# UK and Euro Dividend Champion lists



## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

If you want to check out UK and Euro Dividend Champion lists
, you can find it here 
http://dividendlife.com/index.php/uk-dividend-champions-home/


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## londoncalling (Sep 17, 2011)

Thanks Gibor! I needed to allocate more funds away from Canada (even though I have numerous bids in Canadian equities, a few US stocks and nothing in UK/Eur) 

Cheers!


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

No problem  If you have some interesting ideas , please let us know  I have some non-NA ETFs : VEA and VGK, but only 1 stock UL ... So far just took a look at spreadsheets .... looks like majority of stocks traded only as OTC Pink


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## Moneytoo (Mar 26, 2014)

Thank you, gibor! From this list, I had Diageo and sold it in February (bought it last summer, collected a nice dividend, but the stock was going nowhere, so sold it slightly above the purchase price - but still watching it) 

We hold XEF (developed countries ETF that doesn't yield much), was thinking to buy one or two dividend-paying ADRs (in RRSP). Short-listed BTI, GSK and UN (from the list that was posted last year), but decided to wait if a better idea comes along...


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

> I had Diageo and sold it in February (bought it last summer, collected a nice dividend, but the stock was going nowhere, so sold it slightly above the purchase price


 You are too active trader  I wouldn't sell stock increasing dividends for many years only because "stock was going nowhere".



> We hold XEF (developed countries ETF that doesn't yield much),


 XEF is pretty much the same like VEA , only hedged.... imho VEA is much better. much lower MER 0.09 vs 0.22 (XEF), much higher yiled 2.75% vs 0.83% (XEF), and if you hold in in RRSP, you don't pay dividend withholding taxes on VEA, but pay (inderectly) on XEF


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## Moneytoo (Mar 26, 2014)

gibor said:


> You are too active trader  I wouldn't sell stock increasing dividends for many years only because "stock was going nowhere".


I think it was a good decision:

Bought: 14-08-29	50	119.45	4.95	119.55	5,977.45
*Sold: 15-01-29	50	121.75* 5.09 6,082.41

Sold near the top, it's been down since, could repurchase it for $111 now but don't want to  Soon after I sold Diageo, I bought VTI with the proceeds for $102.50, it's been up since then - $109.40 today. Still holding AT&T for example, wish I sold it and moved on - but "lesson learned", don't keep the "losers" for too long, especially if they pay the dividends semi-annually lol



gibor said:


> XEF is pretty much the same like VEA , only hedged.... imho VEA is much better. much lower MER 0.09 vs 0.22 (XEF), much higher yiled 2.75% vs 0.83% (XEF), and if you hold in in RRSP, you don't pay dividend withholding taxes on VEA, but pay (inderectly) on XEF


No, XEF is unhedged, and holds stocks directly (unlike most of the other CAD denominated International ETFs), so no Level II withholding taxes in both RRSPs and TFSAs. I was considering VEA, but it's just easier to rebalance with XEF for now


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

> Still holding AT&T for example, wish I sold it and moved on - but "lesson learned", don't keep the "losers" for too long, especially if they pay the dividends semi-annually lol


 AT&T pays quaterly  ..... i don't think it's correct to determine "losers" after 3-4 months , especially for dividend champions... I bought AT&T 3.5 years ago, sometimes it was "loser", sometimes not.... but for me 21% appreciation in 3.5 years is very good, plus my YOC is 6.6% nad more than 20% appreciation because of the week CAD%.... I wish many of my stocks will be like AT&T


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## Moneytoo (Mar 26, 2014)

See - the entry point is important (we bought a year ago for $36, and it underperformed the index and other stocks, so a loser for us )

Anyways, will watch BNN's Market Call after work:

1:00 pm - Market Call - Global Large Caps
Darren Sissons, Managing Director, Portfolio Management Corp.

Will report if I hear anything interesting about international Co's!


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## My Own Advisor (Sep 24, 2012)

Thanks gibor, interesting stuff from the UK in particular.


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## Moneytoo (Mar 26, 2014)

Diageo vs. Unilever (4:00)

I guess because at this point we don't really need income, I'm more interested in companies that have an upside potential than those with just steady dividends. So in this regard BTI still sounds more interesting - here's from my April 19th notes:

*British American Tobacco*

In the top 3 of top dividend ADRs in the last 5 years Q2s (page 8):

http://www.capitaassetservices.com/assets/media/SS14035_Dividend_Monitor_Q3_2014-v4-PP.pdf

Video: https://www.fool.co.uk/investing/in...d-so-bullish-on-british-american-tobacco-plc/

Also Strong Buy on Globe Investor:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/markets/stocks/summary/?q=BTI-A

In the middle of its 52 weeks high and low, slightly above its MA(200), 4.16% dividend.


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## Financialplannerdude (Apr 30, 2015)

Just a note,m if you buy and hold be aware of withholding taxes. I'm a tax resident of Germany and deal with a lot of Brits. Quite a while back in anther forum there was similar discussion and I posted a gif (long since deleted) of withholding taxes. For a fund domiciled in Ireland the withholding tax was double a fund domiciled in Luxemburg. The point was to be aware of how withholding taxes affect your dividends. To be honest this subject is way to complicated for me to even begin to offer an opinion other than to pay attention to withholding taxes. 

Rob


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

While it is an important point ... I thought part of the attraction for a Canadian tax resident with no other tax residencies for a US or Euro stock that was an ADR was that US to UK has no withholding tax so that in an RRSP (US withholding tax exempt) - there would be no withholding taxes taken.

