Home Capital Group (HCG)
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Thread: Home Capital Group (HCG)

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\r\n hboy54\r\n \r\n
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\r\n Quote Originally Posted by hboy54\r\n View Post\r\n
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I am in luck as my financial weighting is 29% and the house is immaterial.
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Actually my financial weighting is at 28% after doubling my HCG yesterday.
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\r\nNow there is approximately zero HISA deposits left, so the panic will now proceed at the rate that GICs come off. As the rate of panic is now no longer determined by the folks doing the panicking, but rather the contractual nature of the GICs, perhaps things will cool down a bit in a few weeks or months, providing an opportunity for something interesting to develop to the upside.
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    \r\n Financial institutions have failed in Canada, notably in the 1980s and 1990s.
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    \nThis is the CDIC insured list that failed. It doesn\'t include lenders who weren\'t covered by CDIC insurance.
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    \nI posted elsewhere that Canada Trust was in some difficulty in the 1980s. A lot of trust companies were in trouble around that time. Interest rates were high and they were paying out high returns on deposits while few people were looking for a mortgage.
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    \nSince its creation by Parliament in 1967, CDIC has handled 43 bank failures, affecting more than 2 million depositors. No one has lost a single dollar of insured deposits.
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    \nMember Institution - Year of Failure
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    \nSecurity Home Mortgage Corporation 1996
    \nNAL Mortgage Company 1995
    \nNorth American Trust Company 1995
    \nIncome Trust Company 1995
    \nMonarch Trust Company 1994
    \nConfederation Trust Company 1994
    \nPrenor Trust Company of Canada 1993
    \nDominion Trust Company 1993
    \nFirst City Mortgage Company 1992
    \nFirst City Trust Company 1992
    \nCentral Guaranty Trust Company 1992
    \nCentral Guaranty Mortgage Corporation 1992
    \nShoppers Trust Company 1992
    \nStandard Trust Company 1991
    \nStandard Loan Company 1991
    \nSaskatchewan Trust Company 1991
    \nBank of Credit and Commerce Canada 1991
    \nSettlers Savings and Mortgage Corporation 1990
    \nFinancial Trust Company 1988
    \nPrincipal Savings & Trust Company 1987
    \nNorth West Trust Company 1987
    \nColumbia Trust Company 1986
    \nBank of British Columbia Mortgage Corporation 1986
    \nBank of British Columbia 1986
    \nWestern Capital Trust Company 1985
    \nPioneer Trust Company 1985
    \nNorthland Bank 1985
    \nLondon Loan Limited 1985
    \nContinental Trust Company 1985
    \nCanadian Commercial Bank 1985
    \nCCB Mortgage Investment Corporation 1985
    \nNorthguard Mortgage Corporation 1984
    \nSeaway Trust Company 1983
    \nSeaway Mortgage Corporation 1983
    \nGreymac Trust Company 1983
    \nGreymac Mortgage Corporation 1983
    \nFidelity Trust Company 1983
    \nCrown Trust Company 1983
    \nAMIC Mortgage Investment Corporation 1983
    \nDistrict Trust Company 1982
    \nAstra Trust Company 1980
    \nSecurity Trust Company Limited 1972
    \nCommonwealth Trust Company 1970
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    \r\n \r\n Last edited by sags; 2017-05-02 at 10:55 AM.\r\n \r\n \r\n
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    Someone planted a tree a long time ago so I can sit in the shade.
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    \r\n Great West Life announced layoffs of 1500 people a few days ago. They took over the London Life insurance company and their layoffs will affect 450 people in London alone. Other financial institutions have announced layoffs and cutbacks. The local GM CAMI plant has been going full tilt for a couple of years and they recently announced future layoffs. Other places have announced layoffs. Retail is having a tough time.
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    \nOne wonders how strong our economy actually is and how a real estate downturn would affect it.
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    \nThere are 48,000 real estate agents in Toronto. How many sold a home in the last 6 months ?
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    \nIt all doesn\'t bode well for alternative types of lenders. They would be among the first casualties.\r\n
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    \r\n \r\n Last edited by sags; 2017-05-02 at 11:02 AM.\r\n \r\n \r\n
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    Someone planted a tree a long time ago so I can sit in the shade.
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by sags\r\n View Post\r\n
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    Financial institutions have failed in Canada, notably in the 1980s and 1990s.
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    Not sure what the point is.
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by sags\r\n View Post\r\n
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    ... I posted elsewhere that Canada Trust was in some difficulty in the 1980s. A lot of trust companies were in trouble around that time.
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    The other trusts ... sure.
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    \nCT OTOH, I don\'t recall anything at the time and have found nothing beyond British American Tabacco that controlled Imasco decided to take Imasco private with no desire to keep CT that Imasco controlled.
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    \nThere\'s also the 1923 Home Bank failure where the Finance Minister\'s lack of reaction to a letter detailing a host of issues meant depositors lost what looks like half their savings and could have lost 85% of their savings.
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    \nCheers\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by Eclectic12\r\n View Post\r\n
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    I am wondering if it was restriction on the investment or a glitch in the integration.
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    \r\nAs a CT customer with money on deposit, I had no issues and don\'t recall any concerns (beyond consolidation, fears that CT would end up with Big 5 banker\'s hours instead of the extended hours people had chosen them for etc.).
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    \r\nCheers
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    If I remember correctly at first BofM wanted to merge with RY and CIBC with TD. Paul Martin would not allow. (He probably saved the big 5 from themselves. I do not know what would happen in 2006-2008.) As a consolation price he allowed all of them to swallow Trusts. Late 90\'s - very early 2000\'s.
