Go Ahead and Debate It

[dogcom]

It has been mentioned under other threads that a new topic should be made to talk about something that was off the current topic. So here is your chance to talk it out as this thread is wide open and that is the purpose of it.

Something I wanted to reply to, to humble pie was his mentioning that we are on a forum hiding behind a name so it doesn't matter if we change it or whatever. I feel on the other hand that even though it is not our real name we should still try to treat it as if it was. By doing this we try to be true to ourselves and are forced to learn from the mistakes we make in money or how we handle ourselves. This I find can help you in the real world as you try and create good habits in all aspects of your life. There are people on this forum that I have had debates and disagreements with on other forums and these people have never hid or tried to change names, because I think they take themselves seriously, even if it is not their real name. Anyway that was my little piece and if you agree or disagree with that then put it here or talk about some other issue you might have.

[ssimps]

I feel on the other hand that even though it is not our real name we should still try to treat it as if it was. By doing this we try to be true to ourselves and are forced to learn from the mistakes we make in money or how we handle ourselves. This I find can help you in the real world as you try and create good habits in all aspects of your life. There are people on this forum that I have had debates and disagreements with on other forums and these people have never hid or tried to change names, because I think they take themselves seriously, even if it is not their real name. Anyway that was my little piece and if you agree or disagree with that then put it here or talk about some other issue you might have.

I have no idea about the details of the debate in question that raised this new thread (to much skimming on my part maybe), but there is my position in general.

I agree with the above post; even if it is a forum, it is a better place to be if people are honest and share their successes and their failures as if they were a real person (each of us is aren't we?). I think you can learn just as much or more from your failures than your successes in life.

I think it is also OK to change your position on a topic over time because you have taken in new information, that is called part of learning if you ask me, and it should not be treated as a negative.

The worst thing I think a person can do on a forum, or in the real world, is play people or lie to people so that they can personally gain, or try to make another lose. If we all did this it would == chaos.

To me, someone having multiple identities or switching ones without telling people is playing with people and serves no purpose but to diminish the value of the forum to members that are here to learn and share real experiences with others. There maybe be special cases I am not taking into consideration here, but I can't think of any.

Again, my comments above are targeted at no one specifically, they are my opinion in general.

Overall I really enjoy participating on this form and reading other peoples thoughts, ideas, and suggestions. It is fun and informative; often making me think about things I would not normally have, or in a different way than I may normally have.

[dogcom]

There has been cases in other forums where the person was kicked off and needed to remake themselves. So in a case like that you would have no choice but to change your name. Many people think the disagreements can hurt the forum but to me as long as they don't go off the rails then they can be educational and interesting. I am actually happy that humble pie brought up the subject so it can be addressed and people would know how people think about changing their name. The thing is I could be wrong and by not asking I would not know that people don't hold much stock in what they call themselves
here

[Berubeland]

I was in a forum once and somehow this lady got to disliking me and a few other people. Me in particular because I did not agree with her stance that her ex boyfriend should be make to pay child support for a child that was not his.

In any case every time i logged on after that she would swear at me and abuse me. I thought this was just be but it turned out that she was doing this kind of thing to many other people for different reasons.

The moderators talked to her etc but after numerous infractions she was finally booted off from the forum entirely. So even thought I did not change my name several people involved did because they gave her many chances.

This is a very large world we live in with some very sick people at times so...

Also anonymity has a curious effect on people either it makes them more honest or more dishonest sometimes radically so. In my case I have no problems admitting that I am not rich by any means but I am trying to get better and improve myself. I cannot learn from people who do not know. This is why I hang out here a lot so i can learn and be with people who have similar goals and share what I know in my field of expertise.

[high octane]

Also anonymity has a curious effect on people either it makes them more honest or more dishonest sometimes radically so. In my case I have no problems admitting that I am not rich by any means but I am trying to get better and improve myself. I cannot learn from people who do not know. This is why I hang out here a lot so i can learn and be with people who have similar goals and share what I know in my field of expertise.

Exactly

I think it's interesting that people can build a reputation as an expert on forums, and those are the people who make forums invaluable resources. I've saved thousands on my motor sports from these people, and I hope to do the same here

There's also people who think they're better just because of something they have. I go to an Accord forum for info and some people think they're King based on their supped up car. Why would I want to make my Accord fast when I have a motorbike?

Anyways I don't see why people can't change their name if they want. Unlike real life, everything you say is documented on a forum

[dogcom]

Interesting points high octane, that is another way to look at it.

I also like the challenge that berubeland had to put up with. It is easy to destroy crazy people on a forum like berubeland described and also learn how to deal with the extreme at the same time.

You guys sound like you have learned to deal with things and exploit them and thus you gain on the forum. Those who avoid everything and are not honest with themselves can actually be hurting their own progress.

Do we really think that everything financial is outside of our lives. In fact everything in our lives effects us financially. Good habits are good habits and we should apply them in every aspect of our lives.

[Spidey]

I've found that you have to try as much as possible not to let your ego get involved in discussions or debates. You may want to express your point of view, but especially with financial topics, it can be dangerous to close your mind. The only thing I find offensive are personal insults, but they usually bother me more when they are directed at another poster rather than myself (especially if it's someone new to the forums). I believe how you treat people is a strong reflection on how much you like yourself, so someone that goes out of their way to be insulting is probably already hurting so much that I probably can't damage them too much further anyway.

