# The Ladies' Suit Conspiracy



## Taraz (Nov 24, 2013)

Up until this point in my life, I've been self-employed and worked from home in my basement. I wear comfy T-shirts and pants that I got on sale for 94 cents from the clearance rack at Superstore. I have one custom tailored suit that I got for $200 when I was in Thailand many years ago. 

<rant>
With the new "professional" job, I now need to wear suits every day, and the shopping process has been a nightmare! I can see why women have trouble with equality in the workforce - they don't have outfits that let them be taken seriously. I cite the following examples:

-Women's suit jackets often don't have buttons. Seriously. When was the last time you saw a men's suit jacket without a button? It just looks sloppy to walk around with an unbuttoned jacket.
-Women's suit pants don't have pockets. I guess it's something to do with the fit, but surely there's a way to make pants fit well and still include pockets?!?!
-Women's shirts and jackets generally aren't designed for gals with chests. (With one exception - Ricki's had a shirt with a hidden snap to keep the chest buttons tight. Someone should get a Nobel prize for that invention.)

What I really want is a man's suit with curves. Does such a mythical item exist? Is there some secret suit store for ladies that I don't know about? I can't wait until 3-D clothing machines solve this problem! :neglected:
</rant>


----------



## Nemo2 (Mar 1, 2012)

Bespoke tailor?


----------



## Taraz (Nov 24, 2013)

I will check into local prices on bespoke suits, but I think another trip to Thailand to have them made there might be cheaper. Edmonton labour costs are high.


----------



## Spudd (Oct 11, 2011)

Have you tried Laura, Banana Republic, Jones New York (at the Bay)? I'm not a suit buyer but those are the places I'd check.


----------



## MoneyGal (Apr 24, 2009)

Try Freda's on King Street at Front in Toronto (closer than Thailand, I assume; they make most of their clothes on-site). However, all of the women there will tell you that women's suit jackets are not designed to be buttoned closed, even if they have buttons 

Also, the NYT did a whole series a while ago on "menswear for women" - I'll try to find the article and link if it's not behind the paywall.


----------



## Pvo (Jul 4, 2013)

All my suit jackets have buttons. Not sure where you're finding them without? Banana Republic, Mexx, Jacob, etc are all decent options for affordably priced professional wear.

Especially if you go to their outlets. The Banana Outlet typically has 40% off the entire store at least once a month. Great spot to pick up professional pieces for a reasonable price..


----------



## donald (Apr 18, 2011)

Without being rude!Do you know the male brain thinks of sex like 12 times or something a hr(young men esp-and older!)and are hard wired ie:6 times the amount of testosterone surging through the veins as women fyi-if your attractive and in a snowsuit men will still ''look''
I say imbrace your feminism(it's a plus not a minus)and own it(not saying you need to dress provocative but after all you aren't a man your a women
know matter how many rah rah books are written ect you are not going to change male dna and men likely take you more serious than you think
I don't get why women think the way they do do sometimes.
The day men don't look at you is a worse problem imo
Most successful women don't dress like men imo


----------



## jcgd (Oct 30, 2011)

I didn't really take away from her post that she could only find provocative clothing, but rather she couldn't find any functional clothing...

As an aside, a confident, strong, intelligent woman properly dressed is much more attractive to me than a short skirt and cleavage.

Sorry to get off topic.


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

jcgd said:


> I didn't really take away from her post that she could only find provocative clothing, but rather she couldn't find any functional clothing....


Never mind Donald, you know he's always thinking about the 3 letter word. 

What the OP said, was that women wearing no closure jackets could not be taken seriously, which of course is not the case, unless the person were wearing a chiffon camisole under said jacket.


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

Taraz said:


> 1. I've been self-employed and worked from home in my basement. I wear comfy T-shirts and pants that I got *on sale for 94 cents*
> 2. Women's suit jackets *often don't have buttons*.
> 3. Women's *suit pants don't have pockets*. I guess it's something to do with the fit,
> 4. It just *looks sloppy to walk around with an unbuttoned jacket.*


*1.* Could it be then, that with respect to prices, you may be a tad out of touch? You may not be able to get a custom tailored suit for $200, but if you look around enough, you may get lucky & find a label that has the style & size that is just right for your body type, or that requires minor alterations. Why not take a friend/family member shopping with you to help you and give opinions? That way, your shopping experience could be more pleasant than nightmarish. :encouragement:

*2.* That may be the case if you're looking for very inexpensive, or looking for casual blazers/suit separate types/shopping in the wrong stores?

*3.* It has more to do with fashion than functionality. 

*4.* I beg to differ. Do these look sloppy to you?


