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    \r\nI loved CT 8am to 8pm hours. And I still have a radio I got for opening the account I am using today (now it requires k$2 balance to be a no-fee).\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by sags\r\n View Post\r\n
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    She remembers when she had money in Canada Trust and they were in trouble. She had to wait to get it out.
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    That doesn\'t ring a bell at all with me. I banked with CT (now TD) since the late seventies and I cannot recall any point where they were in even the smallest whiff of trouble. As a customer, the customer service certainly took a major hit during/after the TD takeover, but as an institution I do not believe they were anything other than wholly and entirely sound and profitable.\r\n
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    \r\n Generally I\'d like to know how it\'s working. Can Oaken/Home trust declare bankruptcy on the spot...let\'s say May 1 and I won\'t be able totake out money from there?\r\n
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    \r\n ^ If you\'re uncomfortable with the thought of Oaken/Home Trust closing doors soon, then consider taking your money out then. But if you\'re stuck with a fixed GIC term, then you would have no choice but to get in inline like every other depositor.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by gibor365\r\n View Post\r\n
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    Generally I\'d like to know how it\'s working. Can Oaken/Home trust declare bankruptcy on the spot...let\'s say May 1 and I won\'t be able totake out money from there?
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    Highly doubtful a company fold and shut down everything on the spot. I\'d be surprised if they didn\'t give shareholders or anyone who bank with them advance warning. Maybe you (or someone) should contact CDIC and ask what their process is and how soon deposit holders get their payments back if HCG were to go under.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by sags\r\n View Post\r\n
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    I guess this would qualify as a historic "run on the bank"............from $2 billion savings account deposits to $814 million.
    \nMy wife has a small amount in GICs there. She remembers when she had money in Canada Trust and they were in trouble. She had to wait to get it out. ...
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    When was this?
    \n
    \nI only became a TD bank customer because of the buyout when British American Tobacco decided to take Imasco private. BAT had no interest in banking assets, had long standing offers made to Imasco for CT Financial from CIBC but accepted the TD offer instead.
    \n
    \nI can recall some hiccups for the integration process but never had an issue getting to my money or any reports of financial distress.
    \n
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    \nCheers\r\n
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    \r\n \r\n Last edited by Eclectic12; 2017-04-27 at 02:21 PM.\r\n \r\n \r\n
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    \r\n Royal Trust anyone? \r\n
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    \r\n Cohodes is a short seller who has been very vocal with criticisms of Home Capital Group and especially their poor underwriting standards
    \nhttp://www.bnn.ca/cohodes-vs-home-ca...laims-1.593533
    \n
    \nThankfully for all of us, this researcher has helped with market price discovery. The market has also rewarded him handsomely for his fundamental research with about 60% profit short the stock since 2014.
    \n
    \nThe HCG scandal is similar to US problems with ninja loans and falsification
    \n
    \nIn the US, just a handful of years ago we saw that poor lending standards and fraud go hand in hand. Management encourages reckless behaviour and covers it up, because the reckless lending boosts short term profits and boosts compensation, especially bonuses for management and executives. I\'m sure the same thing is happening in Canada, though I have no proof.\r\n
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    \r\n \r\n Last edited by james4beach; 2017-04-20 at 11:54 AM.\r\n \r\n \r\n
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    \r\n Funny how the stocks that have done the worse in the past year or so are all Jason Donville\'s staple stocks (eg., HCG, VRX, CXR). Maybe people should sell Constellation Software before the Donville effect strikes again!\r\n
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    \r\n Someone considered VRX a staple stock? omg\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by james4beach\r\n View Post\r\n
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    Someone considered VRX a staple stock? omg
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    VRX is a typical bullshit stock , good think they don\'t pay dividends or I might\'ve buy them before crush \r\n
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    \r\n The Donville connection is an interesting one. CSU trades at 20 times book and 50 times earnings. Yes, something bad could easily happen there. Especially in a recession when spending on software by business will drop faster than HCG\'s funding sources.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by sags\r\n View Post\r\n
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    Bank runs are so civilized these days, at least in Canada.
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    \r\nOnline banks don\'t even have a place for the angry crowds to congregate and storm.
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    I, for one, am standing in my living room shaking my fist angrily at my Wi-fi router.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by Davis\r\n View Post\r\n
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    I, for one, am standing in my living room shaking my fist angrily at my Wi-fi router.
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    \r\n Ok so HCG has gone, I\'m wondering about Equitable Bank. Let\'s say that the mortgages of Equitable were sound, no fraud committed as in the case of HCG, then I suppose we have two scenarios:
    \na) A bank run does not occur (or not in such a large scale to have large impact on liquidity)
    \nb) A bank run does occur due to fear.
    \n
    \nSo in a) I would suppose EQ would be fine, correct? If a) is the case that plays out, then right now EQB would be a buying opportunity right?
    \nIf b) occurs, then Equitable Bank would suffer the same fate as HCG, even though it did nothing wrong?
    \n
    \nIs that a fair summary of the situation for EQ? Long shot here: Does anyone have (or know where to get) information of the mortgages that Equitable Bank lent out? (Income, House Prices, Loan to Value). Like if we could just see the numbers and the locations of these mortgages (Vancouver, Calgary vs a more stable location such as Ottawa) we would have a better sense of the situation rather than blindly guessing on this forum.
    \n
    \nEDIT: so I looked through Marc Cohodes Twitter. Hard for a noob like me to understand the bigger picture but I guess summary on the liquidity can be found here: https://twitter.com/AlderLaneeggs/st...827776/photo/1.
