive' activities after [paid] working hours. 
*2.* Yes, you do avrex!
*3.* I would say that you probably need a few more 'checks' to qualify you for retirement [not just talking about $$$].

On a serious note, the transition from employment/self-employment to retirement [whether early/late/forced/voluntary], is a difficult period for many & for various reasons; it is not just about having enough funds as some have expressed here.


----------



## fraser (May 15, 2010)

My father retired at 59-early retirement from his employer based on medical reasons. Prior to that he had been on medical leave for six months. 

He had a very stressful job.

He subsequently moved to Vancouver (beside a golf course), got a small part time job, and played golf three times a week.
His heath improved significantly. He was fortunate to have 25 years of good health. He outlived all of his peers/colleagues who waited until their mid sixties to retire (and probably had a healthier retirement).

I think that this issue is a function of the lifestyle that you build for yourself after retirement-no matter what age that is.


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

the-royal-mail said:


> in fact am *MORE* engaged etc outside of work.


How could that be?

If let's say you: [based on 5 days]

- work = 37 hrs. [7.4 hrs. daily] 
- commute = 5 hrs. [1 hr. daily]
- non-escaping chores = 15 hrs. [3 hrs. daily: cooking/cleaning {dishes/home/showers}/eating/laundry/shopping]
- leisure = 15 hrs. [3 hrs. daily: TV/CMF/other social forums/social events/family/friends]
- sleeping & other bedroom activities = 30 hrs. [6 hrs. daily]

- total of the above = 102 
- total hrs. in 5 days = 120
- balance of hrs. for engaging outside of work = 18 or 3.6 a day vs. 7.4 hrs. of work


----------



## steve41 (Apr 18, 2009)

As some of you may know, I recvd my last T4 in my early fifties. Rather than becoming an employee again, I decided to get into the DIY software authorship game.

What a ride! I didn't have the energy or financial resources to go big.... I just plugged along on my own, relying primarily on word of mouth and the odd trade show. It sure has kept me engaged, and provides a modest living as well.

At age 71, I now find it a bit of a chore to keep everything fed and watered.... programming is, after all, a young man's sport. I was hoping the program would become obsolete, but alas.... I just heard from one of my users that he had sucessfully got it to run on Windows 8. Arrgghh!

If anyone wants to write an article on how to screw up succession planning, I would be a good subject.


----------



## Four Pillars (Apr 5, 2009)

Toronto.gal said:


> How could that be?
> 
> If let's say you: [based on 5 days]
> 
> ...


I don't think you understand the word 'engaged' very well.


----------



## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

a side note to the other extreme,
the co owner (brothers own it) of a drilling company in my town sold his company to a larger international company for over 50 million, a month later he died of a heart attack.
very tragic. 



Emma said:


> A friend's father retired at 65, had a bypass at 75, passed away recently at 102. He had very little retirement income, received income isupplements. He was healthly until his late 90's and then physical limitations forced him into retirement living and he was able to cover the costs. As for activity in retirement he mostly helped out with his children and grandchildren. I think its in the genes, how you treat your body and maybe just plain luck.
> 
> Personally, my husband retired at 60 and I thought that might be the end of me, very stressful adjusting to "what's on for today". I decided to keep a job jar to keep him busy. He did have all those check marks above.....


----------



## Hawkdog (Oct 26, 2012)

for sure, and i would think a big portion would be based on personality type.
introvert versus extrovert.
where an extrovert IMO is more likely to be more engaged in non work social activities.



fraser said:


> My father retired at 59-early retirement from his employer based on medical reasons. Prior to that he had been on medical leave for six months.
> 
> He had a very stressful job.
> 
> ...


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

Four Pillars said:


> I don't think you understand the word 'engaged' very well.


I do and I did understand TRM very well! Such a word has multiple meanings, and it would seem that you did not understand 'my message', which was not totally unrelated to that of TRM's.


----------



## cainvest (May 1, 2013)

steve41 said:


> As some of you may know, I recvd my last T4 in my early fifties. Rather than becoming an employee again, I decided to get into the DIY software authorship game.
> 
> What a ride! I didn't have the energy or financial resources to go big.... I just plugged along on my own, relying primarily on word of mouth and the odd trade show. It sure has kept me engaged, and provides a modest living as well.
> 
> ...


Nicely done, I'll likely (hopefully) be following the same route in a few years.

I don't know what area you're in with your software biz but a good move might be to go after the tablet/smart phone market, if applicable to your application(s). BTW, I don't think 71 is to old to do programming and the young ones tend to make many mistakes.


