# The sailing thread



## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

Hi:

Well, let's find out how many sailors and latent sailors we have here. I know Eder has something in the range of 40 feet out in BC, and Moneytoo has mentioned sailing recently too. I have a number of boats, but the two that will see action this season are the Sandpiper 565 (19 feet, 1200 pounds) and the Tanzer 22CB (3200 pounds, 22 feet).

So if you sail, or are interested, say hello here.

I'll start with sags ...



sags said:


> Have you watched the Robert Redford movie on Netflix called "All is Lost", about a guy who is sailing in the middle of the Indian Ocean and runs into problem after problem ?
> 
> There is no dialogue in the whole movie, and although I know nothing about sailing it was interesting watching him resigned to tackle each problem as they came.
> 
> ...


No I have not seen the movie.

That is much of the joy in it, "really knowing what you are doing". So much of modern life has been de-risked. We are spoon fed by the nanny state, permit for this, cannot do that. I see sailing as one of the last frontiers of freedom and ultimate responsibility for yourself, a state of affairs that really does not exist on land any more. Even if I never leave Canadian waters, I can choose when to sail, where to sail, in whatever craft I like, as seaworthy or not seaworthy as I like. Other than the safety stuff like flares, PFDs and the like, the government pretty much leaves you alone.

Of course then people abuse this freedom, and I would guess that the vast majority of boats are unsafe. Certainly any one I have ever purchased needed some very fundamental things done to it, things that should have never been done when the boat was made, and certainly not left for 40 years! Like texting and driving I guess, people usually get away with it, so they continue to do it.

Serious sailing and boat ownership done well really involves a very wide skill set: Electrical, plumbing, engines, woodworking, composites, navigation, weather, tides and currents, radio operation, sewing, metal working, mathematics and physics, geography, foreign languages, customs and laws, and last but not least the actual sailing. And whatever dozens of skills I neglected to mention.

However, to sail out of a marina as sags proposes to NOT do, one can get by on much less knowledge than a world cruiser. There still are certainly Darwin Award possibilities, but not to the same level.

hboy43


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## Moneytoo (Mar 26, 2014)

I fell in love with sailing 15 or so years ago when the president of the company I worked for at the time took me with a few other "employees of the month" for a few hours of leisure sailing in Lake Ontario on his boat. I came home and told my husband that we need to join a yacht club to learn how to sail - and eventually buy our own boat. 

We never joined the club, but some years later my husband got a co-worker who was looking for a sailing companion, and his friend needed a crew member for racing. So my husband learned the ropes to the point the owner would give him the keys and he would take me and sometimes our daughter out on the weekend. And I sometimes would join them on weekdays after work (more convenient now as we work nearby - and not far from the club)

A few years ago the boat on the nearby "parking spot" was for sale, and I made some good money that year, so I really wanted to buy that boat for my husband, but he said he wasn't ready. Then the owner of the boat lost his job and said he'd have to sell it - again, I said we should buy it, so we can keep sailing together. But they helped him to get a new job, and my husband again said he doesn't want to own one, he's fine just pitching in.

He still talks about crossing the Atlantic "one day with a nice crew", and I keep daydreaming about moving to Belize, buying a boat and sailing there, but for now we keep our stressful high-paying jobs - and sailing is just a nice form of relaxation/meditation on a hot day after work...

(I can steer, but realized that I don't really care about anything else, so yeah, you can call me a latent sailor - who takes pretty Instagram pictures lol And I still love swimming more than sailing... and haven't watched "All is Lost" - my husband did, and loved it )


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

All is lost is pretty much a pile of BS...REdford hits a floating cargo box & holes his boat. He tries to patch the hole...gets in a storm...patch fails since after a useless effort to patch he spends the rest of his time attempting to radio for help and fix his radio and make meals etc,

Trust me, if you have a hole in your hull you don't lose focus to do other things. Real sailors would have torn a door off of the galley cupboards to span the hole & then fiberglass the breach. If that failed they would have run their trysail under the hull...winched up tight to control water ensuring the batteries (which in the movie were OK) were powering the bilge pump etc.

The entire movie was an insult to intelligence for sailors world wide...come to think of it Redford had insulted human kinds intelligence often before.

At any rate we are heading North to our boat if we can drag our butts out of Napa tomorrow....plans are to redo the rub rails...haul out and do the zincs,grease the feathering prop...touch up the ablative...then sail North to Port McNeil for beer,burgers and 50 lb halibut. Hopefully August will find us heading South to San Diego to join the Bahaha gang. We'll see.