    \n
    \nHe\'s pointing out that 1 year deposits to total liquidity ratio is 6.3x. Meaning (correct me if I\'m wrong) if there is a bank run, EQ has only 1/6 of the money to cover it.
    \n
    \nHmm... Looks like the big fish has left long ago: https://twitter.com/Mr_Silbergleit/s...62765950545921
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    \nI\'m under the $100k CDIC in EQ Bank, but to save myself the trouble dealing with CDIC, I\'ll be making call to Tangerine to ask for promo interest rate and transferring out tomorrow. Jeez thanks for the thread guys, I honestly didn\'t know about this.\r\n
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    \r\n This discussion should be in an Equitable Group thread..... But to respond, what Marc is saying is that IF all $6+ billion of the 1 year deposits were to NOT renew (and be withdrawn) over the course of the next year, EQB has only $1 Billion of liquidity to fund all those withdrawals. A severe shortage in liquidity in event of a run.
    \n
    \nWhat is not on the chart is the amount of <1 year (left in term) mortgages out there that EQB could decide not to renew to provide additional liquidity. Granted recalling all those mortgages may not be easy, but it is a little biased to provide one part of the answer.
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    \nBanking institutions cannot afford to have \'bad\' publicity/behaviour/shortcomings because once the tide turns, it can get ugly quickly.\r\n
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    \r\n I am. $100K plus change.
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    \r\nActually impressed with the management. Not to say the company won\'t be hurt -or that I know anything beyond common knowledge - but Equitable seems to be well managed.\r\n
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    \r\n What are you arguing about? Nothing is 100% safe. The only way to not have your assets exposed to any risk is to not have any assets. Anything could be stolen, eroded by inflation, taxed by future governments or disappear in a crash or war.
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    \r\nSo, let\'s use a little common sense, diversify and relax and all will be well.\r\n
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    \r\n We HISA\'s with EQ bank. We are in the process of pulling most of it out. Not because of Home issue but because we need the money for a real estate transaction.
    \n
    \nNot the least bit worried about the remainder. It is well under CDIC limits. Don\'t understand the comment about CDIC not honouring it\'s commitments because of fraud. I have to wonder what on what basis a comment like this is made. We have HISA accounts with several of the eBanks but keep those deposits within CDIC insurance limits.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by mordko\r\n View Post\r\n
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    What are you arguing about? Nothing is 100% safe. The only way to not have your assets exposed to any risk is to not have any assets. Anything could be stolen, eroded by inflation, taxed by future governments or disappear in a crash or war.
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    \nSo, let\'s use a little common sense, diversify and relax and all will be well.
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    ... true including earth being hit by an asteroid tomorrow or Trump trigger happy with that red button.\r\n
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    Everyone should be respected as an individual, but no one idolized.-A. Einstein
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by mordko\r\n View Post\r\n
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    What are you arguing about? Nothing is 100% safe. The only way to not have your assets exposed to any risk is to not have any assets. Anything could be stolen, eroded by inflation, taxed by future governments or disappear in a crash or war.
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    \r\nSo, let\'s use a little common sense, diversify and relax and all will be well.
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    Yup... diversity is key.
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    \r\nLike I\'ve said numerous times before, I am not concerned about any CDIC insured amounts. The CDIC will make good on its guarantee.\r\n
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    \r\n The math seems to be working against HCG. They might well survive or someone may save them but my guess is that the probability is less than 50%. What\'s interesting is that the problem is old and has been known but its only circa April 19th that the regulator decided to do something about it.
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    \r\nAll the other Canadian financial institutions are as safe as any company can be. People are looking for patterns; thats how we are wired. They are finding patterns even if there aren\'t any. Now the crowd is thinking that Canada 2017 is USA 2007. Well, we did have the crazy uptick in house prices looking very much like a bubble. Yes the prices may fall.
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    \r\nSo what? What about the rest of it? Do we have huge numbers of properties with zero LTV? Do we have triple A "bonds" made up entirely of bad mortgages? Are the interest rates going up? Is it easy for Canadians to walk away from underwater mortgages?
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    \r\nIf the answer to the above is "no" (which it is) then we have no condition for massive failures beyond one specific case of fraud. The rest is an emotional reaction to a presumed pattern which has no basis in reality.\r\n
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    \r\n ^ Isn\'t one case of fraud sufficient to shake the confidence of the lending systems? Confidence (or lack thereof here), fear and perception are all real as emotionally responsive as they can be. And to sag\'s earlier post(s) - the keyword is "contagion" in the financial sector.\r\n
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    Everyone should be respected as an individual, but no one idolized.-A. Einstein
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    \r\n Nobody knows how systemic the fraud is throughout the financial system.
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    \nMortgage applications are approved automatically. Home appraisals are issued automatically based on postal codes.
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    \nThere is an element of trust baked into an automated system and when random audits reveal problems it is a warning sign.
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    \nIt isn\'t the loss of money that is most important. It is the loss of trust.\r\n
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    Someone planted a tree a long time ago so I can sit in the shade.
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by mordko\r\n View Post\r\n
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    ... What\'s interesting is that the problem is old and has been known but its only circa April 19th that the regulator decided to do something about it.
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    I am not sure we know what the regulators have been doing or when they became active.
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    \r\nCanadian Commercial Bank failed around Labour Day 1985 where the investigation later indicated that the Feds working with the Big 5 arranged a special liquidity facility in 1983.
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    \r\nCheers\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by Eclectic12\r\n View Post\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by mordko\r\n \r\n
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    What\'s interesting is that the problem is old and has been known but its only circa April 19th that the regulator decided to do something about it.
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    I am not sure we know what the regulators have been doing or when they became active.