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Toronto.gal said:


> ...it is not just about having enough funds as some have expressed here.


Yes so true. In fact, the uncertainty about sufficient funds seems to be a minor factor for the first 10 years of retirement. Psychological factors are much more important, as well as interpersonal relationships if you are living with someone else.

Get these right and the money seems trivial.


----------



## brad (May 22, 2009)

My brother is 63 and writes plug-ins for computer animation software; one of the great things about selling things on the internet is that nobody knows how old you are. He's well known in the industry but never goes out to conferences or makes appearances, so I bet most people think he's some nerdy guy in his early 20s.


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

steve41 said:


> If anyone wants to write an article on how to screw up succession planning, I would be a good subject.


Steve that was why we had the "Go big or go home" exercise 10 years ago. You decided to take the low road and now you are an indentured servant. You choices are limited now. But you still have choices even though they are much different than then...


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Barwelle said:


> Nemo2... Great write-up on Robb's blog. Enjoy your trip and please share stories when you return. I'd buy your autobiography for inspiration!


So, here's the link to our boring Czech Republic slides........your worst nightmare come true. :wink:

http://sdrv.ms/19kKWRa

Just click on the first pic to start the slides.


----------



## Barwelle (Feb 23, 2011)

Nemo, your pictures are hardly boring! I was there 2 years ago, so I recognize some of the places. They bring back memories ... including a similar situation like your slide 81 where I just missed a train in a rural area and had to wait a few hours to catch the next one! Got some time to explore the area more, which was nice.

Thank you for sharing.


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Looks like they got their share of flooding...


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

one of the most beautiful presentations of historic european city architecture that i've ever seen. Nemo you have a marvellous eye. Thank you so much!

there's something about rainy grey days that perfectly suits these graceful, ancient grey stone buildings.

did you happen to find out how the citizens of prague managed to prevent creeping modern? was most of downtown prague somehow decreed a world preservation site shortly after WW II? there isn't a mcDonald's or a pizza hut or even a neo-soviet-style post office to be seen.


----------



## steve41 (Apr 18, 2009)

kcowan said:


> Steve that was why we had the "Go big or go home" exercise 10 years ago. You decided to take the low road and now you are an indentured servant. You choices are limited now. But you still have choices even though they are much different than then...


 Yes, I know. The upside is that I don't have to deal with all the company BS.... meeting a payroll, reasoning with marketing egos, investors, bank managers. All I have is a modest coding splurge twice a year and the odd support call. Suits me fine. 

Plus, I don't need the money


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

HP: My wife, the photograph taker, thanks you.........I just carry the bag, (although there is a small Kodak Easyshare that I use to take the occasional pic), and write the (dumb) captions.

The Old Town is, I believe, a UNESCO World Heritage Centre, (and there are, at least, a couple McDonalds, (one on Wenceslas Square), but they're a little more 'subdued' than the N.American drive-thru types).........Prague escaped most of the ravages of WWII, (initially because Adolf threatened to raze it if the Czechs didn't 'ask' him to occupy the country, and they had no options).....from what I understand, from Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1945_Bombing_of_Prague , what damage there was was done was an offshoot of the Dresden raids.

Outside the Old Town area there is a LOT of graffiti....can only presume (because I don't credit the taggers with a lot of social conscience), that the penalties in the Old Town area are somewhat severe.


----------



## NorthKC (Apr 1, 2013)

My Dad retired at 57 and is somehow even busier than when he was working. However, he has taken on a brand new "volunteer career" building houses for Habitat for Humanity. He chooses to spend however much time as he wants on the houses and gets to learn more tools of the trade in building a house from scratch. In his words, "who says retirement is boring?!"


----------



## Daniel A. (Mar 20, 2011)

There are only two things in life that we don't get second chances at, raising kids & retirement.

Everything else may offer three or four chances to change along the way. 

I raised my kids to be independent treated them with respect was always fair and did what I could to support them.
Today they tell their friends they had dream childhood memories the best.
They even come back telling me that they understand what I was trying to convey today because they have been out working for a few years.

I retired early three years ago, I've done more reading in the past two years than my whole life.
I spend winters in Mexico only sorry for my lack of Spanish something I'm working on.
I sleep 8 hours a night something I never did working.

Possessions mean little to me but then they never have.
I talk with many people that wonder about retirement or waited to long.

I have the freedom to do what I want when I want, that is so cool.
I feel like a real person.

It takes about 18 months to get over the work thing identity once past that there is no looking back. 
I've never talked to anyone that regretted early retirement once past that 12-18 month time.