Oh...and only marry a girl that asks about your sail plan preference rather than whether you want kids or not haha. Thanks for starting this thread Hboy.


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## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

Moneytoo, your husband is a wise man. If you can sail on someone else's boat and be happy, carry on. You save a pile of expense and time. It is very likely I work on my boats more hours every season than actual sailing hours. Time on the boat at dock, at anchor, and moving probably exceeds work hours, but actually moving under sail, no.

One of the dirty little secrets of boating is how little they are actually sailed. I read once that the average boat only goes out 5 times a season. Don't know if true or not, but it would not surprise me. 4 or 5 years ago, late May, I cycled to my yacht club and literally camped on the grass out front for 4 days and did not manage to get onto anyone's boat. Much of boating is hanging out at the dock drinking and BBQ.

The Tanzer 22 is the main focus for repair this year. I am rebuilding the 6 ports (windows) including core repair. The lazarette covers are being rebuilt as core was wet and spongy there too. The lazarette seal need replacing, as a fair amount of water was getting in there. Just purchased a 150W solar panel that will mount horizontally just aft of the backstay to provide battery charging so I can abandon the shore cord. Happy bonus will be a bit of shade too. 

Might get to buying or making a Bimini but I don't know what kind of time I have this year - in Canada, sailing season is the same time as repair season unless you have a huge heated building. Last year I got a fair bit done in terms of the critical safety stuff but did not launch til mid August and my wife was not happy. Maybe I can get until July 1 to work on the Tanzer if the Sandpaper is down at the dock for the early season.

Hboy43


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

hboy43 said:


> The Tanzer 22 is the main focus for repair this year. I am rebuilding the 6 ports (windows) including core repair. The lazarette covers are being rebuilt as core was wet and spongy there too. The lazarette seal need replacing, as a fair amount of water was getting in there. Just purchased a 150W solar panel that will mount horizontally just aft of the backstay to provide battery charging so I can abandon the shore cord. Happy bonus will be a bit of shade too.


Once you get all that done, you should be ready for that ocean crossing sags talked about  

Sags said: "I will take the ocean liner." - Not without problems either, even if just on a cruise to Bahamas. http://www.cbsnews.com/news/cruise-...coast-on-royal-caribbeans-anthem-of-the-seas/  and http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/14/travel/cruise-ship-fire/ and many more.

We have cruised in the Caribbean on a good sized sailboat and watched those cruise ships dock and disgorge thousands of tourists so they could go buy t-shirts etc to show they had been in islands! We felt sorry for them, and maybe they felt sorry for us being in such a small boat (49 ft)



> Maybe I can get until July 1 to work on the Tanzer if the Sandpaper is down at the dock for the early season.
> Hboy43


How you going to prepare the hull for anti-fouling if your sandpaper is down at the dock ?


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## Eclectic12 (Oct 20, 2010)

hboy43 said:


> ... If you can sail on someone else's boat and be happy, carry on. You save a pile of expense and time. It is very likely I work on my boats more hours every season than actual sailing hours ...
> One of the dirty little secrets of boating is how little they are actually sailed ...


Which is why I like my relative in LA's sailing club deal ... manageable expenses, being able to go during the week makes basically all the boats available for use and the maintenance is only what he wants to take on.


Unless one is living on the boat or has the $$$ to hire whomever needed to keep it ready for use ... it seems like too much work to me.

Cheers


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

Eder said:


> At any rate we are heading North to our boat if we can drag our butts out of Napa tomorrow....plans are to redo the rub rails...haul out and do the zincs,grease the feathering prop...touch up the ablative...then sail North to Port McNeil for beer,burgers and 50 lb halibut.


Sounds like a nice trip!

Heading to Pt. McNeill, when you get to Quadra Is., what route do you take? Johnstone Strait, passing between Campbell River and Quadra Is., or do you take a longer route to the east?


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

We have gone Seymor narrows straight up Johnson Strait, 10 knot current pushing us thru the narrows is a thrill most never get...it's a great trip but lately we head East thru Desolation Sound up to Yaculta Rapids, Forward Harbor...then the run up Johnson turning at West Cracroft into the Broughtons stopping always at Pierres at Echo Bayfor a pig roast before Pt McNeil. It's nice never to be in a rush and we have made many friends along the way that require visiting and free Scotch lol.


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## Prospector (Jul 25, 2014)

I sold our Catalina 25 when we got serious about digging ourselves out debt-serf status. The boat was a load of fun, but not owning it has freed up piles of time. I still have some fittings hanging around I need to sell off. Anyone need a Bimini, or a couple anchors? Ahem... *Hboy43*

We did trips up Georgian bay and along Lake Ontario. The nice thing about a small boat is that you can still transit the Trent Canal, and get into some pretty nice anchorages.