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    Actually, they served Home with a preliminary enforcement notice back in February (which Home made public); April was when the official allegations were filed. What the actual OSC timeline in 2016 was I don\'t know, but between being a regulatory agency and having to line everything up to survive the platoons of expensive lawyers the defendants will employ, these wheels probably grind slowly.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by NorthernRaven\r\n View Post\r\n
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    Actually, they served Home with a preliminary enforcement notice back in February (which Home made public); April was when the official allegations were filed. What the actual OSC timeline in 2016 was I don\'t know ...
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    OSC asked for more info as part of the second-quarter earnings release in July 2015 so there is clearly a lot longer time line than this year plus a bit of last year.
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    \nhttp://www.theglobeandmail.com/real-...ticle25776197/
    \nhttp://business.financialpost.com/in...lsified-income
    \n
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    \nCheers\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by Beaver101\r\n View Post\r\n
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    ^ Isn\'t one case of fraud sufficient to shake the confidence of the lending systems? Confidence (or lack thereof here), fear and perception are all real as emotionally responsive as they can be. And to sag\'s earlier post(s) - the keyword is "contagion" in the financial sector.
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    That\'s true but at some point perceptioon ends and the reality takes over. And the reality is that:
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    \r\n- Nothing else has been uncovered.
    \r\n- HCG is a very minor player which operated in a specialized area.
    \r\n- Canadian financial institutions have a large moat and tremendous cash piles.
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    \r\nHypothetically - yes, anything can happen. On the balance of probabilities the risk of a "chain event" is very low.\r\n
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    \r\n And EQ is cocky this morning. Quote from BNN
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    \r\n \r\n CEO Andrew Moor told us that he\'s not interested buying loans from Home Capital, whose stock has slid after the Ontario Securities Commission said investors were misled on fraudulent loans. "We believe that we\'ve got really strong internal controls and a strong loan book," Moor said. "The analogy I\'d make is that we are a Volvo and [Home Capital] is a Pinto. I have incredible confidence in our loan book loan-by-loan because I know how they were processed and created."\r\n \r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by mordko\r\n View Post\r\n
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    Hypothetically - yes, anything can happen.
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    ... I wouldn\'t call it \'hypothetically\' then when it does happen.
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    \r\n \r\n On the balance of probabilities the risk of a "chain event" is very low. \r\n \r\n
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    ... and how sure are you on that?\r\n
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    Everyone should be respected as an individual, but no one idolized.-A. Einstein
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by Beaver101\r\n View Post\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by mordko\r\n View Post\r\n
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    That\'s true but at some point perceptioon ends and the reality takes over ... On the balance of probabilities the risk of a "chain event" is very low.
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    ... and how sure are you on that?
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    While nothing is written in stone, so far - one lender is reporting struggles versus previous years where as many as five or six went under *in the same year*. There\'s also seven consecutive years of failures that was dealt with.
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    \r\nCheers\r\n
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    \r\n If Home goes down, and I suspect that it will, the big losers will be the shareholders, bondholders, and of course the employees. Hopefully few depostiors an GIS holders have exceeded the CDIC parameters.
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    \r\nOn a smaller scale, Walton International went down on Saturday for a court re-org. Alberta based international land developer. My understanding is that they issued lots of notes to investors under the exempt banner. Suspect that many of those folks will be taking a haircut. They had apparently been loosing money for the past 5 years.\r\n
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    \r\n Well done OSC! Thry are harming investors they suppose to protect.
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    \r\nI think HCG will br profitable for years to come without this allegation.
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by namelessone\r\n View Post\r\n
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    Well done OSC! Thry are harming investors they suppose to protect.
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    \nI think HCG will br profitable for years to come without this allegation.
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    \nhttp://www.financialpost.com/m/wp/fp...-it-was-pushed
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    ... so you think it is the OSC\'s fault for pursuing the shady practices being done in the industry? Hush hush. Perhaps OSC is trying to use HCG as an example for the rest of the industry ... it does have bite and not just bark.\r\n
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    Everyone should be respected as an individual, but no one idolized.-A. Einstein
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    \r\n \r\n \r\n\r\n\r\n \r\n \r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n I\'m not worried about a series of bank failures.
    \n
    \nWhat I\'m more worried about is the economic outlook. Real estate market is a huge part of the Canadian economy ... between the financial sector, loan businesses, real estate services and construction, quite a bit of the GDP is dependent on real estate.
    \n
    \nIf a country wide real estate slowdown happens, we\'re going to see a big uptick in unemployment, a drop in GDP, layoffs at many companies, higher loan defaults, and generally worse credit conditions. That in turn will lead to reduced consumer spending and a general slowdown in everything. Plus, worse retirement outlooks.
