Wireless Web Programmable Thermostats and Switches - Page 3
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Thread: Wireless Web Programmable Thermostats and Switches

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by m3s View Post
    The Sinopé system is encrypted like secure WiFi and online banking. If some teenage hacker can crack SSL they might as well rob banks instead. This is a real concern for some other systems though.. Anyone can trigger a typical garage door with a simple transmitter yet many Canadians leave valuables in their garage and don't lock the front door. Doesn't seem to be a major problem?
    Many devices have exploits that hackers can use to gain access, they don't need to break SSL encryption. Did you find out if their system uses external servers or do you just access the web module you purchase from them?

    BTW, most (all?) newer garage doors have rolling digital codes transmitted to protect unwanted opening, much more than a simple transmitter needed and they have to "hack it" in proximity to your garage to test access. External webservers or internet connected devices can be hacked from virtually anywhere on the planet, 24 hours a day. Just look at all the "secure data" breaches large companies have had lately and the hackers can be in countries that don't/won't prosecute even if they could be found.

    Quote Originally Posted by m3s View Post
    I set up the house so I can leave at a moments notice, unplug and few things and flip a few circuit breakers, and the neighbours teenager takes care of the rest. The more things I can control online the better. I like that the Sinopé system can send email alerts, and I can remotely monitor usage and turn the heat back up on the way home.
    Convenience is a big plus with a system like this.


  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by brad View Post
    Not if it you heat with electricity and it can play a role in helping to avoid the expense of building new power plants (or entering into new contracts with outside providers). Programmable thermostats save a typical household about $180/year in energy costs. Multiply that by 1,000 households and you've saved $180,000. Translate that into kWh saved per year and it becomes worth it: energy efficiency is always the cheapest option when you're worried about meeting electricity demand.
    Yes, I understand all that and it's fine for programmable thermostats for which we've had rebates in the 10$ range (per thermostat) around here if I recall correctly. You can find them for about 30-40$ each. I'm all for more efficient lighting, water heaters, etc.

    But you don't need a "smart" thermostat to conserve energy. Nor a 150$ rebate. It's luxury. It's a bit like "plain LED bulb" vs "wifi enabled color changing LED bulb". The former saves energy. The later is a gadget for rich people to play with and should not have targeted incentives over what a basic LED bulb has.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by off.by.10 View Post
    Yes, I understand all that and it's fine for programmable thermostats for which we've had rebates in the 10$ range (per thermostat) around here if I recall correctly. You can find them for about 30-40$ each. I'm all for more efficient lighting, water heaters, etc.

    But you don't need a "smart" thermostat to conserve energy.
    The reality, though, is that many people with programmable thermostats find them too difficult to use, so they don't end up saving much energy with them. Most programmable thermostats are a lot harder to set up than a VCR or TV remote; remember how many people never set the clocks on their VCRs because it was too hard to figure out, even with the manual? And maybe they couldn't even find the manual.

    The problem isn't that the thermostat in itself is a major challenge (most programmable thermostats have ridiculously bad user interfaces, though), but that you have to think of it in the context of people's lives: a programmable thermostat is one of maybe 15 devices they have to learn how to use: their phone, their computer, features in their car, their washer, dryer, televisions, and on and on. If it's not easy to use, or you have to read a manual and refer to it next time you want to change a setting, that's too hard for most people. This isn't just some conjecture on my part, it's based on actual studies; see http://www.energystar.gov/ia/partner...t-Comments.pdf for example, which found that only about 3 percent of 400 people with programmable thermostats in a Florida study programmed them correctly. Lots of them ended up using MORE energy with a programmable thermostat.

    Smart thermostats work better because they require little work on the part of the user. There's almost nothing to learn.

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  5. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by brad View Post
    This isn't just some conjecture on my part, it's based on actual studies; see http://www.energystar.gov/ia/partner...t-Comments.pdf for example, which found that only about 3 percent of 400 people with programmable thermostats in a Florida study programmed them correctly. Lots of them ended up using MORE energy with a programmable thermostat.
    I can see that. They aren't easy to set up efficiently. If you have 8 thermostats like in Quebec and you don't sync them up properly, it probably doesn't save any power to have some thermostats working alone if they aren't properly synced etc. There's also the question of maintaining a temp vs the energy spent adjusting it.. I'll be toying with it this winter. Quebec is one thing, but the energy costs in Ontario are at least double, and rising.
    amat victoria curam

  6. #25
    Senior Member m3s's Avatar
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    This is more drastic than I expected. There are several things I can still toy around with, but this is an example of how a timer might not necessarily reduce much.



    It was about -8 outside when the heat went off for the night. It looks like it took nearly as much power to stabilize again, 10% savings at best here for a 10 hour night.
    amat victoria curam

  7. #26
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    I installed a Honeywell Wifi tstat at my winterized cabin so I can see the temperature when I'm not there, turn it up when we plan to go, and I get a notification if the temperature drops below a preset value. But a wifi one for the house - is just so I don't have to get up to turn it up or down because I'm lazy. (Both places use a Natural Gas furnace). I like the Honeywell and is pretty easy to set up I think.

  8. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by m3s View Post
    It was about -8 outside when the heat went off for the night. It looks like it took nearly as much power to stabilize again, 10% savings at best here for a 10 hour night.
    Do you have a chart leaving the temperature fixed for comparison?

    Also knowing the temperature for each hour would help.

  9. #28
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    8 thermostats in a house?

    Can someone explain this? Are we talking 8 separate zones on your,furnace?

    As for the outside lights, I have a levitron switch from Home Depot. 40 bucks I think. It goes on at sundown, and off at sunrise. It even adjusts for,day
    Ightmsavings. You input your longitude and latitude and away you go

  10. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by praire_guy View Post
    8 thermostats in a house?

    Can someone explain this? Are we talking 8 separate zones on your,furnace?
    What's a furnace?

    Here in Québec, most people heat with electricity (because it's so cheap), and most people heat with baseboard heaters, one thermostat in every room or living space.

  11. #30
    Senior Member m3s's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cainvest View Post
    Do you have a chart leaving the temperature fixed for comparison?

    Also knowing the temperature for each hour would help.
    I agree but no it doesn't show temps. That would be easy enough to implement, and maybe I could ask them to, but what is probably more important for now is that they keep the interface reliable, responsive and easy to use.

    The temps have dropped even more, but the pattern is still about the same. It costs +3 hours to heat a room back up. I'm seeing a 40% savings if you turn the heat off in a room for 16hrs. That's not really possible in all rooms though.


    amat victoria curam

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