IMHO, if anyone should be complaining, it should be the men; women's fashion is way less restricted, have endless choices in colours, styles & fabrics. Ditto for make-up & accessories [we have purses, who needs pockets?], etc., etc. :biggrin: 

Good luck with the new polished & professional look!


----------



## donald (Apr 18, 2011)

Fair enough jcgd,I might have misread the op's 'I can't find anything to be taken seriously'
The point Is though when dealing with men(I am sure she is talking about men in business?)
well,men are men right!(self explanatory)
I think women can(and do)use this for a advantage(clothing/feminism/beauty ect)I don't see how it's a bad thing!why would a women want to dress as close to a man's style suit?women's curves and bodies are totally different!
Even though some women say they don't I think most women enjoy dressing with a element of their sexuality in clothing and no I am not talking about short skirts and halter tops!
It is no different than I am sure women in business notice a man in a nice suit tailored to him accentuating his masculinity(women are visual also)sex plays a role in this life if people admit it or not(the dynamic between women and men)in conversation/body language and different other cue's,You will see innocent flirting between sexs in every office-it is human nature.-use it to your advantage I say


----------



## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

donald said:


> . ....It is no different than I am sure women in business notice a man in a nice suit tailored to him accentuating his masculinity(women are visual also)sex plays a role in this life if people admit it or not(the dynamic between women and men)in conversation/body language and different other cue's,You will see *innocent flirting *between sexs in every office-it is human nature.-*use it to your advantage I say*


 ... is there such a thing as "innocent flirting"? Especially when advised to "use it to your advantage" - no wonder the divorce rates in this country (and any others) are so high. Glad your field of work is not in the marriage counseling area. :eek2:


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

donald said:


> 1. *men are men right!(self explanatory) I think women can(and do)use this for a advantage*(clothing/feminism/beauty ect) I don't see how it's a bad thing!
> 2. You will see innocent flirting between sexs in every office-*it is human nature.-use it to your advantage I say*


*1.* Since it's also self-explanatory what you meant by 'men are men' in the context you wrote it, it's also clear what you meant by saying that women should use that as an 'advantage'. Sure, some women & even men [single or not] use sexual flirtation, but it's certainly not advisable in the workplace. Wonder though [as someone fearful of gold-diggers], whether you would be able to separate or distinguish charm/confidence/feminine style/friendliness/expensive taste in clothes, etc., from sexual flirtation.

*2.* Again, I think it's self-explanatory what you meant by taking 'advantage.'


----------



## heyjude (May 16, 2009)

Back to jackets and buttons. I find it annoying to watch a man stand up and button his suit jacket, then sit down and unbutton it again. This mannerism is constant in Parliament and in formal business meetings where men stand up to speak. I presume it developed because sitting with a buttoned jacket will lead to wrinkles. Isn't that a design problem? Either but the jacket loose enough not to wrinkle when you sit down, or leave it open. Women's suit jackets offer more options.

I sympathize with the OP. I personally disliked wearing formal business dress (my nemesis was pantyhose) and was glad to abandon it on retirement.


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

heyjude said:


> 1. Back to jackets and buttons.
> 2. I find it annoying to watch a man stand up and button his suit jacket, then sit down and unbutton it again....I presume it developed because *sitting with a buttoned jacket will lead to wrinkles*.


*1.* Less complicated/controversial topic for sure. 

*2.* The buttoned rule has more to do more with the drape/style of the jacket; the unbuttoning of the bottom button [2 many b's, lol] has more to do with allowing easier movement [especially for those with a bit extra weight]. 

Until rules change, men can only dream of having more flexibility when it comes to having a professional look with open front suit jackets & other more comfortable styles as women already do; in fact, have enjoyed for a long time [although they had to suffer with other clothing items].


----------



## Beaver101 (Nov 14, 2011)

Many corporations have casual Fridays (or business-attire dressed down days, not jammies or shredded jeans though) so those clients-meeting professionals only has to suffer in those strait jackets/suits 4 days of the week. For women, more comfortable to wear trousers than dress/panty-hose combine without sacrificing the professional look.


----------



## Taraz (Nov 24, 2013)

MoneyGal said:


> However, all of the women there will tell you that women's suit jackets are not designed to be buttoned closed, even if they have buttons


Why not? I've seen plenty of these types of women's suits online that look amazing. (It just seems like the majority of the jackets at the Bay, Sears, Ricki's, that I've seen have been buttonless.)