    \n
    \nCanadians have enjoyed the many benefits of a tremendous real estate bull market. It\'s come to be accepted as the norm, but the flip side -' + '- a real estate bear market -' + '- will cause lots of damage.\r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n\r\n \r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n \r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n -' + '->\r\n
    \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n Reply With Quote Reply With Quote \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n\r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n\r\n \r\n \r\n\r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n -' + '->\r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n
    \r\n
  • \r\n'; // next/previous post info pn[204066] = "1578506,204068"; pn[0] = ",204066"; pn[204068] = "204066,204069"; pn[204069] = "204068,204073"; pn[204073] = "204069,204130"; pn[204130] = "204073,204134"; pn[204134] = "204130,1570474"; pn[1570474] = "204134,221982"; pn[221982] = "1570474,221985"; pn[221985] = "221982,222009"; pn[222009] = "221985,222041"; pn[222041] = "222009,222135"; pn[222135] = "222041,224888"; pn[224888] = "222135,306586"; pn[306586] = "224888,317321"; pn[317321] = "306586,333761"; pn[333761] = "317321,427569"; pn[427569] = "333761,427745"; pn[427745] = "427569,428081"; pn[428081] = "427745,428393"; pn[428393] = "428081,428545"; pn[428545] = "428393,428577"; pn[428577] = "428545,428857"; pn[428857] = "428577,428937"; pn[428937] = "428857,506329"; pn[506329] = "428937,506665"; pn[506665] = "506329,509689"; pn[509689] = "506665,565170"; pn[565170] = "509689,1569834"; pn[1569834] = "565170,1569842"; pn[1569842] = "1569834,1570298"; pn[1570298] = "1569842,1570482"; pn[1570482] = "1570298,804090"; pn[804090] = "1570482,804418"; pn[804418] = "804090,804434"; pn[804434] = "804418,804442"; pn[804442] = "804434,804554"; pn[804554] = "804442,814473"; pn[814473] = "804554,814529"; pn[814529] = "814473,815969"; pn[815969] = "814529,816593"; pn[816593] = "815969,817561"; pn[817561] = "816593,817617"; pn[817617] = "817561,817809"; pn[817809] = "817617,817905"; pn[817905] = "817809,818017"; pn[818017] = "817905,818714"; pn[818714] = "818017,818833"; pn[818833] = "818714,819105"; pn[819105] = "818833,819361"; pn[819361] = "819105,819457"; pn[819457] = "819361,819481"; pn[819481] = "819457,819489"; pn[819489] = "819481,819505"; pn[819505] = "819489,823793"; pn[823793] = "819505,824081"; pn[824081] = "823793,824097"; pn[824097] = "824081,848489"; pn[848489] = "824097,848553"; pn[848553] = "848489,852617"; pn[852617] = "848553,853137"; pn[853137] = "852617,924866"; pn[924866] = "853137,924898"; pn[924898] = "924866,1011466"; pn[1011466] = "924898,1015410"; pn[1015410] = "1011466,1016090"; pn[1016090] = "1015410,1016842"; pn[1016842] = "1016090,1017890"; pn[1017890] = "1016842,1017898"; pn[1017898] = "1017890,1040074"; pn[1040074] = "1017898,817833"; pn[817833] = "1040074,817529"; pn[817529] = "817833,1053513"; pn[1053513] = "817529,1053625"; pn[1053625] = "1053513,1054617"; pn[1054617] = "1053625,1056017"; pn[1056017] = "1054617,1118706"; pn[1118706] = "1056017,1119065"; pn[1119065] = "1118706,1125137"; pn[1125137] = "1119065,1323938"; pn[1323938] = "1125137,1332762"; pn[1332762] = "1323938,1332882"; pn[1332882] = "1332762,1338082"; pn[1338082] = "1332882,1467210"; pn[1467210] = "1338082,1467290"; pn[1467290] = "1467210,1524794"; pn[1524794] = "1467290,1525850"; pn[1525850] = "1524794,1555866"; pn[1555866] = "1525850,1555890"; pn[1555890] = "1555866,1556138"; pn[1556138] = "1555890,1556658"; pn[1556658] = "1556138,1556850"; pn[1556850] = "1556658,1556882"; pn[1556882] = "1556850,1556938"; pn[1556938] = "1556882,1557201"; pn[1557201] = "1556938,1557241"; pn[1557241] = "1557201,1557265"; pn[1557265] = "1557241,1559450"; pn[1559450] = "1557265,1559690"; pn[1559690] = "1559450,1559762"; pn[1559762] = "1559690,1559842"; pn[1559842] = "1559762,1559898"; pn[1559898] = "1559842,1559906"; pn[1559906] = "1559898,1559914"; pn[1559914] = "1559906,1559938"; pn[1559938] = "1559914,1559962"; pn[1559962] = "1559938,1559970"; pn[1559970] = "1559962,1559986"; pn[1559986] = "1559970,1561665"; pn[1561665] = "1559986,1562337"; pn[1562337] = "1561665,1562345"; pn[1562345] = "1562337,1565225"; pn[1565225] = "1562345,1565257"; pn[1565257] = "1565225,1565281"; pn[1565281] = "1565257,1565353"; pn[1565353] = "1565281,1565385"; pn[1565