# Help with Armtec Class action Notice



## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

I just received in the mail a notice of a Class Action Lawsuit against Armtec infrastructure. My purchase and selling dates definitely fall within the terms of the Claim.



Am I correct to assume, after reading this pdf file, that I should expect a pay-out of almost all my capital losses for stock purchased & sold during that time frame? or am I completely out to lunch?



http://www.armtecclassaction.com/wp...12-SCHEDULE_D_TO_ORDER_PLAN_OF_ALLOCATION.pdf

thanks in advance for any help!


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## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

It looks like if you're a "prospectus class member" you would receive that, but if you're a "secondary market class member" you would only receive 85% of that. 

I am guessing that prospectus class means you bought it directly from Armtec while secondary market class means you bought it on the stock exchange? 

I'm no lawyer and no expert, this is just what I gleaned from a quick glance at the document.


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## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

thanks Spudd, I wasn't aware what Prospectus class member meant and unfortunately chose that one, which looks like it may be wrong as I bought them through TD waterhouse. I'll try e-mailing them to see if I can change that info.


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## Potato (Apr 3, 2009)

Canuck said:


> Am I correct to assume, after reading this pdf file, that I should expect a pay-out of almost all my capital losses for stock purchased & sold during that time frame?


Maybe but I doubt it. You'll make a claim for that amount, as will many others who bought during the period. The ~$13M settlement will be used to pay the lawyers and other fees, and the remainder will be split up proportionately. ARF dropped from something like $16/sh to $3.50/sh, so the losses in the settlement are for -- ballpark -- $12.50/sh. The volume at the time was something like 50-100k shares/day, and the period is roughly 50 days, so the total possible losses people could throw at the settlement are (very roughly) about three times the amount of the settlement. I can't remember what the lawyer's fees typically are, but I would ballpark that in the end you might recoup about a ninth to a quarter of your losses. Let us know when it finally comes through.


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## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

Potato said:


> Maybe but I doubt it. You'll make a claim for that amount, as will many others who bought during the period. The ~$13M settlement will be used to pay the lawyers and other fees, and the remainder will be split up proportionately. ARF dropped from something like $16/sh to $3.50/sh, so the losses in the settlement are for -- ballpark -- $12.50/sh. The volume at the time was something like 50-100k shares/day, and the period is roughly 50 days, so the total possible losses people could throw at the settlement are (very roughly) about three times the amount of the settlement. I can't remember what the lawyer's fees typically are, but I would ballpark that in the end you might recoup about a ninth to a quarter of your losses. Let us know when it finally comes through.


Thanks Potato. After giving this more thought I agree with you, I'll likely get back only a percentage of my losses depending on how many claim. Darn I was so excited for a day or 2 

I will keep you posted as to how this turns out. It will certainly be nice to get something, as I wasn't even aware until I got the letter that there was a class action suite boiling, but I do hope it's at least more than $100 cuz filing the forms, looking for & uploading proof etc... has taken up a few hours of my time


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## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

Just an update.

I received e-mail yesterday stating that I was accepted in the claim, and that all claimants have 14 days (a referee period) to dispute the "nominal entitlement".

My total net loss was $12,590, and my "nominal entitlement" is $10,700.

So I assume I'll only get a portion of that $10,700. What percentage I have no idea.

Such a waiting game!

Anyway, I thought it may be interesting for others that my be in a similar situation at some point. We'll see if it was even worth my while participating.

I'll keep you posted as to how much I actually get.


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## OptsyEagle (Nov 29, 2009)

My guess is you will get back about 3.3% of your losses x 85% or about $350. Please let us know. My numbers come from the fact that about $300 million was lost in total and the settlement was for $13 million. The lawyers will take $3 million at least, leaving around $10 million for shareholders (I am probably a little high on that). So, 10/300 = 3.3% and then they put on you an 85% payout figure.

My numbers are pretty rough and I should point out that you are very lucky that only $300 million was lost. With the larger companies the losses tend to get into the billions but the payouts are usually not delved out at the same rate of increase. As long as the plaintiff lawyers get enough and get it quickly they tend to recommend to settle.

Keep in mind that this entire exercise is simply a lawyer money making game. The lawyers are simply looking for a quick payout of a few million dollars for themselves, so they can move on and extort the next public company of some more money in and around the same amount. Do this 2 or 3 times a year and you are making a good living. The defense lawyers understand this game as much as they do so both players knew the amount of settlement before they even got started, even though I am sure the lawsuit was in the $300 million range or more, when it started. 