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## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

Prospector said:


> Anyone need a Bimini, or a couple anchors? Ahem... *Hboy43*
> 
> We did trips up Georgian bay and along Lake Ontario. The nice thing about a small boat is that you can still transit the Trent Canal, and get into some pretty nice anchorages.


Sure, send a list and location in PM.

Did you never get to the North Channel? Many consider it the best sailing in North American. We have gone with the Trailer Sailors the last 2 seasons in our Sandpiper. Biggest guy in the smallest boat LOL. I would have been pretty nervous sailing such big water in such a small boat without the gang backing me up. Now after 2 seasons I'd have the confidence to go without the support structure.

Not sure how I feel about transiting canals. I like to sail, motor not so much. Trent Severn, well I can trailer for less cost than locking fees etc. I think maybe Erie canal to Hudson river then NYC might be more fun and more sailable.

I'd really like to do Lake Superior. I think the Tanzer really well set up could be safe enough. I drove to Thunder Bay a few years back with my Aunt and Uncle and the whole way there along Superior I was thinking "I want to sail here".

Hboy43


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## Mukhang pera (Feb 26, 2016)

Eder said:


> It's nice never to be in a rush and we have made many friends along the way that require visiting and free Scotch lol.


Sounds like a good route. If you pass this way, I might part with a dram or two of a decent single malt!


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## Prospector (Jul 25, 2014)

hboy43 said:


> Sure, send a list and location in PM.
> 
> Did you never get to the North Channel? Many consider it the best sailing in North American. We have gone with the Trailer Sailors the last 2 seasons in our Sandpiper. Biggest guy in the smallest boat LOL. I would have been pretty nervous sailing such big water in such a small boat without the gang backing me up. Now after 2 seasons I'd have the confidence to go without the support structure.
> 
> ...


We were headed there when everything fell apart. If we've crossed paths on the water or online, then this will out me... here's our Georgian Bay story.

Let me get some photos of my gear together and I'll PM you. We may be able to meet up or something - anchors and biminis don't ship well.


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

Anchors ship well...I bought a 40kg Rocna anchor last year from Halifax...the chandlery shipped it free to Alberta for me. Was quite funny at the Redcliff post office...they had seen heavy tractor parts etc shipped before, but had no clue what my anchor was. (no Pst in Alberta makes this worthwhile....just a remnant of our Alberta advantage Notley hasn't skewered yet haha)

Mukhang...thanks for the offer,we may wash up in the area in late May.


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## sags (May 15, 2010)

Interesting story about the Georgian Bay trip, Prospector.

I spent a lot of time in the Pointe Au Baril area. I was never sailing though. We always had motor boats.

Been at the Parry Sound harbor many times as well, to watch the boats come in and have a fish dinner.

I considered moving to Parry Sound after retirement. It is a nice place.......on the water with all the amenities at hand.

But at the end of the day it is hard to leave family behind to do what we wanted.


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## steve41 (Apr 18, 2009)

Lemme get this straight.... people actually SAIL on lakes?


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## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

steve41 said:


> Lemme get this straight.... people actually SAIL on lakes?


Ah the Pacific Ocean wise guy.

Well Prospector there are two kinds of sailors, those that have hit bottom, and liars.

I terminated our NC cruise early last year when I cut it too fine and hit and got stuck on a rock. I do mean rock, probably only 8 inches in diameter, but enough to stop our all up weight of a bit over 2000 pounds. I got the idea of starting the engine to push us off. Well the boat wasn't floating was it, it was 4 or 6 inches high. So the prop was 4 or 6 inches high, high enough in fact to snag the floating line towing the tender.

Well who thought it was a good idea to eliminate shear pins from small outboards? I got the line out of the prop, and tried the motor. It ran, but sounded like crap. Turns out $700 of lower end gears plus labour valiantly saved $5 of polypropylene line from completely cutting though. Thanks for that.

We ended up sailing back to Little Current with another boat very kindly accompanying us, and towing us back into the marinas. Plural because we first went to Spanish to get hauled on the travel lift in order to gently strike the center board to get it unstuck. I could not get it unstuck in the water because there just wasn't any way to get enough force to move it. Another $200. I still need to repair the centre board, which I will do myself, but if I were paying for the work, probably another 2 or 3 hundred.

Maybe for the non sailors it is time to define sailboat cruising: "The art of boat repair in exotic locations."