385] = "1565353,1565393"; pn[1565393] = "1565385,1565409"; pn[1565409] = "1565393,1565521"; pn[1565521] = "1565409,1565553"; pn[1565553] = "1565521,1565697"; pn[1565697] = "1565553,1565769"; pn[1565769] = "1565697,1566761"; pn[1566761] = "1565769,1566793"; pn[1566793] = "1566761,1566809"; pn[1566809] = "1566793,1566874"; pn[1566874] = "1566809,1566921"; pn[1566921] = "1566874,1565417"; pn[1565417] = "1566921,1565465"; pn[1565465] = "1565417,1565785"; pn[1565785] = "1565465,1565801"; pn[1565801] = "1565785,1565825"; pn[1565825] = "1565801,1565873"; pn[1565873] = "1565825,1565881"; pn[1565881] = "1565873,1565905"; pn[1565905] = "1565881,1565913"; pn[1565913] = "1565905,1565937"; pn[1565937] = "1565913,1565969"; pn[1565969] = "1565937,1565977"; pn[1565977] = "1565969,1566017"; pn[1566017] = "1565977,1566177"; pn[1566177] = "1566017,1566225"; pn[1566225] = "1566177,1566249"; pn[1566249] = "1566225,1566257"; pn[1566257] = "1566249,1566321"; pn[1566321] = "1566257,1566329"; pn[1566329] = "1566321,1569370"; pn[1569370] = "1566329,1569418"; pn[1569418] = "1569370,1569586"; pn[1569586] = "1569418,1569434"; pn[1569434] = "1569586,1569626"; pn[1569626] = "1569434,1569650"; pn[1569650] = "1569626,1569458"; pn[1569458] = "1569650,1569490"; pn[1569490] = "1569458,1569514"; pn[1569514] = "1569490,1569538"; pn[1569538] = "1569514,1569578"; pn[1569578] = "1569538,1569618"; pn[1569618] = "1569578,1569634"; pn[1569634] = "1569618,1569658"; pn[1569658] = "1569634,1569666"; pn[1569666] = "1569658,1569610"; pn[1569610] = "1569666,1569714"; pn[1569714] = "1569610,1569722"; pn[1569722] = "1569714,1569850"; pn[1569850] = "1569722,1569746"; pn[1569746] = "1569850,1569754"; pn[1569754] = "1569746,1569826"; pn[1569826] = "1569754,1569602"; pn[1569602] = "1569826,1569770"; pn[1569770] = "1569602,1569786"; pn[1569786] = "1569770,1569810"; pn[1569810] = "1569786,1569858"; pn[1569858] = "1569810,1569914"; pn[1569914] = "1569858,1569930"; pn[1569930] = "1569914,1569946"; pn[1569946] = "1569930,1566025"; pn[1566025] = "1569946,1566073"; pn[1566073] = "1566025,1566201"; pn[1566201] = "1566073,1566089"; pn[1566089] = "1566201,1566105"; pn[1566105] = "1566089,1566185"; pn[1566185] = "1566105,1566217"; pn[1566217] = "1566185,1566473"; pn[1566473] = "1566217,1566521"; pn[1566521] = "1566473,1566537"; pn[1566537] = "1566521,1566593"; pn[1566593] = "1566537,1566625"; pn[1566625] = "1566593,1566633"; pn[1566633] = "1566625,1566866"; pn[1566866] = "1566633,1566617"; pn[1566617] = "1566866,1566705"; pn[1566705] = "1566617,1566209"; pn[1566209] = "1566705,1565945"; pn[1565945] = "1566209,1566729"; pn[1566729] = "1565945,1566737"; pn[1566737] = "1566729,1566745"; pn[1566745] = "1566737,1566753"; pn[1566753] = "1566745,1566769"; pn[1566769] = "1566753,1566777"; pn[1566777] = "1566769,1566785"; pn[1566785] = "1566777,1566850"; pn[1566850] = "1566785,1566890"; pn[1566890] = "1566850,1566906"; pn[1566906] = "1566890,1566993"; pn[1566993] = "1566906,1567025"; pn[1567025] = "1566993,1567121"; pn[1567121] = "1567025,1567177"; pn[1567177] = "1567121,1567241"; pn[1567241] = "1567177,1567273"; pn[1567273] = "1567241,1567281"; pn[1567281] = "1567273,1567321"; pn[1567321] = "1567281,1567353"; pn[1567353] = "1567321,1567385"; pn[1567385] = "1567353,1567409"; pn[1567409] = "1567385,1567585"; pn[1567585] = "1567409,1567601"; pn[1567601] = "1567585,1567633"; pn[1567633] = "1567601,1567657"; pn[1567657] = "1567633,1567689"; pn[1567689] = "1567657,1567705"; pn[1567705] = "1567689,1567713"; pn[1567713] = "1567705,1568361"; pn[1568361] = "1567713,1569970"; pn[1569970] = "1568361,1569994"; pn[1569994] = "1569970,1570010"; pn[1570010] = "1569994,1570066"; pn[1570066] = "1570010,1570082"; pn[1570082] = "1570066,1570130"; pn[1570130] = "1570082,1570154"; pn[1570154] = "1570130,1570178"; pn[1570178] = "1570154,1570306"; pn[1570306] = "1570178,1570402"; pn[1570402] = "1570306,1570434"; pn[1570434] = "1570402,1570506"; pn[1570506] = "1570434,1570930"; pn[1570930] = "1570506,1571090"; pn[1571090] = "1570930,1571106"; pn[1571106] = "1571090,1571170"; pn[1571170] = "1571106,1571250"; pn[1571250] = "1571170,1571282"; pn[1571282] = "1571250,1571298"; pn[1571298] = "1571282,1571306"; pn[1571306] = "1571298,1571338"; pn[1571338] = "1571306,1571610"; pn[1571610] = "1571338,1573010"; pn[1573010] = "1571610,1573058"; pn[1573058] = "1573010,1573090"; pn[1573090] = "1573058,1573162"; pn[1573162] = "1573090,1573194"; pn[1573194] = "1573162