Something like:
http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00qKitOasJSVcF/2013-Ladies-Black-Business-Suit-A011-.jpg
or
http://img03.taobaocdn.com/bao/uploaded/i3/T1ogq9XnXoXXbbhgg3_050106.jpg




Pvo said:


> All my suit jackets have buttons. Not sure where you're finding them without? Banana Republic, Mexx, Jacob, etc are all decent options for affordably priced professional wear.
> 
> Especially if you go to their outlets. The Banana Outlet typically has 40% off the entire store at least once a month. Great spot to pick up professional pieces for a reasonable price..


Thanks for the tip! I'll check out those stores.




donald said:


> Without being rude!Do you know the male brain thinks of sex like 12 times or something a hr(young men esp-and older!)and are hard wired ie:6 times the amount of testosterone surging through the veins as women fyi-if your attractive and in a snowsuit men will still ''look''
> I say imbrace your feminism(it's a plus not a minus)and own it(not saying you need to dress provocative but after all you aren't a man your a women
> know matter how many rah rah books are written ect you are not going to change male dna and men likely take you more serious than you think
> I don't get why women think the way they do do sometimes.
> ...


So first of all, dressing "girly" isn't exactly professional, especially when you're on a client's worksite. I don't see why they should force the men to wear suits and not hold the ladies to the same standards. Second, I'm not trying to get anyone to check me out, as I'm attached with a kid, and most of them are married or in relationships. I'd rather not be a distraction. Third, I'd prefer to be judged on the merits of my work than based on my hotness. (Also, I think you mean that I should embrace my femininity. If I want to be a feminist, I'll leave the bra at home...)

I'm not specifically looking for inexpensive suits, but I'd prefer to buy "off the rack". $200-400 would be fine, but I don't want to drop $2000+ on a bespoke suit.


----------



## cedebe (Feb 1, 2012)

Taraz, those 2 buttoned jackets you posted are quite cute, but those women are basically breastless, hence they 'hang' well. I believe you mentioned in your first post that you have trouble with buttoned blouses (so do I so I feel your pain, sleeveless tops are another nightmare to fit into properly, too), anyway, if you're having problems with blouses, I reckon you'll have similar troubles with buttoned jackets unless you get extremely lucky and find one that actually fits off the rack, or are prepared to go the alterations route.... not always a cost-efficent option, I've found. 

Good luck and post back with your successful finds.


----------



## donald (Apr 18, 2011)

I am going to quit while I am ahead  lol...I'll call uncle,good luck in your suit buying situation!tara
And tgal-your one of the biggest flirts on cmf!admit it!lol


----------



## Toronto.gal (Jan 8, 2010)

donald said:


> 1. I am going to quit while I am ahead
> 2. your one of the biggest flirts on cmf!admit it!lol


*1.* That's a good idea! :encouragement:
*2.* And you have to admit that you can't differentiate between fashionistas & femme fatales, LOL.

Cedebe is right and what I was saying also, that not all suit styles work for every body type. 

Dressing professionally is about projecting the right image, and the proper style can, not only de-emphasize, but also be flattering. However, the latter does not necessarily make one provocative.

For larger types, wrap-around dress suits are also a good option. Also, it's much easier to wear camisoles/buttonless blouses with skirt & pant suits, as these can actually raise the neckline even more, if so desired, and they come in various stretchy fabrics. And if the wish is to cover as much as possible, then IMO, 3 buttons, as per below image, works better than the example shown upthread, in which the model looked to be a size 4. As well, with longer jackets, there would be no need for pant-pockets. 










Anyhow, at the end of the day, there are solutions to perennial problems, but there is a bit of experimentation, research & shopping involved in crafting one's image, as well as understanding one's body-type and willingness to adapt to changing styles & fabrics, which work in our favour.

Last but not least, buying a little bigger and then have the items tailored, is not as expensive as some may think.


----------



## marina628 (Dec 14, 2010)

I have found a couple nice suits at Laura ,they also have a petite line as well.For me the issue was always shoes as I have some hardware inside my left foot from my accident.In 2008 I went to Israel and my prayers were answered when I found a shoe maker who made me the most amazing dress shoes to accommodate that issue.They cost me $500 each pair and I had 3 different styles done but I don't have to buy another pair of shoes again in my lifetime for formal wear or Business Classy.Who really enjoys pantyhose?lol


----------



## Taraz (Nov 24, 2013)

It's not just my imagination....

"Why women's pockets are useless: A history"
http://www.marketplace.org/topics/tech/why-womens-pockets-are-useless-history


----------



## heyjude (May 16, 2009)

I still want to know what the Queen has in her handbag!


----------



## Karen (Jul 24, 2010)

Frankly, I get a little tired of reading Donald's views on women. I am pleased to read his comments on other subjects, but, please Donald, no more comments about women and their place in the home and the workplace!


----------