Or BOAT. Not the common word among the non nautical. It is actually the acronym "Bring Out Another Thousand" (dollars).

Enough of the bad stuff, time for some good stories. I turn it over to the ocean guys, cuz I am just a lake sailor.

Hboy43


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## steve41 (Apr 18, 2009)

Maybe never having to worry about tides, makes lake sailors complacent.


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## Prospector (Jul 25, 2014)

You forgot the one about standing in a cold shower throwing $100 bills down the drain...


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## Eder (Feb 16, 2011)

Heres a couple of my favorite reads on sailing...maybe others will enjoy as well

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/3...e-anything-about-sailing-around-world-159669/

http://www.bumfuzzle.com/2003/09/01/septemberoctober-2003/

Both were inspirations to our buying a sailboat and starting a new chapter in life.


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

steve41 said:


> Maybe never having to worry about tides, makes lake sailors complacent.


The Great Lakes do have tides, but unlike 0cean tides, they are unpredictable. There is also a large change in water depth from Spring to Fall which on occasion I have failed to consider


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## agent99 (Sep 11, 2013)

Eder said:


> Heres a couple of my favorite reads on sailing...maybe others will enjoy as well
> 
> http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/3...e-anything-about-sailing-around-world-159669/
> 
> ...


That first link mentions Captain Ron. A great movie for those considering sailing into the sunset  http://putlocker.is/watch-captain-ron-online-free-putlocker.html


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## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

Some pics. 

First is a sunset on Bay of Quinte looking aft over the solar panel on the Sandpiper 565 (19 foot) boat. September 2014









Also Sandpiper 565 Docked at Phinney's Point Ottawa early morning September 2013. Spidey joined me for an afternoon sail one day on this trip and kindly bought dinner at the Nepean Sailing Club afterwards.









A little cove on Bark Lake, summer 2014, about 50 km from my house. Our boat and two others anchored over night inside there. This is my favorite large (say 8 or more km long) inland lake of the 5 or 6 within 100km of my house (4 of which I have sailed on).









Our sailing companions running on Bark Lake.









The reluctant 1st Mate. Always abandon's ship at the first opportunity. Can't convince her to pee in the cockpit. "I know what you are telling me, but it is just is not right".


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## hboy43 (May 10, 2009)

Bay of Quinte fall 2014. I believe the shot is looking west at the highway 62 bridge in Belleville from about 5 miles away.








Going by Deseronto. I continued on motoring up the Napanee River to Napanee where there is a nice public dock for $10/night.








A view of much of the workings of the boat. The black object near the tiller is steering the boat while I am standing on the cabin top looking back.








At the public launch in Belleville. I got back on a September Friday about 11AM in 25 to 30 knot winds. Glad I did, because by the afternoon, the boat was going up and down at the dock like a cork. Another excursion cut short. My Wife came with the trailer to pick me up the Saturday instead of the Sunday as planned. I was stunned that guys in small aluminum fishing boats were going out into these conditions.








hboy43


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## Moneytoo (Mar 26, 2014)

I never get tired of Toronto skyline view from the lake:









But I hear when the boat owner posted their kite photos one of the Americans commented, "Omg look what Canadians are wearing when sailing in June!" - and they didn't even see me in winter parka lol But it is freezing off the shore...









Still loved it - my first sail this summer, hopefully will be able to go a few more times..


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## hboy54 (Sep 16, 2016)

So Eder, how is the sailing going in Mexico? At least I think that is where you are these days.

If I am feeling better by Sunday, we are going to take in the Toronto Boat show after skipping a year or two.

My boat project right now is assembling 4 Sailrite sail kits for the little Sandpiper 565: 100, 70, and 40% hank on jibs and a new mainsail. I bought these kits 2 seasons ago, then got distracted by the Tanzer 22. 

I'll likely order some Tanzer kits next year as I have a full set of blown out sails there. Well maybe the storm jib isn't blown out but the other 3 are about 40 years old and baggy as hell. No hurry as I can't beat anyhow until I get the centreboard unstuck, which is Tanzer job #1 for the spring.

We are going to try to hit the Trailer Sailors North Channel cruise with the Sandpiper this year after taking a year off. It will be nice to have some sails to choose from as the 120% furling Genoa does not reef and is the right sail for the conditions only about 1/3 of the time.

The big adventure last season was Hamilton and back, around PEC on the way down, returned to Belleville through the Murray canal. Made Newcastle to Port Credit that glorious day when it was blowing like stink from the east. Most of the day was with reefed main only. Two metre waves, good times.

hboy54


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