,1573362"; pn[1573362] = "1573194,1573378"; pn[1573378] = "1573362,1573426"; pn[1573426] = "1573378,1573450"; pn[1573450] = "1573426,1573458"; pn[1573458] = "1573450,1573498"; pn[1573498] = "1573458,1573546"; pn[1573546] = "1573498,1573650"; pn[1573650] = "1573546,1573586"; pn[1573586] = "1573650,1573658"; pn[1573658] = "1573586,1573946"; pn[1573946] = "1573658,1574010"; pn[1574010] = "1573946,1574050"; pn[1574050] = "1574010,1574130"; pn[1574130] = "1574050,1574154"; pn[1574154] = "1574130,1574194"; pn[1574194] = "1574154,1574210"; pn[1574210] = "1574194,1574226"; pn[1574226] = "1574210,1574410"; pn[1574410] = "1574226,1574450"; pn[1574450] = "1574410,1574466"; pn[1574466] = "1574450,1574490"; pn[1574490] = "1574466,1574506"; pn[1574506] = "1574490,1574610"; pn[1574610] = "1574506,1574626"; pn[1574626] = "1574610,1574738"; pn[1574738] = "1574626,1574746"; pn[1574746] = "1574738,1574762"; pn[1574762] = "1574746,1573722"; pn[1573722] = "1574762,1573778"; pn[1573778] = "1573722,1573794"; pn[1573794] = "1573778,1573802"; pn[1573802] = "1573794,1574146"; pn[1574146] = "1573802,1573562"; pn[1573562] = "1574146,1573666"; pn[1573666] = "1573562,1573282"; pn[1573282] = "1573666,1571442"; pn[1571442] = "1573282,1571450"; pn[1571450] = "1571442,1571506"; pn[1571506] = "1571450,1571546"; pn[1571546] = "1571506,1571562"; pn[1571562] = "1571546,1572106"; pn[1572106] = "1571562,1572154"; pn[1572154] = "1572106,1572170"; pn[1572170] = "1572154,1572194"; pn[1572194] = "1572170,1572330"; pn[1572330] = "1572194,1572338"; pn[1572338] = "1572330,1571842"; pn[1571842] = "1572338,1571890"; pn[1571890] = "1571842,1571914"; pn[1571914] = "1571890,1571946"; pn[1571946] = "1571914,1571986"; pn[1571986] = "1571946,1573002"; pn[1573002] = "1571986,1570114"; pn[1570114] = "1573002,1567745"; pn[1567745] = "1570114,1567809"; pn[1567809] = "1567745,1567729"; pn[1567729] = "1567809,1567753"; pn[1567753] = "1567729,1567761"; pn[1567761] = "1567753,1567769"; pn[1567769] = "1567761,1567777"; pn[1567777] = "1567769,1567841"; pn[1567841] = "1567777,1567849"; pn[1567849] = "1567841,1567865"; pn[1567865] = "1567849,1567889"; pn[1567889] = "1567865,1567921"; pn[1567921] = "1567889,1567937"; pn[1567937] = "1567921,1567945"; pn[1567945] = "1567937,1567961"; pn[1567961] = "1567945,1567977"; pn[1567977] = "1567961,1568001"; pn[1568001] = "1567977,1569506"; pn[1569506] = "1568001,1567985"; pn[1567985] = "1569506,1567993"; pn[1567993] = "1567985,1568009"; pn[1568009] = "1567993,1568025"; pn[1568025] = "1568009,1568041"; pn[1568041] = "1568025,1568057"; pn[1568057] = "1568041,1568097"; pn[1568097] = "1568057,1568113"; pn[1568113] = "1568097,1568161"; pn[1568161] = "1568113,1568169"; pn[1568169] = "1568161,1568193"; pn[1568193] = "1568169,1568233"; pn[1568233] = "1568193,1568249"; pn[1568249] = "1568233,1568257"; pn[1568257] = "1568249,1568289"; pn[1568289] = "1568257,1568314"; pn[1568314] = "1568289,1568322"; pn[1568322] = "1568314,1568345"; pn[1568345] = "1568322,1568722"; pn[1568722] = "1568345,1569250"; pn[1569250] = "1568722,1569266"; pn[1569266] = "1569250,1569306"; pn[1569306] = "1569266,1569802"; pn[1569802] = "1569306,1569818"; pn[1569818] = "1569802,1570938"; pn[1570938] = "1569818,1570946"; pn[1570946] = "1570938,1570986"; pn[1570986] = "1570946,1571010"; pn[1571010] = "1570986,1571202"; pn[1571202] = "1571010,1571162"; pn[1571162] = "1571202,1571258"; pn[1571258] = "1571162,1571274"; pn[1571274] = "1571258,1571314"; pn[1571314] = "1571274,1571290"; pn[1571290] = "1571314,1568762"; pn[1568762] = "1571290,1568786"; pn[1568786] = "1568762,1568802"; pn[1568802] = "1568786,1568850"; pn[1568850] = "1568802,1568826"; pn[1568826] = "1568850,1568858"; pn[1568858] = "1568826,1568906"; pn[1568906] = "1568858,1569002"; pn[1569002] = "1568906,1568946"; pn[1568946] = "1569002,1568978"; pn[1568978] = "1568946,1569018"; pn[1569018] = "1568978,1569074"; pn[1569074] = "1569018,1569114"; pn[1569114] = "1569074,1569154"; pn[1569154] = "1569114,1569170"; pn[1569170] = "1569154,1569274"; pn[1569274] = "1569170,1570514"; pn[1570514] = "1569274,1570538"; pn[1570538] = "1570514,1570554"; pn[1570554] = "1570538,1570562"; pn[1570562] = "1570554,1570570"; pn[1570570] = "1570562,1570578"; pn[1570578] = "1570570,1570586"; pn[1570586] = "1570578,1570818"; pn[1570818] = "1570586,1570866"; pn[1570866] = "1570818,1570906"; pn[1570906] = "1570866,1570850"; pn[1570850] = "1570906,1569098"; pn[1569098] = "1570850,1569050"; pn[1