Unfortuneately, none of these players actually care what you lost or what you recoup, or for that matter, anything about you at all.


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## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

OptsyEagle said:


> My guess is you will get back about 3.3% of your losses x 85% or about $350. Please let us know. My numbers come from the fact that about $300 million was lost in total and the settlement was for $13 million. The lawyers will take $3 million at least, leaving around $10 million for shareholders (I am probably a little high on that). So, 10/300 = 3.3% and then they put on you an 85% payout figure.
> 
> My numbers are pretty rough and I should point out that you are very lucky that only $300 million was lost. With the larger companies the losses tend to get into the billions but the payouts are usually not delved out at the same rate of increase. As long as the plaintiff lawyers get enough and get it quickly they tend to recommend to settle.
> 
> ...


I believe the lawyers fees are around 4 million...crazy.

I will try and remember to post here if and when I get a cheque.

It certainly is eye opening on how this whole process works. It seems you are correct that it's just a game for these lawyers to make a few million.

And thank you for your input! I know nothing about this stuff, so it's better that I prepare for a measly pay-out rather than get my hopes dashed. A few grand would have been nice, but by the sounds of it, that's not gonna happen


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## supperfly17 (Apr 18, 2012)

OptsyEagle said:


> My guess is you will get back about 3.3% of your losses x 85% or about $350. Please let us know. My numbers come from the fact that about $300 million was lost in total and the settlement was for $13 million. The lawyers will take $3 million at least, leaving around $10 million for shareholders (I am probably a little high on that). So, 10/300 = 3.3% and then they put on you an 85% payout figure.
> 
> My numbers are pretty rough and I should point out that you are very lucky that only $300 million was lost. With the larger companies the losses tend to get into the billions but the payouts are usually not delved out at the same rate of increase. As long as the plaintiff lawyers get enough and get it quickly they tend to recommend to settle.
> 
> ...


Great post, really opens one's eyes.


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## OptsyEagle (Nov 29, 2009)

When you look at this process closely, we simply have a process where the shareholders sue the company and if they win, the shareholders pay the shareholders some money. This would make no sense at all except for the obvious fact that their is one group of true winners ...the lawyers.

If you ask the lawyers about this quagmire, they would say they are doing the world a great service, because if they didn't sue these companies the management groups would have no reason at all to play by the rules. I really can't argue with the fact that there is really very little else available to keep corporate managers in line, but I don't think this process, where someone else pays a group of others money, really keeps anyone worried to the level we need them to be to act appropriately. The punishment has to be directed at the person that held back material information or sugar coated a news release, etc, for it to work properly. Without that, this is just a money maker for lawyers.

All my opinion of course.


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## al42 (Mar 5, 2011)

I just received a settlement cheque from Marsh for just over $1500.
Its made out to my registered account, just wondering if I can just deposit this in my unregistered account?

Just for anyone interested My total net loss was $5155.00 and my "nominal entitlement" was $4318.00.


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## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

Thanks for the info al42.

Did they notify you with regards to the amount you were getting before you got your cheque? and did you originally buy Armtec in a registered account? 

I haven't received anything yet, and their website that had my claim info appears to have disappeared, which is rather alarming. Can you get onto that site? or do you have a phone # you can pass on to me?

thanks


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## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

al42 said:


> I just received a settlement cheque from Marsh for just over $1500.
> Its made out to my registered account, just wondering if I can just deposit this in my unregistered account?
> 
> Just for anyone interested My total net loss was $5155.00 and my "nominal entitlement" was $4318.00.


Also, where do you live? maybe my cheque is in the mail but is taking longer because I'm in Vancouver...fingers crossed.


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## al42 (Mar 5, 2011)

Canuck said:


> Thanks for the info al42.
> 
> Did they notify you with regards to the amount you were getting before you got your cheque? and did you originally buy Armtec in a registered account?
> 
> ...


Nope...no notification from them. just received cheque on Friday. Did originally purchase in my RSP account but went to the bank today and they told me I could deposit it in any account. Think they are wrong but what do I know.
And yes, live in Toronto. MAybe take a few days for your cheque to arrive out west.


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## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

Thanks al42, appreciate your help with this.

If I get roughly the same percentage I'm looking at a cheque for around $3000. Better than what I expected after reading some comments on this thread.

Do you know if we have to declare this as a Capital gain?


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## Canuck (Mar 13, 2012)

Got my Cheque today.

So for any that may be interested...

My total net loss was $12,590, and my "nominal entitlement" is $10,700, and my cheque is $3,725.

Definitely worth the pain in the arse paperwork, and the waiting.


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