A second attraction is that one can use the US market which almost all brokerage accounts have access to.


Cheers


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## mrPPincer (Nov 21, 2011)

The UK ADRs do not have a withholding tax, inside or outside the RRSP, which is why I hold a couple of them in my TFSA.
It's because the UK has a different way of taxing dividends, at the source, a system called dividend imputation, and the tax treaties with the US reflect an understanding of this system, so we as Canadian holders of UK ADRs can benefit as well.
The dividends are taxed by the UK, but it's more of a hidden tax that the shareholders don't really see; what divs are paid are what you get.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dividend_imputation


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

^^^^

Won't the UK ADR have US withholding tax in a taxable account, eligible for the FTC?
ADR does mean it's a US investment, correct?

Thanks for the explanation of the why the UK ones won't have dividend withholding taxes.


Cheers


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## Financialplannerdude (Apr 30, 2015)

mrPPincer said:


> The UK ADRs do not have a withholding tax, inside or outside the RRSP, which is why I hold a couple of them in my TFSA.
> It's because the UK has a different way of taxing dividends, at the source, a system called dividend imputation, and the tax treaties with the US reflect an understanding of this system, so we as Canadian holders of UK ADRs can benefit as well.
> The dividends are taxed by the UK, but it's more of a hidden tax that the shareholders don't really see; what divs are paid are what you get.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dividend_imputation


That was very interesting, will keep an eye out for it when discussing this in the expat forums I frequent


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

> The UK ADRs do not have a withholding tax, inside or outside the RRSP


 this is why i bought UL plc and not UN nv


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## mrPPincer (Nov 21, 2011)

Eclectic12 said:


> ^^^^
> 
> Won't the UK ADR have US withholding tax in a taxable account, eligible for the FTC?
> ADR does mean it's a US investment, correct?
> ...


Yes the ADRs of UK headquartered companies are US investments traded on US stock exchanges, but as I understand it, because of the tax treaty between US and UK the dividends on those particular ADRs are not subject to taxation by the IRS, which probably makes them popular for US investors, but also is nice for us north of the border because they don't charge dividend withholding tax due to the fact that the companies have already been taxed in the UK (UK residents can claim this on their tax returns, we can't afaik).
The tax treaties take this into account to avoid double taxation.

I'm sure we have a thread or two kicking around on this someplace.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

It seems odd to me in these days of US gov't desperation for money that the ADR held by a Canadian resident would be exempt from the US NR withholding tax.

It's great where it is this way ....


Cheers


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## mrPPincer (Nov 21, 2011)

^shh.. (don't give the IRS any more bright ideas lol)


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## humble_pie (Jun 7, 2009)

(minority opinion here) my understanding is that absence of NR withholding taxes on british ADRs has little to do with the UK/US tax convention each:

rather this welcome absence has everything to do with the fact that Britain does not levy withholding taxes on investment income sent anywhere on the planet.

for example, some cmf members live in canada but maintain close ties with the emerald isle, including the holding of british securities purchased directly on UK exchanges rather than in the form of US-traded ADRs.

in other words, these folks live in canada, they own british securities, the US is not involved. But there are no british NR withholding taxes for these folks, either.

great britain is one of only a few countries in the world that do not tax or assess income paid to non-residents, wheresoever they may live. Hong Kong is perhaps the other well-known jurisdiction in this category.

the story goes that the UK learned to never again tax her overseas nationals or beneficiaries after getting thrashed so badly by the boston tea party & the american war of independence.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

Below is pdf of withholding taxes for all countries. 

Except UK, Brazil, India and some other countries doesn't have dividend withholding tax
http://topforeignstocks.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/dttl-tax-withholding-tax-rates-2014.pdf

Some countries like Australia are confusing, as they may have 0% or 30% , Israel may have 4, 15, 20, 25 or 30%  
Is it depends on specific stock?


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## epson600 (Nov 24, 2014)

In the case of Australian dividends, if they are fully "franked" then the taxes owed are prepaid up front by the company so there is no withholding for ex-Aussie investors. If they are not franked, then I assume 30% would be withheld. You can take a look at WBK dividend history page to get some idea of what to expect. In their case, all divs since 2001 have been fully franked.


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

> if they are fully "franked" then the taxes owed are prepaid up front by the company so there is no withholding for ex-Aussie investors


 what do you mean by "ex-Aussie investors"? If I understand correct, if dividends are fully "franked", Canadian investor is not taxed...right? So, in case of WBK (and this is only stock that I may consider) , I won't pay any taxes?


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## epson600 (Nov 24, 2014)

gibor said:


> what do you mean by "ex-Aussie investors"?


 people who dont live in Australia


gibor said:


> If I understand correct, if dividends are fully "franked", Canadian investor is not taxed...right? So, in case of WBK (and this is only stock that I may consider) , I won't pay any taxes?


Yes. Personal experience held inside tfsa.


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

epson600 said:


> gibor said:
> 
> 
> > what do you mean by "ex-Aussie investors"? ...
> ...


Then they are more likely non-resident investors. 

Most people will interpret "ex-Aussie" as meaning an Aussie citizen who has moved away from Australia. :biggrin:


Cheers


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## gibor365 (Apr 1, 2011)

> Most people will interpret "ex-Aussie" as meaning an Aussie citizen who has moved away from Australia


 this is exactly how I understood it


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