569050] = "1569098,1569138"; pn[1569138] = "1569050,1568882"; pn[1568882] = "1569138,1568890"; pn[1568890] = "1568882,1568898"; pn[1568898] = "1568890,1568441"; pn[1568441] = "1568898,1568449"; pn[1568449] = "1568441,1568457"; pn[1568457] = "1568449,1568473"; pn[1568473] = "1568457,1568489"; pn[1568489] = "1568473,1568650"; pn[1568650] = "1568489,1568674"; pn[1568674] = "1568650,1568666"; pn[1568666] = "1568674,1569298"; pn[1569298] = "1568666,1569322"; pn[1569322] = "1569298,1569394"; pn[1569394] = "1569322,1574794"; pn[1574794] = "1569394,1574810"; pn[1574810] = "1574794,1574842"; pn[1574842] = "1574810,1574994"; pn[1574994] = "1574842,1567737"; pn[1567737] = "1574994,1567425"; pn[1567425] = "1567737,1567465"; pn[1567465] = "1567425,1567553"; pn[1567553] = "1567465,1567577"; pn[1567577] = "1567553,1567569"; pn[1567569] = "1567577,1555938"; pn[1555938] = "1567569,1556034"; pn[1556034] = "1555938,1566337"; pn[1566337] = "1556034,1566345"; pn[1566345] = "1566337,1566361"; pn[1566361] = "1566345,1566401"; pn[1566401] = "1566361,1572474"; pn[1572474] = "1566401,1572514"; pn[1572514] = "1572474,1572826"; pn[1572826] = "1572514,1572834"; pn[1572834] = "1572826,1572842"; pn[1572842] = "1572834,1573418"; pn[1573418] = "1572842,1573826"; pn[1573826] = "1573418,1573858"; pn[1573858] = "1573826,1573882"; pn[1573882] = "1573858,1573938"; pn[1573938] = "1573882,1574850"; pn[1574850] = "1573938,1574874"; pn[1574874] = "1574850,1574906"; pn[1574906] = "1574874,1575002"; pn[1575002] = "1574906,1575058"; pn[1575058] = "1575002,1575250"; pn[1575250] = "1575058,1574962"; pn[1574962] = "1575250,1574978"; pn[1574978] = "1574962,1574986"; pn[1574986] = "1574978,1575026"; pn[1575026] = "1574986,1575042"; pn[1575042] = "1575026,1575098"; pn[1575098] = "1575042,1575090"; pn[1575090] = "1575098,1575266"; pn[1575266] = "1575090,1575410"; pn[1575410] = "1575266,1575610"; pn[1575610] = "1575410,1575674"; pn[1575674] = "1575610,1575794"; pn[1575794] = "1575674,1575834"; pn[1575834] = "1575794,1575850"; pn[1575850] = "1575834,1576530"; pn[1576530] = "1575850,1576570"; pn[1576570] = "1576530,1577002"; pn[1577002] = "1576570,1582338"; pn[1582338] = "1577002,1593834"; pn[1593834] = "1582338,1596306"; pn[1596306] = "1593834,1596338"; pn[1596338] = "1596306,1577930"; pn[1577930] = "1596338,1577978"; pn[1577978] = "1577930,1577994"; pn[1577994] = "1577978,1578034"; pn[1578034] = "1577994,1578282"; pn[1578282] = "1578034,1578306"; pn[1578306] = "1578282,1578506"; pn[1578506] = "1578306,204066"; // cached usernames pu[0] = guestphrase; pu[63961] = "dogpower"; pu[39968] = "doctrine"; pu[2389] = "scomac"; pu[42812] = "MrMatt"; pu[43971] = "leeder"; pu[32651] = "GoldStone"; pu[250414] = "CPA Candidate"; pu[226099] = "Dom"; pu[53917] = "james4beach"; pu[50955] = "Jaberwock"; pu[33536] = "gibor"; pu[72101] = "Synergy"; pu[281339] = "Lena100"; pu[864] = "martinv"; pu[51968] = "My Own Advisor"; pu[260759] = "lh0628"; pu[31948] = "GOB"; pu[1247] = "el oro"; pu[300185] = "besmartrich"; pu[191844] = "Killer Z"; pu[15577] = "Homerhomer"; pu[143] = "Potato"; pu[16749] = "zylon"; pu[5118] = "andrewf"; pu[46821] = "supperfly17"; pu[309250] = "godblsmnymkr"; pu[6012] = "sags"; pu[1190] = "AltaRed"; pu[1206] = "HaroldCrump"; pu[36565] = "blin10"; pu[67431] = "GalacticPineapple"; pu[298698] = "treva84"; pu[39452] = "londoncalling"; pu[320073] = "hollyhunter"; pu[1181] = "humble_pie"; pu[189718] = "Janus"; pu[149299] = "yyz"; pu[41742] = "Beaver101"; pu[32020] = "Eder"; pu[325209] = "Lost in Space 2"; pu[6917] = "NorthernRaven"; pu[3783] = "OptsyEagle"; pu[327650] = "hboy54"; pu[325033] = "gibor365"; pu[31313] = "jargey3000"; pu[329922] = "like_to_retire"; pu[277544] = "gardner"; pu[15783] = "Eclectic12"; pu[317122] = "mordko"; pu[328994] = "mark0f0"; pu[280946] = "Parkuser"; pu[195195] = "Mechanic"; pu[278304] = "fplan"; pu[297609] = "Userkare"; pu[30482] = "leoc2"; pu[276641] = "Mortgage u/w"; pu[32613] = "al42"; pu[3507] = "fatcat"; pu[333185] = "Bill G"; pu[297313] = "Davis"; pu[313929] = "splatapus"; pu[44077] = "Rusty O\\\'Toole"; pu[327554] = "lonewolf :)"; pu[324938] = "ian"; pu[52186] = "namelessone"; pu[282403] = "gaspr"; pu[319794] = "twa2w"; pu[6462] = "kcowan"; // -->

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    1. #11
      Senior Member scomac's Avatar
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      Royal Trust anyone?

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