I have talked to several that wished they had left sooner as things have not worked out from a health point of view very sad.

Once people have an idea in their minds it is hard to change, my idea was to take every day as it comes.
Some day's things come up that I need to deal with but most are at my choosing.

Like raising the kids once retired something may come up but at least I can count on the fact that I've had some good years for me. 

No need for regret I bailed early and if I only have ten good years that's ten more than if I'd gone the distance.

Daniel A.


----------



## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

Very good post, Daniel A. Thank you for sharing.


----------



## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

nemo, mrs nemo is a marvellously talented photographer! Such a keen eye for photocomposition & such a beautiful colour sense. There's a silver luminescence that shines over all these pictures. It might be due to the rain in may or it might be due to a filter she's using. But whether with people or without, each photograph has a magical quality.

wondering if you are the cute gentleman in the black cap who just missed the train at krivoklat station?

speaking of cute gentlemen & speaking of health in retirement ...

.


----------



## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

Daniel A. said:


> It takes about 18 months to get over the work thing identity once past that there is no looking back.


Great post!

I've been retired almost 4 years now but still get butterflies if I hear a cell phone ring.(My own cell phone met its coup de grace on the day I retired ...I chopped it to pieces with my axe)


Other than that I am enjoying retirement and have never been happier,healthier,busier or better looking.


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

humble_pie said:


> nemo, mrs nemo is a marvellously talented photographer! Such a keen eye for photocomposition & such a beautiful colour sense. There's a silver luminescence that shines over all these pictures. It might be due to the rain in may or it might be due to a filter she's using. But whether with people or without, each photograph has a magical quality.


 I blush on her behalf.....she is indeed a prize.



humble_pie said:


> wondering if you are the cute gentleman in the black cap who just missed the train at krivoklat station?


'Cute' and 'Gentleman' are debatable...but it is, indeed, moi.......71 in 3 months.....where do the years go?

(BTW, who are the guys in the pic?)


----------



## HaroldCrump (Jun 10, 2009)

Nemo2 said:


> (BTW, who are the guys in the pic?)


They are the guys accompanying you on your next trip


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

steve41 said:


> All I have is a modest coding splurge twice a year and the odd support call. Suits me fine.


It is the epitome of a cottage industry. At the time, Hornby was only part of your future. So the choice was best in hindsight.:encouragement:


----------



## hystat (Jun 18, 2010)

brad said:


> My brother is 63 and writes plug-ins for computer animation software; one of the great things about selling things on the internet is that nobody knows how old you are. He's well known in the industry but never goes out to conferences or makes appearances, so I bet most people think he's some nerdy guy in his early 20s.


that's cool!


----------



## brad (May 22, 2009)

hystat said:


> that's cool!


my brother used to spend a lot of time on the phone giving tech support to the actor Dick Van ****, who's 87 years old and is obsessed with computer animation -- he apparently spends hours every day working on animations. So that's another example of a happy guy in retirement.


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

Nemo2 said:


> http://sdrv.ms/19kKWRa
> 
> Just click on the first pic to start the slides.


Skvělé fotky! Thanks for sharing Nemo.

Oh, and you definitely don't look your age; you could easily pass for 60! :wink:


----------



## w0nger (Mar 15, 2010)

retirement = working because i want to... not because i have to.


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Toronto.gal said:


> Skvělé fotky! Thanks for sharing Nemo.
> 
> Oh, and you definitely don't look your age; you could easily pass for 60! :wink:


It's somewhat frightening when one reaches a point where passing for 60 is a compliment. :chuncky: (But, hey, since I'll be 71 in two months I'll gratefully accept it!)


----------



## kcowan (Jul 1, 2010)

Nemo2 said:


> It's somewhat frightening when one reaches a point where passing for 60 is a compliment. :chuncky: (But, hey, since I'll be 71 in two months I'll gratefully accept it!)


Yes I get that all the time. I think:``Do they really think they are complimenting me.``

I remember when I was 14 and people said I looked 18. I even went to a bar that demanded proof of 21 with older friends.

But your are older by a few months...


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

Nemo2 said:


> It's somewhat frightening when one reaches a point where passing for 60 is a compliment.....


Sorry, I didn't mean to frighten  nor compliment you either, I was just giving my honest impression.


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Toronto.gal said:


> Sorry, I didn't mean to frighten  nor compliment you either, I was just giving my honest impression.


Hey, I'll take it as a compliment.....intended or not. :highly_amused:


----------