There is an added problem with forums as I've found that often something in writing is taken too seriously or in a different manner than was intended. This has happened with things I've written where perhaps I thought I was being playful and someone has taken offense to it. (My humour sometimes falls very flat.) And sometimes it's even happened for reasons that I can't understand. On the other hand, I admit that I occasionally take a retort too seriously at first and have to "step back" and remember my first comment about egos.

[humble_pie]

dogcom, it's a good idea to look at the circumstances. In this case we had as our guest an inexperienced poster whom you tormented. Only two people welcomed the newcomer, myself being one. Among others with varying degrees of chill and patronization, you stood out as hectoring, blaming, and scolding. In less than 24 hours, the hot seat treatment caused our guest to ask if the thread could be closed, and then he vanished, presumably forever.

could you please ask yourself how you would feel if someone belittled you with the following public remarks, all of which you posted to this individual:

"You have a lot to learn ..."
"You need to be a lot more comfortable with any risk before putting money in the market ..."
"You should keep it real and stand up and learn from here ..."
"Your problems started because you were not real with yourself ..."

the reason i suggested a different name to our polite and well-spoken guest was to open an avenue he could take if he wished to come back but not get raked over the coals again. Quite frankly, it was to escape punishing remarks like yours that i thought he might consider returning as somebody else.

right now, there are millions of investors all over north america who are crowding into online brokerages for the first time to manage their own savings. There is almost nothing to help them. There are uncharted universes of risk, because if their efforts fail an unprecedented generation of citizens is going to wind up bankrupt and impoverished. And in this colossal void of empty space, one of the very few aids and supports to the brand-new investornauts are forums such as this one.

what i have witnessed here on this forum is that a handful of reliable, experienced and knowledgeable posters are supporting an unbelievably large invisible population. They do this without being paid and without anything to sell. A fair toronto price for their expertise would be several hundred dollars per hour. These posters are a tiny first aid space station for the millions of neophyte investornauts. One could say that they are the médecins sans frontières of the DIY investment universe. To the best of my observation, dogcom, you are not one of these hyper-knowledgeable individuals.

as for myself, i would like to say that anytime i see a polite and kindly newcomer being taunted in this forum for no reason, i will not hesitate to step in and try to protect the individual. If this includes suggesting that he or she return under a different name to avoid the abuse, i will do so.

i do not have a 2nd name.

[dogcom]

Good reply humble pie and this is where I wanted you to hammer me and not on the other thread which is the proper thing to do. I was not part of the other debate and did stick my conversation to our new guest. I just felt that he needed a little wake up call for his sake and I don't think I was all that harsh. But I do agree with you defending him that was good of you to do.

As far as the hyper-knowledgeable I would give that honor to Leslie and maybe one or two others. It takes a lot of time, courses and working in the industry just to get a background and then you need to rise above all that and learn your own way through massive learning to rise above the industry to be hyper-knowledgeable.

[Toronto.gal]

1. right now, there are millions of investors all over north america who are crowding into online brokerages for the first time to manage their own savings....

2. what i have witnessed here on this forum is that a handful of reliable, experienced and knowledgeable posters are supporting an unbelievably large invisible population. They do this without being paid and without anything to sell. A fair toronto price for their expertise would be several hundred dollars per hour. These posters are a tiny first aid space station for the millions of neophyte investornauts. One could say that they are the médecins sans frontières of the DIY investment universe.

3. as for myself, i would like to say that anytime i see a polite and kindly newcomer being taunted in this forum for no reason, i will not hesitate to step in and try to protect the individual.

4. i do not have a 2nd name.

1. Indeed & the numbers are growing!

2. I could not agree with you more! Yes, every forum has those that lack a little finesse in manners, but I would say the majority are very kind & helpful. I never thought forums had such generous individuals until I joined one for the 1st time just a couple of years ago. "médecins sans frontières of the DIY investment universe." Oui, vraiment je suis d'accord!

3. Thank you. :)

4. :D

[humble_pie]

salut torontogal,

nice to hear from you
actually one of the expert posters i was thinking of is your soeur du nom moneygal. And there are quite a few others. The forum is graced by them.

i'm glad to see you're holding stocks, not just etfs.
re emerging mkts i'm not big on these at this very moment, the recent china news was rattling (effect on commodities) which is why i closed out my fxi chinese call spread a week or two before it would have expired today, but am not planning to open another at present.

potash, when you think about it, is an emerging market play.

are you a speed skater. Awesome.
ps i'm going now to bump frugal's Haiti post back up to top of the thread so it gets max visibility ...

[Toronto.gal]

salut torontogal,

nice to hear from you
actually one of the expert posters i was thinking of is your soeur du nom moneygal. And there are quite a few others. The forum is graced by them.

i'm glad to see you're holding stocks, not just etfs.
re emerging mkts i'm not big on these at this very moment, the recent china news was rattling (effect on commodities) which is why i closed out my fxi chinese call spread a week or two before it would have expired today, but am not planning to open another at present.

potash, when you think about it, is an emerging market play.

are you a speed skater. Awesome.
ps i'm going now to bump frugal's Haiti post back up to top of the thread so it gets max visibility ...

Ma soeur moneygal, LOL.

Thanks for your opinion on Emerging Markets. Actually, for some reason, I prefer European more than the much talked about BRICK countries, they may not be new markets, but anything 'hot' scares me.

No, I'm not a speed skater, just a huge fan of the sport and naturally looking forward to the Olympics as Canadians rock in this sport. Maybe I and/or someone else can start a thread on this closer to Feb.12th. :)